Biting into Healthcare with Dr Miguel Stanley
Biting into Healthcare with Dr Miguel Stanley
Electric Bodies: How Mixed Metals Create Silent Health Crises
Could your unexplained chronic health issues be caused by the metal implants in your body? This eye-opening conversation with orthopedic surgeon Dr. Scott Schroeder challenges everything we thought we knew about "biocompatible" metal implants.
When different metals are present in your body—perhaps titanium in your jaw and stainless steel in your foot—they can create electrical currents flowing through your tissues. These electrical potentials, measuring up to 340 millivolts, may be powerful enough to disrupt cellular function and trigger widespread inflammation throughout your body.
Dr. Schroeder shares shocking case studies of patients diagnosed with fibromyalgia, depression, chronic fatigue, and even paralysis who experienced dramatic recovery after metal implant removal. Using specialized equipment, he demonstrates the measurable voltage between implants in different parts of the body, providing compelling evidence that these "body batteries" may be behind thousands of misunderstood health conditions.
Most concerning is the discovery that supposedly "inert" titanium actually corrodes inside the body, releasing particles including aluminum and vanadium that circulate throughout your tissues. Electron microscopy images reveal significant degradation of implants removed from patients, confirming that what we've been putting in bodies isn't as stable as we thought.
This conversation isn't just academic—it offers hope to countless patients suffering from unexplained symptoms. If you have metal implants and chronic health issues, or know someone who does, this episode might connect dots that medical specialists have missed. Listen now to understand the hidden dangers of mixed metals and learn about emerging alternatives that could offer safer solutions.
The challenge here is that the problem doesn't affect everyone, and there are millions of people around the world that have metal implants in their mouths and bodies without any evident symptoms. However, many of the symptoms are subclinical and don't really manifest obviously.
The call action here is, that we need better ways to diagnose and to understand the problem. One thing is for sure, if you have unexplainable health issues and are taking multiple medications and seeing multiple doctors for conditions that seem to be uncurable, the solution might be hidden in the metals in your body.
To see the video with the slides of Dr. Schroeder hop over to my YouTube channel : https://youtu.be/Npwl0VT9Xls?si=C9OyCp8sgPPJmNXn
We are going to stop.
Speaker 2:Yep, yep. So let's go ahead and yeah, so things that. Just so you know what I found out yesterday up at the corrosion engineers up in Canada. It was, you know, five and a half hours up there, five and a half hours back Five and a half hours. Got back at 11 o'clock last night, but we were looking at, you know, sammy Nimbisi.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we were looking at you know, sammy Nimbisi, yeah, yeah, so Sammy had sent some implants, titanium implants because we're having these problems, like I presented in Istanbul, with titanium implants right, or at least we're seeing with the FDA and complaints, so brought some up and we were looking at that and I have some of those to show you here. But the abutment seemed to be where the problem was with the titanium and that's where we're seeing the corrosion and so we can discuss that.
Speaker 1:Man, we're already on, so let's go. I like that. We're going to talk about everything. So, scott, it's been a while since I've done one of these podcasts.
Speaker 1:Sometimes I always feel that there's just too much information out there. So, biting into healthcare. I started about three, four years ago during the pandemic, had nothing else to do and the idea was just to get ideas out there with a timestamp on them that needed to get out there the sooner the better, for you know people to be aware of certain ideas and concepts, and after I saw your lecture in Istanbul, you know I of course I'd known around metal hypersensitivities, I know the work of Linda Nelson, and but to see the way that you explain this, being an orthopedic surgeon, and the emails that you sent to me, I just want more people to know about this. So just a little bit about you, if you want to just explain people who you are. So of course you know you went to Washington State University. You're an orthopedic surgeon, but explain a little bit in detail. You know how you started your career, what you learned, what you did and where you are today, just so people know who you are.
Speaker 2:So yeah, my I mean briefly my dad was an anesthesiologist. He was chairman of the board of the hospital here looking at medicine. Really, after I looked at foot and ankle side of things and really got excited about that and so went into that ankle side of things and really got excited about that and so went into that and so that's what I do and put a lot of implants in patients over the years metal, metallic implants, because that's what we had.
Speaker 1:But you're talking foot and ankle right. You're a foot and ankle specialist, correct?
Speaker 2:correct Foot and ankle specialist, yep, and right now I'm working with a lot of people that work, you know, you know, basically, patients and the Doc's, you know spine surgeons, head and neck surgeons and others, because they don't understand a whole lot of the metal hypersensitivity or metal reaction thing either. We were never trained, you know, about that in our, in our training, unfortunately, and I think that needs to change.
Speaker 1:that's one of the probably the biggest things that needs to change is that so and in your, in your, what your career was 30 year career right, doing, uh, foot and ankle surgery. So let's just say I'm an implant dentist, so my implants go in the jaw. I've been doing that for about 25 years. We did the industry's been doing it for about 50-60 years, since Brunnermark invented the titanium implant, and there's hundreds of millions of people around the world with titanium implants in their mouths and, I could only presume, even more with pins in their ankles and feet, because it's a very common fracture, right?
Speaker 2:Very well or surgery that we do to reconstruct the foot. You know, like some of my, a lot of my surgeries weren't just fractures, they were reconstruction, where and I'll show you some of those slides, but where it's, you know, seven, eight-hour long surgery to straighten the feet out, to allow people to walk again, without, you know, pain, the goal.
Speaker 1:So, just to set the stage before you start showing these slides and of course I'll be putting this out on youtube as well, on my youtube channel, um um, I've always paid attention to the science and the evidence and you know things that I learned in my training in 1998, when I learned how to do implants. We were always focused on the osteointegration of these fixtures. So do they integrate? Does the bone? And I remember discussions 30 years ago, you know, is it fibrointegration, is it osteointegration? And then the different coating of these implants to improve the biology and the, you know, the osteoinduction or conduction of bone formation against the surface, because we wanted these things to stay and, you know, to last. Was that the same with you? Was that the major concern?
Speaker 2:Well, when you're dealing for me? No, not as much. We wanted the bone to be able to get compression with the screws to hold the bone pieces together, so they can heal and once those bones heal, we're done.
Speaker 1:Let's say just retention plates, so like, basically, to join a fracture. Let's put it that way. So the only thing going in the bone marrow per se would be the fixation screw, correct, correct, okay, nonetheless. Oh, yes, only thing going in the bone marrow per se would be the, the, the fixation screw, correct, correct, nonetheless. Yes, this would, this would be put inside the body anyway, right sitting on the below the periosteum, above the bone, correct uh, correct.
Speaker 2:Well, well, above the peri, the plate is, above the periosteum, the screws go throughiosteum the screws go through, all right so still, there's a lot of irrigation, innervation, all of that.
Speaker 1:And then I remember about 15 years ago we became a bit more concerned about how we could make the soft tissue integration and all of that. No one was ever thinking about anything remotely near metal hypersensitivity. And the first time I started actually thinking about hang on the quality of the product was in another podcast I did a year ago with Dirk Dudek from the Clean Implant Foundation and he asked me to be an ambassador for this organization about seven years ago and the first time he even mentioned the concept. It's like what the hell are you talking about? So you know, because everybody knows these implants are sterilized with gamma radiation but they're not always clean.
Speaker 1:So during the packaging process, surface contaminants, plastic, organic, inorganic leftover metal from the you know detergents, all this stuff from the manufacturing process and the doctor or surgeon is they don't know about this. You know we have to trust the industry that this is is good, right, and here we are putting this with the best of intentions in our patients. So I I got really upset the first time I started understanding this. How did you feel when you started understanding this stuff as well?
Speaker 2:oh, I, I was the same way, I think you know, in the mouth and the dental world I think you have to even have higher standards because it's already we already have bacteria and all this there, and you know we're in a quote sterile environment in the foot and ankle and other parts of the body, but you still have to have a clean device. Excuse me to get going with otherwise potential problems and so this metal hypersensitivity thing.
Speaker 1:Honestly, I got this email from you about a year ago and I read the email very polite email, very long email, very well-structured email from you, from our mutual friend, jack Cole I think you know the chairman of the io amt and and I read this email and I just went, oh my god. And so I really want you to start sharing, you know, your slides and your deck with uh, with the people that are going to watch and listen to this. Uh, and just a word of caution to all surgeons using metal and titanium. This doesn't affect everybody. All right, it's not an everybody problem, but if you know so, there's no fear mongering going on here. But for those patients that do have a lot of health issues that no one's figuring out, this could be that hidden or missing link that no one's really connected. Would you agree with that statement?
Speaker 2:I would totally agree with that, and I think we have to be metal aware, we have to understand the potential issues with metal and no, it's not everybody by any means, but there are certain individuals that are definitely affected quite severely in some cases.
Speaker 1:That's what I want, I mean, look, I've always had, you know, friends that can't handle, let's say, any type of metal earring. They can only have specific gold earrings, otherwise their ear flares up. Or those girls that want to have the piercing in their belly and they get these masks. Some do, some don't. You know, the large majority don't, but some really do, because there's no test for this. Obviously we don't test our patients for metal hypersensitivities. Luckily, at the white clinic we have been for almost a decade now. But listen, um, let's get into it. Um, okay, just I. I would liken it also to this you know, I'm 52.
Speaker 2:Uh, you're probably the same age as me, I'm 62, but uh, but got a few years when I was a kid man, no one ever heard about gluten intolerance, right?
Speaker 1:No one was ever gluten, I mean, it wasn't a word. I think the first time I heard the word gluten I must have been in my 30s. To say what. There's a whole food industry around now the gluten intolerant and the non gluten and dairy free and all of that because people have become aware that certain foods are bad for them and I would liken metal hypersensitivity to that discussion. But at point of care, no surgeon is asking the body if it's hypersensitive or not. Would you agree to that?
Speaker 2:I would agree with that. A quick note on the gluten and everything too with some of the breads and other things is that a bunch of these breads have soy in them and soy is high in nickel. So you have to look. It may not just be gluten, it can be a nickel allergy that, like I have. I have this and I. There's only a certain few breads that I will want to eat, because I will have issues and I was kind of sinus issues. That is unbelievable.
Speaker 1:You know that I will want to eat because I will have issues and I'm kind of sinus issues draining. That is unbelievable. You know I stopped using deodorant with aluminum. The Americans say it already 25 years ago. I was aware of that problem. But yeah, metal in food I hadn't thought about that one, so listen.
Speaker 2:Scott, oh, it's very, very big. I mean that's a whole nother discussion.
Speaker 1:That's honestly, it's very, very big. I mean, that's a whole nother discussion. That's scary. It is scary. So let's, let's get started.
Speaker 2:I think it's you know, I'll jump in every now and again, but please do share your deck with us, because I was blown away by your lecture in Istanbul, and I think more people and, like I said, I just had a meeting with our corrosion engineer professor we're working with up in Canada and just some new data just came out yesterday with some of these electron microscope pictures that we have and this type of thing, and so it's very exciting finding these things out and also related to mercury and amalgam and that type of thing too. So let me share my deck and then we will get going, and so I'll kind of go through this briefly here, and this is just me and the presentation that I presented down in Istanbul and this is some of the hardware I'm talking about. You know, these can be very intricate cases. A lot of metal I put on my patients over the years. These can be very intricate cases.
Speaker 2:A lot of metal I put on my patients over the years and surgeries are very long 30 plus years. We talked about thousands of metallic implants. And then a couple of decades ago I started having an awareness, like you were talking about, as far as some of these things, and I was having patients come back 15, 20 years later to have metal removed with significant changes after I removed the metal. So I gave that more of an option to my patients about 10 years ago, say, hey, you know, we put this metal in, it's there for temporary. In Europe they use it for temporary fracture fixation. In the US we just kind of put it in and you know it stays in because it takes time to get it out and patients, you know, are busy with life. And so I said you know my recommendation, you know you don't have to. You can do what you want, but my recommendation get it out after the bone's healed. We don't need it anymore. It's just sitting there. Potentially you can develop a reaction as time goes on, as years go on. So I removed over a thousand metallic implants and over 400 patients in the last 10 years of my career, multiple presentations and then, excuse me, istanbul this year.
Speaker 2:But what I'm presenting is cause and effect and essentially where I place the metal implants and these were almost all placed by me and then these certain symptoms develop. The question is you have to know the right questions to ask, and that's what I didn't know and that's what I've been learning over the years and that's what I think a lot of physicians and dentists and all this don't know. What questions do you ask? It's not just local, it's systemic and is, I think, a much higher likelihood of having systemic issues than local issues, potentially, you know, depending on the implants involved. So then I removed the implants and symptoms then improved or resolved and the last vast majority of time these symptoms have resolved. So, and you know, local swelling rashes, electrical sensations in the areas, that type of thing, erosion of bone around implants, which can be, you know, we're worried about, especially in the titanium realm, there in the dental implants, and this was just from two stainless steel screws in the foot and she was allergic to nickel. And this rash resolved after removal of those.
Speaker 1:So again, systemic these kind of patients have. Sorry, do these kind of patients also have stuff in their mouths, metal in their mouths, and do you?
Speaker 2:Actually the majority of them did. You know, when I started asking the questions and me, being a foot and ankle surgeon, starting to ask patients about, you know, dental metals and that type of thing, you know, some of the docs thought I was kind of crazy. But guess what? You know? My recommendation is that's what we need to do because, as you'll see in this presentation, we can get potential interactions or potentials. There's potential differences between these metals in the foot and the mouth that I'll show and I don't think we figured everything out. You know what it does at this point, but it's there and with dramatic improvement after these metals are removed. So it's definitely something we need to look further at here. They're at here.
Speaker 2:So some of the things that I've had, you know muscle spasms throughout the body, fibromyalgia type symptoms, severe fatigue, joint pains throughout the body, headaches, migraines, emotional health, suicidal type ideations with a number of these patients that don't feel they're listened to by their doctors, and then they're having problems. And it all started after this metal is placed in, whether it's in the mouth or in the rest of the body, gi issues, IBS, diarrhea, other types of things, and this can exacerbate any type of rheumatological condition. I've seen it exacerbate where I've then removed the metal and the swelling and the pain in the hands went away. You know, within a week after me removing the metal down in the foot or ankle, paralysis issues we'll talk about full body paralysis and then nerve symptoms radiate, radiating throughout the body and then reactions of pain of in our reaction between metals, like I put in the foot and the ankle, and then let's say, a back.
Speaker 2:One patient had titanium back hardware from a fusion and you know chronic pain since that surgery. Then it was actually exacerbated after she had a total knee with titanium in it and then I removed the stainless steel, which is a dissimilar metal, from the foot and her back pain completely resolved and she had it for a number of years since that surgery. And so that's what we have to really look at. And actually it was uh, uh, vera Stetskal over, uh, you know the immunotoxicologist who actually invented the Melisa test. She's from Sweden, but she was the first one to tell me about that, you know, 10, 15 years ago. And then I started looking and, sure enough, cause, they'd removed dental metals and pain associated with a total hip or knee resolved. And uh, so that was quite impressive. Quite impressive to me and because the orthopedic surgeon said hey, everything's fine with the knee and hip, there's no problems here that we can see on x-ray. And then they removed the dental metals and that pain went away.
Speaker 1:So I think that needs to be that's oral galvanism, right.
Speaker 2:Well, potentially, that's. My feeling is, yes, that we are having some type of electrical potential or electrical current, potentially, and that's what we're trying to prove with the engineers here that go through the body, but something's obviously happening.
Speaker 1:And I don't think we are made of energy, right? The difference between an alive and an unalive human is electricity. It's energy, right, the difference between an alive and an unalive human is electricity. It's energy, right. It's literally electric current. So we know that water is highly conducive to electrical currents, right? That's why if there's an electrical wire going in a puddle and you step in that puddle, you can get electrocuted because it can transmit the voltage.
Speaker 1:So if we are 90% or 80-something percent water, it's a no-brainer to know that if we have an electric current going through in some people that might be exacerbated if we've got these metal rods in our body. I mean again, we need to figure out how metal rods in our body I mean again it's we need to figure out how, because you know this, I think, more than anything before you continue, here is yeah, what breaks my heart here, scott, is the amount of people that their doctors are like. You know, they go all these symptoms and they're like, oh, but my work is fine. I know, because I've done it, you've done it. You know it's like. You know your problem is a rash in the skin.
Speaker 1:Go see a dermatologist, because it's nowhere near the root cause of the problem? Right, because the body how? We forgot to see the body in its entirety. You know that integrative concept of looking at this and these people are desperate, and I've seen results like this myself. I really have, and that's why I know how important this is. So please keep on going, my friend.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes. Well, on that point, I had a rheumatologist that I'd already been working with and I didn't even know. This patient of mine that I did surgery on had a rash on her abdomen similar to what this other patient I just showed you. She had a rash there, and so she said she was talking to me, well, when did this come up? And he had, you know, he had the foresight to ask about the surgery and oh, oh, and you're having that metal removed. Okay, let's just wait till after you have Dr Schroeder remove that metal. That rash was gone in a week. By the time I saw her back five days for her first post-op, the rash was gone.
Speaker 2:I've had one and she didn't tell me about it until the recovery room. She goes oh yeah, I had this rash, you know, and it was gone. So, yes, exactly that. And we see this all the time with patients, with doctors, just kind of say my work is fine, that's why I brought that up, and it is, the work is fine, the doctor did not do anything wrong it creates, that's, it Didn't do anything wrong, because what it does is it creates an existential threat to this entire community.
Speaker 1:I mean, I placed thousands, if not tens of thousands, of titanium implants and I'm very proud of that work. And 99 of those patients of what I wouldn't say 99, but let's say the great majority of the patients still have those, those structures in their mouth and they're fine and they're healthy and they're good. You know and it's, but the problem is it's. We need, you know, medicines and constant evolution. We need to be curious, we need to ask questions. There's more people sick than ever before. We see this, chronic illnesses on the rise. I mean I think you saw in my, my lecture, I'm asking people to stand up that have autoimmune disease, cancer or unexplained symptoms. I mean, almost everybody's got something going on. I'm not saying this is everything, but it's definitely one of the things that I think is missing.
Speaker 2:Well, exactly, and that's what we're just getting into now. Here was a paper put out by the FDA September 2019, discussing all the different issues that can be associated with metals. And you look on the side and there's cardiomyopathy and headaches, psychiatric symptoms, GI symptoms Parkinson's parkinson's.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh yeah, exactly all all of this. And what actually is a better paper that this in, and this is 149 page paper, but the best thing is just to read these tables, you know, but even even, I think, even more concise than this, and this, you know, goes into a lot of different stuff but this particular paper, the road back one.
Speaker 1:just go back one side. Look at at that Uh-huh.
Speaker 2:Titanium, aluminum, hepatic yeah hepatic dysfunction, anemia, encephalitis, association with Alzheimer's.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly Right. Can I just ask you one quick question, moving forward, your titanium, the titanium plates that orthopedic surgeons use, is it grade four or grade five titanium? Do you know? Is there a difference?
Speaker 2:Well, it's an alloy, so it's titanium 6AL4V, so it's 6% aluminum, 4% vanadium, vanadium.
Speaker 1:So that's what's happening in there. So in dental implants you've got pure titanium, which is grade four, with no alloys. It's a bit softer, uh, which is the gold standard, let's say. And then, uh, about 15 years ago they started doing exactly the same thing to make them stronger by adding aluminum and vanadium this. So we've now technically got three different types of metal in one implant, plus the surface prep, plus a huge amount of them aren't clean, according to the Clean Implant Foundation. And then you've got replica screws.
Speaker 1:Most clinics they try and avoid the hefty costs of the abutments, so they buy replica abutments and replica screws. I mean, the industry hates this, nobody likes to admit it. But instead of having, let's say, the real branded, they buy a cheaper material for the lab components to save money. It's a big part of the industry. Some are good but some are less good. There's very little oversight into that. So you'll have multiple metals in a big reconstructive case. And you were saying earlier, that study we're doing with the engineers, that the problem was with the interface of the abutment and the implant, and that could be because the quality of the abutment isn't the same as the quality of the titanium. But yep, people think they have titanium, but they also have aluminum and vanadium.
Speaker 2:That was the punch line oh well, and and not only that, as you'll see, um, you know, because when we start breaking these things down engineering wise, with the icpms, which is indexically coupled plasma mass spectrometry, you can break the metals down. And that's what we're doing with five samples we just had yesterday. We'll cut off a piece, dissolve that and then this particular machine can break it down into a thousandth percent weight. So in one of these cases coming up, you know, the nickel was 0.013 percent nickel, but that's what he was allergic to and and he had dramatic improvement after his back hardware was removed and he had titanium implants. So but he, he had like 14 to 17 different metals associated with that titanium alloy. So uh, yeah, it's, yeah, I would not say that.
Speaker 2:Uh, you know, and these studies have proven out already, that there's multiple impurities and I spoke to the engineer yesterday about it. He goes well, it's just the mining process. When you mine you don't just get a vein of pure titanium, it's all kinds of things, and so you go then try to purify that as best you can, but it's very, very, very expensive to purify it totally, so they don't do that. So this titanium or aluminum or vanadium have other impurities already in it, just from the mining process. So that's what he explained to me yesterday.
Speaker 1:That is interesting so it's not by design, it's just by default.
Speaker 2:Yeah, default, it's too expensive. He had a zinc rod and it was a few centimeters long and it was 99.9999% pure, but it was $400 to get that for one of the studies he was doing, that for one of the studies he was doing. So, yes, so that it's, and then also just the process of making things you're going to have. You know impurities associated with that, but I think it sounds like the majority of them can come just from the mining whole mining process.
Speaker 1:All right, man, let's keep on going.
Speaker 2:Yeah, ok, so this paper, yeah, so what's good about this paper? You know people can look it up here, but this is out of the National Institute of Occupational Safety and Health here in the United States and it's the Allergy and Clinical Immunology Branch. And but this, if any doc, any doctors that have, you know, surgeons, dentists that they should, anybody puts metal in patients, they should have these tables and just read the tables. This is another long, close to 100, you know page article. Most of it a lot of it references. But just have these tables and just read the table. This is another long, close to 100 page article. Most of it a lot of it references. But just have these tables. And this goes through all kinds of these issues that can happen. Here's the geographic tongue burning mouth syndrome, all of which I've seen, you know, oral lichen planus.
Speaker 1:I mean all this stuff anise, I mean all this stuff. You know, as a dentist, we and I still think today I mean the burning mouth syndrome, the amount of people that suffer from this that go to their dentist and their dentist with the best of their knowledge, up-to-date knowledge, will say it's an idiopathic syndrome that is multifactorial and there's no known cause and no known treatment outside of steroids and this or that. You know it's today, but I would argue that it's, you know, no one at school at least. I might be wrong here, I don't, you know, I haven't gone into the recent education, but I doubt they're adding metal hypersensitivities to one of the causes of burning mouth syndrome. I don't think that that's not the first step in the diagnostic.
Speaker 2:Well, in my gut feeling and in my world, that's one of the first things that needs to be looked at, as well as the electrical side of things, you know I would be excited.
Speaker 2:I would because I've had it multiple times in the foot. I have metal in there titanium specifically, uh, or stainless steel and it's, you know, burning in the region. They're shooting pains from there, shooting pains all the way up to the buttocks, and I remove the metal, boom gone. So, yeah, it's. I mean there could be nerve issues, you know, but most time it's just related to the metal that I had in them. Yeah so, and then we? I mean this it goes on allergic asthma. I've seen patients with asthma and then I remove the metal and then the symptoms, you know, go and here's all the same type of thing. We get into all these different things and you can see over on the right rosacea, psoriasis, ulcerative colitis, irritable bowel syndrome, lupus, rheumatoid arthritis.
Speaker 1:Rheumatoid arthritis. Yeah, celiac disease, that's the gut, it's the skin. Sjogren, which is, is very, very uh. You know, students spend dental. Students spend a lot of time studying fibromyalgia. I am seeing all of this ibs, irritable bowel syndrome. Now this paper is published peer-reviewed, where uh, let's go back to that.
Speaker 2:And uh, here is the uh here Toxicology and Environmental.
Speaker 1:Health 2022. From the US Kyle Roach and JR Roberts. So the cat's out of the bag.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this article, and I actually contacted Roach and told her I was just so excited about this article because this has been a long time coming, and she was very gracious and all this and she spent a lot of time on this, as you can tell.
Speaker 1:What's her background?
Speaker 2:It's just incredible. She's actually an immunology, you know. So she's not a. She's not an MD. Yeah, I may be misspeaking, but I thought she was, you know, into research and all this kind of stuff. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So that's even so. From an immunological perspective, that's okay. I'm very pleased to see this article. I didn't know it was out there. Amazing.
Speaker 2:All right, this needs to be in every doctor's office. I agree, 100%, I agree 100%.
Speaker 1:I agree 100%. And look just for dental implant specialists out there. For the last 30 years 20 years, let's say the average failure rate for dental implants globally almost inexplicably, has been between 5% to 7%. All right, like you do the right thing and that implant fails, okay, what if this is behind it, that those you know let's say so. If it's, let's say if it's 5%, that means that 95 can tolerate it. They develop other symptoms, but 5% vehemently reject it. But we're trained to think that there's no way you can't reject titanium because it's a biocompatible material, et cetera, et cetera. But what if this is? But that's what we're trained to.
Speaker 2:I mean, we only know what we know it is more biocompatible than other materials, that's a better way to state that I spoke yeah, because that's what I've been hearing for years oh, titanium's inert, titanium's inert.
Speaker 2:Well, I spoke to the engineers that work with titanium all the time and I told them that I go, the doctors have been told that titanium is inert. And they go, what Titanium is not inert, especially when it's placed in the body and electrolytic solution, you know and you were talking about water earlier well, just add salt and everything else to it. You know, chloride is very corrosive. And so he could not believe. They were told that titanium was inert and, okay, more biocompatible, not biocompatible.
Speaker 1:I would argue, then, that from because I'm always trying to find appeasement on both sides of the fence. You see, I'm a dental surgeon. I love my brothers and sisters out there that have. You know, everyone comes to the table trying to help their patients get their smile back, their health, their function. You know, some do a better job, some don't, some are, you know, but at the end of the day, the industry is really just trying to help people and we depend on the manufacturers and the universities to teach us to.
Speaker 1:You know, there has to be a measure of trust in the game, right, and you know there's a lot of people that don't have an interest in this information coming out. Right, but let's just say, for example, that if the 5% failure rate of implants is associated to this I don't know, we'd have to prove that, obviously, but it could be then there should be an interest in at least testing prior to placement, because when implants fail, it's very costly to the clinician, it's very costly to the clinic. Even that 5%, it's not negligible. So like, for example, the ITI, which is a very big study group, they said that in Germany in 2022, 1.2 million implants were placed in Germany alone with a 5% failure rate, that's roughly 75,000 to 80,000 implants that failed. That's a big number for the dental economy it's not negligible and somebody had to foot the bill right the patient.
Speaker 1:It's horrible. You have to go through the whole process again. A large amount of those had to have bone grafts to get it done. They had temporary teeth. You can't chew aesthetical issues, emotional issues. Some people got sued, whatever. It's a huge amount of stress. What if they read this paper, understood that maybe they should test their patients prior to engaging and be a little bit more successful? I mean, I'm just saying that could be the beginning of a good argument to go where it hurts, which is that failure rate which some people just can't seem to explain.
Speaker 2:Right, right, well, I agree, I think that is one thing you know. As far as that goes and actually this leads right into this, you know five ways metals can react negatively in the body. I changed that really to six now. But physical or just improper placement, impingement, what have you? Infection? We always got to rule that out. But then toxicity from excessive metal, ion release from wear and tear and or corrosion, okay, but then, yes, we're dealing potentially with allergy or hypersensitivity. So that's another thing in that, that is one thing that can be tested for and ahead of time, and I I we definitely need, in my opinion. If I have a my spouse or child or parent is going to have a total knee or hip that's supposed to be in the rest of their life, do I have a my spouse or child or parent is going to have a total knee or hip that's supposed to be in the rest of their life, do I want them tested prior to that and for metal hypersensitivity, so we know what they're allergic to prior to this big procedure. And I think it goes hand in hand, probably, with what you're talking about too. If this dental implant is supposed to be placed the rest of their life, should they be tested prior to make sure they're not allergic to one of the metals associated with that. And then we're looking at the galvanic electrical type reactions that we'll be talking about here in a second. And then the other one is EMF and you know I've just been seeing too many cases lately coming out with reversal of things, like one of the professors that I was working with. She couldn't hold her cell phone up to her ear, her face would go numb and she had these different dental metals Actually we'll show some of these coming up and after she got all that out she can hold her cell phone up to her ear now without her face going numb. So you know, something's happening there and I don't think we have a total handle on it. And I've just been working with a bunch of, you know, different docs and corrosion engineers and dentists and everything around the world here.
Speaker 2:This particular I try to run through this one pretty quick, but this is just a stiff person syndrome. This patient I operated on him put some stainless steel screws in his feet and he ended up with paralysis. That and these are just the screws, the small screws in his feet, but he had paralysis up to 10 hours a day where he could breathe but he could not talk and could not move, and he was an engineer, actually, and he didn't realize that it came on three months after the surgery, so he didn't realize it was associated with the surgery. I didn't know because he had left the practice because everything healed up and he didn't have the symptoms prior to me doing't know because he had left the practice because everything healed up and he didn't have the symptoms prior to Be doing the surgery that he said that he had. Then he came back and he his big toe started having a problem. So I had to, you know, and that started curling. I was gonna have to fuse part of the big toe and but I noticed all the swelling around these screws and they go. Well, you know, I'm not sure what's going on here, but we don't need those screws. The bones healed.
Speaker 2:Let's get rid of these. You may be allergic to nickel and I used titanium in the big toe. Ultimately, I had titanium or problems with the titanium. I had to remove that too. And he had seen all kinds of people University of Washington Mayo Clinic and they just said sorry, you'll just probably be in a wheelchair the rest of your life and this gentleman that started in his forties and he said your wife will have to put you in a nursing home after a while because she won't be able to take care of you. And so I removed the screws and put titanium in, but also remove those stainless steel screws.
Speaker 2:He went from being paralyzed 10 hours a day to three hours a day overnight. So he goes, something's going on here. So then we sent his blood off for meliza testing. He was a positive for a nickel, as well as highly, highly positive for palladium. Well, you, being a dentist, would know where that could be. And uh, but I had no clue. And so you know I'm looking at a palladium, you know. And well, his gold crowns. He had two gold crowns and he had some amalgam fillings and his gold crowns were 26% palladium.
Speaker 1:So he worked with his dentist. What's that? Just for people that aren't that specific. You know, when you have a gold crown, it's not always pure gold, right? So there's alloys can be alloys to make it a bit softer and malleable, and one of those could be palladium.
Speaker 2:Or or or, you know stronger. You want it stronger, right? Sure, yeah, yeah, and yeah. So in his particular one had his palladium, and so he ended up, the day he got his last gold crown, he got all of his amalgam out. He also had an ACL repair in his knee and had a titanium screw in there. The day he got all of his amalgam out, he also had an acl repair in his knee and had a titanium screw in there. The day he got his last gold crown out, he hasn't been paralyzed since. Wow, uh, and I've speaking to him for a number of years now and he's still, you know, no paralysis. And that was the first case that really, you know, directed me from the foot to the mouth, and then I really started paying attention after that, and so, and here are the small screws in front there, those are the ones that paralyze them, you know, and there's, that's the.
Speaker 2:ACL repair screw. What's that? What's that big screw? That's the ACL titanium screw. So they have the. They replace the ligament and then they use that kind of as an interference screw to screw down in and then the ligament heals into. Then they use that kind of as an interference screw to screw down in and then the ligament heals into the bone and you don't need to screw anymore.
Speaker 1:The smaller ones are made of what?
Speaker 2:those are stainless steel. Okay, so he and they were about. You know, stainless steel is anywhere from you know, in the 14 to 16 percent range of nickel, and he was allergic to nickel, got it. Yeah, you could see the ring on his hand right this guy's not metal yeah, so, and he had to be careful of what he ate and everything also, you know. So, uh, this was just a teacher. I don't know if you want me to go into some of the voice memos I have or not.
Speaker 1:I think, leave one for our listeners.
Speaker 2:Okay, and so you do want one for the listeners. Huh.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, let's. Yeah, there's actually some coming up. This was this actually can be. This one's a pretty impressive one, because this goes directly between the foot and the mouth also. And so I'd seen her.
Speaker 2:She had stainless steel screws in her feet when she was 16. And then I had to do some other work and notice, like you were talking about that's one of the first thing is the earrings. You know she had problems with earrings. You go oh well, most likely you're allergic to nickel, so let's, don't use stainless. I'll take those stainless steel screws out. We use titanium, we did. She did fine. Then she came back and I said you know, come back if you have any problems with these screws. So she comes back later. Oh yeah, these screws are giving me problems. Can you get them out? Sure. And then I looked I'm doing the pre-op and I'm looking at all our medications, all these huge list of medications.
Speaker 2:I go what's going on? And she goes oh, those are from my fibromyalgia. Well, how long have you had fibromyalgia? Well, about you know, two years. And I go what else you got? She goes oh, I got the severe fatigue. I'm a teacher, I'll send the kids out for recess and I'll sleep under the desk and I'm going well, how long have you had that?
Speaker 2:She goes, oh, about two years. They go you have any other metal? And she goes, nope, never had a cavity, you know. And she goes, oh, but I have this, you know, bar behind my teeth. I go, oh, you had braces. I go when'd you get braces? She goes, oh, about two years ago. I go check with your orthodontist when you get your braces. So she goes in, calls him back later that day. Oh, my God, I got this. I got my braces in August, and beginning of September is when I started having these severe fatigue symptoms and the fibromyalgia came on. And so, anyway, we go and we go and get the screws out of her feet. Okay, and this actually I presented to the FDA back in 2019.
Speaker 3:I presented this particular case and so let's go ahead and we will listen to her and you can hear her story around 2016, beginning of, you're having some symptoms with a screw, so we decided to get it out, and then we realized you were having a number of different symptoms, some fibromyalgia type symptoms. You were diagnosed with some chronic fatigue and we decided to get you metal tested, found out you were allergic to titanium dioxide and nickel and vanadium, both of which titanium dioxide and vanadium were then titanium in your foot, so we decided to get that out. Also, you had a stainless steel bar with 15 nickel behind your lower teeth. So what happened after we got the titanium plate out of our titanium screws out of your foot?
Speaker 4:so, almost immediately after you took the screws out of my feet, I noticed that, um, almost all of my body pain and my migraine symptoms had gone away and within a of weeks, actually, all of my rosacea had cleared. Um, so I was able to stop most of my medicines within a month. I was, I think I was taking 18 different medicines for fibromyalgia at that point, um, and then, shortly after that, I made an appointment to take the the bar out from my teeth, and since then I um don't take far out from my teeth, and since then I take one pill a day for my migraines and that's it.
Speaker 1:Okay, thanks. So what do you think about that Unbelievable and probably the migraines could be caused because there's a lot of evidence that shows when you do orthodontics without controlling the occlusion you can offset the TMJ because basically you create a premature contact and that can create tension headaches. So she might just need some calibration of her occlusion and she'll be fine to go. But oh my God, that's unbelievable, dramatic. People dentists are going to freak out when they hear this right Now. As you know, I run a practice. I have thousands of patients that have metal bars in their mouths with no problems, all right, so no visible complaints and in their medical chart they're not taking any medication, they're healthy they're active, they don't have rosacea, so how do you explain that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I think, again, you have to be know what questions to ask. You know, okay, and you're you have to look at the whole big picture. We can't just focus on one little thing. You know, let's put an ankle surgeon. That's what I was doing. I was looking at the foot and ankle and, okay, yeah, they have headaches and they have fibromyalgia and neck pain. But hey, that's not me, right? But what I'm saying is it could be me, or at least, coming from the work I did, I need to ask the right questions and then you really need the proper history. When did these things come on? You know, like all her symptoms came on after she had her braces, look, you know. But then that vast majority went away when I removed the titanium from the foot. That's very telling to me. You know that, hey, there's a problem going on between these two.
Speaker 1:Somehow look, I mean I've, I've, like I said I've. I started seeing this about a decade ago. Um, I would argue that you know it's. You're completely right with what you say. I have done the metal removal of some of my patients that have desperately, uh, been trying everything and seen immediate results, like you. I had one guy. He had really bad eczema all over his skin, under his armpits and after removal of the metal, because we did the tests and all of that within two hours of the surgery. The redness went away about 80% within two hours, like I was still suturing and he was already having improvements and he was a redhead. Now my mother's a redhead and we all, you know. I don't know if there's anything to do with that, but some people are more sensitive to this than to others, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't affect everybody. So I guess my question is do you think metal's bad for everybody?
Speaker 2:You know that's the question. I don't know. I don't think so, as far as you know what I've seen in my patients, because I've had the same thing I've had. You know patients and I've asked questions later. You know about patients when they come back in for something else oh, you have any problems with that foot, and then you know the heart, the surgery we did, any other symptoms in your body? No, no, no, no, no. So no, I do not believe it's everybody, by any means. Why and I don't think we have that question answered Totally, I think do we need to study that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and because it's going to only help people, I think right now we just need to have a high index of suspicion and awareness around this topic, because you know, I think most folks that are in the healthcare sector really truly, genuinely want to help their patients heal, right. I mean, a huge part of the industry has gone into the financial aspect of things. I understand that, but you know, most surgeons are good people and they're like you know, they want to help their patients. I mean, you know if you're still in the game, I guess so what we're doing is we're just adding an extra tool, an extra tool of to help at least think well, hang on, if you've got that and you have that, maybe it could be this, you know, and if you get it out, I mean, there's no, you don't need a metal wire. It's easy, it guarantees. But you can always have a, a retainer at night, a metal free. Thanks to 3d printing, you can have metal-free retainers for your aligners. You don't, you know?
Speaker 1:For orthodontics, we have alternative to titanium. We have ceramic, zirconia, ceramic implants. So there are alternatives. We stopped using gold in dentistry many, many years ago for composite and high quality ceramics. So I went metal free as a dentist in 2006 in my prosthodontic cases. You know pretty much metal. Naturally, we still use titanium bars and titanium implants, but we do test our patients and we always use mostly use grade four titanium, so alloy free when we do and, of course, clean implant certified. But this makes me obviously and since I saw your lecture, we always ask do you have metal plates in your body before we go ahead and place another implant in the mouth. So let's say a patient's got no metal in their mouth, I always ask do you have any metal in your body? Exactly because of the slide, because it can create a current. So talk about this a little bit.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, so that's where we're going into. Oh, just one point on that. I was just talking to a dentist about, you know, because I was concerned about the stainless steel bars, because all three of my daughters had those and two of them had significant reactions that we didn't even know were associated with that. One was IBS type thing and the other was a rash. You know that both that the rash resolved within three days after removal. But he talked about Kevlar. You know, the lingual bars potentially, you know, just have made out of Kevlar type material instead of having to use the stainless steel probably more expensive, I don't know, but there's one way to potentially avoid that. Um, yeah, yeah, um. So here we go into the positive. You know, uh, you know there's, there's all.
Speaker 2:All of these metals have their unique charges to them. You look at the periodic table, okay, and the more positive metal is more of a cathode and more negative metal more of the anode, and it's going to be the anode metal is going to be the one that's going to corrode faster. The least noble metal is the one that's, and then the more the positive metal or the more noble metal is more protective and all metals in the body will corrode, just period it's, you know there's it's going to, it's the rate at which it corrodes and it may take a long time. But this is where I'm concerned, that some of this may be accelerated. You know, if we have some of this type of galvanic reaction going on and if we do, you know, it's basically a battery type reaction between dissimilar metals in the body.
Speaker 2:We have the cathode and the electrode. In the middle are the body fluids and the anode, and so that can create a battery. And then we look at the body and we go okay, here is an action potential of a nerve, the resting state is minus 70 millivolts and this nerve will fire off at minus 55 millivolts. And we don't know how this exactly relates to what I'm gonna present to you, but this just tells you. Hey, we have electrical things going on in the body. And then, like you talked about earlier, how much of the body's function involves electrical impulses, you know, or chemical, electrical, pretty much the vast majority, right?
Speaker 1:unbelievable. Um, yeah, yeah, you know, I I told you about this. Yeah, this is, this is Unbelievable. Yeah, you know, tell me about this. Yeah, this is what I want to. This is what you sent me. That really yeah yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So this is where I actually, when I presented the FDA, I did a similar type one. I redid this for this presentation and came up essentially with the same thing. But I wanted to. I was thinking I was having a problem between the foot and the mouth. So I go, how can I try to prove this scientifically? You know, because I'm like you, I want the, I want the science behind everything.
Speaker 2:So I went to my neurologist friend who does a lot of diagnostic testing and I said hey, can I use some of your equipment to test this? He goes, well, actually, what's going to be better is you get a high quality voltmeter multimeter and then use ultrasound gel, because I wanted to test titanium, like titanium plates and stainless steel screws, or what have you against each other to see if I'm seeing some. You know potential differences between them. So here's a titanium plate on the right, stainless steel screw on the left, and here we are at 151 millivolts between the two and I'm going, whoa, okay. And and again, I don't know how it relates to the, how the actual potential of a nerve fires off, you know, with just really about a 15 millivolt change. But here's a potential between these two and so I go. Well, I think I'm having a problem six feet away.
Speaker 1:So actually, in the FDA presentation I presented, the girl the hot wheel in the FDA presentation.
Speaker 2:I presented the girl with hot wheels. Okay, you got to be thinking outside the box a little bit, right, I love this. And so, and it's still 68 millivolts, that's not insignificant.
Speaker 1:That's enough to disrupt cellular activity. I mean it is.
Speaker 2:You know that's what we got to figure out, totally. You know, and you know, especially when you're up in a lot of these that I'm seeing, as you'll see here, you know, in the body. Well, when I presented the FDA, a group of us were talking and somebody said, boy, we should figure out how to do this in vivo. And I go, I think I can do that. And so, because I have my own surgery center, a group of us were talking and somebody said, boy, we should figure out how to do this in vivo. And I go, I think I can do that. And so, cause I have my own surgery center, and so I went ahead and I just had to figure out a way to get a sterile probe for the foot. And I just used a cautery probe that we use all the time, cut off the end that can hook into the volt meter, and then we were good to go and we can sterilize the other end.
Speaker 2:So here was a lingual bar, okay, and then titanium. I had titanium plate and screws. So anybody watching just be careful. These are some graphic signs of surgery here. So just be careful if you're a little queasy. But this titanium that I had in the foot prior to removal, and so minus 158 millivolts from the foot all the way to the mouth. And the positive negative doesn't? It just depends on where you have the positive probe negative probe and that's from a lingual bar for orthodontic.
Speaker 1:Just the bar that the orthodontist place after orthodontic treatment. Correct, correct. So that bar is not in the bone, it's not in the bone, it's not under the gum, it's literally just against the back of the teeth. Correct With saliva.
Speaker 2:Yes, everybody's saliva around Right. So then I removed the plate and screws and then I go to bone or the soft tissues, you know, and it was 35 mill millivolts. So we had a difference of 193 millivolts. That's significant difference. That's what I believe. So in some of the studies out of russia this is sorry to interrupt.
Speaker 1:There's something that's freaking me out because there's a huge part of the population uh, these people would be mostly between the ages of 55 to 85 that have partial dentures, that have a chrome, cobalt infrastructure, metal, acrylic, partial dentures with these metal clasps, partial dentures with these metal clasps. So my concern was always structures that were under the gum, in the bone, you know, because there's an implant surgeon, or fillings inside the teeth right or crowns and stuff. I hadn't really thought about this. So the amount of people that have these external prosthodontics like removable partials with a huge amount of metal alloys in them, that probably also have. So it affects if it's just in the saliva, oh my God.
Speaker 2:Well, that's saliva and blood and interstitial fluids are all the electrolytes, right?
Speaker 1:Huge part of the population, scott. Huge part of the population, yeah.
Speaker 2:They're huge. Yeah, and I was talking to one of the engineers corrosion engineers that actually work with body, with, you know, some of the orthopedic appliances, metals and that type of thing. He goes, yeah, you know, then you have a reaction between the mouth and the foot, plus then the total knee and you know. So you have all these different reactions potentially going on, right.
Speaker 1:And no one's asking that question when you. Because, as you saw, you know my lecture the doctors and dentists just don't speak. So the likelihood that an orthopedic surgeon and a dental surgeon ever speak on stage or ever share the same room is almost zero. Um, you know, that's why I'm loving speaking to you. You're an orthopedic, so we do the same thing. Just somehow, magically, the mouth isn't part of the body, you know.
Speaker 2:So uh that's exactly why I came to meet with uh jack call and others. You know he was the one that asked me to present to the fda. You know, their, their group.
Speaker 1:They're bored very grateful for this scott keep on going. I love, love this. Keep on going. I'm scared. I'm scared of what I see here is gold, gold.
Speaker 2:Yeah, gold to titanium and gold. You know one of the more noble right? Well, here it is. So here's to titanium, right, and a screw in the toe 340 millivolts, 340 millivolts, and then so I take the, the screw out of the foot, go to the bone, minus 37, so a 300 millivolt change.
Speaker 1:And that was very consistent what I saw with gold and the patient's number of these are like the one in the voice note.
Speaker 2:Just like my symptoms improved dramatically overnight, kind of not not everybody, not I mean that particular, this particular gal's how swollen those two toes are versus the third toe right. So I took the, these titanium screws out of these. By the time she came back, five days later, the toes look very similar to the other one. I mean, the swelling just went down, the redness went down, inflammation associated with that. Now, that could be just from localized titanium. Is it related to the gold? I don't know, um, but it is.
Speaker 2:You know, we're just, we're, we gotta ask the questions, you know, and try to, you know, figure out what's happening here. So, and these were just, you know, she had a gold crown, let's test that, you know, and see, and some of these also have amalgam, and so I test to that, you know. And uh, so this is one you know, this is a recovery room nurse, significant issues, uh, you know, mentally and and emotionally and all that, as well as body pains and everything. But here's her titanium to amalgam, here's her amalgam. And uh, so she was minus 154 millivolts, I take, I go to bone and then she's seven, so it's 161 millivolt.
Speaker 1:Change right and that's to the amount. Amalgam has a bunch of other things. So it's copper, silver, mercury, mercury. There's three metals, right? So?
Speaker 2:right, and potentially nickel and others too. Well, what I'll?
Speaker 1:what I'll have you do just because of actually with her, with the reason sorry to interrupt you, the reason why amalgam fillings are so brilliant is that they actually corrode, and it's the corrosion that kills bacteria, making them last forever. So that actually is something that we study. So they're actually designed in the interface between the filling and the tooth to leash that corrosion that you know that would actually. It's part of their reason why they last so long. At least that's how I remember it. I haven't used them in 30 years, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, and we have some things coming up on that too, but so let me just I'll have you listen on her to some of the emotional things.
Speaker 3:So two weeks ago, we removed multiple titanium plates and screws from your foot, and how do you describe your emotional state prior to the hardware removal.
Speaker 5:I was highly emotional, I was very labile, I was depressed and cried and well, 75% of the day I was crying and I had big, my husband's big hanky and cried myself to sleep every night and um was so, would wake up in the morning and out my eyes and I was so sad and it was just hard to even carry on, to continue to live.
Speaker 5:And since getting the hardware out and it was just hard to even carry on, to continue to live. And since getting the hardware out, I feel brand new, I feel alive. I'm not. I've never I haven't cried in two weeks. It makes me cry to even think about that. I mean I just I'm happy, okay, thanks.
Speaker 2:So that's some of the stuff I've seen, with these emotional side of things, you know, and anxiety, that type of thing after I moved. What are your thoughts?
Speaker 1:We've got millions of people taking SSRIs, antidepressants, zolofts and Xanax and all of that stuff dealing with mental health issues, and they might be oblivious to this issue. And it could be oblivious to this issue and it could be just cured overnight. I mean, mental illness is a multibillion-dollar industry. It is an industry and so many people suffering, leading to suicide ideation, and it could be something as simple as this. You know, dr Professor Edward Bulmore from Cambridge University published a book in 2012 called the Inflamed Mind and basically he published findings.
Speaker 1:Actually had dinner with him a lovely guy and basically, you know, the theory was that anxiety, depression, panic attacks, all the way up to dementia, wasn't just caused by sadness let's put it that way but actually by cytokine, chemokine passing the blood brain barrier. So if you have systemic inflammation, those chemokines and cytokines pass the blood brain barrier, activating microglia and disrupting brain activity, so of course, that is perceived as sadness and depression and all of that stuff. So if you remove the root cause of the inflammation, whatever that may be, then people get immediately better. So Ed's book if anybody wants to read it, the Inflamed Mind proves this. So what you're seeing here is a current that could be causing inflammation. That could then be. I don't know, we need to look into this bigger, but I mean wow.
Speaker 2:Yes, I think the current can be involved. I also think then, because if we're looking at the current, going between the two or having an issue between the two, and we look at the again, the positive, negatives, and the anode and cathode, you know, like with stainless steel, 316 that we use versus amalgam at least according to a number of the reports that I'm looking at is that the amalgam is, the more is the anode in this case, and so then now that's going to get released, more, you know, and then into the body, and that's my concern because a number of these patients I'm seeing, they also have amalgam. So, with the more emotional issues, so are we then, as the titanium, then allowing the amalgam then to be released more readily? It's contributing to it.
Speaker 1:I'm just remembering right now. I remember I had a friend about 20 years ago and she didn't want to get pregnant, she didn't want to take the pill and she had one of these intrauterine devices placed and it had a coil in it. I don't know, I'm not a gynecologist, but I remember her. One day she I didn't know she had it, she was a colleague of mine and and back in the day, many years ago, and I remember her like just crying all the time and like depressed she was always a happy person, right and then just one day, like her mood just, and she's like consistently crying and sad and depressed, and I was like you know, what did you do? You know, because I'm a very curious, you know, I'm a doctor, I'm a scientist, I'm very curious.
Speaker 1:And she said, have you done anything recently, like in the last month, you know? And she said I had this thing device and then I was like and I knew it had metal in it and I said, well, just, you know, take it out. And that just instinctive, that wasn't. I said, well, if you were happy before that, take it out. You know, and I remember her, she took it out and the week later she was back. She was back 100, so she must have I've only just I haven't thought about that in 20 years, but she probably had that to that that they the metal allergy to the coil in the in the the and they had many problems.
Speaker 2:There's one device called Escher that is night no and it's 50% nickel and they had significant problems with it. I believe it's off the market now. Uh, but yes, uh many there's called the bleeding edge. Um, it's a Netflix uh documentary uh that discusses this specifically and all the issues and that type of thing. So, um, yeah, that's what I'm talking about?
Speaker 1:what do you tell somebody? You know I've got a patient and she came in for for checkup and we run the metal hypersensitivity test. You know I have done for many years and she's off the charts for titanium, off the charts uh and vanadium, and yet she's had a back accident, back injury, and she's got a bunch of pins down her spine and like she can't I don't know, I'm not a spine surgeon, but basically can't take them out because there's no alternative in another product, let's say in ceramic and or PMMA or peak or pectin or something like that. Do you know how? How can these people find hope if they've got this problem? I?
Speaker 2:mean, are there, in your experience as an orthopedic surgeon, are alternatives to metal on the rise? Yes, I mean I've been trying to work with some of these companies, you know, to uh see what else can be. You know, I, I get paid for nothing and I never want to be paid for any. Like, say, some of these companies will ask me to lecture for them and I go, no, I'm not gonna do it because I compromise myself. But uh, uh so, but I encourage them as far as that goes, and fine, is a big thing.
Speaker 2:I get uh again, I, that's not my specialty at all. I'm putting ankle, but metal is. And so you know, I've had to work with and talk to spine surgeons, neurosurgeons, about okay, we know that this particular patient is allergic to, you know, metal, but that's all I have. And I go, okay, well, you just have to tell them that and I speak to the patient too, that that you know you may have some symptoms during this, and she did, and then. But then he was able to get it out and then, you know, all the symptoms went away and her original problem was gone too. But with some of those fusions after fusions, many times, if it is a fusion, then many times you can get the metal out. It just depends on where like. If it's coming in from the back and everything's fused, then you don't need that hardware anymore.
Speaker 1:And we're also seeing, we're seeing in the hip replacement, like ceramic and polyurethane are basically pretty much taken over, right? You don't? You're not, you're not placing metal that much anymore, right?
Speaker 2:Oh, no, no, no, you still, no, no, no. Hips still have to have a metal construct that goes in the head right.
Speaker 2:To support that. Yeah, so the head can be ceramic. And then, yeah, there's the poly, but there's still knees. They do have some over in Europe that are kind of total ceramic-type knees, but they still have to cement those, my understanding right now. So the total knees and hips the hips are behind the knees a little bit, but still a vast majority of them still can contain some type of metal. They're working to ceramics more and more, but I don't think we're where we need to be.
Speaker 1:So, basically, if you can't have any, if you have the hip, if you have the knee, if you have other metal, then ideally no metal in the mouth, right, I mean if you have the tonic health, exactly, if you have the health issues.
Speaker 2:Exactly If you have chronic health issues. Exactly, and that's what I'm seeing. Yes, that's what I'm seeing. Like one gal, she had titanium hips placed. She had all kinds of pain, problems, mental issues. She had stainless steel in the foot. I removed the metal from the foot, stainless steel, and her hip pain dramatically improved, her emotions dramatically improved and again, I think it was just the reaction between the two she could still keep the hips. And that's where I'm saying with the surgeons that you know, these patients are having problems, you know, and the surgeon says, hey, the knee looks great, the hip looks great, look elsewhere in the body for another metal that potentially you could get out much easier without having to address the hip or knee. And so I mean you take out the easiest metals first.
Speaker 1:That's what I always tell people about it all, right, yeah, so uh, do you have any any other stuff? Okay, so what else have you got there?
Speaker 2:yeah, so here here is, you know this. So here's another whole part of this. Then is all this corrosion right and working with the corrosion engineers? Like I say, I was just up there and here was this clip, here's the penny and here's a clip down here. This is a gallbladder clip and this patient was in a wheelchair majority of the time. And here was the titanium clip and here's the corrosion under this scanning electron microscope that we saw from this titanium clip and so they and it's and we're seeing this quite a bit with these- gallbladder removals and that obviously has leached into the body, obviously.
Speaker 2:Dr Correct, yeah, so you know, it can go throughout the body and the patient was allergic, in this case to nickel, and after removal, you know, significant improvement. She also had titanium clips in her thyroid and had those removed and after both these were removed, dramatic improvement in health with this particular. Then here's another. Like you were talking about. This is from back surgery and this was his titanium hardware. The arrow points to where this picture comes from and this is corrosion of the titanium back hardware. You can see the normal striations to the left you know the milling process of the titanium and to the right. That's all corrosion. And where did all those titanium, including vanadium and and aluminum and nickel and other things, go? Where'd that go?
Speaker 2:it's in, oh my god, yeah yeah, throughout you know, throughout the body, the whole inflammatory thing. Aluminum can cross the blood-brain barrier. You talk about the inflamed mind.
Speaker 1:Alzheimer's is through the roof. I think Alzheimer's is one of the leading causes of death now in America. Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know specifically on that, but yeah, but yes, I mean, all of this we have to look at. And then here's what I was talking about. I you know inductively coupled mass spectrometry, where we can look at all the elements from that particular hardware. This look at all the elements you know that were in here, including, you know, not just titanium, aluminum and vanadium, but you can see the concentration there, but also chromium, iron, nickel and then a whole host of other things up there of trace amounts. So that's all kind of that. I think we're back to that mining process and that type of thing.
Speaker 1:That was great.
Speaker 2:And then, yeah, the nurse we just listened to. This was her plate, titanium plate. After just about five months after I removed it, we took and looked at that under the scanning electronic microscope and this is the bone side of one of the small plates she had after just five months and this is the corrosion. So what do?
Speaker 1:you think, and then of course you've probably got different like in in dental implants. You've got, I don't know well, I thousands, yeah well the dental implants, thousands of.
Speaker 2:Well, I've been different man right? Well, we've been looking at that yeah, yeah, um, but you know the coating it's. Ha, is that one of the coatings?
Speaker 1:We've stopped putting hydroxyapatite on coatings. There was a phase. Now Usually it's called SLA, so it's acid, etched and sandblasted for, let's say, more surface adhesion. We stopped using polished titanium many, many years ago, so there's like a roughened surface which is etched and sandblasted.
Speaker 2:Right, okay, well, that had to be looked at too. We've looked at some of the HA ones, but the HA kind of coats the implant into the bone, so we can't really see underneath that very easy. We haven't figured out a way to get it off. But this was again people want to get it off. But this was again people want to kind of be careful looking. But this was all titanium. This was after about four and a half five months of me removing a titanium plate and all the black I've sent this off to. Pathology comes back as titanium particles.
Speaker 1:I've seen this in the mouth Once. I you know, having to remove a fractured titanium implant. I have seen the corrosion on the bone. I've seen it, and I think Sam Mimbussi has an article on that as well, about titanium particle corrosion, published a few years ago. All right, man, listen, it's okay. Yeah, that's just so. What do you think needs to happen at universities, in policy and hospitals?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, I think we just really need this is showing me right now. I see every day, and I think we just really need to show me right now. I see every day. That's a metal screw, an amalgam filling and a porcelain fused to metal alloy crown. That's dentistry from the last 40 years.
Speaker 2:It's there. And so we took yesterday, we took this one on the left, the amalgam, the chunk of amalgam, and this happened to be a stainless steel, you know, rip post, and here's what it looked like under the microscope, under the electron microscope, and, and this was to the left, that was the stainless steel rip post that then was attached to the amalgam. And you look how kind of rough everything is there, you know. And so that's what we don't know, you know, I, we want to get a new piece of amalgam that's just formed and just see how much of this amalgam potentially has corroded away. Or is this just the way it looks when it comes out after it's, you know, formed and um, so then we looked at this was the amalgam itself, and it was, you know, mercury and silver in this particular one and that's with what's called EDS.
Speaker 2:And then here was same type of thing we were looking at. This was the root post there. And then this was actually the, the crown, the crown, and the metal of the crown was palladium. Okay, and palladium is a more noble than the mercury. So, and these are right in close proximity to each other. So again, we get a battery, we can get a battery type reaction. What's going to be released? Well, the mercury is going to be released, right, because it's the more and that's just physics period.
Speaker 2:There's, there's yeah, this is just physics.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this is physics, this is engineering. I can't argue that. So it's just not going to not happen. It's going to happen, right.
Speaker 2:So yeah, I thought you'd kind of want to see that one, you know. And then this may be interesting too. Just briefly, stainless steel to titanium implant 111. Here's stainless steel to a zirconia implant. You know, 0.1 millivolts Titanium to titanium. Go back go back, go back which one?
Speaker 1:Ceramic. So this shows you that zirconia is probably the way to go in the future, right.
Speaker 2:That's my gut feeling. Looking at this especially electrically yeah, there's not a reaction. Looking at this especially electrically yeah, it doesn't. You know, there's not a reaction electrically. Here's the titanium, and this is my gut feeling as to why we're having failures. You know you're having failures, or the dental world is having failures is that here's zirconia and there's titanium, and so you definitely have electrical issues going on, and then if you have other metals in the mouth, and then we, we're sitting there looking, okay, here's, here's again titanium to zirconia no one is aware of this, scott.
Speaker 1:This is so important.
Speaker 2:Honestly, I'm gonna make and then here, yeah, and here's titanium implant to titanium implant and these are ones I believe sammy gave me uh to to check it out. So these are ones I believe Sammy gave me to check it out. So these are different companies, right? And again, they're not the same alloy, so you're going to have a potential difference between. So if you put one titanium in one place and then another different brand in another place, you're going to have reactions just between those two types, potentially between those two titanium implants, potentially, right.
Speaker 1:Keep on going.
Speaker 2:OK, yeah, so here's titanium implant to zirconia, all right. And then here is the gal that worked with the FDA. She presented to me with the FDA and so she. Her specialty was this adverse events reporting. And of all the metal, metal medical implants, including total hips, knees, everything it's 25 million. Here's the staggering one through April 25 of this year, there's 5.1 million adverse events reported for titanium dental implants point one million adverse events reported for titanium dental implants, so one fifth of all.
Speaker 1:What, what's organization?
Speaker 2:is this? This is at the fda. No, no, no device event. She um madras broke off from that, and then there was a couple there's what's called the mod reporting that she has listed there, and then there's another type of database and she combined the two to then get this quote device events.
Speaker 1:And then she works with a lot of universities, 25 million from dental implants.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, 25 million of all devices Of all Okay, and then dental implants? How many? Five million of no, 25 million of all devices, of all, okay, all medical devices.
Speaker 1:Five million of those Five million. That's a big number. And are these numbers just from the US or globally?
Speaker 2:These are what are reported to the FDA and my understanding is that this is because the company. No, no, no, Because the companies that most of this reporting actually comes from the companies. When a dentist has an implant that fails, they send it back to the company, says hey, this one failed and as you see, at the bottom of this it says 4.4 million of these were serious injury reports and basically what that means is it's lack of osteo integration and basically what that means is it's lack of osteointegration. That's a 4.4 million.
Speaker 1:So that could be these 4.4. Are those, let's say, 5% that fail? Now we could tap into the greed of the dental industry and say, hey, because they have to replace those implants and the clinics have to replace them. It's a very expensive proposition when these implants fail because you lose the crown, it's just, it's horrible. Nobody likes these failures. Maybe that will inspire people to start asking more questions and and looking into this a little bit more. Geez man, right, right a little number.
Speaker 2:So, uh, yeah, yeah that that is a big number. That that's what these corrosion engineers were. Boy, we need to look at this further, and they're willing to work with the dental industry regarding this, you know, to try to figure out why. So you know, and then this this was actually the HA on this in the upper right is that titanium dental implant, an older one, you know, and so what this was actually. I was talking about the abutment, so it's abutment where we're seeing the issues. Here's the corrosion on the abutment that screwed into that older dental implant. So you can see the corrosion in the center aspect. So it's, and that makes sense, because that's where you have more of the fluids and all that around there, right, and so, and again, we're just delving into this now sense, because that's where you have more of the fluids and all that around there, right, and uh, so, and again, we're just delving into this now. So, but, uh, I think more work needs to be done here. So, and then we looked and, sure enough, this was titanium. You can see this eds, it's called, it's aluminum titanium, and actually nickel was in this too, so in the above.
Speaker 2:But uh, then here here's the reports for the fda with the uh, you know, the dental implants and and happening last, you know, from 2019 on is when it really took off as far as uh, you know more serious events here, interesting, yep.
Speaker 2:So, and then I'll just kind of put this in, so people kind of look at it real quick because this is the lack of Osteos integration and what have you, and some of the other issues associated with this. But but that's what we, you know, that's what we got. Yeah, so big thing is going to be, you know, working with, you know, having a high index of suspicion and really looking in, you know, asking the questions and when there are issues and maybe a little forethought going into some of this, now it does appear, you know, if we can have good ceramic implants. You know, in my mind, from what I'm seeing, from my, at least, electrical type stuff, that seems to be a way to go with this and avoid and that's what we're trying to do in the orthopedic world too, with a number of these issues is, you know, find other alternatives, you know.
Speaker 1:I'm going to tell you something. First of all, thank you for this. It's brilliant the way you educate and explain and back it up with your experience, but also the publications and stuff, and it's very simple, it's very on point and it's scary. You know a dentist, a normal dentist, that does this. It's going to scare the living shit out of a lot of people, all right, and I would say that you know it is a duty of every doctor, every medical professional, to continuously be curious and ask questions and challenge the status quo and educate themselves and follow the science and the literature of autoimmune disease, unexplained conditions, chronic health issues, subclinical issues that you know, the amount of people that are on pills, just like the ones that you said, that are desperate for help.
Speaker 1:And it could be something as simple as we have just overlooked electric currents that were created by putting metals in people's mouths. We didn't know we were trying our best and you know 100 years ago we'd make lead piping. We put asbestos in people's mouths. We didn't know we were trying our best and you know, 100 years ago we'd make lead piping. We put asbestos in people's ceilings. Doctors were recommending smoking to pregnant women. Where medicine is evolving, you know it was done with the best of the knowledge, the best of intentions. You know, and we need to evolve. So I'm going to make sure a lot of my colleagues see this. They might want to reach out to you. How do people find you?
Speaker 2:So it's, you know, right now I've been kind of laying on the low a little bit, just because with how much I'm doing and working, it's probably best to kind of come through you and then you kind of, you know, be able to get people on.
Speaker 1:And also very clear, scott, you are not uh, you know, be able to get people on very clear scott. You are not. You don't have any devices, you don't have any shares, you are not paid by any organization. You have no fiduciary or financial interest in any company in health care outside of just. You want to help people see what you're saying this has affected my family.
Speaker 2:Four of my five family members, including myself, have been affected by this quite significantly. And so you know you have that type of thing happen and you flip, you change. You know you kind of really start asking questions and you know both my mother and father are same type of thing Alzheimer's. What have dementia issues I'm concerned about when I'm going by the group homes and people are screaming and yelling and all that okay, do they have amalgam in their mouth? You know it's a neurotoxin right and what's happening. You know we look at this. Like you mentioned the psychological, you know issues in this country. Let's let's take, let's ask a question, issues in this country. Let's ask a question what metals do these people have in their body and can that contribute to these issues that? We just looked at that article.
Speaker 1:That yes all of that can be related to metals. Okay, let's just rule that out then. You know, I'm going to do my very best to see if we can uh get you on guys like joe rogan, you know, who have huge reach. These big podcasters, uh, david huberman, uh, these big guys because, um, I think I introduced you to leila the other day, uh, in miami. They know a lot of big names. Because this information is to get out there and you need to work with the companies. We need to find solutions, we need to help people. Listen, scott, I can't thank you enough for finding time for me and to jump on this and educate. I'll get this up as soon as I can and God bless you. Keep up the good fight, keep on asking questions, and I look forward to sharing the stage with you again, real, real soon, my friend.
Speaker 2:It will be great, yep. Always a pleasure, miguel. Thank you very much, very, very much Appreciate.
Speaker 1:It All right, thank you, okay. Okay, don't hang up, you bet.