{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":19.475,"endTime":23.965,"body":"Welcome to season three of the Dirt on"},{"startTime":19.475,"endTime":23.965,"body":"Organic Farming, a podcast from OATS,"},{"startTime":23.985,"endTime":28.085,"body":"the Organic Agronomy Training Service."},{"startTime":23.985,"endTime":28.085,"body":"I'm your host, Nate Powell Palm."},{"startTime":29.095,"endTime":32.565,"body":"We've talked about experimentation,"},{"startTime":29.095,"endTime":32.565,"body":"and we've talked about taking risks,"},{"startTime":32.905,"endTime":35.604,"body":"and how to assess them."},{"startTime":32.905,"endTime":35.604,"body":"For our final episode,"},{"startTime":35.935,"endTime":36.685,"body":"we're going to talk about emotions,"},{"startTime":36.685,"endTime":40.245,"body":"because farming can be"},{"startTime":36.685,"endTime":40.245,"body":"an emotional business."},{"startTime":41.425,"endTime":45.525,"body":"As much as we may want to keep it"},{"startTime":41.425,"endTime":45.525,"body":"cerebral, whether we like it or not,"},{"startTime":45.526,"endTime":50.525,"body":"emotions tend to play a major role in how"},{"startTime":45.526,"endTime":50.525,"body":"we manage our agricultural operations."},{"startTime":51.385,"endTime":52.925,"body":"And I'm here to say,"},{"startTime":51.385,"endTime":52.925,"body":"that ain't a bad thing."},{"startTime":53.475,"endTime":55.565,"body":"Farmers feel passionately"},{"startTime":53.475,"endTime":55.565,"body":"about their work,"},{"startTime":55.615,"endTime":57.685,"body":"which is why many of us"},{"startTime":55.615,"endTime":57.685,"body":"do it in the first place."},{"startTime":58.425,"endTime":63.165,"body":"But letting emotions guide our decisions"},{"startTime":58.425,"endTime":63.165,"body":"too much could cloud our judgment and"},{"startTime":63.166,"endTime":65.444,"body":"produce outcomes that might"},{"startTime":63.166,"endTime":65.444,"body":"not serve us in the long run."},{"startTime":66.355,"endTime":70.645,"body":"Finding the balance between the"},{"startTime":66.355,"endTime":70.645,"body":"emotions and the data is key"},{"startTime":71.225,"endTime":73.365,"body":"and is how we're able to"},{"startTime":71.225,"endTime":73.365,"body":"learn from our mistakes."},{"startTime":73.366,"endTime":75.605,"body":"Instead of getting bogged down by them,"},{"startTime":75.955,"endTime":77.765,"body":"this balance was"},{"startTime":75.955,"endTime":77.765,"body":"something that our friend,"},{"startTime":78.105,"endTime":80.365,"body":"Wesley Reith had to discover for himself."},{"startTime":81.185,"endTime":84.245,"body":"So we're ending the season"},{"startTime":81.185,"endTime":84.245,"body":"with matters of the heart."},{"startTime":85.295,"endTime":88.525,"body":"We'll get started by learning a"},{"startTime":85.295,"endTime":88.525,"body":"bit about Wesley and his operation."},{"startTime":88.825,"endTime":92.325,"body":"My name is Wesley Reith. I'm a"},{"startTime":88.825,"endTime":92.325,"body":"farmer in Southwest Michigan."},{"startTime":92.865,"endTime":97.125,"body":"My grandpa farmed here, and we"},{"startTime":92.865,"endTime":97.125,"body":"grew up across the street from him."},{"startTime":98.745,"endTime":101.965,"body":"My memories growing up were of"},{"startTime":98.745,"endTime":101.965,"body":"helping my grandpa on the tractor,"},{"startTime":102.305,"endTime":104.205,"body":"and engaging in all those activities."},{"startTime":104.345,"endTime":107.325,"body":"The conventional wisdom at the time"},{"startTime":104.345,"endTime":107.325,"body":"was that there's no money in farming,"},{"startTime":107.425,"endTime":109.325,"body":"and if you can do something else, do that."},{"startTime":109.945,"endTime":113.605,"body":"So I think the advice was well"},{"startTime":109.945,"endTime":113.605,"body":"intentioned. I took it to heart,"},{"startTime":114.105,"endTime":117.485,"body":"and got a college degree, and"},{"startTime":114.105,"endTime":117.485,"body":"spent some time in Washington DC,"},{"startTime":117.715,"endTime":119.205,"body":"like the ag policy side."},{"startTime":119.865,"endTime":123.085,"body":"And also spent a couple years"},{"startTime":119.865,"endTime":123.085,"body":"as a high school teacher,"},{"startTime":123.545,"endTime":126.885,"body":"and eventually found my way back to"},{"startTime":123.545,"endTime":126.885,"body":"farming and was very grateful to do that."},{"startTime":127.465,"endTime":129.485,"body":"And for the last eight years or so,"},{"startTime":130.355,"endTime":135.044,"body":"I've been leading the operations"},{"startTime":130.355,"endTime":135.044,"body":"and the grain program at Granor Farm"},{"startTime":135.264,"endTime":136.645,"body":"in Three Oaks, Michigan."},{"startTime":137.425,"endTime":142.005,"body":"We grow primarily some row crops"},{"startTime":137.425,"endTime":142.005,"body":"and cereal grains. So we do corn,"},{"startTime":142.235,"endTime":147.005,"body":"soybean, wheat, rye, barley, and a few"},{"startTime":142.235,"endTime":147.005,"body":"other things on occasion, buckwheat,"},{"startTime":147.525,"endTime":147.945,"body":"et cetera."},{"startTime":147.945,"endTime":152.845,"body":"We are focused primarily"},{"startTime":147.945,"endTime":152.845,"body":"on the markets available to"},{"startTime":152.846,"endTime":156.805,"body":"us in Michigan. So that includes a"},{"startTime":152.846,"endTime":156.805,"body":"lot of the craft beverage market."},{"startTime":156.985,"endTime":160.044,"body":"So our distillers, maltsters, millers,"},{"startTime":160.335,"endTime":164.205,"body":"those are folks that we work with a"},{"startTime":160.335,"endTime":164.205,"body":"lot directly to showcase, you know,"},{"startTime":164.206,"endTime":165.165,"body":"the heirloom corns,"},{"startTime":165.185,"endTime":169.925,"body":"the varietals that we enjoy growing and"},{"startTime":165.185,"endTime":169.925,"body":"that work well in those applications."},{"startTime":170.544,"endTime":172.685,"body":"The distillers, maltsters, and millers."},{"startTime":174.275,"endTime":178.885,"body":"When have I ever said no to a nursery"},{"startTime":174.275,"endTime":178.885,"body":"rhyme about drinking? I tell ya,"},{"startTime":179.425,"endTime":181.885,"body":"as you can tell from the"},{"startTime":179.425,"endTime":181.885,"body":"variety of crops Wesley grows,"},{"startTime":182.445,"endTime":185.125,"body":"Granor Farms is a really"},{"startTime":182.445,"endTime":185.125,"body":"diversified, creative,"},{"startTime":185.305,"endTime":189.285,"body":"and sustainably minded operation that"},{"startTime":185.305,"endTime":189.285,"body":"works hard to meet the specific needs of"},{"startTime":189.286,"endTime":190.965,"body":"their land and their community."},{"startTime":191.445,"endTime":195.485,"body":"I like to say we're not very dogmatic"},{"startTime":191.445,"endTime":195.485,"body":"when it comes to the types of practices we"},{"startTime":195.486,"endTime":199.445,"body":"engage with on the farm. We"},{"startTime":195.486,"endTime":199.445,"body":"currently operate on about 500 acres,"},{"startTime":199.625,"endTime":202.285,"body":"and most of that is"},{"startTime":199.625,"endTime":202.285,"body":"certified organic production."},{"startTime":202.735,"endTime":207.445,"body":"We're very much focused on creating"},{"startTime":202.735,"endTime":207.445,"body":"a resilient and a sustainable"},{"startTime":207.446,"endTime":209.365,"body":"operation that allows us to keep farming."},{"startTime":209.825,"endTime":212.085,"body":"We are trying to employ"},{"startTime":209.825,"endTime":212.085,"body":"as much no-till as we can,"},{"startTime":212.086,"endTime":216.885,"body":"whether that's in a cereal rye field"},{"startTime":212.086,"endTime":216.885,"body":"that we crimp and plant soybeans into,"},{"startTime":217.585,"endTime":221.765,"body":"or it might mean using more tillage on a"},{"startTime":217.585,"endTime":221.765,"body":"corn field that we need to control some"},{"startTime":221.775,"endTime":224.165,"body":"weeds a little bit better,"},{"startTime":221.775,"endTime":224.165,"body":"and everything from that,"},{"startTime":224.225,"endTime":226.285,"body":"all the way to growing some non GMO crops,"},{"startTime":226.286,"endTime":229.765,"body":"or some other crops that maybe aren't"},{"startTime":226.286,"endTime":229.765,"body":"certified organic but fit one particular"},{"startTime":229.795,"endTime":234.365,"body":"farm better. So we're very focused"},{"startTime":229.795,"endTime":234.365,"body":"on soil health, ecological health,"},{"startTime":234.705,"endTime":237.885,"body":"and obviously the, you know,"},{"startTime":234.705,"endTime":237.885,"body":"the health of our employees too."},{"startTime":238.105,"endTime":242.405,"body":"And of course there's a lot of learning"},{"startTime":238.105,"endTime":242.405,"body":"that goes into that every single year,"},{"startTime":242.406,"endTime":246.565,"body":"and sometimes the tension"},{"startTime":242.406,"endTime":246.565,"body":"between agronomics and"},{"startTime":246.566,"endTime":250.005,"body":"the ends meet. But such is the,"},{"startTime":246.566,"endTime":250.005,"body":"the beauty of farming, and we're,"},{"startTime":250.025,"endTime":251.805,"body":"we feel really lucky"},{"startTime":250.025,"endTime":251.805,"body":"to be able to do that."},{"startTime":252.315,"endTime":253.765,"body":"Such is the beauty of farming."},{"startTime":254.555,"endTime":257.605,"body":"It's certainly no easy task to"},{"startTime":254.555,"endTime":257.605,"body":"balance all of these outcomes,"},{"startTime":257.865,"endTime":261.005,"body":"but we do our best. So let's"},{"startTime":257.865,"endTime":261.005,"body":"get into Wesley's story."},{"startTime":261.555,"endTime":263.964,"body":"It's about grain marketing"},{"startTime":261.555,"endTime":263.964,"body":"for organic products,"},{"startTime":264.455,"endTime":267.964,"body":"which is of course a little different"},{"startTime":264.455,"endTime":267.964,"body":"than grain marketing conventional grains,"},{"startTime":268.455,"endTime":273.125,"body":"since the price of conventional"},{"startTime":268.455,"endTime":273.125,"body":"grains is set, but for organics,"},{"startTime":273.154,"endTime":276.485,"body":"it's much more variable. And when you're"},{"startTime":273.154,"endTime":276.485,"body":"dealing with your hard earned grain,"},{"startTime":276.865,"endTime":280.805,"body":"and substantial amounts of money"},{"startTime":276.865,"endTime":280.805,"body":"in a small margin business,"},{"startTime":281.195,"endTime":282.365,"body":"that can be pretty difficult."},{"startTime":282.585,"endTime":287.445,"body":"So grain marketing is a kind of a tricky"},{"startTime":282.585,"endTime":287.445,"body":"thing. It's as close as a lot of folks,"},{"startTime":287.625,"endTime":290.365,"body":"at least the folks that I usually"},{"startTime":287.625,"endTime":290.365,"body":"interact with, get to gambling."},{"startTime":291.865,"endTime":294.565,"body":"And the hard part is you're"},{"startTime":291.865,"endTime":294.565,"body":"gambling with a lot of money,"},{"startTime":294.625,"endTime":297.085,"body":"and sometimes your livelihood."},{"startTime":294.625,"endTime":297.085,"body":"You put your blood, sweat,"},{"startTime":297.086,"endTime":301.605,"body":"and tears into creating this crop"},{"startTime":297.086,"endTime":301.605,"body":"that usually corn, soybeans, wheat,"},{"startTime":301.885,"endTime":303.845,"body":"whatever it happens to be,"},{"startTime":301.885,"endTime":303.845,"body":"and when you sell that,"},{"startTime":304.305,"endTime":308.645,"body":"you kind of get one shot to do it."},{"startTime":304.305,"endTime":308.645,"body":"And so I think just by exposure,"},{"startTime":309.165,"endTime":312.605,"body":"I adopted this mentality of this"},{"startTime":309.165,"endTime":312.605,"body":"is a really emotional decision."},{"startTime":312.995,"endTime":315.725,"body":"It's a significant impact on"},{"startTime":312.995,"endTime":315.725,"body":"our bottom line every year,"},{"startTime":316.325,"endTime":320.325,"body":"and kind of how we sell our"},{"startTime":316.325,"endTime":320.325,"body":"grain. And so here comes 2020,"},{"startTime":320.985,"endTime":324.285,"body":"and the beginning of the year"},{"startTime":320.985,"endTime":324.285,"body":"brought a lot of volatility, right?"},{"startTime":324.286,"endTime":327.365,"body":"We had lockdowns, we had"},{"startTime":324.286,"endTime":327.365,"body":"a lot of new vocabulary,"},{"startTime":327.415,"endTime":332.365,"body":"we were learning about essential"},{"startTime":327.415,"endTime":332.365,"body":"workers and what it means"},{"startTime":332.464,"endTime":335.645,"body":"to work from home or try to work"},{"startTime":332.464,"endTime":335.645,"body":"from home and also work at the farm,"},{"startTime":335.904,"endTime":340.125,"body":"and figuring out how to navigate this"},{"startTime":335.904,"endTime":340.125,"body":"kind of new world we were living in."},{"startTime":340.705,"endTime":345.485,"body":"And at the same time, we had some grain"},{"startTime":340.705,"endTime":345.485,"body":"in the bins, and I was hearing stories,"},{"startTime":345.625,"endTime":347.525,"body":"and some of this was making"},{"startTime":345.625,"endTime":347.525,"body":"the news at the time,"},{"startTime":347.525,"endTime":350.885,"body":"I remember specifically about"},{"startTime":347.525,"endTime":350.885,"body":"dairy farmers having to dump milk."},{"startTime":351.285,"endTime":355.645,"body":"This farm here in West Bend"},{"startTime":351.285,"endTime":355.645,"body":"has been forced to dump 25"},{"startTime":355.714,"endTime":356.845,"body":"each day as a part of coronavirus."},{"startTime":356.845,"endTime":358.404,"body":"Or, you know,"},{"startTime":358.405,"endTime":362.925,"body":"livestock producers having to call some"},{"startTime":358.405,"endTime":362.925,"body":"of their herd just because all these"},{"startTime":362.926,"endTime":364.285,"body":"markets were shutting down, right?"},{"startTime":364.286,"endTime":368.964,"body":"Farmers couldn't get their product to"},{"startTime":364.286,"endTime":368.964,"body":"the distributors. So, among myself,"},{"startTime":368.985,"endTime":371.045,"body":"and a lot of the folks I"},{"startTime":368.985,"endTime":371.045,"body":"was talking to at the time,"},{"startTime":371.046,"endTime":375.485,"body":"there was this degree of fear around"},{"startTime":371.046,"endTime":375.485,"body":"how are we going to sell our grain this"},{"startTime":375.486,"endTime":378.045,"body":"year, right? Things"},{"startTime":375.486,"endTime":378.045,"body":"really seem up in the air,"},{"startTime":378.185,"endTime":381.725,"body":"and we don't know if there's going to"},{"startTime":378.185,"endTime":381.725,"body":"be the market that we thought there was"},{"startTime":381.726,"endTime":385.445,"body":"going to be for our organic corn, or"},{"startTime":381.726,"endTime":385.445,"body":"organic soybeans, or whatever it was."},{"startTime":386.555,"endTime":390.695,"body":"And so I distinctly remember,"},{"startTime":386.555,"endTime":390.695,"body":"this was probably in mid 2020,"},{"startTime":390.714,"endTime":394.654,"body":"we sold some organic soybeans. We"},{"startTime":390.714,"endTime":394.654,"body":"actually needed to clean out a bin,"},{"startTime":394.955,"endTime":398.575,"body":"so we took a price and we thought,"},{"startTime":394.955,"endTime":398.575,"body":"well, you know, at least we sold them."},{"startTime":398.725,"endTime":399.975,"body":"This was an okay decision."},{"startTime":400.685,"endTime":402.654,"body":"This was completely new territory,"},{"startTime":403.075,"endTime":405.415,"body":"and Wesley could not have known"},{"startTime":403.075,"endTime":405.415,"body":"how things would play out,"},{"startTime":405.995,"endTime":408.535,"body":"but all the shortages actually"},{"startTime":405.995,"endTime":408.535,"body":"led to spikes in food prices."},{"startTime":409.035,"endTime":413.775,"body":"And I remember kind of watching the price"},{"startTime":409.035,"endTime":413.775,"body":"change over the next couple weeks and"},{"startTime":413.776,"endTime":414.815,"body":"which turned into months."},{"startTime":415.395,"endTime":420.214,"body":"And the price for these organic soybeans"},{"startTime":415.395,"endTime":420.214,"body":"just kept going up and up and up"},{"startTime":420.235,"endTime":425.175,"body":"and up, and to a point where"},{"startTime":420.235,"endTime":425.175,"body":"I was really kicking myself"},{"startTime":425.875,"endTime":430.455,"body":"for making this decision when I did."},{"startTime":425.875,"endTime":430.455,"body":"Because sooner than I thought, you know,"},{"startTime":430.456,"endTime":434.215,"body":"the price was now I think $10 a bushel"},{"startTime":430.456,"endTime":434.215,"body":"more than what I had sold mine for,"},{"startTime":434.395,"endTime":438.335,"body":"you know, approaching $30 a bushel,"},{"startTime":434.395,"endTime":438.335,"body":"which was a lot for organic soybeans,"},{"startTime":438.336,"endTime":440.815,"body":"or at least in, in my part of"},{"startTime":438.336,"endTime":440.815,"body":"the world, it seemed like a lot."},{"startTime":440.955,"endTime":444.935,"body":"And so that was a decision I really"},{"startTime":440.955,"endTime":444.935,"body":"beat myself up for, for a long time,"},{"startTime":444.936,"endTime":447.455,"body":"because I felt like I had"},{"startTime":444.936,"endTime":447.455,"body":"really missed an opportunity."},{"startTime":447.456,"endTime":450.415,"body":"And I was seeing this"},{"startTime":447.456,"endTime":450.415,"body":"difference between, you know,"},{"startTime":450.416,"endTime":455.055,"body":"what could we have done with this extra"},{"startTime":450.416,"endTime":455.055,"body":"many thousands of dollars at the time"},{"startTime":455.495,"endTime":457.175,"body":"in this one little decision that I made?"},{"startTime":461.895,"endTime":466.015,"body":"I think I speak for everyone when I say"},{"startTime":461.895,"endTime":466.015,"body":"it's not fun to reflect on a decision"},{"startTime":466.365,"endTime":470.015,"body":"once you have more information and"},{"startTime":466.365,"endTime":470.015,"body":"wish you would've chosen differently."},{"startTime":470.975,"endTime":473.455,"body":"For Wesley being so emotionally"},{"startTime":470.975,"endTime":473.455,"body":"attached to his work,"},{"startTime":473.595,"endTime":477.975,"body":"and knowing what they could have done"},{"startTime":473.595,"endTime":477.975,"body":"with that extra money made it all the more"},{"startTime":477.976,"endTime":478.809,"body":"disheartening."},{"startTime":479.075,"endTime":482.495,"body":"But he realized beating himself up"},{"startTime":479.075,"endTime":482.495,"body":"over it wasn't the best solution."},{"startTime":482.875,"endTime":485.295,"body":"So he started to take a"},{"startTime":482.875,"endTime":485.295,"body":"more constructive approach."},{"startTime":485.735,"endTime":490.735,"body":"I think my reflection on that situation"},{"startTime":485.735,"endTime":490.735,"body":"and this point at which I maybe missed"},{"startTime":491.735,"endTime":494.275,"body":"the movement of a market"},{"startTime":491.735,"endTime":494.275,"body":"in a positive direction,"},{"startTime":494.276,"endTime":496.155,"body":"and I was not able to"},{"startTime":494.276,"endTime":496.155,"body":"take advantage of that,"},{"startTime":496.215,"endTime":499.795,"body":"really kind of made me in retrospect,"},{"startTime":500.195,"endTime":503.355,"body":"and analyze this from a more objective"},{"startTime":500.195,"endTime":503.355,"body":"point of view and said, you know,"},{"startTime":503.356,"endTime":507.435,"body":"if we're dealing with spreads of"},{"startTime":503.356,"endTime":507.435,"body":"tens of thousands of dollars here,"},{"startTime":507.585,"endTime":510.275,"body":"this probably shouldn't be"},{"startTime":507.585,"endTime":510.275,"body":"a purely emotional decision."},{"startTime":510.835,"endTime":515.554,"body":"I think there's got to be a better way"},{"startTime":510.835,"endTime":515.554,"body":"to kind of fundamentally navigate how to"},{"startTime":515.555,"endTime":517.515,"body":"sell grain, when to sell grain,"},{"startTime":517.945,"endTime":521.955,"body":"even in an organic market where we've"},{"startTime":517.945,"endTime":521.955,"body":"got lots of outside factors playing into"},{"startTime":522.105,"endTime":523.795,"body":"what prices do or don't do."},{"startTime":524.785,"endTime":528.245,"body":"And so what we attempted"},{"startTime":524.785,"endTime":528.245,"body":"to do following that,"},{"startTime":528.246,"endTime":530.085,"body":"and what we're still"},{"startTime":528.246,"endTime":530.085,"body":"learning how to do today,"},{"startTime":530.086,"endTime":532.605,"body":"and trying to get better"},{"startTime":530.086,"endTime":532.605,"body":"and better at every year is,"},{"startTime":533.165,"endTime":537.365,"body":"I think two things primarily. The"},{"startTime":533.165,"endTime":537.365,"body":"first was, I understood pretty quickly,"},{"startTime":537.725,"endTime":539.925,"body":"I need to know rock solid,"},{"startTime":540.395,"endTime":543.165,"body":"what my cost of production"},{"startTime":540.395,"endTime":543.165,"body":"is for an organic crop."},{"startTime":543.304,"endTime":548.005,"body":"How much does it cost me to produce a"},{"startTime":543.304,"endTime":548.005,"body":"bushel of organic soybeans or a bushel of"},{"startTime":548.006,"endTime":550.684,"body":"organic corn? And once I know that number,"},{"startTime":551.565,"endTime":556.495,"body":"that is a very non-emotional way or"},{"startTime":551.565,"endTime":556.495,"body":"a very objective way into helping me"},{"startTime":556.815,"endTime":560.895,"body":"navigate when do I need to sell a crop?"},{"startTime":556.815,"endTime":560.895,"body":"Because then the attitude that we adopt,"},{"startTime":561.005,"endTime":565.335,"body":"once we know that what that number is,"},{"startTime":561.005,"endTime":565.335,"body":"I now know how much money I'm making,"},{"startTime":565.505,"endTime":567.535,"body":"right? It's not just a check"},{"startTime":565.505,"endTime":567.535,"body":"that I get in the mail,"},{"startTime":567.536,"endTime":568.735,"body":"and we hope it covers everything."},{"startTime":568.736,"endTime":571.775,"body":"If I'm selling my crop"},{"startTime":568.736,"endTime":571.775,"body":"above my cost of production,"},{"startTime":572.005,"endTime":576.054,"body":"then I can at least be sure that we"},{"startTime":572.005,"endTime":576.054,"body":"can live again to farm next year."},{"startTime":576.955,"endTime":580.975,"body":"So I think that was my biggest piece of"},{"startTime":576.955,"endTime":580.975,"body":"learning primarily that came from this"},{"startTime":581.035,"endTime":583.735,"body":"was, I need to know what"},{"startTime":581.035,"endTime":583.735,"body":"my cost of production is,"},{"startTime":584.075,"endTime":587.695,"body":"and I need to have a very good knowledge"},{"startTime":584.075,"endTime":587.695,"body":"of if the market is above that,"},{"startTime":587.804,"endTime":589.295,"body":"what is my risk tolerance?"},{"startTime":589.355,"endTime":592.695,"body":"And basically seeing if it's"},{"startTime":589.355,"endTime":592.695,"body":"going to go higher or lower."},{"startTime":592.875,"endTime":597.135,"body":"But really fundamentally knowing where"},{"startTime":592.875,"endTime":597.135,"body":"we're at from a budget perspective or a"},{"startTime":597.136,"endTime":598.095,"body":"cashflow perspective,"},{"startTime":598.635,"endTime":602.775,"body":"and understanding that I think took a"},{"startTime":598.635,"endTime":602.775,"body":"lot of the emotion out of it for me,"},{"startTime":602.875,"endTime":603.708,"body":"and that was really helpful."},{"startTime":604.315,"endTime":605.148,"body":"Luckily for Wesley,"},{"startTime":605.355,"endTime":610.135,"body":"he did not have to embark on this mission"},{"startTime":605.355,"endTime":610.135,"body":"to figure out his cost of on his own."},{"startTime":610.455,"endTime":612.575,"body":"I relied on a lot of"},{"startTime":610.455,"endTime":612.575,"body":"other farmers for that."},{"startTime":612.745,"endTime":615.175,"body":"We've relied on several different tools."},{"startTime":615.176,"endTime":619.815,"body":"There's a lot of great resources in"},{"startTime":615.176,"endTime":619.815,"body":"helping farmers kind of find your cost of"},{"startTime":620.216,"endTime":623.215,"body":"production. Which seems at the"},{"startTime":620.216,"endTime":623.215,"body":"outset like a very simple question,"},{"startTime":623.275,"endTime":627.054,"body":"but I think it's actually one of the"},{"startTime":623.275,"endTime":627.054,"body":"more complicated ones on the farm,"},{"startTime":627.055,"endTime":630.495,"body":"especially in organic farm, because"},{"startTime":627.055,"endTime":630.495,"body":"you're dealing with a lot of fixed costs,"},{"startTime":630.615,"endTime":634.015,"body":"a lot of variable costs, and these"},{"startTime":630.615,"endTime":634.015,"body":"costs change every single year."},{"startTime":634.395,"endTime":636.455,"body":"And for a lot of us that farm full-time,"},{"startTime":637.355,"endTime":639.415,"body":"it can be challenging too"},{"startTime":637.355,"endTime":639.415,"body":"to account for our labor."},{"startTime":639.515,"endTime":640.775,"body":"How much do we pay ourselves?"},{"startTime":641.115,"endTime":645.015,"body":"And luckily for you, Wesley is happy"},{"startTime":641.115,"endTime":645.015,"body":"to share the tools he now uses."},{"startTime":645.315,"endTime":648.575,"body":"The OGRAIN Network, the OGRAIN resource"},{"startTime":645.315,"endTime":648.575,"body":"from the University of Wisconsin,"},{"startTime":648.576,"endTime":653.375,"body":"they've got a couple great tools out"},{"startTime":648.576,"endTime":653.375,"body":"there on how to go about establishing a"},{"startTime":653.376,"endTime":655.934,"body":"cost of production. I think it's"},{"startTime":653.376,"endTime":655.934,"body":"called the OGRAIN Compass Tool."},{"startTime":656.655,"endTime":658.975,"body":"There's other spreadsheets out"},{"startTime":656.655,"endTime":658.975,"body":"there that farmers have built."},{"startTime":658.976,"endTime":663.615,"body":"There's even some platforms that you"},{"startTime":658.976,"endTime":663.615,"body":"can purchase as a subscription. We use,"},{"startTime":663.635,"endTime":667.655,"body":"we actually use one called Harvest Profit"},{"startTime":663.635,"endTime":667.655,"body":"that helps us track our numbers and,"},{"startTime":667.656,"endTime":672.415,"body":"and build a cost of production that we"},{"startTime":667.656,"endTime":672.415,"body":"can be confident in so we can take the"},{"startTime":672.416,"endTime":673.895,"body":"emotion out of making that decision."},{"startTime":674.705,"endTime":676.335,"body":"Today, Wesley's a farmer,"},{"startTime":676.705,"endTime":680.255,"body":"who's put a lot of thought into how he"},{"startTime":676.705,"endTime":680.255,"body":"strikes the balance between emotional"},{"startTime":680.256,"endTime":682.775,"body":"investment, and data-driven"},{"startTime":680.256,"endTime":682.775,"body":"decision making,"},{"startTime":683.434,"endTime":687.215,"body":"and he's trying to apply that framework"},{"startTime":683.434,"endTime":687.215,"body":"beyond determining cost of production to"},{"startTime":687.434,"endTime":688.855,"body":"all aspects of his operation."},{"startTime":689.075,"endTime":692.934,"body":"One of the things that I like to say is"},{"startTime":689.075,"endTime":692.934,"body":"there is no such thing as an agnostic"},{"startTime":692.935,"endTime":693.725,"body":"farmer,"},{"startTime":693.725,"endTime":697.815,"body":"meaning every farmer believes so deeply"},{"startTime":693.725,"endTime":697.815,"body":"in the work that they do every day,"},{"startTime":698.035,"endTime":700.535,"body":"and that gets down to like,"},{"startTime":700.645,"endTime":704.975,"body":"what colors the paint on the machinery"},{"startTime":700.645,"endTime":704.975,"body":"that I operate, right? And so,"},{"startTime":705.895,"endTime":709.775,"body":"even equipment purchasing decisions,"},{"startTime":705.895,"endTime":709.775,"body":"that becomes a very emotional decision."},{"startTime":710.095,"endTime":712.015,"body":"And I think we saw that"},{"startTime":710.095,"endTime":712.015,"body":"too as a result of covid,"},{"startTime":713.184,"endTime":716.605,"body":"and the economy that we"},{"startTime":713.184,"endTime":716.605,"body":"navigated in the years following."},{"startTime":716.775,"endTime":719.325,"body":"There were lots of supply shortages."},{"startTime":719.465,"endTime":721.645,"body":"We couldn't get equipment"},{"startTime":719.465,"endTime":721.645,"body":"maybe when we needed it."},{"startTime":721.985,"endTime":725.165,"body":"And so the prices became very"},{"startTime":721.985,"endTime":725.165,"body":"volatile, and very expensive,"},{"startTime":725.166,"endTime":729.365,"body":"very quickly in the equipment world."},{"startTime":725.166,"endTime":729.365,"body":"And so I think as an operator,"},{"startTime":729.505,"endTime":730.338,"body":"as a producer,"},{"startTime":730.934,"endTime":735.005,"body":"there were definitely some times where"},{"startTime":730.934,"endTime":735.005,"body":"we're looking at potentially upgrading a"},{"startTime":735.006,"endTime":738.445,"body":"piece of equipment or trading"},{"startTime":735.006,"endTime":738.445,"body":"something or selling something, and"},{"startTime":740.355,"endTime":744.315,"body":"a one quick look at the price tag compared"},{"startTime":740.355,"endTime":744.315,"body":"to what it was right before Covid,"},{"startTime":744.605,"endTime":746.995,"body":"makes the decision all of a"},{"startTime":744.605,"endTime":746.995,"body":"sudden seem not very attractive."},{"startTime":747.735,"endTime":750.275,"body":"And I think it goes back"},{"startTime":747.735,"endTime":750.275,"body":"to the same thing, right?"},{"startTime":750.735,"endTime":753.115,"body":"If I'm emotional about that decision,"},{"startTime":753.665,"endTime":758.595,"body":"there's not a whole lot of leeway for me"},{"startTime":753.665,"endTime":758.595,"body":"to kind of navigate it in an objective"},{"startTime":758.596,"endTime":761.955,"body":"way. And so we're actually"},{"startTime":758.596,"endTime":761.955,"body":"using a lot of these same tools."},{"startTime":762.184,"endTime":764.115,"body":"It's not necessarily a"},{"startTime":762.184,"endTime":764.115,"body":"cost of production tool,"},{"startTime":764.145,"endTime":767.475,"body":"it's a cost of machinery or"},{"startTime":764.145,"endTime":767.475,"body":"an operating cost, right?"},{"startTime":767.535,"endTime":771.315,"body":"How much does it cost me to run this"},{"startTime":767.535,"endTime":771.315,"body":"tractor over this many acres per year?"},{"startTime":772.095,"endTime":775.675,"body":"And that's the tool that I"},{"startTime":772.095,"endTime":775.675,"body":"can then use to justify, Hey,"},{"startTime":775.676,"endTime":776.955,"body":"is this a good purchase right now?"},{"startTime":779.295,"endTime":783.475,"body":"But Wesley understands from"},{"startTime":779.295,"endTime":783.475,"body":"personal experience that"},{"startTime":783.476,"endTime":784.675,"body":"thing for many farmers to do."},{"startTime":785.054,"endTime":788.995,"body":"The culture that I was brought up"},{"startTime":785.054,"endTime":788.995,"body":"in as a farmer is very emotional,"},{"startTime":789.405,"endTime":790.755,"body":"which is kind of in a way,"},{"startTime":790.756,"endTime":795.115,"body":"almost ironic and antithetical in a way"},{"startTime":790.756,"endTime":795.115,"body":"that a lot of farmers are very much like"},{"startTime":795.116,"endTime":797.635,"body":"individualists, pick yourselves"},{"startTime":795.116,"endTime":797.635,"body":"up by your bootstraps,"},{"startTime":797.636,"endTime":800.635,"body":"and get the work done type"},{"startTime":797.636,"endTime":800.635,"body":"of mentality. And again,"},{"startTime":800.715,"endTime":803.915,"body":"I don't think that's necessarily a bad"},{"startTime":800.715,"endTime":803.915,"body":"thing. I think that's the beautiful,"},{"startTime":803.934,"endTime":804.695,"body":"and frankly,"},{"startTime":804.695,"endTime":809.554,"body":"the very human part of us being"},{"startTime":804.695,"endTime":809.554,"body":"involved with growing crops to feed"},{"startTime":809.555,"endTime":813.755,"body":"people. So I don't want to"},{"startTime":809.555,"endTime":813.755,"body":"advocate for no emotion at all,"},{"startTime":813.756,"endTime":816.675,"body":"because I think that's missing"},{"startTime":813.756,"endTime":816.675,"body":"the point. At the same time,"},{"startTime":817.035,"endTime":820.075,"body":"I think that emotion can get us"},{"startTime":817.035,"endTime":820.075,"body":"into a tricky corner sometimes."},{"startTime":820.075,"endTime":824.275,"body":"If we're purely making a decision"},{"startTime":820.075,"endTime":824.275,"body":"that involves a lot of dollars and"},{"startTime":824.515,"endTime":828.195,"body":"cents without consulting,"},{"startTime":824.515,"endTime":828.195,"body":"what do our finances tell us?"},{"startTime":828.304,"endTime":832.835,"body":"What do our market conditions tell"},{"startTime":828.304,"endTime":832.835,"body":"us? What do our advisors tell us,"},{"startTime":832.836,"endTime":835.395,"body":"frankly about what is the right"},{"startTime":832.836,"endTime":835.395,"body":"decision to make right now?"},{"startTime":835.545,"endTime":838.554,"body":"What we've learned to try to"},{"startTime":835.545,"endTime":838.554,"body":"do, I think, in a perfect world,"},{"startTime":838.555,"endTime":841.915,"body":"is to leverage the things that"},{"startTime":838.555,"endTime":841.915,"body":"make us human, our problem solving,"},{"startTime":842.695,"endTime":845.315,"body":"our ability to analyze"},{"startTime":842.695,"endTime":845.315,"body":"a complex situation,"},{"startTime":845.316,"endTime":849.554,"body":"and come up honestly with a solution"},{"startTime":845.316,"endTime":849.554,"body":"that's probably not perfect in any way,"},{"startTime":849.555,"endTime":854.515,"body":"but is a kind of multifaceted"},{"startTime":849.555,"endTime":854.515,"body":"compromise. So I think for myself,"},{"startTime":855.415,"endTime":859.915,"body":"the learning to combine the"},{"startTime":855.415,"endTime":859.915,"body":"objective data alongside keeping"},{"startTime":860.665,"endTime":864.595,"body":"this deep seated emotion, and value,"},{"startTime":860.665,"endTime":864.595,"body":"and belief we place in our work,"},{"startTime":864.715,"endTime":867.355,"body":"I think putting those together,"},{"startTime":864.715,"endTime":867.355,"body":"especially as organic farmers,"},{"startTime":867.855,"endTime":869.315,"body":"we face enough headwinds already,"},{"startTime":869.475,"endTime":872.835,"body":"I think this is a quick way to give"},{"startTime":869.475,"endTime":872.835,"body":"ourselves every tool in the toolbox,"},{"startTime":872.855,"endTime":875.155,"body":"so to speak, to make"},{"startTime":872.855,"endTime":875.155,"body":"good financial decisions,"},{"startTime":875.395,"endTime":877.235,"body":"just by kind of taking some"},{"startTime":875.395,"endTime":877.235,"body":"of that emotion out of it."},{"startTime":885.815,"endTime":889.355,"body":"That's a wrap for season three of"},{"startTime":885.815,"endTime":889.355,"body":"The Dirt on Organic Agriculture,"},{"startTime":889.635,"endTime":891.845,"body":"a podcast from the Organic"},{"startTime":889.635,"endTime":891.845,"body":"Agronomy Training Service."},{"startTime":891.995,"endTime":895.765,"body":"Hopefully this season has provided some"},{"startTime":891.995,"endTime":895.765,"body":"tools and insights for thinking about"},{"startTime":895.766,"endTime":899.445,"body":"experimentation, and mistakes,"},{"startTime":895.766,"endTime":899.445,"body":"and how to make the most of them."},{"startTime":900.155,"endTime":902.925,"body":"Because we know all too"},{"startTime":900.155,"endTime":902.925,"body":"well that it happens."},{"startTime":904.105,"endTime":907.445,"body":"But the more we can figure out how"},{"startTime":904.105,"endTime":907.445,"body":"to capitalize on those mistakes,"},{"startTime":907.995,"endTime":910.765,"body":"seek out advice, and"},{"startTime":907.995,"endTime":910.765,"body":"incorporate learnings,"},{"startTime":911.185,"endTime":913.845,"body":"the more capable and resilient"},{"startTime":911.185,"endTime":913.845,"body":"we become as farmers."},{"startTime":923.665,"endTime":926.805,"body":"That's a wrap for season three of"},{"startTime":923.665,"endTime":926.805,"body":"The Dirt on Organic Agriculture,"},{"startTime":927.405,"endTime":929.805,"body":"a podcast from the Organic"},{"startTime":927.405,"endTime":929.805,"body":"Agronomy Training Service."},{"startTime":930.515,"endTime":933.965,"body":"OATS provides training to agronomists,"},{"startTime":930.515,"endTime":933.965,"body":"advisors, and crop consultants,"},{"startTime":934.225,"endTime":936.685,"body":"so that farmers will have"},{"startTime":934.225,"endTime":936.685,"body":"better access to reliable,"},{"startTime":936.995,"endTime":939.765,"body":"science-based advice for"},{"startTime":936.995,"endTime":939.765,"body":"their unique farm operation."},{"startTime":940.315,"endTime":943.885,"body":"Special thanks in this episode goes"},{"startTime":940.315,"endTime":943.885,"body":"to Wesley Reith of Granor Farm."},{"startTime":944.635,"endTime":948.485,"body":"This episode was produced by Blue"},{"startTime":944.635,"endTime":948.485,"body":"Canoe Studios. For more information,"},{"startTime":948.625,"endTime":950.845,"body":"go to www.organicagronomy.org."},{"startTime":952.915,"endTime":956.685,"body":"OATS is a programmatically independent"},{"startTime":952.915,"endTime":956.685,"body":"consortium that is fiscally sponsored by"},{"startTime":956.686,"endTime":958.005,"body":"the Organic Trade Association."},{"startTime":958.755,"endTime":961.925,"body":"OATS is supported in part with"},{"startTime":958.755,"endTime":961.925,"body":"funding from OTA membership companies."},{"startTime":962.545,"endTime":967.445,"body":"Season three of the Dirt"},{"startTime":962.545,"endTime":967.445,"body":"on Organic Farming is made"},{"startTime":967.446,"endTime":972.005,"body":"Organic Center and FFAR the Foundation"},{"startTime":967.446,"endTime":972.005,"body":"for Food and Agriculture Research under"},{"startTime":972.405,"endTime":976.725,"body":"award number TOCFFAR-EXT-002."},{"startTime":978.985,"endTime":982.765,"body":"The content of this publication is"},{"startTime":978.985,"endTime":982.765,"body":"solely the responsibility of the authors."},{"startTime":983.285,"endTime":987.245,"body":"It does not necessarily"},{"startTime":983.285,"endTime":987.245,"body":"reflect the official views"},{"startTime":987.246,"endTime":990.965,"body":"Foundation for Food and Agriculture"},{"startTime":987.246,"endTime":990.965,"body":"Research. I'm Nate Powell Palm."},{"startTime":992.005,"endTime":993.405,"body":"Till next time, thanks for listening."}]}