WEBVTT 00:00:34.962 --> 00:00:37.522 Hello and welcome to another episode of Gender Stories. 00:00:37.522 --> 00:00:45.422 I know I'm always excited and thrilled about all my guests, but today I have an extra little nerdy piece of excitement because I get to talk about Shakespeare. 00:00:45.422 --> 00:00:49.022 And for those of you who don't know, I am a little bit of a Shakespeare nerd. 00:00:49.022 --> 00:00:55.102 know, 30 years ago, I even did the Shakespeare camp at Stratford-upon-Avon so super excited. 00:00:55.102 --> 00:01:06.600 And I get to talk about this with Beks Roen and they help trans-aspect folks and allies who feel isolated and powerless to find chosen family through queer fantasy and Shakespeare. 00:01:06.760 --> 00:01:14.866 Beks runs Rogish Goblin Stories, an online queer art library where enbys and aspects are the main characters. 00:01:14.866 --> 00:01:24.634 Roen's goals for RGS is to grow it into a streaming platform that supports multiple queer artists full-time, freeing them to focus on the art they were born to share. 00:01:24.634 --> 00:01:39.746 And I'm so excited to explore More about this and as ever listeners, all of the links are going to be in the episode description to find out more about this and welcome Beks Thank you so much for making the time to talk with me for gender stories. 00:01:39.746 --> 00:01:41.438 Thank you so much for having me. 00:01:41.438 --> 00:01:43.221 I'm very, very excited. 00:01:43.221 --> 00:01:47.938 And of course, Shakespeare, I'm even wearing a sword on my shirt today. 00:01:48.203 --> 00:02:00.722 I know, I noticed that and I was like, I should have worn my little like I have a Shakespeare shirt with like the picture of a bear that's like from anyway, it's so good. 00:02:00.843 --> 00:02:01.343 Okay. 00:02:01.343 --> 00:02:07.662 So before we get into the super nerding out about Shakespeare and the listeners are like, what is even happening right now? 00:02:07.662 --> 00:02:12.582 Let's talk about what is it that you love about Shakespeare? 00:02:12.582 --> 00:02:14.817 Let's start from there actually, if that's okay. 00:02:14.817 --> 00:02:34.804 Yeah, I really like, so my background is particularly in mostly like outdoor Shakespeare, sort of like the free Shakespeare in the Park, which is my favorite kind of theater because you get to welcome people who can't access theater otherwise. 00:02:34.804 --> 00:02:47.401 And so you get a lot of like first time theater folks, which is like so fun because they often have like, oh There's a fun sort of like nerves that they're like, okay, what is this? 00:02:47.401 --> 00:02:48.812 What are the expectations? 00:02:48.812 --> 00:03:16.105 I don't know what to but also like this person is making eye contact with me and asking me questions that I'm like I only know half of the words because this is 400 year old text, but I think it's supposed to answer so you get a lot of people who like um and are more engaged with you sometimes and If there's just such a fun like community vibe to that outdoor like Shakespeare in the park. 00:03:16.206 --> 00:03:31.178 I had some of my favorite stories, uh you know, like getting to see some kids, you know, we're performing in a parking lot and you know, this group of kids who's like trying to stay busy during the summer rolls up because we're swinging swords doing fight call and they're like, what? 00:03:31.660 --> 00:03:36.894 And they came over and they're sitting on the hot blacktop like there's no shade. 00:03:36.894 --> 00:03:59.778 We're literally just like out in the full sun and um this like retired guy who had never met them before dropped like over a hundred dollars on our like VIP seats, not for him, but for these three kids that were sitting on the ground by themselves so that they could have a special experience like their first time ever seeing theater. 00:03:59.778 --> 00:04:06.490 And it's like that kind of like community among strangers, like it's so fun. 00:04:07.197 --> 00:04:08.247 It is the best. 00:04:08.247 --> 00:04:09.728 love Shakespeare in the Park. 00:04:09.728 --> 00:04:18.649 em As my oldest was growing up, we lived near Pataron Park in Minneapolis where they would often have theater in the park, including Shakespeare. 00:04:18.649 --> 00:04:24.951 And we spent so many beautiful afternoons in community. 00:04:24.992 --> 00:04:30.523 And I think that is the joy of bringing the theater outside of the theater space, right? 00:04:30.523 --> 00:04:35.295 And to the people and giving people sometimes that first experience. 00:04:36.425 --> 00:04:37.074 So beautiful. 00:04:37.074 --> 00:04:40.355 So I really resonate with so much of what you said. 00:04:40.355 --> 00:04:48.134 And of course in Shakespeare, because it is Elizabethan theater, there's also a lot of kind of gender swapping, right? 00:04:48.134 --> 00:04:50.978 And gender play, I would say also. 00:04:50.978 --> 00:05:00.622 And it's been really wonderful to see how creative people have gotten over the last couple of decades, especially in kind of playing with that in a lot of different ways. 00:05:00.622 --> 00:05:10.088 And I know that when you contacted me, you said something about how acting in Shakespeare in a way helped you come into awareness of your own gender identity. 00:05:10.088 --> 00:05:23.699 So I would love to hear more about that and how that process was, what was the process like for you and where there are specific moments that really stand out in that journey for you. 00:05:24.086 --> 00:05:33.335 Yeah, so I like to say that I face planted my way into professional acting because I was gonna be an engineer. 00:05:33.335 --> 00:05:34.175 was high school me. 00:05:34.175 --> 00:05:36.698 was like, this is what I'm gonna do. 00:05:36.698 --> 00:05:47.788 uh And then I went to a fairly rural Midwest high school and there happened to be a local Shakespeare festival that started performing like across the street from my school. 00:05:47.788 --> 00:05:50.889 And my family was like, we're going. 00:05:51.833 --> 00:05:57.085 So like, I started talking with them because I'm an extrovert and have no idea what a stranger is. 00:06:00.146 --> 00:06:01.387 Exactly. 00:06:01.387 --> 00:06:06.620 oh And so they sort of like encouraged me to audition. 00:06:06.620 --> 00:06:10.151 And I was like, I've never done an audition before. 00:06:10.182 --> 00:06:11.201 I'm curious. 00:06:11.201 --> 00:06:12.923 I'll just go to see what an audition is. 00:06:12.923 --> 00:06:16.394 And then I walked out with a gig and went, I guess I'm an actor now. 00:06:16.394 --> 00:06:19.088 oh that. 00:06:20.137 --> 00:06:28.103 And it was interesting because the, mean, I was one of the youngest in that cast being like one of the student uh actors. 00:06:28.103 --> 00:06:47.750 And so I was mostly playing like, know, gentlemen two, citizen four, like non gendered ensemble roles, which meant that like, you know, at the time I didn't really consciously clock it, but like looking Beks, I'm like, all of the costumes that I were in were fairly androgynous or like slightly masculine presenting. 00:06:47.750 --> 00:06:54.141 uh Combine that with just some of the conversations we had at the actor housing. 00:06:54.141 --> 00:06:58.263 That was my first time meeting people in the gender diverse community. 00:06:58.263 --> 00:07:06.026 And they were so just generous and honest about, what are you curious about? 00:07:06.026 --> 00:07:07.367 Let's talk. 00:07:07.367 --> 00:07:15.591 And they ended up being some of the first people that I called when COVID hit my first year of college. 00:07:15.591 --> 00:07:16.610 And then... 00:07:17.014 --> 00:07:22.901 like started looking around the internet and started hearing more stories and going, boy, oh boy. 00:07:23.963 --> 00:07:31.912 I might, hmm, some of these stories about being ace and aro and trans are hitting very close to home. 00:07:31.912 --> 00:07:33.331 Hey guys. 00:07:34.774 --> 00:07:39.992 But that's great that you already had like a little crew of people that you could call and like talk to. 00:07:39.992 --> 00:07:41.550 I love that. 00:07:41.550 --> 00:07:42.391 yeah. 00:07:42.391 --> 00:07:46.971 we've, I mean, that's been like six plus years, seven years or something like that. 00:07:46.971 --> 00:07:53.771 And like, we still keep in touch and like, we check in about like, hey, how's life going? 00:07:53.771 --> 00:07:55.451 Any pronoun updates? 00:07:55.451 --> 00:07:57.230 Anything I can help with? 00:07:57.871 --> 00:08:08.439 And yeah, so then like, I went to undergrad and got some experience in some other like theater and... 00:08:08.439 --> 00:08:14.173 started training in stage combat, which flows really nicely with Shakespeare. 00:08:14.564 --> 00:08:18.735 Absolutely, there's plenty of stage combat in many plays, yes. 00:08:18.735 --> 00:08:19.876 Oh, yeah. 00:08:19.876 --> 00:08:32.721 And that has been a huge, it actually has been a source of like gender euphoria for me because it tricked me into working out. 00:08:32.721 --> 00:08:38.092 And it was it was really cool to like, say that I got to swing swords for work. 00:08:38.092 --> 00:08:59.951 And then I started I started assisting with classes and I started training to be a teacher and getting to see like the getting to be there to like boost the confidence of some of my trans students who like, I put a rapier in their hands and I have never seen them stand so tall, eyes so bright. 00:08:59.951 --> 00:09:02.692 And I was like, yeah, hey there. 00:09:05.694 --> 00:09:07.255 Look at this. 00:09:07.615 --> 00:09:09.116 Look at this. 00:09:09.116 --> 00:09:09.776 Yeah. 00:09:09.776 --> 00:09:14.458 And so then I think that the, college really helped me. 00:09:14.606 --> 00:09:25.026 play around with, I got to play more masculine roles and like kind of figure out like, okay, what are the roles that I want to play and how does my gender as the actor like interact with that? 00:09:25.926 --> 00:09:34.567 And then I went and became, I was an actor teacher at Great Lakes Theater out in Cleveland for a year after, that was right after college. 00:09:34.686 --> 00:09:43.906 And one of my favorite, favorite things, and I always had my pronoun pin on because I've got a shoulder injury. 00:09:44.014 --> 00:09:50.058 And so was just a visual marker for my teaching partner since we were rotating just to be like, remember, this is the... 00:09:51.341 --> 00:09:52.881 Don't pull off this arm, please. 00:09:52.881 --> 00:09:55.813 uh It's were like 7 a.m. 00:09:55.813 --> 00:09:58.184 and an English class going, okay. 00:09:59.726 --> 00:10:10.875 And um so I had my pronoun pen on very visibly and multiple, multiple schools where I would have kids like pulling me aside. 00:10:11.086 --> 00:10:42.180 and or me and the you know and other folks aside and be like hey um i just wanted to tell you that like because i see you like out and getting to do what you love i know i'm gonna be okay and i still tear up because like that's that's the why under everything because like man if i had had a trans like actor walk into my classroom in high school things might have been a little easier but i at least get to pay that forward Absolutely. 00:10:42.180 --> 00:10:42.890 I love that. 00:10:42.890 --> 00:10:50.925 I feel like there are 10 different tangents I want to go with you in this conversation, but let's follow this one first. 00:10:50.925 --> 00:10:56.728 And then I want to go Beks to kind of this kind of finding yourself through acting role. 00:10:56.728 --> 00:11:06.464 But I want to talk for a moment about that power of being that person that younger folks like say thank you for making me feel like this is possible. 00:11:06.464 --> 00:11:07.454 Right. 00:11:07.454 --> 00:11:09.035 And I definitely. 00:11:09.035 --> 00:11:31.914 I've experienced, I've been on the receiving end of experiencing that, you know, from kids and young adults sometimes too, as an older trans person, you know, I remember somebody going, I'd never met somebody who was like, at the time more like gender queer, gender fluid before we use non-binary more like 20 years ago when I was in my 30s, who was like above like 25, right? 00:11:31.914 --> 00:11:37.500 And literally I thought that I had to like pick a gender when I left college. 00:11:37.500 --> 00:11:41.986 And I was like, you do not have to pick a gender if that's not what you want. 00:11:41.986 --> 00:11:44.007 You get to just be yourself. 00:11:44.007 --> 00:11:55.535 And so, you know, I think that the power to be that person that people see and they're like, maybe a life is possible and doing what I want is possible. 00:11:56.416 --> 00:12:02.560 What is that like for you to be that person for other people, especially as somebody who didn't have that, right? 00:12:02.560 --> 00:12:07.183 I mean, you had a little bit of that with your first acting crew, sounds like, but. 00:12:07.274 --> 00:12:09.742 for those kids to have that at a younger age. 00:12:09.742 --> 00:12:11.848 What does that feel like for you? 00:12:12.058 --> 00:12:14.269 my goodness, I cry. 00:12:14.269 --> 00:12:49.899 I'm I'm tearing up actually, like thinking about it again, just cause it is part of why I stay outside of major theater hubs, like your Chicago, New York, LA, just because like, no, wrong with if you are moving there or you live there, but having spent so much time performing in areas, in more rural areas across the Midwest and elsewhere, The impact just feels so much deeper and louder because there's often less access to it. 00:12:51.258 --> 00:13:06.266 And I mean, people come up who are like, you're the first out trans person I've ever seen! they're crying, I'm crying! it's such a beautiful gift to just be that vessel. 00:13:07.046 --> 00:13:11.947 Because I'm just like showing up and being like, hello, this is... 00:13:11.947 --> 00:13:23.606 But it is, know, my being raised in a Christian household, my dad's a pastor. 00:13:23.606 --> 00:13:37.711 so like being part of that culture of like looking for the people who are pushed out to the sides and being like, no, you get to be in here too and you're loved and you're not alone. 00:13:37.711 --> 00:13:44.043 It's so, so special. 00:13:44.264 --> 00:13:49.447 And it makes me laugh and cry all at the same time. 00:13:50.227 --> 00:13:51.507 That makes a lot of sense. 00:13:51.507 --> 00:14:00.147 And it sounds like, so, you know, you were brought up in a Christian household, but it sounds like maybe a more inclusive Christian household than some other folks might be. 00:14:00.147 --> 00:14:01.067 Okay, good. 00:14:01.067 --> 00:14:03.187 I'm so glad to hear that. 00:14:04.139 --> 00:14:13.519 Yes, I really lucked out with and like beyond immediate family, like out to like cousins are supportive. 00:14:13.519 --> 00:14:22.558 And, you know, I got to take my grandma to see her first drag show and it was mine, my mom's and my grandma's first drag show for Trans Day of Visibility a few years ago. 00:14:22.558 --> 00:14:25.408 like, you know, it's I... 00:14:25.408 --> 00:14:39.184 Part of why I'm doing what I do and starting to produce more and gather my own groups is because I know how rare, unfortunately, that welcoming family and that welcoming environment is. 00:14:39.184 --> 00:14:44.099 And I'm like, well, dang it, I'm going to pay it forward to as many people as I can. 00:14:44.711 --> 00:14:46.112 That is so beautiful. 00:14:46.112 --> 00:14:49.564 And I love that you're doing that through like the power of stories, right? 00:14:49.564 --> 00:14:57.300 Because again, it's that kind of, sometimes it's hard to be what you cannot imagine or to create what you cannot imagine. 00:14:57.300 --> 00:15:07.077 And, you know, even in this moment, I think I'm really seeing a lot of fear of like, if we do away with this part of the system, then what is life going to look like? 00:15:07.077 --> 00:15:07.788 Right. 00:15:07.788 --> 00:15:08.408 And I get it. 00:15:08.408 --> 00:15:11.099 It's very human to be afraid of uncertainty. 00:15:11.099 --> 00:15:13.861 And so I think the story is an imagination. 00:15:13.907 --> 00:15:21.087 and art have such an important role to play in the realm of possibility, right? 00:15:21.087 --> 00:15:29.727 Like I think they help us like expand the sense of what is possible and what we can create and what we can co-create together. 00:15:29.727 --> 00:15:35.127 And so I love that that, you know, that's what you're focusing your work on. 00:15:35.247 --> 00:15:35.947 Yes. 00:15:36.281 --> 00:15:49.802 think especially I just finished reading the book, Great White Bard by Farah Karim Cooper, who is I believe head of education at the Globe. 00:15:49.802 --> 00:16:02.894 She works at the Globe and the book is specifically about like uh the history of Shakespeare and race making and racism and how it's uh been been used and reclaimed and. 00:16:02.894 --> 00:16:06.353 oh pushed and pulled in all these different directions. 00:16:06.353 --> 00:16:16.966 it's, yeah, it's like, well, tracking just how potent the world making of specifically live theater is. 00:16:16.966 --> 00:16:31.690 It's like, okay, you we saw Shakespeare get co-opted for some, you know, colonialism and imperialism, but that shows that, okay, we can build just as strong systems that are healthier using the same tools. 00:16:31.690 --> 00:16:32.926 We just gotta know. 00:16:32.926 --> 00:16:36.001 like how to shape things. 00:16:36.853 --> 00:16:37.814 Absolutely. 00:16:37.814 --> 00:16:38.615 And I love that. 00:16:38.615 --> 00:16:50.144 And I'm really curious about because Shakespeare can be claimed and used in so many different ways, like both in terms of the place, but also the person, right? 00:16:50.144 --> 00:16:53.987 There are so many who was really Shakespeare. 00:16:54.628 --> 00:17:01.346 Italians even have their own like Shakespeare was really Italian, you know, which always makes me think of like a. 00:17:01.346 --> 00:17:06.376 I think it's my big fact, Greek wedding, the movie where it's like, that Greek, that Greek. 00:17:06.376 --> 00:17:08.988 was like, my God, Italians do the same thing. 00:17:09.468 --> 00:17:24.961 And so there's like an old theory and that was Shakespeare woman, was Shakespeare this person, Was Shakespeare, what class was Shakespeare, especially in such a class structure and an obsessed country like the UK, which definitely is. 00:17:24.961 --> 00:17:30.472 I mean, lived there for a good 15 years before moving to the so-called United States. 00:17:30.492 --> 00:17:36.498 And so Shakespeare, I think, can be manipulated in so many ways, both the person and the work. 00:17:36.798 --> 00:17:47.229 And so I'm curious about how you found your way through into your own gender identity and expression through the different characters. 00:17:47.229 --> 00:17:54.404 And maybe even if there are one or two characters or one or two plays that really stand out, they were like a moment for you. 00:17:54.404 --> 00:17:56.476 And maybe not, but I'm just curious. 00:17:57.643 --> 00:18:02.145 Yeah, okay, characters coming to mind right off the top of my head. 00:18:02.145 --> 00:18:08.840 um I know that like just as a baseline, I give off a lot of puck energy from Midsummer. 00:18:08.840 --> 00:18:17.857 Like I am a chaos goblin through and through. 00:18:17.857 --> 00:18:19.383 I really like, I'm thinking of... 00:18:19.383 --> 00:18:28.820 Honestly, a lot of the roles that I usually use for auditions, I'm thinking of Alphidius from Coriolanus, Arthur from King John. 00:18:28.820 --> 00:18:47.786 And I'm also really fascinated by the idea of Beatrice and Benedict from Much Ado, especially Beatrice being non-binary, because they have that speech about, oh God, that I were a man. 00:18:48.630 --> 00:18:56.609 oh Hearing that speech as an AFAB trans masculine person hits a little different. 00:18:57.416 --> 00:19:04.209 There's a lot in Shakespeare that I feel like I revisited once I came into my gender and I was like, it does feel different. 00:19:04.209 --> 00:19:09.838 There is something, you know, yes, there is just so much gender in the place. 00:19:09.838 --> 00:19:10.220 Yes. 00:19:10.220 --> 00:19:22.108 m I really like pulling from the histories and some of the like, Coriolanus is definitely not one of like, you know, it's no Caesar or Hamlet, you know, as far as popularity goes. 00:19:23.269 --> 00:19:39.479 But like, I think some of those like lesser, less popular plays have some really fascinating characters and like, Alphidius is this, you know, I interpret him as this freedom fighter who's going up against literal Rome. 00:19:42.060 --> 00:20:01.456 You know, and even Corey Elanes in that play, there's, he has this really strong resistance to uh showing his scars to the people and like going in front of the crowd and exposing his physical body, which I'm like, what's there? 00:20:04.159 --> 00:20:05.020 Yeah. 00:20:05.020 --> 00:20:08.322 And it's also fun because like, especially with like, Alphidious. 00:20:08.732 --> 00:20:13.184 You know, he's this, he's this, you know, this general of this army. 00:20:13.184 --> 00:20:21.867 so like me being this tiny little five two, you know, I've gotten more than one like, huh? 00:20:21.867 --> 00:20:25.068 When I, yeah. 00:20:25.068 --> 00:20:26.948 And I'm like, hear me out. 00:20:28.629 --> 00:20:40.620 And it's, it's, it's one of those that like, I think it It comes up in the conversations about especially being a trans masculine actor that like I am a very small person, my voice is higher. 00:20:40.620 --> 00:20:46.845 So roles like Puck, it's like, we need someone who looks not quite fully human. 00:20:46.845 --> 00:20:48.205 Let's pull the non-binary person. 00:20:48.205 --> 00:20:51.728 It's like, okay. 00:20:51.728 --> 00:21:01.073 eh Love the role, but I won't use it as an audition piece because of that. 00:21:02.355 --> 00:21:03.816 understandable. 00:21:03.816 --> 00:21:08.637 and roles like Arthur, he's like 14, he's like a kid. 00:21:08.637 --> 00:21:13.879 And so I get mistaken for a middle schooler frequently. 00:21:13.879 --> 00:21:20.942 And so it's like, you know, those roles are like, okay, you know, they align pronouns wise with totally cool. 00:21:20.942 --> 00:21:31.214 Um, and the story is fascinating, but it is fine with roles like Alphiteus and Macbeth, um, those two in particular. 00:21:31.214 --> 00:21:37.115 Um, to be like, no, really, think about it. 00:21:37.115 --> 00:21:48.694 Because it's, you know, you're okay, the story has now shifted potentially with how you cast the other actors and what kind of gender dynamics you're gonna have. 00:21:48.734 --> 00:21:56.115 I mean, Macbeth has some very potent lines about gender, you know, I dare do all that may become a man who dares do more as none. 00:21:57.234 --> 00:22:08.856 But positioning a trans person as that just absolutely powerful symbol ah is something that I don't see often. 00:22:08.856 --> 00:22:10.788 I'm seeing it more. 00:22:10.788 --> 00:22:16.942 um But it still definitely gets enough surprise that I'm like, okay, cool. 00:22:16.942 --> 00:22:26.597 We're gonna continue to dig into this and be like, no, really think about trans people as the one who can be wielding a sword and shield and winning the day. 00:22:27.759 --> 00:22:28.408 Exactly. 00:22:28.408 --> 00:22:35.751 And I think it also opens up people to think about masculinity and femininity and gender in general in different ways. 00:22:35.751 --> 00:22:49.278 Why is it that we associate maybe this more packed ethereal theory of this world, not of this world qualities to this uh perceived androgyny, let's call it. 00:22:49.278 --> 00:22:55.200 And why is it that we feel like Macbeth should look a certain way or Ophelia should look a certain way? 00:22:55.200 --> 00:22:57.480 Where are those ideas coming from? 00:22:57.555 --> 00:23:06.151 And so I love that kind of subverted quality because also I feel like a lot of Shakespeare work was subversive at the time. 00:23:08.313 --> 00:23:21.475 really when you think about, especially when I hear the critique often or the concern from some people that's like, well, so many more people, so many more young people are exploring their gender because of the internet. 00:23:21.475 --> 00:23:23.897 And I'm like, look, I was brought up in the seventies. 00:23:23.897 --> 00:23:25.461 There was no internet. 00:23:25.461 --> 00:23:36.461 And I still had gender feelings and people before me still had gender feelings and people have had expansive gender for the whole history of humanity. 00:23:36.740 --> 00:23:43.380 You know, I always say to people, was like, well, sure, medical science, whatever, even though I'm healthcare provider. 00:23:43.500 --> 00:23:47.840 But really, like history, like gives us a really good idea. 00:23:47.840 --> 00:23:50.941 The gender expansiveness has always existed. 00:23:50.941 --> 00:23:51.762 The gender. 00:23:51.762 --> 00:23:56.975 hasn't really been binary from the beginning of the world, like some people would have us believe, right? 00:23:56.975 --> 00:24:17.797 And even just looking at Shakespeare's work, like how much gender is in those plays, both around gender identity, gender dynamics, expectations of gender, what happens when you don't live up to those expectations, the intersections of gender and class and kind of, oh, there's so much there. 00:24:17.797 --> 00:24:20.488 And I was like, that was no internet people. 00:24:20.488 --> 00:24:21.888 That was just... 00:24:22.729 --> 00:24:23.730 Yeah. 00:24:24.018 --> 00:24:33.703 So, um I think it's just such a good counterargument for folks who are like, it's a contagion, you know, because of the internet. 00:24:33.703 --> 00:24:35.764 And I'm like, it's really not. 00:24:35.764 --> 00:24:45.861 Like a lot of us have been thinking about and questioning certain expeditions, society-ly, for a very long time, including Shakespeare, right? 00:24:45.861 --> 00:24:47.972 I mean, at it feels like it. 00:24:47.990 --> 00:24:58.561 pronouns alone, mean, gender neutral, using they them as a gender neutral pronoun in English dates Beks pre Shakespeare to at least Chaucer. 00:24:58.561 --> 00:25:03.946 And, you know, and we used to have two versions of the second person pronouns. 00:25:03.946 --> 00:25:11.148 like, eh So nothing new under the sun in a lot of ways. 00:25:11.287 --> 00:25:11.628 Yeah. 00:25:11.628 --> 00:25:18.432 So I love that you're kind of really uh challenging people to think about the plays in a different way. 00:25:18.432 --> 00:25:21.212 Cause I think we can get so used to things. 00:25:21.212 --> 00:25:23.683 Oh, this is what Macbeth looks like. 00:25:23.683 --> 00:25:29.445 This is like what I expect, you know, out of, you know, King Lear or whatever, right? 00:25:29.445 --> 00:25:34.197 Whichever character or out of, you know, all of the... 00:25:34.993 --> 00:25:37.253 Beatrice or any of the characters, right? 00:25:37.253 --> 00:25:44.157 Or Romeo even like the, some of the most kind of uh popular, let's say Romeo and Juliet. 00:25:44.157 --> 00:25:47.038 I feel like everybody knows Romeo and Juliet, right? 00:25:47.038 --> 00:25:57.143 And I've seen some really uh amazing casting of various characters to do with gender and expanding our expectations around gender, which is really fun. 00:25:57.143 --> 00:25:59.703 Oh, so much to talk about. 00:26:00.144 --> 00:26:24.149 And I love also what you said about not wanting to necessarily focus on the big theater cities, you know, on the coast or even in Chicago in the Midwest, but really staying in maybe where there's not as much representation or not as much presence, both of trans folks and also, you know, sometimes not as much theater, although I feel like I'm very lucky in Minnesota. 00:26:24.149 --> 00:26:27.389 have like, I guess, a Leonardo artist, feel. 00:26:27.984 --> 00:26:29.464 Yeah. 00:26:29.566 --> 00:26:29.995 Yeah. 00:26:29.995 --> 00:26:39.413 And the Midwest is such a fun place with, with like theater because you have all these hidden gems of like, all these that you're like, what, what is this? 00:26:39.834 --> 00:26:46.358 You know, like, what are five gorgeous 20s renovated theaters doing in Cleveland? 00:26:46.358 --> 00:26:51.624 I, I love the Cleveland theater scene and like Northeast Ohio has some really cool stuff. 00:26:51.624 --> 00:26:55.145 I've worked in, I've worked in Indianapolis. 00:26:55.702 --> 00:27:01.677 Actually, the play that I did in Indie was called Gender Play, Will Wilhelm and Erin Murray. 00:27:01.677 --> 00:27:18.101 And I got to understudy it and it was all, was just non-binary Shakespeare and tarot and just cracked open my, again, just cracked open a little bit more of what I thought was possible. 00:27:18.101 --> 00:27:24.489 And my fellow crew members definitely caught me a couple times backstage scribbling furiously in my notebook. 00:27:24.489 --> 00:27:30.856 Not because anything had gone wrong and I was taking notes, but because I'm listening to the play and went, oh ideas. 00:27:30.856 --> 00:27:31.715 Yeah. 00:27:33.349 --> 00:27:34.129 I love that. 00:27:34.129 --> 00:27:37.542 I love that kind of sparking of the imagination. 00:27:37.600 --> 00:27:42.202 So I talking about imagination stories, the importance of stories. 00:27:42.202 --> 00:27:49.346 em I would love to ask you a little bit more about roguish goblin stories, because first of all, I love the name. 00:27:49.346 --> 00:27:58.680 We'll love to hear more about why you came up with that name, but also just the idea of having this online queer art library, the streaming project you're doing. 00:27:58.680 --> 00:27:59.659 Just tell me everything. 00:27:59.659 --> 00:28:01.163 It sounds fascinating. 00:28:01.163 --> 00:28:26.021 Yeah, so the name came from, I got the nickname Chaos Goblin at my first stage combat workshop, not because of the gleeful cackling that ensued once I held a sword and was having a fair amount of fun, but because of the ice cream sundae that we had on the second day after training, and I get very hyper on sugar very quickly. 00:28:26.021 --> 00:28:29.397 uh Thus the name Chaos Goblin. 00:28:29.397 --> 00:28:32.015 Unfortunately, that is already trademarked. 00:28:32.742 --> 00:28:42.075 It sure is, yes! I was like, well, okay, so I, roguish goblin, I get that term roguish a lot. 00:28:42.075 --> 00:28:45.335 Rogue is also the class that I usually play in D &D. 00:28:46.234 --> 00:28:48.894 So I was like, that works. 00:28:52.214 --> 00:28:54.855 Yeah, it gets to the idea. 00:28:54.855 --> 00:29:01.879 And also like sort of rogue being sort of this idea of like going Beks to like the Robin Hood sort of. 00:29:01.879 --> 00:29:16.466 rogue archetype of, you know, someone, a commoner who is taking on oppressive systems and like, I was like, yeah, I'll hop onto that little like, reputation. 00:29:16.466 --> 00:29:20.376 You're like, topical right now? 00:29:21.069 --> 00:29:39.202 oh So shortly after, let's see, so college had me going, I'm gonna be an actor and then also a writer because I started publishing poetry and anytime I tell the universe, I'm not gonna do a thing. 00:29:39.202 --> 00:29:45.447 They're like, hey, bet. 00:29:45.447 --> 00:30:00.841 So I started realizing that like, I had my first couple playwriting debuts in college and I was like getting paid for publishing my writing and producing plays and so but was still like I'm an actor. 00:30:01.676 --> 00:30:02.532 Hmm. 00:30:02.621 --> 00:30:20.015 And so fast forward to out of college and past uh actor teaching in Ohio and I had a gig that got postponed because of nonprofit theater budgets, especially are shaky right now. 00:30:21.317 --> 00:30:31.043 So I had a gig that got uh postponed indefinitely for budget reasons and I was like, well, crap, I had a job and now I don't. 00:30:32.500 --> 00:30:36.300 So I was like, well, the school year is Beks in session. 00:30:36.300 --> 00:30:41.672 So all of my school friends who are still in school are right in town. 00:30:41.873 --> 00:30:44.153 I have this play that I finished. 00:30:44.793 --> 00:30:47.743 Hey friends, do you want to do a thing? 00:30:47.743 --> 00:30:51.075 My dad's, so like I got some space for free. 00:30:51.075 --> 00:30:53.875 My dad's church was like, yep, here's the key, keep it clean. 00:30:53.875 --> 00:30:59.927 uh And uh my friends are like, yeah, we'll do it for free. 00:30:59.927 --> 00:31:01.057 And I went, no, no. 00:31:03.171 --> 00:31:08.174 I don't know how much I can pay you because of no nowhere near independently wealthy. 00:31:08.174 --> 00:31:12.577 But like even if it's just I make you food, like you're getting something. 00:31:13.078 --> 00:31:14.220 Yeah. 00:31:14.599 --> 00:31:19.543 So I put together like I taught myself how to run a crowdfunding campaign. 00:31:19.543 --> 00:31:29.114 uh And our first day in the in the rehearsal space, the church pickleball group was was practicing. 00:31:29.114 --> 00:31:34.375 And so the church lady saw some people they didn't know, they came over like, hey, can we help you find anything? 00:31:34.375 --> 00:31:35.836 know, welcome. 00:31:35.836 --> 00:31:40.107 We told them what we were doing and they were like, can we, can we copy your posters? 00:31:40.107 --> 00:31:42.717 I'll take some to work and I'll do, you have a fundraiser. 00:31:42.717 --> 00:31:43.338 What's the link? 00:31:43.338 --> 00:31:44.858 I'm going to donate right now. 00:31:45.898 --> 00:31:55.461 Fast forward to like maybe two, three weeks later, we had enough raised mostly by Midwest Christians. 00:31:55.713 --> 00:32:02.821 to pay a bunch of mostly queer people $20 an hour and we didn't charge for tickets. 00:32:03.532 --> 00:32:04.596 That's amazing. 00:32:04.596 --> 00:32:06.399 That is amazing. 00:32:06.541 --> 00:32:09.601 And I went, okay, let's see if we can do this again. 00:32:09.601 --> 00:32:12.481 Got another show that was focused on veterans. 00:32:12.601 --> 00:32:13.981 Did it again. 00:32:14.261 --> 00:32:15.821 $20 an hour. 00:32:15.821 --> 00:32:19.061 Recorded the cast album, kept the show free. 00:32:19.162 --> 00:32:28.961 And then was like, okay, the nonprofit part of it is struggling a little bit because I wasn't able to get a ton of grants being under a religious organization. 00:32:29.422 --> 00:32:30.321 But. 00:32:31.118 --> 00:32:34.178 it was clearly like something the area needed. 00:32:34.178 --> 00:32:41.078 And I was getting support from people who couldn't make it to see the shows live who were like, can you, is there a way that you can record it? 00:32:41.078 --> 00:32:43.578 Like we would love to see like a streaming version of it. 00:32:43.578 --> 00:32:48.278 So I went, cool, I'm going to make this my day job. 00:32:49.698 --> 00:33:14.412 And so August 1st of 2025, I started Roguish Goblin Stories and building a subscriber base and working on just getting as much support as I can so that I can pay also be and also providing professional like paying theater work in an area that doesn't have a lot of paying work. 00:33:14.412 --> 00:33:19.973 um So yeah, that was sort of the roller coaster. 00:33:21.120 --> 00:33:22.321 That's amazing. 00:33:22.321 --> 00:33:37.436 Well, and it feels like more important than ever to create, I think, alternative systems, because like you said, some of the, I think some of the system that we have maybe become used to rely on are not as reliable for whatever reasons. 00:33:37.436 --> 00:33:38.327 Right. 00:33:38.348 --> 00:33:47.111 And I think that under this regime, we're going to see like more and more cuts to things like the arts, because they're not seen as useful in air quotes. 00:33:47.111 --> 00:34:08.162 And I put in air quotes because There is so much research evidence of how useful things like arts and humanities and language studies and community spaces are and all that they bring to communities, not just to individuals. 00:34:08.481 --> 00:34:17.164 you know, unfortunately, that is not the direction that uh we are in in terms of uh regime level. 00:34:17.164 --> 00:34:19.168 And so I think it is really important. 00:34:19.168 --> 00:34:21.951 to keep creating kind of alternative structures. 00:34:21.951 --> 00:34:23.302 And I love that. 00:34:23.302 --> 00:34:32.449 I know that you said you launched the first investor opportunity because you're really passionate about supporting trans artists because that's the other thing I know. 00:34:32.449 --> 00:34:48.792 I I know personally the opportunities for trans folks are shrinking even as a speaker, educator, trainer, not as many calls, not as many emails lately, uh you know, and lately as in since fall 2024. 00:34:48.792 --> 00:34:49.597 Yeah. 00:34:49.597 --> 00:34:49.977 words. 00:34:49.977 --> 00:35:08.397 And so I think it is really important to keep creating kind of our own spaces where somehow we have each other's backs and knowing that this plan your community, like your church ladies were like, let's do this Beks We'll get, you know, we'll get you donations and we'll, you know, put flyers around, which is beautiful. 00:35:08.397 --> 00:35:12.537 And so tell me a little bit more about like the big vision. 00:35:12.537 --> 00:35:14.821 Like if you, you know, if you could like. 00:35:15.083 --> 00:35:18.817 wave a magic wand and tomorrow you have exactly what you wanted. 00:35:18.817 --> 00:35:22.411 What's the big vision for roguish goblin stories? 00:35:23.054 --> 00:35:25.614 Yeah, ambitious, that's for sure. 00:35:28.614 --> 00:35:29.173 I... 00:35:29.173 --> 00:35:29.974 Oh yeah. 00:35:29.974 --> 00:35:33.294 Well, and it's like, I have never had... 00:35:33.294 --> 00:35:36.494 Wasn't expecting to get $20 an hour for the first one, and it went okay. 00:35:36.494 --> 00:35:42.414 Clearly that dream that felt massive was much more doable than I thought. 00:35:43.334 --> 00:35:52.888 So yeah, big vision is I wanna build productions, like entertainment spaces. 00:35:52.888 --> 00:36:02.282 that are also building around the community gardens and affordable housing and supporting Indigenous land stewardship. 00:36:02.282 --> 00:36:09.565 um Just because that seems like a helpful thing to um do. 00:36:09.565 --> 00:36:19.619 And also like how cool would it be to like go to like the outdoor, the local like outdoor theater space and like your concessions are like in the trees, like there's the apples, there's a washing station. 00:36:19.619 --> 00:36:20.909 Like how fun. 00:36:22.505 --> 00:36:23.893 It's beautiful. 00:36:24.051 --> 00:36:27.789 supporting local communities like food sovereignty. 00:36:27.789 --> 00:36:35.358 as a traveling actor who's also a pastor's kid, boy do I have some wild housing stories. 00:36:35.358 --> 00:36:45.523 so affordable housing that isn't catching fire, isn't full of mold, isn't filling your lungs with carbon monoxide are like, housing is, yeah. 00:36:46.548 --> 00:36:48.084 All things that would be nice. 00:36:48.084 --> 00:36:48.656 Yeah. 00:36:48.656 --> 00:36:51.624 Maybe even accessible housing for the people who need it. 00:36:51.624 --> 00:36:52.986 We're just like, yeah. 00:36:52.986 --> 00:36:56.787 so that when people come over to visit they don't get stuck in the front door. 00:36:56.787 --> 00:37:07.210 uh Yeah, so like the housing and being a United Methodist from the Midwest food are like very important. 00:37:07.210 --> 00:37:19.254 ah And also like because the outdoor theater being that Yakuman in space, like it... 00:37:19.722 --> 00:37:25.184 It seems unrelated at first to be like theater and housing initiatives and food sovereignty, what? 00:37:25.184 --> 00:37:40.810 But it's like, it's all that same world of that community building and like strengthening, know, knowing your neighbors and like theater feeds the soul and the mind so much, it might as well also feed the body. 00:37:42.033 --> 00:37:42.963 Oh, absolutely. 00:37:42.963 --> 00:37:43.845 I love it. 00:37:43.845 --> 00:37:50.390 we, you know, I know in Minneapolis, there's some I'm trying to think of the name of the project. 00:37:50.390 --> 00:37:52.262 I think it was the Picnic Operetta. 00:37:52.262 --> 00:37:55.534 I want to say that was like it's such a beautiful project. 00:37:55.534 --> 00:37:59.498 And, know, so you would go and you would get food, but there would be Auburn. 00:37:59.498 --> 00:38:01.890 It would be like in gardens or parks. 00:38:01.890 --> 00:38:03.201 And I'm pretty sure it is. 00:38:03.201 --> 00:38:07.894 I'll send you the link because I'm like, and I'll put it also in the description if people want to check it out. 00:38:07.894 --> 00:38:11.117 But um that creativity. 00:38:11.185 --> 00:38:13.376 It really is about community building. 00:38:13.376 --> 00:38:15.197 That's really what we're talking about, right? 00:38:15.197 --> 00:38:20.969 We're talking about sustainable living for the people who do the labor, right? 00:38:20.969 --> 00:38:26.632 Like housing that is like respectful of our human dignity. 00:38:26.632 --> 00:38:28.032 That's the way I think about it. 00:38:28.032 --> 00:38:38.859 You know, like when there's like, you know, that meets the needs of the people and our food, like things I shouldn't really, I feel be that hard in such a wealthy country overall. 00:38:38.859 --> 00:38:42.772 And yet we know that they're really hard because of lots of systemic reasons. 00:38:42.772 --> 00:38:45.144 So I agree that all those things are connected. 00:38:45.144 --> 00:38:52.129 And I think that's often what people don't realize that it's arts is not just for like upper middle class people. 00:38:52.129 --> 00:39:08.651 No, art is really what gives a lot of folks in the community a way to come together, a way to support each other, a way to celebrate, a way to imagine other possibilities, a way to educate kids. 00:39:08.651 --> 00:39:11.704 you know, engage elders as well. 00:39:11.704 --> 00:39:24.576 We have a lot of kind of theater locally now that have moved kind of further north, that kind of uh is in that mixture of amateur and professional theater, I like to call it, where the auditions are in the community, right? 00:39:24.576 --> 00:39:30.380 But there's also like professionally trained actors and the productions are beautiful. 00:39:30.801 --> 00:39:33.564 know, so I totally see that. 00:39:33.564 --> 00:39:35.275 How do you see the... 00:39:35.693 --> 00:39:50.873 in person like the housing, the community, the gardens, know, with native plants and Indigenous land stewardship go together with the online platform because it sounds at the moment it's really more of an online platform. 00:39:50.873 --> 00:39:52.493 So tell me about that connection. 00:39:52.493 --> 00:40:00.493 Because I think sometimes people think in very binary ways online and in person, but I don't think they need to be so separate. 00:40:00.493 --> 00:40:03.693 So I'm curious about how you're imagining that piece. 00:40:04.268 --> 00:40:19.959 Yeah, especially starting out, I'm drawing a lot of inspiration from like National Theater, MarquisTV, like the other platforms that like they do it's uh for non-theater folks what's called a pro shot, which is essentially they have anywhere from like one to like four, depends on the budget. 00:40:19.959 --> 00:40:33.938 Like they have camera crews either in the audience, shooting it with an audience, which is my preferred, uh or they like shoot a dress rehearsal uh so that you can stream a recording of the show. 00:40:34.112 --> 00:40:43.664 even if you can't make it in person, especially with COVID, a bunch of different tactics for how do we digitize. 00:40:43.664 --> 00:40:51.147 And then also the theory question of what is theater and when does it become film? 00:40:52.027 --> 00:41:02.542 you know, but yeah, so like recording the shows, I think there's also ways to do hybrid attendance for sure. 00:41:02.542 --> 00:41:05.443 um especially if the cameras are already there. 00:41:07.664 --> 00:41:17.931 And also doing regular, like I have gotten the privilege to do a lot of different kinds of playwright groups. 00:41:17.931 --> 00:41:20.252 So I've been in some that like met over Discord. 00:41:20.252 --> 00:41:28.757 I've been in some that were in person or some that like, you you walked onto a Zoom call and you were like reading the play out loud and then getting feedback. 00:41:28.757 --> 00:41:47.235 um And so like, that's a really good way to bridge that because people get to see online, okay, I'm calling it a play test, where everyone is aware that the play is still in development, this might be the first, second, whatever draft. 00:41:47.235 --> 00:41:57.036 ah And so the point is you're hearing it out loud, it's in service for the playwright, and then the audience gets to work with the... 00:41:57.036 --> 00:42:02.472 talk with the actors in the playwright afterwards and provide feedback and their reactions. 00:42:02.634 --> 00:42:12.447 So that's a really fun, because then you get people involved and they get to see how the play grows and then when it finally does get staged they're like, remember when? 00:42:12.447 --> 00:42:16.765 uh That is so cool. 00:42:16.765 --> 00:42:17.505 I love that. 00:42:17.505 --> 00:42:18.985 That's a great idea. 00:42:19.025 --> 00:42:30.065 it also is, yeah, that sounds like there are so many different ways that people can engage, you know, and so many different audiences that this would be accessible to. 00:42:30.065 --> 00:42:34.305 And you also have a podcast as part of Roguish Goblin Stories. 00:42:34.305 --> 00:42:35.225 Is that right? 00:42:35.225 --> 00:42:39.245 I see that you have a podcast, Art Lives Aren't That Interesting. 00:42:39.245 --> 00:42:41.001 Is that what it's called or? 00:42:41.001 --> 00:42:42.939 Yeah! Tell me more about that. 00:42:42.939 --> 00:42:45.432 I love hearing about other people's podcasts. 00:42:45.432 --> 00:42:47.564 So I'm like, yes, tell me more. 00:42:48.074 --> 00:43:03.579 Yeah, so as I am still like very early, very low budget, like I'm still like trying to apply for grants and like grow the subscriber base and the investors uh to be able to pay actors for those like fully staged productions. 00:43:03.579 --> 00:43:28.092 uh Everywhere I go, uh least one person is like, I need a dang memoir of like your life and also like what in the heck is like As a clergy household, we have some very interesting stories and some of them we can't share, but some of them have been already like part of sermon illustrations for years, like the time that I cut my own hair with a pair of safety scissors. 00:43:28.092 --> 00:43:38.256 uh Especially my daughter has been with me her whole life in terms of parenting. 00:43:38.256 --> 00:43:43.448 It's part of many stories I share when training and when writing books with our consent. 00:43:43.448 --> 00:43:48.070 But, you know, we often joke about it as like pieces of our lives are pretty public. 00:43:48.070 --> 00:43:49.430 I understand that. 00:43:49.430 --> 00:44:05.239 Right, yeah, and so my parents and I were talking, because my parents are there, I love them to death, and they are doing everything they're like, what can we do to help you, like, get this to the point where it can be your day job? 00:44:05.239 --> 00:44:16.990 And so I was like, you know, you two keep talking about how like, oh, you know, our lives, we were told all growing up that like, our lives aren't that interesting, we don't have anything that important to say. 00:44:16.990 --> 00:44:19.006 And I'm like, mom, dad. 00:44:19.479 --> 00:44:23.941 Do you realize how wild some of the things that we have been through are? 00:44:24.581 --> 00:44:39.446 And how encouraging that having, you know, being able to see Christian parents and their trans-Aro-Ace kid, that alone is so encouraging to so many people that I talk to. 00:44:39.619 --> 00:44:44.307 And so they were like, well, let's do a podcast. 00:44:44.307 --> 00:44:47.749 And so like we started a podcast about it. 00:44:49.763 --> 00:44:50.455 Yeah. 00:44:50.455 --> 00:44:51.438 I love that. 00:44:51.438 --> 00:44:52.922 What's the focus of the podcast? 00:44:52.922 --> 00:44:58.055 That you just talk about your lives, like basically, or how? 00:44:58.314 --> 00:45:05.710 stories from our life and we are trying to be very intentional about what stories that we tell and put out on the internet. 00:45:05.710 --> 00:45:15.218 um But the underlying focus and the underlying message is the same underlying message that's for Rougash Goblin stories, which is you're loved, you're not alone. 00:45:15.759 --> 00:45:24.930 And so bringing all of those stories of like, the dog being scared of the toaster and you know. 00:45:24.930 --> 00:45:34.419 What do you do when you're stuck in a space where you're very clearly not welcomed and you can't leave right away? 00:45:34.419 --> 00:45:36.391 Like that's one of the early episodes. 00:45:36.391 --> 00:45:45.389 And how do you hold onto, how do you continue to choose joy when everything is just falling apart? 00:45:45.409 --> 00:45:51.164 And just bringing all of those stories Beks to that, you're loved, you're not alone, you're loved, you're not alone, you're loved, you're not. 00:45:52.783 --> 00:45:53.983 I love that so much. 00:45:53.983 --> 00:46:03.303 think that now more than ever, we really need to remember that those moments of joy, those moments of connection, we need those. 00:46:03.303 --> 00:46:07.443 Like that is what nourish us to keep going no matter what else is going on. 00:46:07.443 --> 00:46:15.103 And I think it can be hard for people to remember that, especially if they're isolated or if they haven't experienced this kind of connection and community. 00:46:15.103 --> 00:46:20.563 So what a beautiful gift for your family to kind of give this to the world. 00:46:20.563 --> 00:46:22.283 That's fantastic. 00:46:22.318 --> 00:46:34.919 And actually fits well with one, I always ask all my guests at the moment, especially my trans non-binary gender experience of a guest, which is mostly what I shifted to focus on since fall of 2024. 00:46:35.239 --> 00:46:48.439 What is it that's kind of giving you nourishment or joy or comfort as we keep facing a lot of anti-trans sentiment from certain parts of the world? 00:46:48.450 --> 00:46:53.034 Yeah, I think um I definitely draw. 00:46:53.034 --> 00:47:01.411 have gotten much more intentional about making sure that my morning routine is I get up, I work out, and then I meditate. 00:47:01.411 --> 00:47:09.147 have some meditations that I have found sort of sorting through all of it and I've saved to my phone. 00:47:09.147 --> 00:47:16.193 I have that habit stacked onto that um tapping, which I just came across recently. 00:47:16.193 --> 00:47:20.478 um pressure point martial artist, I'm like, how have I missed this for so long? 00:47:20.478 --> 00:47:22.729 Because I know what all of these pressure points are. 00:47:22.729 --> 00:47:35.446 uh So having that as blocked off as I possibly can every morning that I'm like, and I'm not necessarily lifting weights seven days a week, but at least four days a week. 00:47:35.446 --> 00:47:40.238 And then I'm training it out with yoga and some other things for variety. 00:47:40.258 --> 00:47:45.281 But having that set time in the morning has done wonders the last couple of weeks. 00:47:45.281 --> 00:47:47.054 Journaling has really helped. 00:47:47.054 --> 00:48:10.681 uh Also, like, even if I can't, you know, because there's eight inches of snow on the ground, uh even if I can't go drive, you know, at least, you know, I have set up with a few friends that like we have a recurring uh like call in our calendars that like every month or every two weeks or every week we're getting on a video call and we're checking in on each other. 00:48:10.681 --> 00:48:16.162 uh You know, it doesn't replace the in-person connection, but it's definitely... 00:48:16.635 --> 00:48:20.267 better than nothing, especially in the winter. 00:48:20.856 --> 00:48:21.557 absolutely. 00:48:21.557 --> 00:48:22.187 love that. 00:48:22.187 --> 00:48:22.668 Yeah. 00:48:22.668 --> 00:48:28.282 And winter and where it's cold, like where you are and where I am is definitely a thing. 00:48:28.282 --> 00:48:35.719 But I love that you mentioned so many things that are so important and yet it's so easy to not prioritize, right? 00:48:35.719 --> 00:48:45.937 Movement and connecting with ourselves, whatever that looks like, whether it's meditation, whether it's like just having breakfast or sitting quietly or reading, right? 00:48:45.937 --> 00:48:47.961 Or connecting with people. 00:48:47.961 --> 00:48:49.572 Those are all things that we really need. 00:48:49.572 --> 00:48:56.656 And I think that often underlay stage capitalism is so easy to not prioritize that, especially during moments of stress. 00:48:56.656 --> 00:49:02.778 So I'm really glad to hear that you're prioritizing those things and they're bringing you nourishment. 00:49:02.796 --> 00:49:07.420 I also scrapped pretty much all the social media off my phone. 00:49:07.420 --> 00:49:19.100 I still have access to it on my computer because that's how I do a lot of my marketing, but I treat it purely as a marketing tool basically at this point and that has helped a lot as well. 00:49:19.100 --> 00:49:29.789 um now that I've gotten some of those self-care habits a little more ingrained, the next one that I'm adding is because I can get very excited about... 00:49:29.856 --> 00:49:35.630 I'm gonna be writing and doing all the things for my business and then like not take a break. 00:49:36.451 --> 00:49:40.293 So like the next habit, oh yeah. 00:49:40.994 --> 00:49:47.298 Especially when it's like something that I'm like A excited about and B also like growing into my day job. 00:49:47.298 --> 00:49:52.221 uh Being like I would like to have the income to support. 00:49:54.443 --> 00:50:02.512 But the next habit that I'm working in is having at least one or two days of just no devices. 00:50:02.512 --> 00:50:11.892 Because those are the days when I do, at the very least when I cut things off at five and like, nope, I am focusing on real life, real people. 00:50:11.892 --> 00:50:21.361 I think of like the movie Ready Player One, where they shut the oasis off, they shut the alternative reality, the video game off for two days of the week. 00:50:21.361 --> 00:50:22.302 And I'm like. 00:50:22.531 --> 00:50:23.400 Yeah. 00:50:23.950 --> 00:50:25.533 That's probably a good idea. 00:50:27.631 --> 00:50:35.231 We've definitely had some like no devices day in our family sometimes because I'm like, okay, no devices day or no devices night. 00:50:35.231 --> 00:50:38.731 Let's just hold like sit around and talk or read. 00:50:38.751 --> 00:50:46.071 And yeah, it's so important because it can be so easy to just disappear into our electronics nowadays. 00:50:47.391 --> 00:50:48.711 Yeah, that's so real. 00:50:48.711 --> 00:50:50.051 I love all of this. 00:50:50.051 --> 00:50:53.911 feel like I could keep talking and talking about, I want to be respectful of your time. 00:50:53.911 --> 00:50:56.207 If people, if listeners want to. 00:50:56.207 --> 00:51:03.526 towards your project or want to kind of see some of the plays that you've talked about, where should they go? 00:51:03.714 --> 00:51:08.518 Yeah, so I'll spell it out because sometimes auto transcribe does not spell my name correctly. 00:51:08.518 --> 00:51:14.318 uh case people are like, I'm listening. 00:51:14.318 --> 00:51:17.005 I'm going to look it up on Instagram right now. 00:51:17.005 --> 00:51:18.666 I always like to ask as well. 00:51:18.666 --> 00:51:29.894 Yeah, so you can find Roguish Goblin Stories at beksroen.org/rgs, which is B-E-K-S-R-O-E-N dot org slash rgs. 00:51:29.894 --> 00:51:35.339 That page is going to have a couple different options for you to be involved. 00:51:35.339 --> 00:51:44.526 If you have extra resources and you really want to help, like not just like, I'm bankrolling the productions and like helping get this off the ground, but like. 00:51:44.608 --> 00:51:51.672 you're getting to put names and faces to the people in the queer community and the artistic community that you're helping. 00:51:51.672 --> 00:52:19.298 I've intentionally designed the investors to be, uh there are different levels of engagement based on what you prefer, but getting that personal connection with the artists, like Q &As with the artists, getting like pre-show dinners for when we do in-person shows, know, getting to uh even If you have someone you're sort of kind of fond of and you want to name a character in the play after somebody, there's that. 00:52:19.298 --> 00:52:25.731 And that's that really, really deep impact where you're getting to put those names and faces to the people that you're helping. 00:52:26.471 --> 00:52:35.554 On that same page is also if you're just like, just want to see the shows and a little behind the scenes and I just need a community built by us and for us. 00:52:35.554 --> 00:52:42.438 that there's just an option to subscribe and there's uh two different tiers based on basically how much behind the scenes do you want. 00:52:43.256 --> 00:52:44.157 Yeah, that's fair. 00:52:44.157 --> 00:52:46.117 Ah, that sounds so fun. 00:52:46.117 --> 00:52:51.821 I hope that a lot of listeners check it out because it sounds super fun. 00:52:52.001 --> 00:53:03.318 And anything that we haven't talked about that you were hoping that we would cover or anything else that you would like the listeners or people watching if they're watching this on YouTube to know. 00:53:03.597 --> 00:53:06.980 ah Thank you for being here. 00:53:06.980 --> 00:53:15.643 Thank you for sticking around and for not giving up and for not letting all of the chaos numb you. 00:53:15.664 --> 00:53:17.423 It is difficult. 00:53:17.423 --> 00:53:26.949 m But one of the things that I'm trying to do with the stories is use, because theater is an excellent rehearsal for life. 00:53:26.949 --> 00:53:30.786 uh very true. 00:53:31.126 --> 00:53:39.292 using the stories to help us rehearse how to grieve and how to have joy and how those two grow together, right? 00:53:39.292 --> 00:53:48.778 Like, happiness is that fleeting situational, like, it comes, goes, it's much harder to hold on to. 00:53:48.778 --> 00:53:57.405 But real joy comes with and from and around the grief. 00:53:57.405 --> 00:54:09.062 And so being able to let that flow through is like really what I'm hoping people get from anything I say and any show that I do. 00:54:09.062 --> 00:54:15.733 And also it's really fun to make trans people and air and ace people the main characters and give them a sword. 00:54:16.752 --> 00:54:19.652 uh That is true. 00:54:19.652 --> 00:54:21.553 Oh, I love that so much. 00:54:21.553 --> 00:54:26.855 Well, I can't wait to see how Rogish Goblin stories grows. 00:54:26.855 --> 00:54:42.609 And I can't wait to see for that beautiful vision that you talked about of like housing and land and food sovereignty and Indigenous land stewardship and community and theater uh all kind of grow. 00:54:42.609 --> 00:54:44.708 I can't wait to like. 00:54:44.708 --> 00:54:52.952 read news that it's all happening and it's thriving and it's like a model for so many other communities maybe to follow. 00:54:52.952 --> 00:54:54.074 So thank you, Beks. 00:54:54.074 --> 00:54:56.635 Thank you so much for your time today. 00:54:56.635 --> 00:55:09.364 And dear gender stories listeners, I hope that you feel nourished, excited and inspired to explore the edges of your own imagination no matter what you do. 00:55:09.364 --> 00:55:12.557 And until next time, take care of yourselves and each other. 00:55:12.557 --> 00:55:13.544 Mm-hmm.