Romantasy | Stephanie, Briana, Shan, & Cate

It's no wonder that romantasy has become one of the fastest growing book genres among readers. These books beautifully blend intense romantic relationships with high stakes magical worlds. Unlike traditional fantasy novels, romantasy plotlines completely fall apart when you remove the romance. Many readers find the emotional experience involved in romantasy stories to be a welcome addition to the fantasy worlds they long to escape to. In today's episode, Stephanie chats with Briana, Shan, and Cate about their experience with this burgeoning genre. They'll discuss powerful female protagonists, engaging tropes, creative world-building, and the varying spice levels found in the books they've brought to the table. If you love traditional fantasy and/or romance novels, consider giving this genre a try. Romantasy holds the potential to offer the best of both worlds! 

Books Recommendations

Quicksilver by Callie Hart

Fourth Wing by Rebecca Yarros

A Witch's Guide to Magical Innkeeping by Sangu Mandanna

Intro Music by nikitsan

Transcript

Romantasy2026

Stephanie: [00:00:00] Cheers. Welcome to Top Shelf with the librarians of Russell Library. I'm Stephanie Rush, and today I'm joined by Brianna. 

Shan: Hey 

Stephanie: Kate. 

Shan: Hello 

Stephanie: and the Shan. 

Shan: Hey guys. 

Stephanie: Thank you for joining us today. On Top Shelf, you'll hear about compelling reads from the people who know books best. Our librarians will share titles that connect to a unique theme each episode.

Stephanie: This show will also invite you to learn about the many services offered here at Russell Library. If you're not local, no worries because chances are that your local library will have similar gifts to offer. We are very excited to turn the page with you. Today we are tackling a buzzy genre. You may or may not be reading Romantic, 

Briana: romantic.

Stephanie: Know it sounds sparkly like we need like fancy text. The spark text sparkle emoji. Yes. Yes. 

Shan: It's like jazz [00:01:00] hands. 

Stephanie: Yes, exactly. And while this sounds like a new term, which it sort of is, the concept is not new. So let's get into the history and chat all about the intersection of romance and fantasy. As you probably figured out, romantic is a blend of romance and fantasy.

Stephanie: Readers and marketers love to combine words for marketability and honestly, just for fun. So, like I said, the blending of romance and fantasy is not a new concept, but this term has recently come into Popular U usage and to sell more books to readers. So quote, romantic fantasy contemporarily known as romantic, took off in the early 20th century.

Briana: 20th century. Really? 

Stephanie: Yes. Although it exploded with the help of TikTok over the past year or two. 

Briana: Yeah. 

Stephanie: Yes. Right. So it seems new, but it's not new. It's just in our faces now. Yeah. Because we have constant. 

Briana: We're bombarded with it all the 

Stephanie: time. Yes. 

Briana: Yeah. 

Shan: So what are you, what is like deemed as like a 20th century novel that is romantic.

Shan: I'm 

Stephanie: gonna tell you in the next paragraph. 

Shan: Of course you're, 

Stephanie: hold that thought. 

Shan: Simmer 

Cate: [00:02:00] down, Shane. 

Shan: I know. I get excited. 

Stephanie: I did research, I have quotes, I have sources. 

Shan: Girl librarian. I don't expect anything less. 

Stephanie: Yes. So to quote an article from the Science Fiction Fantasy Writers Association, which is a really cool website, that was a lot to say.

Stephanie: Yes sure was. I had to make sure I had it right. Reviewers define romantic as a fantasy where the plot falls apart if you remove the romance. 

Shan: Hmm. 

Stephanie: Yes. Yeah. Yes. Right. That is the like easiest definition. Mm-hmm. So this eliminates a classic like Lord of the Rings immediately, which is what I found fascinating.

Shan: Oh yeah. There's like no romance 

Stephanie: in that at all. Really. Well, despite a little extra sparkle in the movies, the love story of a Gorn and Arwin can be deleted as easily as trimming out Tom Bombadil. And while fans might not like it, the plot works without either one. True 

Shan: not to be. Whatever. True though, they should have put Tom Bombadil 

Stephanie: in it.

Stephanie: They should have. He 

Shan: is my 

Stephanie: favorite 

Shan: character in Lord of the 

Rings. 

Stephanie: But as we know from the movies, you can take Tom Bombadil out and the movie still stands. No. 

Shan: Yes. You can also, I wrote a queer theory [00:03:00] paper, see on Lord of the Rings, by the way. 

Stephanie: Oh, I would like to 

Shan: read that. That's all I'm gonna say. 

Stephanie: But yeah, technically you can take out.

Stephanie: Eric Gordon and AR Wind's love story and the plot still works. 

Shan: What about Frodo and Sam? 

Stephanie: That is not considered the romantic plot in the traditional sense, however, I love that. 

Shan: Without Goum, 

Stephanie: Frodo and his love of the ring. 

Shan: No. In Frodo. 

Stephanie: Oh, I feel like that 

Briana: thought never crossed 

Stephanie: my mind. Nope. Nope. 

Shan: Queer theory.

Briana: Well, yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Stephanie: No, I love this. 

Shan: That's another day. 

Stephanie: Okay. Totally separate conversation. We're gonna come back to. 

Shan: I know. I'm sorry guys. 

Stephanie: Mm-hmm. So continuing on on with this romantic thing really shakes out to be, it's usually set in a fantasy world with its typical tropes, such as complex magic and intricate world building.

Stephanie: But in this genre, romance is the main point of the story. So this is author Danielle Tomlinson, and she argues that it's hard to pinpoint when the very first romantic book was published. However, 1980 Seven's War for The Oaks by Emma Bull can be remarked as the [00:04:00] earliest publication from within the genre.

Stephanie: It's a story about a rock and roll singer named Eddie McKendry, who somehow became drafted into a war between fairies and now her life is in danger. Not to mention she finds herself slowly falling in love with the same person who put her in danger. Uhhuh, uh, see, you know where this is going. Uhhuh, the fantasy is obviously rich in Irish mythology, but there's also the solid romance between Eddie and the unnamed puka in the center of the war.

Stephanie: I don't know what kind of creature that is. 

Shan: I think, you know, as the reader, you can infer that in any way you want. 

Stephanie: Correct. 

Shan: Puka sounds like. Many things. 

Stephanie: Mm-hmm. It's spelled P-H-O-U-K-A, so it could be fuca, but either way, some sort of fantasy creature Faye adjacent. Yeah. So it's definitely possible that the subgenre has existed far longer, but, and this is, this is how we know Urban Dictionary had its first entry on it in 2008.

Stephanie: So it's commonly used nowadays by readers as the name for the genre of [00:05:00] romantic fantasy. So that's the brief history. Brief history, 

Shan: the fact that you've now defined it that way. Yeah. I now question if my book is total romantic. See, well then 

Stephanie: that's gonna be a great thing to discuss. 

Cate: Yeah. 

Shan: We're gonna, 

Stephanie: we're gonna, we're gonna dig it into that.

Stephanie: Yeah. And that's just the. The basis for the conversation. We're using that loose definition just to get a grasp on it, but we can really take it any way we want. 

Shan: I think so, 

Stephanie: yeah. And I'm sure we're gonna get into why the genre is so popular as we chat today, but some people have posited that the overlapping of the themes between fantasy and romance makes them an easy pairing.

Stephanie: As someone who generally does not read the genre, um, I've read a few in the past. I read the CarVal series by Stephanie Garber years back, and I liked that one. Um, but I'm in anxious to hear about today's books because this is not a genre I really read and I'm kind of neutral. Leaning negative on it.

Stephanie: Mm-hmm. So I wanna give everybody an opportunity to like really sell me. 

Cate: Yeah. 

Stephanie: Yeah. So, um, Brianna, we're gonna start with you. 

Briana: Exciting. 

Stephanie: Yeah. Can you tell me, um, or I guess tell us, tell us and the listeners what book [00:06:00] you brought today along with a brief description 

Briana: I brought with me today. Quick Silver by Callie.

Briana: So I have a little description that's more than two sentences. Um, but it gives you enough with, it's a 

Stephanie: thick book, so 

Briana: you're allowed, it's a thick, it's a thick mama. So 24-year-old, and I'm gonna butcher her name. 

Stephanie: Try your best. 

Briana: Gimme one second. This is why I'm actually a pronunciation guide in this book.

Stephanie: That's awesome. She does that. I appreciate that. Yeah. It's like 

Briana: fantasy. Sarah. Sarah, I don't know. She's a. Sarah, we're gonna go. Sarahs Sarah. 

Stephanie: Sarah. Sounds good. 

Briana: It sounds, 

Stephanie: yep. 

Briana: 24-year-old Sarahs Fein is good at keeping secrets. No one knows about the strange powers she possesses, or the fact that she's been picking pockets and stealing from the undying queen's reservoirs for as long as she can remember.

Briana: When Sayers comes face to face with death himself, she inadvertently reopens a gateway between realms and is transported to a land of ice and snow. The Faye have always been the stuff of myth, of legend, of nightmares, but it turns out they're real. And CS has landed [00:07:00] herself in the middle of a centuries long conflict that might just get her killed the first of her kind to tread the frozen mountains of Y.

Briana: In over a thousand years, CS mistakenly binds herself to King Fisher, a handsome Fay Warrior who has secrets and nefarious agendas of his own. He will use her alchemist's magic to protect his people no matter what it costs him or her. 

Stephanie: Okay, I thought you were gonna say, she fell in love with death and I got excited.

Stephanie: Because that I read, 

Cate: there was a, there was like another book that had, I think that theme that I was, I thought it was this one, but I think it's a different one. I'm pretty sure that did at the theme, but I don't remember the name. Interesting. 

Stephanie: Wonderful, interesting. 

Cate: It was kind of like a Persephone. Okay.

Stephanie: So the vibe, I feel like we get that retelling a lot. We, 

Briana: that's very common. 

Stephanie: I think I am intrigued. Romantic. Sorry, that's a different book. Brianna. 

Briana: Yeah. 

Stephanie: What drew you to this book? 

Briana: So I'm in a book club with a lot of. Women who really love this genre, and prior to maybe like a year or so ago, I also did not read this really [00:08:00] at all.

Stephanie: Yeah. 

Briana: And you didn't, it took me like three attempts to read the first book in the AAR series. Then once I read it, I was hooked. So, but 

Stephanie: now I feel like you are such a romantic 

Briana: reader. 

Shan: You are my go-to person. I literally wrote that in my notes that like, oh, Brianna's my go-to romantic fantasy person. I said that funny.

Shan: Yeah. You know what I mean? 

Briana: Romantic fantasy. If it wasn't for. Some of the women in my book club talking about this book nonstop, I wouldn't probably have not picked it up. That's 

Stephanie: awesome. 

Shan: Okay. 

Briana: So they talked about it a lot like December of 2025. 'cause the sequel to it came out. Mm. And someone got it as a secret Santa gift and she was like, oh my god, oh my God.

Briana: You have to read the first book. Like it's so good. So what was like. Whatever you say, because usually their recs are on point. And I'm like, if this, many of them loved it, I have to try it. So 

Shan: yeah, I gave it a shot. Yeah, 

Briana: because the library holds list and Libby holds list for too long. I was, I was like, you know what, we'll just buy it and hope for the best.

Briana: And I really, once I actually read about what it was about, it kind of reminded me of the AAR series [00:09:00] by Sarah J. Moss. But also, if anyone here has read alchemized like. Yeah, there are elements of alchemized in it that I liked, and that's like another kind of high fantasy with like a romance element in it.

Briana: But that had like a lot of like war alchemy, like very interesting things. And pairing that with like the aar, like fe romance also wars. Mm-hmm. Like it was the perfect melding and our. Male main character is very similar to what you're gonna find in a lot of romantic. Yeah. Just this brooding morally gray like shadow daddy of a man, 

Stephanie: shadow daddy.

Shan: Yeah. That's hilarious. Yeah. 

Stephanie: You said that sentence and I was like, no, that my sounding my sister Reese, 

Shan: that like that fits. Yeah. Like with my book. Yes, it 

Briana: does. It 

Shan: does? Mm-hmm. Okay. It does. 

Stephanie: Yeah. Brianna, how did this book resonate with you? 

Briana: So. I absolutely loved it because the world building was so easy for me to catch onto and it felt very unique compared to a lot of the other things I've read, and I really don't know why, but it [00:10:00] was just different.

Briana: Hmm. And our female main character, who I may refer to as the FMC, as an abbreviation, cs very strong, very confident. Like she doesn't second guess herself. Like she's gonna commit to whatever she decides she wants to do. Yeah. Like. I just loved her so much and she's very human. So like sometimes like she may have done things.

Briana: I was like, girl. 

Stephanie: Mm. 

Briana: But I still loved her anyway. Mm-hmm. 'cause we're all human in that regard. Like sometimes we're gonna do things and be like, 

Stephanie: I feel like that's why that was the best 

Cate: choice. 

Stephanie: People are drawn to this genre. Yes. Because it tends to feature a strong female flawed heroine. 

Briana: Yes. 

Stephanie: Yes. And I, yeah, 

Briana: a 

Shan: hundred percent.

Shan: I was just thinking that too. 

Briana: Yeah. 

Shan: And then if it's a man that's their opposite, that they love usually dark. Brooding man, 

Briana: there's a lot of enemies to romance, enemies to lovers. Um, that does not surprise me in these books. 

Shan: A hundred 

Briana: percent. And that was very strong in this and their, like, the chemistry between CS and King Fisher was just, you could feel it [00:11:00] like radiating off the pages and their banter, not just with them, but also the banter between the side characters.

Briana: Was so well done. Like I was laughing a lot out loud reading this. Okay. And it was just a really nice found family type of vibe too. Mm-hmm. And that's also very common in these books. 

Stephanie: Yeah. Okay. 

Briana: Um, 

Stephanie: so this is an adult book, correct? 

Briana: This is an adult book. Would you 

Stephanie: say? It's got that like heavy spice level that we sometimes 

Briana: see in romance?

Briana: It like a four out of five. Okay. So 

Stephanie: that's pretty high. I 

Briana: felt like there was a lot of spice. Very open door. There are no closed doors. 

Stephanie: Okay. Okay. 

Briana: Good to 

Stephanie: know. 

Briana: So don't read this if you can't handle that level of spice. And also this has very graphic in terms of like a lot of the war scenes. Yeah. So if you're not into that, like graphic descriptions, like don't pick this up.

Briana: It's probably going to scar you in some regard. Like it's a lot. 

Stephanie: So does it lean heavier into romance or fantasy, or is it kind of even? 

Briana: It felt to me pretty even. 

Stephanie: Okay. It sounds like the way you're describing it, it sounds like 

Briana: it's 

Stephanie: pretty 

Briana: similar, like very similar. Up my alley for what I would look for in a [00:12:00] really great romantic scene novel.

Briana: Cool. And I'm glad it worked out when I picked it out. 

Stephanie: Cool. So I was thinking about romantic as a term. Mm-hmm. And if we've heard other of these genre mashups kind of bouncing around, I know I've heard a couple, um, but Brianna, is there another genre mashup that you like and does it have like a fun snappy name?

Briana: So I what I, I like a historical fantasy. Mm-hmm. Every now and then, like. And the only author I can reference is RF Kwang. 

Stephanie: Yeah. 

Briana: Some people, me and Shannon loved it. I love B Babble Bale babble is on my tv. So good. Like I wish it had a fun name, but that genre is just really cool. 

Stephanie: Yeah, I don't think it has a cool name, but it is.

Stephanie: I 

Briana: wish it did hopely One day someone will give it 

Stephanie: name. I've also heard romantic sci-fi, which is like fun. Mm-hmm. That's kind of cute if you do like Yeah. It's, but, but other than that, the only other like snappy fun one I've heard is horror romantic. 

Shan: I've heard that I did a little research uhhuh 'cause I was like, I have no idea.

Stephanie: No, no. It's okay. When I come to you, you, yeah, [00:13:00] yeah. You can add in. But I was just like, I know I've heard these terms. Are other people hearing these terms that I've like not heard? 'cause romantic just flows. That's exactly does so easily. It pairs so well that I wish there were more genre blends that had such a, like a cool sound.

Stephanie: Yeah. There really aren't as many girls. They 

Shan: just don't have 

Stephanie: cool sounds too or romance sounds. Okay. Yeah. But I feel like that's a very niche. Yeah. 

Shan: That could also. Be sounded sound differently. Yeah. 

Stephanie: If 

Shan: you know what I'm trying to say. Yep, 

Stephanie: yep. I know what you're trying to say. Don't say it too many times.

Stephanie: Too fast. 

Briana: Yes. 

Stephanie: Yeah. Well, Brianna, I think we know the answer, but would you recommend this book? 

Briana: I would. Um, so like I said before, if you love a cast of very lovable characters, minus maybe like one or two of them, and aren't afraid to embrace the like heavy spice, this book is definitely for you. Like, if you love this genre, you really should try this book.

Briana: Cool. It's just so good. Um, I will say like, check the trigger warnings. I hinted at this maybe a little earlier, but they list the author lists them on her website. Great. I would [00:14:00] definitely look at that because like I said, if like graphic images of war are too much, like I really wouldn't read this. Um, and I also wanna say like, don't go on good reads and read people's reviews of this because I did that yesterday.

Briana: And I was very sad to see how many people like really hated this book and that would've deterred me from reading it if I went there first. So yeah, I don't read 

Stephanie: the reviews until 

Briana: after. Yeah. No, don't go on. Good reason until you're done reading. 

Shan: Can't read the reviews till after because people do spoilers constantly.

Stephanie: Yes. In reviews. And also I like to read a review and feel validated in the way that I felt. 

Shan: Mm-hmm. 

Briana: Same like, I'll go on. 'cause I'm curious like what was the average rating for this. 

Stephanie: Yes. 

Briana: Um, but that's the most I would, 

Stephanie: that's what I do first. Yeah. Then I read it, then I go read the. 

Briana: Yeah, 

Stephanie: the reviews. 

Cate: Yeah.

Cate: 'cause otherwise it just skews your perception. 

Stephanie: It does. It's really hard to unread a line and a review. 'cause then it sticks and you get to that part in the book and you're like, dang it. Yeah. Yeah. 

Shan: Well, like the New York Times when they do their reviews. Yes. It's spoiler after spoiler or after spoiler.

Shan: Mm-hmm. And it's like, do you want people to read the book? 

Stephanie: And I don't, [00:15:00] spoilers really work for people for various reasons, but I don't wanna know what's gonna happen. I'm not a spoiler reader. 

Shan: No, 

Briana: no, 

Shan: neither am 

Stephanie: I. Let me, let me have my journey. 

Briana: Yeah, so overall, have my journey. Please, please read this book because it's so good.

Briana: And book two is out. Book three comes out later. I wanna say this year, hopefully, but they're, they're long though. So also be prepared to read something that's a bit of a chunker, but it's worth it and it ends on a cliffhanger. That's all. I will say, Uhhuh, that's slightly frustrating, but. It's, it's so good.

Stephanie: That's why we read series. 

Briana: Exactly. 

Stephanie: And we will talk about that on different episode. Can't wait. I'm gonna go to Han now. 

Shan: Cool beans. 

Stephanie: Han, what did you bring and can you tell us a little bit about it? 

Shan: So the book I brought today is Fourth Wing by Rebecca Yaros. 

Stephanie: Okay. 

Shan: Many of you may know this book. Mm-hmm. It is huge.

Shan: I feel like this book was everywhere. Mm-hmm. I actually did not read this book. I listened to. It 

Stephanie: counts 

Shan: count. It was the [00:16:00] dramatic audio. Oh yeah. With the full. Yeah, it was, it wasn't the full full, but it was another dramatized version. 

Stephanie: Okay. 

Shan: Um, I thoroughly enjoyed this. 

Stephanie: Remember how many hours it was? I know that that's a long book.

Shan: 32. 

Stephanie: Okay. Well that's a lot of hours. That's why I ask, just in case people are gonna listen. Yeah. 

Shan: We'll get to that later. Okay, 

Stephanie: great. 

Shan: As you guys know, I will say I'm new to romantic. Mm-hmm. Coming to think of this, there is good romance in this book. However, I think even if it. Was taken away. You would still have the story.

Shan: I'm looking to Brianna a little bit because she like loves Fourth Wing 

Briana: as someone who's read all three, like the romances incorporated in every single book. But you've read them too. 

Shan: I only read the 

Briana: first one. You've read the first. Okay. I know you need that. Throughout, especially the second book because So scratch 

Shan: that.

Briana: Yeah. You need the romance. 

Stephanie: No, but that's a fair point. Like 

Briana: does it 

Stephanie: meet the criteria as we've outlined? Maybe, maybe not, but still worth discussing. 

Briana: It would just be a war story without romance. If you didn't have the romance, 

Shan: [00:17:00] that's exactly what it would 

Stephanie: be. Also, I think people are reading this book because they know there's a romance.

Briana: Mm-hmm. 

Shan: It's steamy. 

Stephanie: And so I, so, so to your point, I think even if you took it out, people would not be reading it in the numbers. They have been reading it. Yeah. 

Shan: This is true. 

Stephanie: So I think you're good. 

Shan: Okay. 

Stephanie: I'm cool. Uh, can you tell us what it's about? Yeah. In case people don't know, in case I think I can get somehow escaped fourth wing.

Shan: Um, the story is about Violet, Soren Gale. Uh, violet was meant to live this, like quaint life as a scribe. Because this is like the world building in this is really good. It takes place as like a college campus essentially for people to eventually become the dragon writers. So a Violet's like fragile and like little and would never ever think, you wouldn't think she would be like a candidate to go be a dragon writer.

Shan: Mm-hmm. However, her mother, who is the general of all of the dragon writers, has a different. Pathway for Violet, so no longer is she going to be a scribe in living [00:18:00] amongst books, which. We all will love. Mm-hmm. Um, but she goes out into the ring of fire, literally. So it's a 

Stephanie: legacy story 

Shan: basically. So she, she goes out and it's not only like the dragons go and pick them.

Shan: And who will be their rider? 

Stephanie: Are the dragons like, uh, like sentient and speak, or They, 

Shan: they do. 

Stephanie: Okay. 

Shan: And they can speak into your brain? 

Stephanie: Yeah. 

Shan: Oh, okay. So, like, violet ends up getting like, I don't wanna speak. Spoil anything? A pretty cool dragon. 

Stephanie: Okay. 

Shan: Fair enough. And let's just say there's more candidates fighting for the dragons than there are candidates to be The rider.

Shan: Okay. Like musical chairs. So not only is she fighting for her life to not burn and be incinerated by a dragon, she's also fighting against, um, her classmates. Her classmates, essentially. Okay. And she does, let's just say. Is an awesome character and save some of her classmates life. 

Cate: Cool. 

Shan: In the meantime, there's also this like group of rebels who are against her mother.

Shan: Yes. And classic fantasy structure. Let's just [00:19:00] say that maybe Violet gets involved with like the leader of all of those rebels. 

Stephanie: Okay. So to clarify, she's, it's not a romance with the dragons, it's a romance with another person. 

Shan: Yes. Who is also 

Stephanie: the dragon rider in this specifically? Okay. Yes. I just want people to be prepared.

Shan: No, thank you 

Cate: for, for specifying that because 

Shan: I was, you didn't know where it was gonna go. '

Stephanie: cause there are books where the dragons or the, the creatures are the romantic interests. I just wanna be clear where this book is. 

Shan: I just wanna say that Violet and her dragon are very connected. 

Stephanie: Okay. 

Shan: Um, 

Stephanie: but he's not the romantic interest.

Shan: He's not the romantic interest. What's his name again? The romantic 

Briana: tt? No. Oh no, that's the dragon. That's the dragon. Oh, za Zane. 

Shan: Zane, 

Stephanie: Zane. Okay. I just want people to know what they're getting into because like what's his 

Shan: name? That's fair. What's his name? I didn't write it down and I was 

Stephanie: like, oh my God.

Stephanie: The book I'm reading, they are reading a book about people falling in love with dragons inside my book and I was like, I just need to clarify. 

Shan: No, this isn't like monster romance vibes. Okay. That's what making, she's falling in love with a fellow dragon writer who is against her mother, because 

Stephanie: I 

Shan: feel 

Stephanie: like Monster Romance [00:20:00] actually blurs into romance.

Shan: It totally does. 

Stephanie: It's Zaden. 

Shan: It's Zaden. Yeah. So Zaden is the character, but the thing is, so as, um, violet is like coming into all of this, she's peeling back many layers and those layers are unveiling like a many secrets. So this rebel group who's against her mother, let's just say there's a reason for that, as we all know, and Violet has to come to terms with a lot of things as a main character and also.

Shan: With her mother, with this rubble group, with the death of her brother, with this romance that's steamy. I would say there's some very significant steamy 

Stephanie: points. So of all the things you just named, what drew you to this book? I 

Briana: know 

Stephanie: because I feel like you just named all the things. You jumped 

Briana: ahead quite far.

Stephanie: It's you, you got so into it. I'm just curious. I got really into the draw specifically, 

Shan: honestly. Brianna. 

Stephanie: Okay, great. Expand. 

Shan: Brianna loved this book and I was just like, I'm in the mood for something like fun and exciting [00:21:00] and I was doing a lot of driving 'cause it was like going back and forth to Cape Cod.

Shan: Yes. And I commuting, I think we went to, you 

Briana: were, I think so. 

Shan: Wasn't a lot going on and so I was like, oh, this will be a great audio to have. I remember when you started listening to us and it was so much fun and Violet's such a great character. And then the Dragon's so cool. I don't know, I just had a really.

Briana: It's again that like everybody in the book is amazing, so it's hard to not love them all. Yeah. Other than like 

Shan: the 

Briana: mom, obviously the mom and a couple other people that kind of suck. Um, but Violet's amazing. 

Shan: She's so cool. 

Stephanie: It's just interesting to me that Brianna sold you on a book in a genre that you don't typically read.

Briana: Yeah. 

Stephanie: Yeah. You didn't sell me on this book. No. And I also don't really read this genre, so I'm so like, shit. So, you know, keeping this going. What resonated with you about this book? 

Shan: Honestly. The relationship that Violet has with her Dragon. It's really cool. They built this bond and that's kind of the thing.

Shan: I listened to this like over a year ago now. Yeah. And that's the thing that stuck with me the most. There are two [00:22:00] more. There's gonna be a fourth one in the series. 

Briana: Yep. 

Shan: Um, I haven't listened to all of 'em. Sorry. My reading list. Um, that's alright. A lot different way. They'll always 

Stephanie: be there. Yeah. 

Shan: Um, no, it's like if I'm doing a long drive, right?

Shan: Yeah. Let's get the second one going. Yeah. 

Stephanie: Yep. 

Shan: Um, 

Stephanie: mm-hmm. 

Shan: But really it was the relationship between Violet and her dragon. I just thought it was cool and it was, um, it was good. I like as we all know, me as a reader, my main thing is like characters development of relationships, seeing how they mold. Yeah, of course.

Shan: This is the thing that, you know, resonated the most with me, so. 

All 

Stephanie: right. All right. Let's talk about your genre, mash up opinions. I know you said you did some research. 

Shan: I did research. 

Stephanie: Okay. 

Shan: So 

Stephanie: tell us what you researched 

Shan: now that we were talking about Outlander. I do think, like I love historical romance.

Shan: Mm-hmm. With a mix of like magical realism. Mm-hmm. And romance. My mashups are all romance related. Okay. Because I do like a little bit of the love flair in it. 

Cate: Yeah. 

Shan: Because it makes like a story whole in different ways. Like [00:23:00] sometimes if you just have war. That's not fun. There's a reason why I warn peace.

Shan: Like whatcha 

Cate: fighting for? 

Shan: Yeah. You have the story of war and then you have the story of the families in love. Like Yeah. Yeah. You need to have that well-roundedness of characters and plot line to keep the reader going. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I don't have snappy things. 

Stephanie: That's 

Shan: fine. I can't think of snappy as we discussed.

Shan: That's fine. Um, 

Stephanie: snappy was optional. I was just curious really. 

Shan: Yeah. And like books that came up in this. I actually never read Outlander. I'm not gonna write, but 

Stephanie: I feel like you would like Outlander now that we're talking about 

Shan: it. The thing is though, I love the TV show, so I won't read the books. It's too hard to go back.

Shan: Yeah. But coming to think of certain things like Anna to Carina, that's a romance. It's historical. Yeah. Yeah. But it was written for its time. I don't know. You know what I mean? 

Briana: You like Ashley Post and she's that whimsical, magical real. 

Shan: Yes. I love her. I just recommended her. Yes, you're, yeah, so it all ranges.

Stephanie: So just like toss a romance in and you're good. 

Shan: Toss it in [00:24:00] L Love, 

Stephanie: literally. Yeah, 

Shan: just throw a little love in. 

Stephanie: Yeah. 

Shan: L Love. 

Stephanie: I love that. 

Shan: Yeah. 

Stephanie: All. Shannon, would you recommend Fourth Wing? 

Shan: Yeah, and I did. And um, my good friend like blew through all the audio. 'cause she did the audio book Lauren. 

Stephanie: Nice. 

Shan: She was like, Shannon, I love this.

Shan: Oh my God. I was like, that's so great. Enjoy. 

Stephanie: Wonderful. 

Shan: No, it was a good book. It was fun. If you want a fun, exciting read with a little steam, I would say. I don't know. The steam was light for me. 

Briana: I gave it, I would give it like a 2.5 to three. Okay. 

Shan: Yeah, 

Briana: like it'll pick up in the, it's 

Stephanie: good to know 

Briana: coming books.

Shan: Oh, I thought it was supposed to be higher. No. 

Briana: I felt like, like, well compared to what you just said for me, like Quiksilver was higher in spice than fourth wing. 

Shan: She knows the spice levels for romantics and I don't that well. Um, it's weird when her dragon can read her mind though. Yeah. 

Briana: And 

Shan: she can read his, and she can read his, yeah.

Shan: Yeah. So then you don't really know what's going on. Yeah. That I, 

Stephanie: I'm intrigued by that bit. That 

Shan: makes 

Stephanie: really well animal [00:25:00] telepathy. 

Shan: Yeah. That's all I'll say there. 

Stephanie: We can talk about Mike 

Shan: because then she's, what's going on? And he was like, get out of my head. It's like, I can't, 

Stephanie: I liked your dragon voice.

Stephanie: That's 

Shan: his voice in the audio. He talks like this or something. It's, that's funny. 

Stephanie: That don't sound like a dragon coated voice though. It's 

Briana: like, 

Stephanie: yeah, like smile. Yeah. It's got like that, you know? I like it. 

Briana: Yes. 

Stephanie: Yes. 

Shan: Um, 

Stephanie: all right. All right, Kate, you wanna round us out? Sure. Okay. All Kate, what book did you bring today and can you tell us a little bit about it?

Cate: Yes. So I brought with me a Witches Guide to Magical in Keeping by Sgu Manana. This is an enchanting novel about a witch named Sarah Swan, who has a second chance to regain her magical powers, powers that were lost to her when she resurrected her great-Aunt Jasmine from the Dead. 

Shan: Oh, wow. 

Cate: Yes. Cool. She now runs an inn full of quirky guests, but longs for the magic she once had when she was one of [00:26:00] the most powerful witches in Britain.

Cate: When she learns about an old spell book that holds the secret to restoring her power, she turns to Luke Larson, a gorgeous historian who might just be able to unlock the book's mysteries. 

Stephanie: Luke Larson, that is a love interest name of I. I also love 

Cate: it. I was looking down and all I could see was your, your hand motion there.

Shan: Gorgeous historian. 

Cate: A gorgeous historian. Sounds like my kind of 

Stephanie: man chick is like, yeah. 

Cate: Yeah. 

Stephanie: Same. Same with even the protagonists in all these books. They sound like romantic fantasy names. Yes, they do. They're very specific. Very specific. 

Cate: Yeah. 

Stephanie: Um, Kate, what, what drew you to this book? 

Cate: So, to be completely honest, I was drawn in by the books cover.

Cate: Mm-hmm. 

Stephanie: It's so cute. 

Cate: It's cute. Is it's mostly pink and teal in color, which is an eye catching combo for me. And the focal po, the focal point is a winding path leading to a charming ivy covered inn. And when you look a little closer, you see not [00:27:00] only the couple. To be, but there's also a sweet little fox and a rooster skeleton.

Stephanie: Oh my God. 

Cate: To grab your attention. It's a very tiny not see that? That's little rooster skeleton. You're like, huh? That's a rooster skeleton. I wonder what that's doing there. 

Stephanie: This cover looks like it could be one of two things, like very cozy, charming, very low stakes, or fantastical with some like weird, more intense elements.

Stephanie: And you don't know. 

Cate: You don't know. And so she's got a book in her hand. He's got a cup of tea. I was also, I guess I'm. Apparently unable to resist a book about a magical house. Yes, because I love houses. I love my house, and the idea of running a cozy, magical inn full of colorful characters is very appealing.

Stephanie: Yeah. Mm-hmm. To me, you 

Cate: also love 

Stephanie: a witch book? Yeah, 

Cate: I do love a witch book. You love a witch book? There's pretty much no witch book. I won't. 

Stephanie: Yes, 

Cate: yes. 

Stephanie: Yeah. 

Cate: Yes. 

Stephanie: Um, how did this book resonate with you? 

Cate: So, truth be told. 

Stephanie: Yes. 

Cate: I [00:28:00] started this book many months ago and I put it down and I'm looking at Han because she.

Cate: Turns out felt the same. Um, on the first go around, a few things just weren't clicking for me. No, probably because like you, I am super character driven. Mm-hmm. And I just wasn't connecting with the characters mm-hmm. Right outta the gate the way I thought I would. Mm-hmm. Um, but I decided to pick it up again because I thought, I don't know, maybe I just didn't give it enough time.

Cate: Yeah. And this time around, as the story unfolded, I began to get a little bit more connected to the characters. I found the more endearing, and I should mention that on my first attempt, I hadn't yet met Luke Larson. 

Shan: Oh, the 

Cate: steamy historian. You hadn't 

Shan: gotten to the romance. 

Cate: Yes. And so. That was his character was the missing piece for me.

Cate: Oh, because he's a bit sarcastic. 

Shan: Mm-hmm. 

Cate: A bit grumpy. I love a sarcastic, grumpy guy, but also he's very intelligent and loving. So he's the guardian of his naughty little sister who has [00:29:00] autism. 

Shan: Oh. 

Cate: And she doesn't. Know that she should control her magic or she doesn't want to control her magic. Mm-hmm. So she's a ton of work, but their relationship is very heartwarming and very genuine.

Cate: He works for a woman who is kind of a renegade professor. And she's blunt and fierce and just sort of plays by her own set of rules, and she isn't swayed by the bureaucracy of the magical guild. And so their relationship kind of drew me in because they really respect each other, but they also don't take any of each other's nonsense.

Cate: Mm-hmm. Like they kind of hold each other to the flame a little bit. And it was obvious from Luke's relationship with his sister and his boss that he could handle a strong feminine energy. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And so that made me excited to see how the relationship with him and Sarah would unfold, because her character definitely kind of goes along with what we were talking about earlier.

Cate: And so that's when things started clicking for me. 

Stephanie: Cool. I love that. 

Shan: Yeah. I just said, no, 

Stephanie: that's [00:30:00] fair. 

Cate: I, you know, I, that's fair. After a while I really did the same. Yeah. I was reading it. I was probably, I don't know, maybe a third of the way through. Mm-hmm. Maybe a quarter of the way through and I was like, I don't know.

Cate: It's just not do. And I was really disappointed 'cause I was like, I wanted it 

Shan: to do something. 

Cate: I wanted it to do something too. And then the second go around was definitely was better. Yeah. It needed more time. 

Stephanie: I almost never go back to a book that I've stopped, so 

Cate: Me neither. 

Stephanie: Yeah. What made you, because you wanted to know, 

Cate: I, I did it for this.

Stephanie: Yeah, 

Cate: because, 

Stephanie: yeah, 

Shan: for the podcast. 

Cate: I did the podcast because I was looking at some of the books that, you know, the huge sort of tones, and I was like, okay, I'm not gonna do, like, this is a very, this is, I don't know. 200 pages, 300, something like 

Stephanie: that. I was, I can't see you picking up a book that like Brianna has right now.

Cate: No. And so I, I would, but then you have to lock in for a long time, and especially because so many of these romantics were series uhhuh and I wanted a standalone book. 

Stephanie: Oh yeah. 

Cate: That's what I was [00:31:00] specifically looking for, point, not because I don't like series, but because I knew I wasn't gonna commit to the whole thing.

Cate: And if I'm not gonna commit, I'm like, I'm not gonna do it. So, um, so yeah. So it was a little bit of a, of a, an effort to go back. 

Stephanie: Yeah. Do you have thoughts on genre mashups? 

Cate: I do. 

Stephanie: Yay. 

Cate: So I have not personally read the genre yet. 

Stephanie: Okay. 

Cate: But it's cozy apocalypse. 

Stephanie: Ooh. 

Cate: Oh, you had a fun name. I did. You did it. So obviously a mashup of Cozy and Apocalypse.

Cate: Mm-hmm. Which you wouldn't normally put together. No, but it intrigues me because the focus is more on community and humor and finding joy. After the world has ended, rather than just sort of survival. Horror. Yeah. Dark darkness. 

Stephanie: Okay. So I feel like that's similar to like Hope, core Hope Punk. 

Cate: Yes. 

Stephanie: And it's really having an emergence right now.

Cate: Well, so my son is actually the one that introduced me to it inadvertently because he's reading Monk and Robot. Oh yes. I don't if you're familiar. So that book is [00:32:00] basically, it's a. Post-industrial world where a tea monk and a robot travel together and they're focusing on philosophy, nature, and tea rather than starvation.

Shan: That's 

Cate: so, 

Stephanie: yeah, so that's 

Cate: delightful. That's 

Stephanie: so cute. The first book is called A Psalm for the Wild Built Yes. By Becky Chambers. 

Cate: Yes. Yes. 

Stephanie: Who. Famously writes, um, cozy science fiction, ah, cozy space fiction. 

Cate: Well, and so I, I hope that one day my son is actually gonna write a book just like this. Oh. 'cause he's kind of building it out in his, in his head right now.

Cate: That, and yeah, I think. Gen Z is so focused on so many awful things, and the idea that there would still be something to salvage. Yeah. If it all went up in flames, is kind of, I don't know. I don't focus on 

Shan: all the negative things. That's fair. 

Cate: You're an older Gen Z. I'm an old, 

Shan: yeah. 

Cate: Yeah, this is true. And so I feel like, and again, this is maybe just the Gen Zs in my life, but I feel like they're, they're pretty concerned about the way of the world.

Cate: And there's this That's true. [00:33:00] I, but there's also a little bit of, um, nostalgia for something they've never known. 

Stephanie: Yes. That is huge right 

Cate: now. Yeah. Which is like my kids. At 18 and 20 or 19 tomorrow, Scarlet Turns 19 tomorrow. Um, and 21, they, they love analog things. They love record players. Yes. They love, you know.

Shan: Yeah. 

Cate: They, they love things that just do one thing. Yep. You know, that really is, um, I don't know. They, they like old things that they can repurpose and that sort of thing, so I feel that they, I don't know. They're connecting to it in, in a way that, yeah. I don't know. It's, I, that's all I, the only way I could describe it, nostalgia for something they've never known.

Cate: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Stephanie: And Cozy Apocalypse is a cool port mento, like that's a great term. 

Cate: Yeah, when I saw it, I was like, oh my God. And there was other books that they listed, but Monk and Robot, I mean, Logan's been carrying it around for a while 'cause he just tends to read a little bit at a time. And, um, the cover on that one kind of caught my eyes.

Cate: Gorgeous. So, yeah. 

Stephanie: And they're like novella length, they're not super long. They're like 120, 150 pages. [00:34:00] Yes. And I think there's, there's two, maybe three in the series. 

Cate: Possibly, 

Stephanie: maybe even more. 

Cate: Yeah, possibly. 

Briana: So he's like, it feel like the new TJ Clune kind of falls into that because. It's technically the world hasn't ended yet, but it's like about to.

Briana: Mm-hmm. Yeah. And there's this kind of cozy road trip element Yes. That's going on that 

Cate: I haven't read that yet. 

Briana: It, it comes out. If not, it's very this month. I think very soon. 

Cate: What, what was his last one is? Um. What was the title of the last one? One, yes. No, no, no. Not I read that one. The um, ah, 

Briana: there's Ilian C 

Cate: Puppet.

Cate: Not that one, which, oh, I love puppets. No, not the puppets one. It's good. There's another one of, one more recent I believe. I feel like I know you're talking 

Briana: about and I don't, 

Stephanie: he's put out a lot of bugs. 

Cate: I know. Okay. Well, regardless, it's 

Stephanie: authors are responding to this right now. They are? Yes. With these kind of, yeah, like hope.

Stephanie: Hope punk scenarios. It's cool. 

Cate: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think so. I think so. 

Stephanie: All right. Before we wrap up, does anyone have any final thoughts on romantic? Oh, Kate does. 

Cate: Would I recommend this book step? 

Stephanie: [00:35:00] Oh, yes. Sorry. I'm so excited. Kate, would you recommend this book? 

Cate: So that depends. Mm-hmm. Um, if you are looking for a solidly cozy romantic, and I chose this specifically 'cause it was a little bit different, then I would actually say no.

Stephanie: Okay. 

Cate: And here's why. So anyone who spends more than five minutes with me knows I love a good swear word. Oh, swear words are my favorite. But they can be a little off-putting in a cozy book. 

Shan: Yeah. Mm-hmm. 

Cate: And so this may have been part of what turned me off at the beginning because. The F-bombs, they just felt kind of forced.

Cate: They were not natural. Right. And they should natural. Yes, 

Shan: yes, yes. 

Cate: They shouldn't be forced. No. And so there's also some open door bedroom action. And so someone looking for a fully cozy experience may want a more closed door romance. Okay. Without the extra spice. So these are things I think you should know going into it because the cover looks as we [00:36:00] were talking about.

Cate: Mm-hmm. Super quaint. Yes. Very cozy. And while this does hold true in many ways, the spice and language could turn true, cozy, romantic enthusiasts off a little bit. That being said, if you don't mind a few obscenities and some steamy sizzle, then. Enjoy. Have at it. Cool. 

Stephanie: Yeah. Sometimes these books trick you.

Stephanie: It's like there's a witch on the front and she's got like a spell in her hand, and then it's like really spicy. And you're like, what? 

Cate: That's what happened with Mirth and Magic Tale of Mir and Magic for me. You 

Stephanie: gotta really know what you're getting into. 

Cate: I didn't know, but Brianna knew. She's like, how could you not know?

Cate: She's our go-to person? It's like, can you just determine from this cover what is the spice level? Please? 

Stephanie: Honestly. Yes. And you can't always. You 

Cate: can't. And would you from this. Cover. Would you think that there was language in it? 

Briana: The entire time I've been looking at the cover, I wouldn't even put that in a romantic category to me.

Briana: Right. That's just cozy fantasy, right? 

Cate: Yes. 

Briana: So the elements you were describing, I was like, oh, there is that romantic element to it. And I would never picture swearing. I would think it'd be like [00:37:00] wholesome, maybe. Like a cracked door. Yes. Not like I'd fully open 

Stephanie: and 

Briana: I think we're, it's very interesting. 

Stephanie: I think we're so, um.

Stephanie: Focused on, or like, we, we expect the fantasy in a romantic to be high fantasy. Yeah. And this one, it seems as a little lower fake Yes. Because 

Cate: there wasn't the, the whole world building. 

Stephanie: Yeah. Mm-hmm. 

Cate: Which, but I, I, 'cause I, I questioned, I was like, is this a romantic? But it definitely came up as one. Yeah. But the cozy element sort of gave it that different bend.

Cate: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Um, but I, I do think that it's not, I, it's a little bit. Misguided. 

Stephanie: Yeah. 

Cate: Mm-hmm. So, yeah. 

Stephanie: Good to know. 

Shan: Interesting. Can I say one last thing 

Stephanie: please? Final thoughts? All the thoughts. 

Shan: So we talked about a lot of these characters have strong female leads. Mm-hmm. Who do have flaws, but those flaws make them wholesome and like even, you know, more of a brute force in ways, which then makes me think in certain ways, nothing against male or female authors, but is it predominantly female authors who write romantic?

Shan: Yes, for 

Stephanie: sure. [00:38:00]

Shan: That makes mic drop. Let's go girls. That's all I really wanted to say. I mean, 

Stephanie: it's also predominantly female authors writing romance. Mm-hmm. So it would make sense to me, 

Shan: but yes and no. You don't know. Sometimes 

Cate: I think that's gonna change. 

Shan: I think that's 

Cate: change I have. I have hope for the young men coming up that they may be able to tap into some of what it would take to write a truly.

Cate: Mm. Sort of captivating, romantic. 

Shan: I'm curious from like a male's point of view, like how are you going to define these characters and in what way? And what flair of the open closed creek doors are you going to have? Mm-hmm. And how are you going to describe that? Hmm. Boom, boom. 

Stephanie: I'm not sure. I personally wanna know.

Shan: I wanna know. 

Stephanie: I'm fascinated. That sounds like everybody in this room wants to know. 

Briana: Yeah, I don't wanna know. 

Stephanie: Okay. Brianna doesn't wanna know either. I'm 

Briana: gonna keep, it makes me 

Stephanie: feel better. 

Briana: Yeah, no, I'm good. I less, 

Shan: I'm curious see how one would do. 

Briana: Yeah, 

Shan: no, you're like, nah, Brianna 

Stephanie: and I aren't reading it.

Stephanie: We're like, 

Briana: give us it. If it sounds [00:39:00] good, I'll read it. But beyond that, I don't really care. 

Cate: Yeah. 

Briana: Like I'm just gonna go with my ladies that write. Really great stuff. Yeah. And I don't need, 

Cate: I feel like I need to read one of the, the big ones, the true you do because it's not a genre. I don't read romance. I don't read.

Cate: I do read fantasy, but even the fantasy, again, sometimes you're really committed to a long journey 

Shan: to commitment. 

Cate: Yeah. And so I'm not always, I'm not always up for that. But 

Briana: that was a lot. That was kind of my biggest issue with getting into the genre. 'cause I don't really commit to series very well.

Briana: Mm-hmm. But loved Fourth Wing, like once I finally got past the first book in the AAR series, I blew through it 'cause I loved it so much. So now I'm starting thrown a glass and I'm kind of having that issue of like. Alright, I gotta commit to this for like a week or two when I know I could have already read two or three books if I wasn't reading this one.

Briana: Mm-hmm. So it's once you. Start reading it, you may find like, oh no, I love this. I'm going to keep going. Or you'll know, you know what? Yeah, yeah. This isn't really for me. I'm done. I'm [00:40:00] gonna 

Stephanie: this. I also like to like, if it's a big series, but I'm intrigued, I'm like, try the first book. 

Cate: Yeah, yeah. 

Stephanie: And then see, 'cause if I love the first book, then I'm excited to read the rest of them.

Stephanie: Right? Yeah. Versus if the first book is just fine. Like for me, the first Akata book, I was like, eh, so I didn't finish. 

Briana: Yeah. It's not 

Stephanie: good. And I moved on, but it's not good. But then 

Briana: you get to book two and it's fantastic, in 

Stephanie: my opinion anyway. But like I, you get excited to wanna read the rest of the books.

Stephanie: Yeah. If the first one really hooks you. 

Cate: Yeah, but then you have to deal, at least this is my experience when I do really get into a series, then I have to go through a se, like a, a period of depression when it's all over. Yeah. I'm getting, because it really, you have that sort of coming down of like, oh, 'cause then you're so connected to the characters and they're just, they're, they're, it's done.

Briana: I'm four books into an eight book series right now. I read. So I don't remember. 

Cate: I, I do, I maybe really like you. I do too. But I initially, like when I fir, when I'm on those last few pages, I'm like walking. I don't wanna finish. It's, that's exactly it. Yeah. 

Stephanie: No. All right. Any other final thoughts on romantic as a genre?

Shan: Go, women. Sorry. 

Stephanie: Oh, [00:41:00] okay. Just wanna 

Shan: say 

Stephanie: that. 

Briana: Heck yeah. Give it a try. Anything here piqued your interest? Just try it because you'll never know unless you try it. 

Shan: Listen to Fourth Wing. It's fun. 

Briana: Yeah, 

Shan: listen, 

Stephanie: also if you're looking to dip into this, there are lots of ya romantic books that are gonna be, um, not spicy.

Stephanie: Mm-hmm. So kind of give you a, like, if you are not sure that you're gonna like romantic, maybe try a ya book. I don't have any off the top of my head right now, but, um, 

Shan: visit, 

Briana: I see you at the 

Shan: library. We can 

Stephanie: help you figure that out. Avatar is the beginning. 

Briana: Throne of glass is more so ya than aar. So you could start with Throne of Glass.

Briana: If you want to explore the Ser j Moss universe in a way that doesn't have a whole lot of. Spice. 

Stephanie: Yeah. So you're gonna get that romantic Yeah. Fantasy element, but it's gonna ease you into it. Yeah. A little bit better than some of the mm-hmm. Some of the adult picks. 

Shan: Cool. 

Stephanie: It's time to close the book on today's episode.

Stephanie: If you like what you've heard here, please subscribe to the show. This ensures that you won't miss any episodes. And if you have a moment, kindly rate and review the podcast. This helps other bookish people like yourself. Find the show. Tune in later [00:42:00] this month for our second episode to find out what else is on the shelf.

Stephanie: Bye bye. Bye.