EP. 90: Grace Across Divides With Duane Parker

What if unity isn’t a program, but a daily practice? In this episode, Duane Parker - pastor and executive director with Marketplace Chaplains - shares lessons from a lifetime of cross-cultural ministry and reconciliation work.

From church-based efforts that faded without long-term intention to workplace chaplaincy that shows up week after week, Duane reminds us that unity has no shelf life. Grounded in John 17, this conversation challenges us to pursue reconciliation not as a moment, but as a way of life - one that the watching world can see and trust.

Special thanks to our sponsors: 

Nissan, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy, Regions Foundation, Mississippi College, Anderson United Methodist Church, Grace Temple Church, Mississippi State University, Real Christian Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptist Church, Christian Life Church, Ms. Doris Powell, Mr. Robert Ward, and Ms. Ann Winters.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:12

This is Living Reconciled, a podcast dedicated to giving our communities practical evidence of the gospel message by helping Christians learn how to live in the reconciliation that Jesus has already secured for us by living with grace across race divides. Hey, thanks so much for joining us on episode 90 of Living Reconciled. I'm your host, Brian Crawford, hanging out with incredible friends, friends like Nettie Winter.

SPEAKER_03 0:38

Sir, how are you doing today? I'm wonderful, man. I'm excited to be here, especially with my good friend Dwayne Parker. I'm excited about the program today. I can't wait to get him started.

Meet Guest Dwayne Parker

SPEAKER_02 0:49

I'm sure you can. I'm sure you can. But before we wind him up and turn him loose, we want to give a special thanks to our friends, sponsors like Mississippi College, Bellhaven University, Anderson United Methodist Church, Grace Temple Church, Mississippi University, Real Christian Foundation, Nissad, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy Regents Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptist Church, Christian Life Church, so many good folks, so many good friends. It's because of supporters like you that Mission Mississippi is able to do what we do. If you want to join that incredible list of individuals, churches, companies, and foundations who are investing in the work of reconciliation by investing in Mitch Mississippi, it's incredibly easy to do. Just go out to Mitch Mississippi.org, click on the donate page on the top right corner, and YouTube can join in investing in the work that the Lord is doing in this state and beyond. Today, as Nettie mentioned, and he is so eager and cannot wait to get into our interview today. But today, we are joined by a special guest and friend of Mr. Mississippi. He is the executive director of operations at for the Marketplace Chaplains here in the state. He uh was a pastor, he was a graduate of education at the University of Louisville, the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary. Um he has uh an illustrious, uh illustrious list of credentials. Um he is a resident of Laurel, Mississippi, and again a friend of Mission, Mississippi. Uh we welcome to the program today, Dwayne Parker. Brother, how are you doing?

SPEAKER_01 2:25

Oh, yeah, fantastic. It's a great day. The cold has moved out, and uh we're uh just waiting for Christmas to turn around.

SPEAKER_03 2:34

God is back on the throne, man.

SPEAKER_02 2:39

I don't think he's ever left, Nettie.

SPEAKER_03 2:41

I don't think he's ever left. I think I think he sticks I think he sticks around even for the cold weather, man. Yeah, I I you know some people think because it got down to 17 degrees in Mississippi, the God must have left the drone.

SPEAKER_02 2:54

No, I think he sticks around even for us uh folks that aren't used to the cold nature. Dwayne, why don't you start off by telling us a little bit about yourself? Tell us a little bit about your story of faith, man, and and and how the Lord uh brought you to the space and place that you currently are.

Testimony: From Rebellion To Calling

SPEAKER_01 3:12

Sure, love to do that. Um I grew up in a uh pastor's home. My dad was an American Baptist pastor uh in the state of West Virginia, and uh we were uh first in, last out, every church service. Um and and to be honest with you, you know, that that breeded some resentment in me. Um and and though I was uh I was baptized at an early age, I I just got wet that day. Um and and uh didn't have a real faith in in Jesus. I I had faith in me. Um was still had me on the throne instead of Jesus on the throne and uh went down a really dark path. I could have ended up in a mental institution, I could have ended up in jail. Um the uh the allure of drugs and alcohol was pretty prevalent uh on my life, and really it was just rebellion. Um and there was a there was a a moment as a freshman in college where uh I had a come to Jesus moment, as they say, right? I was uh I was failing my classes, I was about to get kicked out of uh school, I was gonna lose my scholarships, uh, you know, everything was going wrong, and it was all because of my attitude. And um uh in that dorm room, uh I reached over and and found the Bible that the church had given me for graduation. Now, I'll be honest with you, I brought that Bible because I didn't want my parents to think bad of me, but I never thought about using it, hadn't hadn't looked at it since they gave it to me. But I reached over, I reached over that day and I prayed.

SPEAKER_03 5:05

I said, God, they were gonna think about you. Huh? I said, Were you really concerned about it, them thinking bad about you? Well, you know, it was a gift.

SPEAKER_01 5:16

Okay. Uh you you still honor the gifts people give you.

SPEAKER_05 5:21

Yeah.

Early Cross‑Cultural Threads

SPEAKER_01 5:21

Um, yeah. So I was, I was, I was when I packed up my house, I was concerned about it. When I got out in the away from them, I wasn't much concerned about it, Neddy. Um, but uh, you know, I've I I realized if I didn't change, my life was gonna be different. I was gonna uh I was gonna have a very difficult life. And uh and really felt the Holy Spirit, uh, you know, I know it now. It was the Holy Spirit coming to me and telling me that uh uh I was free to choose that way, but there were consequences if I did. And so I um I prayed that night in my dorm room and said, God, you gotta help me. I don't I don't know what I'm doing, I don't know how to do this, and you know, just that you encourage as a pastor, you encourage people never to do this, but just flip open the Bible and put your finger on a verse. Don't do that, right? But that's what I did. And uh and that verse was um was God talking to Solomon, and as he was taking over the reins of the kingdom, and Solomon asked for wisdom, and the verse that I read first was, I'll give you this because you didn't ask for riches. And um, and almost immediately there was a transformation in my person. There was a transformation in my thought, there was a transformation in my affect, uh, there was a transformation in my behavior. And uh and for that last two or three weeks, um you know, the Lord put uh discipline in my heart and I started studying and and and worked my way back into uh a C average as a freshman uh in in college. Um and and and you know, from that point then uh I guess as a senior in college, uh felt a calling into ministry and uh went to seminary and then from there uh into uh counseling. Uh uh studied educational counseling, uh vocational counseling, but eventually went to mental health counseling for about seven or eight years. I worked with adults with severe mental illness. Um and then uh uh kind of pulled pulled into community ministry. Uh I like to tell people uh yeah, I have a lot more in common with um with Barack Obama than I do with Donald Trump because I was a neighborhood organizer. Oh wow.

SPEAKER_03 8:18

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_01 8:20

Yeah. Uh on on staff as a minister doing neighborhood organizing, block watches and programs, writing grants for um for after school programs and kids' programs in the neighborhood and uh doing well. And and and then at some point my wife comes to me and she says, uh, you know, you're you're you're pursuing the wrong thing. God really, I think God really wants you to be a minister.

SPEAKER_02 8:54

And uh I like I like to say that which is an unusual request, by the way, typically coming from the spouse, right? It's yeah, it's typically the the the minister to be going to the spouse saying, hey, is it okay? Would you come along if I if I embraced this call to be a minister, would you come along?

SPEAKER_01 9:14

That's right. That's right. You know, I I I uh I oftentimes uh say this, not usually in her presence, but I say this. You know, uh uh Balaam had a donkey that talked to him. At least I got somebody good looking. They talked to me.

SPEAKER_00 9:32

Um my goodness. But but here's the the other part of that, right?

SPEAKER_03 9:36

Is that my wife you you do know that this is gonna be uh publicized.

SPEAKER_04 9:42

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_01 9:42

I know that is. I know that is. She'll eventually hear it. But if you want to date me, she will hear about it, I'm sure. Uh but really my wife had grown up, and and uh kind of the vision for her life was that she was supposed to marry a minister. And so when I was not in the ministry when we got married, she kind of questioned, you know, was I wrong all this time? And I'd, you know, I'd been on boards for the church and leadership teams for the church, uh, worship leader for the church as a lay person. And wow, and I had I had made the decision at that point that I was going to be the best layperson a pastor could ever have rather than being in leadership and uh as uh chairman of a search committee for a new pastor for our local congregation in Louisville, Kentucky. Um, I had two of the candidates who said to me, uh, you know, it seems like there's a calling greater than this on your life. And uh and one of them became a mentor for me and helped me move in the direction of uh full-time ministry. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 11:01

Wow. You your your journey in ministry took you in a direction um that that coincides with the lane that we run in, Dwayne, um, as it relates to the the work of reconciliation, the work of racial healing, um, building relationships across divides and differences. Talk to us a little bit about how you ended up in that space uh as you ventured into ministry and talk a little bit about not just how you got there, but also a little bit about some of the some of the joys and the sorrows of working in that space from your vantage point.

SPEAKER_01 11:40

Uh you're talking about the neighborhood organizing space or the mental health space.

Shifting Traditions: Toward Unity

SPEAKER_02 11:45

Well, the the the the reconciliation, the racial healing space. You could talk about both of them in particular, but I know I know I know your your story has led you into that reconciliation space. So please tell us a little bit about that journey.

SPEAKER_01 11:57

Yeah. Well, you know, it's it's it's funny because uh in anticipation of this conversation, Brian, I'm I'm looking back at my early life and um and and my my my context, my familial context, my um uh early life to uh to high school was Lily White. I didn't know any black people. I didn't know any people of color. They weren't in my churches, they weren't in my schools. Literally, I was you know, I was in in uh rural West Virginia. Um I I didn't know in anybody there. Now, remarkably enough, right, in my hometown, Clarksburg, West Virginia, the uh the animosity that existed in that town was there was some there was some racial black and white stuff going on, but most of it was Italians and everybody else in that community. Wow. This is in the 1970s. Um in fact, uh uh you know, we say it uh kind of jokingly, but it was probably true, um, that the Italian mafia ran our community.

SPEAKER_00 13:16

So being white and in West Virginia.

SPEAKER_03 13:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:20

In West Virginia.

SPEAKER_03 13:20

I thought it was the Hatfields and the McCoys, man. But you mean being white in your community was not an advantage?

SPEAKER_01 14:09

Uh being Italian was an advantage. And and listen, this is um uh one of those those things, right? I I don't remember this because I was just I was just a baby, but my mom was in the grocery store one day. My mom and dad would tell the story. She was in a grocery store one day, and I was in the buggy, and she had stepped away from the buggy to get something off the shelf, and somebody comes up to her to to me and says, Oh, I know who you are. You're a little romano boy. Wow. And my wife's and my mom's my mom steps up and says, No, he's a parker. But but I had I have I've always had a very dark tone to my skin, which made me look a little more ethnic. And even now, you know, some of our brown brothers will ask me, say, say, what's your heritage, man? You you have a unique tone. What's your heritage? And uh and I share with them, you know, our our family tradition says that there is Cherokee in our family, and I'm just the one that got the most of it. Right, right, right.

SPEAKER_03 15:28

So um I you know and Dwayne, I thought they just let you drink coffee when you were growing up.

SPEAKER_01 15:38

Well, uh, no, they didn't let me drink coffee and and I still don't.

SPEAKER_02 15:43

So now Dwayne, you talked a little bit about oh I'm sorry, go ahead. Jump jump in, jump in, go ahead.

Mississippi Move & Katrina Ministry

SPEAKER_01 15:50

Yeah, so so you know that um in fact uh you know there was a place, there was a neighborhood in in town that uh the Itali where the Italians lived, and they and even though it was uh Northview on a hill looking over the river, um, it was typically referred to as Talley Valley, which is an ethnic slur um that that was prevalent in our in our community. Now there was also there was in our community, there was a there was a there was a black part of the community as well, uh Washington Irvington High School. Didn't think much about that until I got to high school, but it was it was the black high school in town. And um uh and as a as a high school sophomore, I was in junior high uh seven, eight, nine, so I didn't go to high school until tenth grade as a sophomore. Um and there were two or three African Americans in the community uh high school there. One of them actually was my hero, the guy I looked up to. He was the state champion uh cross-country runner for our high school, Corky Davis. And I wanted to be like Corky. You know, I wanted to be the guy that uh brought home uh uh medals and and ribbons and trophies for our community, and and Corky was was the guy I looked up to uh in that. So you know, moving in to to reconciliation, it was it was like, oh that was that was just normal for me. Right. I don't know, I don't know how that happened. Um you you fast forward um what four years, five years, and I'm a I'm a junior in college, I'm living off campus, and I need a roommate, and the one the one black guy at the first Baptist Church in Morgantown, West Virginia needed a roommate, and so we moved in together. Wow. Spent the whole semester uh together as uh as roommates and got along. Never had any any problems, uh, any issues. Now, again, he was the only black guy at the first Baptist Church, right?

SPEAKER_02 18:24

But you know, we Which was not which was not incredibly unusual um, you know, in in you know in those years in those years at all to be solo, solo in terms of the only black or brown person in the first Baptist church. So that's that wasn't incredibly unusual at all. It's um, you know, it I I find it always interesting that a lot of stories of individuals that um eventually went on to do reconciliation work, racial healing work, that a lot of those stories are always, you know, there's there's this uh there's these other smaller stories that are sprinkled in where God was setting or orchestrating the path by giving you different relationships uh across those lines, giving, giving those relationships to you early. And and you and at the at the time, you know, they're just relationships. You don't know necessarily what you what he's doing with them. But then you look back and you say, oh, so that was one reason why that was a relation, a meaningful relationship in my life, and oh, that's one reason why this was a meaningful relationship in my life. And so um, and so I I know, I know, you know, when I think about the work that I'm doing today, I can look back on all of the smaller stories from elementary all the way through high school and college, where there were these moments where I didn't know what he was doing then, but now that I look back on it, I'm like, oh, that's why I went to that place. That's why I was with those folks, that's why I got a chance to have that experience. It was all tied together to, to, to make this uh this rich, you know, this rich tapestry, so to speak, that he was making um of the life, of the life of Brian Crawford. So it sounds it sounds like the way it sounds like some of that is we're listening to your story, it sounds like some of that is kind of how you were shaped.

SPEAKER_01 20:20

Yeah, I I think I think you're right. Um, you know, I uh and I moved to Mississippi in 2005, 62 days before Katrina. Um, and in South Mississippi, you know, there was a lot of stuff to do. And uh and and I started helping people, you know, through the church, we started outreach to

Church Of God Reconciliation Work

SPEAKER_02 20:40

uh people in the community and we didn't ask what your background was your or your your ethnicity we just you know people were in need and uh the people at the church found out that I could roof houses and uh that I knew how to that I knew how to put tarps on a roof and and how to how to put down shingles and they said where'd you learn that I said well I I learned that as a kid my dad was um bivocational as a uh uh in construction and ministry and uh and I said you know God has a way of not wasting our experiences whether they're you know uh occupational experiences or uh relational experiences he has a way of not wasting those yeah in order to bring us to some future event and that's our preparation yeah yeah amen tell us a little bit about your um your experience uh with the church of God you you you mentioned we've had some conversation a little bit where you talked about some of the reconciliation uh work that you that you done that you've done when you were with the church of God talk to us a little bit about that work and and what lessons what lessons the Lord taught you uh through through that work you you know do I mean before you get before you get into that transition though I want to understand you got a a degree from a Baptist place your daddy was a Baptist preacher I didn't want to as you translate into that or a segue into that tell us how you've been baptist through and through and you end up in the church of God well um you know that's another uh aspect of the ministry that Mission Mississippi has is that that broad range uh inclusion of people from across the faith uh uh landscape right um one is that I didn't graduate from that Baptist seminary only attended and and made the shift okay uh it was it it was now now I will say I was there for one semester but it was probably the most meaningful educational experience I've ever had wow um because it was it was it did force me to become disciplined and it was it was whole very different than anything I'd ever done before um but as as a leader in the what was then in when I was in college a leader in the Baptist campus ministry one of the things I got to do was to be on the Interfaith Council at West Virginia University.

Why Reconciliation Requires Ongoing Intent

Marketplace Chaplains: Model & Mission

Care Without Walls: Families And Diversity

SPEAKER_01 23:23

Now that's a the largest secular university in the state of West Virginia at the time that had 2000 students and there were 2000 people in Morgantown. So when the students came to town it doubled the size of the city. Wow wow um so I got to hang out with uh with Presbyterians and with Pentecostals and Baptists and Methodists and the intervarsity folks and the Crusade for Christ folks and and I got to see that there were believers across the spectrum in fact there was there was one group that I hung out with that was uh that was a student-led group student started group called Rushing Wind Ministry they were very Pentecostal um they were you know and I and and they were great people and I would go hang out with them and they would do stuff that just um you know push pushed me to my limits and and uh and and I said I said man I don't I don't really understand you know why I'm here but they were great friends uh they were they were kind to me as a Baptist guy you know they let me join their group um and and so you know moving from the Baptist faith or the Baptist uh tribe to the church of God tribe was really just a matter of um understanding the the call of God loves everybody you know when I was growing up Nettie we used to have a a joke and say uh you know uh God died and went to heaven and when he got there uh St. Peter was showing him around and there was a big wall up and St. Peter says now when we go by here y'all be quiet because the Baptists think they're the only ones here that's pretty genius so so there was that um uh there was that that aspect of exclusivity that still uh permeated uh you know where I grew up that if you had you had to have all the right theology in order to be accepted by God it wasn't as much about what Jesus did it was about what you were doing and what you believed um and I found that in college uh undergraduate that that that didn't resonate with me anymore that um I had I had uh I had grown beyond that and the church of God that that uh you know has its theology we reach our hands in fellowship to every bloodwash one that all believers are welcome here is um was was was was was very attractive to me not to mention the fact that I was dating a young lady who attended that the real the real the real story well she was the introduction to the theology and uh and amazingly enough she had attended a Baptist college and then she came back and said you know our faith traditions are very different this may not work for us and so I started investigating the Church of God Anderson Indiana and uh found that um uh their teachings on holiness and unity were very attractive for me which is a good segue into the unity conversation because you said the teachings were attractive and then that moved you into the work in the space of unity reconciliation in the church of God and you learned some stuff in that and you learn you learned some lessons rather in in that in that space talk to us a little bit about some of those lessons. I did absolutely well and and it probably started in Kentucky in Louisville because there was in in the city there were four kind of Anglo Church of God congregations and one African American uh church of God congregation down the west end of Louisville and some reason you know God moved me to go down there and be part of that ministry to think about them they started a tutoring program after school and really what I'm what I eventually wrote grants to do in my neighborhood organizing was based off of what that brother had done in the west side of town without getting grants he was just you know funding that from from local uh areas um and my so you know that was a that was a uh an another experience God didn't waste right so I I moved to Mississippi and um uh first thing we did was we uh we had a we had a lady in our congregation when I came to the to the church I asked because a neighborhood was probably 70% black 30% white it had it had been a transitional neighborhood had turned over since the church had been planted in 72 in that location and so I asked him I said I said you know before I come here I just want to know if if we do outreach in the neighborhood are the people from the neighborhood going to be welcome to worship here and they said oh we have a blended congregation and I said oh great we have a blended congregation well I got you know when I got here I found out it was one person uh of color in the congregation um but she was an integral part of that community of faith and she was accepted into that community of faith and she was uh welcomed and and you know um it was uh and actually her husband had been in ministry and had been the director of the farmhaven the the the black church of God for years but when he passed away she elected to come to this church in Laurel Mississippi instead of going to one of the other congregations she could have gone anywhere and been welcome but she chose to come here so she was really a a trailblazer in terms of reconciliation um I found out um I guess you know maybe a couple of years in that um as I was doing research on the local congregation that another mentor of mine had once been a pastor here in Law Mississippi and um and so I called him up and I said I said I said brother tell me about your experience here this is 19 he was 1976 77 right so it was it was just after all of the um the uh Brown v. education decisions and the integration of the schools in 72 and Mississippi and he said he said I knew brother and sister Crockett and I went to their house and and we dined together and we had great fellowship together as individuals and so I told brother Crockett um well I'm gonna have you over to the house uh and you and you know we'll reciprocate and we'll invite you over to the house and and brother Crockett said don't do it man don't do it he said so what do you mean he said well you live in the church parsonage and if you invite me over there you won't stay around very long wow that was in the 70s wow um so his experience you know that was that was that was a precursor as well for that um but by the time I get there in in 2005 um they're like yeah you know we want everybody to come but uh church was getting older um they were interested in that um and so you know I was I was I was all for that in fact um uh one of the first things that happened not long after I got here was there was a Promise Keepers event in Jackson Mississippi and I'd been to Promise Keepers events in Louisville Kentucky in uh Madison Wisconsin in um in Memphis Tennessee I've been to several of these things and so I got my my board chairman to agree to go with me he was the only one that would go with me to Promise Keepers and uh and we went to have the event and then I got a call from from this sister uh in the church and said that her nephew was in the hospital in Jackson and I said well I just happened to be in Jackson State we left the uh uh promise keepers event and we're going to Baptist hospital to see him and on the way we stopped at McDonald's and this guy walks in from uh obviously from the Promise Keepers events dressed up he's got four or five teenage kids with him uh young men and they all got on uh uh shirts and and ties and I said those guys those guys have been to been the promise keepers event and so we called over you know the guy in the in the lead and said what'd you guys think of the event and they said he said oh yeah it was great i said I said what do you do how do you get these young men to you know hang out with you and and uh all that stuff and and Nettie Winters said well my name's Nettie Winters and I work for Mission Mississippi and and uh uh he said I I I traveled I traveled a state talking about reconciliation and I want to know when can I come to your church and preach and my board chairman said what are you doing next week wow wow wow um yeah so um you know um now that that that sister her family was involved in the church of God in Jackson at Central Community Church um and at their home in Farmhaven at Crossroads uh church in farmhaven and so when I when I pulled up they were a little surprised to see me because I'm the the white pastor from Laurel but it's auntie's auntie's pastor and so I just you know I just introduced myself and and walked in the emergency room and prayed over uh the nephew and uh you know several times I was called to the hospital to minister with that family and uh and so you know it was just I I didn't think anything of it that was a person in need somebody needed prayer it was family and and I was welcomed as family uh there and and always was uh later on her her sister moved back from Ohio to the farmhaven community and uh she had been a pioneer in uh recon in in building the church in the South uh back in the 40s so she had been through the Klu Klux Klan and so I interviewed her and got her her uh you know cultural understanding and some of the things that she had done and and was just really interested in how God had moved uh in her life and she became uh a great friend to me as well until her her passing um such Ozzy Waddellton um so you know I'm I'm like those were just just the experiences God really brought them to me he put Nettie Winters in McDonald's at the same time I was there yeah yeah I I didn't I didn't go looking for him he didn't go looking for me God put us together yeah um and so you know we've been been building that and then in the Church of God in Mississippi we had a uh a movement of reconciliation that had started in the 90s and we had brought together our our a black church a white church uh our ministries our ministers uh assembly into one unit and they've been working together for 15 years give or take and so when I come in I'm hanging out at the ministers meetings I'm hanging out with all these you know brothers from all kinds of different places and I'm like why don't why do we have two campgrounds why do we have why do we have the segregated uh summer activities if we can come together in a minister's meetings why do we do it the other way and I found that it was it was largely based on tradition you know it was um it was the the that that segregation had happened and uh and now we were comfortable in that isolation right we had developed our own organizations and I said well why don't we we bring together one general assembly I was vice president of the of the the White Assembly um and so I got I got tagged to be the leader for a reconciliation committee that would build a structure that would hopefully bring us together and and we did a really good job with that for a while our state pastor was very integral in that was very motivated he set up cohorts around the state much like Mission Mississippi does uh they were they were there to build relationships uh regionally and so black and white pastors came together not just at our annual conventions and our ministers meetings but they came together on a monthly basis had coffee and donuts together talked with one another prayed for each other and their congregations and things happening uh studied you know leadership books together and uh and so so for a while we did really good and then we got some new leadership and the emphasis shifted uh from that and and that's it's cooled off a little bit yeah um in order to I don't know we we we got comfortable again in our isolation yeah um it's it doesn't it you know that one one of the one of the things um that we stress around around here Dwayne is that the work of reconciliation racial healing um you know a limit fighting against partiality that one of the things that has to that has to kind of one of the things we have to stop thinking is that it has a shelf life is that you know that you'll do it and then eventually the problem gets solved and then you can stop worrying about it.

SPEAKER_02 39:13

You know because everybody wants to put a shelf life on it. Everybody wants to say okay we're gonna embark on this mission and after you know 48 hours 48 days 48 months 48 years it'll be over and the reality is is that this is a work that if you if you stop putting intentionality behind it putting resource behind it putting effort education prayer behind it it is a work in which it will slowly but eventually slide back to where you were um you just you just can't uh the human condition will not allow us to stop doing this and then not have to worry about it again ever again that's just not how it operates.

SPEAKER_01 40:01

Yeah that's right well you know and and um and the the the difference and we came together and the differences culturally still existed right absolutely that that didn't go away absolutely so when we when we when we failed to put the emphasis on relationship then the relationship creep happened and we drifted back to our cultural pockets and pods and and uh you know and we're I think we're lesser for it because Of that.

unknown 40:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:42

And it and it's natural and instinctual for that to happen. You know, we we talk about the culture, the not the culture, but the current of relationships always flows to familiar. It's it you have to swim upstream if you're gonna cross, if you're gonna get into unfamiliar. If you're gonna, if you're gonna start moving across differences, that's an upstream swim. That's not a swim that happens naturally. So if we're not putting intentionality and effort in it, we're just gonna slide back into our familiar spaces. Those cultures that we know, those stories that we know, those people that we know, that's what we slide back into. It just happens naturally.

SPEAKER_01 41:17

Yeah. The flesh, the flesh wants us to to establish the boundaries of we and they. Yes. But spirit wants us to move to reconciliation. Yes. And and so if we don't put uh that spiritual emphasis on that, uh, we lose and and and the flesh takes over.

SPEAKER_02 41:43

Amen. Yes. Big T. Amen. Hey, hey, Dwayne, we got a couple of minutes, but we we would be remiss if we didn't allow a little bit of time to talk about marketplace chaplains. You're the executive director of operations with the marketplace chaplains. Tell us a little bit about what marketplace chaplains is about, and tell us a little bit about how you see the Lord using that ministry to bridge divides and to heal relationships across difference.

Confidentiality, Immigration, And Trust

SPEAKER_01 42:16

So I'll give you the mission statement, right? Marketplace Chaplains exist to share God's love in the workplace by providing an employee care service through chaplain teams. Um, so we are uh contracted by employers to provide a spiritual and emotional care for their employees across the state of Mississippi. Um now I'm just I'm just you know, in Mississippi, there are 53 other executive directors across the country and the U.S. and Canada who are doing the same thing. Our our work and our ministry is 42 years old, I think, now. Um and uh in Mississippi, I've got a team of 41 chaplains that minister in 55 locations to about 8,000 employees. And and my job is just keeping all that stuff running. Wow. Right? Wow. Um and and hiring and training and uh coordinating schedules and that kind of stuff. Now we we use chaplain teams, which means that um if I've got a location that needs more than one chaplain, I try and build a team that matches the uh demographics of the employer. So we've got male and female, right? Because they're women in the workplace. A lot, in fact, a lot of our workplaces is predominantly women, single moms, uh uh, you know, people working a second job, um, they're they're they're in those workplaces. Um, and then we we build a team, black, white, hispanic, depending on the the the work, again, the demographics in the in the workplace. So um, and we do that not because I have to remind chapters, you're not there only to minister to people who look like you or the same gender as you, but so that people who are the same ethnic background and the same gender as you can identify with you. And and maybe they will, maybe they won't. Now we live in the South, and the South, there's still a uh a predominance of uh idea that spiritual guides are men, right? That's still that still happens, but um women can often be more effective in those spaces, so we we do that. And uh and so then I bring those teams together and I say, hey, we're on the same team, right? We're passing the ball back and forth between each other. We're um we're we're doing our part on the day that we're there, but you know, if you need to refer to another chaplain because they're more skilled in that area, right? Not because of their ethnic heritage necessarily, but just because of their skills, because of their giftedness, their talents. Right. Um maybe because they're just closer uh to the individual's home or the hospital. And so we uh we deploy chaplains uh to take care of those issues uh as well. So uh that's reconciliation. When we get together for our for our trainings and our team meetings, our our work is blended because the um the workplace is blended. Um we don't we don't get the opportunity to discriminate against people in the workplace because the employer doesn't get the ability to discriminate against people in the workplace. Right? If if we go in and there are 500 people in this workplace, we're a chaplain to all 500 of them, even if they don't share our faith tradition or our faith at all. Right? If there's if there's a Muslim working in that in that building and he needs somebody to talk to, we're still the chaplain.

SPEAKER_02 46:48

Which is a which is an incredible opportunity, I imagine, for for a host for a host of reason, for a number of reasons.

SPEAKER_00 46:54

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 46:54

Absolutely. You know, and and when we interview, uh when we're doing background records, background checks and screenings for individuals, one of the questions we ask is how does this person handle the cultural diversity? Do they have experience in cultural diversity? Um, have they have they been able to navigate that space in reconciliation so that they're not going to discriminate once they get into that those spaces? And um, you know, and and and we have the freedom in there to share the love of God and to testify about salvation that's available when those employees ask us about the faith that was within us. We don't go in preaching, we go in caring. Caring, yeah. And then the care brings the question.

SPEAKER_02 47:51

Let your light shine so that men will see your good works and give glory to your father in heaven. And so the so the goodness opens doors and opportunities.

ROI Of Care And How To Engage

SPEAKER_01 48:00

Absolutely. You know, if somebody needs housing assistance, we we connect them to people that do housing. Yeah. If somebody needs food because they're just starting work or the rent assistance, we connect them to people. We don't have those resources necessarily available, but because we're in those communities, we know people who have those resources and we and we point them to it. And a lot of times, you know, those employees have to work because they're working hourly, and if they take off to go and find these resources, they don't get paid. So now they're even a bigger hole. So if we can do some of that legwork for them, with them, and and point them in those directions, we can uh we can help them uh navigate that without losing time from work. Um, but we also we also minister not only to the employee, but also to their families. So I had a chaplain uh yesterday who texted me and he said, he said, Oh, I forgot to tell you that one of the employees uh mom had just gone in hospice and they wanted me to make a home visit. And so he said, I I forgot to tell you, but I went and did that today. I'm like, yeah, brother, go go for it. Thank you for going above and beyond. And that's that's what we call excellent chaplaincy.

SPEAKER_05 49:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:17

Is when you when you see somebody in need and then you you go visit their family in the hospital.

SPEAKER_02 49:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:23

Or you go to a funeral. You know, I've got a chaplain I talked to uh this morning, and one of the managers at the location was let go, and he had been through two funerals. This is a white guy, a white chaplain and a and a black employee. They've been through two funerals with his family. And and now the now the guy's you know doesn't work for a company that we serve anymore, but he called him and said, he said, just to let you know, I still care about you. Uh they've developed a bond. And that's uh that that's that's a board member from Mission, Mississippi, by the way, who's done that, right?

SPEAKER_02 50:04

Yeah, yeah, that's that's good. That's that's that's good, man. I I tell you, I tell you, Nettie, Nettie worked really, really hard to train up and disciple all these board members from Mission, Mississippi. So we got some good ones.

SPEAKER_01 50:18

Um so you know, so we're we're uh we're reaching out, we're we're making a difference. Um I'm hoping that we're you know that the chaplains when they go into those workplaces, we've uh uh just had to had to hire a couple of new chaplains that spoke Spanish because we've got a lot of Hispanic workers in the in the workplace.

SPEAKER_03 50:40

I can imagine what I'm running. You have a lot of work there.

SPEAKER_01 50:44

Yeah, a lot of lot of a lot of care. Well, yeah, there's some workplaces that uh uh remarkably enough, our work has diminished because ICE is active and so they don't come to work anymore. Wow. Um, but you know, we tell the employers listen, uh, we're gonna talk to people about immigration status, but we're not gonna report immigration status. Because as a spiritual guide, as somebody who's helping them deal with stress or family issues, we want to be able to help them with that. But if that person can find, you know, it's a confidential discussion that we're having with them. Right. We're gonna tell you that we're talking about immigration. Yeah, we're gonna tell you that we talked about immigration, but we're not gonna tell you about the content of that conversation. Yeah. Um, and that's not that's not one of the, you know, uh our confidential discussions can be disclosed if they're gonna harm themselves or others. Sure. They're gonna harm the the goodwill of the company and do something, you know, to hurt the company. Sure. And the and a major law is being broken, but for some reason we don't define an immigration status as a major law being broken.

SPEAKER_02 51:57

So your your work you know, we've your work is in is really incredibly diverse. And it's and it's and it's incredibly diverse. You know, as you begin to unpack it more, it's incredibly diverse because the marketplace is incredibly diverse. And so and so since the marketplace is incredibly diverse, then of course the work of chaplaincy in the marketplace is going to be incredibly diverse, and it requires that that ability to navigate um in all these different spaces. And so you and so you guys are seeing reconciliation and and and healing work up close and personal.

Hiring Chaplains And Statewide Network

SPEAKER_01 52:40

Yes. So basically in a word, it's um you know, and and and again, it's but it's it's because um our chaplains deploy to the workplace. Right? We don't sit at the office waiting for somebody to call us. We are active and and provide a ministry of presence in the workplace. So we build relationships with those employees, we get to know about them, we hear about when their kids are having a great time on the football field, and we get to hear about when their kids are having a surgery and and when their mom and dad are having trouble when there's you know, had chaplain got invited to a 90th birthday party for grandma. He didn't know grandma, but he had such a good relationship with the employee, and then when he got there, they said, Hey, chaplain, would you mind doing a prayer and bringing a devotion for us? Wow. Wow. He's like, he's like, I don't know these people, but sure, you better, you better be ready with the word, you know, because you never know when it's gonna come. Um and and I've had I've had chaplains who, you know, I've got a chaplain down on the coast who was uh asked to perform a uh funeral service for uh company leader, went in for some minor surgery and wound up with a heart attack and died um unexpectedly. Wow. And um and he was moving toward faith and may have made a made a made a uh a decision of faith, but it never connected to a church, so he didn't have a pastor. Um, you know, one of the statistics that our that our marketing team likes to tell us is across the country, about 60% of employees we serve, and across the country we've got about half a million employees that we serve. Um 60% of those people don't have a pastor, priest, or rabbi in their phone contacts they can call in a time of crisis. So who are they gonna call? Right. They're gonna call the guy who walks down the hall once a week and talks to them nice and builds a relationship with them and says, Hey, can you help? Right. I know you, I trust you. You've you've listened to me before, you know, even if it was just talking about sports and and how the cowboys are doing this week, or uh, you know, uh how much we we both hate that other team. Um those relationships have been built, and so people, people are willing to trust their chaplain. Um, and remarkably enough, believers are more likely to share really hard things with the chaplain than they are with their pastor. Because on Sunday mornings, you know, we like to put on the mask. Hey, I'm fine, everything's great, God loves me, Jesus is good, but you know, we've just had that fight with our spouse and the kids on the way there, and uh, and we've got that dinner with our family members that don't agree with us politically and there's tension there. And so, you know, you don't want to share that with your with your faith community because they might look bad if you do that, but they'll share that with their chaplain because they're not connected to that community. They're and it's confidential.

SPEAKER_02 56:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 56:09

Yeah. Give gives you gives you some space for vulnerability.

SPEAKER_01 56:13

That that um that ministry is is is powerful. Um, it's wonderful, it's needed. Um, and and we're just glad that there are uh well one, that there are Christian business leaders who see the value in providing that for their employees. And two, that there are large corporations who see the value in uh having employees whose family lives are well adjusted, or at least there's some help for them, and maybe they won't leave and and turnover would be reduced, and there's some ROI from this service of having chaplains.

SPEAKER_02 56:57

If there was someone out there, Dwayne, who um may have a small business, large business that's interested in linking up with marketplace chaplains and and and getting uh that kind of support and service in their own workplace, uh, how would they how would they do that?

SPEAKER_01 57:18

Um probably the first step would be to call me um and and I just get some general information about them. We've got a team of of experts, you know, those are the guys that that are writing the contracts for service, and and they know how to how to how to answer a lot of the questions. I don't I'm operations guy, right? But if you're in Mississippi, I'm the guy you're gonna deal with from operations from an implementation perspective. And um, yeah, my phone number is 601-323-4988. And I answer my phone 24 hours a day.

SPEAKER_02 57:56

Got email address for folks to catch up with you as well.

SPEAKER_01 57:59

Yeah, uh it's Dwayne Parker. It's D-U-A-N-E, P-A-R-K-E-R, at MCAPUSA.com. Excellent. And and they can also go to that m-chapusa.com website and they can find out some more information, do some research, look at some of the companies that we serve. Um, and uh, you know, if they're interested, I can put them in touch with they want to reference. You know, before 15 years ago, 15 years ago, before I came on at Marketplace Chaplains and never heard of it, and I said, Hey, are there some other people doing this that I could call? Because I don't know you. And so I, you know, I I called a couple of people that have been serving as chaplains, and uh one one guy out of Vicksburg uh said to me, said, I'm getting ready to retire from my church, but I'm keeping my chaplain work because I think that's the most important thing I've done in a long time. Wow. Wow. And that made an impact on me. Wow. Um as a guy who who you know who who loves to work outside the four walls of the church. Yeah. And and I think have always been called to do that. Um, that the church was was the the vehicle through which God brought me to this ministry, but it was really him preparing me for this all along.

SPEAKER_03 59:26

You know, Dwayne, we got some more prepared Miss Mississippi folks out there that may want to do this kind of work and reuse the same contact information.

Theological Anchor: John 17 On Oneness

SPEAKER_01 59:36

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Um, you know, we're uh as as new companies come on board, we need to hire uh new chaplains. A lot of our chaplains are working um four hours a week. You know, so it's it's not something that that they're gonna get rich doing. Um, but it is a ministry outside the church. It is unique. Uh a lot of my my full-time pastor chaplains say, you know, this is the this is the one day a week that refreshes me. Again, because they don't have to deal with the church politics, they don't have to deal with the fakeness that often comes from church members, they don't have to deal with uh all those stuff. They just could go out and love on people. And they come away and they say, hey, this was this was a hard day. People shared so much, but I was blessed that they were willing to share that with me. Grassroots ground level ministry.

unknown 1:00:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:35

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and uh, you know, it just just amazing. Uh we've got we've got chaplains in Pascagoula and and Macomb, chaplains in Corinth and South Haven. So we cover across the state, but there are a lot of places we don't have chaplains. I've only got 40 chaplains.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:57

You got chaplains in Jackson, Blackfield?

SPEAKER_01 1:01:00

I do. I've got chaplains in in Jackson. I've got my biggest team is in Jackson, actually.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:08

Sounds like a conversation that you and Nettie are gonna have to have after our podcast.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:13

Well, hey, you know, and one of the things that I know, right, when I started in this, I didn't know I didn't know people outside of Jones County, outside of my church tradition. Uh, and so when I needed somebody in uh in Vicksburg or in Natchez or in Tupelo, you know who I called? I called the guy who travels the state and knows people from all over. I called Nettie Winters and said, Nettie, who can you recommend? Who's in the area? There you go. And uh I think what when we when we went into McCall, you know, I I called Nettie and and he gave me a name of somebody, and they gave me a name of somebody else, and they gave me a name of somebody else, and eventually I found somebody, but it was because Nettie Winters had a network of people that he was willing to share with me for ministry across the state.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:06

And um I'm still waiting on my stick for those people in carrent and and you know, and Doomsville and Tatorsville and you know other nice places.

unknown 1:02:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:22

Store up for yourselves treasury. There you go. There you go. Treasures of heaven.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:26

I know he's gonna have a good Christianity church answer, right? Well, I've been I've been well paid. I have sat down at the table with he and his family and enjoyed a meal together on many occasions. So I'm excited that my friend is out there doing what he's doing.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:44

Amen. Amen. And Dwayne, uh, we really, really appreciate not just the work that you do, but we appreciate you taking a little time today to tell us about that work and tell it, telling, uh, telling our listening audience how they can keep up with Dwayne Parker and the work of uh Marketplace Chaplain. So so thank you very much. And um, and God bless you, man, and God bless the work that He's entrusted to your care.

Closing Thanks & Ways To Support

SPEAKER_01 1:03:07

Um we don't for those that are you know, Brian, Brian, yeah you're doing you're doing the the number one thing that uh I think the scriptures called us to, right? Reconciliation is not the the the best thing we can do, it's really the only thing we do in the church. We're reconciling people to God and then people to one another. Amen. Um and that's that's probably from all those promise keepers events I went to, right? Amen, brother. But but that's that's really the work of the church is reconciliation. And if we can't get that right, it um um I point to uh I I think you guys do too. Nettie's preached this many times, I'm sure, but John 17 says says that they may be one, followers of Jesus may be one as he and the Father are one, so that the world will know. Well, if you and I can't get along in spite of our cultural differences, how are we gonna be attractive to the world who doesn't have any reason to worry about reconciliation?

SPEAKER_02 1:04:22

Amen. Amen and amen.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:27

We learned that missificate message well.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:29

We say it all the time, Dwayne, that that that reconciliation or oneness is a defense, an apologetic, one of the most powerful defenses of the gospel that we've been given. And on the flip side, division in the church is one of the biggest and greatest indictments against that gospel. And so um, so you're you're you're spot on. You're spot on. Uh for our listening audience, uh, thank you guys for tuning in. Please feel free at all times to uh go out to missimisissippi.org, learn a little bit about this work, or feel free to go to Living Reconciled or any podcast app. You can search Living Reconciled and you can find this podcast. Feel free to like, share, and subscribe. Um, spread the word about this work that we do, this work of reconciliation, and spread the word about these stories, uh these stories and reconciliation from people all over this state and beyond on this podcast called Living Reconciled. It's been great to have our friend Dwayne Parker with us today. And on behalf of my friend, Nettie Winners, this is Brian Crawford signing off saying, God bless. God bless. Thanks for joining Living Reconciled. If you would like more information on how you can be a part of the ongoing work of helping Christians learn how to live and the reconciliation that Jesus has already secured, please visit us online at mrmisissippi.org or call us at 601-353-6477. Thanks again for listening.