{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":87.58999999999999,"endTime":90.11,"body":"We've got kids"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":87.58999999999999,"endTime":90.11,"body":"who present as irritable, who"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":90.11,"endTime":93.02,"body":"present as argumentative and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":90.11,"endTime":93.02,"body":"defiant. And we've also got kids"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":93.02,"endTime":96.05,"body":"that can be quite vindictive."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":93.02,"endTime":96.05,"body":"These are kids who might be"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":96.05,"endTime":100.13,"body":"deliberately spiteful to other"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":96.05,"endTime":100.13,"body":"children who actively enjoy"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":100.16,"endTime":103.69999999999999,"body":"others failures will"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":100.16,"endTime":103.69999999999999,"body":"deliberately plan to upset or"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":103.69999999999999,"endTime":106.07,"body":"harm other children that they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":103.69999999999999,"endTime":106.07,"body":"don't get on with. Now, this is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":106.07,"endTime":110.38999999999999,"body":"different from a child having"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":106.07,"endTime":110.38999999999999,"body":"poor social understanding and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":110.38999999999999,"endTime":112.52,"body":"upsetting someone because they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":110.38999999999999,"endTime":112.52,"body":"don't understand the impact of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":112.52,"endTime":115.82,"body":"their actions or they have poor"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":112.52,"endTime":115.82,"body":"empathy. This is someone who is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":115.82,"endTime":120.38,"body":"deliberately going out of their"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":115.82,"endTime":120.38,"body":"way to engage in a plan that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":120.38,"endTime":122.92999999999999,"body":"they've thought about to upset"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":120.38,"endTime":122.92999999999999,"body":"or diminish the other kids in"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":122.92999999999999,"endTime":123.38,"body":"class."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":123.77,"endTime":127.88,"body":"Welcome to the school behaviour"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":123.77,"endTime":127.88,"body":"secrets podcast. I'm your host,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":127.88,"endTime":130.91,"body":"Simon Currigan. My co host is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":127.88,"endTime":130.91,"body":"Emma Shackleton and we're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":130.94,"endTime":134.6,"body":"obsessed with helping teachers,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":130.94,"endTime":134.6,"body":"school leaders, parents and of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":134.6,"endTime":137.81,"body":"course students. When classroom"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":134.6,"endTime":137.81,"body":"behaviour gets in the way of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":137.81,"endTime":140.72,"body":"success. We're going to share"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":137.81,"endTime":140.72,"body":"the tried and tested secrets to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":140.72,"endTime":143.54,"body":"classroom management,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":140.72,"endTime":143.54,"body":"behavioural Special Needs, whole"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":143.54,"endTime":146.72,"body":"school strategy and more all"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":143.54,"endTime":146.72,"body":"with the aim of helping your"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":146.72,"endTime":149.81,"body":"students reach their true"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":146.72,"endTime":149.81,"body":"potential. Plus, we'll be"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":149.81,"endTime":152.87,"body":"letting you eavesdrop on our"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":149.81,"endTime":152.87,"body":"conversations with thought"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":152.87,"endTime":156.62,"body":"leaders from around the world."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":152.87,"endTime":156.62,"body":"So you'll get to hear the latest"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":156.62,"endTime":160.97,"body":"evidence based strategies before"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":156.62,"endTime":160.97,"body":"anyone else. This is the school"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":160.97,"endTime":162.86,"body":"behaviour secrets podcast."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":163.45999999999998,"endTime":166.51999999999998,"body":"Hi there. My name is Simon"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":163.45999999999998,"endTime":166.51999999999998,"body":"Currigan and welcome to another"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":166.51999999999998,"endTime":169.33999999999997,"body":"episode of school behaviour"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":166.51999999999998,"endTime":169.33999999999997,"body":"secrets. I'm not saying we're at"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":169.33999999999997,"endTime":172.76,"body":"the low brow end of educational"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":169.33999999999997,"endTime":172.76,"body":"podcasting, but I'm sure you"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":172.76,"endTime":175.45999999999998,"body":"won't be surprised to learn that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":172.76,"endTime":175.45999999999998,"body":"most of our scripts are written"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":175.45999999999998,"endTime":178.97,"body":"in crayon. I'm here with my co"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":175.45999999999998,"endTime":178.97,"body":"host, Emma Shackleton. Hi, Emma."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":179.08999999999997,"endTime":181.7,"body":"Hi, Simon."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":179.08999999999997,"endTime":181.7,"body":"Haven't we won awards for this"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":181.7,"endTime":182.48,"body":"podcast?"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":182.51,"endTime":184.82,"body":"Yeah, the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":182.51,"endTime":184.82,"body":"certificates were from my mom."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":185.6,"endTime":189.41,"body":"I've got a question. I've been"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":185.6,"endTime":189.41,"body":"dying to ask you all week. Have"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":189.41,"endTime":192.29,"body":"you ever been in a position"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":189.41,"endTime":192.29,"body":"where you really wanted to do"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":192.29,"endTime":195.38,"body":"something? But you've been told"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":192.29,"endTime":195.38,"body":"no. You're not allowed to do it?"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":195.35,"endTime":198.86,"body":"Yes. Easy, easy"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":195.35,"endTime":198.86,"body":"question this week. I think all"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":198.86,"endTime":202.16,"body":"of us can think of a time during"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":198.86,"endTime":202.16,"body":"the Coronavirus pandemic,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":202.19,"endTime":206.18,"body":"especially during lockdown when"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":202.19,"endTime":206.18,"body":"we couldn't do things that we"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":206.18,"endTime":210.26,"body":"wanted to because of the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":206.18,"endTime":210.26,"body":"enforced limitations. So for"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":210.26,"endTime":214.19,"body":"example, I didn't get to see my"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":210.26,"endTime":214.19,"body":"mom for about 10 months. And"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":214.19,"endTime":216.98,"body":"that's the longest time in my"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":214.19,"endTime":216.98,"body":"life that we haven't seen each"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":216.98,"endTime":220.79,"body":"other for and it was really,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":216.98,"endTime":220.79,"body":"really tough to be told that,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":220.79,"endTime":223.67,"body":"you know, there were travel"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":220.79,"endTime":223.67,"body":"restrictions, we weren't allowed"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":223.7,"endTime":226.64,"body":"to go and see the people that we"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":223.7,"endTime":226.64,"body":"loved. What's this got to do"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":226.64,"endTime":228.73999999999998,"body":"with today's podcast? Why do you"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":226.64,"endTime":228.73999999999998,"body":"want to know?"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":228.92,"endTime":230.6,"body":"Well, because in"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":228.92,"endTime":230.6,"body":"this week's show, we're going to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":230.6,"endTime":234.29,"body":"be looking at Oppositional"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":230.6,"endTime":234.29,"body":"Defiant Disorder. ODD is a"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":234.29,"endTime":237.23,"body":"condition where children can"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":234.29,"endTime":237.23,"body":"present really challenging"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":237.23,"endTime":240.17,"body":"behaviour when they don't get"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":237.23,"endTime":240.17,"body":"their own way. They really want"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":240.17,"endTime":242.84,"body":"to be in control of their own"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":240.17,"endTime":242.84,"body":"behaviour choices. And we're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":242.84,"endTime":246.10999999999999,"body":"going to look at what odd looks"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":242.84,"endTime":246.10999999999999,"body":"like in the classroom how it"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":246.10999999999999,"endTime":249.95,"body":"presents, we're going to look at"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":246.10999999999999,"endTime":249.95,"body":"what odd actually is, and give"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":249.95,"endTime":252.26,"body":"you some strategies for managing"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":249.95,"endTime":252.26,"body":"that behaviour."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":252.29,"endTime":252.85999999999999,"body":"Great."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":252.88899999999998,"endTime":256.30899999999997,"body":"But before we do that, I have a"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":252.88899999999998,"endTime":256.30899999999997,"body":"quick request to make. If you're"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":256.30899999999997,"endTime":259.549,"body":"listening to this right now,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":256.30899999999997,"endTime":259.549,"body":"please can you open your podcast"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":259.579,"endTime":263.419,"body":"app and use the Share button to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":259.579,"endTime":263.419,"body":"share this episode with three"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":263.419,"endTime":266.959,"body":"friends or colleagues who you"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":263.419,"endTime":266.959,"body":"think might find this episode"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":266.959,"endTime":270.709,"body":"useful. That means they and the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":266.959,"endTime":270.709,"body":"children in their care can get"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":270.709,"endTime":273.529,"body":"the help and support they need"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":270.709,"endTime":273.529,"body":"to make progress in their"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":273.529,"endTime":274.609,"body":"classrooms, too."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":274.85,"endTime":277.66999999999996,"body":"Okay, I'm"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":274.85,"endTime":277.66999999999996,"body":"excited to get started. So let's"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":277.66999999999996,"endTime":281.03,"body":"pull up our shirts take a long"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":277.66999999999996,"endTime":281.03,"body":"deep breath and prepare to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":281.03,"endTime":284.03,"body":"pierce that belly button we call"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":281.03,"endTime":284.03,"body":"behaviour."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":284.15999999999997,"endTime":288.12,"body":"Okay, so what"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":284.15999999999997,"endTime":288.12,"body":"does ODD look like? Well, the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":288.12,"endTime":294.41999999999996,"body":"term oppositional is defined as"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":288.12,"endTime":294.41999999999996,"body":"resistance or dissent and"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":294.41999999999996,"endTime":299.25,"body":"Defiance is more obvious. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":294.41999999999996,"endTime":299.25,"body":"that is resistant or combative"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":299.25,"endTime":303.03,"body":"behaviours, even sometimes"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":299.25,"endTime":303.03,"body":"vindictiveness two figures of"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":303.06,"endTime":308.4,"body":"authority. It's open resistance"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":303.06,"endTime":308.4,"body":"and bold disobedience,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":308.35,"endTime":310.53999999999996,"body":"There are three"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":308.35,"endTime":310.53999999999996,"body":"key behaviours that are"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":310.53999999999996,"endTime":313.0,"body":"associated with ODD and we're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":310.53999999999996,"endTime":313.0,"body":"going to run through them"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":313.0,"endTime":316.81,"body":"quickly. Now, the first and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":313.0,"endTime":316.81,"body":"probably the most obvious is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":316.81,"endTime":319.53999999999996,"body":"sort of having an angry or"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":316.81,"endTime":319.53999999999996,"body":"irritable mood. So we're looking"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":319.53999999999996,"endTime":324.1,"body":"at kids that are touchy, that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":319.53999999999996,"endTime":324.1,"body":"are easily annoyed, that often"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":324.1,"endTime":327.46000000000004,"body":"lose their temper with others or"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":324.1,"endTime":327.46000000000004,"body":"with their work. They generally"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":327.46000000000004,"endTime":331.99,"body":"present in an angry or resentful"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":327.46000000000004,"endTime":331.99,"body":"way, this is really easy to spot"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":331.99,"endTime":333.85,"body":"in the classroom. These are the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":331.99,"endTime":333.85,"body":"kids that you know, fly off the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":333.85,"endTime":336.66999999999996,"body":"handle very, very quickly, when"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":333.85,"endTime":336.66999999999996,"body":"they feel that they're being"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":336.66999999999996,"endTime":339.78999999999996,"body":"questioned. Or, you know, you're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":336.66999999999996,"endTime":339.78999999999996,"body":"saying their work isn't good"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":339.78999999999996,"endTime":343.27,"body":"enough. They fly off the handle,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":339.78999999999996,"endTime":343.27,"body":"they lose their temper, and also"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":343.27,"endTime":346.68999999999994,"body":"they're really easily annoyed by"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":343.27,"endTime":346.68999999999994,"body":"other children in the class."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":346.71000000000004,"endTime":348.92999999999995,"body":"Okay, so in"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":346.71000000000004,"endTime":348.92999999999995,"body":"addition to those sorts of"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":348.99,"endTime":353.54999999999995,"body":"irritable and angry mood"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":348.99,"endTime":353.54999999999995,"body":"behaviours, you'll also see"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":353.61,"endTime":358.40999999999997,"body":"argumentative and certainly"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":353.61,"endTime":358.40999999999997,"body":"defiant behaviours. Children"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":358.40999999999997,"endTime":363.33000000000004,"body":"with ODD frequently get into"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":358.40999999999997,"endTime":363.33000000000004,"body":"arguments, particularly with"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":363.36,"endTime":366.9,"body":"figures of authority. For"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":363.36,"endTime":366.9,"body":"children that might be with"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":366.9,"endTime":371.18999999999994,"body":"adults, especially adults who"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":366.9,"endTime":371.18999999999994,"body":"are making demands on them. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":371.18999999999994,"endTime":375.09000000000003,"body":"teachers, parents, head"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":371.18999999999994,"endTime":375.09000000000003,"body":"teachers, anybody who they feel"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":375.09000000000003,"endTime":379.47,"body":"is trying to control them."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":375.09000000000003,"endTime":379.47,"body":"Often, children with ODD will"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":379.53,"endTime":385.02,"body":"actively defy or refuse to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":379.53,"endTime":385.02,"body":"comply with requests from those"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":385.04999999999995,"endTime":390.21000000000004,"body":"authority figures or even refuse"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":385.04999999999995,"endTime":390.21000000000004,"body":"to comply with the rules. And"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":390.24,"endTime":395.18999999999994,"body":"what we're talking about is"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":390.24,"endTime":395.18999999999994,"body":"blatant refusals. So saying no,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":395.28,"endTime":400.11,"body":"digging their heels in, saying"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":395.28,"endTime":400.11,"body":"I'm not doing it, you can't make"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":400.11,"endTime":404.97,"body":"me maybe even arguing that the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":400.11,"endTime":404.97,"body":"rules are stupid, lots of name"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":404.97,"endTime":408.9,"body":"calling involved as well. And"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":404.97,"endTime":408.9,"body":"often those children with ODD"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":408.92999999999995,"endTime":413.25,"body":"will intentionally or"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":408.92999999999995,"endTime":413.25,"body":"deliberately annoy others. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":413.25,"endTime":417.41999999999996,"body":"they'll goad other children"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":413.25,"endTime":417.41999999999996,"body":"either by name calling or"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":417.41999999999996,"endTime":421.71000000000004,"body":"laughing, sometimes physical"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":417.41999999999996,"endTime":421.71000000000004,"body":"things like poking or pushing,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":421.74,"endTime":424.43999999999994,"body":"they'll try and go to others,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":421.74,"endTime":424.43999999999994,"body":"they're trying to get a"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":424.43999999999994,"endTime":430.02,"body":"reaction. And children with ODD"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":424.43999999999994,"endTime":430.02,"body":"usually blame others for their"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":430.02,"endTime":434.46000000000004,"body":"own mistakes or misbehaviour. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":430.02,"endTime":434.46000000000004,"body":"they are unable to admit when"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":434.46000000000004,"endTime":437.82000000000005,"body":"they've done something wrong or"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":434.46000000000004,"endTime":437.82000000000005,"body":"accept any responsibility for"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":437.82000000000005,"endTime":441.27,"body":"their own actions. They'll blame"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":437.82000000000005,"endTime":441.27,"body":"somebody else, they'll blame the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":441.27,"endTime":444.21000000000004,"body":"teacher, they'll blame the work,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":441.27,"endTime":444.21000000000004,"body":"they'll blame other children,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":444.33000000000004,"endTime":447.99,"body":"they're not able to accept that"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":444.33000000000004,"endTime":447.99,"body":"they might have made a mistake."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":448.37,"endTime":450.67999999999995,"body":"So we've got"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":448.37,"endTime":450.67999999999995,"body":"kids who present as irritable,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":450.86,"endTime":453.89,"body":"who presents as argumentative"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":450.86,"endTime":453.89,"body":"and defiant. And we've also got"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":453.89,"endTime":456.89,"body":"kids that can be quite"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":453.89,"endTime":456.89,"body":"vindictive. These are kids who"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":456.89,"endTime":460.58000000000004,"body":"might be deliberately spiteful"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":456.89,"endTime":460.58000000000004,"body":"to other children, you know, who"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":460.61,"endTime":465.32000000000005,"body":"actively enjoy others failures"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":460.61,"endTime":465.32000000000005,"body":"will deliberately plan to upset"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":465.32000000000005,"endTime":467.80999999999995,"body":"or harm other children that they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":465.32000000000005,"endTime":467.80999999999995,"body":"don't get on with. Now, this is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":467.80999999999995,"endTime":472.13,"body":"different from a child having"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":467.80999999999995,"endTime":472.13,"body":"poor social understanding and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":472.13,"endTime":474.26,"body":"upsetting someone because they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":472.13,"endTime":474.26,"body":"don't understand the impact of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":474.26,"endTime":477.79999999999995,"body":"their actions, or they have poor"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":474.26,"endTime":477.79999999999995,"body":"empathy. This is someone who is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":477.79999999999995,"endTime":482.65999999999997,"body":"deliberately going out of their"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":477.79999999999995,"endTime":482.65999999999997,"body":"way to engage in a plan that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":482.65999999999997,"endTime":485.21000000000004,"body":"they've thought about to upset"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":482.65999999999997,"endTime":485.21000000000004,"body":"or diminish the other kids in"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":485.21000000000004,"endTime":489.11,"body":"class. So let's have a think"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":485.21000000000004,"endTime":489.11,"body":"about how ODD develops. Well,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":489.11,"endTime":491.9,"body":"first of all, children with odd"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":489.11,"endTime":491.9,"body":"as we've discussed already, are"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":491.9,"endTime":495.32000000000005,"body":"often angry or irritable, and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":491.9,"endTime":495.32000000000005,"body":"that can manifest itself in"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":495.32000000000005,"endTime":499.82000000000005,"body":"class as tantrums. Now, most"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":495.32000000000005,"endTime":499.82000000000005,"body":"kids have tantrums and lots of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":499.82000000000005,"endTime":503.03,"body":"them up to about the age of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":499.82000000000005,"endTime":503.03,"body":"four. You know, sometimes it's"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":503.03,"endTime":505.97,"body":"called the terrible twos. But we"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":503.03,"endTime":505.97,"body":"all know that that that period"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":505.97,"endTime":508.52,"body":"goes on longer than that, at"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":505.97,"endTime":508.52,"body":"that age, you know, kids are"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":508.52,"endTime":511.54999999999995,"body":"started walking around, they're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":508.52,"endTime":511.54999999999995,"body":"starting to gain more"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":511.58000000000004,"endTime":514.34,"body":"independence in the world,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":511.58000000000004,"endTime":514.34,"body":"they're able to make choices"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":514.37,"endTime":517.91,"body":"away from their own parents and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":514.37,"endTime":517.91,"body":"kids love that, you know, who"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":517.91,"endTime":520.22,"body":"wouldn't love more and more"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":517.91,"endTime":520.22,"body":"independence and being able to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":520.22,"endTime":522.95,"body":"explore the world and to have"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":520.22,"endTime":522.95,"body":"tantrums because you've been"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":522.95,"endTime":526.25,"body":"told no, by a parent, up to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":522.95,"endTime":526.25,"body":"about the age of three or four"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":526.28,"endTime":530.96,"body":"is developmentally normal, it's"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":526.28,"endTime":530.96,"body":"expected, and it's still normal,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":531.02,"endTime":534.05,"body":"or expected to have occasional"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":531.02,"endTime":534.05,"body":"outbursts around boundaries,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":534.23,"endTime":536.72,"body":"even up into your teenage years."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":536.8,"endTime":540.9399999999999,"body":"However, having"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":536.8,"endTime":540.9399999999999,"body":"lots of tantrums over the age of"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":540.9399999999999,"endTime":545.05,"body":"four usually indicates that"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":540.9399999999999,"endTime":545.05,"body":"something else is at play here."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":545.08,"endTime":548.59,"body":"Sometimes there might be an"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":545.08,"endTime":548.59,"body":"issue around parenting or"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":548.59,"endTime":552.52,"body":"boundary setting. But it might"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":548.59,"endTime":552.52,"body":"also be a sign that the child"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":552.52,"endTime":557.5,"body":"has ODD and it's only at the age"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":552.52,"endTime":557.5,"body":"of four and over that medical"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":557.5,"endTime":560.98,"body":"professionals may start to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":557.5,"endTime":560.98,"body":"assess for ODD"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":561.01,"endTime":563.74,"body":"Something to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":561.01,"endTime":563.74,"body":"bear in mind here is while many"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":563.74,"endTime":567.1,"body":"children will start to develop"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":563.74,"endTime":567.1,"body":"ODD in the early years, it's not"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":567.13,"endTime":571.48,"body":"always present then, sometimes"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":567.13,"endTime":571.48,"body":"you can have fairly easygoing"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":571.48,"endTime":575.71,"body":"kids, and they suddenly develop"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":571.48,"endTime":575.71,"body":"ODD in adolescence. So what was"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":575.71,"endTime":579.67,"body":"an easygoing, happy child can"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":575.71,"endTime":579.67,"body":"sometimes develop ODD very"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":579.67,"endTime":582.43,"body":"quickly in their early teenage"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":579.67,"endTime":582.43,"body":"years, it's like to have a"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":582.43,"endTime":585.88,"body":"sudden rapid change of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":582.43,"endTime":585.88,"body":"personality. So it doesn't have"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":585.88,"endTime":589.18,"body":"to be present in the early years"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":585.88,"endTime":589.18,"body":"for you to see in teenagers."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":589.24,"endTime":591.85,"body":"Okay, so what"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":589.24,"endTime":591.85,"body":"happens to these children who've"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":591.85,"endTime":597.37,"body":"got ODD then? Well, it seems"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":591.85,"endTime":597.37,"body":"like some kids tend to grow out"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":597.37,"endTime":601.75,"body":"of it, but others actually carry"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":597.37,"endTime":601.75,"body":"it with them into adulthood. And"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":601.75,"endTime":605.86,"body":"this can really impact on their"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":601.75,"endTime":605.86,"body":"life chances and have quite a"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":605.86,"endTime":608.71,"body":"lot of negative outcomes for"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":605.86,"endTime":608.71,"body":"them. So you can imagine"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":608.71,"endTime":612.49,"body":"somebody who's having those sort"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":608.71,"endTime":612.49,"body":"of tantrum behaviours and really"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":612.58,"endTime":616.0600000000001,"body":"openly defiance against"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":612.58,"endTime":616.0600000000001,"body":"authority figures is going to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":616.0600000000001,"endTime":619.57,"body":"find it really difficult to do"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":616.0600000000001,"endTime":619.57,"body":"things like hold down a job, for"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":619.57,"endTime":622.72,"body":"example, they're probably going"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":619.57,"endTime":622.72,"body":"to have lots of problems in"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":622.72,"endTime":625.6,"body":"their relationships, whether"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":622.72,"endTime":625.6,"body":"that be with family members or"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":625.6,"endTime":629.23,"body":"with their peers. And ODD has"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":625.6,"endTime":629.23,"body":"actually also been linked to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":629.23,"endTime":633.58,"body":"negative life experiences such"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":629.23,"endTime":633.58,"body":"as alcohol and substance misuse."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":633.35,"endTime":636.2900000000001,"body":"When we think"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":633.35,"endTime":636.2900000000001,"body":"about ODD prevalence, which is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":636.2900000000001,"endTime":639.23,"body":"how many kids have it, it's"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":636.2900000000001,"endTime":639.23,"body":"actually really hard to judge."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":639.23,"endTime":642.2,"body":"There's been lots of studies"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":639.23,"endTime":642.2,"body":"done around the world and the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":642.2,"endTime":644.27,"body":"numbers, they come back out with"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":642.2,"endTime":644.27,"body":"when they sample their"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":644.27,"endTime":647.72,"body":"populations are very, very"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":644.27,"endTime":647.72,"body":"varied. At the low end, they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":647.72,"endTime":652.4300000000001,"body":"come back at 2% at the high end"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":647.72,"endTime":652.4300000000001,"body":"16%. That is a very wide margin."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":652.58,"endTime":654.74,"body":"If you average out those"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":652.58,"endTime":654.74,"body":"studies, which is something I"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":654.74,"endTime":657.32,"body":"did a couple of months ago,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":654.74,"endTime":657.32,"body":"you're probably looking at"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":657.32,"endTime":662.21,"body":"something like 4% of children of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":657.32,"endTime":662.21,"body":"school age would qualify for a"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":662.21,"endTime":666.26,"body":"diagnosis of OD D. So we're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":662.21,"endTime":666.26,"body":"talking about one child in the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":666.26,"endTime":668.72,"body":"average class of 30. So it is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":666.26,"endTime":668.72,"body":"quite widespread."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":668.8000000000001,"endTime":670.72,"body":"And the other"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":668.8000000000001,"endTime":670.72,"body":"complication with getting a"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":670.72,"endTime":675.4,"body":"diagnosis of OD D is it's often"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":670.72,"endTime":675.4,"body":"diagnosed alongside other"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":675.4,"endTime":680.62,"body":"conditions. Interestingly, it's"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":675.4,"endTime":680.62,"body":"often diagnosed alongside ADHD"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":680.62,"endTime":684.34,"body":"so Attention Deficit"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":680.62,"endTime":684.34,"body":"Hyperactivity Disorder. About"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":684.34,"endTime":690.1,"body":"four in ten children with ADHD"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":684.34,"endTime":690.1,"body":"actually turn out to have ODD as"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":690.1,"endTime":694.57,"body":"well, but it's also linked to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":690.1,"endTime":694.57,"body":"mood disorders, anxiety and"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":694.57,"endTime":698.6800000000001,"body":"learning and communication"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":694.57,"endTime":698.6800000000001,"body":"disorders. Children with ODD"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":698.71,"endTime":702.88,"body":"often go on to get a diagnosis"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":698.71,"endTime":702.88,"body":"later in life like conduct"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":702.88,"endTime":707.02,"body":"disorder, for example. So it can"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":702.88,"endTime":707.02,"body":"be complex to unpick as the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":707.02,"endTime":710.26,"body":"presentation is often"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":707.02,"endTime":710.26,"body":"complicated and children with"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":710.26,"endTime":713.9200000000001,"body":"ODD will, of course, often"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":710.26,"endTime":713.9200000000001,"body":"refuse to engage with the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":713.9200000000001,"endTime":717.97,"body":"assessment process to. If what"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":713.9200000000001,"endTime":717.97,"body":"they perceive to be an authority"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":717.97,"endTime":721.57,"body":"figure tries to come in to do"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":717.97,"endTime":721.57,"body":"observations or ask them"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":721.57,"endTime":725.47,"body":"questions. Children with ODD"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":721.57,"endTime":725.47,"body":"will often refuse to answer"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":725.47,"endTime":728.77,"body":"those questions and refuse to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":725.47,"endTime":728.77,"body":"engage with that assessment. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":728.77,"endTime":731.0500000000001,"body":"it all makes it quite tricky to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":728.77,"endTime":731.0500000000001,"body":"diagnose"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":731.16,"endTime":733.86,"body":"A condition that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":731.16,"endTime":733.86,"body":"ODD is similar to in many ways"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":733.86,"endTime":737.28,"body":"in the way it presents is PDA."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":733.86,"endTime":737.28,"body":"Now, we did an interview with"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":737.28,"endTime":740.01,"body":"Ruth Fidler, a few months back"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":737.28,"endTime":740.01,"body":"where we did a deep dive into"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":740.01,"endTime":745.14,"body":"PDA. PDA stands for pathological"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":740.01,"endTime":745.14,"body":"demand avoidance. So here the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":745.14,"endTime":748.8000000000001,"body":"word pathological means to an"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":745.14,"endTime":748.8000000000001,"body":"unhealthy degree. And then"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":748.8000000000001,"endTime":752.94,"body":"demand avoidance is avoiding"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":748.8000000000001,"endTime":752.94,"body":"demands. The difficulty is, when"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":752.94,"endTime":756.8100000000001,"body":"you look at the behaviours of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":752.94,"endTime":756.8100000000001,"body":"children in class, ODD and PDA"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":756.8100000000001,"endTime":760.32,"body":"can look fairly similar, but"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":756.8100000000001,"endTime":760.32,"body":"they have very different"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":760.35,"endTime":761.58,"body":"underlying causes."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":761.64,"endTime":765.1800000000001,"body":"So PDA is"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":761.64,"endTime":765.1800000000001,"body":"actually a specific form of"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":765.24,"endTime":769.47,"body":"autism. So while it's not a"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":765.24,"endTime":769.47,"body":"diagnosis by itself, the child"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":769.47,"endTime":773.97,"body":"will usually first get an autism"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":769.47,"endTime":773.97,"body":"diagnosis. But sometimes within"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":773.97,"endTime":778.47,"body":"that diagnosis, it will be"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":773.97,"endTime":778.47,"body":"described as autism with a PDA"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":778.47,"endTime":783.6,"body":"profile. Kids with PDA often"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":778.47,"endTime":783.6,"body":"seem on the surface to be quite"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":783.6,"endTime":788.58,"body":"social, at least superficially,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":783.6,"endTime":788.58,"body":"so their autism gets overlooked."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":788.35,"endTime":794.5600000000001,"body":"I just like to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":788.35,"endTime":794.5600000000001,"body":"take a pause for a moment and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":794.5600000000001,"endTime":797.38,"body":"say that if you're finding this"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":794.5600000000001,"endTime":797.38,"body":"podcast useful, then you're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":797.38,"endTime":800.74,"body":"going to love what we've got"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":797.38,"endTime":800.74,"body":"waiting for you in our Inner"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":800.74,"endTime":803.95,"body":"Circle programme. The Inner"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":800.74,"endTime":803.95,"body":"Circle is your one stop shop for"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":804.0400000000001,"endTime":808.0,"body":"all things behaviour. It's a"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":804.0400000000001,"endTime":808.0,"body":"comprehensive platform filled"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":808.0,"endTime":811.57,"body":"with videos, resources, and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":808.0,"endTime":811.57,"body":"behaviour inspiration to get you"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":811.84,"endTime":814.45,"body":"unstuck with classroom"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":811.84,"endTime":814.45,"body":"behaviour. We've got training"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":814.45,"endTime":818.38,"body":"resources on de escalation,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":814.45,"endTime":818.38,"body":"supporting kids with anxiety,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":818.59,"endTime":821.89,"body":"support strategies for"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":818.59,"endTime":821.89,"body":"conditions like autism, ADHD,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":821.89,"endTime":825.82,"body":"and PDA. Practical ways of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":821.89,"endTime":825.82,"body":"helping pupils deal with strong"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":825.82,"endTime":828.76,"body":"emotions, assertive behaviour"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":825.82,"endTime":828.76,"body":"management, techniques for"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":828.76,"endTime":831.46,"body":"managing the whole classroom,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":828.76,"endTime":831.46,"body":"setting out your classroom"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":831.46,"endTime":834.37,"body":"environment for success."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":831.46,"endTime":834.37,"body":"Resetting behaviour with tricky"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":834.37,"endTime":837.6700000000001,"body":"classes, and more. Our online"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":834.37,"endTime":837.6700000000001,"body":"videos walk you through"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":837.6700000000001,"endTime":842.26,"body":"practical solutions step by"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":837.6700000000001,"endTime":842.26,"body":"step, just like Netflix, you can"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":842.26,"endTime":845.02,"body":"turn an Inner Circle"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":842.26,"endTime":845.02,"body":"subscription on or off whenever"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":845.02,"endTime":848.95,"body":"you need to. With no minimum"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":845.02,"endTime":848.95,"body":"contract Plus, you can now get"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":848.95,"endTime":853.3000000000001,"body":"your first seven days of Inner"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":848.95,"endTime":853.3000000000001,"body":"Circle for just one pound. Get"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":853.3000000000001,"endTime":856.33,"body":"the behaviour answers in you've"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":853.3000000000001,"endTime":856.33,"body":"been looking forward today with"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":856.4200000000001,"endTime":859.72,"body":"Inner Circle, visit"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":856.4200000000001,"endTime":859.72,"body":"www.beaconschoolsupport.co.uk"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":859.9300000000001,"endTime":862.78,"body":"And click on the Inner Circle"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":859.9300000000001,"endTime":862.78,"body":"picture near the top of the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":862.78,"endTime":864.58,"body":"homepage for more information."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":867.74,"endTime":871.7900000000001,"body":"The key thing with kids with PDA"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":867.74,"endTime":871.7900000000001,"body":"is their behaviour, their demand"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":871.7900000000001,"endTime":875.6,"body":"avoidance, their refusal, their"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":871.7900000000001,"endTime":875.6,"body":"negotiation is linked to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":875.66,"endTime":879.41,"body":"anxiety. So inside their head an"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":875.66,"endTime":879.41,"body":"adult asks them to do something,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":879.44,"endTime":882.5,"body":"maybe as simple as put your coat"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":879.44,"endTime":882.5,"body":"on a coat peg or, you know do"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":882.5,"endTime":885.41,"body":"the first two sentences of your"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":882.5,"endTime":885.41,"body":"work. And in their head theyre"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":885.53,"endTime":889.64,"body":"amplifying those demands. And as"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":885.53,"endTime":889.64,"body":"a result, they experience huge"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":889.6700000000001,"endTime":893.27,"body":"amounts of anxiety. So to deal"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":889.6700000000001,"endTime":893.27,"body":"with that anxiety, they engage"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":893.27,"endTime":896.9300000000001,"body":"in lots of social tactics to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":893.27,"endTime":896.9300000000001,"body":"avoid demands like negotiating,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":897.14,"endTime":900.6800000000001,"body":"or becoming very passive or"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":897.14,"endTime":900.6800000000001,"body":"arguing or pretending to be the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":900.6800000000001,"endTime":904.46,"body":"person in charge to escape the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":900.6800000000001,"endTime":904.46,"body":"pressure of that anxiety. And"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":904.46,"endTime":907.58,"body":"when as adults, we put pressure"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":904.46,"endTime":907.58,"body":"on kids with PDA, what we're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":907.58,"endTime":911.0600000000001,"body":"doing is actually increasing the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":907.58,"endTime":911.0600000000001,"body":"anxiety. The anxiety builds and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":911.0600000000001,"endTime":914.0,"body":"builds and builds as the adult"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":911.0600000000001,"endTime":914.0,"body":"puts more pressure until you"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":914.0,"endTime":918.14,"body":"will eventually, in many cases,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":914.0,"endTime":918.14,"body":"the child physically resisting"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":918.14,"endTime":920.72,"body":"or melting down in the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":918.14,"endTime":920.72,"body":"classroom. So the key thing with"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":920.72,"endTime":924.71,"body":"PDA is their resistance to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":920.72,"endTime":924.71,"body":"demands is all around anxiety,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":924.74,"endTime":928.4,"body":"Whereas ODD can"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":924.74,"endTime":928.4,"body":"result in similar behaviours,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":928.4,"endTime":931.7900000000001,"body":"but it's actually got a very"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":928.4,"endTime":931.7900000000001,"body":"different cause. So therefore it"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":931.7900000000001,"endTime":936.2900000000001,"body":"will need different strategies"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":931.7900000000001,"endTime":936.2900000000001,"body":"to manage it. So ODD is more"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":936.2900000000001,"endTime":941.63,"body":"about that high need to be in"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":936.2900000000001,"endTime":941.63,"body":"control. Whereas PDA is about"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":941.66,"endTime":945.74,"body":"the anxiety that comes around"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":941.66,"endTime":945.74,"body":"other people making demands upon"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":945.74,"endTime":946.01,"body":"them."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":946.34,"endTime":948.44,"body":"Because we've"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":946.34,"endTime":948.44,"body":"got similar behaviours but"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":948.44,"endTime":951.38,"body":"different driving needs, it"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":948.44,"endTime":951.38,"body":"means our response to those"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":951.38,"endTime":954.74,"body":"needs needs to be different. So"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":951.38,"endTime":954.74,"body":"let's think about why do kids"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":954.74,"endTime":958.16,"body":"develop ODD what causes it? And"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":954.74,"endTime":958.16,"body":"the truth is at the moment,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":958.34,"endTime":960.8000000000001,"body":"researchers don't know they're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":958.34,"endTime":960.8000000000001,"body":"not sure there's all sorts of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":960.8000000000001,"endTime":964.19,"body":"research going on to this but"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":960.8000000000001,"endTime":964.19,"body":"ODD hasn't been linked to any"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":964.19,"endTime":967.16,"body":"one specific cause. The one"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":964.19,"endTime":967.16,"body":"factor might be might be"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":967.16,"endTime":970.1,"body":"developmental, it might be"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":967.16,"endTime":970.1,"body":"linked to changes in the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":970.1,"endTime":972.44,"body":"prefrontal cortex and we've"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":970.1,"endTime":972.44,"body":"talked about the prefrontal"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":972.44,"endTime":975.65,"body":"cortex, lots and lots and lots"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":972.44,"endTime":975.65,"body":"in this podcast. If you've"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":975.65,"endTime":978.26,"body":"listened before, you'll know"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":975.65,"endTime":978.26,"body":"it's the part of the brain that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":978.26,"endTime":981.6800000000001,"body":"deals with executive functions."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":978.26,"endTime":981.6800000000001,"body":"It deals with regulating mood,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":981.9200000000001,"endTime":985.85,"body":"accepting constraints being"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":981.9200000000001,"endTime":985.85,"body":"flexible, regulating your"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":985.85,"endTime":988.73,"body":"emotions and social interaction."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":985.85,"endTime":988.73,"body":"So if that child has a"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":988.73,"endTime":991.4,"body":"prefrontal cortex that's wired"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":988.73,"endTime":991.4,"body":"slightly differently, it's going"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":991.4,"endTime":994.01,"body":"to affect their ability to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":991.4,"endTime":994.01,"body":"integrate in class, it's going"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":994.01,"endTime":997.73,"body":"to affect their ability to be"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":994.01,"endTime":997.73,"body":"flexible. They're going to want"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":997.73,"endTime":1000.46,"body":"to be more in control of their"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":997.73,"endTime":1000.46,"body":"own actions and demands. And it"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1000.46,"endTime":1003.76,"body":"might affect the way they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1000.46,"endTime":1003.76,"body":"perceive other people and engage"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1003.76,"endTime":1004.4200000000001,"body":"socially."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1004.35,"endTime":1007.77,"body":"And of course,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1004.35,"endTime":1007.77,"body":"researchers are wondering if ODD"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1007.77,"endTime":1011.61,"body":"could be genetic. So that means"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1007.77,"endTime":1011.61,"body":"that it would be inherited from"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1011.61,"endTime":1016.0500000000001,"body":"one or both parents like some"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1011.61,"endTime":1016.0500000000001,"body":"other disorders, like autism,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1016.08,"endTime":1018.12,"body":"like ADHD, for example."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1017.35,"endTime":1023.14,"body":"Well, that's right. And it's"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1017.35,"endTime":1023.14,"body":"important to note that bad"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1018.1,"endTime":1020.583,"body":"Another question"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1018.1,"endTime":1020.583,"body":"I often get asked about ODD is,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1020.635,"endTime":1023.74,"body":"is it learned? Okay, is this"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1020.635,"endTime":1023.74,"body":"something to do with parenting?"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1023.14,"endTime":1067.6,"body":"parenting alone can't cause ODD"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1023.14,"endTime":1067.6,"body":"on its own. It's a bit like"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1023.792,"endTime":1026.638,"body":"And the truth is, kids with ODD"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1023.792,"endTime":1026.638,"body":"will present very, very"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1026.69,"endTime":1029.846,"body":"challenging behaviour in the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1026.69,"endTime":1029.846,"body":"home, which will often result in"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1029.898,"endTime":1032.899,"body":"that negative behaviour being"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1029.898,"endTime":1032.899,"body":"reinforced from parents, you"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1032.951,"endTime":1035.642,"body":"know, by giving too much"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1032.951,"endTime":1035.642,"body":"attention, which feeds that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1035.694,"endTime":1038.799,"body":"behaviour in future, or parents"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1035.694,"endTime":1038.799,"body":"might not feel they have the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1038.8509999999999,"endTime":1042.059,"body":"skills in place to put in place"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1038.8509999999999,"endTime":1042.059,"body":"consistent boundaries, because"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1042.1109999999999,"endTime":1045.3709999999999,"body":"otherwise, they would constantly"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1042.1109999999999,"endTime":1045.3709999999999,"body":"be putting in place boundaries"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1045.423,"endTime":1048.786,"body":"with their kids for every little"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1045.423,"endTime":1048.786,"body":"behaviour. And some parents will"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1048.838,"endTime":1051.995,"body":"stop trying to enforce those"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1048.838,"endTime":1051.995,"body":"boundaries, just for the sake of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1052.046,"endTime":1055.099,"body":"some harmony in the household."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1052.046,"endTime":1055.099,"body":"So if you've got ODD, you're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1055.151,"endTime":1058.2559999999999,"body":"going to bring more challenging"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1055.151,"endTime":1058.2559999999999,"body":"behaviour, which is going to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1058.308,"endTime":1060.43,"body":"need a different kind of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1058.308,"endTime":1060.43,"body":"parenting style."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1067.6,"endTime":1072.73,"body":"chicken and egg. ODD kids are"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1067.6,"endTime":1072.73,"body":"naturally harder to parent"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1072.76,"endTime":1075.9099999999999,"body":"because of their temperament,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1072.76,"endTime":1075.9099999999999,"body":"which can lead them to a"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1075.9099999999999,"endTime":1079.48,"body":"negative parenting style. And"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1075.9099999999999,"endTime":1079.48,"body":"that results in more challenging"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1079.48,"endTime":1083.02,"body":"behaviour, which is even harder"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1079.48,"endTime":1083.02,"body":"to parent, and around and around"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1083.02,"endTime":1083.98,"body":"and around we go."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1083.35,"endTime":1086.586,"body":"So let's have a look at a couple"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1083.35,"endTime":1086.586,"body":"of strategies that will work"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1086.639,"endTime":1089.822,"body":"with kids in the classroom who"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1086.639,"endTime":1089.822,"body":"present ODD. So kids with ODD"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1089.875,"endTime":1093.165,"body":"often respond well to extrinsic"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1089.875,"endTime":1093.165,"body":"rewards. So it's time to break"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1093.218,"endTime":1096.508,"body":"out those reward charts. Now, in"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1093.218,"endTime":1096.508,"body":"this podcast, we've talked in"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1096.561,"endTime":1099.691,"body":"the past how the ideal is, you"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1096.561,"endTime":1099.691,"body":"know, to encourage kids with"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1099.744,"endTime":1102.927,"body":"intrinsic behaviour that we do"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1099.744,"endTime":1102.927,"body":"the right thing, because it's"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1102.98,"endTime":1106.2169999999999,"body":"the right thing. But you've got"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1102.98,"endTime":1106.2169999999999,"body":"to work with what you've got,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1106.27,"endTime":1109.2939999999999,"body":"you've got to use what's"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1106.27,"endTime":1109.2939999999999,"body":"effective with the children that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1109.347,"endTime":1112.3709999999999,"body":"are in front of you. And the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1109.347,"endTime":1112.3709999999999,"body":"fact is, research shows that"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1112.425,"endTime":1115.7669999999998,"body":"using extrinsic reward systems"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1112.425,"endTime":1115.7669999999998,"body":"is very effective with kids with"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1115.82,"endTime":1118.685,"body":"ODD. So we need to get our"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1115.82,"endTime":1118.685,"body":"reward charts. And on those"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1118.7379999999998,"endTime":1121.4969999999998,"body":"reward charts, we need to be"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1118.7379999999998,"endTime":1121.4969999999998,"body":"very specific about the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1121.55,"endTime":1124.84,"body":"behaviours we are looking for"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1121.55,"endTime":1124.84,"body":"from that child, we want to make"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1124.8929999999998,"endTime":1127.8639999999998,"body":"the criteria for success"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1124.8929999999998,"endTime":1127.8639999999998,"body":"objective, so we could put on a"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1127.917,"endTime":1130.994,"body":"target along the lines have to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1127.917,"endTime":1130.994,"body":"behave better in class. But"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1131.0469999999998,"endTime":1134.072,"body":"actually, what does that mean,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1131.0469999999998,"endTime":1134.072,"body":"it could mean a variety of"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1134.125,"endTime":1137.149,"body":"things, it could be about how"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1134.125,"endTime":1137.149,"body":"you engage during the whole"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1137.202,"endTime":1140.491,"body":"class introductions and whole"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1137.202,"endTime":1140.491,"body":"class conversations, it could be"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1140.5449999999998,"endTime":1143.463,"body":"about trying hard with your"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1140.5449999999998,"endTime":1143.463,"body":"work, it could be about not"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1143.5159999999998,"endTime":1146.6989999999998,"body":"being physically aggressive to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1143.5159999999998,"endTime":1146.6989999999998,"body":"the other children, it's just"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1146.752,"endTime":1149.723,"body":"too broad. So with our reward"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1146.752,"endTime":1149.723,"body":"chart, we need to be super"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1149.7759999999998,"endTime":1153.013,"body":"specific about the things we're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1149.7759999999998,"endTime":1153.013,"body":"looking for. So that might be"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1153.0659999999998,"endTime":1156.1429999999998,"body":"along the lines of putting up"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1153.0659999999998,"endTime":1156.1429999999998,"body":"your hand three times on the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1156.196,"endTime":1159.2199999999998,"body":"carpet, that is something the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1156.196,"endTime":1159.2199999999998,"body":"child has done or not done,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1159.274,"endTime":1162.6689999999999,"body":"where there is a grey area. And"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1159.274,"endTime":1162.6689999999999,"body":"bear in mind the child here with"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1162.722,"endTime":1165.375,"body":"ODD, one of their"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1162.722,"endTime":1165.375,"body":"characteristics is they're going"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1165.4279999999999,"endTime":1168.665,"body":"to be argumentative. If your"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1165.4279999999999,"endTime":1168.665,"body":"targets are in that grey area or"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1168.7179999999998,"endTime":1171.954,"body":"woolly. You know, when you're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1168.7179999999998,"endTime":1171.954,"body":"using a reward chart, then they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1172.0069999999998,"endTime":1174.8719999999998,"body":"might start arguing about"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1172.0069999999998,"endTime":1174.8719999999998,"body":"whether they've achieved the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1174.925,"endTime":1177.9489999999998,"body":"target or not. So we want"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1174.925,"endTime":1177.9489999999998,"body":"something they've done, or they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1178.003,"endTime":1181.2389999999998,"body":"haven't done that's very, very"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1178.003,"endTime":1181.2389999999998,"body":"objective. And then we need to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1181.292,"endTime":1184.051,"body":"be consistent on our"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1181.292,"endTime":1184.051,"body":"expectations and delivering the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1184.1039999999998,"endTime":1187.2869999999998,"body":"rewards. If we say we're going"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1184.1039999999998,"endTime":1187.2869999999998,"body":"to promise something, if they"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1187.34,"endTime":1190.418,"body":"get 34567 stickers on their"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1187.34,"endTime":1190.418,"body":"chart, then we have to deliver"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1190.471,"endTime":1193.548,"body":"it. Otherwise, the child won't"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1190.471,"endTime":1193.548,"body":"believe in the system won't"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1193.6009999999999,"endTime":1196.625,"body":"believe they're going to get the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1193.6009999999999,"endTime":1196.625,"body":"rewards and it loses its"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1196.6779999999999,"endTime":1200.0739999999998,"body":"effectiveness. Another thing you"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1196.6779999999999,"endTime":1200.0739999999998,"body":"can do with reward charts is to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1200.127,"endTime":1203.204,"body":"vary the rewards because the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1200.127,"endTime":1203.204,"body":"system gets boring otherwise."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1203.2569999999998,"endTime":1206.653,"body":"And if your criteria are simple"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1203.2569999999998,"endTime":1206.653,"body":"and objective, there's no middle"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1206.706,"endTime":1209.677,"body":"ground to argue about whether"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1206.706,"endTime":1209.677,"body":"the reward was earned. Use"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1209.73,"endTime":1212.808,"body":"phrases if they tried to argue"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1209.73,"endTime":1212.808,"body":"like I'm not going to argue"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1212.8609999999999,"endTime":1216.2559999999999,"body":"about what I've seen with my own"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1212.8609999999999,"endTime":1216.2559999999999,"body":"eyes. And the decision has been"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1216.309,"endTime":1219.3339999999998,"body":"made when you're discussing"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1216.309,"endTime":1219.3339999999998,"body":"whether the child has met the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1219.387,"endTime":1222.04,"body":"criteria or not that will close"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1219.387,"endTime":1222.04,"body":"down the argument."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1222.1,"endTime":1223.99,"body":"I think closing"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1222.1,"endTime":1223.99,"body":"down the argument is key"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1223.99,"endTime":1227.9199999999998,"body":"actually because sometimes"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1223.99,"endTime":1227.9199999999998,"body":"adults get very drawn into"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1227.9499999999998,"endTime":1231.9099999999999,"body":"arguments with children and"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1227.9499999999998,"endTime":1231.9099999999999,"body":"children with ODD are like world"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1231.9099999999999,"endTime":1235.57,"body":"class arguers. They're very well"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1231.9099999999999,"endTime":1235.57,"body":"practised. What we've got to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1235.57,"endTime":1239.02,"body":"realise is that an argument is"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1235.57,"endTime":1239.02,"body":"like a game of table tennis, it"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1239.02,"endTime":1244.09,"body":"takes two, so one person, the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1239.02,"endTime":1244.09,"body":"adult, needs to put the bat down"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1244.2099999999998,"endTime":1248.1699999999998,"body":"and walk away. So having those"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1244.2099999999998,"endTime":1248.1699999999998,"body":"closure phrases like I'm not"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1248.1699999999998,"endTime":1252.01,"body":"going to argue or the decision"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1248.1699999999998,"endTime":1252.01,"body":"has been made, and then actually"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1252.01,"endTime":1256.4499999999998,"body":"physically turning away walking"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1252.01,"endTime":1256.4499999999998,"body":"away indicating what I sometimes"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1256.4499999999998,"endTime":1259.99,"body":"see is adult saying I'm not"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1256.4499999999998,"endTime":1259.99,"body":"going to argue about it and then"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1259.99,"endTime":1264.3999999999999,"body":"carry arguing about it. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1259.99,"endTime":1264.3999999999999,"body":"you've got to you know, say it"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1264.3999999999999,"endTime":1268.09,"body":"with conviction. And don't worry"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1264.3999999999999,"endTime":1268.09,"body":"if you don't have the last word"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1268.12,"endTime":1271.27,"body":"so don't worry if the child"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1268.12,"endTime":1271.27,"body":"comes back with something"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1271.27,"endTime":1275.53,"body":"because they will, but be the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1271.27,"endTime":1275.53,"body":"grown up and don't you feel like"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1275.53,"endTime":1279.1599999999999,"body":"you have to have the last word"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1275.53,"endTime":1279.1599999999999,"body":"so let them have their say. You"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1279.1599999999999,"endTime":1282.61,"body":"say what you need to say and"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1279.1599999999999,"endTime":1282.61,"body":"then that's it stop engaging"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1282.61,"endTime":1285.9099999999999,"body":"with that behaviour. Otherwise,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1282.61,"endTime":1285.9099999999999,"body":"it's easy to get tied up in"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1285.9099999999999,"endTime":1289.4199999999998,"body":"knots and you start negotiating"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1285.9099999999999,"endTime":1289.4199999999998,"body":"and compromising and going round"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1289.4199999999998,"endTime":1292.8999999999999,"body":"in many circles, and it just"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1289.4199999999998,"endTime":1292.8999999999999,"body":"gets really complicated. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1292.9299999999998,"endTime":1294.8799999999999,"body":"choose to put the bat down and"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1292.9299999999998,"endTime":1294.8799999999999,"body":"walk away."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1295.1799999999998,"endTime":1298.81,"body":"Another useful strategy is to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1295.1799999999998,"endTime":1298.81,"body":"give lots of choices about the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1298.81,"endTime":1302.35,"body":"work where you can. So you can"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1298.81,"endTime":1302.35,"body":"give choices about where it's"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1302.35,"endTime":1305.83,"body":"done, for example, so you can"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1302.35,"endTime":1305.83,"body":"say to the child, it's up to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1305.83,"endTime":1309.3999999999999,"body":"you, you can work here at the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1305.83,"endTime":1309.3999999999999,"body":"table, or you can work in the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1309.3999999999999,"endTime":1313.03,"body":"book corner, or you can lay on"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1309.3999999999999,"endTime":1313.03,"body":"the beanbag to do your work. You"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1313.03,"endTime":1316.6,"body":"can give choices about how the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1313.03,"endTime":1316.6,"body":"work is done. So maybe let them"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1316.6,"endTime":1320.86,"body":"use to write in pen or write in"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1316.6,"endTime":1320.86,"body":"pencil or write on a whiteboard"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1320.86,"endTime":1324.79,"body":"and photocopy it or use post it"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1320.86,"endTime":1324.79,"body":"notes or have a special notebook"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1324.79,"endTime":1329.59,"body":"give choices. So it doesn't feel"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1324.79,"endTime":1329.59,"body":"like you are trying to control"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1329.59,"endTime":1333.1599999999999,"body":"everything. And a great way to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1329.59,"endTime":1333.1599999999999,"body":"do that is use the language of"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1333.1599999999999,"endTime":1338.3799999999999,"body":"choice. So say things like when"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1333.1599999999999,"endTime":1338.3799999999999,"body":"you're ready, or it's up to you,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1338.4099999999999,"endTime":1343.87,"body":"or you decide. And that really"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1338.4099999999999,"endTime":1343.87,"body":"takes away that pressure of the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1343.87,"endTime":1347.26,"body":"adult trying to control the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1343.87,"endTime":1347.26,"body":"child, and it helps the child"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1347.26,"endTime":1351.28,"body":"with ODD to feel like they've"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1347.26,"endTime":1351.28,"body":"got some control. And they are"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1351.28,"endTime":1352.8999999999999,"body":"doing some of the decision"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1351.28,"endTime":1352.8999999999999,"body":"making"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1352.9499999999998,"endTime":1354.57,"body":"Linked to that,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1352.9499999999998,"endTime":1354.57,"body":"is an approach called limited"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1354.57,"endTime":1358.26,"body":"choice for managing behaviour."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1354.57,"endTime":1358.26,"body":"Very, very similarly, imagine"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1358.26,"endTime":1360.09,"body":"you've got a child who's"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1358.26,"endTime":1360.09,"body":"refusing to come in from"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1360.09,"endTime":1363.75,"body":"outside, what you do is give"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1360.09,"endTime":1363.75,"body":"them two separate options. So"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1363.75,"endTime":1366.36,"body":"you might say to them, well, you"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1363.75,"endTime":1366.36,"body":"can go in through the reception"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1366.36,"endTime":1369.57,"body":"door, or you can come in through"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1366.36,"endTime":1369.57,"body":"the year six door and giving"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1369.57,"endTime":1372.3,"body":"them that choice makes them feel"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1369.57,"endTime":1372.3,"body":"like they're in control of the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1372.3,"endTime":1374.58,"body":"outcome. And as Emma said,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1372.3,"endTime":1374.58,"body":"finish that off by saying, you"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1374.58,"endTime":1376.83,"body":"know, it's your choice, you're"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1374.58,"endTime":1376.83,"body":"in control. So you can go"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1376.83,"endTime":1379.86,"body":"through reception, we can go"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1376.83,"endTime":1379.86,"body":"through year six, it's entirely"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1379.86,"endTime":1381.1499999999999,"body":"your choice. I don't mind."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1381.2099999999998,"endTime":1382.98,"body":"I think with"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1381.2099999999998,"endTime":1382.98,"body":"limited choices, too, it's"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1382.98,"endTime":1386.6999999999998,"body":"important to make sure that"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1382.98,"endTime":1386.6999999999998,"body":"you're limiting to probably two"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1386.6999999999998,"endTime":1389.58,"body":"choices and make sure that"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1386.6999999999998,"endTime":1389.58,"body":"you're happy with either"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1389.58,"endTime":1392.8799999999999,"body":"outcome. Because where I've seen"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1389.58,"endTime":1392.8799999999999,"body":"this technique fail is where the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1392.8799999999999,"endTime":1396.84,"body":"adult has given two choices, one"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1392.8799999999999,"endTime":1396.84,"body":"that they would really like the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1396.84,"endTime":1400.4699999999998,"body":"child to pick, and one that they"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1396.84,"endTime":1400.4699999999998,"body":"don't want the child to pick. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1400.4699999999998,"endTime":1404.07,"body":"in your example, Simon about"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1400.4699999999998,"endTime":1404.07,"body":"coming in, if the adult says,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1404.28,"endTime":1407.8799999999999,"body":"Well, you can either come in or"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1404.28,"endTime":1407.8799999999999,"body":"you can stay out, when really"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1407.8799999999999,"endTime":1410.6399999999999,"body":"you want them to come in. You"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1407.8799999999999,"endTime":1410.6399999999999,"body":"know what's going to happen, the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1410.6399999999999,"endTime":1414.0,"body":"child is going to choose the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1410.6399999999999,"endTime":1414.0,"body":"well, I'll stay outside choice"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1414.0,"endTime":1417.6,"body":"then. And if you've given that"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1414.0,"endTime":1417.6,"body":"as an option, it feels like oh,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1417.6599999999999,"endTime":1420.81,"body":"you've been foiled. So make sure"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1417.6599999999999,"endTime":1420.81,"body":"you think through the options"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1420.81,"endTime":1423.3899999999999,"body":"and you're happy with either"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1420.81,"endTime":1423.3899999999999,"body":"one. So if you're giving the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1423.3899999999999,"endTime":1426.1799999999998,"body":"option, you can come through the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1423.3899999999999,"endTime":1426.1799999999998,"body":"reception door or come in"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1426.1799999999998,"endTime":1429.24,"body":"through the year six door, don't"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1426.1799999999998,"endTime":1429.24,"body":"then tell them off for choosing"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1429.24,"endTime":1430.9199999999998,"body":"the year six door if that's what"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1429.24,"endTime":1430.9199999999998,"body":"they do."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1431.02,"endTime":1432.6999999999998,"body":"And then you've"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1431.02,"endTime":1432.6999999999998,"body":"got to sound super neutral and"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1432.6999999999998,"endTime":1435.37,"body":"not like trying to force them"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1432.6999999999998,"endTime":1435.37,"body":"towards one choice. You've got"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1435.37,"endTime":1437.98,"body":"to sound super neutral. Now is"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1435.37,"endTime":1437.98,"body":"not the time to be assertive,"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1437.98,"endTime":1440.5,"body":"it's more dialling it back to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1437.98,"endTime":1440.5,"body":"neutral saying I do that one or"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1440.5,"endTime":1441.79,"body":"that one, I don't mind either"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1440.5,"endTime":1441.79,"body":"way,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1441.8,"endTime":1444.05,"body":"it's feigning a"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1441.8,"endTime":1444.05,"body":"little bit of disinterest. So it"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1444.05,"endTime":1446.9599999999998,"body":"takes the heat out of it, isn't"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1444.05,"endTime":1446.9599999999998,"body":"it? Okay, and if you're working"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1446.9599999999998,"endTime":1449.48,"body":"with kids with challenging"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1446.9599999999998,"endTime":1449.48,"body":"behaviour, and you're not sure"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1449.48,"endTime":1452.6299999999999,"body":"why they're acting that way,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1449.48,"endTime":1452.6299999999999,"body":"we've got a really useful"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1452.6299999999999,"endTime":1456.59,"body":"download that can help. It's"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1452.6299999999999,"endTime":1456.59,"body":"called the SEN handbook, and it"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1456.59,"endTime":1460.52,"body":"will help you to link together"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1456.59,"endTime":1460.52,"body":"behaviours that you've observed"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1460.52,"endTime":1465.23,"body":"in your classroom with some"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1460.52,"endTime":1465.23,"body":"possible causes such as autism,"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1465.3799999999999,"endTime":1470.0,"body":"ADHD, or attachment. The idea"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1465.3799999999999,"endTime":1470.0,"body":"here isn't for teachers to make"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1470.0,"endTime":1473.57,"body":"a diagnosis because we're not"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1470.0,"endTime":1473.57,"body":"qualified to do that. But what"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1473.57,"endTime":1477.98,"body":"we can do if we can try to link"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1473.57,"endTime":1477.98,"body":"together the behaviours that we"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1478.01,"endTime":1482.36,"body":"observe with some of the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1478.01,"endTime":1482.36,"body":"probable or possible causes. If"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1482.36,"endTime":1485.81,"body":"we can do that quickly, it means"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1482.36,"endTime":1485.81,"body":"that we can get the right help"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1485.84,"endTime":1489.77,"body":"and get early intervention"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1485.84,"endTime":1489.77,"body":"strategies in place. The SEN"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1489.77,"endTime":1493.1,"body":"handbook is a free download. So"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1489.77,"endTime":1493.1,"body":"go to the website"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1493.1299999999999,"endTime":1498.1399999999999,"body":"www.beaconschoolsupport.co.uk."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1493.1299999999999,"endTime":1498.1399999999999,"body":"Click on free resources, and"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1498.1399999999999,"endTime":1501.02,"body":"you'll get instant access to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1498.1399999999999,"endTime":1501.02,"body":"that resource. And we'll put a"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1501.02,"endTime":1503.36,"body":"link in the episode description"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1501.02,"endTime":1503.36,"body":"as well."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1503.5,"endTime":1505.6,"body":"And remember to"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1503.5,"endTime":1505.6,"body":"subscribe to the show to make"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1505.6,"endTime":1509.4399999999998,"body":"sure you hear each episode as"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1505.6,"endTime":1509.4399999999998,"body":"it's released. It's super easy"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1509.4399999999998,"endTime":1513.1299999999999,"body":"and only takes 10 seconds, open"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1509.4399999999998,"endTime":1513.1299999999999,"body":"your podcast app now click the"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1513.1299999999999,"endTime":1515.9199999999998,"body":"subscribe button or follow"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1513.1299999999999,"endTime":1515.9199999999998,"body":"button as it's called in Apple"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1515.9199999999998,"endTime":1519.6399999999999,"body":"podcasts and your podcast app"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1515.9199999999998,"endTime":1519.6399999999999,"body":"will automatically download"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1519.6999999999998,"endTime":1524.4699999999998,"body":"every single episode for you. So"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1519.6999999999998,"endTime":1524.4699999999998,"body":"you never miss a thing. And what"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1524.4699999999998,"endTime":1527.62,"body":"better way of celebrating your"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1524.4699999999998,"endTime":1527.62,"body":"mastery of the technology than"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1527.62,"endTime":1530.8899999999999,"body":"by giving the next five people"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1527.62,"endTime":1530.8899999999999,"body":"you see in the street, a knowing"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1530.8899999999999,"endTime":1533.1999999999998,"body":"wink. They won't know your"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1530.8899999999999,"endTime":1533.1999999999998,"body":"secret, but they'll know"},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1533.1999999999998,"endTime":1534.01,"body":"something's up."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1534.8799999999999,"endTime":1537.1899999999998,"body":"And if you can"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1534.8799999999999,"endTime":1537.1899999999998,"body":"think of a friend or colleague"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1537.1899999999998,"endTime":1541.03,"body":"who might be teaching a child"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1537.1899999999998,"endTime":1541.03,"body":"with ODD for example, or who"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1541.03,"endTime":1544.54,"body":"would find the content from"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1541.03,"endTime":1544.54,"body":"today's episode useful, then do"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1544.54,"endTime":1548.23,"body":"them a favour. Use the Share"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1544.54,"endTime":1548.23,"body":"button in your podcast app to"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1548.23,"endTime":1551.62,"body":"let them know about the episode"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1548.23,"endTime":1551.62,"body":"so that their classes and"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1551.62,"endTime":1554.83,"body":"students can benefit as well."},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1551.62,"endTime":1554.83,"body":"That's all we've got for you"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1554.83,"endTime":1558.01,"body":"today. I hope you have a great"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1554.83,"endTime":1558.01,"body":"week and we'll see you in the"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1558.01,"endTime":1561.49,"body":"next episode of school behaviour"},{"speaker":"Emma Shackleton","startTime":1558.01,"endTime":1561.49,"body":"secrets. Bye."},{"speaker":"Simon Currigan","startTime":1561.61,"endTime":1562.0,"body":"Bye now."}]}