Age of Vice and The Villa

We review two of the buzziest books of early 2023: Fast-paced gangster novel set in India Age of Vice by Deepti Kapoor and friendship travel story/thriller with Daisy Jones and the Six (by Taylor Jenkins Reid) vibes The Villa by Rachel Hawkins. Age of Vice is a contemporary novel set in India. It is equal parts thriller and family saga and centres around the Wadia crime family. The book is about gangsters, lovers, false friendships, forbidden romance and corruption. The Villa is a classic beach and escapist read. It is popular fiction with backstory and a bit of a bite.

Books and resources discussed:
Age of Vice by Deepti Kapoor
The Villa by Rachel Hawkins
Party Down, Crave
Shantaram by Gregory David Roberts
Shantaram, Apple Plus

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Transcript

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Unknown: 0:00

So long as we did His work, whatever else we did short of Killing cops, we had protection. I had a great education there. I understood the turning of the wheel, how the cops and the politicians and the bureaucrats were all working together to keep this wheel in motion. However he spoke of the wheel was important how the wheel was a system itself. How men like you are the shit that sticks to the wheel. How wheel crushes everything in its path. And oh, what a crushing it was. We indulged in extortion, collecting protection, money from businesses, or else burning them down. We commit many kidnappings for ransom. We kill our opponents stage riots, manage protests, if the minority community became upstarts, we burn their neighborhoods down. If some misguided citizen tried to complain about us, go to the media, or the new district magistrate we break their legs, or else we kill the journalist themselves. We had to make sure the message was clear. As long as you know your place and don't interfere, the wheel turns very well. But if you wish to be a hero, goodbye. Hello, welcome back to the Red Fern book review. I'm your host, Amy Mair. And today I'm joined by my co host, Jeff Mair. Hi, Jeff. Hi, Amy, how's it going? It's good. We're here to discuss two of the buzziest books of early 2023. We're going to talk about the fast pace gangster novels set in India, called the age advice by Deepti Kapoor and that was the opening quote that I gave, and a friendship travel story thriller with Daisy Jones in the six vibes, called the villa by Rachel Hopkins. But before we get started, Jeff, I wanted to thank you and point out to listeners that you might be hearing new sounds on this podcast and hopefully, better edits because you've taken over as executive producer.

Geoff Mair: 2:27

Yeah, I'm really excited to be doing the edits, because I think I can do a pretty good job on them. Yeah.

Unknown: 2:34

So people are, have been very supportive of this podcast. But I have had a few comments over the last couple of years that sometimes the music just stops, and there's the cuts are kind of severe. So

Geoff Mair: 2:53

I've suggested that the few times that I that I could make them better, and I think, so far it's working,

Unknown: 2:59

and even picked up a little made music a little jazzier. Yeah,

Geoff Mair: 3:04

I mean, I picked little jazz, your section of music. So it's a little more upbeat at the start of the show.

Unknown: 3:09

So this dovetails with what you're doing in your spare time, which to tell everyone about what what you've been up to, because you you've had a little back story, we've mentioned it before, but you've had double knee replacement surgeries. Yeah,

Geoff Mair: 3:23

so I got some time on my hands, like a lot of time on my hands. So and I knew I was going to have a lot of time on the hands coming up. So I decided to take up a new hobby, which is DJing. Because it kind of blends two things I love. I love music, and I love tech and like DJing and kind of mixing music is a very techy endeavor that that, you know, also brings a music and I love music. So I'm learning to edit sound now as a hobby, and it's awesome for the show, because I get to edit sound in the show, too.

Unknown: 3:56

So maybe when you're ready, we can debut one of your mixes on the Red Fern. I don't know if it's the right audience. But anyway, let's talk about the books. So the first book we're going to talk about, I think this discussion is going to play out a little bit about like the 1991 movie with Kevin Bacon called. He Said, She Said, and it's about journalists with dueling perspectives. Do you remember that movie? I did? Anyway, we're pretty divided on this book, this first book. So the first book we're going to talk about is Asia vise. And it's a contemporary novel set in India. And it's equal parts thriller and family saga, and it centers around the wadiya crime family. And this book is about gangsters, lovers, false friendships, forbidden romance, and corruption of lot of corruption and highlights the huge disparity in wealth between classes, highlights poverty, government corruption and organized crime. And I really thought it was about a lot of it was about the lack of choice people have on either side of the spectrum as well, the book literally starts with a bang. And in the very first pages, it starts like a, like an action movie. It's, we're in New Delhi, it's 3am. And a speeding, Mercedes jumps the curb, and moves over five people. And the car is owned by someone very wealthy. But when the whole thing's over, it's the servants that takes the blame. And we're, that's how it starts. And we don't know anything more, except all of a sudden, this person named Aj is left kind of literally holding the bag. And that's kind of that's like kind of the setup, the kickoff. And so it really was fast moving and dramatic as the book the whole rest of the book remains. And, Jeff, you really liked this book. And I'd like you to tell everybody why.

Geoff Mair: 6:19

For various reasons, I think the first is like, I thought the author did a really good job of transporting the reader into another culture. You know, the book is kind of like, has elements of the Godfather in it for sure, but set in India. So you really learned about, you know, the Indian, Indian mafia and Indian culture, and I really felt like I was transported into, you know, another world. I really liked the characters and and sort of the moral conflicts that they had. And I thought I felt like the moral conflicts that the characters had sort of reflected the moral conflicts that exist in Indian culture. What like, here's some some examples of moral conflicts. Like there's Netta, who's a journalist, you know, supposed to be ethical, but she's also a part of the story. You know, she's there, sonny, who's like this, descend into the mob, and he's like this mob son, but he also sees himself as a moderniser of New Delhi and like this really good. You know, a lot of the mob characters see themselves as almost like politicians. And I think that's a really moral conflict. And then the other one that I really liked is when Aj is sold into slavery, and there's the characters my mommy and daddy who, you know, think they're very moral treat him like they're his son, but he's really a slave, you know, that those kinds of moral complex in the book, I think, are super interesting. I love the middle part of the book where there's like this sort of out of control, romance going on between Netta and Sunni. And just generally, I thought the book was, you know, a pretty, pretty realistic depiction of what goes on in the gaming world in India. But it was really interesting.

Unknown: 8:07

So AJ, who just mentioned was the person stuck with the speedy Mercedes, at the very beginning of the novel, and the author, deep tea, says that he is the heart of the book, he was my favorite character. And, and as Jeff mentioned, he came from very difficult circumstances really had nothing, nobody. And he is sold off, as you said, as a slave. And so you kind of see him. He's kind of propelled into this world and ends up in a crime world and you have to read the book to find out how, but it just so through his eyes, you see him kind of seeing all the appeal, and all the kind of sad things and why he makes his choices, which really, I don't think he had a lot more a lot of choices. So you mentioned the Godfather, Rubin comparisons to the godfather. And I also read a comparison pillar comparing it to the Great Gatsby. Do you see that?

Geoff Mair: 9:10

I don't agree with the Gatsby. I don't actually think that's a very good comparison. I think the Godfather is a very good comparison. You know, other than

Unknown: 9:18

there was a big car crash right in The Great Gatsby maybe that Yeah, and I think

Geoff Mair: 9:23

that he sees himself as like this this kind of noble sort of, like, creator of a new new culture kind of likes any word. Yeah, that's really the only parallel that I would see and they throw big parties. But that's that's really the only parallel I saw there. i To me, it's too much the godfather to be Gatsby.

Unknown: 9:47

Um, okay, one of the things you had mentioned was how much you'd liked the sense of place like I will agree with that. This book was too violent for me. That's just the bottom line for me like i i I get it, I get the appeal. And why would it? It would appeal to people, but it goes into, you know, you get it. It's pretty violent. Yeah. It's some very dark parts of the book for sure. It's also incredibly long, which I think it's a lot to ask people. It's at some I think it's 550 pages. So it's a commitment. But one of the things I was going to ask you, Jeff, you mentioned that you really enjoyed the sense of place in the sense of kind of the sights and sounds of India, because this book takes place kind of all over India and the coast and the mountains and a new kind of super busy, New Delhi. And I would agree with you that sense of place was very, very visceral. And right before I met you, you were planning to go to India to travel and explore the country. You didn't end up going your parents kibosh that plan. You ended up going to grad school and you met me instead. I didn't go to India. Yeah, I guess that would have changed and changed. Changed our future, that's for sure. But what was it at that time that drew you to the country and, and when, as an, you know, middle aged person now reading this book, what, what

Geoff Mair: 11:17

I think when I was young, what I really wanted to do was go somewhere that was like, completely culturally different to where I had grown up. That's what appealed to me, I think India is known as being kind of a very, almost culturally overwhelming place to visit. And that's what I was really looking for when I was in my youth, something completely different. You know, in terms of like, what I, what I enjoyed about, you know, learning about Indian culture in the book, I think it's something that I thought was really interesting was kind of the difference between class and wealth in India, I thought the book did a good job of describing that. And I thought that was really interesting aspect of Indian culture that I, you know, so explain, explain that. Well, there's a part of the book where Sonny wordier, who's probably one of the wealthiest people in, in India is driving around and netas car, which is a piece of crap. And he talks to her all about how she can probably drive in a piece of crap car into the fanciest hotel anywhere in India and get great service, because she's upper class, and everybody could tell she's upper class.

Unknown: 12:25

So this is a good time to talk a little bit about deep tea and her kind of her process. And a little bit about her. So she's a young writer, a title a couple of age, I don't know. But you know how everyone looks when you get older, everyone looks young, so I can't tell. She says she could be 30, she could be 40. But she's young. And she came from an educated family. And she went to university, which puts her in one of the highest classes. And she actually was a journalist. And she lived and worked as a reporter in New Delhi. And what she has said is that she had rich friends, so she actually glimpsed and that would make sense if she was true, because she's one of the she wasn't like, super rich herself, but had a glimpse into the life that she's writing about here. And she says that her creative process, she said, I won't say too much about it, or I don't know how, but that the characters that she writes about are all composites of people either she knows or that she's seen from afar. And then she builds on these characters and they sort of come to life organically. And you know, a lot of you hear this from a lot of authors, like once a character gets started, they start to say things kind of almost like they're taking over the keyboard talking. So she did say they sort of built themselves but yeah, they they're based on true characters. And AJ was someone I think she met on like a coastal town like, and she just sort of imagined them more, but some when she was working as a journalist, she saw a lot. The implication is that she saw corruption. And she took notes and hoped she didn't know if she was gonna write a book but she sort of thought there's a lot here to work with. And she also wanted to show all the decadence and kind of sorrow and New Delhi like New Delhi, I've never been but

Geoff Mair: 14:32

I thought that was some things you did really well. Like it's a quite a dark book, but but the fun the fun part of the book is like this really opulent, you know, crazy spending that goes on, because it makes it kind of like fun as well.

Unknown: 14:50

This is her second book in 2015. She wrote her debut which was called a bad character. And it's a story about a young woman and that in India, and another thing this book is set as a planned trilogy. So this is the first one. And I think some of the minor characters and I think AJ might may or may see more of him in the next one.

Geoff Mair: 15:16

But I would say to read the next one, I will read the other, at least another one. It was great book, I really enjoyed it.

Unknown: 15:23

A couple positive things I will say from my point of view, the author is young and female, and it's also fresh and modern. It wasn't my taste, but it was I can see that it was, it's edgy. And the other thing that I think it does well is it does dance between popular and literary fiction, which I'm always kind of looking for that especially on this podcast, because I think a lot of people like that. I agree that good sweets, a good sweet spot, literary, but it's not not literally some literary aspects to it for sure, and big themes. Okay, so hopefully that's a nuff info for people to decide whether the book is right for them. Oh, and FX has bought the rights to this book, it's going to become a show or movie of some type. And this was good morning America's book club selection for January,

Geoff Mair: 16:19

it would make a really good movie or TV series.

Unknown: 16:24

The next book we're going to talk about is the villa by Rachel Hawkins. So the villa is a thriller. It's a book about toxic female friendships. And Rachel Hawkins is known for her thrillers. She is the author of the wife upstairs, which was one of my former book club Peck for my book club, reckless girls more recently, and she's also written a slew of way novels and has a passion for Gothic literature. So it's kind of a lot going on here. This book is everywhere. You may have seen it, it has a beautiful turquoise cover with lemons and lemon leaves and blossoms. And then there's this kind of crack down the middle. And it looks like it could be this is like a painting. That's an old painting that's been torn or piece of pottery that's been ripped. So I thought that was a really beautiful cover. And this is a mash up of a lot of different styles. And I think that this would be a popular, this could be a popular book club pick if you're looking for something lighter. And it would also be a great beach beach read and a great escapist read. And it's heavy, popular. It's heavy on popular fiction, but has a little bit of Overbite a little bit of with a backstory. What does that sound like to you? Are you interested?

Geoff Mair: 18:04

You know, typically be the type of book I'd be as interested in. But you describe it as, you know, Daisy Jones on the sixth leg, and I love Daisy Johnson. So that part piqued my interest.

Unknown: 18:18

Okay, well, so I'm going to now explain there's a few different storylines, and it sounds complicated. It's really not that complicated. But um, we'll talk about the Daisy Johnson six, because I think you're gonna have some thoughts around that. But okay, so the, the premise the the starting premise of the book is there these two friends, Emily and chess and their childhood friends, and they're both authors now in their 30s, just as super successful and write self help books. And then Emily, who's the primary narrator, she writes cozy mysteries, but she's kind of sort of successful. Like, I mean, I would think if she's published, I think that's successful, but not as well known. She's in the middle of a divorce and her husband wants half her earnings and our future earnings. So then, Justin, her a kind of frenemies, like they have a long history, but just reappears in Emily's life. And she's like, going on a girls trip. I've rented a villa in Orvieto, Italy, and let's go, let's get away and reconnect. And Emily's like, it's a good time to get out of town. So then they get there, and the house is gorgeous. There's a beautiful setting food and wine. But while they're there, they find out that this villa was the site of a famous murder that happened one summer, where a group of musicians from the early 70s got together kind of for like a crazy summer, and some bad things happened. So that's the first storyline and then there's a dueling storyline. And that is there's flashbacks to that summer, and that was 1974. And this is the whole like, Hey, Daisy Johnson, the sixth vibe. And it was a villa that was rented by the notorious rock star star, no Gordon, and he invites an up and coming musician, Pierre Sheldon, as well as Pierce's girlfriend, Mary, and stepsister Lera. To join. And so they have this kind of crazy summer with sex, drugs, and rock and roll. That's perfect. That's fun. Yeah, like, it's, um, that is fine. Of course, I liked the other storyline better. But you would like this one better. I like the first storyline, because I just sort of thought, oh, gosh, it'd be so fun to go on, like a girls trip. And like, there's a woman who brings like, sometimes clicks their meals and does their grocery shopping. And it's like, beautiful blue waters. And I like that sounds pretty appealing. But I can see why. The other part sounds more interesting to me, though. More fun. Yeah. And so then then there's a little bit of another storyline. So of course, the girls, the women get there, and they're like, wait a minute, they start to find out more about that summer. And they start to think maybe there's more than what was originally put in the news. Like, maybe there's, maybe maybe there's more to the story. And at the very same time, and we're seeing this more and more in literature, there's two podcasters they appear in a separate storyline. And they have a podcast called Two Girls One murder. And they are young, kind of a little millennial like, and they are currently investigating what really happened that summer 1974. And they think the murder needs to be reinvestigated. And so they're doing that on their podcast. So that's happening. Yeah. And then the very last part, which I think was kind of oversold, because it's really interests me. The final, there's a final storyline that's implied. And the author herself. Rachel Hawkins, she's really interested in Gothic literature or the Gothic time period. And she's really interested in Lord Byron, and in the 18th was 1816, Lord Byron, rented a home unlike a castle on Lake Geneva, and he had a wild group of people that came up and that was Mary Shelley, who wrote Frankenstein, Percy Shelley, her husband's. And then Lord Byron's Dr. John Polidori. And while they were there, they call it It's been called the summer without a summer like it was super rainy and dark that summer. And they sat around telling each other ghost stories. And they were considered as wild as kind of musicians from the 60s. Because Mary Shelley was like 17 years old, and Percy Shelley was married. And they were running around Europe together, she eventually gets pregnant. And it's just was kind of considered like the crazy 60s thought, in the 1800s. So what happened was the author sort of thought, this is kind of making me think of 100 years later. And that's why she picked up this kind of 1970 Crazy musician thing going on. But what she did as a nod was she took all the characters and kind of gave them names. So like, there's a Percy, in the 1970 version, there's a Mary. So that's kind of her nod. But I wanted more because it says on the back, talks about Frankenstein talk about and this is where Frankenstein was conceived. So and also, the first vampire story called The Vampire was also conceived here by another one of the guests. But that's all there is. That's the only real connection is that there was a castle by

Geoff Mair: 23:58

the for the author, it's a bigger connection, because she based the whole thing on it in in her mind and writing it but as a reader, it's not as obvious.

Unknown: 24:08

Yeah, and she does use some Gothic conventions, like there's a missing manuscript. And there's a house like a house is often the character in these gothic novels. And, you know, there's a bit of a mystery. So. But yeah, I wanted a little bit more. And I got so interested in this kind of timeline. I'm going to be having on Route retired SFU, Professor Mason Harris on next month, and he's going to talk about Rankin the making of Frankenstein, the novel, and also this whole wild crew and their backstory. So what do you think about that in questions? No, it

Geoff Mair: 24:50

sounds like an interesting book. Sounds like it's got any, you know, several interesting storylines, and you know, isn't it? It has a fun aspect to it, too.

Unknown: 24:59

Yeah. mean, it sounds like the way I described it might sound like it's complicated. It's really not. It's just kind of fun. And another, it's also a nod to Exile on Main Street was created at a villa in France, The Rolling Stones went there one summer, and I think they were kind of crazy. There's references implied to Fleetwood Mac and the Manson murders. So, um, but it I think this book on balance is a little too popular fiction for me. But what I would do, I tend to read, as I mentioned before, a more challenging book. And then I love a little bit of a lighter book as a palate cleanser. And I really did enjoy this book. So and I think a lot of listeners would, too. So. Okay, and our last segment, we're going to talk about what we're watching right now. And Jeff has had a lot of time to watch programs. I've watched all of Netflix, you've watched all of Netflix. So what do you recommend, Jeff?

Geoff Mair: 26:07

So the show I'm going to recommend today is called Shantaram is very closely tied to a device because it's all about the underbelly and sort of Mafia of India. So the story follows main character who is an escaped convict from Australia, he flees to India and gets really sort of closely tied to the underbelly and sort of criminal world in India. And so the parallels between age advice and Shantaram are really a lot like there's you know, there's mafia people who think they're going to recreate India and modernize India, they see themselves as, you know, really moral people that really, they're like, their crime lords. It's very, you know, has a lot of similarities to the book, the book we read this time around. So Shantaram is based on a novel, it was written by Gregory, David Roberts. And what's interesting is, Roberts was actually an escaped convict. And he based and he escaped India, and he actually based the book on himself. And he obviously had a pretty big ego, because the main character is like, kind of a Christ figure. And yeah, so that made it kind of interesting, because this Christ figures kind of subtly woven throughout of the story. And yeah, it's a really fun show. I really recommend it. Um,

Unknown: 27:37

so this sounds more appealing to me than age advice. Primarily. No offense, Jeff, but some of my girlfriends have recommended it. So Chandra, yeah, both the book and the show. I think they like it because of what's his name fairly. He's not bad looking. I will admit, he's a pretty funky character. No, but they just I just think it sounds like something I try.

Geoff Mair: 28:04

Yeah, it's maybe not as heavy as a device. It's more sexy and fun. And it's a little more lighthearted. And there's, there's more hope in it. A device doesn't really feel like there's a lot of hope in it. Shantaram like, it kind of has this, I would say Christ thing going on throughout it. And it's much more hopeful.

Unknown: 28:24

Okay, so I wanted to recommend a show, which we watched, which I think people would like called party down. And this was recommended to me by my friend Jill, and it is currently on crave. And it is an older show. It came out. Season One came out in 2009. Season two came out in 2010. But why it's getting a bit of buzz right now is they've waited and they've just done season three and it's a cult classic, written partly by Paul Rudd. And it's a bit like the office in LA and it's about a group of random want to be actors. And they're all trying to make it in Hollywood in order before they make it. They're working for a posh la catering company. So each show they go to all kinds of different events. Like a senior singles, mixer a porn war words after party, a super sweet 16 Bash. And so you can imagine hilarious this that ensues. Yeah. And it's got a lot of people that you guys will recognize on it.

Geoff Mair: 29:40

I've watched a couple episodes. It's pretty it's pretty fun.

Unknown: 29:43

Yeah, so I think and apparently Jennifer Coolidge is on it, which now Lizzie Kaplan Jane Lynch mechana Lolly and Jennifer Garner apparently is in this season. And Zoey child from the app After Party, which is also hilarious. She's on it. Yeah. So anyway, I think people that come for something that's

Geoff Mair: 30:08

yeah. Yeah, it's fun. It's fun. It's smart. Okay. well written.

Unknown: 30:14

All right. Well, I think that's it for now. And anything else you want to add?

Geoff Mair: 30:19

No, I really enjoyed doing podcasts with you today.

Unknown: 30:23

Thank you. Thanks for editing. I appreciate that. And I feel like I have a staff I have like, it makes me more does it make me more efficient? Does it much more efficient? So the books again, our age advice by deep tea Kapoor and the villa by Rachel Hopkins, and we're getting close to the end of our third season. Can you believe it? Wow, you've been working hard in Yeah. And so we have a few more episodes to go. But I wanted to encourage people again to send us a voicemail, because I love getting feedback. And we could play that on a future show or give me some ideas for future episodes. So thanks so much for tuning in. And thanks, Jeff, for coming on podcasts. Awesome. Thanks, everyone. Okay, bye.