Homemaker Portrait | Kathlena Rule

We are kicking off Season 28 today a brand new Homemaker Portrait! 

I'm starting this episode with some notes from you out of the mail bag, what to expect this season on the podcast and magazine updates!!

After those updates, I am chatting with my good friend, Kathlena Rule, about her experience of full time homemaking over the past 42 years. Kathlena’s concept of home was shaped by 2 godly parents and a life of constant moving. She loves the change that moving brings and the fact that there are always new people to meet. She and husband, Ed, lived several years abroad and that experience profoundly shaped her homemaking. 

We discuss all of the usual material-strengths, weaknesses, expectations and how to set and keep priorities. Throughout our conversation you’ll hear this theme; the home is a tool, an extension of the people who live there. The people are the point. Home and homemaking provide opportunity and space for unhurried fellowship leading to flourishing relationships with others and with Christ. 

You can now text me or leave me a voice mail using the link at the top of this description AND I can text you back! 🎉

SHOW NOTES

All resources mentioned in this episode, including Kathlena's signature dish recipe, are on the blog. Click the link below.

https://www.theartofhomepodcast.com/post/the-home-is-a-tool-the-people-are-the-point-a-homemaker-portrait-of-kathlena-rule

Transcript

Welcome & Mail Bag

SPEAKER_00 0:03

Hello, homemakers. Welcome to kickoff week of our spring 2026 season of the Art of Home. I'm your host, Alison Weeks. I am a wife, a mom, a granny to two little ones, and I have been practicing the art of home for over 30 years. How are you doing, my friend? I have missed talking to you each week for the last month, but I have been diligently working over my spring break on the first issue of our brand new magazine, Homemaker's Journal. I will have more to share about that in a minute, but first, let's check the mailbag, shall we? This is the part of the show where I respond to messages and answer questions that you all have sent me either via email, voicemail, or a one-way text message. This mailbag segment is brought to you by listeners who support the art of home through Buy Me a Coffee. Buy Me a Coffee is a virtual tip jar where you can show your appreciation and support for the show by giving a one-time tip or by becoming a Titus2 Woman supporter and setting up a recurring tip of $5 per month. Titus2Women supporters receive my undying gratitude for and the occasional perk, such as free printables and free registration for the recipe exchange and other fun things. Whichever way you choose to give, I'm grateful for your support. Sandy Smith left a comment on Jasmine Wyland's episode on Spotify. I wanted to drop a suggestion for group or potluck meals. There's a website called Perfect Potluck. It's super easy to set up a new meal with a theme or whatever, and you put listings of the things you need so people can just fill in a slot. Our church uses that anytime we do a big potluck meal after service, and it's been an excellent resource. Hand in hand is the Take Them a Meal website. Perfect for any kind of meal schedule like a new baby, family hardships, or loss, etc. Thank you, Sandy. That is an excellent resource suggestion, and I will try to link those down in the show notes for you guys. Dottie from South Dakota, thank you so much for producing the podcast, especially the homemaker portraits. I am always encouraged to hear about how different homemaking can be and how normal women, not authors or influencers, problem solve and adapt to the unique situations God has designed for their families. My daughter Katie is seven, and anytime she and I have a car ride together without the younger children, she asks to listen to your podcast. Last night we heard Emily Baxter's story of home and loved it, especially because we are currently reading Farmer Boy. Emily talked about tapping the maple trees in her woods, and her final comments were about Almonzo's family farm and the legacy of home. Katie told me she wants to make Emily's Shepherd's Pie recipe when I ask her to make dinner when I'm 18 or something. And then she proceeded to recite the recipe. I told her she could make it tomorrow. With much appreciation, Dottie. I love this story so much, Dottie. I am honored to connect stories like Emily's with listeners like you and Katie. Thank you for taking the time to share how this show has blessed you both. If you would like to share a great tip like Sandy did, or share how the show has blessed and encouraged you like Dottie, I would love to hear from you. Leave me a comment over on Spotify or send me an email, contact at theartofhomepodcast.com, or send me a message using the link in the description box. Now, new and improved. You can either text me with that link or you can leave me a voice message with that same link. And even better, I can text you back. It does not start an ongoing text thread between us. I can only text you back once, and then you cannot text me again unless you're doing it through the fan mail button. But at least I can text you back and say thanks for the message and ask clarifying questions if I need to. If you leave me a voicemail, I might even play it on the show, with your permission, of course.

Magazine & Spring Season Update

SPEAKER_00 4:11

Now a little update on the magazine and what to expect this season on the Art of Home. If you tuned in on Monday, you already know that most of this season I will be sharing motivations for spring cleaning. In Monday's episode, I discussed how we can gain some perspective and motivation for spring cleaning by looking back at history, looking around at modern wisdom, and looking to the gospel-saturated roots of spring cleaning. The rest of this season, we will explore the best tools and supplies and work our way through the house with the top-down cleaning approach. One week we will talk about ceilings, vents, and other spaces above your head. And then we will move on to walls and windows, and then appliances, furniture and the forgotten. And finally, we will cover floors, carpets, and baseboards. That's every Monday this season. On a Wednesday, you can expect to hear five brand new homemaker portraits from newbies in the trenches and seasoned homemakers. I also have a deep dive on quilting for you, as well as one on summer family road trips. And I will be introducing a brand new type of episode with my good friend and multi-episode Art of Home alumni, Jessica Fisher. We will be doing a bit of a seasonal ramble once per quarter. So this season, we will ramble together on all spring-related topics. It will be very different, not as scripted, well, really not scripted at all, uh, but I promise well worth your time. So that's what is happening this season on the podcast. Let me give you a quick update for the magazine. I have been so privileged to work with 13 very talented homemaking writers over the past several weeks, and they have crafted lovely, compelling, and inspiring articles for this first issue of Homemaker's Journal. You may not realize this, but the Art of Home turned five last month. And in honor of the Art of Home's fifth birthday, this first issue will not only cover spring and summer topics, but will feature articles about birthdays and celebrations. Here are just a few of our featured articles. How celebrations reveal the heart of God. Celebrate this season, tips and recipes for getting together in summer, celebrating on a budget, celebrating the everyday, celebration and grief, and much more. We will also have regular sections in each issue, including Homemaker Culture, where we will give you seasonal ideas and resources for cultivating in yourself and in your home a love of handicrafts, art, poetry, literature, music, and nature. Each issue will contain a homemaker skills section where we will highlight one or two skills that you can add to your homemaker toolbox. There's even more, but I need to wrap this up. So issue number one of Homemaker's Journal will go on sale May 1st. Make sure that you are on our mailing list to receive a notification as soon as they are available. Click the link below to get on the list. Now, on to today's episode. I am talking with my good friend Kathleen about her experience of full-time homemaking over the past 42 years. Kathleena's concept of home was shaped by two godly parents and a life of constant moving. She loves the change that moving brings and the fact that there are always new people to meet. She and husband Ed lived several years abroad, and that experience profoundly shaped her homemaking. We discuss all of the usual material, strengths, weaknesses, expectations, and how to set and keep priorities. Throughout our conversation, you will hear this theme: the home is a tool, an extension of the people who live there. The people are the point. Home and homemaking provide opportunity and space for unhurried fellowship, leading to flourishing relationships with others and with Christ. I will be back at the end with this episode's long haul listener emoji and a few closing reminders. Thank you for trusting me with some of your valuable time today. Whatever you are applying your hands to as you listen, I know you will enjoy Kathena's story of home. Here we go. Let's see. Press record. Yes, very good.

Meet Kathlena

SPEAKER_00 8:32

Welcome to the Art of Home. I am here with my good friend, Kathleena Rule. And Kathleena is we're a member of the same church, and she is in my small group. So I get to see her on the weekly, usually, sometimes twice a week. So it has been a delight to get to know Kathleena over the last three years. And you get to know her today as she is going to tell us about her story of home, of keeping a home for many decades. And I'm so excited. Yes, we were just at a wedding, and you and your husband won the longest married dance contest.

SPEAKER_01 9:05

I think everybody older than us had already left. They had already gone home to go to bed. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 9:11

All right. Well, Kathleen, why don't you just say hi to everybody? Tell us a little bit about who you are today.

SPEAKER_01 9:17

Love to. First of all, Alison, thank you so much for the privilege of being able to be here today. And for anybody listening, um, I know that you're blessed over and over when you listen to Allison and listen to her podcasts. And um I just want to say good morning or hello to you as well. Um, I have been married as of yesterday for 42 years. So happy anniversary. Thank you. And I've had the privilege of being raised by two very godly parents who are still living. And we shared life with my two older brothers, my younger sister. Um, in college, I met and married Ed. Um, and we have two incredible sons married to our remarkable daughters in love, and we have three delightful grandchildren. I just say that I'm corn fed because I was basically raised and have lived the majority of my life in the Midwest of the United States. I've had two international moves, and I we have moved a lot. Uh, Ed and I, as a married couple and also growing up, moved a great deal too. So um it's change is something that I absolutely uh embrace and love, which is unlike many, many people. But I think part of that was just because life every two or three years growing up changed, and um, there are always more people to meet.

SPEAKER_00 10:45

That is true. That is true. Okay, I didn't realize you had two international moves. So you were in Saudi Arabia.

SPEAKER_01 10:52

We were for three and a half years, and then just for one year, um, my last my senior year or grade 12, depending on where who's listening and what it's called there. Um we my family moved to Canada. So I actually graduated from so it's considered an international, and I was absolutely I was actually an alien coming back to the United States to go to the uh University of Illinois. Um so my first year I came as a foreigner, uh, even though I was a U.S. citizen.

SPEAKER_00 11:22

So wow. That's very interesting. Okay. Um and just for those listening who are not in the States, when we say the reason she's corn fed, because she grew up in the Midwest is because they grow a lot of corn there.

SPEAKER_01 11:36

A lot of corn. And I love symmetry because I love a cornfield where every row just looks yes, yes, corn as far as the eye can see.

SPEAKER_00 11:46

Exactly. So okay. Well, congratulations again on 42 years of marriage with Ed. Thank you. He's a great guy. I think so. Yeah. Well, you must. I mean,

Beginnings & Influences

SPEAKER_00 11:57

okay, let's go back to the beginning. When did you first become a homemaker? And what, if any skills did you bring with you?

SPEAKER_01 12:05

You know, this is a great question because it um as I think back, my some of my absolute earliest memories in life focus on hospitality and homemaking. Um and when I was three years old, because we moved so much, those are great reference points for how old I was at the time. So um, when I was three years old, my mother had a group of ladies over six, eight ladies, I don't know how many, they had had coffee. And as my mother was having, you know, greeting them as they left, um, I went around and started cleaning up. And I noticed that the coffee cups, many of them, still had a little residual liquid in them, but they all looked different. They were different colors. And one, you know, some were very dark brown and some were much lighter brown and almost tan. So I just took it upon myself to finish all of those. So I drank every one of them. Some were very sweet, some were, you know, the the with nothing in them, those were a little bit more bitter. But um, that was my first taste of coffee. As I so I that was that. Then when I turned four and we lived in the next home, I remember very vividly, I remember where we were in the kitchen. My mother was making something. I don't know if she was preparing dinner, and I asked her as a four-year-old, can I make my own recipe? I had no idea what that would entail. And my mother said, sure. You know, and she didn't do anything. She didn't offer to help me with what that would look like. So I just started pulling things out of the refrigerator, and it was had to have been totally grotesque. You know, ketchup and mustard and mayonnaise and just saucy kinds of things. And I tasted it and I was like, hmm. And my mom tasted it, and we went, hmm. And that was the end of it. But that was the beginning for me of knowing that you could be creative in the kitchen. Also, during that time, um I had been gifted a very small, uh, but precious to me, um, little China tea set. It had very small plates, a little tiny tea uh pot that maybe held a quarter of a cup. And my mother and I were Mrs. Jones and Mrs. Smith, and we'd lay out a blanket, and we just thought we were queens and princesses, and we would have little tea parties. So that type of thing was very much the beginning of hospitality and hope making.

SPEAKER_00 14:43

Okay. I love all of those stories. I had a little tea set too. Mine was a Holly Hobby. Do you remember Holly Hobby? Me too. 70s. Yes. So cute. I don't know where it is. I'm sad that I that I don't know where that is, but T-sets are the best. So you have these early memories of the impact of home and home, uh, hospitality, home and homemaking on you as a child growing up. So then how did that affect you when you became your own homemaker? Would you say that was when you married Ed? Was when that really started?

SPEAKER_01 15:16

Yeah, well, actually, um, homemaking became even more clarified. Uh, my senior year of high school, so grade 12, when we moved to Canada, um my mother, we had one car, and so my mother would drive my father to and from work each day. And while she would get him from work at the end of the day, I was in charge of making dinner. So the idea of putting together dinners every night, um, not every night, but the majority of them. Sure. And so that was you know the creation. And then in college, I lived in a Christian cooperative women's home and where everybody had duties. And we had duties growing up in my home. This was an extension of that. We cooked, we cleaned, we and we took care of things and managed a home. So I had great training along the way of all of those things, um, weaving gardens and just all of the things that it took to um, maybe not so much on the financial side of management of a home, but um certainly the day-to-day activities. So I was very grateful for that. Um and the other thing is that when as I grew up, if you came as a first time to our home as a guest, we treated you very much as a guest and and didn't ask anything of you, but it was kind of one of those things my mother said, next time you come, you get to help serve, you get to help clean up, you just become part of and so that idea that everybody's just incorporated here, that um not that they're not special, right, but it felt even more special to just kind of include you along with. So I would say that that was a big part. And then um early on, maybe my first year of college, um my mother and I attended at a church. There was a woman by the name of Karen Burton Maines. She had written a book, Open Heart, Open Home. I love that book. And that I would say, Allison, was spurred me on into all things hospitality and homemaking. It was like, oh, this was important to Jesus. Yes. And this is a Christ follower, it is important to me. And so I would say that that really was a pivot point for me.

SPEAKER_00 17:49

Oh, that's wonderful. That sounds like you had an amazing foundation. Um, and I do love that book. It's I I highly recommend listeners if you haven't heard of that one, go check that out. It's well worth your time. Um, okay, so that's a lot of influences on your homemaking right there. With, you know, your mom, um, that experience in college at the women's house, and then this book by Karen Maines. Was there anybody else that you wanted to mention as an influence on your homemaking?

SPEAKER_01 18:16

You know, just I I mean, I have a uh sister-in-love here in town, and she and I would um my brother's wife, and she and I would sit down and we'd read through, call through cookbooks, and you know, what are you making? And um she is hospitality extraordinaire. And um, so I learned, I've learned a lot from her, and there are so many people there. I have some dear friends that every time I walk into their home, it just feels like you're being hugged in a beautiful atmosphere. And things don't have to be um, they don't have to be some extravagant meal to feel extravagant to the soul. And I think those are the kinds of things

Homemaking Strengths, Weaknesses & Expectations

SPEAKER_01 19:00

that I have um experienced and and desired then to give to others.

SPEAKER_00 19:07

Yes. So what would you say is your greatest homemaking strength?

SPEAKER_01 19:12

Ooh, that I had good examples. I had people uh uh speak in and show me and invite me to come along with them in that. Um, and I have always been um sometimes to a fault and to my husband's chagrin at times, but I have always been very drawn to organization.

SPEAKER_03 19:34

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 19:35

And so for me, that helps a great deal. Um for me personally. Now there are what I would call organized messies, they know exactly where to go in their home to find things. Yes. And I'm an organized, organized, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:51

Yeah, you're yes. It's not organized chaos, it's organized order.

SPEAKER_01 19:55

Yes, yeah. Because I I just don't deal with a lot of things around me um well at any time. So um it doesn't bother me one bit to go into somebody else's home. And they, yeah, but in my home, it yeah, some people wonder when do you get the rest of your stuff out of storage?

SPEAKER_00 20:16

So would you consider yourself a minimalist?

SPEAKER_01 20:19

Uh uh no, only because I have people in my life that truly are minimalists and I am not that. And um so, no, I have a beautiful home and it's filled with many things and much more. And because you move, I have moved uh a good number of times, you tend to um really look at those things like do I want to do do I need this and then this this next chapter, this next season?

SPEAKER_00 20:52

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:53

And there was something when my husband and I moved internationally in 2012. I remember very distinctly. We were in, we were in the Midwest at the time. We have basements there, so lower below ground um level of our home. And we were on the floor sifting and sorting through boxes of stuff and all these Bible studies and women's things that I had done all these years, and even books of recipes that I just never tried, but thought, oh, that's cool. And the internet was a new, you know, was a thing. So I knew I could find a lot of that stuff. But we did something that I didn't even know was a term at the time, but the term now is Swedish death cleaning. And we did that. It was like if somebody, you know, if if something happens to us at some point and somebody else has got to go through this, why would we make them do that if we're not gonna use it again?

SPEAKER_00 21:47

So yes. That's funny. I think some of it comes with stage of life as well. You know, the older you get, the more you're willing to. Kind of let go of some things. Yes. Yes. Now I'm I'm definitely more of a maximalist and I do like my things and I use my things. I'm who I come to when I need something. That's right. I need a coffee pump pot. I bet Alison has one of those. Actually, I have two. Yes. Good to know. I probably do have it. Um, okay, what is your greatest homemaking weakness?

SPEAKER_01 22:28

If I am not careful, organization becomes king. And um that is so disrespectful uh to those that you invite into your home that you are wanting things to be just so.

SPEAKER_00 22:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:47

I can pull the Martha move in Luke uh in the Bible, in uh the book of Luke, chapter 10, is um we read of Jesus coming into the home of Mary and Martha. And while Mary was sitting at Jesus' feet and learning, and um, Martha was not doing a bad thing. Right. She was, but she was doing a different thing. And she was wanting her sister to do that different thing with her and wanting to take that away from her sister in order to accomplish what was really important to Martha. And so I can do that. I can pull a Martha move. And so that's probably my greatest weakness and something that the Lord just continues to work on in me is how can I express to the people that walk through my door or walk into my life, let them know they're more important than this thing or how this looks or whatever, whatever that is that is my distraction at that point.

SPEAKER_00 23:46

Yeah. Yeah, it's a good lesson. Or my phone. Or your phone. Oh my goodness, the phone. It is the dang phone. Oh, yeah. I'm I have a complicated relationship with my phone right now. All right. What surprised you most about homemaking? Good or bad? Just something that you did not expect.

SPEAKER_01 24:07

It takes a lot of time. Yes, it does. It takes effort. Uh, I'm still not good at this. My husband loves if I would uh write out a menu, not because we have to stick to that menu, but again, it's that we're purposing.

SPEAKER_00 24:23

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 24:24

It's just a level of care.

SPEAKER_00 24:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

And so in your homes, it's just like, what is it that is meaningful to the other person that you're living with or other people and how to lean into that? And because a menu's really never been a big deal to me, I don't do it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:41

But it's important to Ed.

SPEAKER_01 24:42

It yeah, but I still don't do it very well at all.

SPEAKER_00 24:45

Does it give him like a feeling of what to expect? Or so he knows like what not to eat for lunch?

SPEAKER_01 24:51

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 24:51

That's exactly it.

SPEAKER_01 24:52

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 24:53

Because we're having Mexican tonight, so don't eat Mexican for lunch.

SPEAKER_01 24:57

And so it, but it does. I mean, to being a homemaker, to be hospitable, to invite other people into your home and into your lives. It doesn't, hospitality doesn't have to be in your home.

SPEAKER_04 25:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:12

I mean, Jesus talked about hospitality more than a two dozen verses, but he never had a home that was his. And yet, hospitality and home was very important. So um, anyway.

SPEAKER_00 25:28

So not letting the organization overshadow things. Yes. And realizing that showing hospitality, we're going to talk more about hospitality in a minute, but that was one of my questions I used to ask everybody was how do you show hospitality to the people in your home? And that's a huge part of what we're doing in homemaking, is we are, like you said, um, oh, how did you just phrase that? I didn't write it down, but you said something about um, you know, for him, it's important to have a it it would matter to him to have a menu. And it was like an act of intention, or I forgot what you called it. Yeah. Um, an act of service, an act of love for that person that you're living with. And that takes time.

SPEAKER_01 26:09

It does. And effort. And effort to know what is meaningful and then to do something like that. And to actually do it.

SPEAKER_00 26:15

Yes. Especially if it's not in your nature. Right. Or it's not something that's a priority for you personally.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

And it's never been a thing. It's just uh, I know that. Why would I not want to lean into that just a little bit? Um and sometimes challenges in homemaking is, you know, you you live with other people.

unknown 26:37

Right.

SPEAKER_00 26:38

That is the number one challenge. And it's so easy to be a homemaker without all those other people.

SPEAKER_01 26:44

And they they live differently and they leave things in different places, or they they just manage things differently. And so learning how to do that collectively and well and communicate through that takes time. It takes time and it takes effort. So I would say those are kind of the the things that that surprised you. It did, it did, because you know, when you're solo and you're just doing it yourself. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:11

Um, yeah, it's it's a big difference, adding it is adding another person and then more and then more people.

SPEAKER_01 27:16

And yeah, and growing up, I knew what the expectations of my parents were. So I lived in those expectations as far as a home.

SPEAKER_00 27:23

But when you create your own, you're bringing somebody else who has a different background, right? Grew up with probably different expectations, and then you're now creating your new formula for your household. So, yes, it is complicated, and that takes time and effort. Um, okay, let's look at the next question. Um I'm gonna have you move just a little bit closer. There you go. What special challenges?

Homemaking Challenges

SPEAKER_00 27:48

Um, if any, I'm sure you have lots, because you've been married for 42 years. But if maybe you can think of one in particular that stands out a special challenge that you had to face in your homemaking journey. How did you work through that? And what did the Lord teach you and how did he grow you?

SPEAKER_01 28:06

That is a great question. And honestly, as I think about that, I I cannot recall any major challenge of any kind.

SPEAKER_03 28:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 28:14

What I can what I am thinking about is that there are different seasons of homemaking, and there are different cultures of homemaking. And what I mean by each of those is having young children in the home is a very different season. When Ed and I first married, we were part of a dinner for six club, and we would, you know, everybody would create these lavish to us at the time, meals. And um, we had a group of friends where the guys would cook a meal, and at the time the internet was not what it is now. And you go to the library and you check out all these cookbooks, and it's okay, this is gonna be Italian night. So the guys would make all things Italian, and next time the women would do it, and it would be all things French. And we had a great time doing that. Um, but when children came, your expectations just have to change. Um, and although those things have been fun and they will return at some point, perhaps, if that is still something that's important, um you then pivot and you start incorporating your kids and you make things simpler. And um honestly, I loved that season, if not even more. Um Ed grew up in a home where his mom invited him to come in and he was very interested in learning how to cook. So Ed and I, I mean, some some women that maybe or some people listening to this may feel like this is my nightmare, but for Ed and I, it works and has. I don't, I can't think of very many meals that we have not somehow prepared together. And certainly when we've been inviting people into our home, yeah, uh, we like to pray before people come into our home and we prepare meals together and have a lot of joy in doing that. So um, and as far as different cultures, just living in different places. I mean, the culture of Texas is far different than the culture of Michigan, although we're all part of the same country.

SPEAKER_00 30:30

Very different.

SPEAKER_01 30:31

Um, and uh, I remember one of our sons moved to um Wisconsin several years ago. And I remember he and my daughter-in-law talking about the casseroles of of the Midwest. Like, what's a casserole? And it used to be that everybody brought a chicken casserole or a lasagna or something uh to whatever potluck event. And so um, there are different cultures as well, and certainly living overseas for a while. I learned very early on that if somebody brought you a gift of food and it was in something that you would return, you know, a dish that you would return to them, never ever return an empty dish. Ever. In Canada, when I lived there, it may have been just that particular time. You didn't enter somebody's home without taking your shoes off.

SPEAKER_00 31:24

Oh, yeah. That's and I found that to be true in the Midwest, too.

SPEAKER_01 31:27

I did as well. And so I still have a propensity. We've only lived in Texas for five years. I still have a propensity to remove my shoes when I walk into somebody's home. So, and some people feel like that is utterly weird.

SPEAKER_00 31:44

Yeah, I think more and more people are getting to wear, even in the south here, you know, where take just for hygiene to take your shoes off before you the problem, and I would love to do that. The problem I have with it is um I can't walk barefoot in my house because it kills my back.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

Yeah. Well, I uh especially in the wintertime in the Midwest, and then can't I would always have a small pair of slip-on slippers and I would put those on. So as far as challenges, I would just say different seasons, different cultures. And then I do recall in college, I didn't have much um additional resource. Um, I was working a couple of different jobs, um, putting going to school and paying for school for university. But I always wanted something, some way to um be able to express hospitality to other people. And so I know that that wasn't necessarily homemaking, but again, living in kind of a cooperative um uh lifestyle. There is a verse out of um 1 Timothy that was very important and I it has stuck with me. It is 1 Timothy 6, 6 and 7. It says, But godliness with contentment is great gain. We brought nothing into the world, we can take nothing out of it. But if we have food and clothing, we will be content with that. So that was my challenge for hospitality is with the food that I have, what can I do with it? So even as a college student, even as a college kid.

SPEAKER_00 33:23

That's great, which leads us very nicely into our um next section. Hospitality and personal growth.

Hospitality & Inviting Kids Into Homemaking

SPEAKER_00 33:31

Um, before we get to the hospitality, and this might be part of the um answer to this next question. How did you invite your kids to participate in homemaking with you? And you had sons, you have sons. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 33:44

And because I saw such a great example in Ed and his mom inviting him into the kitchen. And even when he went away to college, she bought him uh a cookbook. Oh, just a small one, yeah, kind of survival skill stuff. And he he used it, yeah. Like he made, I think, probably all the recipes in it. Um and so we wanted to do that with our sons too. And Ed for Christmas one year had purchased this beautiful set. It was the blue Le Crusade uh cookware, and I was just thrilled and I started using it, but my kids were toddlers, and I wanted them to be able to help cook. They could not lift the pots. They couldn't pick them up, yeah. Couldn't pick them up. We sold them, found somebody else that equally loved them, and bought a much lighter set of um pots and pans, and um they had a step stool and they had their own apron and they they cooked alongside of me. Um, so when we had guests come, um they knew that that was really important. We we hosted weekly uh Bible studies in our home. Uh so they were very accustomed to people coming and going from our home on a pretty scheduled basis, um, but pretty regularly. And so I have to say, I mean, it's and to to their credit, to my son's credit, and to their our daughter-in-love's credit, their brides, each of our sons in their own homes, I mean, they extend hospitality and I learn much from them as well. Um, and it's really become very much a way of life for them, which is incredibly beautiful to see.

SPEAKER_00 35:39

Yeah. Yeah, I love that. It's a service also to their when you're teaching them their future wives, but now they're they're actual wives because they're married. But like you have done your daughters in love a great service by having trained your sons how to cook.

SPEAKER_01 35:57

And well, and they in their own right, these women, are they remarkable. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:03

That's a blessing. So, what's a practical way that you showed hospitality in your homemaking or still do?

SPEAKER_01 36:11

Um in our very first home, I I don't remember having a space in our homes growing up necessarily, but in uh grow in our very first home, Ed went into the basement and built me a small pantry. And it was important to me to always have a few staples in our home. That if somebody unexpectedly was coming to dinner or coming for the weekend, or not the weekend, but necessarily, but that would require a little bit more planning. But just that I would be prepared to put something together and not run out of whatever. Yeah. Not that I never have run out of something, but that has been a pattern our whole married life. And I would say that that's just a really practical way. And it was not very big at all. I mean, now there are walk-in pantries and all this other stuff, but this was a small little three-shelf uh area, but it was adequate. So that's probably one thing. Um another practical thing is when, and we don't do this all the time by any means, but our practice typically is we try to pray before if we have people that we know are coming. Just and Ed laughs at me, but I pray that the food would taste especially good. Because honestly, sometimes I don't know after I've prepared something. Yeah. Oh it's really gonna be. Not really sure how this is gonna go. And just um, yeah, so we pray for our time that we're gonna spend with those people. So I would think those are just two very small little practical things.

SPEAKER_00 38:00

Those are great suggestions.

SPEAKER_01 38:03

I always wanted one space in our home to be absolutely picked up so that if somebody dropped by unexpectedly, there was a place to sit and have a cup of coffee.

SPEAKER_00 38:15

That's that is very good practice, absolutely. Um I love the praying before the guests come. I wrote that down when you said that earlier that you that you will prepare the meal together and you will pray together before the guests come over. That's a wonderful practice. Um, and then this basement pantry is a great idea. I have a secondary pantry also, because that's mine, and it's pretty, it's not, it's you can technically walk in it, but it's not like a giant walk-in pantry. So I turned there's a closet in the laundry room that I turned into my second pantry. Um, that was actually a COVID project when we all were like, are we gonna even be able to buy more food six months from now? Um so I'm curious to know though, what is kind of your standard thing to stock to always be ready for a guest?

SPEAKER_01 39:04

Oh gosh. I mean, really simple things. Always have uh beans and some diced tomatoes to make up um soups or chilies or something like that that can easily and have some either frozen ground turkey or ground beef or something in the freezer so that you know, within an hour I can have something that's nutritious. It doesn't have to be, I love a meal of soup and bread. And um, when I was in college, uh my my parents, my younger sister and I came uh to uh Texas and we went to a one of the most beautiful homes I'd ever been in, and it was Christmas Eve, and uh we were invited to come for dinner and we went into that home and I had no idea what to expect, but we sat down and it was absolutely delicious, but it it it was two soups and two different kinds of breads, and it was served on beautiful, you know, just it could have been served on paper plates. This wasn't, but all I'm saying is that any it doesn't have to be cordon bleu.

SPEAKER_00 40:18

Yeah, it just yeah, doesn't have to be fancy. Does not have to be fancy.

SPEAKER_01 40:23

So yeah. Um, and then if I I also we make our own pizza, and so I always like to have um, especially if there are kids coming, and um I try to have these days uh there are a lot more people that are gluten-free, so I always have some of the um the gluten exactly, exactly in the freezer so that we've got that as an option. So I don't keep a lot of things, but just a few.

SPEAKER_00 40:49

Just a few, yeah. Yeah, so a few standbys. Uh I mean I we I've talked about this before that it's always good to have. This is why I ask about the signature dish. You know, it's good to have like a signature dish in your back pocket that somebody's have had a baby and needs a meal. You can pull that out and do that almost with your eyes closed, or last minute guests almost with your eyes closed. And I would say if that's your signature dish that you know is gonna go well, yes, try to always have the ingredients for that.

SPEAKER_01 41:16

Right. And our signature dishes at our home are uh a honey glaze grilled chicken. We um have a coffee cake recipe and banana bread. And I almost always have a loaf of the banana bread in the freezer. In the freezer, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:30

Okay, um I want to hear more about the signature dish later. But let's no, that's fine. Let's finish um our section here. Okay, priorities. I want to talk

Priorities

SPEAKER_00 41:40

about priorities. How do you set your priorities and keep them in order?

SPEAKER_01 41:46

Early in our marriage, when we uh after we had uh the two young when our sons were young, um, we had let our calendars get way out of whack. We were super involved in a lot of things, and there was a period of two weeks, and I think we had been home that as a family of four at our table, dinner table, um, maybe three of those nights together. Wow. And Ed and I just did a hard pivot. And um we let people know that we were going to disengage from some of those things. And we gave, we agreed on how many times that was gonna, how many times and evenings we were gonna be out each week, what those commitments looked like. And we didn't commit to anything without talking to each other. Now that doesn't work for everybody, and I understand that for us and for our marriage, we did that. And every Sunday evening, Ed and I, and as the as our sons grew older, um, all four of us would sit down on Sunday afternoons or evenings and we'd go through our calendar for the week. And we would just say who's got what going on, who's going where, who needs to get what, what do we need to prepare for the week. Um so that that was a game changer for us um to communicate um and to also not try to overcommit.

SPEAKER_00 43:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:13

Um yeah, it was a pretty, I mean, ruthless elimination. And it left some people not happy about that.

SPEAKER_00 43:22

But well, yes.

SPEAKER_01 43:24

It was life-giving eventually.

SPEAKER_00 43:26

Yes, yes, exactly. What's that saying? You can please some of the people all the time, but you can't please all the people all the time. No, you can please some of the people some of the time, but you can't please all the people all the time.

SPEAKER_01 43:39

Is that how it goes? I think we're close enough to get the idea.

SPEAKER_00 43:43

Somebody is always going to be upset about the decisions that you make. But for the health of your family and your marriage and your home, you have to make those hard pivots sometimes. Yeah. Um, so thank you for sharing that. Might be just what somebody out there needs to hear. So, what does homemaking look like in the season that you're in right now? How are you still challenging yourself to grow and learn as a homemaker?

SPEAKER_01 44:07

It's a very different season for us. Uh, we travel quite a bit. Both of our sons and their families uh live out of state. Um and so it is a it's a very different season for us. And we go to them um most often. And so sometimes homemaking looks like, how can I help them?

SPEAKER_03 44:29

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 44:30

Um, I try not to assume what they want or need, but if they have an expression of, hey, if you could go to the grocery store, if you could do a load of laundry, if you could run the vacuum, or if you could just whatever. Um, that is a different extension.

SPEAKER_00 44:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:45

Um, and gives me as a mom great, great joy. Um, one of our sons and his family would just move from California to the Chicago area, and we just had a joy, uh we had a wonderful Christmas together, all together in their brand new home. And then a couple weeks later, Ed and I were able to go back and just do some home projects together, shoulder to shoulder, hand to hand. And that's it's helping them create their home. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:13

So it's more like you're helping facilitate somebody else's homemaking.

SPEAKER_01 45:18

Yes. Um, for here, for us, for now, when we are home, I really enjoy having people around a table. It is fine. And by and large, it seems like more often than not, when people get together or invite, oftentimes it's we're going to a restaurant, and there's nothing wrong with that. And it can be delicious and wonderful, and it's absolutely the season that you're in. To me, there is something very sacred about setting at a table, someone's table, and I I love it when it's in our home, around our table. Um, earlier in February, we had 12 of us sitting around our crammed around our table intended for eight or ten, um, and just sharing stories and life and nobody was hurried. And um it those are the things that give me great, great joy when I get to hear the stories of others and when friends are still willing to listen to mine, probably for the tenth time.

SPEAKER_00 46:26

Yes, yes. I love I love an unhurried dinner and it's rare. It's it is rare if you're and I think that's I think that's what the thing about going to a restaurant, that's fine, but it's not the same in the sense that you can't just typically and and a lot of this is cultural because I know they they do do this in European countries. Just languish around the table as long as you want, you know, but not in not in America. You feel the need to get in there, eat your meal, and get out and free that table up for the next person. Um, that's just how we roll here, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_01 47:02

But even take out in your home. In your home, just I mean that's a good compromise. Yeah, it does not have to be again, just you start small and you just do something or invite people over for uh a cup of coffee or a glass of wine or a dessert. I mean the people are the point.

SPEAKER_00 47:21

The people are the point, and the the providing an opportunity to have unhurried fellowship. I love that you use that word because that is what's missing in a lot of our fellowship right now. Even when we get together as a church, you know, even as a small group, we are by design of the way that it's it that we have to structure it because we have young families and and we don't want to not meet. So we have some strict parameters around how we meet, but we tend to be a bit hurried just because of that. So it's really a gift to people, I think, to provide an opportunity for unhurried fellowship.

SPEAKER_01 47:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:59

And you have to set the tone as the hostess for that by not being obsessed about the organization of things or how things look or anything like that, and be willing to be inconvenienced. Yep. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 48:13

And our sons were so amazingly good. They knew that on Wednesday nights at seven o'clock, they didn't have to go to sleep, but they were needed to be in their rooms and they got to have, you know, special books that they didn't have the rest of the week or some something that wasn't a um it wasn't a punishment to them.

SPEAKER_04 48:33

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 48:34

And we just found out a few um a couple of years ago that at least one of our sons would crawl out into the hallway and listen. And listen to your small.

SPEAKER_00 48:43

So this is when your small group would meet.

SPEAKER_01 48:45

Yes, during our Bible study. Okay. And we learned so much. That's awesome. That's awesome. But I had no idea because he would just crawl out and lay on the floor. Oh gosh, I love that image.

SPEAKER_00 48:58

That's just beautiful. I love that so much. All right, let's I'm gonna get to my next page here. Oh, okay.

Rapid Fire Q&A

SPEAKER_00 49:06

Rapid fire. We're gonna ask um some questions here. And I you could tell me a story if you want, or you can just give me a short answer if you don't want to share the gory details. It's up to you. Could be ugly. Okay, tell me about a memorable homemaking fail.

SPEAKER_01 49:23

Um, this one very clearly. Uh, first time I tried to make yeast rolls for Ed. Okay. Um, they were, let's just say that we literally put them on the floor and used them as hockey butts.

SPEAKER_00 49:36

So we laughed, but they were horrible. Oh gosh, that's bad. That's bad. Um have you since redeemed yourself? Can you make a yeast roll now?

SPEAKER_01 49:45

That's I can make a yeast roll, but there is something about the way my mother, she makes these little um she takes three smaller balls and the clover leaf. Yes, yes. So she makes those and she gets them so smooth. And I've sat with her for hours trying to do these things. I'm like, I my fingers don't do whatever she makes. Don't have the magic touch. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 50:08

A memori uh, a memorial, a memorable homemaking achievement.

SPEAKER_01 50:12

I would say what comes to mind for that is not so much an achievement that is a reflection of my achievement, but what the Lord gifted to us. So um, in one of the homes, because we have moved quite a bit. Um, I'm the gal you want to call as you're moving into town or you're moving out of town because I've got this down. Okay. And we had a couple, uh, we lived in uh Michigan in uh a town that was the global headquarters for the company that my husband worked for. And so it was not unusual to have international um families move in and out. And we had this one Chinese couple move just two doors from us, and so went down, introduced ourselves, and but we wanted to get to know them just a little bit more, and we invited them to come to our home for dessert. And I don't recall exactly who said what, but we realized that it would be more comfortable to them if um she could make a pot of tea and I would bring the dessert to their home. I think they had a young child.

SPEAKER_00 51:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 51:23

So we did that, and Allison it was um it was humbling. It was uh it was they had this beautiful home. This gentleman was highly achieved in his work and he spoke English well. His wife uh struggled with English, and so she did not feel like she could go out of the home very much. And so she felt very isolated with this little one. This woman had been a judge in China. This woman was brilliant. She just and she spoke some English. She and I communicated just fine, yeah, but she did not have the confidence to go walk out of her door. Wow. And and be part of any of the women's groups that were available for international for any of that. And um, I took a cake that evening and she paid me probably the highest compliment. She she said, Kathleen, will you come back to my home next week and teach me to make cake? Oh because it was something she had never tasted.

SPEAKER_04 52:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:34

And um, for her, it was it was quite sweet. Um, and she she's like, This is something that you do here. So come back and teach me. And so I would say for me, that was a huge gift. So achievement, it was not what I did. It's what she did. On the flip side, in my own home, I would say when I have a gathering, what I typically will do is I will lay out all the dishes, I will lay out all the serviceware that I need on the bar where I'm gonna serve. I typically do buffet style. I just that just works better for most all the time when we have people come. And so I will take my little sticky notes. Thank you, 3M, and I will write down all around, you know, what goes where so that I because I want to know that I'm not forgetting the mashed potatoes in the oven or something. Yes. Um, there was a 4th of July gathering, and we were gonna have about 20 people at our home, and most of it was our extended family. And one of our family members coming into town was in a car accident. And so I needed to leave our home. And I just looked at my niece and I said, Here you go. And I walked back in like an hour later. Everything was out, everything was done. And I said, Oh my goodness. And she said, You had it all labeled. She said, I knew what to do. Yes. So I was grateful for that. Absolutely, absolutely. So it wasn't my achievement, it was her just fleshing it out in my home.

SPEAKER_00 54:12

Listen, though, that is such a good illustration, Kathleen, of really how we're supposed to do things. Like, approach whatever you do in your home as if you had to go into the hospital tomorrow. Could somebody else step in? You know, on the both on the side of being thoughtful and organized, right? Having the post-it notes and having a plan, but then also like being open-handed about it.

SPEAKER_01 54:41

Oh, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 54:42

Like, so there's a purposefulness, a purposefulness in thinking through and being strategic and like, okay, I do have a plan and I'm going to help my future self by putting these sticky notes out, but I'm also helping anybody else that wants to come in and help, whether I need to leave the house or not. You know, because I've done that before. And it's really helpful when mom comes in or one of my daughters-in-law comes in and says, How can I help? What can I do? And I'd be like, Here you go. Like, if I've already laid out everything that goes into the pecan pie, I can just say, There's the pecan pie stuff, it's all yours, you know, and that sort of thing.

SPEAKER_01 55:19

I think that is one of the best things that we can do. I've got a couple of friends that they really don't want anybody else working in their kitchen. Exactly. And that I just I don't agree with that. But but and for them, that works for their kitchen. And so I respect that. In my own kitchen, if I there are some things that I still feel like, oh, I want to be able to be the one doing this. But if you can just have those things that are set aside, rarely is a person come into your home and want to just watch you. Oh, very rarely. Yeah. Sometimes, yes, especially if you're tired and hungry and you just want to sit, that's fine. But oftentimes people just want to be invited in and along.

SPEAKER_00 56:00

Absolutely. Absolutely. Okay, so we just gave them a good tip, but another, what is your favorite homemaking hacker tip?

SPEAKER_01 56:07

Oh, um, it's not a hack, it's not a tip, but I do feel very, very strongly about praying before people come into my home. Okay. Um, because it's it's it's a reset for me that this is not a show. It's an extension of our home and that I desire it to be a lighthouse and a haven. And sometimes it's not. And sometimes I need those five seconds, literally, sometimes just five seconds to say. And sometimes some people that come into our home are those MGRs, the more grace required people, that the people that you know are in your life, and and you just you need to extend a hand of hospitality and be mentally, emotionally, spiritually prepared for hard sometimes. Um Absolutely good as far as other just like little tips and that kind of stuff. I for me personally, um, I love just having even even if it's just one fresh flower if or or some boxwood off of just anything living. Fresh. Yeah, something fresh and living that's either on the table or in the bathroom or somewhere. Um that just for me, I it elevates my spirits.

SPEAKER_00 57:30

So absolutely. Elevates your environment, it elevates your spirit. I totally agree. Yeah. Uh okay, a homemaking tool or product that you cannot live without.

SPEAKER_01 57:42

My coffee maker. Wooden spoon.

SPEAKER_00 57:48

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 57:51

A good skillet. Um and for cleaning, oxyclean.

SPEAKER_00 57:59

OxyClean is the best. Do you clean do you use it on anything besides laundry?

SPEAKER_01 58:05

Um, I can make a paste out of it and use it some others on some other things too.

SPEAKER_00 58:09

And like a tubstain on a counter or something.

SPEAKER_01 58:12

Or in a carpeting. I mean, I don't even know if you're supposed to, so I don't know, people read the label, but yes, use at your own discretion and risk. But OxyClean has been uh been a champ in our homes.

SPEAKER_00 58:23

I find that adding it to the wash here, um, I have like a whole formula worked out at this point that I think is where I'm sticking because our water is so hard and mineral, it's got a lot of minerals in it. And and we have a water softener, but it's still really tough on on fabrics. Yeah. Um, so I always I use Tide. Um, and I went to start, I started using powder because it's better for it, just it's more abrasive, it's better at cleaning. It just gets the stuff off better. Um, combined with oxyclean. Because I can't use bleach because I have a an aerobic septic system.

SPEAKER_02 59:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:04

Um, and then occasionally I'll use a little bit of bleach, but don't tell anybody. And then water softener. I put in like old Calgon. Yes, yes. Calgon, you know, I have to go to there's only one place I can find it in town. It's in Walmart. And they usually only have one bottle of it. So I take the one.

SPEAKER_01 59:22

The Calgon is gone.

SPEAKER_00 59:24

Yes. Um, okay. So any other tools you can't live without?

SPEAKER_01 59:28

Not this, it's not a separate tool. It's just um if, and maybe it goes to the hack too, but um I always like to have just a stainless um a spoon or something, especially if I'm preparing onions. Um, if you have uh that onion smell in your hand, you can, and if you've got a stainless sink, it works fairly well as well. But if you just rub your hands against stainless, they have these little discs that are stainless discs that you can buy, you know, on Amazon or whatever, and you just rub your hands over stainless and it eliminates that really that onion smell.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:03

Yeah. I have never heard that before. Oh, yeah. That is a great tip. Just anything stainless, really. Yeah, it really, yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:12

And so I just have a spoon or something like that. Um, and like I said, they make these fancy little ones. Yeah, you don't need a special tool.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:20

Okay, I'm gonna try that next time I cut onions. That's a great tip. Okay, now tell me about your signature dish. Signature dish.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:28

Uh, and always want to make sure to have the the products on hand because um I there's a honey glaze grilled chicken.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:36

That sounds amazing.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:37

Um, you it takes it doesn't take time really to prepare, other than you dump all this stuff together and let it marinate. So you need a few hours. What's yeah, what's the minimum? Uh probably three hours. You want it to marinate some, and then you've got a honey glaze that you put over top of it. Um, a coffee cake, a coffee cake recipe that I've got. Um, when Ed and I first started dating, he was went to the union at our university and he got this coffee cake, and he really liked this coffee cake. And I tasted it and I was like, yeah, that's not the same coffee cake recipe I've got. So I went on a mission. I wanted to win this man. And I found it in a 4-H cookbook, and it's a sour cream coffee cake. And so it has become, I mean, we've used it for birthday cakes, we've used it for breakfast. I mean, it's kind of an any-time cinnamon coffee cake. And then banana bread always. And uh in that same 4-H cookbook, um, it had the banana recipe, banana bread recipe that, yes, that um, so those are kind of those are your signatures.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:44

Okay. And I'm assuming you're you're gonna share those recipes for you. I'm happy to. Okay. Yeah. All right, we'll make sure we get those and we will link them in the show notes.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:52

Perfect.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:53

Okay, let's

The Art of Home & Titus 2 Wisdom

SPEAKER_00 1:01:54

talk about the art of home. How do you see homemaking as an art and where do you find beauty in it?

SPEAKER_01 1:02:03

To me, the art is the people and the people living in that home and what and how that home is reflecting who they are and their values. And for myself, for my husband, for our family, we're Christ followers, and we uh certainly have much to change in our lives, but our desire, our intention is to be a reflection of who Christ is. And Christ invited other people to come with him and to come along with him. And uh there is another book uh that was very challenging, and I'm certainly not at this level. Uh Rosaria Butterfield wrote a book several years ago called The Gospel Comes with a House Key. I believe that's the title. Very challenging in how she just opens her heart, her home, their lives. Um I have always, there's a verse in the book of Acts in the Bible that talks about God knowing the exact times and places that you live. And I take a great deal of comfort in believing that God knows exactly where I am. And He has placed me among the people that He wants me to know.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:29

And um there every story is unique. Some people don't really want anybody, any neighbors intruding in their lives, and you respect that. And there are other people. I met a neighbor for the first time. We've lived in our home now for four years, and I at Christmas time just delivered some banana bread to those closest around us, and um, she became tearful. And she said, Life is really hard. And so she and I will be getting together for coffee soon. And you don't know anybody else's story.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:03

And so the art of homemaking for me is using your home to um create a place that is beautiful for you. It doesn't have to be extravagant, but beautiful for you, that you are comfortable in and your family's comfortable in, and that you can invite others into. Um not that there aren't boundaries around all of that or anything like that, but um I just yeah, that it would be a reflection. I have a few close friends that I sense a welcome and a beauty every time I enter their home. And I just want to sit and just want to enjoy that. And I would love for people to feel that way. And when I said before that my challenge is not to become too busy or too organized, that means you just have to stop. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:58

So you said something at the beginning that I I don't think anybody has ever said this before. Um, not in this way. I think it's always inferred, but I like you said the people are the art. And the home reflects who they are. And that just really beautifully sums up, excuse me, what our purpose is as homemakers. The home is a tool. Like I said before, the people are the point. That's always the message here. You know, we are not um creating a space to show off. We're not creating a space for, you know, just ourselves alone or whatever. We are creating a space for people to belong. We are cultivating uh a place for people to belong. And we are cultivating a place for people to flourish and become the masterwork that God is making them to be. They are the artwork. And it reminded me of the verse where it says, You are God's. Workmanship created in Christ Jesus to do good works. Yeah. And he's prepared. He's yeah. So thinking about that we get to come alongside the Lord and work with him in creative and artistic ways through the act of making space for people, like we said at the very beginning, noticing what's important to them and taking all the extra time that it takes to notice and then to and then to implement. All of that goes towards helping um further the workmanship that God is crafting in that person's life, the piece of art that He is making that person out to be. So I just really love that take on that. So sharing, thank you for sharing that. Absolutely. Um, what is one thing about homemaking that you're thankful for?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:50

Goodness. It has changed my life. Um because we have moved, uh, I tell people, um, I love change, but people in my life are like I I'm Velcro. I kind of let people know I'm kind of like Velcro. So the number of people that have sat in our den or at our kitchen table or out on a patio, um every life is such a unique story. And I love hearing people's stories. And sometimes you just have to give people a time and a place and a space to to do that.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:40

And um to be able to be part of creating that with and for somebody uh is wonderful. And I'm not so outward focused that I'm I've also done that sometimes at the expense of our own family. And so I do want to have that little caveat, just one very brief story. Um, when I didn't get the art of homemaking well, and I changed something because of it. Uh, one of our sons were in junior high, I believe, at the time. And again, we hosted small group Bible studies and had people in our home weekly. And, you know, oftentimes I would just prepare a dessert and sometimes other people would bring them. But when I prepared them, you know, we would have our dinner, and I never served that dessert to my family because it had to, you know, it had to be whole, had to look good. Yeah. And for the very first time, and I never even thought about that until one of our sons said, Mom, are is the group more important? And I said, you know what? It's not more important that it looks whole. Help yourself. And from that day forward, it was like, it's not about the way, and I understand we want things to look beautiful. And, you know, you don't want your, you don't want other people walking in while you're trying to put to the chakuterie board and deconstructing it as you're trying to put it together. I get all of that. But there is a message sometimes that I can subtly send to those that I live with that this event, these people are somehow more important. Sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:20

So yeah, I think it's a fine balance. It's a fine balance between making your guests feel special.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:26

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:26

Um, and not ostracizing your family in the process.

unknown 1:09:32

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:33

So I don't know if that answered your question.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:35

Absolutely. Absolutely. Good answer. All right. Let's give a little tidus to advice here. So, what is a word of advice or encouragement or even warning that you would give to the younger homemakers who are coming behind you?

SPEAKER_01 1:09:52

Um, I would say remember that you are uniquely created. And quit comparing yourself to someone else. Um, you will always have somebody that does something differently, better, worse, whatever. Comparison is a killer.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:10

Um, so know that you're uniquely created. And because of that, you can be an extension of that to other people and invite them into your home and into your lives. Um, as I mentioned before, Jesus invited people to come along. And honestly, you know, I was talking to a woman uh probably a year ago, and she said, Oh, you know, I've got to fold laundry and um and I'll make us grilled cheese for lunch, but maybe you can help me fold laundry too. I mean, she just invited in. It was like, this is my life right now. Yeah. So don't try to have things look perfectly. Just um, so that would be one thing. Okay. The other thing I think I would say is, and this is very difficult, especially for many, many women in this in a different seasons of life. You have to be so intentional about creating some kind of a margin in your life so that you can enjoy, and it's not just becoming one more task that you can check off a list. I've been there, I've done that, I can still be there, I can still do that. But so I'm saying that to myself as well. Um so yeah, I think embrace your creativity and your uniqueness and just um have to try and really be intentional of creating some margin.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:40

Yes. I think this theme of sort of making space, being unhurried, taking time to notice. I've seen that, I've seen this weave throughout our conversation. I'm a big proponent of margin, almost to a fault sometimes. I can I can be very like obsessively protective of margin. Um, I have some people in my life who push me on that. So that's helpful. Um, but it's because I burnt out so epically um in the past with no margin. I don't ever want to be in that place again. So I'm a big proponent of that, but not just for the sake. This is where I get in trouble, not just for the sake of I gotta protect my margin, I gotta protect my margin, you know, for my own mental sanity, but for the sake of what we've been talking about, being unhurried with people, being unhurried in your experience of raising your children and doing their laundry and keeping, taking care of your home. I I don't think you can ever truly, it's already a challenge to find the joy in the mundane and repetitive tasks of homemaking. Don't make it doubly challenging by giving yourself zero margin and you have to just rush, rush, rush, rush, rush through every activity because you don't have time to find the joy.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:59

And I think it's really important to, at least from my perspective, and everybody can have a different opinion on this, but I think it's very important practice to have your children as they grow up have them um, whatever is age appropriate for them, participate in your home. Yes. If they can fold on, I mean, our kids learned we played ghish with our socks because you know, they learned to do laundry at a young age. Yeah. And they they learned to do different household tasks. They made their beds. They um not because it was absolutely essential, it was just part of the order of our day. And so sometimes moms feel like they have to do all of that until they leave the kids leave for college, and then they're ill-equipped. Yes, you're doing them a disservice.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:53

So, anyway, um the people are the point. Yes. The people are the point, and and that shows up in many different ways in homemaking. And I have so enjoyed hearing this conversation. I learned new things about you, even though I've known you for several years now. Um, this was delightful. So thank you, Alison. Yeah, thanks for taking the time to think and have thoughtful answers and giving me these the a couple hours here. So I really appreciate it. My joy. Thank you for listening to this homemaker portrait of Kathleena Brule. I pray it has been encouraging, inspiring, and time well spent for you. Did you pick up on that unhurried theme? How well are you setting an unhurried tone in your homemaking and hospitality? Let's make the emoji for this episode a sloth to remind us to slow down, especially in the presence of others. Drop a sloth in the Spotify comments or an email or a text message and tell us something that you practice or aspire to practice in order to maintain margin and keep an unhurried atmosphere in your home. I can't wait to hear from you. If you have found value in today's episode, please like, follow, comment, and share this episode to help the Art of Home reach more and more homemakers all over the world. And if you are so moved, you can support this ministry through Buy Me a Coffee. Support links are down in the description box. Info on products, books, resources, and Kathleen's signature dish will be in the extended show notes on the blog. Thank you again to Kathleena for adding her story of home to our ever-growing catalog. There are dozens and dozens of other homemaker portraits in our back catalog, so be sure to check them out if you love this content. That's all for this episode. I will be back on Monday with some new spring cleaning motivation and next Wednesday with a brand new homemaker portrait. Until then, keep practicing your art of making a home.