Marley Morgan - First Nations storytelling through photography

In this episode, Caroline is joined by the widely published photographer and storyteller Marley Morgan. A proud Wiradjuri woman born on Gumbaynggirr Land, Marley’s incredible portrayal of Aboriginal culture, stories, and women has taken her across so-called Australia. Her work has been featured in publications like Vogue and Marie Claire, where she shares awe-inspiring stories and imagery of Aboriginal women, deeply connected to Country and Culture

Caroline and Marley yarn about Marley’s career and her drive to capture authentic, intimate, and unforgettable moments for Aboriginal women, as well as her work supporting Blak owned businesses. They chat about the current state of Aboriginal representation in the media, and how to be authentic storytellers in a modern world. They also dive into topics like giving back to the community, managing the stresses of a work-life balance, and being supported by your mob. Lastly, Marley shares how she overcame her own self-doubts and anxietyabout her art, and was able to stay true to herself and her vision through the pressures of the photography industry.

To learn more about Marley Morgan and her work, follow her on Instagram @marleymorganphotography and visit her website here. If you enjoyed this episode, please leave a review and don’t forget to follow the show! 

Follow Caroline on Instagram @blak_wattle_coaching and learn more about working with Caroline here! 

We would like to acknowledge Aboriginal people as Australia’s First Peoples’ who have never ceded their sovereignty. We acknowledge the Wurundjeri/Woiwurrung people of the Kulin Nation where the podcast was taped. We pay our deepest respects to Traditional Owners across Australia and Elders past, present and emerging.

This podcast was brought to you by On Track Studio.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Podcast. Unite our voices.

SPEAKER_00 0:03

This podcast is brought to you by On-Track Studio. Welcome to Yarning Up, a podcast that showcases stories of First Nations excellence. To help us learn and unlearn Australia's history to work towards a better future. I'm your host, Proud Barbara Woman and founder of Blackwater Coaching and Consulting, Caroline Cowell. This podcast was taped on the sacred, stolen, and unceded Aboriginal lands of the Wurundjeri people of the Cullen nation. I pay my deepest respects to them, my elders, your elders, and all owners of country of this beautiful place that we call home.

SPEAKER_01 1:21

Thank you so much for having me. I'm such a fan of yourself, also, and I've felt really honored when you asked me to join. So thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_00 1:32

Oh, thank you. Marley has been doing some amazing work, you know, a visual storyteller, a photographer, a mum of three little jar gems, uh community warrior and woman, someone who's fiercely strong in advocating for mobs as well. So it's the honour and privilege is so reciprocal. But as we do on this show, I'd like to start by formally handing over to you to introduce yourself and your mob. And yeah, just tell us a little bit about yourself, sis. So my name is Marley Morgan.

SPEAKER_01 2:07

I'm a photographer and as you mentioned, a mum of three boys. He's just name as Marley Morgan Photography. I've also in I guess the works of starting a mentoring program for young indigenous women called Shadow Sisters that live in regional, rural, or remote. I am Gamilla and Rodri, and I grew up in a small opal mining town called Lightning Ridge on ULRO country. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 2:34

Oh my goodness. Three boys' businesses and mentoring programs. It's so amazing how our mob can just, you know, continually dig deep into giving back to families and communities and never never ceases to amaze or inspire me what our people can do, especially our sisters.

SPEAKER_01 2:53

So yeah, in that respect. Thank you. Like I think we as Blackfellas, it's just in our nature to give back. We are sharers, we're not greedy people. So I think like when we are running businesses and being parents, it just comes natural to want to, when we have the right means, to start giving back to community because it's just who we are as people and how we've been raised.

SPEAKER_00 3:15

So true, isn't it? Like that responsibility, you know, when we get an opportunity to not only be able to help our families, but really help the next gen and our younger ones coming up. Well, uh, you know, you have shot some incredible, incredible photos, you know. The thing that has really drawn me to your work is I think the way that you I'm getting goosebumps. Ah, ancestors. Just the way that you are able to portray the beauty of black women, the the women, the matriarchy, the way that we see them in our in their in our softness, in our realness, in our beauty. They're so earthy and so raw. I mean, you've shot for places like Vogue a couple of times, I see, you know, Mari Claire to name a few. But I'm just wondering, you know, what inspired you to pick up the camera and start capturing these beautiful moments?

SPEAKER_01 4:15

I just look back when I was younger, like there was no true representation of the women that I was seeing in my community. Like, you've just got to look at with mainstream Australian media that how black women are portrayed, we're portrayed as being violent or drunk. Like, and I I growing up, I'd never seen that. I was always surrounded by beautiful, staunch black women who really just held our communities together, and they're the women that inspire me, and they still do. They were not like what the media had portrayed them at all. Like I and I feel immensely grateful to be raised by such incredible black women like my aunties, cousins, and the black women in my community. And I really wanted to through photography portray how I see black women as we are, you know, we're connected, we're strong, but we also carry such strength but also softness. And for me, it's just how I really see you know mob and through my own lens. And I really like through my photography, I also wanted to really change that stereotype of Aboriginal women. We are just incredibly beautiful, and even like if you look back at the stereotypes that they say were ugly or that old gam and saying, you know, like oh, you're too pretty to be Aboriginal. Like, I really wanted to change that because I think every black woman is absolutely magnificent, like chef's kiss.

SPEAKER_00 5:50

Yeah, gosh, and you really are helping to change the narrative of how people perceive us because you're so right. Like, we firstly have not been really represented on a main global stage, and whenever I think of like our black women and and my aunties, my cousins, my my friends, my sisters, there is this beauty and and realness that comes with with you know being a black woman, being a sovereign, sacred woman. Like our women have been here for longer than modern governments, longer than you know, we can we can you know even conceptualize. So you really are helping to change the way that Australia, so-called Australia, views us by by showing us in all of our facets and that, yeah, we are strong, but we are soft and beautiful and loving and generous. So yeah, it's really, really special what you're doing, sis.

SPEAKER_01 6:48

Because like I, at the end of the day, I, you know, I look back when I was younger and I seen those stereotypes. And even like there was a moment when I was pregnant with my secondborn, and I was in the doctor's waiting room, and I just seen all these posters of like, you know, pregnant women like quit smoking, this and that. And I was like, well, is this really how they view us? Like, none of these posters or pictures I had seen really was showing anything that reflected how I'd grown up or like the incredible black women that I knew. So that there also was like another kind of turning point because I do I I love to photograph black motherhood. And that was another inspiration, really, like that pushed me that little bit step further to really want to change the narrative.

SPEAKER_00 7:39

I must say, you know, I've spoken quite openly on the show about our journey, uh, my partner and I's journey to IBF and and and trying to have a family and your photos. I might get emotional, my God, ancestors get me. Because this is the thing about a picture or a photo of someone that is so special, it's because you're almost holding this mirror back to them that they might not see this beauty within themselves. And your maternity shots are just incredible, like so stunning. And, you know, we use this terminology about decolonizing things, but when you think about, you know, what we see online or on Instagram about like baby showers and maternity shoots, they're all very white-centric, you know, they're not really how we do it. And you you take us back to our our our roots and you put us in these the photos you you put these women in in this like dreamy, raw, earthy, sacred state. And I'm I imagine that it's so much more than taking a photo, it's so much more than capturing a moment.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

Yeah. I'm just in awe of our women, like to be able to, you know, grow another life form and also like carrying on this beautiful sacred bloodline that we as black fellas have, and passing on that knowledge that these women have been taught, like it's it's so special. We are like the world's oldest continuous culture, and seeing, you know, more little black babies being born and carrying on that bloodline, it's it's so special. Like, I can't even put into words how special it is. And I I I really love it. Most of the time, you know, it's when I get to meet these incredible men and women and families and models, it can become quite intimate because we get to, you know, it's very one-on-one. We get to learn more about each other and really connect and you know, learn about each other's mobs to like who they are, who's who their people is, who their family is. It's it's really special.

SPEAKER_00 9:47

Yeah, what a gift because it's such a vulnerable, intimate thing to sometimes even open up on film or on camera. I know we've done branding shoots before, and you know, we've used mob and there's something so vulnerable about being exposed. And so having a sister on the other side of the lens who understands you and your sacredness and your beauty and is helping to guide that is just so, so special. Yeah. I mean, what's your journey been like in take in becoming a photographer? Like, when did you start this craft? And and did you ever imagine it would take you to places like Vogue and Marie Claire and you know, all of those fashion shows? And yeah, what's the journey been like for you in becoming a photographer?

SPEAKER_01 10:35

Honestly, I didn't I'd never thought I'd see the day that I'd be published in these mainstream magazines because it wasn't too long ago that people who looked like me or mob were really featured in these magazines, let alone being able to photograph them. So for me it's quite special, but also it makes me question like maybe this should have been happening a long time ago, because like I know there's some incredible women out there who are black who are amazing photographers who deserve to be seen, you know, globally. Like Billy Cooper, Bobby Lockia, I mean all with how talented our women are, and I really hope with me being featured in these magazines that it does open up more doors for other black titters and brothers to be featured and seeing their incredible work. So I do feel really privileged, but also in the sense I'm like, well, you know, this should have been happening a very long time ago.

SPEAKER_00 11:40

It does feel like, you know, mainstream is is very much catching up, and it does beg the question of you know, what shifted, you know, for us to actually be, I guess, respected for our craft, not for our aboriginality. Um, that we bring so much, like we contribute so much just for our skills, not because we're aboriginal and we have skills. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:04

Exactly right. Like I know my storytelling skills come because I am Aboriginal, like it's something that I carry in my blood, and you know, we are the world's oldest storytellers. But like at times, yeah, I do question when I am booked. Am I being booked because of my Aboriginality? Is this a tick in the box or because you know of my work and my style also?

SPEAKER_00 12:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:33

Yeah, I but also I know that with stereotypes and how slowly this is moving, that you know, if I what's the word like I if I wasn't Aboriginal, I do believe, you know, without the racism, I'd probably get more opportunities like from a realistic stand of view. Because there is still in media this very racist stereotype that we aren't capable or we need to be supported, or you know, we're just not well suited when that isn't the case at all. Talented and we are more than capable. I hope that made sense.

SPEAKER_00 13:15

Oh, it makes it makes so much sense, and I think you're right, like you know, why in Australia has such a long way to go for us to not just be seen as that diversity tick, but actually respected for the for the the skills, the unique skills that we bring. And you know, you you are you know you are so talented in your craft that anyone would be lucky to feature you. And it would be lovely to reimagine a world or we're moving slowly, slowly towards a world where I imagine on set, and I don't I believe this might have happened with the Vogue shoot, but that we had black photographers, black models, black makeup artists, black, all black everything, and that we weren't just sort of slotted into this white paradigm, but it was all black everything. And you know, there's a long way for these industries to go. But I guess I'm pretty grateful that there are people like you who are leading the charge. But I also know that what you're saying would be really tricky to hold on to this hope and optimism, but also be like, well, come on, you followers, like get with it now. We've really got to stop and really address racism in these in these industries as well.

SPEAKER_01 14:24

Absolutely, like it's 2024, there is no excuse to not be hiring mob. It's well and truly great to have these one-off features, but we need consistent work for black fellows.

SPEAKER_00 14:37

Yes, yes, per reach. Say that, yeah, say it louder from the back because you're so right. This is it's hard enough to break into these industries. We need long, long-term work, not this seasonal when it suits them on their terms work.

SPEAKER_01 14:52

Exactly right. Like it always seems lately, like I do believe there has been some incredible progress. Don't get me wrong, I'm really proud to see, you know, mob really leading these campaigns and on the cover of magazines and in runway and all these incredible industries, but I do believe it needs to be consistent. Just one-offset needs to be an ongoing thing where mob are really valued for their time and effort and their work rather than just for a tick in like a tick on the box.

SPEAKER_00 15:26

It's a really good takeaway message, I think, for anyone listening about you know, really going working in really long-term mutual beneficial partnerships with mob and you know, really valuing our contributions and you know, doing more to make sure that there are all black everything because you know when we are around ourselves, when we're around our mob and we can be ourselves, you know, you'll only get better products and and things. So I think it's really important you raise that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:56

Yeah, I truly think like when mob are well supported, we're together, and you know, we know there's going to be long-term outcomes. That's when we really shine. So true. And I think like too when we have like when we're together and mob are booked for these jobs, it creates a whole different level of cultural safety too. Mob just feels a lot more safer and you know, at ease knowing that there's other black fellas working on these jobs.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

Oh well, thank you for raising that. I think it's a really important conversation to be having. You know, with that in mind, sis, you know, it's probably very difficult for for you to sort of say, but you know, has there sort of been any any particular projects or or photo shoots or things that you've been involved with where things have worked well and you have felt that you've had full creative license and have been able to produce a product where it has been done well?

SPEAKER_01 16:56

Yeah, so we did a campaign for my friend who's a designer, Liladia Houston Briggs, and we did that last year, and we had a black makeup artist, two black models, and the styling assistant was black and designer was black. So it was a full black team, and just being able to really like collaborate with each other, like listening to everyone's, you know, um creative input. I think we were all really able to shine, but also feel comfortable and have a lot of fun. So for me, that really like is a you know moment that really stood out to me because everyone's creative use and input was really valued.

SPEAKER_00 17:40

I love that. I could imagine you like master minds all coming together and sharing your passions and and collaborating and working together. That sounds beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 17:51

Yeah, it was a shoot that was made by mob for mob, so I think that itself was extremely special.

SPEAKER_00 17:58

Mmm, amazing. Oh, that's incredible. I mean, what what's going on for you as the photographer behind the lens? Like as you're taking the photos, like if we were on a shoot with you, yeah, what what's going through? What are you feeling? What are you experiencing when you're actually behind the camera?

SPEAKER_01 18:19

So it really depends on the job because I've done like such a range of different jobs. Like I recently photographed the sorry day event in Sydney, and that was a really emotional day when it's you know, events like that or subjects that are really, you know, like heavy for us mob, it can be really hard. But then jobs where it's been, you know, like where it's just been all mob, and that itself has just brought me like so much joy in seeing our people really shine and stuff. So like it really depends on the job. It's been a mixed bag of emotions because I'm one of those kind of people that feel everything. There's been jobs where I've cried, I've laughed, I I very much put myself into the job and really just feel every moment of the photo shoots.

SPEAKER_00 19:12

Yeah, gosh. Hearing you say that, you know, it it's it's obvious. It's a really heart-led job and that ability to like to empathize and put yourself in your in the person you're shooting's shoes and feeling that it's so much more than just a photo, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 19:31

It's capturing these moments. Like I've even done jobs where I would never be able to share just because of cultural protocols for communities and like even with my own people, and it's just you know, you can't describe the feeling of being invited to something that's ceremonial or cultural, like that feeling is indescribable, but there are moments that like I will forever cherish, and I would not be allowed say in that space if I wasn't a black woman or in this kind of role.

SPEAKER_00 20:14

We'll be back, you mob, right after this short break. Wow, it's so I could I could only imagine what it would be like to to capture. I guess there's one thing being in vogues and fashion shoots, but then there's one thing in a ceremony with with your own people and that sacred responsibility. Wow. Incredible.

SPEAKER_01 20:50

It is great that you um said like sacred responsibility because it it very much did feel like that. And like as much as I I've got these photos now, I could never share because they're so special and even speak about. I will always hold these memories really dear. And as a mum, I've been really fortunate that my children have been allowed to come along to these events also, or like ceremonies, so that itself, like my kids now will experience.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

Wow, it's so it's just so beautiful. I think sometimes like you know you've sort of quote unquote made it when you're actually serving the people in your family and communities that mean the most to you, right? Like that's so much absolutely like.

SPEAKER_01 21:34

Although I do feel honored to be featured in some mainstream magazines, like Sorry got Mary Clear, like what to me is a made at moment is really being acknowledged and honored by my own community and people. If I'm doing them proud, then I'm happy.

SPEAKER_00 21:53

That's it, that's it. And we gotta pour into our families and communities as much as we pour into you know Migaloo. Or to other communities, you know, when we're living off our country too. So that is so, so special. Well, I mean, with that in mind, sis, you know, one of the questions we like to ask our guest, because you know, a lot of our yarns is around, I guess, mental health and burnout as well, is, you know, thinking about, you know, because this is such a heart-led role that you play in in providing these beautiful shots, you know, do you have like a person or a practice that you turn to to sort of come back to yourself after these emotional times? Do you have a thing that you do that works for you that brings you a little bit of joy so you can get on with the next shot?

SPEAKER_01 22:42

So may that just went was a very, very horrible month work-wise with just experiencing some really like traumatic events. So for me, I've I just I'm turning off, logging off, I'm spending less time on my phone because I just need to be present with myself.

unknown 23:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:02

If that means doing nothing, then that's fine. If that means I'm just laying on the lounge watching my favorite shows, eating my favorite food, then that's fine. I just need to be alone with my thoughts so I can I can process. And I know for um some people it's very different. I think like connecting with your family and friends is also amazing and being supported. But for me personally, I'm one of those people that I just really need to be present with myself and really just process what's happened and really think through what's the next steps and switching off, just taking time out for me to fill my cup and just enjoy the things that I love. And for me, that's watching movies and just vegging out and munching out on food.

SPEAKER_00 23:49

Oh my god, you're all you're a sister of my own heart. There's nothing more that I love than rotting away at home. I'm laying up on my couch.

SPEAKER_01 23:57

So I I don't recommend that for anyone else, but I know for me that works. I'll be once I've had some time to myself to just rest and be present, I'll I'm back to good old me. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:11

It's so I mean, this is the beautiful thing of what I love asking about this question, is because you know, there's no one size fits all. We all have a many things in our toolkit, and sometimes you might need to be around people, sometimes you might need to switch off. But I think what's important is just giving ourselves the permission to understand what works for us and that we're all so different. And yeah, I feel you.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

I agree, like do what works for you. I know that personally this works for me, but for you, it might be going out on country, it might be being with friends, or it might be going to the gym, like it's you know, whatever you feel is going to bring you back to yourself, I would recommend.

SPEAKER_00 24:50

Yeah, absolutely. I must admit this year myself too, and particularly after, you know, last year and how hard it's been and just life in general with what we're going through with what's happening in here in Australia. You know, I I've I too have really had to do the same, go very inwards and just sit and process and be and put my phone on do not disturb and yeah, go inwards just so I can get enough clarity with what I'm feeling so I can process it, so then I can maybe take a step in whatever direction it might be. But just giving my position myself permission to pause and go in and not feel even remotely guilty about it, and I either, you know.

SPEAKER_01 25:34

I think there's such beauty and just slowing down the time to be with yourself and you know, just letting yourself feel feel like, you know, stop what's the word like trying to for me run away from the problems and really just take time to process what's happening, why am I feeling this way? What do I need to do next? So I'm feeling good about myself and the situation because I don't think, you know, we as people it's normal to be running on low. We really need to focus on filling our own cups and making sure we're looked after.

SPEAKER_00 26:08

And it takes tremendous courage to stop and turn inwards when things are going a bit difficult in our lives, like to truly stop. We've got so many distractions that we can just avoid or repress or or not deal with it. But yeah, having that healthy distraction of like, okay, this weekend I'm just gonna give myself permission to just turn off and watch some, you know, whatever works for you. And yeah, I think it's in I think it's important yarn.

SPEAKER_01 26:33

Whatever brings you joy, just stop and you know, just we're allowed to, you know, enjoy our little guilty pleasures, whether that be, you know, having a snack, going out for a coffee, or you know, just having a good nap. Like it's whatever works for you, we're we're allowed to. And I've been talking myself that too. Like I'm allowed to slow down, I'm allowed to, you know, have a little break from work and have some kid free time and just really be with myself.

unknown 27:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:02

Well, that's it. You got three little jardins too. So, you know, you your time would be so so precious. Thank you for sharing that with me, sis. I really appreciate that. I think it's such an important yarn for us to have.

SPEAKER_01 27:15

Yeah, absolutely. Like I myself, I struggle with mental health issues, and I think it's important we really have these discussions and normalize in our communities that it's okay to not be okay.

SPEAKER_00 27:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:27

Because as we've just had, as mob, you know, we care we wear so many different hats as it is, and I know sometimes it can be hard to just really slow down and look after ourselves, but I think, you know, it is important that we do prioritize our health and mental health.

SPEAKER_00 27:44

Absolutely, you're so right. And and I guess just knowing that we're not alone and that we've got people around us and and people that love us and value us when we are not right, and that we don't have to sit in it alone. But, you know, there's beauty in, as you say, just hitting pause and a reset for you. But yeah, if you're noticing that you you're not doing right, then yeah, you're right, it's it's okay to not be okay. We're we're all, you know, I think the with what's happening is like we've we're chartering new territory about how to look after ourselves and each other now, too. And so yeah, I think it's a thanks for that reminder for all of us, really. It's really important.

SPEAKER_01 28:23

Absolutely. Like, I cannot preach it enough, and there is so much support out there, and you know, there's always mob that are willing to listen to, and that's something like I've had to remind myself like, okay, like I don't need to be going through this alone. Like, there's people out there that care about me and want to support me and see me do well. So for anyone that's listening, like I think it's important that we remind ourselves, like, there is so much, you know, love out there and support from other mob, and you're not alone.

SPEAKER_00 28:53

And that there in you know, to add, I guess, to that, uh, which I I think it's really important to underscore that, you know, you're not alone. And that there is such there's such strength in vulnerability. You know, I know that in the last few months I've really had to ask people for help. I've had to say, hey, I'm not coping, can you take something off my plate? Or, you know, this is what support looks like for me. Are you in a position to be able to help? And it it can be really tricky, but when you come out the other side and you realize that sometimes you're gonna be the supporter, sometimes you're gonna be the person who's giving support. And that's what the beauty of being a part of a big community is is that we're all gonna be have times where we're up and down, that but we're all here to lift each other up.

SPEAKER_01 29:39

So absolutely, I agree. Like I can't even add anything else onto that because you're so correct.

SPEAKER_00 29:44

Oh, this is why I love these yarns because we know we get to one we're talking about photo, and then next minute, you know, we're talking about you know real stuff, and this is why I love I love this podcast so much because they're such beautiful, candid yarns. Oh, I feel like I need to just take a big breath with that one. Well, I mean, with that, I mean, there's no real neat segue, but you mentioned something before that I'd love to be a Dory on and circle back around, which is around Shadow Sisters. You mentioned a program that you're doing to support mob in this space. Can you tell us a little bit more about this idea and and what you hope to achieve in supporting mobs?

SPEAKER_01 30:27

So, as we were talking about earlier, with that whole, you know, if you're in a position to give back like a lot of our people do, I feel like with my career now and my knowledge, you know, it's my responsibility that I start looking at ways to give back and how I can really help foster that next generation of black women that want to get into photography. Because like when I was growing up in Lightning Ridge and also in Dubai was back and forth, I look at the really limited opportunities for mob that wanted to get into the art space or anything really that wasn't sports. Like growing up, footy was, you know, what everyone wanted to get into. Whereas, you know, the mob that don't really want to do sports or want to really pursue a career or hobby in arts, there was very limited opportunities there. So I'm I'm hoping when I do start this program, I can support women to begin a career in photography or just even a hobby, just like a little outlet to get creative and you know, something nice for them. And yeah, I'm I'm still very much in the early stages of really mapping out what these workshops are going to look like and what I really need to make sure they are successful.

SPEAKER_00 31:49

So amazing to create opportunities for, like you say, sisters in areas where there's just sometimes no opportunities. And yeah, just to be able to provide some of that, that some of your skills back. You know, I think we've been having these yarns internally at Blackwattle about creating some some mob meets where we can come and just share our skills, like, oh, you do this, I do that. Let's just share it in like a circular way. It's just exchanging our passion so you can learn a little bit there. And so, yeah, that's incredible that that's what you're thinking about and thinking about birthing into the world as the next step of your, I guess, your your personal passion outside of just yeah, photography. You know, for all of us amateur iPhone people who take in photos or selfies or whatever, is there any like any little tips that you could give anyone who's listening about what is the secret to a good shot? I'm asking for a friend, nah, Gimp.

SPEAKER_01 32:53

No secret, truly. Like, I look at some pictures like people take on their iPhone, they're so creative. I think it's just about getting creative with your photos and like the capabilities of iPhones. Like the cameras on there are incredible. I think it's just really like you know, thinking outside the box and like doing stuff that's creative, but also you know, that's very true to yourself. Ah, Darl, that's such good advice. Even if you just take like a simple, you know, black and white, that's your kind of style of being minimalistic, like it's really like self-preference and just playing around. Like I think with you know, with phones these days, there's so much you can do with them. It's just you've really got to think outside of the box and you know, let yourself be creative.

SPEAKER_00 33:39

That's such good advice because I think we're living in a world where everything is very copy-paste, where people are like, you know, just taking someone's idea, re-badging it for themselves on TikTok or online, but yeah, giving yourself permission to like find the thing that works for you and just in yeah, embrace the your authenticity with it and try to do it in your most creative way. What great advice.

SPEAKER_01 34:03

No, like I love I love seeing authenticity and creativity, like even if it's not necessarily like in a photography standard point of view, like you know, correct what you know the olden ways of doing it. I love seeing just cr creativity, like people who are thinking outside the box and doing what you know others aren't. So I think there's no really wrong way of taking a photo because if you like it, then that matters really.

SPEAKER_00 34:35

I love that. What good advice. Be bold, be creative, have fun with it, and and give something else a go that works for you. Well, I love that.

SPEAKER_01 34:45

I think my own photography, I look now, and you know, at the start I was really creating what I thought other people wanted to see, but now I'm just creating like what I want to see, what's you know, I like. And I think when you start creating for yourself, that's when you know the magic will really outshine and people will really start to notice your work.

SPEAKER_00 35:06

So true, because you're working from that place of like love when you're actually doing something that brings joy or sparks some joy for you. It's so true. Like, I think a lot of us when we're moving into our careers just sort of try to template the white way or think that the white is right, or that's success, or that's what it looks like. And yeah, I think doing the things that you like for you, um, your way, knowing that you're creating a new path and doing things is yeah, really good advice. I love that.

SPEAKER_01 35:38

And I think like just to add on to what you said too about like you know, like with success and the white way, I think in this generation we really need to stop thinking that money or the white way is the right way, like you can be very successful without actually being rich, you know. You're rich in spirit and in community and love. Like, that is the true definition of success and happiness. You're happy with what you're you're making and creating and doing as a career.

SPEAKER_00 36:14

Preach. I love that being wealthy in your spirit, put that on a t-shirt, put that on a mug because you're so right. Like, we really don't need uh we don't need wealth and and fame and fortune and being you know, to be feeling fulfilled. And in fact, probably for a lot of our mob who are sort of, you know, I can't speak for everyone, but you know, I'm I've certainly in my early 20s sort of fell into this trap of I guess thinking that I had to be something I wasn't to be successful because you know the the colony didn't make space for black women, you know, and uh you just burn out, you're miserable, you're you're trying to be something that you're not, but yeah, having enough, you know, and I think it's it's having enough and then having enough time to give back to you the things you love and enjoy and your family and your community too. And you know, if you're running around, running yourself into the ground for you know, white dollars, it's a very it it's for me in my experience, it it's it's it may be a short feeling, but it's a fleeting moment, it's not long-term love of self, you know, it's it's a fleeting feeling of of something, but it will not bring you long-lasting joy, in my experience.

SPEAKER_01 37:30

So absolutely, you're so correct. And I think if you find something that really brings you joy and you're passionate about, then the rest will come, really like the money, if that's you know, your long-term goal, but everything else will come. If you're passionate about something, then you know, people will catch on. Yeah, and see that this is something that you really love and that you're good at, and the rest will come later.

SPEAKER_00 37:56

It's so true. Uh, it's like, you know, that what notion of worthiness and and that feeling and bel belief in self, it doesn't come from out there, this the things we have or the stuff we've done. It comes from who we are and what person we are. You know, I remember when I used when I was in my early 20s, I always used to have this narrative like, oh, when I get this job, I'm gonna be happy, or when I do this, I'm gonna be happy. And then you get to the thing and you never feel fulfilled because you're just chasing this false sense of of what, you know. So it's really just about yeah, turning inwards and and and going in and and focusing on on the spirit, like you say, to be wealthy in spirit, family, and community. It's just so simple, but so so beautiful. So thank you for sharing that.

SPEAKER_01 38:49

Exactly right. Like it is very simple but also very fulfilling.

SPEAKER_00 38:54

Yeah, and it's an unlearning, you know, we're all being programmed, we're all unlearning, and you know, with time and wisdom and lots of setbacks and lots of mistakes and lots of maybe low periods or feeling, you know, really down. You know, sometimes these things become clearer, and we're all on a journey with this, you know. Yeah, that's beautiful advice. I love yeah, you read my mind, sis, because that was one of my questions was around, you know, you know, what advice would you give to Mob? But I think that that captures the essence entirely. Just don't be afraid to do the thing, be bold, be yourself, and you know, find ways to to love yourself just as much along the way.

SPEAKER_01 39:33

Absolutely. Like I like me personally, I, you know, was when I was starting out really afraid to be myself and be what others I thought others wanted me to be. And I found like as I got older and more mature when I started really just being my authentic self, you know, and giving, you know, less not just be vulgar, but fucks. Like, yeah, I that's when I really started to become more successful because I was being my authentic self, whether people liked it or not. And surprisingly, like I've just being myself, I've made some really great friends, and that's when my business was really able to start growing because I was creating, you know, work that was authentic to me, and I was really putting myself out there being vulnerable, also. And it was making me happy, and that's when you know I started filling my own cup and creating what you know made me happy. That's when the rest all came later.

SPEAKER_00 40:34

Working from that place of love and authenticity and and acceptance, and you and because this is a thing, you know, you're not like it's not like with your business anyway, and for the no black business owners who are listening, you know, it's it's not that like we are our business. We we it's not like oh my business is here and I am here, like how we show up for ourselves is how we show up in our business, and so you know, it's such a it's a it's actually a business is a very spiritual feeling, I think, because we're pouring into something and separate.

SPEAKER_01 41:08

So and I find that with black businesses too, like it's just compared to non-Indigenous businesses, like mob, you can really feel when you're purchasing from them or you know, looking at their work, it does come from a place of authenticity and who they are. And yeah, I just thought I'd add that on with that because it's like you are so spot on. It's I love it, I love it.

SPEAKER_00 41:31

Oh my god, this has given me so much to think about. And I think for any of the you know, the young sisters who particularly are listening, you know, that's a I think it's a really beautiful conversation to be having about leaning into all parts of ourselves, and you you will attract the people that want to stick around. And sadly, some people you might have to surrender and let go to as well. It's when you start leaning into yourself, you know, people know, feel that, and you attract that.

SPEAKER_01 41:58

Oh, this is let them leave. People they if they don't want to see you shine, then you know they're definitely not worth it, they're not worth bringing into the next chapter of your life.

SPEAKER_00 42:10

Amen. I mean, I've been, yeah, I I feel that on so many levels. Uh it's such a grief and loss at first to let people go, but over time you're like, bye, see ya, love to see you leave.

SPEAKER_01 42:27

A place of self-love, too. I find when you start really, you know, connecting within and loving yourself, then you're more than happy to let go of that those toxic people and really allow the people who want to see you shine come in.

SPEAKER_00 42:42

That's so true. Oh my sis, you are so wise. And this is the thing, you know, we started off talking about photos, but then when we really started to unpack, it's like it is such a heart-led process. So of course we're gonna be talking about vulnerable things. Like, what a what a no-brainer. Oh, well, my sis, where can people connect with you? And and have you got anything that you want to share in the pipeline or yeah, anything else that you want to share about you and in your work? And and a big shout out to where we can all follow along with your beautiful magic and gifts for the world.

SPEAKER_01 43:18

Well, you can find my work on Instagram. That's where I spend most of my time. It's Marlimorgan Photography, and I'm also on Facebook, and my website is www.marlimorgan.com.au. But also, like to those listening, I encourage them to really connect with other black photographers also, because like I'm very inspired by the other mob who are doing it. I'm a part of a little community called Black Lens. It's just where we really support each other, we share resources and you know, really want to see each other do well, and I think it's really worth checking out. And if you ever need a photographer, I encourage them to reach out. to Black Lens or to source out who is in your community because honestly like there is some mob that's really being, you know, not being booked and their talents are really being overlooked and I couldn't encourage that anymore.

SPEAKER_00 44:16

Such a great piece of advice. We'll be popping all of Marley's and Black Lens's details in our show notes. But it really is such a beautiful reminder that this is what you get when you hire black fellas. Not just someone who's going to rock up and take some photos, but people who are really digging deep into themselves, providing pouring into their communities and are really showing up in unique, vulnerable and fearless ways. So please you fellas get out there and book your black artist because you you aren't going to get this love and care from from anyone. So yeah thank you. Thank you so much for coming on the show today my sis and and also just giving me a place and space to air out some of how I've been feeling too it's it's such a reciprocal beautiful you know thing this job about having yarn so you've given me a lot to think about too sis so thanks.

SPEAKER_01 45:09

I think that's the beauty of when mob connect isn't it like we're really able to just yarn and just like release let go absolutely yeah it's so true.

SPEAKER_00 45:21

You're definitely giving me some things I need to go away and think about so thank you. All love my sis thank you so much for listening you mob if you are vibing this season of yarning up then please head over to Apple Spotify or wherever you get your podcast from to show us some love, rate and review. Alternatively you can get in contact and give us some feedback by visiting wwwincal dot com dot au