Jennifer Bewes: A Real Live Iron Woman!

Our season opener starts off strong with our next guest who joins us all the way from Australia! She’s a leader in aerospace innovation, holding the title CEO of iJetPack. This real live iron woman will have you believing that literally anything is possible. 

She’s here to share her life journey from building her career in digital innovation in the corporate space, her helicopter experience, to then starting her own jet suit company in the midst of Covid 19. She’s currently training to set the Guinness world record for jet suit flight distance! She will be setting off on a 2112 mile journey across the continent of Australia which will no doubt test the limits of both physical and mental human capability. Check out her social to follow along on her amazing journey! 

www.helijen.com 
@HeliJen
@iflyjetpack 

Transcript

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You're listening to the forever on the fly podcast Hello, hello. Hello and welcome back to the forever on the fire podcast season two of your bi weekly dose of aviation inspiration, education and entertainment. My name is Diane dollar. And I am Jose. And yes, you guessed it. We're here to get you guys hooked on aviation. Wow Season Two. Thank you guys so much for sticking around with us for season numero dos. We're so thrilled to keep this show going and to showcase some amazing and inspirational guests and to teach you guys something along the way. So seniors, yeah, you have a new gig. I do. Yeah, I'm gonna be flying for a friend of mine is doing some corporate stuff and getting into an SSR 22 this week. Sexy. Yeah, doing a little fixed wing flying. And guess what's coming? What's coming? Is 350 A B three. My favorite helicopter of all times. So I'm really excited for that to get excited for you. And I'm a little jealous. I want to be flying to be three as well. Yeah, no, it's gonna be so great because now I have some time to focus more on the nonprofit and the event that's coming up. Yes, please do tell. Yes. The dare to dream. aviation career day, August 22 hangar 21. In Fullerton, California. Space is limited. So go ahead to www dot forever on the fly.com under a youth outreach, dare to dream event tickets, and of course they're free of charge. Thanks to our sponsors United States Air Force youth inspiration nation us vertical magazine to six l construction. And young eagles is going to be holding an event in conjunction with ours at the same location hangar 21 Fullerton California, you can register your kids for fixed wing flights. They're either first come first serve, or you can check into young eagles de.org Young Eagles de.org. I don't think they have the event posted quite yet. But continue to check in when we get closer to the date and you'll be able to sign your kids up for the fixed wing flight. helicopter flights at the event are first come first serve. So when you come to the event, there's going to be a registration table for your kid to get a discovery flight and a helicopter. Super exciting. On top of the flights. We are also going to have an entire simulator corner with the full motion simulator stem simulator. The US Air Force is bringing a virtual reality experience which should be really cool. I'm excited for that one. And we're also going to have an entire career seminar that will be all day long with some amazing guest speakers with someone from pretty much every profession. Yeah, we most of them. Yeah, we got air traffic controllers. We got flight attendants, airline pilots, helicopter pilots, and air aeronautical engineers, military pilot military pilots. Yeah, so it's gonna be a really fun day. So come on out and bring the kiddos for a whole day of aviation inspiration and education and entertainment. We invited Morgan Freeman but I don't know if it'd be pretty dope though. It'd be pretty cool if he decided to come along. I would have him like record my voicemail like for like Morgan Freeman, can you just say my name one time? Just one time one time, Jose. I'm terrible. I'm sorry Mr. Freeman, please come to our event. If you're alright guys, our season opener starts off strong with our next guest who joins us all the way from Australia. She's a leader in aerospace innovation holding the title ce o of AI jetpack this real live iron woman will have you believing that literally anything is possible. She's here to share her life journey from building her career in the digital innovation in the corporate space or helicopter experience to then starting your own jet to company and the Mr. COVID-19 Wowza. It's pretty impressive. She's currently training to set the Guinness World Record for jet flight distance by setting off on a 2112 mile journey across the continent of Australia. They were so insane the mental and physical stamina that she's going to have to have in order to make it across the continent on a jet suit. That's pretty unreal. Yeah. And we're gonna learn all about what that journey is going to entail and what type of training she's gonna have to undergo and the logistics of something like that is just absolutely insane. So she's here to chat about that as well. And let's bring around, bring him out, bring him out, bring him out, bring him out. Miss Jennifer views. And I said, Well, I would circumnavigate Australia, my jetpack. And they're like, oh, okay, that's cool. Why don't you do it? I'm halogen and I'm forever on the fly Are you crazy? Are you? I saw that on your website. What do you say to those people when they ask you that? Mmm, hmm. Everything's a matter of perspective, isn't it? How am I crazy? According to some people? Yeah. I don't feel I actually feel like I don't take risks. And no, I don't feel I don't feel crazy. But perhaps that's what crazy is, like, you don't know it. Right? No, definitely not crazy. Let's just start from the beginning. I want to know everything. You've had such a fascinating life with everything that I've read through the articles and on your website. And I just want to share everything with our listeners. Who are you? Where did you grow up? What was your childhood? Like? What were you like, as a child? Did you have family in aviation? And yeah, let's just go from there. Sure. So I grew up in Sidmouth, a little coastal town in Devon population about 10 to 12,000. So very small place. It was a very humble kind of upbringing, both working class parents and you know, living in the country and growing up in farmlands and playing with horses and stray cats and running around and having having a great freedom that I think many folk in this city kind of upbringing don't get to have. And and that freedom definitely allowed my creativity and my curiosity just to go wild. So I think that was kind of set from a very young age to kind of just allow curiosity to, to go wild and follow it and keep playing with things. Yeah, so I had I had a really good upbringing. There no airs and graces, and everybody was really down to earth. And, you know, I remember seeing somebody come down into Devon from London, and it was like, Oh, my God, these people and yeah, and then then later on, you know, I ended up moving up in that direction and, and going into corporate life and, and completely changing from from my, my country roots. But yeah, that was kind of my upbringing and got a got a sister, who's three years older than me. And we used to fight like cats and dogs that were younger, I think my siblings do. But love each other to bits and keep in contact now. They're all still back in the UK. So I'm the only one over here in Australia. And what capacity were you working on like in the corporate world as far as like, what field were you in? Yeah, well, my career was really varied. And I think it really talks to the fact that I just tend to follow this curiosity. So I am not a learner. That works well, with theory and books, and all that kind of stuff. I'm, I question everything, and I research everything. And I rely much more on the consistency of observation, then I do on just reading things and listening to people's perspective. I think these are important ingredients, but they don't, they're not always accurate, I find that observation tends to an observation of behavior tends to lead to more accuracy, then then people's interpretations and how they might express things. So I've kind of always questioned that and and so this experimental approach started when I was young, I worked in hospitality, and no, I lied when I was 11 and said that I was 13. So I could get a job at a hotel when I was 15. And, and said, Yeah, it's my 30th birthday that way. Oh, no. I'm not very good liar. Barely learning. So I watched through the hotel industry, and by the time I was 18, I was running a hotel restaurant bar in the seafront. And then I realized that I didn't lie customer's very much, and that I probably needed to try something else. And I thought I, you know what, I think I want to be a lawyer as you do. And of course, because I left school at 16 and had no interest in reading books and academic studies and all of that. It's like, okay, how do I get into that? So I managed to talk my way into a law firm and work for a partner and tried out that industry realized that I didn't like it very much. But what I what I did learn was that I had created a program, I saw that there was some repetition of the way that they were, the secretaries were writing out these that everything seemed really consistent, they were just changing names in it. These were back in the days this is show my agent, back in the days where macros on on typewriters were like their new technology. And not many people knew about it. So worked out a way to program macro in there, that just meant they all they had to do was type the customer's name, it saves them a shitload of work. And so that was looking back on reflection that was kind of that was an indicator of where I would end up going. And I then worked, I tried out retail. And in the background, I taught myself to code, I'd actually learned to code when I was back. Eight years old, my dad was into computer programming, and had all these PC books and I learned how to code this game called Pong. I don't know whether you it's just a really simple thing, because again, that's my age showing. But I was like, Oh, wow, this is amazing. I can I can spend three weeks finger single finger typing this code and I'm going to be able to create a game isn't this amazing? So I did that and and I got to the end of the three weeks that it took me and it came up on it all it's black and white glory, and said, press spacebar to continue as like, Oh my God, I've actually done it. I know what those words man. And I press the spacebar and it says syntax error line 1148. I was like, Oh my God, I've got to count. All of those lines work out where I've gone wrong. So from that day, I decided that I would, I needed to decipher what what that code meant. It's a language of some sort. And I needed to work it out. And that was really my introduction to coding and then the internet. It kind of the wild west of internet before Google happened. And I taught myself how to HTML code. I had a stent in modeling. And, and I, I saw how many people were being stung by people trying to take money off them to say that they were going to be models, but they're not problem model agencies. So I wrote a guide to modeling to help help those people. And I set up a forum, which was, you know, again, Wild West, this was really early days with animated GIFs of, I remember, I had one with Homer Simpson popping up out of whole that was really like out there back then. And so I done this, and I did some temping work and moved up to Redding. And and my marketing director there saw what I was doing in my spare time, and, and that I created this global community of photographers and model agents, and, you know, from overseas, which again, you know, with the internet being so new was kind of like, Wow, that's amazing. You can connect with all these people. And so then she said, right, I want you to run the launch of mobile, not mobile, or an internet site. And so then that started my career in, in innovation and digital innovation within the corporate space that was CompuServe, which was then bought by AOL. Then I worked in visa V, which then became Vodafone and Vodafone then, was what got me to Australia. So don't just 3g mobile phones. So yeah, so it's kind of been a little bit of like, whoa, explore your way around. And and I think the common theme is just following. Following something inside that just keeps directing me going. Yeah, that feels good. And go and let's let's follow that path until it no longer feels good. And when it no longer feels good. You go off and explore something else until that feels good. Yeah, following the curiosity. That's so funny. I have one of those my intent bracelets and wearing it right now. And I had it engraved Stay curious. Yeah. So important. Yeah. So yeah. So this is my daily reminder to stay curious and to follow those. Those instincts. Yeah. No, I was like, I think she's gonna like this bracelet. For a while good show, I think it can really annoy other people too, though it's like hard, you really have to be curious about everything. Yes, and that's how I've gotten to where I am today. Miss holiday. Right? And so what inspired you to get into aviation? What inspired you about helicopters, it's kind of just the continuation of that story really. So I, I managed to work my way up the corporate ladder, and, and, you know, got to the, the two percenters and and realize that I had lost, I had lost the passion, and for quite some time, but I hadn't realized because you get so busy, and you just end up like churning over what you're doing on a daily basis and trying to keep up. And I realized that, oh, hang on a second, this, I'm just not feeling it anymore. And I, when I took some time out to reflect on that, I realized that the, the, the key thing with me is learning, I have an absolute addiction to learning. And it's common throughout my entire life. And what I, what I kind of realized happened was, as you climb the ladder, and you've been there for 20 years, you start, you know, so you start knowing more and, and learning less, and you start scraping around. So you get to the kind of 80% of learning and then just kind of scratching the surface going, okay, what can I, what else can I get out of this. And of course, you turn your you turn your focus to other great things, which is for me, you know, helping other people move up in their careers and doing all of that, but it still just, it just wasn't enough. I also became really tired and frustrated of constantly having to, because in innovation, you know, you're constantly having to pitch in to executives, and trying to get them to buy into your ideas. And, and I was just, it was just always very dream harder work than I felt necessary. And so I grew tired of that. And one of the things that happened, I started speaking more, and I wrote a column for Australian Financial Review. And people kept saying to me, oh, you should write a book, you should read book. And I'm like, oh, yeah, thanks. It's really nice, blah, blah, blah. And then more people kept saying it was like, Okay, I'm just gonna have to write a book because it will keep people quiet. So I go off to Hawaii, and I take a helicopter tour and land on the top of this mountain in Maui with 360 views and had it might have had a glass of champagne. And it was at a really, really hectic time in my corporate career when my mind is like running at 5 million miles an hour and, and I've just got to the top of that mountain. First of all, I love the beautiful grace of the air was easy, 130 and just the way that it flew. It was just like a ballet. It's beautiful. So I love that bit. And then when I stood on top of this mountain, and realize there's nobody else here for you, nobody else can get here. There's no way to get here by road. And I got the feeling of feeling centered. And it was the first time I'd actually connected what that meant. So I know clearly what it means when you read it on paper, but to feel it is something completely different. And it was like it was like something sliced through this chaos in my head and just created this piece. And, and it was what absolutely what I needed right then so I was like, oh shit, how do I get this? And I thought, Okay, well, I need to be writing a blog. And I really like this feeling. So what if I wrote a book on top of a mountain that's accessible only by helicopter? And then I can get this feeling and it would be perfect for a place to write a book when you feeling so at peace. And so I got back from Hawaii, and I took my first helicopter lesson. And then I fell in love with helicopters like crazy. Oh my god, we quit my Korea and it was like, right, that's it. I have no time for that. I'm focusing on on flying. So yeah, that's how it started. Wow. I know. I can remember. I remember like my first time flying and it was just like the hook. I got like this. I was addicted. It was just where it was. Yeah, it was in San Diego. Like and what were you doing before that like how well I took some time off. I went traveling when I got out of the military. And then essentially I was working as an armored guard transporting money for the banks, you know, like those guys in the armored cars and they pick up money, you know, that kind of stuff. I knew I didn't want to do that for the rest of my life, I got a demo flight. And it was just it was a game changer. after that. I was like, Well, I know what I need is somebody say to you, you should you should fly out, do something I always wanted to do in the military. But at the time, the war was going on for so long, that my parents wanted me to get out and go to school. So I ended up getting out. And one day I just kind of like I was like, you know, I really want to just go check this out. And let me see if I can figure it out. I didn't know that the GI Bill could pay for it or not, or the benefits that we had could pay for it. And at the time, they didn't. It was like 5050 that they would pay. And yeah, you know, I just I just remember getting up one day and just like really falling in love with it. And then I just got addicted. And that was the end of that you know just robbed a couple armored cars and we did meet back then I was wearing a ski mask you were you were driving a car. I was like, opportunity to meet you. I didn't even know you drove an armored car. See, I feel like every single time we do interviews, I learned something new about this guy that I didn't know before. So it's always fun. Yeah, armored cars, mystery. Very cool. Might need one in fitness by the sounds of it. Yeah. Just get around in. So that's, you know, it's really interesting, John, because I feel like this day and age when everybody is like so stuck in their phones, and not looking around and not being an observer. And that's where innovation comes from. Right is looking around you and really observing and watching everything that's going on around you to see what's missing, or new i That's how new ideas come about. And I feel like that's a very rare quality in people these days. So it was really cool to hear that. I mean, that's, you know, inspiring. Yeah, it's inspiring. I think the other thing that is a challenge today is that the other part of innovation is the diversity of thought. And with the digital age that I feel partly responsible for, there's an personalization and all this all it does is serve to fuel us with even more bias. And the more that we start hearing our own bias, the more that we believe it, the less that we listen to others, and particularly others that are completely on the other extreme. I mean, you only have to look at politics and see how how people are just throwing, you know, there's no curiosity there. It's just like, we don't want to hear you How dare you say those kinds of things. And this is, this is kind of the last opportunity for growth and innovation. It's kind of, if we could just turn that narrative round to go, that's really interesting. Can you help me understand why you think that? What if I were to stand on your side for a while and immerse myself in that? Could I at least understand it? And then is there some kind of middle ground that we can get to to create something better that works for us both? And I think we we are at risk with this digital innovation, it's where this digital world is no longer innovation, it is our world now that that we just are serving ourselves to become less innovative in some fields, but of course there's there's so much diversity in the world that there are also a lot of people that that don't fall prey to that kind of view. Right? Yeah. So you got your license Did you ever write that book on top of the mount? No no, I didn't want to do that anymore. I actually had started a criminology degree as well and I decided that you know, I'm going to put all my focus into to flying but that was the criminology thing was another I realized another nother way that I was trying to fill that gap of new learning. And I've still I still got there's still something in that criminal juice space that I feel I need to do something with like I'm totally curious around the power of the human mind and and how it is that some people's interpretations of the things that are happening to them and result in behaviors that are less accepted in society? Or are very conformist. I kind of love these extremes. Dreams of things and, and the fact that the there's the senses are are in many cases taking the same information in and yet processing it so wildly different. And that for me is is what absolutely fascinates me. Well what drove me to become an armored car robber? Maybe that's a story for another time. So once you got your license, what was the next step in your helicopter journey? What did you do next? Well, I started off with a guy down there, private license red. And then and then I thought, oh, you know what, I just want to learn as much as I can about this. And so then I went down the commercial path, but I kind of knew in my heart of hearts that it wasn't it wasn't something that I wanted to do as a career. So my, my, my challenge is that I get bored very quickly with anything that's routine. And And whilst whilst flying helicopters is not routine, because there are so many things. And that's why I love it so much. I don't think I could ever get bored of it in that sense. But I know that starting out in your career to play you have to go through and you do the charter flights, or you do instruction and, and that's me as they go, how do I shortcut all of that? I just want to do the cool stuff. When you when you figure that out? Let's hear the secret book, you should write about it. Yeah, to cut that bit out? Well, I did manage to find a way to do that. And I said, Okay, well, what can I do? What? What are some of the strengths that I have? And where are some of the gaps in the industry? And how can I then put myself into those gaps and do some exchanges so that I can get to do the cool stuff. And that's when I met David Adamson, from specialist helicopters. And I said to him, hey, you know, I could look after some of the your brand and your digital side of things, if you can teach me some of the flying for, you know, film pilot stuff as they that's really cool. Because I used to have a dark room when I was in my teens, and you know, love photography. And, and so this was kind of the perfect mix doing something that's creative and, and with moving images at the same time is flying and, and so he was like, Yeah, okay, cool, we can do that. And I'm like, never know, unless you ask. I'm like, wow, okay, this is really cool. So, so then I started doing, going along on flights with him and doing extra training with him. And I mean, he's, he, he has shown me, again, through, He's not one to tell you, but he will do the scenario based training where you get to experience your own deficiencies. And boy did I have a lot. I still do, by the way, I still do. But, um, but that was, you know, this, this really works for a learning mindset like mine, as well, where you kind of go, that's great. Now, I really know what I need to work on. But at the same time, was getting to go and fly around the country. And, and even to observe, you know, how, how that works, how a professional works with, with the camera in, in film, piloting. And the one the one thing that I really had underestimated was just how much work goes on for the pilot in coordinating all of that. So before you kind of go, Ah, it's really cool, you get to fly around, but But no, I mean, when you're when you're filming with cars, or boats or air to where, you know, the pilot is doing all of the communications and selling you know, what's the banking angle that you need to be going into thinking about where the sun is thinking about the frame, looking at the monitor and just knowing what it takes to get that great picture but also all of the dynamics of the weather and you know, everything about the helicopter at the same time and then getting communications in your air from the director the you know, the the the camera guy and and and everybody else who's on the ground it's just like this massive chaos and and yet he does it with such calm, just ease. Ease. Yeah. And I'm just like, Whoa, that is awesome. I just really want to do that stuff. But there's a reason why it takes 1000s of hours to be able to get to that space. But yeah, I mean, that that's the ultimate I think, where you guys are flying in an A star or any See what yeah, what what are you guys finding? Yeah, and I saw Yeah, the beats three. Beautiful. Oh my god, I just love that. A B three he doesn't know it'd be three plus B three plus. Yeah, still though. That's super nice. I'm super biased. I love a stars. Yeah, me too. Yeah, they're just so good. I remember as learning you're getting in for the first time and learning to fly that thing and thinking, oh my god, it's like getting in a racehorse just wants to go and feeling totally out of control. You know, it was like, how am I ever going to be able to work with this baby? And of course you do. Right? And yeah, just flying with her is just a dream. Absolutely. When you're doing your training, was it in a 22? Or was it in a Robinson 22 I'd actually really love to go back to flying and I haven't flown one for years now. And it's kind of I kind of liken it to you know, you, you drive a Ferrari and then you go into a go kart Not that I've ever driven a Ferrari by the way in my head that I have driven a Ferrari and but but there are 22 is like getting in the go kart, you know, it's really fun. And and you got to do it every once in a while. So I'd love to get back into that at some point. I had a go at mustering up in the northern territories, number of years back and that was really great fun as well. You should have somebody record that for you. Your first pickup back in 22. You know, somebody like record it, you know, that? We've met we've mentioned before Jose's his experience getting back into a 44. Yeah, is an interesting pickup. Apparently, I was. I started instructing again, I haven't checked it in about five years ish. And I started getting back into it about a month ago. You know, of course, I got to get trained back up to standards and learn the aircraft. So when I picked up the Robinson 44, I swear to God, he thought I was like, brand new student. I was like, Whoa, what is happening? And like, my, my instructor who's a good friend of mine, he's a chief pilot now at a flight school down in Orange County. And he would start laughing at me. All right, Jose, the basics. Just work on the base. And I was like, and then I started thinking, Alright, I was outside, you know, doing my thing. And next thing you know, it just comes like clockwork naturally. But yeah. I told him I was just pretending to be a student. Just, you know, yeah. Keeping you on your toes. Yeah, see how you do? Yeah, that's awesome. Well, let's talk jetpacks crazy, so crazy to me, that we're sitting here talking about jet packs. So cool, real life iron woman over here. What got you into that? What What was your inspiration to start a jet pack? Oh, well, I had like I said, I kind of with the helicopters, because I knew that I loved flight and needed to carry on flying and and helicopters will always be my my deep passion. But I didn't want to make a career of that. So I was thinking, Oh, how else do I bring in flight? But take again, so what were my strengths, my strengths, being in innovation, and I started looking around in I had my head in stats around accident stats and, and came up with a couple of concepts. But that that felt that that wasn't quite right. For now. I'll revisit that when I make my millions. Well, baby and, and so I thought, Okay, well, what else is there and I it was a pretty tough time in my life, really, because I quit my career and I'd separated with my husband and sold the house and, and got rid of everything. And I sat in silence for six months just to start to try to question Who am I and and start to really get to know myself I felt like I created this personality of the years that I had actually lost who I was and then I realized I'd never actually met who I was and and so there was there was a really kind of tough time confronting to kind of realize that you you don't know yourself and and so at the same time, you know, not having any that's that familiar stability and and to have quit your career at the same time and to not have any income and, you know, kind of kind of just threw everything out At the same time, and so I'm thinking, Okay, well, what were my strengths while they were in innovation? And, and I went out with a friend of mine and over over beers, I said to the two of them, what would you do if you could do anything in the world? And Money's no object? What would you do? Like what would your passion be? What would you explore? And they both came back with astronauts. And I was like, Dell. Sorry, no, no. No, the astronauts, you're listening right now. I can't imagine sitting still in the same in a spaceship for so long. I would be bored of mindless. I mean, it would be fun, fun for the first 10 minutes. Okay, what do we do now? There's nowhere to go. So yeah, for me, okay. I think I've dug my hole. So and so they said, Well, what would you do then? And I said, Well, I would circumnavigate Australia by jetpack. And they were like, oh, okay, that's cool. Well, why don't you do it? I thought, Ah, well, why don't I? And so that started a year of research and really understanding how feasible is this? What would it take? What would it cost? And, and, and also going through the self narrative guy, you know, one of the things I found really interesting was, I would get frustrated in the corporate world with pitching in ideas that I've, I really strongly believed were gonna be the next big game changer. And anatomy, like, why is the CEO not, you know, not seeing what I can see. And then it came to my own decision. So I was like, ah, but now you're not backing yourself. So why is that? What are what are the things holding you back? So if you're so convinced, and I realized, you know, money has a big thing to play in this and but there were a lot of excuses that I was giving myself that then I just had to self coach myself out of and I was like, You know what, I'm going to do it. I'm going to do it. And and the way that I got my head around that was, I thought to myself, what's the real worst that could happen? The worst that could happen is I have no money. And I ended up on the streets. And you know what, I've been very close to that before. And I was able to get out. So really, is that something you need to be fearful of? Well, mostly, I think it's pride that gets in the way had that if that happens, you know, the pride gets hurt. But fundamentally, if you've been able to get through it once before, then you've got to be able to get through it again. And so I thought, okay, all right. Well, let's do it all in. That's let's go for this. And it has been an emotional roller coaster. One minute feeling like yeah, I'm on top of the world. This is awesome. And then let it go. What am I doing? You know, why am I doing? And am I am I just making this all up in my head? Am I crazy? Am I crazy, right? By myself, Coach says no, you're not crazy, Jen, that you, you know why you want to do this, you know, I decided that I wanted to this life is really, really short. And and finance is people talk and budget with money as if it's the only finite resource in the world. And it's not time is our only finite resource in the world. And yet, we don't budget it properly. We make excuses and we don't get on and do things. And I just think our life on this planet is really short. So I want to be able to kind of create my life in the way that I'd want it written. And and so that kind of gave me permission to go okay, well, what would the next chapter look like and shit? Yeah, I'd want to go and jetpack across Australia. Of course, I would want to do that in a book. Yeah. So let's do it. And yeah, so I took the 12 months of planning, and then I met David Mayman from jetpack aviation. Who's an Ozzy, and he happened to be over here. And he he sat down over lunch with me very generous with his time great guy. And he, he's looked through the plans, he made a few minor changes and said, Yeah, it's totally possible. I'm like, oh my god, it's barely possible. I'm gonna do this training with him. Did you just cold call him? Yeah, yeah. I yeah, I'm Jan I want to fly a jet pack across Australia. Can you help me? Yeah, it was very much yeah. Wow, that's one of the other things that was a challenge. At first I was thinking how am I going to get into this this world? You know, I don't have I don't have the network in the abs. industry at all. And, you know, how do I how do I very quickly build that network? And at first, my narrative was like, oh, no, you can't just go out and ask people. And so then my self coaching would come in and go, Well, why not? And like, oh, yeah, good idea. Why not? Can Happen. Just say, yeah, what's the worst that could happen? Yeah. And and, and so yeah, and he is, he's such an awesome guy, you know, and I think him and Richard Browning as well from from gravity, they're both so down to earth and doing something that is their passion. And it kind of just was reassuring to me to kind of go Yeah, I get it. And I like, I like these people. And I like this kind of vibe going on. And that's so important to be in amongst an environment that is full of, you know, supportive, people that are just doing what they love and wanting to make progress in the world. So yeah, that's inspiring. Yeah, that is inspiring. While senior to got a lot of respect for you. That's awesome. All right, go getter. You know, I am, I've chatted with Richard Browning a couple times via email. And, you know, I literally just wrote in an inquiry onto the website, and he's the one who answered me. I was shocked. I was like, wow, I got the guy. I got the guy got the main guy. That's cool. You know, and we exchanged a couple emails. I was like, I'm gonna be a jetpack pilot someday I'm gonna do it. And he was like, Yeah, you should do it. I'm like, Yeah, I will do it. But like, I don't know how I'm gonna do it. Like, can I come over there? And then they're like, Well, yeah, you can give us like a, you know, whole bunch of money and come over here and do it. I'm like, I don't have a whole bunch of money. But you know what, I'm gonna get someone else to pay for it someday. He's like, Well, let me No, no, but I had invited him on to the podcast and originally he was you know, all about and he got really busy and it just ended up not being able to happen at least not not yet. We'll get him on here eventually. But yeah, so I've flown I originally went with the David moments jetpack and started my training over there and you know, it's it's a real beast of machine and I was wearing my Fitbit at the time and just before my very first flight, I thought oh, just check this heart rate because I can feel it through my clothes at the moment. And I learned and I was like 135 or my heart rate before I'd actually flown it and I'm like, Wow, this beats exercise for sure peloton Yo, I try to tell you about that in a minute. But the so so then I flew that flew that jet pack and it is it's, it requires a lot of stability and it's it it is a proper aircraft because you do have hand controls to your suit your you've got your throttle then you've got your your and your other hand. Because because you're kind of all in a single line with your body in the middle and then you've got the two engines either side, any very slight movement changes you see of g and then actually moves you along with it. So you have to be really careful not to move your legs or and that's really difficult. So if you suddenly feel propulsion, you know your legs kind of want to move back and it's hard to keep them together so you can see in my training videos where I'm trying to cross my legs to stop one of them flailing out and then to take take me along with it and what would without the tether would be would be a serious crash. And so it was I knew with that one that I was going to require a lot of training to be able to fly that off tether and confidently and and feel safe doing so and I kind of discount I'd seen the jet suit but I kind of discounted it because I know Richards you know former not marine but you know former military and and he's super fit like he does that calisthenics stuff and can hold himself sideways on a bar whereas, you know, I can hold on hold a plank for about two seconds. And I was like no, you know what, I am never gonna be able to fly that thing. And then my curiosity was like kicking in and going well that's bit judgey of you Jen like you should go and try it and test out your theory. And so that's when I went over there and and I flew it and the first time flying that thing it I never really thought that my childhood had anything to do with aviation or flying but the minute that I flew that I really I recalled a very vivid childhood dream where I would lift up my arms to fly and that would have to push down really hard to take off. And it was one of those frustrating recurring Sometimes you take off and other times you wouldn't. And it happens to be like real life on a jet suit. You take off, sometimes you don't. And, but but the whole, the whole physiology of pushing down to lift off was exactly the same as this dream. And it was just this is it, I just knew then I had to make this thing. It was always like, what that dream was a premonition. And that's what I chose to believe. And, and so I knew I needed to actually fly that one, rather than the jetpack, the difference being that there are no controls on it on a jet suit, it's it's body control, rather than a trigger for your, for your throttle, there's your the rest of it is all controlled by body movement. And because you've got now a tripod effect of all of your, your thrust factors, it's like a tricycle versus a unicycle. And so you know, your stability is much harder to get wrong. And so it feels just more intuitive and safe. And from a controlling perspective, it is an extension of your own abilities, things that you're more familiar with. So for example, if you're in the water, and you're swimming along, and you want to turn to the right, you, you would take your left arm and you push it back, and you would and you would turn to the right, well, that's exactly the same as what you do with the thrust that you have with the Jetsons. So everything and then if you're falling and you're falling to the right, you would normally extend your hand to push to stop yourself from falling. And you do that with the jet, certain thrust will push you back. So it's very, very natural, and therefore makes it much easier to to learn but also much more stable to fly. So I knew it had to be that. Yeah, so your throttle, is it a squeeze type of thing or is a roll like, because you can't really see your hand, it's a trigger. It's a trigger. Yeah. And and you just keep it in all the time. So in your in your left arm sleeve, you, you you've got a trim switch, and the trim was set to the maximum power for for when you pull the throttle right in. So you can set that according to your body weight, so that you get about the right type of height. Now if you were going to do some really strong banking angles, you would be able to trim up in flight, but typically you're just controlling the thrust by moving your arms. So the more that you move your arms vector down, the more lift, you're going to get up and and so if you want to just reduce your, your altitude a little bit, then you're just going to raise your arms up a little bit rather than messing around with the wheel throttle and trim. Yeah, and they just makes it much smoother. And again, you feel much more in control. Is it the same on the other side with the yaw? Hand? You said you have? Your is is there's there's no your controls? No no mechanical linkages whatsoever. So it's, it's, like I say it's like the swimming thing. So you're just moving your arm back and you're stuck. So there's two different things. You've got the jet pack and then you have the jet suit. Correct. So the jet pack is the one like the trim on it. Or what the yaw on it? Yeah, it's got mechanical controls, whereas the jet suit has no mechanical controls. So jet jet soon it's it's like it's like super powered limbs. Really? Whereas the aircraft Yeah. How many hours do you have flying your jet suit? So following that? We talk in minutes minutes have you logged? Well, so I actually have probably already about under two hours, okay. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. How so to get really solo. So I haven't I haven't done that yet. So that's, that's what we're building at the moment. So there's the I had done the training, my intent was never to build my own. My intent was just a fly across Australia with one of their machines. And and I went I was at Richard's place on and, and we will look at where we're in his workshop. And I said to him, you know, so what do you think like when somebody else like creates another one of these and at the time, I didn't realize it was going to be me. He was like, he was like, oh, no, that's totally cool. Because you know, this competition is a good thing. And I'm quite confident that we can move quicker than anyone else. And, and so it's like, oh, that's a really cool attitude. To Have and when I flew back, I actually landed. And that was I was supposed to be going back over to LA to do the jet pack continue on the training there. But COVID Then hit and the international travel bans kicked in. And so that trip got canceled. And my prediction was that that was going to be at least a year, which turned out to be true, it's probably going to be another year from now even for Australia, we're still not allowed to do international travel. And, and so I thought, Okay, well, I can't afford to not do too to wait that long. And also, I just want to get training and do this. So what are my options? Well, my only option is to build my own. And because I can't afford to buy one of theirs, and they don't have them for sale anyway. So I got to build my own. And that was decided that in about March last year, I think, yeah, March last year. And so it took me a good six months to then find somebody that could actually build it. I knew what I wanted. But, you know, can I actually put those parts together? No, could I go and study it? It did cross my mind was like, Oh, maybe I could just become an engineer. And possible, there's always learning. Yeah, but I thought, Okay, well, two things wrong with that one is time to get there. And if I don't take the time, then the risk of me getting it wrong and, and killing myself would kind of defeat the purpose. So. So I decided to find somebody and it took me six months to find my engineer, but I did find him. And he's the only person to single handedly build a rocket rocket fuel jet pack. So the ones that you see in there, like the James Bond, movies from the 60s, one of the very first ones that you see lasts for about 23 seconds in the air. But it's like a crazy basic machine, there's there's very, there's very little control when it takes off. It's kind of from nothing to you, right, you're there. So there's no gentle progression forward. And so he built he built that single handedly and Bill Souter actually sent him an email to congratulate him saying, I don't know how you managed to do that, you know, this is it took him a lot of people to to build their version, the bell version. So and so I was like, Okay, I phoned him up, and I said, Hey, you know, I am doing this thing with an I want to build a jet suit. And he was like, I was hoping you're gonna ask me that. Like, Oh, really? And so yeah, so then we worked together for nine months. That was in September last year, and it's taken us nine months to get the machine built. But all of that time, we've only ever spoken over the phone. And so I'm sending him up, you know, jet engines and and new computers and all of this stuff. And I've never actually met the guy until about three weeks ago, so Oh, wow. Yeah, I'm like I said to him, I'm like EA you're not a scammer. I'm like, Fischer, engineer that you've just been sending. parts to imagine you can imagine the new story like What idiot does that I think he might have killed Oh my god. I love your conscience voice like earlier. I love to hear the inner thoughts. Like as like very judgy of you, Jen, you know early and now and now you're like, Oh my God. I'm God. He lives in a scam I shouldn't say that. Actually. They should I do have these voices in my head. I don't we all we all do. Yeah, but I have what I call my housemate and my housemate is like the real rational one. And I feel like I'm I'm actually the kind of the five year old kid that never wants to grow up and is just there. Yeah, we could do anything and then the house mate comes in and get her Jen. Right. We really need to think this through and I'm like, Oh, God, I roll. Do we have to? Yeah, yeah, things you shouldn't say publicly. Yeah, no, that's going in. Yeah, it's definitely going in. Damn. Dang. Gotta do the first day. Got to do the first day of the show. Season two, episode one. Dang, yeah. I actually spelled spell it da, M N No. So sorry. In English Australia. Like, dang, I could try that. So what's your timeline? So you've, we've talked about a little bit, but for our listeners, so you've built the pack, or the suit, and you're starting to now build the training facility with the tether and everything so that you can start practicing. Yeah, so actually, it's the Fall Protection System arrived this morning at Sydney Motorsport Park, who are fantastic folks who just loved loved the idea of what I'm doing and just said, Yeah, you know, we want to partner with you. They've got the there's a new Australian motorsport innovation precinct opening next year and they've asked me to be the founding one of the founding partners with them for innovation and technology. And so they've given me like fantastic space above turn five, that there's kind of elevated area that overlooks the the hole of the circuit and so I'm building a flight stage there that will have this full protection system or engineered in with it to make it totally safe and putting a briefing Lounge on there as well with like a spectator area. And so that should be finished in with the rest of the stuff arrives at the end of this month. So apart from the brick and lads, roofing loads will come in around August, but the training at least the training thing, so we can get flying, we'll be in a matter of weeks now. So the we did our first test slider the beginning of June, that's when I first met Dhaka face to face. And yeah, it went exceptionally well, you know, I after years of working in innovation, my expectations are always there's going to be a lot of big things that you're going to need to change and over iteration, they become smaller, and you get to a point where you go, Okay, that's enough for us to actually roll with. But actually, there was no really significant engineering challenges with it at all, it was exceptionally stable. And to actually just lift off your neck machine was just oh my god so cool. He was so awesome. Yeah. And, and to Yeah, it's kind of surreal, though, as well, because you've been working on it for so long. And and it made me realize how accustomed to whatever you start doing when you when you do it enough, you just it no longer becomes that thing. That's kind of amazing. It's just It's just what you're doing, you know, and it's but but actually flying it was was sensational. So there are some things that we need to change on it, we're we're currently going to look at reducing the weight in there. So we kind of knew that we would need to do that. And we're going to change some of the trim settings in the electronics. And then we'll take it down to the training center and be able to do some proper flights. So the so the test flights were all run on a single point tether, which was was bit frustrating because it was so stable as they don't want to fly this now. And I can't because I'm stuck on a single point. Yeah, so So I can't wait to get that down and then and then your housemate started speaking up and was like, and I did have a Rao with her like, on the last flight of the day. And Dhaka the my engineer said, so you want to do one more fly? And I said, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then my housemate was going Jan just leave it here. You're kind of getting to the point where you get to get tired, you're gonna make mistakes, you're gonna be pissed off if you don't do this properly. And really, the way you're How am I felt like the five year old in the back of the car soaking. So we should have done it. I suppose I should have just you'll have plenty of time. I sounds like it sounds like you're gonna have an entire continent to cross. Yeah, I mean, it's further than the distance of the diameter Moon, which was kind of like, whoa, whoa, I didn't know. that's mind blowing. So yeah, so you're gonna build the training facility and how long is it going to take you Do you think before you're going to feel ready and safe I mean, I guess you're not going to know until you start training. But yeah, that's right. I mean, based on my experience with flying, gravity's jet solos, it takes like a couple of days, and you feel pretty confident to do that. One of the other big challenges for me is that exercise thing I've just, I just can't, you know, I, I, on the one hand, I believe in the power of the mind, and that you can overcome anything that you want. And then I've got exercise, and it's like, That one doesn't fit into that. Just don't like it. And I keep trying it. And I keep trying to convince myself yeah, you'd love it. You love it, you love it, and it just doesn't work. So there is always a way though, right? So I thought, Okay, well, how do I overcome this challenge of the physicality because I'm gonna really need it to do you know, what is going to be around 16 flights a day, every day, for at least 60 days. So that's, you know, it's, it's a lot. So that's like doing seven minutes of planking 16 times a day, everyday for 60 days. And this is for somebody who can last about two seconds on a on a blanket at the moment. So so it was a problem that, you know, in innovation, they say, you know, you've got to pick, you got to pick a big enough problem we're solving. So this was my big enough problem was solving. So I started researching, okay, how do we overcome this thing, I'm looking at rehabilitation capabilities. And I came across exosuits. And I had been over to the University of California, and had seen some of the hard exosuits. But they're all really bulky, they do the job, they can support your limbs really well, but they're all bulky and weight on on the jet suit is, is not something you want. So then I was researching it more, and I came across this guy who had invented the first soft exosuit. So pretty much like material and look like a normal code. And so I contacted him. I was like, Okay, this is a theme. And if you if you see something, just contact them. And I didn't hear from him for about a month. And I was like, ah, yeah, fair enough. And I didn't want to be that hounding person even though many entrepreneurs go Oh, yeah, just keep hounding people. I don't know. It's just not in my way of doing things. So I didn't, I didn't follow up. And I just thought, Okay, we'll leave that we'll keep researching other ways. And then he just contacted me other blues, like, Oh, I just came across this. And it was in a different folder, blah, blah, blah. And I would love to help. And I'm like, Wow, that's awesome. And so within 24 hours, he put together a proposition and, and got a team together. He's now got about six people working on it. I think he's Italian guy, Lorenzo Marzia. He is a professor at Heidelberg University. And he and his team have their own inventing the world's first bionic fly suit. And so this will this will take, he said to me, Look, we can take 100% off of your shoulders fired by this thing. And I was like, Okay, well, maybe not 100%. Maybe we could just go to 80. Because if something like a fly lands on my face, and I'm not feeling anything, I'm quite likely to just put my hand up. 80,000 you're likely to encounter some flies across the desert, I'm sure. Yeah, exactly. Building that. And we should get to test that pretty soon as well. So you've made really good progress. And we've got dan de uneasy who are the they do a lot of dynamic sports, protective gear, so mostly like Moto GP and all of that kind of stuff. And when you think about the jet suit and how I'll be flying it, it's actually very similar profile to Moto GP, in that I'm not going to be flying very high off the ground, because you want as much forward motion and with the lack of endurance on these things. You don't want to waste time going up. So it's very much a forward motion. And so it made sense to have these kind of Moto GP equipment. And those guys said, yeah, we'd love to support you on this journey. And so we've been testing out flying with their jackets, which will be integrated with the bionic fly suit. And yeah, it's all coming together. It's like kind of surreal. Cool. You made it happen. Yeah, well, I think so. I don't know. He made the he made the calls. He got really smart people working with you. Got it. Like it's gonna, you know, I think the beauty of it is when you find something you're passionate about, it's very hard to hide that passion. And and people want to be involved with other people that are passionate about things. I mean, like I said, Life is so short, why would you want to spend it like moping around, like, get out there and have fun and be amongst people that are like minded in that sense as well. So I've been very lucky, but I haven't met Lorenzo. So maybe he's the scammer. exoskeleton suit on Amazon? Oh, my God. Yeah, then you gotta fall back on all of your criminal mind studies and figure out what made Lorenzo do this. What's meant to happen? Yeah. So pretty good. I got a number of people like, you know, supporting, supporting this. And, yeah, it's just going to be going through the training, I've actually flown the same route by helicopter. And the, it's, you know, as long as the terrain stays interesting, it's okay. But there's part of Western Australia, which is just plain desert, and it's like nothing to see four hours in the helicopter. And it will take me two weeks to get across that part alone. By jet soon, and it's going to be the most boring thing ever. I mean, even flying in the helicopter and doing a little five minute stints. So logistically, how many vehicles are you going to have following you are you going to have a helicopter following you as well, just in case you get injured, and you have to be medivac. Or to tell about it, it's nothing, nothing firm in terms of the helicopter, they will though, the minimum viable solution is to have the support vehicle, which we're going to need to have to carry the fuel drums as well. And to do the refill. So the idea is that we'll we'll be I'll be flying along and a light will go off on my shoulder when I'm down to 30 seconds of fuel and we will converge and do a hot refuel and then keep going on to try and get the you know, the endurance going and also to not keep stop starting the engines isn't great for the engines, so so that that's the plan, that's the theory. And to have to make sure that we've got somebody who knows the basics of first aid the engineer to, to make sure those fixing, fixing things as we go, because it will need to maintenance overhauls whilst and through that journey as well, the engines will so six engines that we need need to go through so there's there's a lot of stuff that needs to happen in that. But I also I don't know whether this is just me, you know, my five year old child again is kind of going Oh, but I also want to do two other really cool stuff whilst I'm doing this journey and do some other you know, like fun stuff, chasing Chasing Cars and doing little races and, and things like that. But I should probably conserve my energy as I'm going across and we'll see how we go. I don't I don't expect this to be anything in any remote form of enjoyment whatsoever. This is going to be for me about the challenge the power of the mind. You know, like I say I have this theory that you can adjust your and reframe your way of thinking to overcome any form of adversity. And this is me putting it to the ultimate test because I really hate exercise. And this is something that requires fitness. I mean, there's a couple of people going oh, yeah, so you're an athlete. And I'm like if that ever gets put in the media with me and the word athlete, yeah. Smoking something. Yeah, I've just absolutely the opposite end of athlete and so this is about me going okay, can I actually over how much of this can I overcome? And I'm okay with the pain in the challenge of things. But am I when it's really put to the extreme like this? This is this is all about self learning, again, I guess and the curiosity and hopefully I'll be able to help others kind of look within themselves and kind of go okay, well, how can I challenge some of my own restrictive or limiting theories that I have the things that are really preventing me I really do believe it's just a mindset and that we can release. So much of that just if we if we care to attempt to take the attention to it Yeah, so obviously you're gonna be camping along the way. Yeah. Wow yeah that's insane that's what I yeah, I'll be I'll be right there with you Jen if I can get my travel exemption I need some other gonna be there. Oh I made the more other energy that I get there and in distraction from the pain of doing it myself like the better. Yeah I don't know how these people who the girl who the 16 year old that went across the ocean on our own I'm like wow that's like serious. Wow. Yeah that's strength but if you put like rollerblades on and you know just got on the road with the Jetpack is there is there it would be useless with balance on things like, you know, I think it was before like, what? Why not the hoverboard and and things like that. Well, I'm useless like my mates used to skateboard. When I was a teen and I've like a Nah, that's not going to happen. Like my, my balance on my feet. I don't know whether it's like I've got big feet. And I just think that that's an impediment. Well, my sister tells me that it should make me swim better. Because I have my own inbuilt flippers. I feel you Jen. Right. Right. They were the size nines, right? Maybe it's the pilot thing. Yeah, maybe maybe we can reach the pedals better. Yeah, exactly. Crazy. Yeah. But um, yeah. So so the hoverboard and anything that involves feet and balance now? I'm better with arm controls. And yeah, but he should get some get some yoga. And before that he word again. You can get some balancing techniques. Yeah, you know, I know I could do it. But I just yeah, the desire factor for it. Yeah, yeah, you'll have your you'll have your suit. It's gonna help a lot. Exactly, exactly. And I know that the minute that I'm out there doing this, and I think that the trigger point for the exercise is likely to come. When I'm doing the training, when I've got the flight center up and running properly, and I can actually do more training on it. I'm going to start feeling frustrated like I did when I was flying gravity's because I like to get myself to a point where I'm mentally fatigued, where I kind of go, I can't learn anymore, I'm at capacity. And and getting frustrated with that is, is I'm good with that. But what I found was that I was I was still had the mental capacity to learn so much more with the flying on the jet suit. But my physical capability could not allow me to go further. And that really gave me the shit. So I was like, Okay, I think this is going to be the point where I go, I now have a, I now have a need and a desire that's greater than my frustration for exercise. So that's my theory is that that will happen. And then I'm going to start at least training my shoulders to do it's there. The hardest part is the lateral arm raise that you have to do. Both you do that one on landing. But when you're when the engines are spooling up and you're putting up the throttle just to make sure that they they balance you hold your arms out to the sides with the lateral arm raise and and so you've got like over five kilos per arm, that you're holding up in that position until they've spooled up properly and they're balanced and then you then you go down. And it doesn't sound a lot but doing doing that repetitively, definitely extra shoulders and then what happens is your shoulder well for me, what happened is my shoulder got weak, and that actually impacted my ability to keep my arms straight with thrust. So as you're leaning into the thrust, I felt my elbow would move just a fraction like a millimeter or so. But that changed the direction of the thrust to follow up through my arm, forearm and out with not up to my shoulder, which makes you do this wonderful Wonder Woman looking thing, but not so good if you're not on a tether, so I will need to do some exercise but I need to have that that that crushed point that says you know what? Your desire to do this flight now gives you the permission to go off and and fight that aversion to exercise theory and theory. So on a scale from one to 10 How do Dress is jet suit flying. I think it's like any kind of machinery or any vehicle that it depends on how you use the machine as to what the danger level is within it, I don't see myself as a risk taker at all, I do a lot of research around everything that I choose to do, and understand as much about it as as possible. And if I feel that there's a significant risk, then I won't take it. So managing the risk in this is around maintaining a low height off of the ground. So I kind of think it through in terms of would I be happy falling off the platform with the weight of the fuel and the jet suit and falling on my face. So I'm not going to be flying at 50 feet, I'm going to be flying like inches above the ground, and partially because of, of wanting to get as much forward movement as possible, efficiently without using the time to go upwards, but also from a safety perspective. So if you think about that, compared to something like a motorcycle, and why you're, you know, you're you're up a little bit further and and you're kind of getting similar speeds. Is it much different than that? I don't think so. Yeah, we've got we've got systems, we've got engines, and you put through a number of filters on there to make sure that we're protected from things when we're going across the desert for the air intakes and making sure that that's, that's all protected. But of course, things can go wrong with that. And this is a new technology. But if you're flying low to the ground, and you've got safety gear on and you know, I will be wearing a helmet, I will be wearing the protective clothing from day uneasy, and I'm not going to cut corners in safety. And one of the things through the designers we were looking at, okay, well, what what other safety mechanisms can we build in? And so we've been looking at how we build engine redundancy. And one of the things that we'll be testing on the flight training center is what? How can how can we try to get this so that if one engine goes, the others cut out at the same time, that because we've got six engines on ours, and so that you've you've still got three engines running? What is the effect of that? Is there any way to cushion it, even if it can't withhold the total weight, so you might drop a little bit, cushioning it rather than just completely throwing you off kilter? Because one of the one of the tripod legs is gone versus the others. So things like that, where we're testing through and, and, and everything as we've been going through is okay, great. Well, if we cut out on X, Y, Zed, what is the impact of safety? What is the the new level of risk, and I've set up safe, safe work management system and done all the risk assessments in there as well and, and been really thorough around that that safety side of things. And so it just, it doesn't eliminate the risk. But it certainly makes you understand exactly what you're doing and makes you think about in those circumstances, what are the multiple ways that I might be able to to minimize the impact or the effect of things going wrong, but there is the inevitable, you know, engine failure, you're going to hit the ground. And and being at low height, it's going to hurt. But are you going to die? Unlikely, I would say yeah, I wonder how you know, strong winds are going to affect you if you can only go 30 miles an hour and you have a 30 knot wind, huh? Yeah, not not a lot. And you know, it's not the, because you're wearing it and the human is the fuselage. There's not a lot of aerodynamics forces your own or platforms on there to help you give you lift or anything like that. I guess there's a there's a case for saying well actually because it's not aerodynamic then you might be more impacted by by the force of wind going against you. But the thrust on this thing and the stability because you've got the triangle effect. And because you're low to the ground is is is going to it's not going to be the same as again, this is this is what I believe to be the case may end up being different. We're certainly trialing all of these different things so, but not not the same as what you might feel with a larger aircraft like a like a helicopter or plane has a bigger fuselage Let's see was the impact of of that wind force telling more of that form? Drag? Exactly. Yeah, that was far more eloquent weights. Profile. Then you'll you'll have legitimate skin drags skin friction, actual skin friction now, recovering. Luckily, hopefully that suit that you're wearing is going to have a lot of fire protection. I'm sure she'll be built into it. So, you know, what are the chances of like, I'm sure you've got, you've got hot air coming out of the bottom of those engines where you're producing the thrust. How hot does that actually get? Can you burn your legs on that or like on a muffler? Well, you could so if you had an accident, and you pointed the the engines directly at your legs, and you didn't let go with the throttle, then yes, but I mean, the chances that your natural instinct is to let go the throttle when you let go the throttle that goes to idle, there's a kill switch as well. And at idle, you can run your hand underneath the engines and yeah, it's warm, but it's not gonna you know, it's it's not gonna burn you. Not what you might expect, right? Yeah. flammability while it uses jet fuel. So jet fuel is way less flammable than diesel. And and so you know, that's, Is that likely to blow up into flames? No, not really. So yes, the heat if you land on, like the exhaust, well, that's going to be hot. But we've got exhaust protections on there. And we've got materials that also reduce the amount of heat that gets exposed fire, those heat shields. So that's all kind of been looked at and minimized as well. Yeah, so I have to do I feel that it's it's a risky thing. No, not at all. Actually, I don't, I feel pretty safe. I think it's people's unfamiliarity with Acacia capability. And because I'm so close, and I know what's gone into it from a safety perspective. Yeah, it's just a lot of people feel that this new and unfamiliar thing is going to be right, really scary. And it's kind of like, well, I should probably allow that marketing hype. Right, right. Yeah. Yeah, this is really dangerous. No, yeah. Do it, but I'm not. And I know for everything that is anti anti risk, where possible, what, um, what does your family think of the mission? As far as you undertaking this mission? Um, my mum kind of closes her eyes and doesn't doesn't like to think about it too much. And so she, she hears what I'm doing. And it's like, oh, yeah, that's really good. Just don't tell me any details. Yeah, they're, they're all. They're all kind of like, it's Jen. You know, it's Jen doing her thing. It's not really a surprise to any of them. I don't think, you know, my kids really like blase about? Can you just do that? Yeah. That's cool. That's pretty cool. No thoughts, kids. Which is really good. Because, you know, I don't want it to be hyped up around this really big thing. It's not, it's not about the spectacle, it, it's, it's for me, it's, for me, a test of the human mind. And that's really what it's all about. And, and I I just want to learn through that I want to test my theories and learn through that and, and share my learnings with people in the hope that maybe somebody else will be inspired to do something different for themselves. I mean, my my ultimate would be to see other people fighting into their own adversity. You know, that's the thing that really inspires me as is. It's not it's not people, it's behavior that that inspires me and seeing, seeing people using the power of the mind to reframe things and overcome significant adversity that always just, I'm always in tears when I see anything. Oh. So inspiring. Absolutely. Firing, you know, and it's just, it's just amazing. It amazes me how much of our mind is how much control we have over how we feel and perceive things and how that affects everything about us. And it's all just a matter of our choice of interpretation. And I, I believe that many people don't see it as a choice. They think things are happening to them or they other people are doing things. And it's, it's when you learn to take the responsibility that this is a choice and you have chosen to do, you know, to feel that way or to perceive that somebody is attacking you, or you can turn it around. And you can say, well, actually, no, they're not. And, and that changes everything. It makes life so much more, you know, approachable and makes you feel so much more empowered. When you take responsibility for how you choose to see, perceive, behave and feel about things. And it's yeah, it's, it opens up so many doors that in fact, at times, it's kind of like, ah, it was an easier life when you realize when, when you didn't believe that you had so many choices. Now, it's like, oh, there's so much choice, like, how am I going to get it all done? Yeah, I mean, that's just letting go of the victim mentality. And like you said, realizing that you're responsible, response able, you're able to respond to situations and things that are happening in and around you that you can choose, like you said, as a choice to either look at it one way, or look at it in a super negative way and feel like the victim. And yeah, I've heard that from a lot of very successful people, is just letting go of victim mentality when things are going wrong. And moving forward and pursuing your dreams and just going at it. Just that's one thing I've got in similarity to those guys. And yes, no, you're kidding. Similar to what guys, you are the guys, you are the success story. And, yeah, I just met you, but I'm so proud of you. I am a truly a big fan senorita that you have an amazing story. And I wish you nothing but the best. I mean, I'm just blown away by man, everything that you were talking about today, but a journey. To say the least to say now that's a book you should write. However, yeah, anyway. Yeah, just your story. Biography No, there's that there was the only book that I really enjoyed reading when I was young was one called choose your own adventure. And I really feel like life is exactly that you go through and you have to, like, strength and my and then you choose which page you want to turn to, to carry on the journey, and it just feels like life is is this, you can choose your own adventure. And you can choose to turn the page whenever you want to. And I just think that's beautiful. You know, just I love those. That feeling stuck. And one of the other most important learnings through all of this is that the feeling of being stuck is just an opportunity for growth. And it's not a failure. And I think that the negativity that that people put around feeling of failure, it has massive consequence to you personally, and it's a really hard thing to get out of. I mean, I've seen some really dark days through this through this process and have had to have a lot of self coaching to get out of some of those, some of those points. But yeah, I mean, you have to know that you have the power within to reframe anything and, and cheap to get yourself up and out. And to have somebody there to support you and rally you in the background as well as incredibly has has been incredibly important to me to get through those stages. But for those out there, you're not a failure. If you're feeling those things. You're feeling human. That's what makes us human, because that's what makes us not robots, you know, we have these feelings, we have these emotions, they will bring you down, but they bring you down so that you can feel the up even higher. And I know that possibly sounds a little bit wonky. It's not meant to not be at all, but you know that you will get through it and you will learn something so much more. I'd much prefer the highs and the lows than then the consistent line of mediocrity. Well said, beautifully spoken this whole thing is just this has been a very probably one of my favorite interviews actually so far. No offense to any of our previous guests. We love ya know, this is gonna be a great season opener really excited and thank you so much for taking the time and I'm glad that we were able to figure out the time. Yeah. That was That was so funny. And I didn't even I didn't catch it either. Good luck with everything we're rooting for you on this side of the pond. And yeah, well, I'll be they'll be in touch we'll be chatting soon. Thanks, guys wow, what Dori Daniel, I feel really bad about myself right now hearing everything that she's accomplished in her whole life. I mean, obviously, no, I don't feel bad about myself. But what an inspiring story, like growing up in the country in Australia teaching herself code. Who does that? Who does that? Who does a genius? Does? I have? A super motivated? What's up? Miss Elon? Musk? Vilonia? Musk? No, like, yeah, no, she, she's a go getter for sure. Yeah. And then having a go through everything she went through, and having the desire and the will to change, essentially her image, you know, and get into flying? Yeah, I think that, you know, one of the biggest takeaways from her story is that it's never too late to pursue a new dream. You know, she has worked in innovation her entire life. And in a sense, we're talking about self innovation as well, you know, continuing to grow and learning new things and keeping that observing eye open all around you and finding new things in life to aspire to and to learn. I think everybody at some point should ask themselves exactly what she asked all of her friends that one day when they were having lunch, like if you could do anything in the world, if money wasn't even an issue, what would you do? And then whatever comes to mind, just figure out a way to do it. And that's kind of what she did. She you know, we talked about this all the time with finding the right people and finding the right mentors. And, you know, being willing to make that phone call to make that cold call and just say, Hey, this is me. And this is what I want to do. Can you help me? And you know, in this instance, wala found the right people what would you do? If I could do anything in the world? Definitely not fly a jet pack across a jet pack? Don't get me wrong. But man that's that's gonna be quite the trek. You know, she can only go and five minute hops. That's redonkulous for over 2000 miles. That's it's gonna take a while. That's what I told her man. Get on. Get those rollerblades on. I think that that's actually a genius idea. I think that would make her go a lot faster. Time and a half but needs to be like those big, like big has to be pretty big blades that are just going across the desert. You know? Oh, yeah. Like, down like the I thought she's staying on like, the road. She's cutting crops? She I don't know. Is there a road that goes all the way across? I don't know. I don't know, either. I think so. I mean, yeah, you're right. Because all the supply. Yeah, I mean, you'd have to have all the trucks and you know, if you're staying on a highway. Yeah. Why not? You know, just get your rollerblades on and cook. True. True. Go get those nos boosters. I mean, uh, yeah, I can't even imagine she's gonna have to learn how to exercise man, because there's no way she's gonna be able to do that. She can't even hold a plank. Jennifer, get up your butt to the gym. No, you know what, and that's the beauty of what what? You know what she was saying? She's like, find a problem big enough to solve it. And her hatred for exercise is big enough to have to figure out a way around it. And she got the right team to build her a flight suit that will take all that weight off her shoulders. Yeah, the exoskeleton. I mean was x x x Oh, skeleton shell X, Alex. Oh. Yeah, man. Well, you know what, we are totally rooting for her. We've learned so much from the story about just believing in yourself and going after the things that you want in life and always learning always changing and staying curious. That's man, stay curious. Stay curious. Stay curious, my friends. We'll catch you next time on The forever on the fly podcast. Don't forget, like, subscribe, you know, leave us a little message. We'd love to hear from you guys. I mean, it's like, you know, that's everything. That's what keeps us going. And anytime we get a positive comment or review on our, on our apple podcasts, it always brings a big smile to our face, and it brightens up our day. So even just a private message of letting us know that you guys are enjoying the show. We always love to hear from you. Like yeah, well thank you everybody and have a wonderful day.