336: Subtract to Succeed with Nell 3D (Nell Derick Debevoise Dewey)

Are you working harder than ever yet feeling less visible, less fulfilled, and more burned out in your career?

In this episode, I sit down with leadership strategist and Forbes senior contributor Nell Derick Debevoise Dewey, Nell 3D, to challenge one of the biggest myths mid-career professionals face today: that doing more is the only way forward. We explore how strategic subtraction can actually help you become more effective, more influential, and more fulfilled in your work.

If you are navigating a tough job market, feeling stuck under ineffective leadership, or wondering how to sustain performance without burning out, this conversation will help you rethink how you show up at work. Nell introduces her practical Stop, Drop, Roll method, a framework that helps high performers pause, remove draining habits, and redesign their workdays so their energy creates bigger results.

We discuss real stories of leaders who cut unnecessary meetings, redesigned team rituals, and reclaimed personal time while still improving team outcomes. We also tackle real mid-career challenges, including dealing with a difficult boss, maintaining confidence in a slow job market, and learning how to stop carrying expectations and criticisms that drain momentum.

If you are holding onto a role for stability while trying to protect your long-term career prospects, you will also learn why strategically cruising at seven instead of ten can actually extend your runway and help you perform where it matters most.

This episode offers permission and practical tools to step back, gather honest data about how you spend your time and energy, and make smarter decisions about what deserves your attention.

If you are a mid-career professional looking for career clarity, stronger leadership presence, or a smarter job search strategy, this conversation will help you see how doing less of the wrong things can help you achieve more of what matters.

Mid-career success is not about grinding endlessly. It is about choosing where your effort creates the most impact. Often, the smartest career move is not adding more. It is subtracting what no longer serves you.

Connect With Nell 3D

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Transcript

Welcome And The Power Of Subtraction

John Neral 0:04

Hello, my friends. Welcome to the Mid-Career GPS Podcast. I'm your host, John Merrill. This is the show for mid-career professionals who feel stuck, undervalued, or unsure what's next, and know that doing more isn't the answer. Here we focus on how you show up, how you make clearer decisions, build influence, and take control of your career so you can find that career you love or love the one you have. Last week's episode was all about what to do when you're not sure what to do. And this applies to your job search, career clarity, a promotion, or even how you lead. And it's a perfect segue into this week's episode. Rather than thinking you need to add things to your plate to figure it all out, what would happen if you started subtracting things? This week I am joined by Nell Derek Debvoy's Dewey, who is also known as Nell 3D. In this conversation, we explore the concept of giving yourself permission along with Nell's stop-drop-roll method to gain greater clarity about what's happening around you and within you. Nell is a leadership strategist, keynote speaker, and Forbes senior contributor who helps high-performing professionals do less, matter more, and lead with multidimensional impact. Nell's work blends systems thinking, intrinsic motivation, and lived experience, from refugee camps to boardrooms, where she offers a radically human and multidimensional approach to leadership across me, we, and world. In this episode, you'll hear about Nell's stop-drop-roll method and how that helps leaders release what drains them and redesigns their effort for sustainable and satisfying success. So, my friends, if you are in need of a little recharge or boost in your personal or professional life right now, you're in the right place. This episode is for you. So it is my pleasure to introduce you to Nell Derek Debavoy's Dewey. Enjoy my conversation with Nell 3D. Nell, welcome to the podcast. It's great to have you here today.

Nell 3D 2:32

Thank you, John. So good to be here.

Nell’s Two Mid‑Career Wake‑Ups

John Neral 2:34

Nell, I have truly enjoyed all of our conversations leading up to this interview. And I know the listeners are going to pick up on that and get a huge takeaway from today. You have a really interesting career story. So would you please share with us what was your mid-career moment?

Nell 3D 2:52

Yeah. There have been two, if I may. The first was living in the West Bank of Palestine in a community center where I served refugee communities. And so aligned with my 12-year-old self's mission, like the dream, right? Literally changing lives every day, being changed by them, learning, bringing resources. It was incredible. And then realizing that it was not for me anymore. And going to business school in Manhattan.

John Neral 3:32

Just a little different.

Nell 3D 3:36

And then the second was a head-on car collision that I caused in my distraction and overwork. Could have really hurt someone, myself included. And thank the angels, we all walked away. Okay. Thank God. But talk about an impactful moment. Right. And that's where subtraction was born that I know we'll talk so much more about.

John Neral 4:07

We will. And I want to thank you for sharing both of those stories with us because it really does kind of set the stage for what we are going to talk about here today. You know, you've shared with me previously that you're you've been this kind of person where everything looked really good on paper. Everything just kind of checked all the boxes and you had deep alignment and you were purposeful and intentional and successful and all of those things that either you had expected of yourself or other people had expected for you in that regard? When you think about your work today and the people whom you help and this whole idea about what subtraction actually looks like, where does it hit those people who, for your to use your words, everything looks good on paper? Where does hit it hit them and rock them to the core to essentially go, yeah, maybe something needs to change?

When “Looks Good On Paper” Breaks

Nell 3D 5:10

Yeah. It's a great question. And it there's a kind of nuanced answer, right? Because people come to me or find me because they've had some version of that moment. Right. Unfortunately. And that's part of what I my passion is in doing this work, is like to help accelerate that. Like, don't, you don't have to have a head-on collision yourself. You don't have to get divorced because you were too overly invested in your impact work. Like you don't have to miss your dad's funeral. I did those things. Listen to me. And as humans, you know, and and as physical objects, an object in motion stays in motion, right? And so till there's that impact. And so I think the real hit that I see once people are working with me. So again, they they've realized for some reason cancer, getting laid off, losing a friend, whatever. They've come to me, they've seen this subtraction as maybe being a new way forward, kind of because they're desperate. But when it really hits, is when they experiment with this crazy idea of doing less and they have more impact than they had before. So let's go ahead. It sounds too good to be true, right? And so until they actually do that, especially in like a slightly higher stakes moment where it feels a little scary, and someone thanks them, or the client pays them more than they expected, or they get the promotion, or their husband brings them flowers, you know, whatever the thing is, and they're like, This works.

unknown 6:49

Yeah.

Doing Less And Seeing More Impact

John Neral 6:50

So give us an example, please, of what that might look like for somebody who is really purposely or purposefully driven in their career. They want to get promoted, they're looking for that new opportunity, more visibility. And they get this idea or they hear or learn of this idea about, well, what if I subtract something? Yeah. How can I actually get more of that? What does that look like for them?

Nell 3D 7:14

Yeah. Really fun example from a few years back now of this guy who worked at a fast-growing logistics company. And it was a few years into COVID, right? I think we're thinking like 2023. So logistics, you're right, you can imagine, like they were slammed. It was growing really, it was actually really good for their business. And he had always wanted to be a people manager. Like he really loved that idea and he was smart and hardworking, but he wanted that new role. And he got it, right? They're growing, good news, opportunity for everybody. So he gets the role. Great. And he dives in head first. Like he's having one-on-ones with his whole team. They're having weekly meetings. He's bringing resources to them of what they could read to follow up in their growth areas, but firing and all cylinders. And so on one of the three nights a week that he spends with his daughter, he's they're doing their thing, you know, their routine, daddy daughter time, and he puts her to bed. And she looks up and she says, Daddy, and he's like, Yeah. And she's like, When are we gonna make dinner together again? And he realizes that in the two months that he's had this role, they've had takeout every night and not done their thing of making dinner.

unknown 8:22

Wow.

A Manager Redesigns Work And Parenting

Nell 3D 8:24

So he's up all night, right? He calls his coach, hopefully he has someone as good as you the next day. And he's like, which do what do I give up? Do I drop the role I can't people manage because I have this young daughter who I really care about? Or do I drop my standards of parenting and what I want fatherhood to look and feel like? And we'd done these sessions a few months earlier, and so you know, he's thinking, I'm I'm dropping, right? I'm subtracting something. And then he's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. This is a false choice. This is not what I need to drop. What I need to drop is the 60-minute weekly one-on-ones and me doing the research to find the resources for their growth area. These are adults, highly motivated. Like, what am I doing? Um, so anyway, so he like goes through a little more granularly, right? We'll talk stop, drop, and roll in a minute. He stops and really looks at the data and looks at what's happening. And then what he drops is one by one 60-minute weekly check-ins. Nobody needs that. That's a hassle. Nothing is moving that fast. They're in touch all day on Slack. They don't need that kind of contact. He does not have to be Googling or ChatGPTing or whatever searching for the podcast episode that they should listen to. What is he doing? Right. So he drops those things. They realize that takeout is actually really fun sometimes. So he drops three home cooked meals a week and brings it down to two because they like doing the takeout one night a week. Um, oh, and he makes the team, the team check-ins a walk and talk because he realized also his step count was way down because he was just like at his desk, at his desk, at his desk. So all of a sudden he's rolling, right? He's connecting his daughter to the kind of parent he wants to be, to the kind of nutrition he wants to model, to a little fun in the takeout and strategically lowering your workload. He's showing his team what a what an engaged father looks like. He's empowering them to find their own learning. He's encouraging them to take more steps. He's taking more steps and he's physically healthy, right? So by dropping some pieces of this that he thought he should do as a good manager, his impact like way increased, to say nothing of his well-being and his parenting.

John Neral 10:36

First of all, that's a great example for people who are listening because it's going to be so relatable to them. And I don't want to bury the lead with you. So you talked about stop, drop, and roll. And you gave us a really good example of this, but walk us through a little bit more about um what has to happen at each of those levels for someone so they understand um your methodology in terms of what it means to stop, what do you drop, and what does role actually mean?

Stop, Drop, Roll Method Explained

Nell 3D 11:07

Yeah, awesome. So this is the really fun part. I love it. And it's it's really important to me that this come out as well because you know, subtraction, there's some kind of poppy stuff about this going on right now, right? Of like the four-hour work week and let them and maintain your brutal boundaries and be brutally ah, which look, if it resonates and it helps people, great. I don't think it's wrong. But it's not as nuanced as the people that you and I work with, right? Who are big-hearted but also ambitious leaders. And like, I'm sorry, Tim Ferris, but like my job doesn't get done in four hours a week, and I don't want it to. I have a lot more to give that I this is my life's work. So anyway, so so we're doing the subtraction in a really relational way, right? If you we can decide if we go into systems thinking or not, which is kind of the nerd background of this. But stop, drop, and roll reflects that. And so drop in the middle is the subtraction, right? So we'll get there. But first, you've got to stop. And this is not like go join a monastery and meditate on the mountains with the monks. If you want to do that and it works in your life, I'm in. Hallelujah. Like send me pictures. But that's not what we're talking about. Stop is like an eyes wide open pause in your life in the moment. And maybe it's a 10-second pause before you hit join on the Zoom. Maybe it's a 10-minute pause at the beginning of the day, maybe it's 10 hours a year to really go deep. But you need these little stops where you listen to yourself. Simple, not easy in a world of urgent red alerts and demands and chaos and fear and potential and pressure. But you gotta get some data. And it might be qualitative data, it might be quantitative data, it might be internal, my heart is racing. What is that about? It might be external, I'm losing clients, or I had a bad review, it might be longitudinal. I thought it was gonna get better in this new role, it hasn't. It might be in the moment. I'm in this meeting and I can tell that there's some tension. I don't know what's going on, right? But you gotta collect the data. And then we experiment with dropping something, letting go of something. And maybe it's like our logistics manager who's literally dropping one-on-ones every week, take out twice a week. You know, there are little things. Maybe it's just unhelpful thinking. Maybe you're just dropping the ten times you ask yourself, is this the right color? Did I say that too loudly? Do I have to check myself in this meeting? And look, it's not that you don't ever think about those things. But if we're being honest, maybe we think about them a few times too many. Sure. Maybe. And so maybe that's what we drop. And it's an experiment, right? There are no permanent embargoes here. Nobody's checking up. If you miss the recurring meeting that you drop, pick it back up next week. I bet that recurring invite will still be on your catalog.

John Neral 14:22

Exactly. Exactly. Yes. Truth.

Nell 3D 14:27

And finally, roll. And so this is where that systemic kind of relational nature of the subtraction comes in. And it's where the opportunity to do less but have more impact comes in. Because in role, what we're doing is we're connecting the dots of our lives. So come back to that logistics manager with me. Right. And so now he's realizing that if I make this meeting a walk and talk, I get my steps, they get their steps. We get maybe some vitamin D or maybe some endorphins from being outside in the fresh air. Maybe we break a pattern of multitasking a little bit during the meeting because we're at our computer. Maybe we, you know, whatever it is. And so rather than having, you know, team meeting, walk, email check, you know, get outside, look at the sun, take a vitamin D supplement, we're connecting the dots and realizing, gosh, in this same chunk of time, with essentially zero additional effort, maybe even some bringing in of energy from the vitamin D or the sunshine or the movement, I can get all those things done. And so it's using, you know, as people, we're we're sense makers. And so it's using that sense-making ability to connect the dots and recognize where our activities can multitask. We're not multitasking, but our activities are. Okay.

John Neral 15:54

So as I'm listening to you go through this, I'm thinking about the person who is listening to this and going, you know, now this is great. This is this is wonderful. I should probably do this. But I work for an absolute tyrant. And they, if I even brought this idea up to them, they would hate it, probably get angry with me, tell me I'm not working hard enough and everything. And I don't probably would never even bring it up with my manager, but I feel like this is something I need to do, not should do, but need to do. Right? Yeah. What do you say to them?

Nell 3D 16:40

Yeah. I say you've got a few options. There are real bosses. There are real tyrants, right? And so, of course, one case, and good thing we're here with youth, because they've got you as a resource, maybe you need to leave, right? And and so I'm not gonna say that we can make every situation fine, right? There are there are real toxic places and real tyrants and real problems. So that is definitely on the table. In all the other cases, or in the interim before you are able to leave, because many of us need healthcare, which in the United States comes from our jobs. So here we are, a little bit stuck in some cases. Um there is always, we always have agency to subtract something. You don't don't tell your manager. If your manager's a tyrant, don't tell them you're subtracting, right? Tell them you're improving your focus and your performance if you want to tell them anything. But more likely, don't say a thing, but take this stop for yourself. Really get honest, because sometimes the tyrant is a little bit real and a little bit projected. Is there any of the third grade teacher who was a tyrant who's showing up and making this tyrant in your new life bigger than it actually is? Maybe. Right. And so we we have to really that's why that stop is so important because it's like about gathering data and like what have they actually demanded of me versus what I'm layering on.

Handling A Tyrant Boss With Agency

John Neral 18:14

I'm glad you brought that up because there have been a number of times on this podcast where I have mentioned or previous guest has mentioned that you know, at mid-career where people who are so driven, I I often call it the curse of the high performer, right? They they're extremely qualified, credentialed, they've gotten great results. They they are going at an 11 when the odometer only goes, speedometer rather only goes up to 10, right? They are playing full out every single day. And we know that it often leads to some very unrealistic expectations to keep up on those demands, and it leads to burnout and a few other things as well. And so it's why this idea about what could someone potentially subtract, right? This idea of, as you mentioned, about stopping, dropping, and rolling to get more done than you've ever done before. What is the aha or the light bulb moment that goes off for somebody when they realize that they've done less, but got a whole lot more? What happens to them on the other side of that?

Burnout, High Performers, And Lightbulb Moments

Nell 3D 19:31

So let me can I share a personal story. Please, yeah. Yeah. So I um, you know, in this most recent pivot after that car crash, when I was like, okay, life needs to change. And so I'm writing this book, I'm speaking, I'm doing workshops. Um, and I figured that, you know, board memberships would be a really natural and interesting place for me to contribute. And so let's find some boards to join, which I did. And I went hard, right? I hadn't totally learned the lesson. So, exec committee, you need a treasure. I have an MBA. I can do that. I'll lead the, you know, blah, blah, blah. And so, two years into this, I have now two committees, one of which I chair, plus the general board, plus exec committee. And so I have call it eight hours a month of meetings for this board. So the two years comes up, and I love the executive director. She's fabulous, and I really care about the mission. It's an interesting, smart group of people doing great work in New York. And I'm like, Kate, I gotta go. I can't do this. And she's like, shoot, no, I get it, but also, no, but also you don't have to be on exec committee or two other committees. Why don't you just be a board member two hours a quarter? And I was like, oh, okay. I don't really love those meetings either. And I do love coaching you and like helping to facilitate and making the board meetings more interesting. She's like, great. So do that with me. Coach me for 90 minutes a quarter. I would love nothing more. And let's restructure the board meetings and have you facilitate. Great. I'm like, great. So now I've saved myself two hours a week, right? Eight hours a month. Uh, a little less because I'm coaching her, call it six hours a month, back into my into my bank. And I love coaching her. She gets massive impact. She's more inclined to stay because she was a little on the fence, if we're being honest, for a number of reasons. The board meetings are so much more engaging. We're getting comments from the chair and the exec committee, thank goodness. And so I feel freer, less burdened, and more fulfilled. And there's more impact rippling out. I feel I feel on fire in a controlled way, not a blazing house fire because we stopped, dropped, and rolled.

John Neral 21:44

That is a really great example. Thank you for sharing that. That's that's good, right.

Nell 3D 21:48

But I think to your point about people with tough balls, you know, it's so like I hadn't even thought of that until she said, well, just do this. Right. So maybe with the tyrant, you can't have that conversation. But with a more sane manager, you can have the conversation. And the opener isn't, hey, I'm trying to subtract. Can you help? Right. The opener is, hey, I'm trying to contribute the best that I've got to give. And I'm noticing that this meeting, I don't really add any value. I don't have decision-making power. The AI notes are really good. I think I could help bring in new clients if I did 90 minutes of prospecting instead of that. What do you think? What boss is like, no, no, sit quiet, don't get new business. I hate that idea. Said no one ever.

John Neral 22:36

Correct. Yeah, absolutely. Um, now we've talked a lot today about what it means to subtract things out of our work life and even in our personal life, as you've shared some examples. But um, through your Substack and your social media, you've also broached this idea about what happens if we subtract other people. And for the listeners, yeah, because we I record this over Zoom, we both had these big, like cheesy grins on our face when I asked that question, because you know, here we are two months after the holidays. And you know, we might be having some of those conversations about hmm, maybe I don't want all that drama at the holidays this year. Um, what does it mean for you uh to actually go ahead and subtract other people?

Board Service Story: Subtract For Bigger Results

Nell 3D 23:18

And why would we even do that? It's really important, right? I mean, who some I should attribute the quote more properly, but hell is other people? Is that Sart? I think. And look, I'm an introvert, but like I also love humans. Like you're a great human, right? It's been so fun getting to know each other. I value your work so much. This is a delightful conversation. So there are people who I love and appreciate. And most of us couldn't do business without other people. So other people, this isn't like many of my subtractions, this isn't a whole, you know, again, it's not let them, it's not brutal boundaries, it's not meditating in the mountains, it's a relational version. So three buckets of other people that we should subtract very clearly and specifically. Number one, anyone who isn't a loving critic. And so only some people truly know your work deeply and care about you. If those two things aren't true, their feedback is not worth a lot. Now, your boss or your clients may or may not meet those conditions, and you may still have to appease them at the very least. But I want to suggest that there's some unhelpful thinking that you might be able to subtract. That it's not about you as a human when you get that feedback, if they don't meet those conditions of being a loving critic. And that can really change the game, right? I've I've known people who work in really tough situations with really tough people for a long time. And good, bad, ugly, you know, maybe they should have left sooner. But you can we're we're we're pretty strong and resilient. So I'm not endorsing suffering in a toxic place. And if you have to for a moment, we can we can really protect ourselves. So that's one. The second is imaginary other people. And so these are like the third grade teacher who was so hard-driving and embedded themselves so firmly, right? A formative experience that no one is actually saying, Did you prove three that a third time? There might be a typo. No one is saying that, and yet it's a script that you hear in your head. And the final is a nuance of that, which is your impressions or your imagination about a real person, right? And so this is kind of a hybrid of one and two, where I think this tyrant boss expects me to be in at 655 a.m. every day, but it's actually just that they have a brutal commute and they're trying to miss traffic. And they understand that I come on the subway and that or they don't care how I come, but they don't actually care that I'm here at 655. It's just what they do for their own choice, right? And there's no projection or expectation around that. And sometimes, you know, we can really our minds are powerful for better or worse. And so we can imagine other people's expectations in a way that is really unhelpful. Um, so those are the types of other people to subtract, not like your good friends or good families. Sure.

John Neral 26:19

No, absolutely. Yeah, no, thank you for that. Um, this whole idea of subtraction is fascinating. And uh, I hope people will learn more from you and follow you and everything like that. But as we start to wrap up, what advice would you give someone to help them build their mid-career GPS today?

Subtracting Other People With Care

Nell 3D 26:40

I think those stops are so important. Again, there is so much coming at us about what a career should look like and feel like, even. And, you know, John, I don't know what you're seeing in this world right now. It looks pretty freaking crazy to me. And so the idea that like what we learned or what our parents modeled or what our career counselor taught us or what the movies show is still right. Like if you pause, if you stop for a minute, that's a bonkers premise. Yeah. Right? Everything is changing. And so scary and hard, but also major opportunity. And so, you know, I think the only GPS that we can trust right now is our own. Not that there aren't great resources, mentors, coaches, you know, online resources. There's a lot of wisdom to be to be gleaned and and uh metabolized, so it's your own, but really make some time to stop, you know, literally shut your eyes, check in with your physical body, your mental body, your data, your results, um, because everything else is a little bit in tumult right now.

John Neral 27:57

It is, yeah. I now I often say there's two words that typically come to mind with with how I describe this job market, this climate, this work right now. And and the two words are it's frustrating and it's heavy. There's there's a weight that we have not seen before, especially for those people who are job hugging because it's the safest and most reasonable bet for them. You know, like to your point earlier, right? Healthcare and and bills to pay and everything. So sometimes we stay in situations that may not be ideal for us in terms of our employment, but it pays the bills, it keeps a roof overhead and food on the table until we find that next thing. Or until we find ways to actually make the situation better.

Nell 3D 28:48

Yeah.

John Neral 28:48

But it's that, it's that kind of weight and it's it's this whole idea that you talk about today about giving ourselves permission to play with what it would look like if I subtracted something and how much might it actually make my work life or my personal life, my relationships better because of it, that I can see taking some of the weight off. Um, and that sounds, you know, that sounds really good because um, like so many of us, I, you know, I struggle sometimes with everything that's going on. And, you know, full disclosure, um, uh the Girl Scout cookie dealer showed up last night. And um, you know, I'm already two-thirds of the way through a box of Samoas and we're not even 24 hours in. Those are some damn good cookies. All right, they're really good, though.

Build Your Own GPS In A Heavy Market

Nell 3D 29:37

Really good. Can I a note for the job huggers? Can I just add that? Because I think it's a really prime. It's it's happening for sure. We it's a very real phenomenon. And it's a really prime spot for subtraction because as high performers, right? Gold star junkies, we've been taught to do more. And so some of those people are in those positions, need to stay in those positions. Again, as for healthcare or money or whatever else, it's a scary job market to be out in. Um, and so the the potential to subtract, to flip that paradigm from always doing more and always giving 11 on the scale of 10 is magic. Because then you can extend your run there a little bit. And by the way, you will shake. I've seen this happen a lot, so I'm just gonna say, not you might, you will shake some of the resentment that inevitably comes in that position when you stop fruitlessly spinning your wheels and doing more and cruise a little bit, lean out and don't feel guilty about that, right? You put in your years at 11, take a few years at seven, or a few months, or a few weeks, yeah, you still come out at a nine and a half, right? So I think it's really uh important for folks in the in that exact position to experiment with cruising a little bit, maybe.

John Neral 31:05

Yeah, I love that. Well, Nell, if people want to follow you, find you, connect with you, learn more about you, I'm gonna turn the mic over to you, my friend. Please tell us all the great places where people can connect.

Nell 3D 31:18

So Nell3D.com, really good central landing spot. Um, the things I'm most excited about, which are all linked from there, my substack that you referenced, uh, is called Subtract to Succeed. And it's really fun. There's two free posts a week there, just open. We, we, we present, like you said, one was what if we subtracted other people? And I write an essay, there's a video on it. And for paid subscribers, there's a bunch of tips to really make that real. There's a 60-second prompt, there's a 15-minute kind of thought experiment, um, there's an AI prompt, which people are having a lot of fun with. Um, and then there's a paired exercise. So that's all paywalled. If anybody has a financial issue, a lot of people, first of all, can get um reimbursement from their employees, their employers as a leadership development benefit. So easy way to do it. If it's still a barrier to pay, let me know and I'll send a DM. Um, but the paywall is there to make it a little bit more of an invested community. Um, so yeah, that's and we're doing right now, we're doing a hundred-day subtraction practice. When this airs, we'll be midway through, but the door is always open. It's been really fun so far.

John Neral 32:24

Well, good. I wish you all the best with that. Keep up the great work. What you're what you're doing and putting out there is so important. So, Nell, Derek, Deba Voice, Dewey, what a pleasure. Thank you so much for being a great guest today on the MidCareer GPS podcast.

Nell 3D 32:37

So welcome, John. Thank you.

Job Huggers: Cruise Without Guilt

John Neral 32:40

All right, my friends. So I'm gonna peel back the curtain with you for a little bit because um as as I shared earlier, I record this over Zoom, but but what a lot of people don't know is that I jot down some notes and I'll I'll make little symbols or stars or asterisk or things like that that I want to make sure to highlight or go back to, or maybe it becomes like the podcast thumbnail post when we go to promote on social media. But Nell said something that I just had to really write down so fast and put a whole bunch of stars next to it. And that is we always have agency to subtract. And that really stood out for me in this episode and thinking about all of the things that you as mid-career professionals are doing, and even for me in my own work to really sit back and challenge for myself for a minute to go, what in my agency do I have right now the power to actually play and subtract something and see what it gives me? So, my challenge for you this week is to really lean into that, lean into what Nell talked about in terms of having our agency to subtract something and what might you want to just stop doing? What might you want to drop from your current workload, schedule, responsibilities, duties, obligations, whatever it might be. And what might that look like? Or can you just get really curious about what it means for you to roll forward in all of that? Definitely check out all of Nell's information. It will be in the show notes as well. But until next time, my friends, remember this. You will build your mid-career GPS one mile or one step at a time, and how you show up matters. Make it a great rest of your day. Thank you for listening to the Mid-Career GPS Podcast. Make sure to follow on your favorite listening platform. And if you have a moment, I'd love to hear your comments on Apple Podcasts. Visit johnnarrell.com for more information about how I can help you build your MidCareer GPS, or how I can help you and your organization with your next workshop or public speaking event. Don't forget to connect with me on LinkedIn and follow me on social at John Daryl Coaching. I look forward to being back with you next week. Until then, take care and remember, how we show up matters.