Gaming The System - The Feminist Gaming Podcast

222 Gamer Guilt Episode 04 - Backlogs, Bias & Letting Go

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In this final instalment of our Gamer Guilt series, we delve into the emotional baggage of gaming: the backlog shame spiral, perfectionism, and the internalised pressure to “do it right.” Hosted by Jem, with Alex and Matt in conversation, this episode is a thoughtful, funny, and heartfelt wrap-up on how guilt seeps into our gaming habits—and how we can begin to let it go.

Do you really need to finish every game you start?
From towering game libraries to piles of unread books, we explore the guilt of not finishing—and why sometimes we need to remember that the journey, not the destination, is enough.

Therapy, spreadsheets, and the Hitman roguelike spiral
Matt walks us through his epic journey modding Hitman: Freelancer, tracking progress via spreadsheets, and why he abandoned completionism in favour of joy.

Game shame: Are mobile games ‘real’ games?
We challenge our own gaming snobbery: Is playing FIFA or mobile puzzle games somehow less valid than a 100-hour epic RPG? And what does our choice of games say about us?

Wisdom from Gotham’s Hugo Strange
Yes, really. We discuss 

Favourite moments from the episode:

  • Alex’s reflections on (not) finishing Assassin’s Creed Valhalla— and why that’s okay.
  • Jem and her daughter finally completed It Takes Two after months away from it, rediscovering its warmth and wit.
  • Matt shares an unexpectedly moving quote from Gotham, featuring a truth-serum-induced confession and a villain’s twisted kind of absolution.

If you struggle with Gamer Guilt, listen to this episode. We guarantee you'll remember that it’s okay to enjoy yourself. No justification required.

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Hello and welcome back to another episode of Gaming the System, the podcast where three intersectional feminists examine gaming and games through a feminist lens. I'm your host for today. I'm Gem and I'm here with my friends Alex and Matt. So before we get started, if you want to support us, you can subscribe to our patron at patreon. com forward slash gaming the system for some exclusive content, or you can send us a one off donation via PayPal to our email address. We are gaming the system at gmail. com.

Jem:

Let's talk about finishing games and the idea of backlog anxiety. We've talked a little bit about having piles of books and piles of games, metaphoric, imaginary piles of games. So do you feel pressure to finish the games that you start to play?

Alex:

I definitely do. In the same way as you said Jim, I definitely feel that for books as well. I don't know how it has happened but since university I've stopped finishing books. Like I find it so hard to actually finish a book. I feel it's like a really rare achievement when I actually do finish a book and more often than not it's non fiction

Jem:

interesting.

Alex:

Yeah, it's changed around, so I used to read a lot more fiction when I was younger and now I'm reading more non fiction, which is interesting. But yeah, I definitely have that sense of yeah. Why have, you've got piles and piles of books, and just like I've got piles and piles of games. It's a thing that came up in therapy multiple times. That I have bad feelings about the amount of stuff that I start and don't finish. Because it says that I can't see things through enough. But yeah, and then my therapist would ask me things like, well, what's the worst thing that will happen if you don't finish something? And got me to try and reframe it in that, what am I getting out of the experience even if I don't complete it fully? I'm still taking something away from it. So I've got to the point where Even if I don't experience the proper ending of a game, you can still experience what a game has to offer for you. Sometimes you might get to that point after loads and loads of hours. Say, for example, I haven't finished the story in Assassin's Creed Valhalla, but I feel like I've finished that game because I've put in Nearly 200 hours. And I think that's more than enough to have experienced what Valhalla has to offer. And I very much enjoyed it, but I just can't finish it. It's too much. And after a certain amount of time, the funny thing, the difference between gaming and reading is we all know how to read a book when we open it. When you go back into a game after months and months, you have to relearn the controls. So, that's an interesting. Extra barrier to actually finishing is maybe it just feels all too overwhelming for lots of people because it's like an extra step that you have to go through to actually get back on to the path towards finishing.

Jem:

We've talked, haven't we, about how it would be really useful for some of the more complicated games to have a sort of

Alex:

Recap. Yeah.

Jem:

that you can do when you go in. I really liked it actually on

Alex:

Oh yeah. Yeah.

Jem:

They had that. So if you went away and then you came back a few weeks later, they would do a little so where were you,

Alex:

They do similar stuff sometimes for stories. Like in The Witcher, whenever you reloaded, they'd have a little recap of where you were. But yeah, it's not quite the same for controls, is it? Yeah.

Jem:

What about you, Matt? How do you feel about your backlog of games? Do you have a backlog of games?

Matt:

Yes, this is something that I alluded to in the last episode. That I was looking for. It's one of those areas in life where, Every time you come round to it, You go, Oh, I need to do something, I need to do something about that, Or, that isn't quite right. And then you do something else, You come back to, oh yeah, that still isn't quite right. And go around that cycle for a while. And this has come The last few months From When I looked at my gaming record from last year and I put it all together and it turns out I'd finished 30 games And I looked at it and went, that's really good, that's a good amount of games, that's a solid amount of games If I live for another 60 years, 60 times 30, that's good But, in the first two months of the year, I, my mindset has twisted to be looking ahead and going Oh shit I've been playing bloody Final Fantasy for a hundred hours. That's like a month's worth of gaming. How the hell am I going to fit in another 29 games in the rest of the year? And I have to pull myself back and going, okay, that's not, so that's the pressure then that's what your therapist was conveying very well is if you feel, we all feel pressures inside our heads that inform us to one degree or another in different areas. And to go, right, I'm feeling this pressure to play more games. Okay, you can say, well, the more games you play, the better. Then you go, well, is there, if you rush through games and don't really enjoy them, does that add more? And then it quickly, you untangle it a bit and go, oh yeah, this pressure is coming from a very, One that tells you that you're not good enough because you're not playing games well enough. That you're spending too much time on games. So, recognizing that bit is the first part, but then go of that side of things as well so that I can just relax into what I'm playing. So really enjoying Final Fantasy, not thinking about the game I'm going to play next or what I'm going to play for the rest of the year. So that's one thing I've clocked. It's taken me two months to properly notice it, but that's the nature of things. So if I could just relax and not think about what I'm playing I'd probably get to the end of the year and go Oh, Yeah. I played a load of games and I enjoyed them all I enjoyed them because I was following what I felt like doing because you never know what you feel like doing until you doing it and So that was one element. The other element, the big element, is with Hitman.

Jem:

Okay.

Matt:

how Freelancer works again, which is the roguelike playing playing element, which is, there are basically 18 maps from across the series and you have to eliminate syndicates and each campaign is Made up of four syndicates and you do three random missions and a showdown Four five six and so basically it's you have to do you have to Complete I think 18 missions in a row to complete a campaign and over the last year on my PC I've completed 68 and all the challenges like the trophies you get for it, I've completed all of those apart from two of them. One of them is collecting all of the items in the safe house 10 times. So you collect them all and then you go up a prestige level they all go away you have to build up again and I am on the final one of them but then the other one I'm nowhere near to close to finishing is the amount of campaigns. have to do a hundred campaigns It took me over a year to do 68, and then my original plan had been to complete all of the challenges for Freelancer, and then I would go to a modded version of Freelancer that basically wouldn't actually. expands it to three times the size and scale in terms of adding tons of more content to it. That when I first got my PC, I didn't know enough about modding to be able to make that work, to actually get it, to install it. And I was thinking, right, once I've got to that 100, I'll start from scratch and work out how

Alex:

Yeah.

Matt:

Freelancer Variations works and start again and I've been stressing for the last month at Going, Jesus, if I complete perfectly a campaign a day to get the next 32 campaigns completed, that would take a month of per being perfect

Alex:

Yeah.

Matt:

of All of a sudden this thing that is for me is about relaxing in the moment, or it's just about the next

Alex:

become pressurized.

Matt:

you can think. Fuck the pressure, the catastrophic destructive pressure to go right, you need to do this perfectly, and you can't do something different until, you finish this, because that's the goal that you've set for yourself. So I was able to go after that, Once you feel that sort of intensity of that pressure, that's when it's that's the opportunity to go, Oh shit, yeah, that's completely wild and disproportionate, get rid of that. So what I've done is Started from scratch. So, basically, the modding landscape of Hitman is quite complicated in a way that I didn't realise before. So basically, I got to a point where I can actually transfer my progress from what I'm doing currently over to This new modded version with this Freelancer Variations pack. So it's literally just as if the game developers have released an update and this entire new stuff is added. That's the impact it's had. And so throw that prologue expression out the window. And then I go, ooh, and I've enabled all of the extra variations on extra 30 missions. And then. Press play to start. Ooh, this is somewhere exciting. And then, was instantly overwhelmed by the sheer amount of differences that there were. Fucking proper panic. That, shit, this is really difficult now. I'd just gotten used to it.

Alex:

Yeah.

Matt:

then, I was able to go into, Okay, so this is what I've been thinking about. Thinking it would just be a simple change. And then, I've been going into, You can, there's a massive spreadsheet, A list of all the different variations. And you can literally go through it, And toggle on and off the bits. So I've been able to go from, Adding all of them, going, I'm not doing enough, to going, okay, I can do more, and they go, oh, okay, that's too much, and instead of going, right, I'll just need to knuckle down and bash my head against the wall until I get used to all of these variations, or you can just cross the ones off the list and do the bits that you enjoy doing, and then go and feel your way from there, and it takes so much practice. and doing that kind of thing over and over again of going, oh yeah, pressure! You can get, let go of the pressure. More pressure!

Jem:

Yeah.

Matt:

fucking, yeah it's mad, but it's the best, it's the best way. It's the best way still, really. And it does, being like, being the mindfulness and, thinking about stuff, it doesn't make it impossible for you to feel that pressure.

Jem:

We've talked, haven't we, about not feeling guilty about playing in easy mode and things like that, and I think that's all part of it. You can put a lot of pressure on yourself and suddenly something that's supposed to be fun is more like a job. And less like fun and I think it is important to always try and bring yourself back to this is a hobby. This is fun. Yes, absolutely set yourself challenges, but not to the point that it becomes a stressful of your life. And I'm sure we've all been in that space at one time or another. I know I, I certainly have been and. And I think it's difficult, isn't it, sometimes to get that balance between setting yourself a challenge, achieving something that requires a bit of discipline, a bit of effort. and it tipping over into the edge of not being fun anymore there is definitely a gray area where something can be frustrating and annoying and difficult and require effort but there's also a sense of real achievement at the end of succeeding something like that and My daughter and I finally finished It Takes Two

Alex:

Oh, well done.

Jem:

Yeah, and it was so nice. We hadn't played it for about six months since the summer. And I said to her, because it's been half term, I said, Oh, can we maybe make some time to play, just. because I felt like we were near the end. And she finally agreed and actually played with me, which is impressive for a 17 year old. And it was so much fun. And what was lovely about it was Unlike so many other games, we were actually just able to jump back in. And within minutes she was saying, Oh, I forgot how funny it was, how bad you are at jumping.

Matt:

Ha!

Jem:

So that was good, I didn't let her down. It was so satisfying to get to the end of it. And one of the things that I really appreciated was The storytelling of games is so important and I completely hear what you're saying Alex and I've have I've not finished way more games than I've finished in my life and I think, you can get a real feel for it, but coming to the end of the story,

Alex:

It is

Jem:

finding it all tied up is a thing and it has a value outside of the gaming value. It has a sort of completion of telling the story and reaching the end of that story and all the lessons that can teach you. And It Takes Two is an

Alex:

It's amazing. Yeah. I think the next one from that developer's coming out next month

Jem:

Yeah, it's, yeah, I think it's like the 5th of March or

Alex:

something, like that. It's quicker than we think. Yeah.

Matt:

I'm so envious of them because they've cut it's called Split Fiction and it's about two authors, a sci fi author and a fantasy author in their, in the worlds that they've created and that is the most genius. Concept for a game ever. I am gutted that I didn't come up with So that's

Jem:

it when people do that, I did not think of that. But I think it's I think yeah, we have to remember that we're gaming for fun. And that, that always has to be the thing to come back to. And it's not about completionism. It's not about I don't know, raw dogging. It's not about all of that stuff. It's about enjoying it and spend, how you are spending your free time. And. Yeah, keeping that balance is quite important. I go on.

Matt:

quite a a wanky Saying that it is it's just a wanky like Live life live laugh love kind of thing, but I find it incredibly useful is The process versus the outcome, The difference between living your life based on one or the other. Because if I do what part of me was doing, which was going, Oh my god, you need to finish this, finish that, finish this, finish that. Finish the prestige levels, finish more games, finish the freelancer campaigns. And then, all of a sudden, all you've got is this list of Destinations, and you think, God, I have no idea how I'm going to get to these destinations, how long it's going to take. All I know is I'm not there yet and that makes me feel like shit. Whereas if you're like with Valhalla, You were on a journey through that, through the process of games is particularly useful because you can't skip anything. You're literally in charge of the process. of doing it. And if you play it for 70 percent for 70 hours and you know there's still 30 to go, but you've enjoyed every step of that Then it doesn't matter where you finish. If you're enjoying the process, then you're good. Then nothing else matters really.

Jem:

That's a thing in itself, isn't it?

Alex:

Yeah.

Jem:

Yeah.

Matt:

so that's my wanky bit of wisdom.

Jem:

I did want to find out how you feel about your game choices and how they're perceived, because there are people out there who will only play FIFA one of the most popular games out there because it's socially acceptable game because it's about football and, there are people out there who will only play first person shooters like Fortnite because That's perceived in a certain way. I think, the three of us tend to like the more fantasy side. And story led games, or at least story rich games. Are there any games that you've said I can't buy that because of the way people might perceive me because I'm playing that, or, you might not want to say.

Alex:

I don't think I have ever felt that way about any of the games that I've played. But I do feel like I have some bias about players that only play FIFA or only play Fortnite. I think there's a very stereotypical view of those players. While I was at uni I remember one of my flatmates only had FIFA to play. On their console. And I was like, oh wow, you're not a real gamer then, are you? Only two things. Just because that's what you do at uni. But yeah. In my head I was just like, well, he's not really a proper gamer like me. So yeah, I do have, there is that bias that works the other way around as well. I think it's quite interesting to think about. But yeah, I never felt bad about any of the games that I've played about. No, or pressured to buy certain games because of the way they are perceived, no.

Jem:

Yeah, I think it's interesting what you said about a proper gamer

Alex:

yeah.

Jem:

because there is definitely some of that. And

Alex:

I think it's almost self informed, isn't it? Like your idea of a gamer is what you play and what you like, and it's not like what anyone else is. But,

Jem:

exactly. And I feel like mobile games aren't really proper games.

Alex:

Yeah.

Jem:

a gamer if you play just mobile games, but actually we've talked about it

Alex:

We have.

Jem:

There are many ways of gaming and, board gaming and role playing and all of those and as I earlier confessed to having spent a year playing ever me, I have stopped now actually.'cause I had to go culture. How do you feel about your choice of games?

Matt:

I'm at, A place where I

Alex:

Yeah,

Matt:

energy to argue with people about Playing I, I have strong opinions about things like Fortnite. I don't understand it and I want to, if I was king, I would ban fortnite and anything that was free to play with mitro transactions. That's my late night at the pub soapbox rant thing I would go on. But then if someone comes up to me and said, Oh, I play fortnite. I go, do you enjoy it? And they go, yeah, I go, good for you. And that's fine. And. I just, I find with games, like with music, you can't Music is so special in that it can, it's a connection to the soul, I find with music because it cuts through all of the artifice the mental stuff the, subconscious stuff. It really just cuts through and you can't choose what. Touches you in that way, but when you find that thing you need to hold on to it really tight because that thing is That's the gold dust things that you need to be opening yourself to as you go through life and I'm just so Just find so much pleasure and comfort in the things that I like to play The I just I'm not bothered. I'm just not bothered I haven't got the energy to care what people think about my gaming because I just want to play the games that I enjoy and do the things that I like. And I want, unlike what a lot of people seem to want, it goes, I want to do what I want and I want everyone else to feel like shit and to hate themselves and to have a miserable time. Whereas I just want to be left alone so I can enjoy myself and everyone else can enjoy themselves. I want everyone else to have a decent life where they get to do the things that they enjoy.

Jem:

Yeah, I think that Doing this podcast has completely changed my attitude to my gaming experience and I'm much more able to feel okay about it. I definitely have moments where I feel guilty about the amount of time I spend or that I should be doing something else or I should be, I don't know, doing something More productive, but we talked about that in one of the previous episodes I think it's a problem with the world that we live in today as opposed to a problem that's specific to gaming. And I think talking about gaming with you guys and the pod is, has just been such a positive experience because we get to talk about all the joy and the good things that gaming brings and the good things that gaming can do. And so I think it's completely changed my attitude to it from a place where I associated it very much with guilt that most of which I wasn't really conscious of, but over the years, I've recognized that. And I think, but now I see it as a very positive thing and a way to. And act self care for me, it is a way that I can take some downtime and you mentioned earlier, Alex, is just such a crappy month and being able to disappear into another world is definitely. A good way to spend time and it's a way that, as long as you're not neglecting your friends and family, or your health, it's a good way to spend your time and it's a positive way to spend your time. Can you sum up in a few sentences each. What advice you would give to somebody who's feeling guilty about their gaming and also how your perception of gamer guilt has maybe changed over time.

Matt:

I've updated my mantra of, there are the things you need to do, things you want to do, and then there's everything else, which ironically comes up with the middle finger when I was trying to count that on my fingers, so that's, I think that's, I think that's good. So yeah, it's things you need to do, things you want to do, things, everything else, and it's very easy for The everything else to bleed into the things that you need to do, so I thought it would be good To clarify things you need to do as things that you'll die if you don't do them Okay, so And if you so technically you only need to eat once a month Technically you need to drink every day. You need to sleep and The Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs things down the bottom and then there's things you want to do And then if you as long as you go through the things that you want to do with the fine tooth comb of going Do I actually enjoy that? Do I actually enjoy that? Do I actually enjoy that? Go through that then the list of things that you don't like doing or don't want to do should hopefully Move further away from you if you go well as again, I've said the big caveat is My interactions with people are an area in my life that I have I have very limited in that so that's an area, but there is a there is a soft spot between all the people you interact with at the moment and if you went through this process and properly took out the woulds and shoulds and coulds of it, to what you truly, genuinely would do if there was no judgement of you of any kind. That's a really difficult thing for people to, to imagine themselves doing because of so many different social pressures. But, I still think that's the advice that I would give to, are you doing all the things you need to do? And then, what do you want to do? And do? that.

Alex:

Yeah, I think for me my advice is would be first off, gaming's meant to be fun. So when it becomes not fun, think about why that is. Take time to think about the root cause of why you're feeling the guilt that you're feeling. What's causing this guilt? And try and work on that. So think about it from different perspectives. Say maybe if you had a friend who was feeling bad about something they were doing, how would you Talk to them about it and treat yourself as that friend. You have to try and treat yourself kindly and it can be hard to do. But oftentimes, probably the guilt that you're feeling isn't linked to, to, to the game itself. Most of the time. And that's where I think about gamer guilt. It's hard to think about whether it's changed because I haven't really thought about as a thing until we've discussed it on this podcast, really, so I think, for me, a lot of it is really hard to separate from the rest of the guilt I feel about all of my other activities because they merge into one. And that's really linked to my feelings of My self esteem and also my position in society as a woman, which we've touched on in previous episodes as well. And the amount of guilt that women are made to feel. For, just being women and like having quite a lot of caring responsibilities and things. But we have talked about that in other episodes. I don't know if my view on gay magil has changed, but I know that it's linked a lot to feelings of guilt from other areas of life, I would say. And trying to separate that and trying to work on that guilt is a long and difficult process, but you can do it.

Jem:

Touch grass, everything in moderation, and be mindful. And I think those are the things that if we can do all of that, then we're fine. So, yeah, no pressure. Thank you so much for sharing with. us and with everyone and I think it's always so interesting to talk to you guys about these things and I've learned lots of definitely taking a lot of what you both said to heart actually and taking it away with me and I'm really interested in anyone who's listening to this and what your thoughts are on gaming and associated guilt and hobbies and how you balance your gaming experience in your life

Matt:

I've just remembered one final bit of wisdom. I think Gem's had

Alex:

She's gone. She's gone.

Matt:

can you hear us Gem?

Alex:

Oh. We'll keep

Matt:

start talking and see if she comes back in the mid story. So, I don't suppose you've watched Gotham?

Alex:

No, but I know of it. Yes.

Matt:

Really good. So There's a point where Jim Gordon, the main character, has been knocked out and drugged and be given a truth serum, and he's feeling very hazy, but is just floating. And Dr. Strange the mad not,

Alex:

Benedict.

Matt:

strange, not they, not Benedict Comeback. One strange little diminutive psychiatrist who runs Arch Asylum, and so he's. Sat with Jim Gordon having just drugged He's asking him questions about his life, and Jim's just responding with going Because I felt guilty, guilt over this, guilt over that, and just this sort of drugged truth serum going Oh yeah, this is the trauma behind why you're doing everything. And Doctor Strange goes up behind him. He's got this fabulous, big, hypnotic voice. And he stands behind him and says, Jim, I want you to imagine that I am God.

Alex:

Well, yes.

Matt:

I am all knowing. I am all powerful. And I absolve you of your And I take it away and tap some on the shoulder and Jim just goes And his entire demeanor changes his entire life change as a result of that thing and obviously it's because you've got this Megalomaniac lunatic Drugging you and pretending to be But then he just comes around the front and says guilt Does nothing love Jim is our guide

Alex:

That's so

Matt:

and that is

Alex:

Yeah.

Matt:

Absolute

Alex:

is brilliant.

Matt:

And then he reveals that he's just set the gym strapped to a chair, and Strange is set for the facility to self destruct in a couple of hours. And says, right, I'm afraid our time is up, and walks off.

Alex:

Yeah.

Matt:

It's a beautiful bit of wisdom, and it's also, I love when villains give some form of closure to their foe or something. They don't just go, Aha! I've defeated you and ride off. They go, I want to help you in this moment, and then go off. Buh bye everyone!