EP. 99: Unplanned Pregnancies and the Gift of the Gospel with Erin Kate Goode

How can the church respond to unplanned pregnancy with both truth and grace? In this episode, Erin Kate Goode, executive director of CPC Metro, shares how her team walks alongside women and families facing some of life’s most difficult decisions.

From pregnancy testing and ultrasounds to abortion recovery ministry, Erin Kate explains why compassion, dignity, and community are essential to helping people choose hope. This conversation challenges us to see abortion not just as a political issue, but as a gospel issue—one that calls the church to offer both conviction and care.

Special thanks to our sponsors: 

Nissan, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy, Regions Foundation, Mississippi College, Anderson United Methodist Church, Grace Temple Church, Mississippi State University, Real Christian Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptist Church, Christian Life Church, Ms. Doris Powell, Mr. Robert Ward, and Ms. Ann Winters.

Transcript

Welcome And Why We Gather

0:12

This is Living Reconciled, a podcast dedicated to giving our communities practical evidence of the gospel message by helping Christians learn how to live in the reconciliation that Jesus has already secured for us by living with grace across grace divides. Hey, thanks so much for joining us on episode 99 of Living Reconciled. I'm your host, Brian Crawford, and I'm hanging out with some very good friends, some very incredible friends, Eddie Winners, and also our special guests, which I will introduce in just a moment. But before we do that, let's give a special thanks to some of our good friends out there in the field, sponsors like Nissan, St. Dominic's Hospital, Atmos Energy Regents Foundation, Mississippi College, Mississippi State University, Bellhaven University, New Horizons, Crossgates, Pear Orchard, Anderson United, Grace Temple Church. So many good friends, Real Christian Foundation, Brown Missionary Baptists. Thank you for all that you do. And then we got even individuals, folks like Doris Powell, Robert Ward, and Winners. It's because of the things that you do, Barbara Beavers and Jerry Beavers, because of what you do, we're able to do what we do. And what we do is we have great conversations with great people around the themes of faith, vocation, and reconciliation.

Sponsors And How To Support

1:24

Here's how you can support that. Visit MitchellMisissippi.org, click on the donate or invest tab at the very top, the little button on the far right, and you can join us in supporting this work as it relates to this podcast, or support the greater work of reconciliation that's happening all across our state and beyond through Mitchell, Mississippi. It's a great organization doing great things, and I don't say that just because I'm the president. Nettie doesn't say that just because he was the former president. It's really, really good things happening at Mitchell, Mississippi, and we would love for you to join us in some of those good things. Nettie, how are you doing, my friend? I'm good. I'm good. I'm good. I'm trying to work my way up to being your incredible friend. But yeah, I'm good. Well, we, you know, maybe you'll earn that by the end of this conversation. I think if you ask enough good questions, then you'll be the incredible friend that everybody is anticipating and hoping that you will be. Everybody's waiting with bated breath to see if you'll become incredible by the end of this podcast.

Meet Erin Kate Good

2:23

Without further ado, we do want to turn our attention to our guest, Erin Kate Good. Erin Kate Good is the executive director of the CPC Center for Pregnancy Choices Metro. She started serving there in 2012, became the executive director in 2017. Erin is a native of Laurel, Mississippi. She also is a graduate of Mill Staffs College, where she earned her bachelor's and master's. Erin Kate is passionate about equipping the body of Christ to engage the abortion issue with the light of the gospel and the hope of Christ. She is a member of Morrison Heights Baptist Church and enjoys the outdoors, collecting plants, and spending time with her family. Erin Kate, how are you doing today, ma'am? I'm doing great this morning. Thank you for having me. Absolutely. Oh, we we are incredibly excited and incredibly grateful to uh to have you. Um you you have been you've taken a scenic route, it looks like. When I look over your bio and I look over your story, you've taken a scenic route to get to this position of uh executive director at the Center for Pregnancy Choices of Metro. If you don't mind, kind of give us a little bit of a of a short-form version of this path that led you, how God has led you to where you are right now. Sure. Aaron, before you before you do, I have

The Plant Collecting Icebreaker

3:34

a question. Uh introducing you said you are collector of plants. Now I've heard of people growing plants. What is this thing collecting plants? What do you what does that look like? Well, I thought about saying gardening, and you know, that implies that there's some order to what's going on, I think a lot of times. And my husband will tell you what I do is collect plants. I just I see something that I want that I haven't seen before. I've got to see if I can keep it alive. So I'm always coming home with something new and different, unusual, and like look at this, and moving it all around to see what light it needs. I kill a lot, to be honest. That's why I don't want to sound uppity. Like I don't want people to come expecting a garden at my house. Um I'd be expecting a museum of flowers to collect some. Yeah, yeah. Gardening assume assumes that there's a that there's a very uh deliberate strategy involved in the Aaron Kate style is like she's just kind of reaching and grabbing and putting it in the house to see if it's gonna work. That's right. I'm having fun with it. So there's a variety of things, some things that that work, and I get them, I buy them again. But um, my husband would say collecting, so I thought that was the appropriate word. I also have heard that we're collecting flowers before coins, cards, pictures, you know, antiques, etc. But collecting flowers. That's good. Thank you. Good stuff. Good. Tell us a little bit about you. That I blame on I was asking Brian, those kind of questions moved me towards being an incredible friend. Oh man, you're up, you're up. Yeah, that that I owe to both of my grandmothers. They were, I would say, collectors of plants as well. So I grew up with that with that passion early, early on.

A Scenic Career Path To CPC

5:10

So how I got to the CPC is kind of an interesting road. Like my bio says I went to Millsaps, I'll just kind of start there, majored in business because I didn't have to write as many papers. I mean, that was really what led me to the business degree. And I was like, I'm so tired of writing papers. How can I get out of here without having to write too much and read too many long books? And so that was at the time, that was that decision. It wasn't just super well thought out. But I really was interested in marketing and my undergrad, and then I did a little work. I actually went and sold cars. So that I was a car salesman with a with a college degree from Millsaps and sold cars because that my family had been in the car business and thought that would be fun. I liked cars. Then I kind of took a roundabout way, went into the chicken business because I'm from Laurel and there's you know big chicken in Laurel. So got into a management trainee program um in Laurel with the chicken company and did that for a while and actually learned a whole lot. You know, I worked all throughout, I mean all throughout the chicken business. I've been in chicken houses, I've been in the place where they fix the trucks and that. I worked in shipping, I worked in D Bone, I worked in Evis, I worked in every part of a chicken plant, but learned about different management styles, um, you know, how to treat your employees and um just just the like a lot of hands-on practical things about running a business. Um, and so, but I really wasn't passionate about chicken. Okay, so you asked how I got to the CPC, and it is it is an interesting path that I got there. As I said, I we all said I went to MILSAPs, uh, majored in business, and I'm really majored in that because I didn't have to write as many papers. Of all the majors, I was really getting tired of writing papers and research. So I said, I'll just I'll just do a business degree and we can just get this wrapped up. I was ready to get in the workforce, to be honest. I had You said let's get this wrapped up like a let's marry this alone. I had four jobs during college. I loved working, like being out and and making money, I guess. Yeah, but I I just like being out there, you know. So did that. I immediately went and sold cars because I thought that'd be fun. Family had a my grandfather had a car business, so I grew up around that. And um, so that was a it didn't last long because I'm not good at that. I ended up in the management trainee program at Sanderson Farms in Laurel, so in the chicken business, because if you're from Laurel, you pretty much everybody at some point in time can work in the chicken business. There's opportunities all across the board. So I was a part of their trainee program, which means I worked all over the chicken business. I worked in chicken houses, I worked in chicken plants, I worked in the shops where they fixed the trucks, I worked in sales, I was out traveling, visiting grocery stores. I mean, everything about chicken, I did it. But I started to feel called to mission work of some sort, and I just wasn't passionate about chicken anymore. Well, I I want to know two questions. Did you eat chicken before you started working for the chicken house? And did you eat chicken after you worked for the chicken house? You know, I I did. And actually, if people I didn't eat it while I was working there because I was just around it so much. I didn't want any to see any more chicken. I didn't want to handle any more chicken when I got home, but I still eat chicken because it really is clean and it really is. I mean, I believe they do it right. So as much as you may hear about chicken plants and all that, it was I I do eat it, you know, and they they do have a good product. So um, but I was I didn't want to touch chicken meat when I got home from work. So there were several years when I did not eat much chicken, but um, but I do, I do eat chicken. So um, but anyway, I started looking around for opportunities and on um, you know, kind of mission-focused work. And of course, the first thing I did was like, oh, well, we've got to go overseas, you know, like we've got to be missionaries, which my husband was not very excited about. So we interviewed actually with some different like mission to the world, um, a couple different missionaries in Europe, and then I had some friends relate that were involved with African Bible College, talked to them, and I never really got like formally in the process because we never felt right about it. My husband was like, just did not feel like this is out of left field, you know. And he's like, There's plenty of stuff to do here, yeah. Right, right. So I got started just looking for local, local opportunities, and I ran, I kept running across a name of a lady in town that was involved in several different nonprofits. So I just called her and I said, Your name keeps coming up. I knew her from church, just from church women's things, you know, that I've been to. So um she told me of two different organizations that she was involved with that she knew needed help, and one of them was the CPC. So I called Barbara Beavers, that y'all know at the time, and I said, Don't even know what I'm looking for. I'm just looking to serve, you know, get involved. And um, I told her I had a you know business degree and all that. So she said, Oh yeah, we could use some marketing help at the time. So I went in, filled out a volunteer application, and my first job at the CPC as a volunteer was to clean up after their fall banquet. Tote the garbage can around and put the trash in the trash can. And I really hadn't volunteered like that before. Um, you know, and honestly, I still laugh about it because I think I don't like asking people for their first job to be the cleanup crew, you know, but it was an important thing, and I got to sit through the banquet and hear about the abortion crisis that I really didn't know about. And so um, and it was really an important job because we can't leave the banquet till the till the facilities have been cleaned up. So um, but anyway, my next job after that was doing data entry. I would drive over from my chicken plant job, I would drive over to the Pearl CPC on my lunch breaks a couple times a week, and I would do data entry of just patient records. Wow. Just typing them in, and then I would pack that up and I go back to my job. And eventually a job came open at the CPC for Barbara's assistant. So um, and that was in 2013. So I became her assistant, and I was her assistant for four years before she retired in 2017. And wow, then I became the director. So that's the that's the short version, I guess, how I got there. That's that's really cool. That that that's really cool. If someone was to ask you, um Erin Kate, what does a Tuesday look like at the CPC Metro?

A Tuesday Inside CPC Metro

12:08

What what what what would you how would you how would you how would you um navigate it? It's really there's a lot going on at the CPC Metro. We're never bored. So we have, and I'll just kind of walk you through from start to finish, but we have a call center um where we're uh we advertise online for women who are considering abortion in our community. We specifically target women who are looking for abortions, and because they're a lot and they're not targeted by pro-life people, they're targeted by the abortion industry. But so we target, um, we put out advertising that's specifically for them. So we have a call center. So we have calls coming in um in our call center every day from women who are most of them just looking for abortions, and of course, we're gonna tell them we don't do that, but um that we have things that they need to know before they make that decision, and we encourage them to come in. We have a medical clinic, so we have we do pregnancy tests and sonogram. So in our clinic during the day, we'll have women coming in to to talk to us and to see their baby for the first time. And often it's the first time they're telling somebody that they're pregnant, and so that can be that's the heavy part, you know. Well, getting them in the door is the hard, the hard part, you know, they're looking for abortion, we're not selling that, we're not giving those. So we're having or convincing her that it's worth it her time to stop and come in and talk to us and to see and make sure that she's making an informed decision, you know, that she's got all the information she needs before she she jumps into this because most of the time they're making that decision out of fear. Um, but in our clinic, um it really is heavy. I would say, I mean, every day of the week is is a heavy day because of the it is a battle of life and death um in those doors. And so um our our staff, they're sometimes the only people who will ever see that baby with that mom. Um, and from one client to the next, one could be really excited or could, you know, be hopeful that they're gonna they're gonna carry the pregnancy, and the others can be determined when they walk out the door that they're still having an abortion. Um in our doors, there's just a lot, there's a lot of prayer we share um throughout the day. Client with a very heavy situation, can y'all stop and pray? Sometimes we do actually all gather to pray if it's you know a serious situation. But then also in our our doors, we're planning the futures with moms. They decide they want to carry it, we're saying, what can we do to equip you, to be a good parent, to have you know this look different for your kids than it did for you, maybe. You know, maybe you're scared to parent because the the parents for generations in your family that hasn't gone well, you know, you haven't had two parents there, or your your mom has been so stressed she hasn't been able to be the mom she wants to be. How can we make that different for you? So we get to really um lift women their vision for their lives. And um, we even have we have online Bible studies that are happening during the week or for moms who want to just get together for support. And then we have classes, and then also um we have an abortion recovery ministry. That's not every single day happening, but we're always talking to women in the church who've had abortions in their past who are looking for freedom and forgiveness and healing from that past abortion. So there's a lot going on. Um besides just then the other side is connecting to the community, going out and talking to churches and people who want to get involved and um talking to pastors about about the abortion crisis. So it's um it's a full full range of of ways to get involved in things that we're doing on a daily basis. Yeah, yeah. With so, I mean, first of all, it's a whole lot going on, a whole lot of really, really incredible work. And um, you know, I mean, living reconciliation for us, Mission Mississippi, we're we're across different lanes and people and party and politics and it's expressions of faith. And because of that, I'm really curious as to you engage that space in a in a very, you know, very ongoing, just regular basis. When you think about the fact that there are so many people with so many different opinions as it relates to, you know, abortion in general, are there some are there some opportunities or some wins that we're missing that, you know, because it's been so politicized, and so we say, hey, either you're for abortion or you're against abortion, right? And it feels like maybe that that that has in some ways kind of kept us from a vast amount of opportunities to minister to young mothers and young

Depoliticizing Abortion For Real Ministry

16:48

fathers and to and to, you know, whether that whether that's giving confidence that young mothers and young fathers can, you know, have children that that and thrive with those children or things of that nature. Are there some are there some wins that all of all of the politicalization of this is keeping us from? Absolutely. There's um a lot, you know, the thing that I think about the most is we have as Christians, we have one common enemy. One common enemy easier to steal, kill, and destroy. And when we take our focus off of that and start making each other the enemy, we're losing. We're losing so much. We're to me, I hate wasting time, we're wasting a lot of time in a in a battle that's really critical. I know that it's you know, the war's been won, but here on earth, we have an opportunity because of our unity, because of us um being unified in Christ, um, to make so much of our savior and to make a huge impact. But we gotta get on the same page about who we're at war with, you know, who the enemy is. Step one. Step one. Step one, right? The enemy is not, you know, our brother or our sister, and it's very hard. It is and you know, as I was preparing for this to talk to y'all, I you know, there's just so there is so much noise around race and abortion. I mean, I we could talk for four days. Yes, and I have example after example, good and bad, you know, from from conversations, you know, with with fellow believers. And so, yes, I think that if we are if we keep the main thing, the main thing, you know, and that that these are image bearers of God, you know, we are we are talking about the reflection of the creator. Um, that all the things that we may disagree about on the surface, if we agree on this one thing that children are created in the image of God and every life is precious and worth protecting, then all this other stuff, we can put that aside to protect the unborn. And but we do have wins, and I think the biggest win that we do have that I am seeing and that I'm very extremely encouraged about is in our abortion recovery space.

Abortion Recovery And Finding Your Voice

19:08

It is our, I would say our fastest growing arm of our ministry. We uh we've always had abortion recovery as part of the CPC minute, or as long, well, for years, maybe not from 1988, but somewhere along the way, Barbara Beavers started abortion recovery ministry, and she's always been very passionate about that. In the last couple years, we've added weekend retreats, we've added staffing, we were actually, you know, paying people to do this work, and so uh just put some more resources behind it. And the Lord has done amazing things in our church, and we are seeing men and women from all walks of life who have suffered from their past abortions, some of them 50 years, you know. I mean 10, 20, 30, 40, 50. These are most of them are I think our average age right now is 55, but it's it's your 50, 60, even 70-year-old women in the church, amen who had an abortion years ago and have been silenced, especially because of all this noise in the church around abortion. Right. Um, or or lack of noise in some ways, you know. We don't talk about it because we don't know, we don't want to offend somebody or we don't want to be political, so we just leave it completely alone, which plunges those people who have abortion and wounded hearts into greater darkness because they are not going to be the ones to speak up about it and single themselves out and draw attention to what they've done. And here's the reality that, you know, even again, going back to this idea of people that stand on different sides of this issue, right? Regardless of where you stand on this issue, um, a mother who has had a had an abortion has undergone a significant amount of physical and emotional trauma. It's uh it it's not really up for debate. And so, regardless of whether we where where we stand on the issue, the support to that mother is incredible, is not only incredible, but it's much needed. Wouldn't you say? Well, and the only healing for that is is Jesus' blood on the cross. The only healing for that is forgiveness from Jesus and grace. And and I'm not saying we're withholding that, but if we're not talking about that as relates to in the abortion issue, and even you know, the enemy is saying this is murder, you know, and I hate to say that we we don't even want to say that word around abortion, but that's what they know, that's what they're hearing. And if they don't believe that Jesus died for that, that he's big enough for that, then they're in a whole category all on their own. So they're silent. But we're seeing so many women um and men coming forward and being healed and is rippling throughout the community. So more women are hearing of it and stepping forward. And so that's a big encouragement. And that's across racial lines, denominations, all these things. And I believe that if we're going to see abortion become unthinkable here, it's going to be because of their voice. Those women getting their voices back in the church. And people say this abortion didn't just take this child's light. It affected that woman forever. And it kept her from receiving the grace that Jesus offered through the cross. Like there's a there's a wall for many of them, a wall in their relationship with Jesus because of that abortion. And so we can break down that wall and help them be fully known by Jesus and fully forgiven. Then it's a miracle to me. Like we get to see that miracle from some. So that's it, that's a good thing that's happening. Then he has his arms, has his hands folded, which means he has something very, very, very intellectual and sophisticated to ask. So I'm gonna let him ask that question, Aaron, Kate. You know, Aaron, I was thinking as you were talking, I was thinking about, you know, we're shooting each other. Well, let me use another word. We're we're arguing and fighting with each other about an issue rather than about a relationship. And for me, the the the reconciliation of a relationship or a building a relationship is more important than the issue, even though people will say differently. You know, Jesus says if you come to the altar and you find that someone has something against you, you remember that. Leave your gift and go be reconciled. So he don't even want you worshiping him without the relationship being intact, without the relationship. So I believe in in listening to what you say about the conversation so well. I believe in my mind, I was thinking that if we could just get the point over that this is about the relationship among ourselves as well with the Lord Jesus Christ, is that it may not be an issue if we go in it the right way. Rather than politicizing it and attacking one another and attacking the person and and and doing all these things, why don't we just learn to listen and learn from each other and love each other? And it may be that abortion would be eliminated as it relates to acceptance because we we gotta I I guess in my mind, I'm thinking, what do we need to find out about these people that's that's decided they want an abortion? What's behind that? What's going on with that? All of those things. I know I you eager to address that. Go right ahead. Well,

Addressing Demand With Relationships

24:32

one of our um, you know, we all at CDC, we say we are here to address the demand for abortion. There is a lot of talk about access to abortion, there is a lot of talk about the right to an abortion, all these things, but we're talking about why would a woman in our community in this day and age in Jackson, Mississippi, where there's a church on every corner and there, I mean, and there is support, there are a can a pro-life presence. Why would a woman consider abortion? Why would a woman in my neighborhood, your neighborhood, or right where your church is, why would she consider abortion? And especially why would she do that completely alone without any human interaction, which is where we are with the abortion crisis now? You don't have to talk to anybody to have an abortion in your bathroom. Fletch your baby in your toilet without anybody knowing whatsoever. That's where we are in our culture. So obviously, we have missed something in relationships with our fellow human beings to where they think that they are isolated, they are alone. And I believe it's fear. You know, it's for the most part, it's fear, which is one of the enemy's greatest tools and tactics. But you're right, we're missing those relationships and talking. And we do jump to judgment a lot of times on the kinds of people who are having abortions, what got them into that situation, which I mean, there are sometimes changes that need to be made in lifestyles. There are, but a lot of times it's been so it's been passed on and passed on and passed on, and then they look around and there's nobody to help them when there's a consequence of the of their behavior. Um, and the easy thing to say is just get rid of it. Go have, you know, we're so we're a relational, one of our main points of our organization are is that we are relational and not transactional. So we do everything the hard way at the CPC. I say, we are about building a relationship. We want to see that heart transformation in the end. We could just give out diapers and say, have a good day, and we're gonna pray for you and and be well. Or we can say, we want to see you come back in. We want to get you involved in a support group of other women who are like you, and we want you to be in a church community where you'll see godly relationships lived out in front of you. We want to sacrificially make a way for you and your child. So those that's one of the main things I tell my team all the time, we're gonna do this the hard way. So you're either in or you're not you're out, but we're not doing it the easy way because I I don't think that's what we're called to do here. So you you would think in a church environment as you just described, that we we we see it lived out or should be lived out or whatever. I find in my experience though, I think that the this is just my observation that the women or the family that decide to go in this direction have more fear of that audience than they do of the enemy's audience. And the church. You know, the the people that are supposed to receive you, love you, accept you, do all the you know, do all the right things. It's probably one of the the the greatest hindrances to stopping abortion because we're afraid to go to that. Uh well because what will they say? What will they say if they know? Yeah, I don't I didn't mean to put we in there, but you know, you know what I'm talking about is that you know as a past as a past, especially when I counsel folks in in that area, they're like, Well, I don't know what they're gonna say, I don't know what they're gonna do, and you know, I can't even go home because I ain't gonna tell them what mom and daddy are gonna do, and you know, these kind of things, what my husband or my boyfriend or whatever else, it's it's a it's a whole spectrum of a disconnect there. And wouldn't it be different? Wouldn't it be a testimony for the church if the moment a woman got pregnant, the woman the child was, the moment the one the child was conceived, if we started treating that life with value and dignity, instead of saying, How'd this baby get here? What'd you do? And shaming that woman. I mean, we could bless that child from the day that we find out that woman's carrying that child. Bless that child and bless that mom and give her a vision and a and a pathway to reconciliation with Jesus and in a home in that church. And I tell people all the time that, you know, we we do baby showers with our Embrace Grace program that is a partner ministry of ours. And some churches can't handle a baby shower for an unwed mom. You know, fortunately, there are a lot who can. And I'm very fortunate about that, but that's a conversation that a church has to have. Can you have a baby shower for an unwed mother? I guarantee in three years down the road, those kids are sent in the nursery. You don't know which one came from an unwed mother or didn't. That's an image bearer of God from day one. So I was gonna say from day one, you can't go to the nurse and decide which one is which. You can't, you can't. There's a lot you can't know by looking at somebody. Right, right. Right. You know, um, which is a whole other tangent, but um anyway, but yeah, we can see. I'm sorry, I'm sorry, Eric. Can continue. No, go ahead. I but I really we have churches like that, and we certainly see a lot of women who have they say they have been to church, but they aren't in church now because of that, because of the judgment. Um they have several kids already, they're single moms, and so they don't feel welcome in the church. But but at the CBC, we know churches that will accept. We know churches that will have that baby shower and walk alongside those moms, which is something I'm really I'm proud of, you know, that we've got that, and we've seen that grow. We there's so many churches in our area that are welcoming, that are moms. And we need more always, but we do see that, and that that is encouraging. Yeah, no, you get you guys are really, you know, you're you're thinking about this in a way that transcends uh a lot of the politics around it. The the ideal of demand, you know, you're thinking about what what what what's what's underneath the surface that's driving the demand. You I heard you say three words that really just resonated with me just then. Vision, hope, pathway. Can can we give parents, future parents, uh parents in crisis, or to use the words of many, can we give them a vision and a pathway and a hope rooted in Christ that says, wait a second, it's gonna be okay. And and if if you can do that and create, provide the the systems and the infrastructure around them to ensure that when they say it's gonna be okay, that that we yeah, yeah, because you have a community that that that's embracing you, now you're really getting at the very issue of demand that you're describing. And so that yeah, it's a it's incredible. It's incredible the work, the the the way the framing and the way that you guys are thinking about this is really, really neat. Aaron Kate, we're gonna turn the corner and try to wrap up here. We typically, we typically just ask, you know, ask folks, you know, about their

Dignity Across Differences And Reconciliation

31:31

moments and experiences with reconciliation. And so what would love to ask you, has there been a moment, a relationship, a conversation that changed how you see someone that's very different from yourself? Something that, you know, something that really, really just kind of opens your eyes, broadened your horizons, so to speak, as it relates to reconciliation. I I deal in a lot in in very hard conversations, especially in the church, you know, with people about this issue. And I've had people say, Well, why do you have a white kid on this brochure? Why do you have a black kid? You know, and I mean all the time, you know, and it's like we really don't, you really can't tell the experience of someone by the color of their skin, or the and it goes back to me saying, you know, there's a lot of there's a lot of suffering on this earth, there's a lot of different experience that people have. We have a common enemy who's here to steal, kill, and destroy, but we have a savior who's offering abundant life for all. And so when um, and I just I can't think of one conversation, but I can say over and over again, I've I've had to say, well, can we look at then this person as a human being who has right and dignity and worth? We can't judge what all this kid has had in their life, or this this woman has had happen to her, or this child, what their future is, even based on this circumstance of their parents, we don't know what's given, been given to them, what what their path is from the Lord, you know, what gifts and strengths and and all those things the Lord has given. But if we're looking at it in the framework of God has ordained the things on this earth and has a purpose for this child who's created in his image, and our purpose is not to know all the complexities of that, but to know that it's an image bearer and that life is worth protecting. And we're supposed to fight for the value and dignity of those lives. Like, I think more and more over the last few years, that has really been opened up to me. It's like quit trying to judge the book by its cover, quit trying to judge this mom, this baby's future by the choices of the mother or this woman in our pew that had an church pew that had an abortion 50 years ago. If if we had treated her with dignity and respect early on or let her know that the sin of abortion was covered by the blood of Jesus, if we had talked about it, her life could have been different. If we're speaking life, the value of life, then a lot of this other tension, I guess, would go away. Um, I don't know if that it was even clear what I said. No, no, I no, it was. It was. And uh it's really the you you don't know. Um we do know is that we're called to love and we're called to um honor every single life. Yeah, we're not to to put all we don't we may not have all the pieces in the amount of time that we um we encounter somebody. We not may not have all the pieces of the puzzle, and we don't have to analyze every piece of the puzzle. We just know we've got to love them and respect them and and show them uh a future that includes Jesus and that um show them a way and a hope. That's good, that's good. And Kate, man, we we are so appreciative of you taking some time to to navigate this very, very, very important and very challenging, uh, challenging issue. Um and of course, me and Nettie, like I mentioned to you, our work takes us across the lines and different places and spaces. And so we find ourselves being more referees in conversations like this than anything. But but I am encouraged. I am encouraged that what I am seeing, even with people that don't necessarily hold the same opinions around this issue, I'm starting to see more and more, as of late, people that are a lot more sensitive in how they have this conversation with one another, and they're thinking more methodically and more and more sensitively and more relationally about what can, you know, how do we navigate this? And so, and so even hearing your heart in terms of how you guys are are engaged in the in the in the struggle for life, and how you're thinking about it as as demand and and and vision and hope and future, I mean, all of that language just speaks to the fact that we are moving in the right direction as to how we engage in this conversation. So, so we're grateful. We're grateful. You make our refereeing a lot easier, is what I'll say. So, so we're grateful. Yeah, Nettie Man, any parting shots? My parting shots is that as Aaron is so eloquently described, is that our attitude toward the issue is one of complexity. But I was just thinking about when I read the 11th chapter, Hebrews, and all of the great heroes, all of them messed up, man. I'm trying, they you know, you know, yeah, come on. Look at Moses. I'm trying, man, look at David, you know. And so for us to do what we do the way we do it, it's like it's kind of uh productive as it relates to that relationship and that life that Aaron was speaking of. You know, I I just got one last statement toward you, Aaron. If you if you had one statement that you could say to the people out there to challenge them to help and change in the attitudes toward it, what would that be? I would encourage people to consider abortion as a gospel issue and to pray about what that means for them. Just talk to the Lord about what does this mean for this abortion issue to be a gospel opportunity for me, whether it's for the moms who are in planned pregnancies, whether it's children in the womb, whether it's women and men around us who've had abortions in their past, what is your calling from the Lord? How does the Lord want you to see this as a gospel issue? Aaron, that's an incredible, incredible statement and uh a really, really reflective

How To Connect With CPC Metro

37:22

one and um and a good way for us to wrap up this dialogue or this conversation with you. Um tell us a little bit about how people can keep up with Aaron, Kate, good, and how can people keep up with CPC? All right. Um we can you can follow us on Facebook. We're CPC Metro. We also have a podcast, CPC Metro Podcast. That is really to give our community a way to hear some different angles about the abortion issues. We want our community talking about abortion and especially the gospel aspect of um the gospel opportunity we have. So cpcmetro um.org and you can see our podcast, Facebook. We have monthly tours in our clinic where you can actually come walk through our doors and see every aspect of our ministry and see how you might come alongside us. Excellent. Great. Thank you so much for being with us. Thank you. Absolutely. Aaron Kate Good, Executive Director for CPC Metro. Thanks again, Aaron. We appreciate your time today. And for those of you all that are listening, you can always listen to more of this Living Reconciled podcast. If you enjoy me and Nettie's voice, you can do so by visiting MitchMisissippi.org, getting some information on us, or just type in Living Reconciled in any podcast app that you have and you should be able to find us. Again, Living Reconciled by Michigan, Mississippi. Like, share, and subscribe. We would love for you to do that. It helps us get the word out about the work that we do around reconciliation in this state and beyond. On behalf of my good friend Nettie Winners and our special guest, Eric A. Good, I am Brian Crawford signing off by saying God bless. God bless, I'm working to be an incredible friend. You made it. You made it. Thanks for joining Living Reconcile. If you would like more information on how you can be a part of the ongoing work of helping Christians learn how to live in the reconciliation that Jesus is already secured, please visit us online at missing.org or call us at 601-353-6477. Thanks again for listening.