The migration of applications from physical servers to virtual workloads has been underway for over two decades, but the migration from virtual machines to containers is less than a decade old. Modernizing applications to run as containers requires new tooling and the open source Kubernetes project has emerged as the widest adopted container management system.
Kubernetes provides cloud-native capabilities, architecture, and operations which require new skill sets, posing a disruptive challenge to traditional organizations who desire the rapid software updates and performance scaling benefits. Like the Linux operating system, there are many Kubernetes distributions, and Red Hat OpenShift provides a market-leading platform to build, deploy and run applications with a consistent foundation across the hybrid cloud. Red Hat OpenShift includes over-the-air updates, container runtime, networking, ingress, monitoring, logging, container registry, and authentication and authorization solutions.
Nutanix provides simplicity, scalability, and hybrid cloud infrastructure, providing one-click upgrades of storage, compute, and network resources and services on your choice of hardware, public cloud, and service providers. Running Red Hat OpenShift on Nutanix provides a full stack, enterprise supported, standardized solution with greatly simplified platform management and many non-disruptive operations, accelerating the adoption of containers and cloud native applications.
Host: Andy Whiteside
Co-Host: Harvey Green
Co-Host Jirah Cox
The migration of applications from physical servers to virtual workloads has been underway for over two decades, but the migration from virtual machines to containers is less than a decade old. Modernizing applications to run as containers requires new tooling and the open source Kubernetes project has emerged as the widest adopted container management system.
Kubernetes provides cloud-native capabilities, architecture, and operations which require new skill sets, posing a disruptive challenge to traditional organizations who desire the rapid software updates and performance scaling benefits. Like the Linux operating system, there are many Kubernetes distributions, and Red Hat OpenShift provides a market-leading platform to build, deploy and run applications with a consistent foundation across the hybrid cloud. Red Hat OpenShift includes over-the-air updates, container runtime, networking, ingress, monitoring, logging, container registry, and authentication and authorization solutions.
Nutanix provides simplicity, scalability, and hybrid cloud infrastructure, providing one-click upgrades of storage, compute, and network resources and services on your choice of hardware, public cloud, and service providers. Running Red Hat OpenShift on Nutanix provides a full stack, enterprise supported, standardized solution with greatly simplified platform management and many non-disruptive operations, accelerating the adoption of containers and cloud native applications.
Host: Andy Whiteside
Co-Host: Harvey Green
Co-Host Jirah Cox
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Andy Whiteside: Hello everyone and welcome to episode 34 of your tenants weekly i'm your host Andy whiteside i've got the clueless Harvey green Harvey how's it going.
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Harvey Green: pretty good pending whatever is going to happen after me finding out why i'm clueless.
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Andy Whiteside: So Harvey has no idea what topic we're going to cover cuz he's a few minutes late and Darren has picked it and we didn't because he wasn't in the zoom in time he didn't get the chat.
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Andy Whiteside: piece so he's kind of in the dark, but that's okay you'll be you'll be fine just just know that in gyro we trust and just hold on for the ride.
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Jirah Cox: first mover advantage right.
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Andy Whiteside: The music okay.
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Jirah Cox: first mover advantage is that what is another word.
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Andy Whiteside: Oh yeah yeah well, I still lose most time in when I first moved, and that includes playing chess with my 12 year old so.
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Andy Whiteside: It is so john Cox with a gyro and we were just having this off camera off recording conversation around why it's so hard for bars to just go recommend good solutions to good customers with good technologies good vendors and grow.
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Andy Whiteside: You know I think we're just a bunch of sales engineers or engineers that that don't understand why just doing good business isn't isn't good enough.
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Andy Whiteside: And we were just kind of chatting through that I figured i'd bring it up here yeah it is, it should be.
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Jirah Cox: it's universal right to it's tough to not know what you don't know and.
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Jirah Cox: You know if that if that includes like I don't know why I should pay for design services for this new cluster for this new APP for this migration that I want to take on.
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Jirah Cox: Well then, it's gonna hurt i'm gonna have a hard time seeing value in buying those design services and making sure my design looks right before I go by the infrastructure to run that application on yeah.
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Harvey Green: And then, like a bad idea to me to build something without going through design and architecture first.
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Jirah Cox: it's.
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Andy Whiteside: You guys, but you guys have all been responsible for running systems at some point, you know that you need to evaluate and you need to design, you need to pilot, but how many of your projects really do all these things.
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Harvey Green: um it depends on whether or not i'm in charge of that project.
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Jirah Cox: yeah and it depends, I mean so so much of so much of that kind of effort right is around.
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Jirah Cox: was around reducing risk right because that's that's ultimately what it comes down to is we think it's X But what if we are wrong, we think this is why But what if we are wrong.
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Jirah Cox: And, and how will we handle that circumstance, if we are wrong Okay, I know that I need to add a note I need that I need this more capacity there's much more throughput.
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Jirah Cox: You know it's all about it's the Multi level thinking about how do I.
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Jirah Cox: handle all these outcomes, whether they're likely are not likely right.
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Jirah Cox: Anyhow it's more than we do for me now we're just totally riffing in any random direction it's more than we do for almost any part of our personal life right like we all have in this meeting we've all had a successful workday I would assume.
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Jirah Cox: Without planning for nine levels of contingency right we didn't have a design session before we hopped onto this call, I mean you know i've never done a design session for any house i've bought or car that i've purchased.
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Jirah Cox: You know, so it does feel it is a different.
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Jirah Cox: kind of motion to go through right for be like Oh, you want to run what ginormous legacy enterprise APP on Prem.
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Jirah Cox: And you might even do it today, but you also want to do an upgrade and when you migrate here's why that design session clarify a lot of all the inputs, that we need to know for those complicated system.
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Andy Whiteside: But jagger this you the House examples have you ever built a house from scratch either yourself or through a builder.
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Jirah Cox: Not all the way from groundbreaking yeah.
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Andy Whiteside: But if you do like you have the design Center, you have the plans you have lots of things that go along with consulting methodologies and.
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Andy Whiteside: It does apply and then, if you're buying one that's you know existing House you already know what this is going to look like and then you buy it, and then they make a few slight adjustments, you probably do it, but it's just so natural to do it when you're buying a house, but you know.
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Andy Whiteside: SIS admin or an IT manager or Director by half million dollars, with the hardware thinks he needs to skip all that.
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Jirah Cox: Right right.
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Jirah Cox: You know your general contractor doesn't ask you what's your square footage requirement and what if you need 50% more square footage in three years, how are you gonna solve that you know.
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Jirah Cox: it's a different sort of question asking directive than, then you can run your personal life.
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Andy Whiteside: I mean all those things are better with hyper.
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Andy Whiteside: converge and new tactics, I mean that's Those are the things that you guys help solve but it's still not perfect, and you can still get it drastically wrong if you don't come close to measure three times cut once.
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Jirah Cox: yeah it's interesting I mean that you think house buying house buying like the almost the first cut right your first your high level filter criteria.
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Jirah Cox: Is price right almost always because there's there's almost nothing else like Oh, but this feature is nice but that's Nice that like magically lets you afford double the mortgage per month.
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Jirah Cox: So, like if prices your Hello filter that's fine and then you think of houses, like a way to spend whatever hundred thousand dollars on a house and ethical right, but at least.
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Jirah Cox: we'll go super low here then there's only a couple of different ways that $100,000 House can be shaped.
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Jirah Cox: By an enterprise it buying a half million dollars infrastructure of any vendor right, not just the tedx there's like 25 different ways that can come out.
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Jirah Cox: And only a handful of them are going to really run your application with a performance that you need to write like did you buy a backup cluster but you want to run production on it right, did you buy a crazy fast cluster.
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Jirah Cox: Oh, but you forgot that you actually need more storage than you planned, I know I can just lots of different inputs, that you can.
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Jirah Cox: that are worth you know hammering out in the front end.
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Andy Whiteside: yeah the key there is you're highlighting that it's the it's the resource load that you're going to need that's that's not.
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Andy Whiteside: that's not negotiable you they're going to need it or you're not the application is going to turn that.
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Andy Whiteside: you're going to need it, and so you have to buy into that, as you make your decisions versus you know just choosing to live with less square footage or more expensive mortgage yep or cheaper side of town.
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Andy Whiteside: All right, well Harvey I should have done a better job revealing to you, but gyro and I have decided we're going to cover this blog for from October 26 is that mark levy, I think, is the name.
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Jirah Cox: In.
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Our hobby.
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Andy Whiteside: Mark lobby sorry totally sorry getting started with red hat open shift on new tannic hca hyper converged infrastructure.
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Andy Whiteside: i've been wanting to talk to you guys about red hat for a while now so that's this lines really well with a topic, I wanted to cover and so Harvey you're just along for the ride.
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Harvey Green: i'll take it i'll figure out how to add value in some way.
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Andy Whiteside: Well, this was likely to be the the gyro show but that's good because that's why we're here, and while i'm sure, a lot of people listening, in fact, I know, based on top of your lungs unix folks they like they like to listen, because of what gyro might say, well.
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Harvey Green: Fine, then i'll shut up and deliver all baloney.
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Jirah Cox: So much so much pressure to deliver um.
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Jirah Cox: No, I think it's I think it's fun content right it's it's a wonderful blend of how do we, I mean like we're talking about how do we use.
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Jirah Cox: Infrastructure and capabilities to run what the business cares about which is the applications right and do it in a in a efficient fashion so.
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Andy Whiteside: So Jerry what is this whole red hat open shift on new techniques ACI what's the idea what's the previous why, why did this happen.
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Jirah Cox: So hmm so back when the earth was young right we started building servers know.
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Jirah Cox: me a the y know the Why is is actually took this from our next conference right the y is customers right saying I love new tannic I want to run my Apps on newt Annex I love red hat open shift right and open shift being red hats.
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Jirah Cox: You know, supported ecosystem and build and branch and offering for Cooper daddy's right, so this is a way of packaging and running my applications.
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Jirah Cox: In production and it's I think entirely hardware agnostic right its infrastructure infrastructure agnostic you can run open shift in the cloud on Prem hybrid multi cloud like we run all of that.
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Jirah Cox: And so we've customers want you to actually there for structure and they want open shift for their application delivery model, then they really want.
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Jirah Cox: And you can make some red hat play nicely together right so we've solved that that that with this alliance and partnership, now we can say, those are two great tastes that taste great together so that's that's the y right is is really beginning and end customer demand.
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Jirah Cox: It really wasn't attending problem to solve.
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Andy Whiteside: This is the idea that we're going to be able to run open shift on on premises new tactics ACI solutions.
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Jirah Cox: yep brilliant thanks anywhere that only to be fair, like even there's no reason you can run it on clusters as well, so bring your hardware as a service.
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Jirah Cox: model right ios on it and that'll also run open chef very well.
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Andy Whiteside: So this is really a matter of.
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Andy Whiteside: Customers who need who want Cooper daddy's through red hat but want new tactics to be a layer between the on premises hardware or the in the cloud technologies so that it's kind of universal for them oh.
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Jirah Cox: yeah totally our customers that even you know there's a great huge amount that have already deployed their open shift right there already somewhere down the path of their open chef journey.
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Jirah Cox: Of this is how we're going to run our next gen cloud native applications in production and so that ability to say you already run.
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Jirah Cox: run open shift here's what it takes runs a bunch of very well and why it's an easy transition for you, but here's what you get out of that right everything we've talked about from.
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Jirah Cox: infrastructure management planning acquisition lifecycle model that can now apply it to your open shift stack as well.
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Andy Whiteside: yeah and i'm looking at the the visual here, you still have a ios and play of course hv and then there's new tannic files and an open shift is somewhere higher up on the stack so open shift as a container and Cooper daddy's type containers, though it is.
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Jirah Cox: Open shift is yeah the the q&a distribution right from red hat, so they.
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Jirah Cox: They can publish it, they can support it right, you can call and say hey.
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Jirah Cox: I see this or I have a question about that and it's, of course, a more supportive probably more rough edges sanded off then.
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Jirah Cox: Forging your own blazing your own career a trail right from a you know building from source right deploying from from repose right it's like Well, no, I just want to.
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Jirah Cox: You know, get my get my distribution from red hat notes supported top bottom.
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Jirah Cox: or or or bolted onto existing open shift installation about having my in my environment right, I can build new pods on new tannic that would be part of my enterprise APP fabric that might already exist.
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Andy Whiteside: So this is starting to make more sense to me right, so you listen to vmware they've got their Cooper nettie play.
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Andy Whiteside: This is where new tactics, instead of creating your own it's just partnering with the best of breed red hat and allowing new techniques to be part of the red hat story, and vice versa, like you said a while ago to two great tastes taste better together.
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Andy Whiteside: that's all this really is right as to best of breed products agreeing to be partners with each other yeah.
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Jirah Cox: Well, actually we even do have our own right, we launch carbon a couple years ago.
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Jirah Cox: The it's more about the you know what's the what's your right use case if you're in that I want the enterprise grade give me the full.
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Jirah Cox: The full ecosystem, the full stack from like my build pipeline my repository of where Am I containers live whether waiting to get deployed.
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Jirah Cox: load balancers ingress managers that can all be supported by one for open shift stack whereas our carpet offering was it's literally just the Cooper and a leg of the stool and lots of other things, to build around it so.
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Jirah Cox: So it's more of it's even more enterprise ready even more turnkey right, you have the full developer pipeline ready to go versus you know here's a foundation, you can go build go build your House on top of it right.
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Harvey Green: So more along the lines of my one of my favorite topics flexibility.
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Jirah Cox: yeah 100% yeah.
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Jirah Cox: And then, and then you know part of the wine eugenics right would be that persistent storage right.
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Jirah Cox: there's very few applications in the world that you want to run that don't need to ever store data right, like, for the most part, most applications want to store data and then retrieve it later on.
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Jirah Cox: And the flexibility that we bring their offering with either you can X files for SMB and nfl s connectivity.
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Jirah Cox: And he thinks objects for s3 or volumes for block storage whatever you know language your application wants to speak, whatever it's it's parlance for storage is what we've got that.
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Andy Whiteside: You know it's not it's not uncommon for us to be having an application centric conversation it comes back to what new techniques, is doing with with files as a way to, as you said, hold the data store and the state or.
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Andy Whiteside: storage for the data which you never get away in an application world without having some level of data that needs to be persistent.
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Jirah Cox: yeah I can't think of any.
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Andy Whiteside: yeah a lot of times I ask what's most important thing, and it ends up I like to think this applications and everyone's possibly hits me with data will be can't have one without the other so it's not wrong.
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Harvey Green: To the story.
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Andy Whiteside: So far as this as this new tannic telling this story and read had just kind of let it happen or both companies truly going to market, together with better together.
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Jirah Cox: I can only speak for for my little piece of the world, but yeah I think we're working very well with red hat teams.
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Jirah Cox: You know, with them being the preferred Cuban a solution and us being a preferred platform.
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You.
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Andy Whiteside: guys give you an example of some of the more popular Apps that are happening through containers I don't I live in a virtual machine world.
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Andy Whiteside: A lot of desktop virtualization lot of x86 applications what what what am I not seeing it's happening all around me that I don't realize it's happening in containers.
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Jirah Cox: Well, so one one whole compartment there right is going to be companies homegrown Apps right if it's an APP that you write developed internally You then have to you know product eyes it.
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Jirah Cox: In production, you know, this is where the whole devops things come into play around we don't just want people over here that right, the APP people over there that to run the APP.
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Jirah Cox: But it's too for teams right that that was one team that owns the pain of supporting it, but then can also write it in more secure and optimize ways in the front end that can help them get deployed more easily.
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Jirah Cox: You know, internal Apps those will never make headlines rarely are they shouldn't make headlines.
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Jirah Cox: That right, at least in a marketing sense right around adoption right because it's like it's a single customer application right you wrote it you run it and it runs your business and you make money off of it, hopefully.
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Jirah Cox: So that part like right, we will will never get a very bright light on from a.
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Jirah Cox: glitzy marketing standpoint of what Apps do I want to container eyes, because your Apps are there, your Apps up its up, it makes sense.
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Andy Whiteside: No, it does it does and that's why living in the world, I live in I don't see a lot of containers but i'm usually working with off the shelf or cloud as a service technologies not internal corporate NAPs.
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Andy Whiteside: Right yeah.
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Jirah Cox: For sure right so that's you know, often their their flavors this conversation around.
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Jirah Cox: You know if it's the the it director, the it leaders saying, I have to provide I need to I need to provide containerized you know compute platforms and container storage to my APP teams right as they're doing their jobs.
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Jirah Cox: You know let's talk through public versus private versus hybrid multi cloud versus you know native cloud itself where we're coordinated was born.
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Jirah Cox: What makes the most sense for for my needs right that's where you know we're solving problems, helping the itm structure team empower the APP team, and therefore the business.
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Jirah Cox: But, but often the Apps themselves can be a bit abstracted from us in general, though right like us almost somewhat dumber more simplified answer is.
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Jirah Cox: kind of whatever runs us and have like the containers that run here at my house, you know there's load balancers there's some web servers there's like some.
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Jirah Cox: Databases not your traditional you know Oracle sequel enterprise databases right like postgres like my sequel stuff like cockroach so cash db like a lot of your next gen applications are much more friendly at being containerized and container eyes packaging.
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Andy Whiteside: hurry what's he talking about.
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Harvey Green: I don't know drivers already cockroaches propeller started spinning, and he just took off.
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Jirah Cox: I mean.
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Jirah Cox: If you're going to take away one thing we shouldn't have cockroaches in your couch right, I think we can all agree on that.
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Andy Whiteside: Let me tell you about the applications that run it my house.
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Andy Whiteside: cockroaches and couches.
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Andy Whiteside: My sequel databases.
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Harvey Green: you've got cockroaches and couches you need to run the raid application.
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Jirah Cox: Know newt annex is an Anti there's a no raid platform.
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know how the raid application.
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Jirah Cox: Nice.
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Andy Whiteside: listener.
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Jirah Cox: The.
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Jirah Cox: You know, you could run you can run vpn you know concentrators at your House, you can run.
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Jirah Cox: What typical home application, you know, like plex server runs it runs a container right so that's.
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Jirah Cox: that's the application vendors choice to publish it in a container eyes fashion right, you can install plex on Linux plex on windows plexus a container it's just another distribution mechanism for them.
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yeah.
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Andy Whiteside: I know I just haven't done any of it, I just haven't run across the need to yet, but i'm sure it's coming in everybody's world to do it as container why, why would you install it if you could just lay down a container and turn it on.
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Jirah Cox: Well, the need comes the need comes in at scale right like traditionally last you can call tradition last 1015 years of it right, we have deployed in ios underneath virtually every APP right as as servers got too big.
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Jirah Cox: And, and the physical server you just couldn't buy them small enough for your application right I couldn't buy.
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Jirah Cox: A physical recommend server small enough to be a domain controller it's overkill right my my domain controller would be like 2% busy on a on a heavy day.
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Jirah Cox: So i've got to do other things with the hardware enter virtualization virtualization means any shared storage, so I can migrate and have high availability.
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Jirah Cox: As long as my hardware economics are staying way way out in the distance, then I don't really care about building an os and virtualize it beneath every single application, but when I look when I step back and I look at my cluster, and I say, well, this whole cluster is running like 40%.
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Jirah Cox: My ios and 60% my Apps or maybe maybe vice versa, depending on, you know how your how how fat your ios is or like what I don't know in guess monitoring agents you're running then.
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Jirah Cox: Then you might think well how do I get rid of 40% right, if I can run more instances fewer instances more APP instances, then my blend is going in the right direction right so it's all about you know, in some ways constraint right is always the.
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Jirah Cox: catalyst for that kind of innovation.
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Andy Whiteside: And everything we're talking about here is containers and it just so happens at Cooper daddy's is the container system that one out.
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Jirah Cox: Right yeah I mean it doesn't got way broader adoption then just me talking here from my anecdotal viewpoint way broader adoption then like docker swarm yeah for sure I mean.
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Jirah Cox: It never hurts to be.
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Jirah Cox: You know google's chosen platform and Google, you know really Google developed right because that's going to give you a huge leg up in the open source community.
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Harvey Green: Is this the blue writing versus laserdisc conversation.
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Jirah Cox: Oh.
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Andy Whiteside: BLU Ray versus a.
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Jirah Cox: Each DVD.
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Jirah Cox: add extra.
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Andy Whiteside: Or we use you just compared like something from five years ago to something 25 years ago, or so.
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Jirah Cox: Which is.
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Jirah Cox: Which is common right like typically that's what we were all here right, so I want vm or containers it's like well, you probably want both, and I could probably want containers in your vm.
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Jirah Cox: But they're gonna do they're gonna do different things right.
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Andy Whiteside: Well you're talking to a kid who had who had laser disc like and we kid in town had laserdisc I had for movies, as it.
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Andy Whiteside: And then, after that we had Betamax instead of vhs so I had 20 movies, and everything else got to go to the movie store and pick any movie they wanted would mind we're high quality when we're higher quality than theirs, but I had 20 it was it.
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Harvey Green: I am happy for that childhood experience for you, because it taught you to pick the right technology later in life.
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Jirah Cox: So Harvey our kids that are similar ages would would your kids know what to do with a DVD if you handed it to them.
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Harvey Green: Probably not.
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Jirah Cox: Saying there's nothing in my living room that you could put that in, and they have never experienced that workflow in their life and I love it right because i've never found peanut butter in you know.
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Jirah Cox: You know player slot that it shouldn't be.
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Andy Whiteside: Thinking about this, these movement oldest kids are 19 we had vhs tapes like we didn't even have DVDs when they were.
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Andy Whiteside: They weren't widely use or what did your car you get a vhs player your car now now you just hand them a device, and they just pick whatever who they want real time.
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Jirah Cox: yeah it's wild how.
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Jirah Cox: Like you could buy your like for like a minivan you could buy an iPad for every seat in the minivan.
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Jirah Cox: And still save money over like the court in car entertainment system and you actually have fewer fights I mean it's amazing I mean that's just my kids maybe.
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Andy Whiteside: I used to have to pull over and rewind the tape halfway to the beach.
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yeah.
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Jirah Cox: struggle was real.
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Jirah Cox: But as we're moving and packing.
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up.
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Jirah Cox: You know, a DVD fell out from behind some boxes on a shelf and it's like Oh, this is still on my list of things to digitize it's like where do I start digitizing a vhs tape.
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Jirah Cox: This is gonna be doesn't, this is a.
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Jirah Cox: stay on the on the to do list for a little while here.
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Andy Whiteside: You know, pay somebody to just to do it so.
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Harvey Green: that's over if you haven't done it by now you're not getting that.
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Jirah Cox: I mean.
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Jirah Cox: i'm with you and I don't think my wife listens to this podcast we're gonna keep that between you and I.
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Harvey Green: yeah.
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Harvey Green: I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but that's over.
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Andy Whiteside: Not gonna get that down.
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Andy Whiteside: i've got a been full of DVDs over here that we burned along the way i've got to somehow get that i'm waiting to buy a massive computer here at home, I can put them all on here and then upload them to the cloud and.
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Andy Whiteside: Hopefully, when i'm dead and gone so my look at least once after all that after.
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Harvey Green: I mean good luck.
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Jirah Cox: In my opinion of its home movies, I think that cloud is YouTube right and and if if they're not on that that probably will never get watched.
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Andy Whiteside: Facebook.
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Jirah Cox: hey here's my here's my s3 bucket of videos kids.
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Jirah Cox: here's the here's the here's the public, private access things.
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Andy Whiteside: I think we've got this one covered I think rv direct proposed to one that will leave for next week, I think it was flow related pretty exciting excellent.
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Yes.
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Andy Whiteside: Because we chose to go red hat.
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Andy Whiteside: Because I was almost employee number five or red hat kind of sort of I screwed that up big big mistake back in the day.
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Harvey Green: So you didn't learn how to choose the best team.
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Andy Whiteside: made tons of mistakes.
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Andy Whiteside: that's how you live, I guess, almost.
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Jirah Cox: Both of them.
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Jirah Cox: Yes, the end this is going to be over some cadence that i'm not privy to a series actually like getting red hat up and running on on getting open up open shift up and running on new tannic so we'll probably revisit this later on when part two of this blog series drops.
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Andy Whiteside: yeah love do it, maybe we can actually record a record a session we're actually walk into it, we didn't take extremely long.
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Andy Whiteside: we'll find out what.
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Jirah Cox: spoilers for yeah for part two.
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Andy Whiteside: Thanks for jumping on and doing this on a Monday afternoon and i'll get it up and posted and we'll move on to next week's topic.
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Jirah Cox: Then.
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we'll go thanks.