Why Guess When You Can Measure

Most golfers are chasing a fantasy: perfectly straight shots and a “tour swing” that doesn’t match their body, their practice time, or their actual ball flight. From Chattanooga at The Honors, we get brutally practical about what really changes a golf game: identifying your pattern, measuring it honestly, and building a plan that fits the golfer you are today.

We talk about coaching that restores hope instead of piling on confusion. That means listening to what the player wants, then delivering a simple fix that shows up immediately in ball flight. We also share a force plates story from a session with Jeremy Wampler where a player finally got his timing to click by cleaning up setup fundamentals like posture and pressure, not by chasing flashy moves. The point is simple: data only matters if it helps the golf ball do what you want.

From there we dig into pattern recognition with a launch monitor like TrackMan, why video can mislead without context, and how many golfers misuse simulators by obsessing over the white center line. Your job is to start the ball on your aim line and curve it predictably, then take that knowledge to the course and aim like a scorer. We even walk through a pressure-hole example where the smartest play might be a layup because your miss brings water into play.

If you want more control, better strategy, and a practice plan that actually translates, hit play, then subscribe, share the show with a golf buddy, and leave a review so more golfers stop guessing and start measuring.

Website : measuredgolf.com 

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Transcript

Welcome From Chattanooga

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Measured Golf Podcast, where you, the listener, join Chuck and I as we discuss all things golf. And we are coming live from the golf hotbed that is Chattanooga, Tennessee. We're together again. The band is reunited and we're having a great time. So, Chuck, how are you? What's going on? What do you got to talk about this evening?

SPEAKER_00 0:22

This is just awesome having you back. Yeah. Ben, um, not only have you been here at the honors, but you've been with um good friend of mine, Jeremy Wampler. Jeremy's great. Um, who's got his own uh shop here in town. He's a uh DPT, made sure I got that right. Um incredibly knowledgeable, great with the body, um, avid golfer as well. He's a he's a nut like uh Michael is and uh Hindred Spirits. Yeah. I knew y'all would hit it off well, and you did, and you were there half the day, six hours, seven hours uh teaching away teaching away and having a good time helping people play better golf. You've got another another day tomorrow uh of teaching. Then I have to go home, which is sad, and then you're going home sad, and you've been injured. We didn't even get to play any golf this time around, so that was sad.

SPEAKER_01 1:20

That was sad, but it's also probably good for my mental state because this place ain't no joke.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

It's really as Michael likes to remind me. He's like, you know, you play a really hard golf course.

SPEAKER_01 1:33

A really 78.2, 155. Come and get it. Yeah, and like I remind you though, drive the ball better because it's not 155 from the middle of the fairway. Um, but no, it's a great course. Uh, highly recommend it. It's definitely gaining some popularity and some steam. And I wouldn't say that it's necessarily gaining popularity as much as you, the membership, the staff is kind of letting there be a little bit more known about this place.

SPEAKER_00 2:04

Yeah. I that's probably a good way to put it, is that it was one of those, like if you know, you know clubs. Yeah. The golfers journal article was very good. Was very well done. Um, the photos were great.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

It's a beautiful property.

SPEAKER_00 2:21

Kind of getting us ahead ready for the U.S. women's am. And uh, we just hosted the senior am a couple years ago, and then we've got the US AM in 31, and that kind of raises the gets us back into the raises the profile for sure. Yeah. The last time the AM was here was 91 in Sierra Blaze in 96 and the mid-AM in 05, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 2:46

So it's been a while since we've I like the quote from Tiger, you know, F this place is hard. It's the hardest place I've ever played. Like I think that's really cool. I mean, it it it's it's a beautiful property, it's an amazing membership, uh, very picturesque, it's gorgeous. Like we were driving out to get dinner uh a little bit ago, kind of a golden hour or or whatever the kids are calling it. And you know, just driving by some of the holes, it's it's very, very pretty. Um, but it's the thing I like, and the thing that attracts me to it is it's a golfer's club. It's it's not, there's no pool, you know, it it's it's here to service people trying to play golf. Uh, Mr. Lupton cared a great deal about amateur golf, uh, and and that really shows. I like the caddy program. Uh, I like that there's not a lot of golf carts out on the golf course, and it's just really a very difficult but very fair test of golf. And golf is at the center of everything here. It's it's not a place where you're bringing the wife and the kids, it's it's a place you come to play golf. And I that's what I like the most about it.

SPEAKER_00 3:59

And I think

The Honors And A Golfer’s Club

SPEAKER_00 4:00

you've seen another um resounding um what's the word I'm looking for from the membership in regard to your teaching, with uh guys taking the lesson from you for the first time that they don't like, hey, do you have space the next day? Like they're coming right back. And and we saw we saw one member he took from you in the morning, he went home, took a nap, came back to beat balls, and he's not a range rat. Yeah, and and he came back to beat some balls, and then he said, Hey, can I get in with you again? So it's clearly been successful.

SPEAKER_01 4:41

It's like we talked about though, and you know, if there's coaches listening to this podcast, you know, if you're gonna be a coach, be able to help people with their problem. Like that's first and foremost, and goes without saying. But you want to be able to give people hope. You want to restore people's faith, you want to make them feel like they're not less than and they can actually do it. And I think that's what we're seeing in that case, right? Is like somebody who's been struggling with their golf game, desperately wants to get better. It's important for him to get better uh with his title and whatnot. So, you know, I think restoring hope, restoring faith in people's abilities within their own golf game, it why wouldn't you want like what else would you rather do? Like if you feel like you're hitting the ball better, why wouldn't you want to come out here and and hit golf balls? Like it's and you know that just because you're you're a good golfer yourself. But like when you're hitting it well, do you ever want to leave the driving range? Like when you're hitting it well, do you ever want to leave the golf board?

SPEAKER_00 5:41

I certainly don't want to leave the golf. If you get one of those days where it's all rolling, yeah, I'm not leaving.

SPEAKER_01 5:45

I'm not leaving. Right. I mean, and that's that's what really frustrates me within the industry because the statistic is 17% of people that play the game of golf take a golf lesson. And there's a lot of factors that go into that, but the main factor is that typically when people come to take a golf lesson and they don't get better, they don't come back. And then they share their negative experience of not getting better after they ask for help with other people, and that it's not good. And we as coaches need to do a better job of listening to the people that we're coaching, figuring out what they actually want to get out of the coaching experience, and then delivering on their request. Because, like I said, I had a gentleman earlier today I was working with that he's he's never gonna be Scotty Scheffler, like it's not even in the realm of possibilities for him. He's never going to be an elite ball striker, he's never gonna hit it the farthest in his group. His body just won't allow him to do these things. But he didn't come in and ask for any of those things. He came in and goes, Man, if I can just get the ball to stop and go left, I'd be tick-wheel pink. And it's like, okay, well, how about this? How about we do that? And how about we get this ball to stop curving or not even curving left, but snapping left. And just giving him the tools and the ability and the understanding of how to do that is the best thing ever for him. He he was thrilled. Yeah, he's super happy with everything. So it's it's not about being able to transform you know a junior to a tour player. That's not the mark of a good coach. The mark of a good coach is to be able to take a wide variety of different golfers or with different skill sets and meet their needs.

SPEAKER_00 7:27

I think Jeremy Wampler said that as we were leaving this evening. He was so impressed with he said, Man, you really listen. Because they here's what they told you at the beginning that they wanted. And at the end, you, Michael Dutro, the coach, regurgitated back to them, like, hey, you said this and this to me, and here's what we've done to accomplish that in in this lesson, and and the ability you have for the guy that he's maybe coming to take a lesson. And uh, we had one today that it was his second time, but it was he'd gone between you being back in Chattanooga and the first time or second time you were here. So you got the guys that are not, you know, they're not trying to play competitively, they just want to get better, they want to be have a drive their buddies, they want to drive their buddies, have more enjoyable time in the golf course. So you've got that in that you you can do, and then you've got maybe someone on my end that you're great at of like, okay, we're gonna, you said it best the other night. Like we've had a lot of decluttering and a lot of refurbishing that we've had to do, and then we can start to to paint, as you said it. Um so it's it's fun to get to see you in both lights of, hey, I understand what this is, and this guy just wants to have a more enjoyable time on the golf course, and then you have your other players that it's okay, what do we actually need to do to continue to to expand and improve the game to be more competitive and to get to some of the things that we're gonna do?

SPEAKER_01 9:18

That's the hard thing, too,

Coaching That Restores Hope

SPEAKER_01 9:20

because so many people that struggle with their golf swing, you know, it's funny because they've sought help. And I've had some of this since I've been down here. I have a lot of this in Ann Arbor. But people come to me and we kind of start going through the process. We do the 3D, we do the the force plates, we do the track man, we we get all this data. And you kind of look at that all and you go, okay, where's the low-hanging fruit and where can I have the biggest impact with this person? Right. Like that's for me, that's kind of the starting point. And then you kind of start going through the process of, hey, I'd like you to do this a little differently, or I'd like you to do this a little bit differently. And it's happened a lot on this trip and it's happened a lot in Ann Arbor. But people kind of look at me, they're like, oh man, really? And I'm like, yeah, why? Is something wrong? And they go, No, this is kind of like what I used to do, or this is like what I want to do. And it's like, good, do it. Like I I give you permission, if you will, right? And it's so funny because a lot of the people that struggle with their golf games or their golf swing in this case, they're not necessarily doing what they think is right, they're doing what they've been told is right, or what they've seen on Instagram is right, or social media is right. And that's where I really challenge golfers the most, is to listen to your intuition. If this feels better for you and you see a halfway positive result, let's do it. Right. And then my job today, especially having Jeremy there, who obviously understands the body at a higher level than I do, but having Jeremy there today, it was like, okay, you know, instead of going in here and putting on the show of the force plate guy and look at all this force plate stuff. Like, you know, it was way more about going, hey, what does this person do really well? And how do I match up? Going back to our last conversation, how do I match up the pieces to work well for him? And once you do that, that's when you get in these conversations about, oh, I used to do that more and I used to do this. And it's, yeah, you probably did, and you probably were playing better then than you are now. And it's just, I hate to say it this way, but it's almost like you got to give per people permission to do what they think is right because they've lost faith in their intuition and they think that they must be doing something wrong. But you have to almost reaffirm that for people that know, this is you, this is what you do well, and if you want to play better golf, like we've got to be true to ourselves.

SPEAKER_00 11:58

And you had a lot of moments today where people were excited and the high fives, and and you were saying how much is you were like, This is what's awesome about my job, yeah, is that I get to do this every day. And we compared it to my job where I maybe get that once every two years. And uh I was jealous of that, but yeah, um you had a lot of that today. You've had a lot of that this entire trip. Uh, every time you're down here, yeah, you seem to get I don't really have bad lessons.

SPEAKER_01 12:32

Yeah, I have maybe people that you know our personalities don't match up well, um, or maybe you know, they just they're just gonna fight you the whole way. You're right. And and there's always gonna be that, but it's such a small percentage of my work life. It's it's less than 10%. Uh, I just don't get a lot of that. But you know, the thing is, is when you show people it's it's a cliche, but when you show people how much you care, that really goes a long way. Um, so my job isn't to judge them, my job isn't to criticize them. My job is to to maybe be a little bit of comedic relief in the beginning because guys can be a little bit down about their golf game. Or they're nervous, right? Or they're nervous, right? And so a little comedic relief. And, you know, just be there with them, be present. You know, I I have my phone out when I'm teaching today, in particular a lot, uh, which is not normally the case, but I was looking at the track mandate on my phone. Um, but yeah, it's like I'm I'm not I'm not texting my anybody, I'm not, I'm there with them and I'm in the trenches with them. And uh yeah, it it's it's home run after home run. And you know, once again, if there's coaches listening to this, get as good as you can get because when you have the ability to help people with their golf game, and it and it means a lot to them, when you help them with that, it it doesn't just improve their golf game, it improves how they feel about themselves in general. So you just get to have a a really, at least I get to have a really nice day, you know, helping people with their golf games, which helps them with themselves and helps them feel better about themselves. And man, like anytime you do something nice for somebody and they feel better about it, like when isn't that a good time? Yeah, you know, so it's it's definitely a uh career of service to others. And I try to always remind myself at the beginning of every lesson, like at the end of the day, the golf is important because that's what I'm being paid to fix. But at the end of the day, this this is a people business, it's a relationship business, and you got to find a way to help that person through this thing they're going through. And while, yes, it's not a world war, and yes, it's it's not major, it means something to them or they wouldn't be here. Yeah, so it is important about that.

SPEAKER_00 14:50

Yeah. I think you had um a lot of fun with your first lesson.

SPEAKER_01 14:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:56

Because this was a this was a client of Jeremy's, yeah. And um so Jeremy also has his own set of force plates, yeah. Which is awesome, yeah, for him. And he nerds out on them and loves them. Um and they were have this this particular player that came in to see you guys, they have had issues with his forces and and getting things to happen in the right sequence at the right time. And you guys pretty quickly got these numbers to move, and it sounded like everybody in the room was like, oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 15:37

It was honestly in a glowing moment, right? Yeah, I mean, I've I've done a fair amount of presenting in my career, and you know, that's always cool. You pull somebody on stage, they may or may not have been on force plates before. You get things looking pretty good pretty quick, and you know, everyone's like, oh, wow, that looks great. But what made this one really more special was they have spent a considerable amount of time on the force plates, so they kind of like knew the pattern, they kind of had an understanding, like, hey, you know, the best I think they said they'd ever done was like get the vertical force peak to happen, you know, basically like at impact.

SPEAKER_00 16:20

And that's not and he took his first, they did their first reading on uh with you, and they were like, Oh, yeah, that's what we see.

SPEAKER_01 16:27

Yeah, yeah. And so, you know, as the force plate guy, I have to do a fair amount of data gathering uh just to live up to my name. So he comes in, we a little bit of levity, uh a little bit of get to know you. Hey, warm up, hit a few. Uh, okay, let's get a capture. We and and Jeremy has an amazing space, and we put it up on the big screen, and like there was another gentleman in the room watching, and uh everybody was kind of like, oh yeah, that we've seen this one before. Like, we've it was like watching a rerun, right? It's like signs out. Umestly, like looking at it, I was like, okay, like I definitely see some things I want to change. And that's the really nice thing about the way that I look at this data is like my process for breaking it down and implementing change never changes. So it's kind of a step-by-step, if you will, approach. So, you know, the one of the first or second things I look at, I go, I don't, I don't really love that. So we spent a lot of time working on this posture and spent a lot of time uh once again, and shout out to Dr. Tyler Standerford doing force plates for dummies and point of application, a line of pressure. We didn't even like, I literally put it up on the screen. I go, hey, like these forces and stuff, all these graphs, it's cool. But before we get here, let's focus on this box up here, which shows the pressure. And we worked on this, and this is like the fundamentals.

SPEAKER_00 18:01

Like this is this is the fundamentals of force plates. Right. And which can be not, I mean, fundamentals are never flashy, they're never exciting.

SPEAKER_01 18:13

But you would have thought that I like did the craziest, wildest lesson you've ever seen at the end of this. Yeah, but what I actually did was I fixed his posture and like how he has his pressure under his feet at setup, not during the swing, at setup. Now, granted, we we fixed some stuff like because we got it set up better in the beginning, he was able to actually get it to move properly throughout the swing. I didn't talk about any of that. I just literally worked on his posture, worked on his point of application, and gave him a positive line of pressure at setup, right? I literally take a capture. Like he's done this. We spent a considerable amount of time. Jeremy got involved, tested out his left ankle because I thought that there might be a bit of a problem with his dorsi flexion. Uh, we found out there was no problem, and then I was like, all right, well, I just got to get creative. So I got creative and I tried force pedals at first, didn't really help much. And then I finally got a wedge and stuck it under his left heel and kind of wedged his foot forward to where he had to be more kind of on the front side of the ball of that foot. So we had worked on this for a bit, it's probably been five, 10 minutes, and I was like, okay, I think we're ready to try this. Like, let's see what happens. And I didn't even tell him. Uh, I just like kind of snuck in a capture. So he hits this ball, and I did not see the ball. I'm standing like in front of him, and at Walfler's place, the screen's here, the player's here. I don't even see the screen, and I see, like, I hear like some kind of auditory come from him that was like, mmm. Like he had he had felt something different, he had liked what he had felt, yeah, and the ball had responded in accordance with the better feeling. So keep in mind, I'm not totally familiar with the space first lesson. I'm looking at this, and I look up over where Jeremy is, and I see his face like look like he's like seeing the Titanic rise from the bottom of the ocean. And I'm like, huh? And then I'm like, oh, it's on the screen. And I'm looking, I I like look and I was like, oh, wait a minute. That's not what we just looked at. And literally his vertical force, and and look, it's not all about vertical force, but his vertical force, which they really couldn't figure out a solution for getting it to happen in time. For him, it was something big for it. Nothing for everybody, for him it was, but for him it was huge. But all of a sudden, his vertical force is happening at his shaft vertical, which is like the early part of the window that we want our vertical force to happen. And I mean, everybody was kind of aghast, and he was able to maintain that, was able to do that. And more importantly, what's great about this is what we did wasn't anything like crazy special, I would say. It was the right thing to do, which makes it special, but it wasn't anything special. And the cool thing is, is he now knows if I do this, I get things to happen in time and I hit the ball a heck of a lot better. So he now has a recipe, if you will, of stealing from Parker. He now has a recipe for hey, if I do this, this happens. And the great thing about Jeremy being smart and investing in his business and having the force plates there is now he can have this client come back in and they can set this up the same way, and we can train that for him and get this guy playing some of the best golf of his life. So yeah, it was an absolute blast.

SPEAKER_00 21:44

Yeah. Uh sounds like the entire, judging from everyone else's experience, they were all having the same like man, this is awesome. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:56

This you know, one of the people didn't we didn't look at force flights. I didn't do a caption. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:00

Um I think that speaks to back to your point of coaching. That wasn't going to be the right thing for him necessarily.

SPEAKER_01 22:08

Oh, the gentleman had come in and um very quickly early on had mentioned that he has neuropathy in his feet, which is a fancy way of saying he can't really feel his feet very well. Um, so it's like as soon as I hear that, it's like, well, he just said he has neuropathy in his feet, which means he doesn't feel them well. Uh, am I gonna try to teach him about what to feel in his feet? Like that's probably not gonna lead to a positive experience. So you adjust on the fly and you listen and you go, what does he want? And and like he's telling me, like, hey, my left knee is jacked up and my hips are tight, and I got neuropathy in my feet. And it's like, okay, you know, and I'm kind of like waiting for the other shoe to drop a little bit. And he's like, Man, I just the damn ball goes left, and I hate it. And I'm like, Oh, the the ball goes left. Well, there's more than one way to skin that cat. Like, we can fix let's work on the geometry of the swing a bit and get the ball to stop going left.

SPEAKER_00 23:03

And he he he's pickled or he's tickled, and he's leaving with his recipe of yeah, here's how I don't see the ball go left.

SPEAKER_01 23:12

Yeah, right. And it's like, hey, here's a a couple drills. We did the drills together, uh, and and he loved it because he's like, I can I can do all this at home. And I'm like, absolutely. Yeah, you know, so once again, it's it's helping people understand their pattern. And once you have this pattern recognition, it's like, okay, well, what's the problem that this pattern creates for this player as they see it, right? Not as I see it, as they see it. And then, okay, well, how do I go about matching the pieces up to where they can still do what they know how to do well and the ball responds accordingly? And once you give people that power, man, it's it might as well be Christmas morning for these golfers. Yeah, it is.

SPEAKER_00 23:57

It feels that it can certainly feel that way. Yeah.

A Force Plate Breakthrough Story

SPEAKER_00 24:00

Um let's stay on patterns for a second.

SPEAKER_01 24:03

So you we've shout out to Alan Chris, very nice uh note on Instagram. Yeah, yeah. Uh, I read it. I'm here with Chuck. I read it out loud. We both very much appreciated the note. So thank you, Alan, for the very kind note. And um Alan had asked a question because we're staying on patterns for a minute. Uh, and he asked me or asked us, what are some of the things I look at on video when it comes to kind of matching up pieces and pattern recognition? And you know, it's kind of a loaded question, a little complicated to answer, but I don't honestly look at a lot of video. I think that's fair to say. You don't look at a lot of video. Yeah, like when we're coaching, I don't look at a lot. You ask me for videos all the time.

SPEAKER_00 24:55

Oh, yeah, you are yes, correct. You are not like you're you're seeing it. I'll say, and you'll be like, that was better, or that wasn't what I'm looking for. And I'll say, can you video it so I can see it? Right, right. That's the really the only video that I ever see you break out is when I say, I know I very rarely am looking at video.

SPEAKER_01 25:16

Right. The only times that I'm looking at video are with my online students because that's what I have to look at. I don't have, you know, and a lot of my online students have found places to get on force plates, they send me that information, uh, or they send me track mandate or whatnot. I think it's very difficult to look at video alone and go, okay, I like, I don't like, um without reference. So I think the big thing when it comes to recognizing patterns and the pieces that go along with the pattern is you got to understand when you're looking at a video of yourself, let's say, like what is the problem? Like start there and reverse engineer from there. So if you're a player and you're hitting the ball, you know, left or you're hitting the ball right, okay, well, is it a first question, is it a path issue or is it a face issue? And once again, a face is always a reaction to the path. So this is where I think a launch monitor is super handy dandy, because you'll see a lot of people that look like they swing it and out. Well, when you measure it on a launch monitor, you might find out that they flip it over the bottom, uh, which means they get stuck in shallow and transition, and then they have to release it just to hit the ball. Well, that looks really shallow because it is in transition, but then it steepens into the ball. So I think you want to have a launch monitor. I think you want to have an understanding of what the club path actually is versus what we feel or think it is. And then if we see that we have a club path that is more than negative two to positive two, I think all of a sudden it's like, oh, I have a face that's erratic, but that face is erratic because my path is extreme. And now we have to come up with a solution for how do I get that path more neutral? So if you're somebody who has a path that's really into out, which is very in vogue right now, I would say you want to add some steepeners to the golf swing. If you have somebody that's very left with their club path, then I say we want to add some shallowers. But generally speaking, most people don't have an understanding that the golf club either goes back shallow and comes back steep, or the golf club goes back steep and comes back shallow. So most people trying to fix a club path generally are trying to fix it in the downswing, and we actually have to fix it in the backswing. So I would say to answer your question, uh, in terms of getting things a little more lined up, is figure out whether you need some steepeners or you need some shallowers and take it from there. But it's difficult to say, hey, what I I could go on for six hours about what pieces match what. Um, but we've got to, we've got to, at minimum and at a starting point, we've got to understand what the club path is, and we've got to understand like whether I need a stronger face for that or a weaker face. So I'd say that's a great place to start, Alan. And sorry I can't be more specific with your question, but thank you again for the note. It's very kind. We appreciate it. Uh, and we will continue to bring it as he has asked us to do.

SPEAKER_00 28:31

It was a very like you waited until I was here and you're like, I'm gonna read this out loud to you. Yeah. And you were like, you can read it if you want, if you don't believe me. So it was very nice, very much appreciated.

SPEAKER_01 28:44

Um but going back to patterns, well, going, we'll stay right here.

SPEAKER_00 28:49

And he's asking, you know, what do you look for? How would you with your point about the launch monitor? And we'll just use me as an example. We're back in the teaching center, and we're trying to get at one point you were like, all right, let's see a path that goes left. And I'm like, okay, okay, I'll show you a path that goes left. And I swing, and I'm like, oh, that's gonna be five left, and it's three to the right. And I'm I was like, well, something's wrong with the track. And you're like, let's see as left as you can get it, and I think it moved to like two to the right. So it and I would have I would have said you were crazy. I would have said you were crazy or the track bands wrong, and you could see it, like you were like, I don't think that's left enough. And then the number would pop up and it wasn't left enough. Yeah, it wasn't left at all. And we moved it to like 0.2 to the right, and we celebrated because it was like the closest thing to left. So it took us a minute, but it's excuse me, I think it is vital to have the launch monitor because we would have uh we would have never gotten there.

SPEAKER_01 30:23

Um yeah, you would have just gotten mad at me and been like, dude, you've lost your mind. Yeah. Like I know what I feel, and I feel that like I was feeling, I was feeling um, but it's it's I don't think I could be me. You've seen me do this a lot. I can I can teach. Excuse me. I'm very proud of this, but I feel like I can teach pretty close to the same quality lesson without the tech. Without tech, yeah. Um, I feel pretty confident in that. But I don't think that I could be me and make the amount of change that I can make with somebody within an hour without the tech. And it's not so much, and don't get me wrong, there's times I need the tech. I you showed me a video last night when we were sitting on the patio, and you go, What do you think of this guy, Swing? And I was like, eh, I don't really like that one so much. And then you showed me another one, and I was like, and I played it a few times. And I was like, that's a and I think I said to you, that's an auto. Hey, I'm gonna put that guy in the force plates for I render an opinion. Because I don't see anything glaring to me. Yeah. Right. So that's where I feel like the tech makes me better is when I see something that a lot of good things are going on, and I have to try to improve it, then that's when you got to get into the the the granular stuff and you got you got to really kind of dig in and lean into the tech. Because I can't see forces and torques with my eyeballs. Nobody can. Um, but where I think the benefit of the technology really lies, and why I say I don't think I could be me without the tech, is because I can say whatever I'm saying to you, but it's an opinion when I say it. Yeah, but when I go, look at the screen, I'm sorry that's not left, Chuck. That is objective. Yeah. And now you're like, well, he's not crazy. I'm crazy, right? Like, why why guess when you can measure? Right. So I mean, I think that that's that's key. And and unfortunately, tech has its downsides as well, and and not everybody understands how to line the stuff up and how to use it properly and whatnot. But man, you it's really, in my opinion, and I know I'm gonna get blasted for this one. I think it's really hard to see a club path with the naked eye. Because, like I said, the bottom is very, very fast. And a lot of people, I mean, it looks like it is so shallow, and then all of a sudden that thing snaps over the bottom and it steepens up real quick, and then it's like it escapes behind the you can't see that. Yeah. So I I think it's really important. And I think that a lot of people are fearful of technology, especially our older players. Uh, they they they don't feel like they understand that or they don't know it. But I think there's a lot of data that it provides. I think it's over 40 data points with Trackman now. You know, you you don't have to get into all this, but like let's at least understand which direction the club's moving an impact. And is there a pattern there? Right? Is it consistently right? The the one gentleman that had the face that was closing was swinging the club when he came in, like six, seven, eight degrees to the right. And it's like he's like, Man, the ball goes, no kidding, the ball goes left. Because if the ball didn't go left, it'd be a mile right. Yeah. So the face, once again, being the reaction to the path, he's just trying to figure out a way to get this thing online, which is close the face because he's unaware of how extremely right he is swinging. So I I once again, I think that the tech is a great investment for a coach. It doesn't have to be a track man or a foresight. I mean, you can get a cheaper version that provides an accurate club path, but that's a great place to start if you're trying to work on your golf swing is hey, what's my club path? Is my club path consistent? And if it's consistent, well, congratulations. You've figured out your pattern. Now, if that's your pattern, does the face work with that pattern, or does

Finding Patterns With Launch Monitors

SPEAKER_01 34:20

the face work against that pattern? And one thing that I know we've talked a lot about on this trip, and it's something that I've known for a while, but maybe haven't articulated, is that I think people will look at track man and foresight and any kind of simulated environment completely wrong. And we talked about this. When you're in a simulator, like at Jeremy's place, uh, he was using a uh Bushnell unit, which is a nice unit. Uh, it's got the driving range mode up, and there's this white line right down the middle of it, right? And trackman does the same thing, Foresight does the same thing, and there's this white straight line. And what people really mess up is that people want the ball, they obsess about getting the ball to land on the white line, and it drives me bananas because what people fail to realize is that when you're in an indoor simulator or you're on a track man outside, or whatever the case may be, you're pointing the track man where you want the ball to start, not where you want the ball to land. And the problem is that when you're in a simulated environment and you can't see the ball flight, you think that you want to start it right of that line and draw it back on it, or you want to start it left of that line and fade it back on it. No, no, no, no, no. Your job is to start the ball on the line and then it curves off the line. That's your job. You're trying to control that the ball starts where you're aimed. Yeah. Doesn't start left of where you're aimed or right of where no, you want it to start where you're aimed. And this goes into our pattern recognition. So, what I want to see from a good player, A, if it's a really good player, I want some variability, but let's just keep it simple and say, I want to see that the ball starts on the line every time and draws off the line or draws away from yeah, draws left or right off the line, or draws or fades off the line. And the reason for that is that we as golfers don't hit perfectly straight golf shots. We don't. You tend to like to you kind of do a little of both, honestly. You kind of fade it a little bit with your driver and you kind of draw it a little bit with your irons right now. I think that's fair. So if you're hitting an iron off track, man, I want to see every ball start on the line and miss the line left. And then what I want you to do is I want you to be smart enough when you go to the golf course to recognize that if you're aiming at the pin, it's full's gold. You're not gonna hit a whole lot of shots close to the hole because we know that you draw your arms a little bit. So you're aiming right of the pin to get it to turn back towards the pen. But when you're aiming at the pin, when you don't hit straight golf shots, you're not gonna hit one close very often. If you do, it's a statistical anomaly. Yeah. Right? So I need players to understand, and this is probably the most important thing I've said on this podcast to date. We've got to understand that we're trying to control where the ball starts and then recognize the pattern that the ball draws or the ball fades. And then when we go on the golf course, we've got to take that white line and shift it relative to the pen so that our ball flight has a chance of landing on the pen. We can't just aim at the thing and expect to hit a perfectly straight golf shot. It's it's crazy. Yeah. Too hard to zero everything out. It's it's a terrible place to live. Like, and I I get it. In early track man days, you know, there were a lot of mistakes made. We didn't have a lot of research, not a lot of people had been on track man, and we thought zero everybody out was the answer, but we've learned and we realize that the line of the golf club is closer to 60 degrees than 90 degrees, and there's not anybody on the planet who swings it perfectly and uh on a straight line every single time. It just doesn't happen. So pick which one it's gonna be. It doesn't have to be severe, but even if it is severe, if you know what it is, you can build in enough curve to where you can still hit shots close. Kenny Perry seemed to play okay and literally hooked it 30 yards with a seven-iron. Like, but he knew that I better aim 30 yards right at that pin if I'm gonna hit one close. Yeah, it's just it's once again understanding your game and training in a meaningful way to where you understand what's going on.

SPEAKER_00 38:43

Uh I think that's the advantage of the launch monitor so that you can have an understanding of what your pattern is. Yeah. And as you've talked about, the the golf swing goes in phases where okay, you are too steep, you're gonna work shallow. Well, then you work it all the way to too shallow, and we so it's this constant back and forth. Uh, but once you see, like you're saying with me,

Stop Chasing The Simulator White Line

SPEAKER_00 39:20

my pattern is irons get path gets a little right, driver path gets a little left. Now, I would have told you feel-wise, okay, there's no way that that driver is four degrees. Like, it's not possible. I'm swinging out. I feel like I'm swinging out. That should be a plus four path. Nope, it's minus three this time. And it it at least gets you in the the the um ballpark of okay, there's my pattern. So right now I can't overdo the other. Like I can just keep overdoing, overdoing, overdoing, which is a nice place to be at times where you feel like, oh, I can just do this as much as I want. It's it's not gonna hurt me at the moment.

SPEAKER_01 40:11

Um, but it's it's kind of like, you know, you you wake up in the middle of the night and you need to use a restroom, it's pitch black. You're in, and for me, traveling, you're in unfamiliar rooms a lot of times, you know, you don't know where everything's at. And it's like, yeah, I could get to the bathroom with the lights off. I might stub my toe three times on the way, but I can I can figure it out, or I can just like turn the lights on and not stub my toes three times. And it's like, I just feel like so many golfers choose to live in the dark versus like turn the lights on, figure out what the pattern is, and like it's gonna help you play better golf.

SPEAKER_00 40:48

Well, there was you know, that we were getting the path left for me. Um, and then it was hey, we got to get the face a little bit more open or square. And I was like, okay, that one was that one was open. Wasn't open. Like we I mean, we spent another five swings trying to get the the face up. So it's I just don't know how you would get to places quickly without and I think we didn't.

SPEAKER_01 41:22

I think that I think that's really what technology does is that I don't know that it necessarily I don't know that it necessarily makes anybody better, but I do know that it helps people get better quicker. Yeah. I I know that for sure. Um because I I agree with you 100%. I I don't and my respect to the old guys that the older guys I should say that you know stood on the driving range with just two eyeballs and and somehow helped a lot of people play better golf. Like my hat's off to them. Like I just don't have the eyes for it. I never have. Uh I've never been somebody to to, you know, I had a listener reach out to me about uh a player on tour, and uh I I was just being honest, and I said, you know, I I haven't really looked into a swing. Well, I thought you, you know, watch this event. I I did watch the event. I just I I'm not somebody that's like looking at the swings going, well, he does this or he. And the reason is is because one, I don't know what their intent was behind the shot.

SPEAKER_00 42:22

I was about to say that piece to me is the biggest piece. Yeah. Like, how can you judge it if I'm if I'm unsure of what they were trying to do?

SPEAKER_01 42:33

Was he like he might have been trying to bump that thing for a while? Exactly. Like was it a foot? Did he even hit it full? Yeah, right. Like, so I don't know what the intent was on the shot. I don't know what the environmental factors were on that shot. Was the wind coming off the left and he was trying to hold one? Was the wind coming off the like I don't have like I just don't have enough information. And the thing that I think a lot of people miss uh when it comes to looking at golf swings on on Instagram, YouTube, uh especially golf coverage. I'll stick to golf coverage. Uh, the problem with golf coverage is the cameraman is not or camera woman, is not allowed to stand directly behind the player. They're not allowed to do that. They're always standing at an angle. Right? I just learned something new. I didn't know that they didn't stand right behind. Oh, I didn't I thought you knew that. So the camera person is not allowed to stand on the line of play. They are standing at an angle. Now, it might be a slight angle, and the TV kind of like because it flattens everything, it kind of straightens it out a little bit, but they're standing at an angle. So you don't even really have a straight line at what you're looking at. So I I just think that it's very misleading. I've proven to you multiple times how cameras lie to us about what we think we see in the golf swing. And I just I feel like that's not enough information to go, oh, this player X is doing these things based off. One swing I saw on TV. Like it just isn't enough information. So I think it's a dangerous game. And once again, you know, if you're me and I'm watching John Rom on TV, and I'm like, man, I like that John Rom swing. You know what? I think I'm going to do that, John Ron. I'm not built anything like John Ron. I I probably don't have the capability and or the capacity to swing the golf club like John Rom. We all want to pick Adam Scott swing. Not all of us are 6'2 and in great shape in Australia in a perfect square. Like you, you, if you're going to pick a tour player and go, man, that's my swing, maybe find somebody that looks like you and start there. And I get it, it's not the olden days where we had Craig Stadler out there and we could find some different body types. But, you know, you got to find somebody that at least kind of looks like you, similar height. You know, do you have a short torso and long legs, or do you have a normal torso and like short legs? Like we're not all configured the same way. And you got to find somebody who's at least configured kind of like you before you're going to say, that's the swing I want to make. Because if we had to pick, why wouldn't we all go back and swing it like Tiger did back in 2000? Yeah. That was the most dominant golf swing in in modern history. Why don't we all swing it like that? Like it just doesn't make a lot of sense, but then yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:27

But it is, I think it is important, and you said it, you have to know what your tendencies are. And you can change, you mean you you can make your movement patterns patterns change. You can do that. You can do it. Um and we did it today multiple times. Yeah. Um but you need to know what you're doing, and you need to know that it's gonna feel so extreme, yeah, making the changes.

SPEAKER_01 46:01

Yeah, and I think you know, everything that you do has to be in the name of ball flight. Everything has to tie back to the ball flight. It might feel better, it might feel crazy, it might really be different, but you're not gonna keep people in the seat trying this thing if they don't see the ball start doing something that they want it to do. Yeah. And that's that's really, I think, what gets lost is I remember I remember early days uh with force plates. I went and and shadowed a coach who, by all accounts, is very good on force plates. And I remember sitting in in the back of the bag just kind of watching. And I had permission to be there, of course, but like I was just kind of sitting back there watching, and he's like, Oh man, this is so much better. This is so much better, and da-da-da-da-da, and the speed's getting up and and all these things, and maybe it was, but I just watched this player's balls just go wider and wider and wider off the map, and I'm just like, I don't think this is better. It might move the graphs in a certain way, but I don't think what we're doing is in the best interest of this player, right? So it it has to it, like whether you're working on a launch monitor of a 3D or force plates or what have you, it's gotta come back to like, does this make the golf ball do what this player wants the golf ball to do? Are they gaining control of a their their window? And then are they hitting it through that window and getting it to curve in a predictable way? And if we can do that, you can play some really good golf. You don't have to hit it the farthest, you don't have to fade it, or you don't have to like you just have to be able to predict what it's gonna do. And then if you know what it's gonna do, or you can predict what it's gonna do, maybe think about that before you like pull the club out of the bag and like figure out what like build it into your strategy. And it's like, okay, cool. Like, you know, honestly, let's uh hypothetical, but let's say that we were playing a something of a meaningful. Uh let's say I was playing the club champion, club championship here at the honors, and let's just say you never would, but let's say I start on 10 and I'm coming down the stretch and I got a two-shot lead. And let's just say uh we're playing the back tees, and eight's like what, 230? The part three, yeah. Yeah, eight's like 230, right? There's water left, there's heather right. Uh, it is a very intimidating hole. It is. Uh, it it haunts my nightmares. But let's just pretend for a minute that I'm coming down the stretch, I got a two-shot lead, and we get to eight. And let's just say I don't know what the prevailing wind is, but let's say the wind's right to left. Okay. In that scenario, I may not be going for the green. In that scenario, I may not be going for the green. For a 230-yard shot, best case scenario, I'm hitting five wood. Likely three. Okay. Okay. From 230 out, I'm likely hitting kind of a less than full three wood, or I'm smoking a five wood.

SPEAKER_00 49:23

And you haven't even brought in are the greens firm. I haven't brought in. We haven't even uh talked about what the ball will do once it lands.

SPEAKER_01 49:31

Correct. We're just talking about getting it onto the surface, right? Or trying to get it onto the surface, right? But if I'm in that scenario, I know good and well that of all the shots I can remember hitting, when I miss it, it is by and large right to left more than I want, way more frequently than it's ever left or right. I almost never hit one left or right. Almost never. That's my pattern. I tend to get a little underneath, I get the path to the right, and then my face shuts because I'm trying to get it on target and I overcook it and it winds up moving too far left. I swear to you, in that scenario, I may not be going for the green. I may think about that on the T and go, man, yeah, I can, I I could pull this shot off. But I know me, and I know I can hit in that water with the best of them. Right. And if I hit in that water, my two shot lead is now gone.

SPEAKER_00 50:30

Yeah, because now you're most likely didn't cover much of anything. So you go to the drop zone, 50, 60 yards away. Right. And now you're trying to get up and down just to say, say boat. Right.

SPEAKER_01 50:46

I, in all honesty, might pull like six iron, lay it up somewhere, find something. But I can promise you, in a practice round, pretending I'm not a member here, like and I'm not a member here, so I'm not pretending. But like it could be an honorary. Yeah, it could be, right? Keep your fingers crossed. Uh, but like, in all honesty, like if I'm prepping for that event, I am figuring out where I can lay this ball up to on this hole. Because it's a nightmare, it's an absolute nightmare. And my tendency doesn't help this nightmare get any better. Yeah. So once again, like understanding my pattern, and like, look, I get it. Like, ego takes a hit. Like, I'm lighting up on a part of three. Like, I get it, but I can lay up and make four, right? I could potentially hit the shot, play it super safe, hit it in the heather, maybe make four, right? It's if you find it. If you find it. I can't, I mean, it is almost impossible to hit it in that water and make four. Yeah. You put a lot of pressure on your short gun. Right. And and luckily I can fall on that thing. But at the same time, like I'm realistically and going, you know what? I feel a lot better about a 60-yard wet shot than I do a 230-yard three wood that I can potentially hit in the water. Because while the the chances are that I hit it, you know, it's probably a 30% chance that I hit it in the water with a three-wood, it's a zero percent chance I hit in the water with a 60-yard shot. Yeah. And I'm just trying to keep, oh, I got like, dude, I can survive a bogey here. I cannot survive a double. Yeah. Yeah. And like that's that's goes back to our conversation about what are your tendencies, what are your patterns, what's going to happen under pressure, and how do you protect yourself and shoot the lowest score possible? And that that might be in that scenario, that might be the best way forward.

SPEAKER_00 52:43

Well, you said it to me the other day. You said, Well, how how well what would your score be if every shot you hit was a B B plus? Yeah. Like, how how well would you score? And um, that was kind of a revelation a bit of well, you're right. If I just if it was just bees all across the board, then yeah, you've probably done some really good things and you've lucked into a couple birdies, and you've probably not made many boats, right? Hitting bees all across the board. Right.

SPEAKER_01 53:17

I mean, it this is a very hard, challenging golf course, 78-2, 155. And bees, yeah, you probably a couple bogeys, you know, you're probably making worst case scenario with you. You're probably making four bogeys with all bees because it's just a very challenging golf course. And, you know, the greens are are getting very firm and fast, as we've talked about, uh, and tournament shape. Uh so yeah, so you know, maybe you make four four bogeys, but they probably made three birdies, but you probably made two or three birdies and you're shooting pretty close to par. And you're definitely shooting under the expected score that you would shoot out here. So it's not about this fantasy land of I'm gonna hit every shot dead straight, and I'm gonna ball strike this thing to death, and I'm gonna hit every shot in a a plot. Like, you can't live in that world, you just can't, like, it's not reasonable. And look, maybe there's a day that that happens. I mean, God bless you if it does. It's never happened. I've never had a day where I went out there and I said, I hit every shot properly. Yeah, that's never happened. Yeah, I've never shot 59. You know, like I've never, and and I think, and I've talked to a couple guys who have shot 59s in tournaments, and I'm like, man, was it just your day or what? They're like, Man, you know, I left a couple out there, you know, like always. It's it's always there. Um, I just I haven't met anybody who's ever played a perfect round of golf. I'm sure there's people who are gonna reach out and say that they have, and God bless them, and that's great for them. But if you played you might have played really above your normal, but I don't think anybody's ever played a perfect round of golf, nor would I even know what that looks like. Yeah, you know what's a perfect round of golf for 2000 Tiger Woods? I mean, 55, 54, 53. I don't know. So I I just I I think we like to think that way, and it's great to have goals and aspirations, but those goals and aspirations have to be based on some kind of reality.

Strategy Under Pressure With Your Miss

SPEAKER_00 55:21

Uh I I think that the major theme, and I noticed it more this this time that you were here, was figuring out someone's pattern and working through okay, are we refining? Do we want to change? Some guys it was, hey, I I I want to change. Some guys it was, hey, I like, I don't mind what you're doing. Let's keep doing that, but maybe we could just tweak one or two things. So I I think that's that's where the coaching takes over of yeah, are we making a full pattern change? What do we like? What do we don't like?

SPEAKER_01 56:06

Yeah. Um it's also recognizing like what people can do, right? So, you know, you take the environmental factors into account, and you got somebody who is a degen like us, right? And they spend a lot of time with the golf course and they love to practice. Okay, like I'm willing to go, hey, kind of like with you, like you have really lofty goals and and really high expectations of yourself, and excuse me, we want to make a lot of change and we want to progress and we want to get better as a as a player. Okay, fine. Like, let's let's start going down this rabbit hole of really cleaning things up and and getting things to where we can keep working through this, and that's great. You get another guy. I've had a couple of these that, you know, they got three, four, five kids at home. Um, you know, the wife, every time they're at the golf course, is texting, you know, emailing when you're coming home, you know, like you get that guy that just doesn't have time. And it's like, how about we work with what we got and try to make this a little better, right? Because he doesn't have the time to commit to making a change and and to working through this and doing those things that maybe you would. So, you know, I think a big part of it is you gotta listen to their needs, figure out what what do they really want? Like, what is and I used to say this, maybe I should start saying I might say this a lot tomorrow because I just thought of this. But I used to ask people, I go, if I was a big blue golf genie and I could grant you one wish here today, what would it be? What would it be? Right? And like generally, people, you know, they they don't have unreasonable request.

SPEAKER_00 57:51

Yeah, it'll usually be something simple as what you heard today. I don't want to see it go left.

SPEAKER_01 57:56

Yeah, right. Like it usually should be something simple. And and sometimes it's maybe a little more I want to eat the ball farther, right? Okay, fine. Like ball flight be damned. Yeah, we're gonna increase the speed because that's what this right. So I I think you gotta you gotta figure out like what why did they come here today? You know, did I'm not they didn't come here to make a friend, they came here because they have a want or they have a need, and it's my job to help them with that. So I think you you kind of figure that out, and then you go, okay, great. Like, how do I get them this with as least how do I get them this being as as least as less invasive as I can be? And how do I get them this in a way to where it fits in their life? And you know, a lot of people, man, it's it's like I have this conversation with them, and I'm like, look, you have a very busy life, you're a high-powered attorney, and you got three little kids at home, and you don't have a lot of time. And the time you do have, you want to be on the golf course, you don't want to be on the driving range. So, you know, you sometimes have to talk people back to reality and go, hey, you know, maybe later in life, once you've retired and you've built this practice and you've sold whatever, then we can talk about these big goals. But for right now, man, like let's just keep it in play, right? Like, how do I help you keep this thing in play? So I think you just really have to weigh it all, and that's that's kind of the art of coaching, right? Is you just have to weigh all these factors and go, how do I help this person today? And that's what I try to do.

SPEAKER_00 59:35

Yeah, and and whether it's granting wishes as golf coach, or just what you said there of as you're talking to the player or the the client, and you're asking about their life, like then you are able to say, All right, what if what can I do? Because what you and I do is very different than like friend of the show, Wayne Brantley. He's always complaining that he has no time, that he's got no time, and that I'm getting the good lessons. And and it's like, well, there's so there what we're able to do is so far removed from me, Wayne's busy guy, and and when he's not busy, he does not want to be on the range and he wants to be playing golf, he wants to be on the golf trip. And I think that's such a another key factor that I hadn't thought about until you said that. That sign of a good coach is figuring out well what's the what's the time look like that can practically go into what you want to do.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:47

So I I I've always struggled with it too, because so I worked for a gentleman, uh, great guy. I miss him dearly, he's passed away now, and I'll never forget this, but I if I don't remember the scenario exactly, but we were talking, and I was talking about a client that I had been teaching. And I said, Isn't this so interesting? Like, he's doing this and that and all these things, and he's involved with this. And I was like, Man, he's just like really, I didn't know he was involved with all this stuff. And the gentleman that I worked for, he goes, How do you know all that? I said, Well, I was talking to him and kind of figuring out what's going on, and he's like, Oh, and and he wasn't he's not, he was a great guy, he was very personal, but he never wanted to talk to any of his clients about their life because he felt like he was being intrusive. And I sometimes feel like people maybe think I'm being a bit intrusive because I do ask a lot of questions that maybe don't pertain to their golf game. But to your point, like I'm trying to figure out like what's your life look like? You know, like what's going on? Do you even have time for any of this? Like, and it's important because you have to factor that in because there are a lot of golfers who really desperately want to be better and want to shoot low scores. But if you don't have time to practice and you don't have time, like if if your time is going to be spent on the golf course, we're gonna have to work in very small pieces because we can't shake this monkey tree. You just you're not gonna be able to really make big changes on the golf course. Now, if you're gonna go and go to the rock pile and work your butt off and put four out, fine, we can make big changes. Like, let's go. But if you're like, hey, I play golf and I want to see it do this on the golf course, okay. Well, we're gonna have to work one piece at a time because I got to get you to where you can still get it around the golf course. I can't send you out there with 10 swing thoughts and and expect you to play decent.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:04

Because there's the difference in what you as your mindset as as the coach okay, this guy, this guy just needs to play better. So we can make one little tweak here or there, whereas you've got another guy that maybe like myself that, like, all right, we we're probably gonna start playing better with things we're doing, but there may be a time where we're in this lull for a minute because we're as you said, we're you're trying to your body is so used to doing one thing, and for someone that practices a lot, like you've told me, your body gets so used to doing that thing that it is even harder to flip it the other direction.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:52

And it it's honestly like you're a dream client for me, because and I I've said this repeatedly, and it's true, I'm not saying because he's sitting here, but like you work harder on your golf game than most of the professional players that I work with work on their golf game. Uh, and that's a testament to you and and your willingness to commit to this.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:14

Um, I'm single, I have no children that I know of, and I have no other hobbies. So that it lends itself to it. It does lend itself to that.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:23

Um, but it it's as much of a dream as that is for me as a coach, it's also like I have to be very careful, and I have to really keep an eye on you. Because, like, if if we get a little off with our communication or you misinterpret something I say, or I don't say it well, you're gonna go and hit 500 to a thousand balls before I see this next or we talk about this next, because you're a range rat, right? So is as good as it can be to have time, if you do have time, it has to be really managed well in terms of are we doing the correct thing and making the change, or am I just out here beating balls, you like to call it therapy? Am I out here in a therapy session and I fall back into my old thing? And now we're just ingraining the old thing again. We're not getting that new thing to happen. So I think it's really important with people who do spend a lot of time, uh, that you you really got to be kind of almost a helicopter parent with them and make sure, like, and you know, hey, we need to have some stations, we need to have some drills, we need to have some reinforcement there to make sure you're staying on track and not like getting tired because you like to hit a lot of balls and just falling into those old habits. So I think

Matching Coaching To Real Life

SPEAKER_01 1:05:50

that's super helpful too.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:52

Well, it's been a great trip. It's not over yet. Yes, another full day tomorrow.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:00

been a a great trip we uh we got you some waffle house which i think we've talked about before is one of your favorites i do love a waffle house um i do i was so disappointed wane has taken chuck has taken me to what i graded out a solid b plus waffle house and as much as i love chuck chuck does not find his way to the waffle house nearly enough but i i do love a greasy spoon you do i i like that kind of breakfast party but you're but you're right the waffle house it was a very nice waffle house i was chuck was fearful for his life i was a little and i explained to him that this was a B plus Waffle house nobody was killed while we were there there were no fistfights no was killed no nobody was like drunk and escorted out I was very disappointed you didn't get the true Waffle House experience it's a very nice well-mannered Waffle House but I think that takes away from it I don't know but the fact it probably also didn't help that I was my back was to the entire restaurant but that adds to the fear which is part of the Waffle House experience and I yeah I was shifty in my seat I am dragging Chuck down to my level public golf and Waffle House Delore we're going to bring him back I'll go I would rather go to Waffle House than deal with public golf. Oh you hate it you you and you once again you got a B plus public and I got it yeah you gotta you haven't even seen the atrocities that are out there so yeah uh but you've got dragging Chuck down to my level I'm I'm happy you're pulling me up I'm dragging we're gonna meet in the middle it's gonna be wonderful a well balanced life you got another full day tomorrow yeah um wish we were playing some golf but you got another full day um hopefully we get a chance to hit a couple balls before you you get out of here talking I would be shocked if we don't yeah and uh I don't think you will let me leave like I won't I will be in the Delta Sky Club and Chuck will be making golf spots I can guarantee it. I don't think I have a Sky Club in the Chattanooga Airport. Unfortunately we do not have one of those that's a shame um shout out to Delta feel free to be the official airline provider of this podcast at any given time. Yeah you did get the upgrade you got the first I did get the upgrade I'm up to first living life uh and you're on the direct flight direct flight it is nice that Chattanooga has us direct to Detroit it's wonderful thank god for who is it Volkswagen down here it is Volkswagen that's the only reason connecting the automotive center yeah we know yeah we know it doesn't fly all day yet but it's very limited flights yet but you can you can get direct but the the nice thing about down here is also is that you're only two hours from Atlanta which is like a 35 minute flight so even if you do have to connect the only problem is the the the windows of your connections are tight uh at Atlanta in Atlanta you don't want a tight window. No especially if you got a golf bag which you you that has to make I'd rather I'd probably rather have the worst flight experience than my golf bag not make it we've got to expose you to playing with Reynolds too that's that's next we're gonna do public golf with you playing with Reynolds that's gonna be a glorious time. I can't wait to see it. Gosh I'm gonna be such an ornery old man you are very sending your ways it's okay. So I think it is getting late uh I have to teach tomorrow Chuck has to go out and and close deals because that's what he does best. But it's been wonderful being here. I'm very appreciative of Chuck uh for being a tremendous host and taking care of me and I think I can say it without getting in too much trouble. But every time I come to Chattanooga I know I got a friendly pimp and truck that's going to make sure that I stay plenty busy uh and I'm gonna be fed and get to where I need to be so thank you uh very much for pimping me out while I'm here in Chattanooga. Uh it's really been great. I've enjoyed every visit and I've enjoyed obviously building a relationship with you uh which has been wonderful so I'm very appreciative of you very appreciative of the honors they are most gracious uh and they give me these amazing uh accommodations every time I'm here and I truly get to enjoy the honors experience the way it's meant to be enjoyed so thank you to Henrik and the entire staff at the honors everybody involved membership's great uh but I really am thankful that I get to you know travel do these things and it really is amazing getting to come places like this and share experiences and and just have a wonderful time so when's the last time you went to a club three times in one year have you done that I've done that I've been to facilities a few times in a year I don't know that I've been to a club three times in a year. So we've probably set that record for we've set that record. Okay yeah so and I love it I like Chattanooga um if you're like me uh and and I I get accused of knowing a lot of things I argued the opposite that I know nothing uh but I definitely didn't know how big Chattanooga was uh it's a lot bigger than you think like it's a lot bigger than I thought it was and there's a lot of cool stuff here people are amazing I've not met anybody who isn't a delight um so yeah I say uh we'll do a little like visit Chattanooga tourism ad. Maybe they can sponsor the podcast. So uh I say come to Chattanooga check it out and if you're really special and you're really fortunate maybe you'll meet somebody that is a member here and get to come out and enjoy this amazing experience because it's it's it really is it's it's one of here's a fun one for you I have the honors of my top five love that how about that so um yeah I'm looking forward to getting healed up and getting playing some golf again and coming down here and rolling the dice and seeing what it's got in store for me because it is it's my kind of joint man I like them hard and I like them mean and this place is definitely that and you'll see it on TV in about a month.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:35

Yeah it's uh I think we're all looking forward to how it's gonna present on TV.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:41

Yeah I I hope that I hate golf courses on TV. They never do it just like Augusta just like Shinikan and the shot is never wide enough to really let you see the surrounds um and it it it it really I mean it's a great golf course and there's not like waterfalls and there's not that stuff but man is pretty and I I just hope that that people you know get a chance to come out you know and and I think a great idea is you know come down to the USA and watch some great golf and and get to walk the property and see how amazing it is and it's it really is cool. So I I highly recommend it. It's in my top five uh favorite places it's probably in my top one uh for places I love coming to work so uh yeah I I definitely I can't endorse it enough you got anything else you want to add I think that's it this has been fun always enjoy having you down um you know my big brother's in town and we've been grinding away at some golf gotta if I'm your big brother then a couple of the kids have been a noobs in the family so yeah it's been great man uh and it's it yeah I'm it's not lost on me every bit of this is because of you so thank you again and and by the way I hear you and I agree with you I think Chuck has really made the podcast better and I would not want to do the podcast without him so thank you very much uh for being part of the podcast I think you make it immensely better and for our few listeners who have made the comment yes uh I have been told I have a voice for radio apparently it is very soothing but I have the voice he has the face and now we're a perfect pair so I think

Where To Follow And Work Together

SPEAKER_01 1:14:40

that wraps us up. Absolutely awesome so if you want to see the face and not just hear the voice you got to go to our YouTube channel uh you can find us by going to YouTube searching for Measured Golf you will find not only our podcast but the content we've created if you're interested in learning about matchups or or how the body works and you're looking for some answers we've got a lot of great content on our YouTube channel you can also uh find the podcast by down or searching measured golf podcast anywhere that you download your favorite podcast and you can reach out to us directly as Alan has done so you can find me on Instagram at measuredgolf or at the force plate guy which tends to be a little more active than the measured channel you can find Chuck at Hubblow423. And if all this is just a bit too much to remember you can always find me at my website at measuredgolf.com where you can not only reach us directly but you can also uh send a message to me about potentially working together online to help you better understand your own golf game and get you playing some better golf. So thanks again for tuning in. It's a treat coming to you from Chattanooga. And until next time keep grinding