The SunDaze Journey Podcast
The SunDaze Journey Podcast
Work, Life, and the Chaos In Between
In this week’s episode of The SunDaze Journey Podcast’s “Unqualified Hour,” co-hosts Alexis Carthan and Mary-Beth Meagher explore the nuances of work-life balance. This term can feel buzzwordy at times—but as freelancers who know just how easy it is blur those personal and professional lines, we’re diving beneath the surface to unpack the benefits of work-life balance, along with the barriers and misconceptions that come with it.
Using our favorite blend of personal stories and scientific insights, we’ll look at what balance actually means. Hint: it’s not an equal distribution of time—it’s about focusing on what truly matters in life, then orienting both our personal and professional commitments around those core values. We’ll discuss how the cultural glorification of performance and achievement can pressure us into burnout. We’ll also chat through the need to prioritize boundaries, cultivate space for relationships, lean into self-awareness as we navigate expectations, and make adjustments until we reach our own definition of a healthy work-life balance.
Next, we’ll share a handful of actionable techniques to maintain that balance, whether it’s in a corporate or freelance environment—or some combination of the two (Alexis knows all about this!). Finally, we’ll “Shine a Light” on some work-life balance resources, influencers, and best friends who help us integrate this practice into our own daily routine.
Also, mentioned in the episode: Read 4 Productivity Methods for Your Workday to learn more about time blocking.
Please rate, review, and subscribe to The SunDaze Journey Podcast, so that you won’t miss an episode. We hope you’ll tune in next week for another installment of “The Unqualified Hour,” and follow our content at the links below:
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Alexis Carthan (00:00)
Welcome back to the SunDaze Journey podcast. I don't know if you can see my dog, but he's right here as well wanting to say hello. My name is Alexis Carthan
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (00:06)
I'm sorry.
and I am Mary Beth Mehar.
Alexis Carthan (00:14)
And we are your host for this lovely, lovely hour that we like to call the Unqualified Hour. As you heard in our first episode of the season, have sort of like shifted our thinking when it comes to these like.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (00:19)
Thank
Alexis Carthan (00:35)
like fireside chat style of episodes that we have been doing for the last couple of, not the last couple of years, but the last couple of seasons. And yeah, like this is just a, I don't know, a time for us to just sit and chat about things that we are not necessarily qualified to talk about, but things that we are experiencing in our own lives that we think that others can also read.
I guess resonate with as well. You know, the other day I was actually thinking about this and I was like, you know, with these like episode styles remind me of it's like when you, this is so stupid, but when you like give your friend advice and they didn't necessarily ask for it, but they asked for it you're like, yeah, this is what I think you should do. But then at the end you're like, but you know, do what you need to do. I'm not an ex. Like that's kind of like, that's what I think.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (01:05)
you.
like unsolicited but appreciated.
Alexis Carthan (01:35)
you know, appreciate
it, but also like, we're not, I don't know, at the end of the day. I'm not an expert. Maybe you should seek the help of. Yeah, it's like, yeah, when you finish that, like your little bit of advice, and you add that, but I don't know at the end, that's what this is.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (01:47)
A therapist.
You're like, let me step down off my soap box
Alexis Carthan (02:01)
we're so excited to be bringing you yet another topic that I personally resonate with so much, but I'm going to let Marybeth take it away.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (02:12)
so for this installment of the Unqualified Hour, we thought that we would unpack what it means to create or reclaim a work-life balance. And just to sort of break the ice, because this can be
more of a heady topic. Let's kick it off with a light-hearted question. Alexis, what have you been reading, watching, or listening to lately?
Alexis Carthan (02:45)
you
I have an answer for all of that. Reading, I have been really into the Empyrean series. they had a, well, depending on when this podcast comes out, this episode comes out, there is a third book in the trilogy or I guess series. I don't know how many books they're gonna have coming out this year.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (02:53)
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (03:17)
So I've been kind of getting myself refreshed and rereading those. no. Yes, you have. I have definitely told you about this. This is the fourth wing. And yeah, don't even like you didn't have to put my nerd on air like. Yes, that's what I've been kind of getting into. I'm super excited.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (03:21)
Do tell what is this? I haven't heard of this series.
is it the dragon book?
My bad.
Alexis Carthan (03:44)
There are going to be all these like special edition covers coming out.
I I'm just I'm really excited about it. It's really like scratching the the itch of my nerdism. So yeah, that's what I've been been reading very much into the Kindle Unlimited gang. This is not an ad, but I highly recommend.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (04:03)
you
Alexis Carthan (04:06)
ocean. Listen, Jeff, Jeff, call me.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (04:06)
mean, if Kindle wants to sponsor us, I wouldn't say no.
When you're not in outer space, give us a ring.
Alexis Carthan (04:12)
I know.
Just pick up the phone. It's fine. It's fine. We'll answer. Even though I don't, he doesn't have anything to do with Amazon anymore, does he? He's just like kind of, he's probably like a silent. He's totally getting money. He's totally, totally. Anyway, what have you been reading or watching?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (04:24)
I have no idea.
yeah.
Well, I might be a decade late on this, but I recently started watching Homeland, that show with Claire Danes that came out like in the early 2000s.
Alexis Carthan (04:37)
God.
Yeah,
you're a little late.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (04:48)
Yeah, just a tad give or take 10 years, maybe even 15 at this point. But I found the entire series on Hulu and I don't mind some political espionage. So I'm on season two now and I'm hooked. am fully in the world of the CIA and I'm wondering if I missed my calling in life.
Alexis Carthan (04:59)
Ooh.
Mmm.
Yeah.
my, okay Olivia Pope.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (05:20)
I know. What would Olivia do? I was such a scandal girly. I was obsessed with that show.
Alexis Carthan (05:22)
Were you a scandal girlie? Me too.
Me too. It was like my favorite thing in the world to get on Twitter during that. I mean, excuse me, X I'll never, I'll never call it that. I'll never call it that. What's an ex? But yeah, I would get on Twitter during like the premieres, like the episodes.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (05:35)
Mm-hmm.
No, we will not conform.
So stupid.
Are you a live
tweet?
Alexis Carthan (05:52)
Well, I would, I would like and retweet. I was not funny enough to be. Unless something like absolutely crazy or wild would happen. I'd be like, my God. Yeah. I mean, every like, it was always a cliffhanger or whatever at the end. So.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (05:58)
You
Which it always did. Yeah.
Like just when you thought there couldn't be more bloodshed, you were wrong.
Alexis Carthan (06:15)
All right.
But you know what? also can't really judge you for watching a show like a decade later. You know what? I started watching like a couple of months ago. Lost.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (06:27)
I could go on a diatribe about Lost. love that show so much. So don't let me. We will be here for three hours. Okay.
Alexis Carthan (06:35)
All right, we'll say that for like a
special bonus episode. I'm not even kidding. Lost out. I was like, I know that that's like decades late. Like, yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (06:45)
Yeah.
We'll have to talk off mic about it because it is, no show has made me cry in quite the same way that Lost makes the waterworks just fall from my eyes. It's embarrassing.
Alexis Carthan (07:02)
Yeah.
wow. And I it's sad because like being a film major, like Lost was definitely like talked about a kajillion times. like, so I have the spoiler of the end. So that kind of sucks. Like I but I don't understand it. And I honestly, I don't think anybody understood it.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (07:09)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Okay.
No, don't expect the show to have any sort of continuity after about season three, because it won't. But with that said, you will fall in love with the characters and you will be fully invested. And this is a hot take, but I enjoyed the series finale. I might be the only person, but I did.
Alexis Carthan (07:31)
Yeah. dang. Okay.
Yeah.
Wow, you the only person in the history of the world.
I don't know a single soul that's.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (07:56)
It's true.
It is the most polarizing conversation topic.
Alexis Carthan (08:02)
Wow,
yeah, like, okay, well, maybe I'll get through all 37 seasons and then we can, and then we can talk about it because yeah, that's definitely, that's a hot take.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (08:09)
of outright.
It is a hot take. And now that we have fully shown how we spend our work-life balance watching TV. Yep. Because we don't get enough screens during our normal nine to fives. Maybe we should give the folks a definition of what work-life balance actually is.
Alexis Carthan (08:26)
Consuming media?
Yeah, what's that?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (08:45)
Because as we, thank you, thank you. I felt really, really solid about that one. As we transition into an increasingly remote or hybrid business landscape, especially in the continued aftermath of COVID, I feel like those boundaries, and I'm sure you can attest to this,
Alexis Carthan (08:45)
yeah, nice segue there.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (09:13)
the lines between home and office are becoming so blurred that it's hard to even know what a healthy work-life balance can even entail, let alone what it means to practice that in daily life. So I found this definition from
Alexis Carthan (09:17)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (09:42)
a certified integrative wellness and life coach. Her name is Aleah Cooks Campbell and she defines work-life balance as maintaining a harmonious relationship between your professional and personal life. She also goes on to point out that this includes being able to
Consciously manage both your time and energy to meet all commitments while nourishing self-care and well-being at the same time How did that hit you does that resonate?
Alexis Carthan (10:14)
Mm.
Yeah, the enternal quest.
Internal, external, eternal.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (10:27)
Hahaha
Alexis Carthan (10:28)
No, yeah, that definitely does hit me pretty hard, especially just like going back to what you were saying about how the vid really shone a light on this particular topic. think obviously, like, I hate to go back to, you know, five years ago, which is crazy.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (10:28)
you
Mm.
Alexis Carthan (10:55)
But during that time, a lot of people were just trying to figure out how do I have work-life balance while my whole work and my whole life and everything in between is at home. And then what's so crazy is that, and of course you can see this on pretty much any major corporation, but a lot of these things that we thought we taught ourselves and the things that we thought we learned.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (11:07)
Mm-hmm.
and
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (11:25)
really do not even remotely matter anymore. Like a lot of the lessons that we were forced to learn literally have just like scurried away into the darkness. And I think that's so sad because I was like, this was such a pivotal, horrible thing that happened to
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (11:30)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
so true.
Alexis Carthan (11:53)
not just our country, but our entire world. And I thought that we'd learn so much from that. But like, I see people more stressed out and struggling more than ever to kind of maintain this like sense of work life balance. And that sucks, you know, and I can speak for myself mostly.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (11:56)
Yeah.
Mmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (12:18)
And obviously those around me, but mostly myself. When I say that according to this lovely wellness and life coach, like I'm not 100 % sure that I have like the best work-life balance because a lot of the time, and we can talk about this till later on, but to meet all of my needs and these different areas of my life. But I've...
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (12:44)
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (12:47)
had certain, I don't know, guess experiences and I use like my own personal tools to like at least keep myself together. But I think this is definitely a lesson that, you know, we can all use and sharpen our little skills.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (12:55)
Hmm.
Yeah, 100%. So let's tease that out. I'm sure that we both could pull any number of examples off the top of our heads, but can you remember like the first time that your work-life balance, even if you didn't know what to call it at the time, fell out of whack and
Alexis Carthan (13:12)
Mmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (13:35)
how you learned to prioritize it or at least create some space for it.
Alexis Carthan (13:41)
Yeah, I can think of several times, but the first I think was.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (13:44)
Hehehehe
Alexis Carthan (13:48)
I guess the first meaningful time where I really had to like say, all right, girl, get it together. And I've talked about I've talked about this before, like in season one of my like leap of faith moment where like I I left a full time job with nothing lined up and, know, everything, you know, happened as it was supposed to as God intended. You know, I'm a Christian, so I'm gonna throw that in there. But I really felt like it was.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (13:54)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Hmm
Alexis Carthan (14:17)
you know, all of these issues I was having was because I wasn't on the right path. You know, that was for me. And I could sense that my soul, my spirit was unsettled because I felt like there were so many different areas of my life that I wasn't able to like give the energy to, you know, where just like all of that was like just kind of out of whack. Like it was work in home.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (14:23)
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (14:45)
And I was like, okay, something's gotta give. Obviously, I'm not saying everybody needs to just go and quit their jobs. But yeah, I think it was that time. my goodness, this was probably like eight years ago now. Probably 10, but I'll not even age myself any further.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (14:50)
Hahaha
You don't look a
day over 31 and a half and three quarters.
Alexis Carthan (15:15)
I thought you were gonna give
me 25, man.
Literally, okay. But yeah, I think that that's my answer is, it was just feeling really unsettled in all of these different areas of my life. yeah, I knew that I had to make a change because of it, but I didn't know what that looked like because I had not been in that situation before. And now, of course, because I have learned these lessons, I...
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (15:28)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (15:48)
I think I can recognize it a little bit more now and really understand the purpose of having this work-life balance, harmonious life on both ends of my existence.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (15:56)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Yeah. for you creating that boundary meant a drastic change.
Alexis Carthan (16:09)
Yeah, and it's not always that, right?
Like, I think currently in my life, there is this call and need for more work-life balance. But yeah, I think at that time, I did have to do something drastic because there were other things at play that involved me doing something drastic in order to...
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (16:36)
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (16:37)
make this this true lifestyle change.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (16:41)
Yeah, I think you hit on something important just then that work-life balance, as it were, can take different forms in various seasons of life or even depending on what your needs or priorities or lifestyle requires. It's not a one size fits all
situation and the specifics of a healthy, sustainable work-life balance can vary for each of us based on what we uniquely require. Like someone who works from home with a family to take care of might need to approach their work-life balance in a much different way than someone who's single and works in an office. There's really
Alexis Carthan (17:12)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-mm.
Yeah. Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (17:40)
no one correct formulaic way to integrate it into our daily routines. And it might take some trial and error until we find what works for us individually.
Alexis Carthan (17:46)
Mm.
Yeah, so I kind of want to flip the script here and ask you pretty much the same question. Can you talk about a time in your life where you felt like your work-life balance was out of whack or out of sync, so to speak? And I know, guess what did you do to come back from that?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (18:03)
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
Yeah, so what comes to mind for me is an instance in my early 20s. I was maybe a year and a half out of college and I had just moved out on my own and full disclosure, I've never had a traditional corporate job. I basically started freelancing right out.
Alexis Carthan (18:45)
Mmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (18:51)
of the starting gate before a lot of folks knew what freelancing was. And I was not equipped to do it in a measured way, so to speak. I dove all in and I thought because I wasn't working in
Alexis Carthan (18:52)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (19:21)
a conventional format that I had to drive myself into the ground to justify working from home and maintaining my own flexible schedule and being accountable for deadlines. Because I had all of this leeway, I assumed that I needed to be extremely
Alexis Carthan (19:31)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (19:50)
structured and disciplined with myself to the point that it became rigidity. So I did not keep normal working hours. I would regularly grind into the evenings. I was always hustling on weekends and I didn't notice that anything was off kilter about that because
Alexis Carthan (19:51)
Mm.
Mmm.
Mm.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (20:18)
I was living on my own, so I didn't have
anyone to answer to. But my boyfriend, now husband, came to visit me and I didn't spend any time with him at all. He drove eight hours out of state to come see me and to spend quality time together. And I just stared at my laptop and clack.
Alexis Carthan (20:47)
Hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (20:48)
the way on my keyboard and justified it because I was working. And in my mind, working should be the priority. Productivity should give me a free pass to set my relationships on the back burner because I'm doing what in my own mind I'm supposed to be doing in order to maintain this semblance of
Alexis Carthan (20:55)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (21:17)
responsible adulthood. right. So he called me on it and was not gonna let that slide. And he was right. He had every reason to point out that in that moment, my focus wasn't on what it should be. I wasn't giving him the
Alexis Carthan (21:18)
Yeah, whatever that is.
Yeah. Yeah.
Mm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (21:45)
time and the energy and the attention that our relationship deserved. So I had to take a step back and reevaluate what I care about and how I want to organize my life. I mean, there's a fine line between structure and stringency. Sorry, that's not a word. Stringency.
Alexis Carthan (21:58)
Mmm.
Mm-hmm.
It sounded good to me.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (22:14)
That was a total tongue tie moment. But the point being, I had to look in the mirror and I had to just kind of shuffle around what I cared about. I don't want to be spending 12 plus hours every single day in front of a computer.
Alexis Carthan (22:16)
Look at you making up words.
Yeah.
Mmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (22:43)
all in the name of productivity. That's not sustainable.
Alexis Carthan (22:45)
Yeah, but like it's not. But
can I be real for like five seconds? It's hard. Like, OK, so there's so many levels to this, right? Like. And I just want to be as real as I possibly can with this topic, because, yes, I do have this some sort of skill and learned lessons, but.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (22:53)
Do it. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (23:11)
At the same time, it is definitely still a struggle, right? So first things first. Yeah, like, okay. Love Brandon. Love him to pieces. But like, you know, at the time, like, mama had to work. She had to get her money, you know? Like, so how do you know, like, okay, I need to, like, put my laptop down, you know, like?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (23:14)
Yeah.
Okay.
Alexis Carthan (23:38)
How do you get what I'm saying? Like it's like, I need to put my laptop down, but at the same time, like I have deadlines and bills need to be paid and things like that, you know, and I'm saying this because I've also gotten the same feedback recently, my husband. So, and obviously like the, the stress isn't as apparent there because we're a little further along in our careers now and like, you know, we,
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (23:40)
Yeah.
you
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (24:05)
are a little bit more established. But they're still like dreams, they're still goals, they're still, you know, like, there's still a little bit of ambition here. So like, with all of that said, you're a high achieving, ambitious woman.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (24:07)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
It's my downfall.
Alexis Carthan (24:20)
Like, yeah,
same friend, same. So like, how are you? How do you make that work? Even in that situation, like this was years ago because you said that you weren't even married then. But yeah, you want to knock on my age. No, right. But yeah, like, you know, this was years ago, obviously, like you guys have grown and I'm sure you have.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (24:32)
Thank you.
I know. I forgot two years on you.
Alexis Carthan (24:48)
your own lessons that you've learned and like your own, I guess your actions that you take, know, day to day to make sure you maintain the semblance of work-life balance. But like, you know, for the people out there that are in that season of grime mode, which we all have to be, you know, at some point, like how do you do it? You know?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (24:54)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah, for myself, I've had to learn the art of moderation and stay tuned on how it pans out because that is still a work in progress. But with the example that I just gave, I had to look at it realistically and holistically. Like the work that
Alexis Carthan (25:15)
You
Mm.
Okay.
Yeah. Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (25:39)
I was grinding away at in that season, I was making pennies on the dollar. So was it even worth my time, energy and attention to be that invested? No, like from a financial standpoint, it wasn't. I thought that's what I had to do to lay the foundation and eventually springboard into other opportunities.
Alexis Carthan (25:41)
Mm.
Mmm, okay.
yeah. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (26:08)
But I also had to look reality in the face and realize I'm spending hours on a project that's not paying dividends. So let me take a step back or let me say no to this and find something else that I can say yes to.
Alexis Carthan (26:17)
Yeah.
Mmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (26:38)
Also, I won't apologize for those times that I do have to work a night or a weekend because that is the nature of my industry. So sometimes it's inevitable and sometimes my schedule doesn't allow for much else. And in those moments, I
Alexis Carthan (26:46)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
you
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (27:05)
put my head down and I say no to social plans or whatever the case may be and I make it happen. But I try not to turn that into a habit to the point where I'm neglecting other areas of my life because I do think that ultimately can lead to burnout and
Alexis Carthan (27:16)
Go.
you
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (27:35)
I even found a stat if we want to bring some data into this conversation. We love ourselves some science.
Alexis Carthan (27:39)
Hmmmm
Science, science. We need like a little jingle for when we bring,
when we bring a.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (27:52)
in that we'll come up with one. So according to a 2024 poll from the American Psychological Association, one in three U.S. employees don't have any balance in their professional and personal lives and almost 70 % are dealing with mental or emotional burnout as a result.
Alexis Carthan (27:53)
Okay, alright, alright.
Hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (28:21)
So that is the majority of us if we're keeping tabs here. that, I can't even say was all that surprising to me because it tracks.
Alexis Carthan (28:33)
No, no, it tracks, it tracks in my own home, okay?
tracks man.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (28:42)
So
my rub here is that work-life balance, I personally feel like that term has become such a buzzword in recent years that it can seem like this vague, stale term we just toss around whenever we feel stressed out or overwhelmed on the job, but that's not really what we're getting to.
Alexis Carthan (29:03)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (29:10)
the heart of right now. It's a systemic problem in our culture and we exist on these hamster wheels that we're actually pat on the back for. It's considered a badge of honor to not have a work life.
Alexis Carthan (29:11)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. So I want to can I talk about this from like a corporate girly slash entrepreneur perspective? So I'm sure like anyone reading or reading or listening or reading our articles on our site, anyone listening has wanted to.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (29:41)
Yes, please do.
you
Alexis Carthan (30:00)
I don't know, just kind of go after a new position at work or get a raise or whatever. And I remember this one time I had requested a bit of a promotion, if you will, at one of my former employers. the advice given to me was,
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (30:07)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (30:28)
well, I think you should just take on any and every project that comes your way. Do any and everything you can do, like live and breathe this, like this is it. And I'm like, yeah, no, absolutely not. you know, like I, could do a whole podcast on playing the game in corporate America. But it, that is not the game. That is not how you play it.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (30:33)
Hmm.
you
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (30:57)
How you
play it is finding other resources to do the work, to do the grunt work you were doing while you focus on other stuff. What this person had suggested to me was absolutely asinine. Like, have you lost your mind, right? So as I'm sitting there in their office, I am like, so you want me to give up my whole existence, my whole life?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (31:02)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Totally.
Alexis Carthan (31:24)
at my big old age and in hopes that maybe, maybe I'll get like a little crumb.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (31:32)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (31:36)
Everything that we've worked for, all of you, for our crumb, right? So I can't even remember why I'm telling this story, but my whole point is it's like that whole like work-life balance becoming a buzzword and like people not like, I can't remember, what was the statistic? I can't remember. It was what? One in three.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (31:47)
haha
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, one in three.
One in three. That's crazy.
Alexis Carthan (32:03)
Don't have, yeah, one
in three. One in three, okay. So most of us, because I know math. I actually think it's two and three, but whatever. Yeah, three out of three people. This is why we're unqualified. But no, like, it doesn't surprise me because, this statistic doesn't surprise me because.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (32:10)
You
It's probably three out of three.
Alexis Carthan (32:29)
of the things that you hear. And it was so casual the way it was said, like in this corporate setting, like, just just do any like take on every project you can do. And I'm like, is this supposed to be some type of rah rah speech to like get me going? Because you have the wrong audience if you think that, you know. So yeah, like it's.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (32:46)
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (32:51)
But then again, like I guess on the flip side of this is hard to also like not listen to these people because they are like you're the people you're reporting to or like, you know, people that hold the key.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (33:00)
you
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (33:04)
And you have to be strong enough and have the skills and the discernment to know that not everything is worth it. You know, if it's going to compromise like your your life outside of work, if your boyfriend is going to be driving eight hours to see you and you're working on all 17 of those projects that. Mr. or Mrs. Mann was telling, you know, like whatever it is, it was like, you know.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (33:31)
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (33:31)
What
are you? No, like it's not gonna work.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (33:34)
So that does raise a sticky question because how
Alexis Carthan (33:39)
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (33:41)
And I'm sure that this question could go in a few directions, but these so-called gatekeepers you're referring to who, thank you, thank you. I must be a writer or something, I don't know. Who, the Mrs. Gatekeeper, Mr. and Mrs. Gatekeepers who do,
Alexis Carthan (33:53)
Mm.
I like how you put that so eloquently. Yeah, I think so. Yes, these gatekeepers.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (34:10)
glamorize productivity and hustle and maybe have a point. Maybe in the short term that does lead to quote unquote corporate success. How do you maintain the resolve and the self-awareness and the respect for other areas of your life to take a stand and say no?
Alexis Carthan (34:11)
Mm-hmm.
Hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (34:39)
I'm not doing that.
Alexis Carthan (34:41)
Well, this I actually feel confident speaking of
on because I do this now. Obviously, I did not do what this person told me to do, and I still ended up getting what I came in that office for. So I feel qualified.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (34:47)
Mm-hmm.
There we go.
Alexis Carthan (34:57)
You have to know what is really worth your time and what isn't. Maybe it is that you take on an additional project so that you can showcase your skills. But that doesn't mean accepting any and everything that not even comes across your desk, goes across someone else's desk, because that's what the suggestion was. was like anything that's happening in the entire space. Like you need to be like putting your toe in there and making sure your face gets seen.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (35:09)
Mm-hmm.
Hmm.
Alexis Carthan (35:28)
And yeah, but I don't I don't want to show my face if I'm not going to be good or, you know, good. I don't want to say good enough because we, know, but like if it's not anything that I'm called to do or I feel particularly passionate about, like why would I waste my time, your time, everyone's time?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (35:36)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (35:53)
doing something that I don't even want to be involved in in the first place, because that opens up a whole set of different set of worms, like can of worms, not a set. They can come in a pair of four. Just four worms. It can open up a set of worms. Please save me. Yeah, but it can open up a whole different can of worms.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (36:02)
What are words?
It's been a long week, folks.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (36:23)
And now you have a bunch of problems. So you say you did get your promotion and they're like, oh, well, Alexis can handle 87 things at once. Or maybe they're seeing that you're taking on all of these projects that you're not even really, I don't want to say qualified to talk about or do, but yeah, like maybe you're not qualified to do this. Therefore you don't have any, or maybe you don't have any like skills that surround this thing.
Like, I don't know, that doesn't, to me that sets you up for failure. You know? So, if there are things that you want to try, you want to like put yourself out there for, like that's a whole different, you know, thing. But yeah, like, no, you just can't, you can't accept any and everything that comes your way. Like that's not what I'm about at all. And I think that's...
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (36:56)
Yeah.
Mm.
Alexis Carthan (37:20)
obviously my biggest take on that sort of situation in a corporate setting. I have a different set of rules outside of that, like in my entrepreneurial efforts, that's, that might not apply there, I'm not gonna lie, because you gotta do what you gotta do sometimes, but yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (37:23)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
So for at least, we'll call it the day job. It's about intentionally delineating between where your skills lie, where your interests lie, where your passions lie versus just trying to get ahead.
Alexis Carthan (37:47)
the day job.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think, I think that there are jobs for certain things, right? Like we've all had a job where it's just like, this is just to pay the bills, you know, or it's like, maybe you, you had a job that paid the bills really well, and then you had to take another job that was like, okay, this is where I'm going to develop a certain skill, right? And maybe that paid a little less, you know, like I think everything has
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (38:10)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (38:28)
Every job can have a purpose, right? So I think it's determining what that purpose is.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (38:30)
Yeah.
Yeah, no, and I also think it's worth mentioning that time is a factor too. I mean, I personally would rather whole ass one project than half ass four or five.
Alexis Carthan (38:44)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it depends on how much the whole ass project was paying. I'm just kidding. I'm kidding.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (38:56)
Yes.
Yes, oh, 100%.
I mean, sometimes you'll see me half-assing, but I, as a rule, I would rather put my full self into something than cut corners and not be proud of the end result.
Alexis Carthan (39:12)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah,
think, yeah, I agree with that. But there's also, and I'm not to refute anything that you're saying or your journey.
I want to look at this holistically in a way that kind of leans into the understanding that like, yeah, like there are times where you do have to like just take any and everything that comes or anything that comes your way in the hopes that you can get the crumbs to pay the bills or whatever it is. Maybe it's more, maybe it's the whole slice. Maybe it's not just a crumb, but yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (39:39)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (40:05)
I know, I feel like I'm so like back and forth with this conversation.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (40:09)
I think that
does go to show though that it's fluid and it is unique to all of us and it can sort of ebb and flow with the tides.
Alexis Carthan (40:13)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. boy.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (40:27)
So
let's kind of parse out a few other common misconceptions about work-life balance because I mean, we just did a dissertation on the glamorization of productivity and how that can drive a wedge in work-life balance. But I also found a couple other
Alexis Carthan (40:37)
Mm. Okay.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (40:56)
misconceptions that I thought were interesting in my research and a time management coach. Her name is Maura Thomas. She's the creator of the empowered productivity system. And she explains that work-life balance is not about devoting an equal amount of time to all your priorities. And I found that interesting.
Alexis Carthan (41:01)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, that's interesting.
So not equal. OK, it doesn't have to be equal anyway.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (41:27)
Yeah.
Right. mean, take this for whatever measure makes sense in your own experience, but I wanted to delve into this a bit more because it sounds beneficial in theory to give 50-50 of your time, attention, and energy to both spheres of your life, the personal and the professional.
Alexis Carthan (41:35)
Okay.
Mm. Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (41:57)
in this case, but Mora Thomas says that's not always practical because the more you fixate on leveling the field, the more stressed out you'll become. And that's the opposite of balance. So how do you feel about that?
Alexis Carthan (41:58)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Hmm, yeah.
So balance is being off balance. It's about not being balanced at all. I guess as you're reading this statistic or this definition, I'm thinking that maybe this is what I'm feeling.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (42:26)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (42:33)
like
why I feel so back and forth with this conversation. Like, yeah, I think you should have work life balance and I feel confident in this, but also at the same time, I know that there are, you know, like I feel so like, I feel like I straddled this conversation because I understand the need to, to feel like you need to grind in certain seasons of your life. And I also under, not even just that, but I understand that
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (42:40)
Mm-hmm.
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (43:01)
there sometimes you have to do things that make your your work life feel more uncomfortable or your like play life feel more uncomfortable. And, you know, it kind of goes back to your earlier comment about, you know, Brandon coming. I'm sorry, coming to see you and like, you know, you not feeling like you not feeling empowered enough to close the laptop and like, you know, really
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (43:08)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (43:31)
focus on the things around you. You know, I think even more so, like there's a level of privilege that we have to admit to, right? Like, you know, we have a second income stream in our house now, so we can breathe a little bit more. And I'm not gonna lie, I tell my friends all the time, that's nice. You know, even if it doesn't matter, like if someone's making, you know, $20,000 or.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (43:33)
Yeah.
Absolutely.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (43:58)
200 million, it's still more money than you were having, what you have by yourself, right? So there's that piece. But anyway, I wanna hear more about what she was saying about this because I'm wondering if the whole idea of not, the things not being like completely equal.
It's just like, is it certain times in your life where things are not equal or like, do you need to give your energy to more things? Like, what, what do you, what do you have for me?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (44:35)
Yeah, my takeaway from that because I too scratched my head when I first came across that. But the more I sunk my teeth into it, the more what I at least came away with is that we might not be able to say
Alexis Carthan (44:38)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (45:03)
No to, let's say 70 % work, 40 % personal time. That might just be the way that our career is structured for however long we're with X company or doing Y project or starting the organization. Like it just.
Alexis Carthan (45:13)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mmm.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (45:32)
might be the reality of the situation we're in, that one sphere takes up more breathing room than the other. And it might flip in the next season. And there might be some overlap and there might be some straddle in the line like you were talking about earlier. It's kind of organic.
Alexis Carthan (45:45)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (46:00)
and it's gonna shift and it's not always gonna be even and equitable. And maybe we're putting more effort into trying to keep it equitable. And that's not even the point. The point isn't to...
Alexis Carthan (46:13)
Yeah.
Mmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (46:27)
make ourselves more anxious by trying to fit this concept of work-life balance into a neat and tidy box, the point is actually to create boundaries within the framework we have.
Alexis Carthan (46:29)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's good. Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (46:47)
And it's our framework and it's going to look different
from someone else's framework. And it's not necessarily constructive to bemoan that because it's the reality of the situation. And it's not constructive to compare to others because their journeys are different. And we're doing ourselves a disservice by saying it should look this way.
Alexis Carthan (46:51)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (47:15)
when
it just straight up doesn't. So we gotta work with what we have. And that doesn't mean that we can't still carve out really meaningful time with ourselves or with our families or with our hobbies or with our passion projects and still have a demanding job at the same time.
Alexis Carthan (47:18)
Yeah.
Yeah, I do appreciate you saying that. What was it that you said? That. We are basically stressing, we might be stressing ourselves out, trying to even like maintain work life balance more than we actually need to. That. That one kind of hit, right? I think.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (47:53)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (48:04)
A lot of mothers can probably, I'm not a mom, but I bet a lot of moms can really relate to that. Parents. Because. And I don't know why I'm thinking about this at all. Because I am not that demographic, but I just imagine like.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (48:11)
Mmm.
Alexis Carthan (48:23)
I don't maybe dog moms too. Dog moms can think like, OK, there we go. I'm definitely a dog mother. But like just feeling like once you leave work, like. And you're working to to make sure these people that you are responsible for, these animals that you're responsible for are alive and well, and that you can take care of them and afford that expensive dog food or whatever it is or the daycare.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (48:25)
There we go. Let's run with that.
Mm-hmm.
Hmm.
You
Alexis Carthan (48:50)
But then you come home and you have like a couple hours with them before it's time for bed. you know, like and now like there's that level of guilt, like the mom guilt that everybody talks about and just like, I didn't spend my day with them and I didn't do this and I don't have that. You know what I mean? Like I feel I feel like that. I don't know, can kind of I don't know why that resonated with me in that way, but.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (48:57)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (49:17)
I just think that I personally put a lot of emphasis on work-life balance in my life and I can see where at times it was like, okay, girl, look, if you can't watch 30 episodes of Lost today because you have to, you have this project or whatever, it's okay.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (49:42)
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (49:44)
maybe next week you can watch 10 episodes, know, like maybe you might have to spare as far as a mile of it, but you get what I'm saying? Like, I don't know, I sometimes, especially like being, this is some real stuff, especially like being someone who founded a whole website and digital platform that surrounds like going after the life you want. Like there's sometimes a level of guilt where I'm like, well, you know, I'm talking to you guys about
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (49:53)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (50:13)
work-life balance, really, I totally just finished working an eight-hour shift today or plus, and now I'm recording this podcast right afterwards, and I'm probably gonna write something for the site or do something afterwards. But what kind of stops that train of thought for me is knowing that what I'm doing after I close
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (50:30)
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (50:41)
closed the book of my, you know, every day job, the day job. I was gonna make some creative name for it. But like, when I closed that door, this part of my life is something that I consider my life. Like, you know, this is like my life's work. This is like a passion. This isn't just like, it's not just work for me. So it's, you know, kind of retraining my thinking in that way. It's not like you're, you know,
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (50:46)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (51:11)
sacrificing something for something that you don't necessarily care about, know, it's so, I don't know. Like I think that, well, I'm gonna stop saying I don't know, but I feel as if there's some sort of just kind of retraining my, like thinking and
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (51:13)
you
Right.
You
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (51:37)
Yeah, just not feeling so guilty about the time it takes to do certain things or the time I have to do certain things and just being really grateful with the time I do have, because sometimes there are moments in our lives where we can't do what we want. Is this bad to say?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (52:01)
Mm-hmm.
No,
I, I absolutely agree. And I do think it's a paradigm shift because we can spend so much time and spin our wheels, exerting undue pressure on ourselves to maintain a work life balance. But in all of the pressure buildup,
Alexis Carthan (52:12)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (52:32)
How is that helping us achieve a work-life balance? It's like this grand oxymoron. yeah, I think reframing or rethinking or just recalibrating what that means for all of us personally is at least a launching point.
Alexis Carthan (52:37)
Yeah.
Yeah,
again, have a lot of work to do. The unqualified hour, folks. We have so much work to do,
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (53:04)
I do too, don't we all? And so
that actually leads me to another misconception, which again, I feel like so many of us can relate to because it taps into that age old dilemma of multitasking. I mean, we've all...
probably felt the temptation of looking for convenient ways to combine or integrate both our professional and personal commitments together into one task list. Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (53:48)
can you like dive into that really quickly and give a little bit more explanation to that?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (53:55)
Yeah, so for instance, I don't know, responding to client emails while on the sidelines at your kid's soccer practice. Like you might assume that you're crushing it and saving yourself time, but all this does is split your focus between the two activities so that you can't
Alexis Carthan (54:06)
Dang.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (54:22)
be fully present for either one of them. And I'm not a soccer mom. I'm not even a mom in this season of my life. But I am notorious for multitasking. And I know I'm not alone in this. So.
Alexis Carthan (54:25)
Mmm.
You're a cat, mama.
no, you're not.
man, I got into an argument with Cole not too long ago because like I have one of my biggest pet peeves in life is like people not like acknowledging when I say something like if I say, hey, we have dentist appointments next week, right? And maybe you heard it, but if you don't say, okay, cool, I don't know why.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (54:46)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (55:10)
I don't know why I need that cosign. I don't know if it's just like middle child being ignored my whole life or what, I don't know what it is. But anyway, so we were driving back from a trip and I was, you know, on the phone, like doing that exact same texting my job from the sidelines of my kids basketball game or whatever. yeah, so I'm like responding and like Cole says something and I heard him. I just didn't.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (55:10)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (55:40)
I heard him, but I didn't hear him. I heard it. I didn't acknowledge it, right? And he was like, So you're not even listening to me. I thought you didn't like that. I thought you didn't like when people did that. But anyway, this is so irrelevant, but it's relevant.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (55:43)
Didn't acknowledge him.
Well now we know what your road trips entail.
Alexis Carthan (56:08)
Yeah, well, I will say that particular road trip that was the only argument and it only lasted about 20 minutes. And then after that, you know, like, are you hungry? Yeah, I'm hungry. You want some chips? That's usually the icebreaker. Yeah, the snacks is what brings us together. It's Switzerland.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (56:21)
Leave it to the snacks to keep the peace.
Yeah, multitasking, is, it's so tricky because on the one hand, I don't know about you, but I feel so accomplished when I can multitask. I, mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (56:37)
Yeah.
I too. I'm like, man, I'm at this Christmas party or
whatever and I just got a new client or whatever, right? I don't know. I shouldn't feel like that. But should we?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (56:54)
Mhm.
It's so tempting
though. don't know. Well, I don't know because I've heard that, and I don't have any concrete data to back this up. It's anecdotal, but I've heard the human mind physiologically cannot multitask.
Alexis Carthan (57:04)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm, yeah.
I
don't believe that, man. I think I'm superhuman.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (57:22)
I think so too!
I can convince myself that I am an expert multitasker and I do have evidence to prove that I am not wrong.
Alexis Carthan (57:26)
I swear.
I think that you're correct. You know, I wonder if a man did that study because they cannot multitask.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (57:38)
NNNN
They sure can.
Alexis Carthan (57:47)
No, seriously, they cannot. I, at least the one I live with cannot.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (57:52)
I'm
Alexis Carthan (57:53)
I bet it was a man who did that study, for sure. For sure.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (57:56)
It very
well might've been because this happened 48 hours ago. Brandon was eating dinner and I had finished like 20 minutes before him because he is the world's slowest consumer of food. And he was watching like some Instagram reel on his phone at the same time and
Alexis Carthan (58:02)
Mmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (58:25)
The fork is in midair in one hand, the phone is in the other hand, and he's just staring at the phone like, like just like totally zoned out to this reel. And we have somewhere we need to be 10 minutes ago. And I'm standing there, shoes in hand, ready to leave, wondering why he's taking
Alexis Carthan (58:42)
Mm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (58:54)
30 minutes to put a fork in his mouth and watching something on his phone at the same time. Like if this were me, if the tables were turned, we would be out the door by now, because I can watch something and eat at the same time. I am a multitasker.
Alexis Carthan (59:00)
man.
you'd be up in our. Yeah, I'd have.
think
that you 100 % are. And maybe, I don't know, I think that that study or whatever statistic or piece of science, research that you have come to us with was created by a man, but.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (59:15)
Thank you.
Alexis Carthan (59:31)
Maybe it says something about women. Just I'm going to just say that. Maybe it says something about us like doing more than one thing at once. But maybe it's just not as, you know, good. Maybe that's what it is.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (59:46)
Or maybe it's become a necessity over the years because we are, societally speaking at least, we are the caretakers and most of us now have full-time jobs. So we've just had to adapt.
Alexis Carthan (59:49)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm, yeah, that sounds legit.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:00:09)
I know, I could be wrong, but it sounded correct in my head, so let's roll with it.
Alexis Carthan (1:00:12)
We.
so good about that. I do think that we have had to adapt to men too, but they're just not as good as we are.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:00:25)
Yeah, I digress. This could turn into a therapy session.
Alexis Carthan (1:00:28)
Should we turn the page?
We should probably get off of this.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:00:38)
We probably should. So let's give the people some effective strategies on how to take this nebulous concept of work-life balance and turn it into something actionable. I just, I want to reiterate, because I do think it's important that work-life balance
Alexis Carthan (1:00:45)
Yes.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:01:04)
is fluid, it's flexible, it should be able to shift with each new season of life, and it should also be tailored to your specific needs, whether that's family, health, interests, passions, finances, goals, you fill in the blank. So it's not enough to simply work less.
Alexis Carthan (1:01:17)
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:01:31)
We have to actually think about how we want to use the time available to us, both in our careers and when we're off the clock, because we all have about 12 waking hours in a day, give or take, and it's helpful to be intentional about how we spend them. So, returning to the research portion of it all.
Alexis Carthan (1:01:57)
Mm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:01:57)
I
found a few strategies that can help either cultivate or reclaim a work-life balance that feels right for each of us. And this is by no means a comprehensive list, but I do think it's an excellent starting point. So I'm just gonna run through these and you stop me if...
Alexis Carthan (1:02:20)
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:02:27)
something pings in your head that needs to be unpacked further. All right, set boundaries with your clients or coworkers as to when you will be reachable and which timeframes you will not be responding. Hit me.
Alexis Carthan (1:02:30)
Okay.
Yeah, that's real. That's, you know, of all the things, of all the
things that I've said today, that's probably like something that I am really good at can provide some truly sound expert. Yes, expert on the Unqualified Hour advice on. And yeah, like this just really resonates with me because
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:03:02)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:03:14)
This was one of the things that encouraged me to really like step out on faith, what I discussed earlier. yeah, like making sure that you maintain that, like the doors open, the doors close, like those true hours, especially at home. Because when I did leave that one full-time gig years and years ago, the next thing that I had was a...
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:03:21)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:03:43)
a freelance career, if you will. And I still do, but one of the things that I learned really early on was the importance of maintaining that balance with clients, especially. And I know you can attest to this or those boundaries with clients because just a quick story time and I'm gonna let you give too many. I have so many stories today, it's ridiculous. But
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:03:44)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
yeah.
Mm-hmm.
No, go for it.
Alexis Carthan (1:04:13)
I had one of my very first clients when I first started my freelancing career journey was this wonderful, very ambitious, successful woman. And I was managing her, I will not give too much away by telling you what she did. I think you and I have had a conversation about her before. Yeah, and she was not as responsive and as...
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:04:16)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
we have. It's ringing a bell.
Alexis Carthan (1:04:39)
she should have been to a lot of the emails that I was sending her. There wasn't a lot of direction. So I was OK, well, I'm going to just take the reins. And I did what I could do. But there came like a chunk of time where she just was not responsive. She got someone else to kind of like do some of the things that, you know, she was working on. And I had to work simultaneously with this person. And this individual that was working with her was someone who
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:04:42)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
you
Alexis Carthan (1:05:07)
would answer their phone at 11 p.m. at night when I was not ever gonna do that. Like I had left a situation where that was the expectation. And I said if I was gonna control my career and be the solopreneur that I wanted to be in this type of space, like that's not what I was gonna do because I was, I needed that work-life balance at that time where like I had enough time to kind of start my,
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:05:14)
Yeah.
Mm.
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (1:05:35)
other businesses or nurture the relationship that was going to one day form into a marriage. I needed that time. So it was very important for me to close the door, close the computer, turn off the lights, whatever. And I remember this person saying, hey, I know that you get your email sent to you at all hours. Everybody's email gets sent to their phone. like, yeah, but I will respond to you.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:05:36)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:06:03)
on
Monday morning at 9 a.m. or whenever I get online. And they're like, if you want to be an entrepreneur, if you want to be a business owner, this is what you're going to need to do. And I'm like, yeah, well, long story short, we me and that client have not worked together in almost four years at this point. But anyway, I am all the better for it. I wish her him all the success, you know. But just yeah, that's something.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:06:16)
Yeah
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:06:33)
we can talk about that forever.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:06:36)
Yeah, I do and I don't want to paint too broad a stroke here because obviously not all clients operate this way, but I think you're making a salient point that if you give someone an inch, it's not too hard for them to want to take a mile.
Alexis Carthan (1:06:41)
Yeah.
Absolutely not.
Mm.
Yeah,
for sure. And I will say, like at the beginning, that was something that I did not establish at first because like I thought that, OK, it's just this one time. But then that one time became occasionally and then it became sometimes and then it became all the time. And I at that point, I was like, OK, did I like not set that boundary early on enough or early early enough to like
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:07:04)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:07:24)
You know, now I had to retrain this person and this is not how they think. Yeah, think, ooh, can wait. Let's put a pin in that one. Yeah, it is.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:07:29)
Yeah.
That's a future episode.
So another strategy that I thought was helpful is to schedule personal time as a non-negotiable appointment with yourself, just as you would with a client meeting or a performance review. I really like that because it's showing that your time with yourself is valuable.
Alexis Carthan (1:07:49)
Mmm.
Mm-hmm.
100%, even if you're
working in a corporate setting. Another hot tip I have to add on to that is just to block your calendar for the same time every single day. I have a block from 12 to 1.30 on my calendar. No one can book anything because it's blocked. So if that's the time that usually what that is for me is like lunchtime and then like the 30 minutes after or before to
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:08:05)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:08:29)
to just kind of regroup and get my mind back into work mode.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:08:32)
Mm-hmm.
It's funny you say that because that's the third tip on this list. Use the time block method, as you were just talking about, to establish concrete margins in your calendar for job responsibilities, family commitments, and self-care activities. So Alexis, we've written an article about this on the Sunday's Journey website, but for folks who are unfamiliar,
Alexis Carthan (1:08:38)
Well there you go!
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:09:06)
Could you kind of just provide an overview of what the time block method is? And I know it can kind of take different forms for different people, but how do you do it?
Alexis Carthan (1:09:12)
see if I can recall. Yeah.
So I essentially, and again, like you said, you can do this a million different ways and we'll link this in the show notes. But basically what you're doing is you're taking a certain set of time, whether it's 30 minutes, sometimes it's two or three hours to knock out a specific task or responsibility. So it could be like if,
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:09:22)
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (1:09:41)
if we're talking on like, you know, the corporate work or freelancing spectrum, maybe you're like, OK, I have two hours in the morning to work on this particular project for this client or like, you know, for my job. And then I have another 30 minutes that I can block out to like, look at emails. This I love this method. And I am a huge, obviously a huge fan of it because it helps me stay on track with not just like
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:09:44)
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:10:11)
you know, the day to day, like my larger goals. So like I can block a certain amount of time every day towards to use that time towards a goal or a task that's gonna, you know, set me to where I want to be and like, you know, X amount of time, a certain amount of time. So yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:10:14)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
totally and to kind of tease that apart further of I think it's interesting that we maybe interesting is the wrong word I think it's human that we sometimes feel like we have to do it all on our own
Alexis Carthan (1:10:36)
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:10:57)
And there's certainly something to be said for owning our time and making it fit in accordance with what we want to accomplish in a day, but it's not all on our shoulders to do solo. So while you're time blocking your calendar, maybe think about
Alexis Carthan (1:11:10)
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:11:23)
which tasks can be delegated or even outsourced if possible. And these can be non-essential items that you could pass off to a virtual assistant if you're in a position where you can hire one, or maybe ask a colleague for assistance if they have...
Alexis Carthan (1:11:47)
Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:11:49)
some free time in their schedule and are willing to pitch in. I collaboration is so important on teams and it doesn't have to be this, am woman, hear me roar, gotta do it all on my own. There's space and there's no shame in asking for help and delegating when necessary. that's...
Alexis Carthan (1:12:06)
Yeah.
That's surreal.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:12:17)
That leads me to another tip that I struggle with because I don't want full disclosure to seem like I can't handle it or that I don't have it all together even though I'm just as capable of feeling overwhelmed as the next person.
Communicate with your supervisor about any workload concerns you might have if you feel like there are too many obligations on your plate. Can't guarantee how the conversation will turn out, but it's better to voice a concern on the front end than to allow it to pile up.
Alexis Carthan (1:12:49)
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:13:11)
until it starts affecting your performance or even worse, your mental health. So be transparent, be honest, and allow yourself to acknowledge when you've hit your limits. I also think we should mention that it's helpful to...
Alexis Carthan (1:13:13)
Yeah.
Mm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:13:33)
resist the urge to over commit to something that you don't have the capacity for or maybe even the interest in. No is a complete sentence and sometimes it doesn't even require an explanation.
Alexis Carthan (1:13:51)
Go listen to our episode one where we discuss boundaries. That was a big thing. No is a complete sentence for sure.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:13:54)
Yeah.
Do you have more to say on that?
Alexis Carthan (1:14:04)
I mean, if we could just rewind everything I said earlier, you know, when I use that scenario or that story to explain how like, you know, sometimes if you're going after a raise or a promotion or whatever it is, like in the corporate space and honestly, I think sometimes in like the contractor freelancing space to like.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:14:08)
You
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:14:29)
people wanna see that you can do so much, you know, or like they will use that like, what else can you do? What else can you do to, before they give you more things to work on and you know, that can lead to burnout as you mentioned. And you have to know when it's the right time to say no. And like when you have to be like, okay, look, if you want me to do this, I'm gonna need additional resources or.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:14:35)
Mm-hmm.
Sure.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:14:56)
something or we're have to invest in a particular tool or platform that will help me accomplish these tasks or whatever a little bit more efficiently so that I can put more focus and attention towards your X thing, your project, your emotions, whatever it is. Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:15:01)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah, even a small amount of self-advocacy can go a long way. And that leads me into use PTO without guilt, people. Plan that vacation, take that mental health day, unplug from the Slack channel.
Alexis Carthan (1:15:26)
Mm. Yes.
Hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:15:42)
Camp out on the couch and binge your favorite show. Hello, Lost. Hello, Homeland. We all deserve some time off to rest and recharge our batteries. And finally, don't neglect your health or sacrifice your relationships on the altar of career success. Well-being matters more than a corporate ladder.
Alexis Carthan (1:15:45)
Yes. Homeland.
Mm-hmm. Mm. Yeah.
Mm-mm.
And that is the tea on that folks. That's yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:16:14)
That is the tea.
So before we wrap this conversation up and sort of transition into our next segment, do you have any final insights on work-life balance, either as a corporate girly or a freelancer in a former life or someone who loves a side hustle? Any final thoughts or takeaways?
Alexis Carthan (1:16:44)
So I have a lot of thoughts and that's the problem. That's why we've gone an hour and a half into this episode because your girl cannot shut up.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:16:48)
lol
I love it.
Alexis Carthan (1:16:58)
I believe that you and whoever created all of this wonderful research that you put together, I believe that work-life balance is fluid and it is personal. As someone who, again, we mentioned earlier, we are both high achieving, ambitious women, have a lot of goals, have a lot of things on our plates most times.
My hot take for myself and the rest of the world is that time and place and scenario, you know, it. I know there have been times in my life where I have had to grind for the whole year, and then there have been times in my life where I got to kind of coast. 2024 was that year for me.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:17:28)
Mm-hmm
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:17:55)
I felt like I just needed to put more of an emphasis on getting myself back together in the post-COVID world.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:18:07)
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (1:18:07)
and kind of finding out who that person is. Like I had to find my style again. I had to, you know, do a little bit more of my like, you know, favorite things I like to do and, you know, to go back outside and, you know, explore because I spent so much time like getting comfortable inside the house. So, no, I could not focus on work, like trying to climb a corporate ladder or
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:18:20)
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (1:18:35)
I couldn't honestly, like I couldn't really like put that big of an emphasis on my entrepreneurial goals in 2024. I think I did okay with it, but I knew that at that point in my life, like I needed to kind of take a step back and work on the things that matter, build community, you know. And now I feel like a lot of those things are in like a pretty solid place.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:18:42)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:19:03)
where like if I did have to like spend a little extra time working on something, I'm okay with that, you know? So.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:19:11)
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (1:19:13)
All in all, time and place, case by case.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:19:18)
Ooh, that's a word right there. Let's end it on that note. That's a fun little catchphrase that will be living rent free in my head for the next week or so. So let's transition over to shining a light because we got to give some flowers. It's a...
Alexis Carthan (1:19:23)
You
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:19:44)
It's a fun way to end what can be kind of a cerebral conversation and a long one of that. So Alexis, is there a person resource or organization you want to showcase that embodies and advocates for a healthy work-life balance that you've been following along with lately?
Alexis Carthan (1:19:52)
Yeah.
Mmm.
I don't know if I have a person or, but this kind of sucks because I wanna have a person. I'll give two, I'll give a thing. And then I'll give a person. So something that I I fell in love with this year was like the concept of like these bingo cards.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:20:13)
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
Mm-hmm.
Alexis Carthan (1:20:34)
And have you, are you familiar with this like method of like goal tracking? my
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:20:41)
No, honestly, I'm not.
Alexis Carthan (1:20:43)
essentially it's a, a bingo card where you fill out all of your goals. And every time you make bingo or get bingo, you treat yourself to something. And I am so obsessed with this, but I think it's just like, it's so beautiful. And I love it because like it does like.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:20:48)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
that's fun.
You
Alexis Carthan (1:21:09)
It combines that like a bit of like, I don't know, goal seeking or whatever, but still also like your life balance, I guess. Like you can put literally anything on this bingo card. For me, like a lot of my stuff was like just go and do and live life and like go to a cooking class and skydive. I'm totally don't have skydiving on there, but like.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:21:13)
Mm.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
I'm out.
Alexis Carthan (1:21:37)
I love the idea of being able to like treat yourself to something that is uniquely for you once you like achieve this goal. Anyway, so like if you like to, if you're a goal tracker or like a New Year's resolution type of person like this, that's like one of like, it's like the new vision board, right? But it like helps you keep track of what has been done other than like.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:21:47)
love that.
Mm-hmm.
What a fun idea!
Alexis Carthan (1:22:05)
Yeah,
it's really cute. So you can put all your work stuff on there. Like I want to like get a million followers or like finish this research report. And then at the end, like you can use the bingo to do something fun for yourself. So that's really, really cool. I'm the other person that I really want to give my flowers to as my best friend. I, yeah, Sanetra Hey girl. Hi. You better be listening to this. I'm a no.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:22:24)
Mm-hmm. Aww.
Hmm.
you
Alexis Carthan (1:22:34)
I'm not even gonna tell you in real life, I'm just gonna wait until I hear you say. No, don't test your friends like that people, that's crazy. But she has truly been a driving force in my work-life balance over the last couple of years. And especially she was the one that introduced me to Kindle Unlimited.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:22:54)
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (1:23:01)
So, you we gotta give our props to her. It's just really nice to have someone in your life that reminds you like, hey girl, you need to like back up and like, hey, what have you done for yourself today? You know, what are you doing? Why, you know, why are you acting crazy? Like, you know, it doesn't matter, right? Like, you know, this is it. You know, it's nice to have that. And, you know, she's definitely been that, well, she's been in my life for like,
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:23:01)
circle.
Hmm.
Yeah.
Alexis Carthan (1:23:29)
I'm not gonna tell you how many years, but it's more than two decades.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:23:30)
Hmm.
I love friends that can offer that fine line of accountability and encouragement.
Alexis Carthan (1:23:35)
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah,
the accountability is so strong there. I'm sure she would say the same to it. It's not just the one way street. I hope if it is girl, keep it to yourself. I don't want to hear it. But no, it's beautiful. And I'm so lucky to have her in my life. And, know, yeah. Yeah. What about you? Like, give me give me something that will put me to shame.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:23:49)
you
Yeah
That's so sweet.
Alexis Carthan (1:24:09)
because I'm sure you have like a great organization.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:24:11)
Oh, please.
Mine is also a person. I don't know this individual in real life. I kind of wish I did. Are you familiar with Morgan Harper Nichols? I want to shine a light on her account because, A, she's such a talented artist and poet. And every time I see
Alexis Carthan (1:24:15)
Aw.
Okay.
Yes, yes. Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:24:40)
her artwork and read her words. I just feel soothed. It's peaceful to look at. It takes my blood pressure down a few notches. The colors are so ethereal. The words are so seamlessly woven together. She's a writer's writer, and I appreciate that as someone who
Alexis Carthan (1:24:46)
I love that.
Mm.
Mm.
Mm. Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:25:09)
spends every day crafting words myself. So I just kind of sense, I don't know, a bit of a kindred spirit in her. And she always has an ability to communicate the message of like, hey, grow where you're planted. Where you are is enough. You're doing okay. Don't try to...
Alexis Carthan (1:25:13)
Yeah.
Mmm.
Mmm.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:25:39)
Push it more than what you're capable of in this season. Don't guilt yourself into more or different or wish away the time you have, but be present, be rooted, be here now and extend yourself some grace. You're doing the best you can. And I feel like that dovetails into
Alexis Carthan (1:25:48)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:26:07)
this conversation around work-life balance because it isn't about more. Sometimes it's about less and sometimes it's just about enough. And I feel that reassurance strongly every time I interact with her content, just that reminder to take a pause, take a deep breath, do what I can.
Alexis Carthan (1:26:11)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm.
Hehehe.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:26:36)
do what's being asked of me, but.
Don't expect an outcome, just be with the process. And I love that. I don't think we give ourselves enough permission to do that and to be okay with that. So I would like to throw my flowers at her feet today.
Alexis Carthan (1:26:47)
Mm.
Yeah.
Yeah,
that's nice. Yeah, that's beautiful. I agree. I do. Appreciate her work as well, like I'm not like I'm going to sit here and pretend like I'm following every single thing, but I am familiar. Love it.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:27:19)
You
So let's leave the listeners with a little call to action. If you don't want to participate, that's fine. You do you. As I literally just got through saying a second ago, where you are is enough. So don't push it if you don't want to. But if you feel so inclined, carve out a few minutes after this episode or
Alexis Carthan (1:27:28)
Yeah.
So where are you?
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:27:51)
in your journaling time or whenever you have some spare moments and reflect on the current state of your own work-life balance and implement a new strategy this week that will help you cultivate more balance in your own life. Also, if you want to, we would love to hear your feedback on
Alexis Carthan (1:28:03)
Mm.
Yeah.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:28:20)
what resonated with you about this topic or any stories that you might want to share on how you learn to navigate the intricacies of work-life balance. We're all ears and we would love to communicate with you further.
Alexis Carthan (1:28:39)
Yeah. So if you do have any questions that you would like us to respond to on air or if you just want to send us a hot, steamy love letter. OK, please, please don't send it. Don't send it if you want to do not know if you want to send some love and in positive words or just just thoughts to us like you can totally do so by emailing us at hello.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:28:49)
We'll take it.
Alexis Carthan (1:29:09)
at sundazejourney.com.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:29:12)
Yeah, and also please rate and review the podcast if you loved it. Also, why wouldn't you love it?
Please subscribe so that it shows up in your feed every time we drop a new episode. We're also on social media. You can follow us there at SunDaze Journey.
and visit our website. We're always putting what we think is valuable content up there and we'd love for you to check it out. Did I miss anything, Alexis?
Alexis Carthan (1:29:48)
I do not think so. I think that was it from what I heard. Well, thank you guys so much. This was a wonderful conversation. Hopefully we didn't confuse you and you found some sort of something from this. Highly encourage you to do Marybeth's call to action. I think I'm gonna do it myself. All right, thank you guys, bye.
Mary-Elizabeth Meagher (1:29:53)
Alright!
