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Growing Through Dance Podcast Dance to Live, Live to Dance
Growing Through Dance Podcast Dance to Live, Live to Dance
Kate Radmilovic-Evans - how dance has touched her life
Episode 3
Part one of a two-part interview with international multi-talented performer Kate Radmilovic-Evans. Kate recalls her journey through university and vocational training, into her first professional career as an opera singer. She discusses how dance has interacted with her singing and acting, giving behind the scenes insights into her many roles. She also talks about breaking into musical theatre, film work and how she has coped in the age of Covid.
Hello, welcome to growing through dance. The podcast for dancers, parents of dancers would be dancers. In fact, anyone with an interest in moving fitness, expressing themselves through body language and generally enjoy.
Speaker 2:I am so pleased that you could join me on this third episode today, we're going to explore interacts with life. So my guest today is the back depressant. Kate TrackMan manager Jenkins has spent a lot of her life as a professional opera center, a musical theater staff, a performance teacher, and an actor. So you can be forgiven for thinking why this multi-talented lady is here to discuss dance. That's fine. Welcome Kate. Hello. Hello, Catherine. Lovely to see you, Kate, you and I first met while you were teaching with me on a performing arts course. I wondered, yeah. Start off by just giving us a little bit of idea. How did you end up teaching or the course when you're clearly a performer? Yes, but I'd been singing a lot of opera immunity for 20 years and I was just teaching 39 to 40 and my singing voice had got a bit tired. Uh, so I had to take some time off as an, as a professional opera singer and I was living in Germany at the time. And, uh, obviously if you're out of work in Germany, it's not the ideal situation. So I decided to come back to Britain for various reasons, for personal reasons. And so, because I was having to rest my singing voice, um, re establish it as I moved into my forties, I, uh, just looked for jobs and out came this, uh, teaching job that said performing arts, teaching, singing musical theater in a performing arts Academy, because it was the Cirencester B tech course, but it was very much a threefold course. So I felt I'd be suitable. So, uh, when I applied and I sort of practically got it on the spot, it was a big learning curve because I w I hadn't, in fact just been doing opera and operetta, but because my previous degree was in music, drama dance, I knew that I had in me to switch over to musical theater. So during that year, uh, from my early instincts in musical theater, as a kid, I'd done musicals and shows in amateur theater right up to, I was 18. I already had a taste of it, and I had done German operator and the movement had always been very much part of my career as an opera. I was always the opera singer that could move well, apparently, uh, I would say sounded very easy just to switch into teaching. And luckily I can't stand. Although I do teach by the piano, I'm always having to do sort of one-to-one lessons. My biggest enjoyment is being in front of a group because then I can perform a little bit, which I like and expand. I have a feeling of expansion with more people around me, so they're not just singing, they're moving and, uh, expressing what they're saying. So it's a music theater sort of dance, singing, acting. So the course was ideal and it, but it also learned an incredible amount from the teachers already there, because I was sort of having to learn as I went along with certain musicals, I've never really heard of like black cabana.
Speaker 3:Um,
Speaker 2:And anything goes, was it anything goes? Yeah, no. So Catherine led me through the woods. And then at the end of that, that extremely fascinating year with being with young people as well, which I didn't realize I'd enjoy so much. I did get Phantom at the end of it, but I'm not sure if I would have got it if I hadn't have had that year being, having to teach musical theater. So I had to sort of be become musical theater orientated from day one. Really? And you, you learn from teaching. Absolutely. That's what happened. And then my opera voice began to come back during Phantom. And then I went back into opera for a few more years,
Speaker 3:Currently seven you've just touched on Phantom, which Phantom of the opera in the West end and very exciting role to have. Um, would you like to just tell us a little bit about that?
Speaker 2:Yes. Well, Carlotta is quite hard to cast. They're always searching for the next Carlotta because she really does have to have an opera singing facility, not necessarily a big voice, because of course it's all done with microphone, but you have to have the range, but not only that you need to know technically how you can keep your voice going. Eight shows a week with that facility. So I, it was difficult for them to find, so I mainly had just left my CB at the stage door and got, got in. And that's unusual. I don't think that would have happened if I was auditioning for Christine or perhaps Phantom, but for Carlos, it just, it was a difficult role to cast. Uh, recently I, they called me back in as Carlotta, but then they decided to hear me as much NGV. So clearly I've aged. I nearly got that, but they said I wasn't settled enough. So I, I thought, okay, maybe next year when they do recalls, because they constantly bring people back in, I would have made myself a bit more subtle, but the music got me going. And I think I became a bit like a car lot, and I had injury. I couldn't somehow just go completely Shiri esque on them.
Speaker 3:Amazing. And you were in, you were in funding for a year, is that correct?
Speaker 2:It's just one year, partly because during that year I began to get longing to go back to opera because I hadn't intentionally, I wasn't meant to give it up. People always just needed time. So during Phantom for that, that moment, I found it quite difficult doing eight shows a week, a lot of opera singers do when they're cast, uh, is best. Uh, I've learned how to do them now, but at the time it was a massive shock to the system. You have to repeat yourself every night, twice a day and stay fresh and enthusiastic. I was atheistic for six months, but the last six months, I, I found it difficult to press that button. I've learned how to do it now. And, uh, and, uh, but at the time I found it difficult. So I decided to go back into opera with a bit more training, and then I did do it for about three or four more years.
Speaker 3:Okay. And just before we leave Phantom for the moment, cause I'm sure we'll come back to it. Were there any sort of, um, you haven't been a professional in opera, I'm sure you knew most of the drill, but was there anything that happened that you thought, Oh, I didn't expect this to happen. Maybe rehearsal wise or something, or yes,
Speaker 2:I would say this. Um, the difference is if a musical theater it is theater musical, so you really have to be completely convincing with your acting too. Although I was always very worried about my voice and I had to be constantly reminded that it was microphoned. So I really didn't need to worry as much. I had to learn not to project save myself. And that, that was perhaps the biggest change. One evening. This is a anecdote there's a costume change on stage is a very famous moment when Carlotta changes into[inaudible] her 18th century opera on the opera stage and they couldn't get the wig on the poor. We actually, one of the grips were into his finger. He was trying so hard to have to do a show stop. But at that moment, I just suddenly improvised queen of the night. I couldn't help myself not to pianist in the pit, uh, echoed it. So we had this wonderful moment of, and then he repeated on the piano. We did it about three or four times during that time they got the wig on show was able to continue. And I thought I was going to get the sack. I didn't depart. I didn't. They put it in the show book to say, if, if this happens again, please ask the Carlotta to localize, improvise, um, to fill the space. Wow. That was perhaps my claim to fame that I got. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. That was amazing. Right reasons. Okay. So can I just take you backwards from them because I know we've got loads to discuss. Um, but you know, you said that you did, um, your degree, including dance as a child, first of all, can you sort of run us through sort of your experiences?
Speaker 2:Yes. So I do have to say, I would say natural move, but I didn't take lots of dance classes. So although I got on this degree, I probably got on because of my drama on music and I did the dance, but I was, my fellow colleagues had done much more than me. They'd done all the grades in Bali and jazz and tap that all that a lot of them had gone to Labon 16 plus to Labon. So they arrived with professional dancers, not as much as someone who has perhaps goes to bird college, you know, really specialist dance. So they were good though. And, uh, so I was the weakest of the group. They always have me playing the mother, whatever, because I just couldn't do what they were doing. And I specialize in choreography. So as a kid, I did do dance class, but I was also a swimmer. I was an athlete. I used to swim twice a day for years, but my dance was, it was, my dance was when I was at four years old, right through to about 10 sort of starts to give it up age nine, nine, 10. And then I took a up again when I was 14, 15, 16, but I, those crucial years I'd missed out on. And that's why I couldn't really go into dance because for a while I thought, perhaps I should go into musical theater. Yes. I, there's no way I would've gotten to somewhere, like feel for school of acting with my dancing because it wasn't technical. I missed out on those years, which is useful for dancers. We're hearing this
Speaker 3:Cause it's, it tends to be a time when a lot of children decide, Oh, this is not cool enough for me anymore. I'm going to do something else. Isn't it? Yeah. So that's a really interesting thing. So as a dancer, I know that, um, you haven't, you've just said you haven't done as much as you would like to have done, but what would you say was your greatest sort of learning from what's what's taking away from it
Speaker 2:Couple donation and movement to music, which of course has then made me an interesting opera singer. So I would instinctively V8, often opera singers get very frazzled when they're asked to move and sing at the same time, um, to do complicated things, uh, staging, but I've always found that easy because I, from an early age and form the dance, also the UCLA technique that I did at Birmingham, I just was taught to move to music throughout all that time. So I, as an opera singer, I was, uh, very useful. Um, not maybe my singing voice sometimes was in fact, the weakest bit about me, but the, the directors, the directors would always say, are they popular with the directors? Because I could do things at the same time as singing. And I had no tight, my timing was uncannily sort of perfect. I would know when to enter. I would, I would sort of know when to sleep around, whereas not pressing, I would see them struggling and an office thing. We didn't have that dance training. I was seeing that they'd go for God's sake. Can't you feel there's that surge in the music can't you see it can't you feel it? And they would find it very, very odd. So, um, that was a strength that, that really helped me become an interesting group. The opera singer.
Speaker 3:That's really interesting. Cause, um, personally, as a dancer and a dance teacher, um, I always feel that actors who haven't had any dance and movement are quite wooden. That's an awful thing to say, but it is, um, having through my experience that once you give them that confidence to move and it makes such a difference to what they can actually perform and, and how much more realistic you enjoy the dance you get as a child?
Speaker 2:Oh yes. And I I'm observed that with my niece. My nephew did a little bit of dance and he was quite good, but he, unfortunately didn't continue with it, but my niece has. And although she finally gave up family, she's keeping up with her jazz dance and tap dancing, and she's definitely, um, this help, help to how you can see it's helped not only in her posture, her general sense of moving and nice. I would say it was gay for a discipline as well. Do you think it same time self-confidence self-confidence she was thrilled to get par. I think it was grade three and she was all grateful. She was convinced she was going to fail and a week before she wants to drop out, funnily enough, I happened to be with her during that time. So I gave her like a pep talk, say you could pass, but the only way you're going to pass to practice every day, this way I would do it in the morning, wake up early, um, practice practice makes perfect. Especially with dance, that's still memory. I said, well, this needs a few to do it every day for a week. And she, she did. She listened to me. So I said, don't panic. Don't worry, no point worrying about it during that worrying period, just practice just mechanically practice. Think, just practice, just do it. And she did what I said and she passed
Speaker 3:Excellent off to university. Where did you go first of all then how did the path lead you?
Speaker 2:So after university, I, during that course decided I wanted to go into opera. I had a big calling for it, for the expressive arts in classical music. It wasn't really excited, fabulous opera voice or anything like that. I just, I just loved the power of the music that made me want to go into opera. So I had to really update my, I was training my voice throughout my university sessions, but I specifically just train my voice only. So I had a year off. I did lots of different different jobs, so I earn some money. And then I trained my, went up to London twice a week and trained with a specialist and then finally gotten to the wall and Northern college of music.
Speaker 3:What was very different about Northern college from any other, you would have chosen old?
Speaker 2:Interesting, considering that straight, I've always been a bit of a rebel. So I didn't get into the, I didn't get into the London colleges. They set out my voice. Wasn't clear enough. It wasn't suitable for opera and the Royal Northern, or that, that may seems terribly far away at that age of 21, but I went and they said also your voice is a bit weird because I think I've just been doing so many other things and it, and it is a bit weird. It's kind of full. So they said, try to train Claire up, getting more clear, more concise. And then we'll we'll we consider you. So they gave me sort of a call back and I did then stabilize the voice to give it one consistent color. I decided to teach at the time, made me become a mix to soprano stabilize sound. And then they, in their words said you're still not a great singer, but you're a great performer. So we feel for you would be ideal. You just need to sort your voice out, but your strength is your acting through song on your general feelings of movement. I suppose they're sort of stage presence. So that's what got me into college. And then I, because I was training every day, by the end of the first year, I was in the finals of the vocal competition. And then I, and then I, again, I didn't trust really the British way of thinking because they are quite classical opera. So I decided I went to Germany, the, in the Bible watch course for summer, they took on students from our college and it was there that I noticed there was 80 opera houses, all smaller ones. And then I thought now that's probably well suit because it's not going to be as incredibly competitive, but Britain, of course, at least five big opera houses. If you're not really that big number one, you're going to end up covering or going, going into the course. And I didn't want to do that. So I decided to become a bigger fish in a smaller pool. So I went to a nice medium sized opera house is 800 seater. There was a couple of us, but I was one of their leading Sopranos. So I did all the roles. I was number one all the time, which I liked. And I had rehearsals. It was then I was able to create and be the rehearsals where they were my rehearsal. So I was able to really do what I wanted without having to sit on a seat and watch somebody else do it. So I chose Germany for that and I don't regret it. The only problem is I would say I perhaps the two much, because they tend to work as seen as very hard. And when I got back, I didn't really break into the opera scene in Britain. So I was by then I was 40 years old. So I'd sort of missed the British gap. And I was warned of that when I went, they said, if you leave now, you'll find it difficult to come back. And I, I did find it difficult to come back, which is another reason probably why find any gave up opera. It's changed. Music colleges have changed because they've become privatized. So they take on more students. Well, they did movement. We had dance class movement to class yoga. I still do yoga now it's my, my main form of movement is yoga. Now I have to eat of it. And of course I'm acting classes and then a singing lessons, two or three times a week, you don't perhaps get as much attention as you did in the 94. I was at music college. So yes. And then you did scenes, you did operas. So it was a big edit, a postgraduate there, but in those days, your post-graduate, you could sort of, I got scholarships, a lot of scholarships. I was able just to stay. They stayed there. I think I stayed there for four years, which nowadays would be unheard of with the price that causes a very expensive, I can't believe I stayed there for four years. And I think one of the years was for free. I just have to work in the library a few hours. So it was very freeform. And in the early nineties in colleges, when you look at the cost of, of, yeah.
Speaker 3:Trying to train their days, it is, it is very helpful. Indeed.
Speaker 2:It's completely changed, but now it's privatized. I literally don't and a lot of us, we stay two or three, four years, and then, but I did get scholarships and it wasn't very expensive. The courses weren't expect 3000 pounds for the whole year. And I worked,
Speaker 3:I did
Speaker 2:Have a, I had to work. I was, I was a secretary throughout the house and I taught singing throughout the whole time. I did group thinking at, to college a bit that the tech yes, I forgot and keep forgetting that I did do that, but I taught at Salford college.
Speaker 3:Oh, right. I got something I didn't know about you.
Speaker 2:No, I didn't know either. I keep forgetting and I was only 23 and that was group singing, but it wasn't a Pacific course as such. It was more of a community community course. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah. More expirational type of thing. Yes. Obviously then he'll opera career darted your form in Korea. And then as you said earlier, you came back and in your vesting period is I like to call it to perform. You did a bit of teaching and started to sort of hone your craft on that. I think done Phantom for a year and being Carlotta. I suppose the question has to be what happened next? What, where did you go?
Speaker 2:Well, I would say if one had a crystal ball, what we'll never know, should I have gone back to opera or should I have continued? Because that, that crossroads, I was getting some nice offers from agents to audition for mama Mia, we will rock you. And another one that was over in Germany, uh, hairspray in hairspray, there was a fun role and I'm afraid. I rather stupid. They turned them all down because I was convinced I needed to go back to opera. And I didn't, my opera career didn't really take off. I got some things, but it was a sort of quite a tricky time. I would say the first tricky time I'd had as a performer, which lasted for four years. So sadly one we'll never know, but I think it's quite obvious for a listener. They'll go. You foolish thing. You should have stuck with the door that had been opened for you back in Britain because the door, the musical theater door was opening. Yes. But I don't think I really understood it. I'd been away for so long and I'd not really done any musicals. I didn't really understand the system. So I would say that's one of my biggest regrets. However, funnily enough, at this very moment in time, now that I'm 53, my singing voices opened up again and it's become very big. So I'm at this very moment during COVID I'm giving myself three months to retrain my opera voice, believe it or not. Oh wow. As a character met. So, so may I ask King would be the strongest, but it just sort of, I'm not going to try and sing any fantastic high notes or anything. So I'm just retrade. I'm just doing it as an experiment. Like I think a lot of people are doing, what are you gonna, what are we all going to do during this period? So I decided I got to work. I'm working very hard to earn a living. I'm teaching on zoom and I'm doing other various jobs and working in a factory three days a week. But during this period, because I won't be on tour, nothing's going to happen. I'm not going to get a performing job. Theaters are shut. I thought just, why don't you just do a little experiment? And if it doesn't work, it doesn't matter. At least your answer your question because the opera goes home to me, unfortunately. And in musical theater coming back to what do I do next? Yeah. So what happened was I found myself as I've got older, late forties, early fifties, I become known to do the character roles and musical. So that the mother, yeah, basically the mother I've just played a lot of mothers and a lot of things, which is fine. It's been a living. I've enjoyed it. It's not being in thrilling because I, a lot of these people didn't have a song. So it's been a bit sort of humble making. On the other hand, I have been making a living and that is in itself. Not many people make a living anymore from the arts. So I'm going to be, I'm going to be grateful. There's some jamming roles that I would obviously like to do, but some of those roles like gypsy for an older woman. So I will see him for last summer at Pitlochry festival. They didn't choose me in the end. They chose a very good actress who was covering Imelda Staunton. But so those type of there's a couple of really fantastic roles. But of course I I'm then competing with the all walks of musical theater who have been in Britain, all that youth. So I can't sort of push them out the way. And they also fantastic. And a lot of them were ex dancers or used to play the big dancing musical theater roles, and then venting to character. They are incredible. I have colleagues, my friends and you see them and their, how a house is houses. They are musical theater goddesses.
Speaker 3:Should we have a little chapter by Jackie the musical exciting moment.
Speaker 2:Now that was when I suddenly became a dancer. So in, in incredible thing, I managed to do with backbends and lifting up. I said the dance. So that was in me that never really trained because that did come to fall. So that was my contemporary musical. I think they thought I was younger. They've always looked young for my age. I think they thought I was five years younger. And I wasn't gonna tell anybody that season I did have back problems. I've not moved. That that was fantastic experience, very slim. And I, I did. That was a one-off I think it would think it was my Swan song to dance and musical theater. Since then I've been doing the old bags.
Speaker 3:So also of course I was lucky enough to come and see you in, um, crazy for you in Plymouth. Fabulous role. Talk about this. There's a little bit about that. How, how that happened, who worked with all sorts of things, because it was a tour, wasn't it?
Speaker 2:It was a tour. My first tour sound of music. This is my second tour. And of course that was an actor muso show. So because I am a musician, I taught myself about four years ago, how to play the saxophone. I used to play the oboe and of course I play the piano and I can read music. So learning the saxophone, isn't very difficult. The difficulty is if you don't read music because I had, so I was able to pick it up quickly, then I could follow a school really quickly. And it's quite a vocal instrument, this exponent and so crazy for you was only for active users. You had to be able to play an instrument unless you were the particularly one of the leads or Tom chambers, who he was tapped dancer in it with the lead Bobby. So all the others were playing all the other reminder roles we had to play in the band, but paid percussion. I learned how to play the xylophone on the job, but again, it looks like a piano. So that was an extraordinary experience at that. Again, I'll be humble again. I was the weakest of the group. Everybody else were fantastic. Musicians who acted. So, but I again got through the back door. So my experience with creative view was very interesting because it was with the late Caroline flower, of course, which is a tragedy in itself. We won't talk about that now, but it was an extraordinary, she was an extraordinary lady to meet and, uh, we were all very upset with what had happened. So yeah, she was a great, great actress, great performer, and really give to the show. She was amazing.
Speaker 3:That's absolutely amazing. I know that when we go on for musical theater, you've been doing some acting roles as well. And this scene from following you a bit that, um, comedy seems to be part of your thing as well. Talk about how this is all happening. And again, I possibly
Speaker 2:Jumping the gun here, but I wonder if again, your deep roots in dance and movement helped your work as well. Yes, perhaps they have done, I've always had a sense of humor and I've always had a feeling towards comedy in my private life. I'd get through it by making people laugh. It makes life easier for me and for them, nobody likes seeing me in a bad mood. I'm much better when I'm making people laugh. So I tend to try and channel that. I don't know what's happened. I just, as musical theater, as I say, I'm sortable though, I'm doing okay. Um, and I just got lured into film. It was a by chance. I just found myself getting involved in it. I think it's, I took acting classes. Now I re I took some acting classes at the actor center. And I decided, I was told when I did some of these musical theater auditions that they said you're too big or too over the top. So my singing voice was too big. My acting was too big. Cause that's an opera singers were expressed large day without a microphone. So everything's bigger. So I thought what's going to make me go smaller. I know the screen acting. Yeah, that will really shut me up. And it's no different, it channeled a new thing in me, a deep core intimate intimacy, which I loved. And then I got addicted to it. So I only do screen acting classes. Now I don't do anything else. And it brings me right down to nothing. So you're literally talking like this to a screen and everything's really small and doing an American accent doing house of life. I absolutely it's like a drug. Um, not that I'd take drugs, but it's, it's like reenacting. And um, because I've had practically no training in it and it's nothing to do with my past, although the dance maybe for the comedy, but it really isn't anything I think do with my past, it's something completely new. So, so anyone listening who's in their late forties, you know, we get to these changes in our life and the screen acting is completely fresh. So I don't have any hang ups or bad memories. I'm completely fresh and I seem to be successful. So though no one knows I've been seen recently at BBC, but nobody really knows about me in the big circuits, more than the independency. I get tremendous feedback. And I think it's because I'm fresh and something very different in that I'm applying to jobs all the time. I've learned how to do self taping and screen acting. And it's, it's so different. So now I'm projecting my voice and probably shouting today because I started singing a lot yesterday. That's just make myself because of COVID and the musical theater Germany's opening again, the opera houses. So this European seemed to be a bit more with it. They seem to be getting the theaters open. So I'm saying to myself, get that door open again, because I basically, I want to work. I don't want to be working, doing odd jobs. I want to be looking as a performance. If I'm going to get work quick as an opera singer. That's one of the reasons I'm just doing it really for my calling for the haunting. So sort of like a split personality, really I'm even going to use two names. So as you know, I'm a Kate Miller as an opera singer, but I'm Kate middle and her Evan does an actor in Britain. So I'm just going to keep the two names. Excellent. Lovely idea. Do you still have an agent? Yes, I do. This narrow road. They've been supportive. They see me more in theater, musical theater and actor loser, the screen acting they're gently pushing me. But of course, again, I can't just suddenly walk in. It is really serving your time. Isn't it? That these things that you've, yes, it is. I've learned how to do it. So my craft has really improved. I've done some independent films. I'm getting jobs now. Smaller jobs just needs to keep knocking on the door, but I, I that's. Okay. Again, they can't do anything at the moment. No, no, this is, this is the problems. So as a rule, you'll forming career has perhaps taken some different terms, but it's a natural resting turns. And you've managed, as I said at the beginning to deal with opera theater and that acting is really coming to the fall. Thank you so much for sharing your dance journey. We look forward to hearing more from you in the second path. If you've enjoyed today's episode, then please subscribe, download and share the podcast. Growing through dance. Would you like to be a podcast guest on going through dance, then click the links in the show notes to register your interests. Then enter the growing through dance launch competition by dropping me a review, press the subscribe button, share all this on your social media platforms and tag me so I know you've completed it. You'll go into a weekly draw with the charts, to be the guest on the podcast and share your dance experiences. Thank you for listening to me, your host, Catherine Lucy. I do hope you will join me doing part two on Kate. We'll be discussing dance, mental health and extending career prospects during the canvas era.
Speaker 1:[inaudible].