AJ Crabill has strong opinions about early childhood education and he's quick to dispel any notion that it should start around preschool.
He is a champion of ECE, and his education experience includes chairing the Kansas City School Board and serving as the deputy commissioner of the Texas Education Agency where he helped spearhead statewide incentives for school districts to expand their pre-K offerings outcomes statewide. He's now a conservator with the DeSoto Independent School District and he coaches school systems nationwide to get clear about what they want for their students.
In this podcast, he talks about why ECE needs to begin WAY earlier than many believe and about the the importance of supporting families and students to help children accelerate when they start kindergarten.
To learn more about AJ and the work he's doing, or to contact him, visit www.ajc7.com.
AJ Crabill has strong opinions about early childhood education and he's quick to dispel any notion that it should start around preschool.
He is a champion of ECE, and his education experience includes chairing the Kansas City School Board and serving as the deputy commissioner of the Texas Education Agency where he helped spearhead statewide incentives for school districts to expand their pre-K offerings outcomes statewide. He's now a conservator with the DeSoto Independent School District and he coaches school systems nationwide to get clear about what they want for their students.
In this podcast, he talks about why ECE needs to begin WAY earlier than many believe and about the the importance of supporting families and students to help children accelerate when they start kindergarten.
To learn more about AJ and the work he's doing, or to contact him, visit www.ajc7.com.
Welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast, brought to you by ProCare Solutions. This podcast is all about giving childcare, preschool, daycare, after school, and other early education professionals. A fun and upbeat way to learn about strategies and inspiration you can use to thrive. You'll hear from a variety of childcare thought leaders, including educators, owners, and industry experts on ways to innovate, to meet the needs of the children you serve. From practical tips for managing operations to uplifting stories of transformation and triumph, this podcast will be chock full of insights you can use to fully realize the potential of your childcare business. Let's jump in.
Speaker 2:You know, like always wanna welcome everybody back to the Childcare Business podcast. Uh, it's good to have you with us again today. And look, I'm excited. I was just talking with our guest, AJ Kraybill, uh, before we started recording. And I, I was telling him, we have a little bit of a, a, a bio here to read to kind of tell a little bit of his story. But AJ maybe I'll, I'll flip the script a little bit, if it's okay. And give you a chance to introduce yourself to our audience. Can you just talk a little bit about who you are and what you do and, and, uh, and we'll go from there.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Thank you very much, uh, Ryan, for having me. And yeah, I'm deeply disinterested in going through my bio, but, um,<laugh>, um, essentially, um, uh, a public education advocate. I, I'm believing what's possible for children in our communities, and that that possibility is, uh, most realized through our, our nation's safety net for all children. Uh, just public education. And I have the privilege of working both with individual schools to help, uh, implement student-led restorative practices, really helping ensure that students have the skillset necessary to help take responsibility for the culture and climate of their schools, and to create a school climate that is conducive to high achievement. And, uh, also have the privilege of coaching school boards across the country as they are looking for ways to be more intensely focused on improving student outcomes.
Speaker 2:Excellent. And I know, I think we'll spend some time, you know, hopefully connecting dots from, you know, I know typically when we hear school boards and public school systems, we think of that K through 12 environment where, you know, ProCare and, and kind of a lot of our listeners will live as in that early education phase, maybe prior to, you know, students entering to kindergarten. But I know that's a part of what
Speaker 3:You're mention. No, that's, that's, that's a different, uh, uh, that's, that's a different world than what I'm experiencing. Most of the places where I'm at, um, school systems are no longer, you know, starting at kindergarten of first grade, uh, the most of the school systems I work with, uh, either have active partnerships with community providers of pre-k, um, active partnerships with community providers of zero to five programming, um, or are doing some amount of it internally themselves. And so, I, I think a lot of people who drug the Kool-Aid on this thing, that if we really want to position our students for greatness, uh, that coming in after the fact, uh, when there're already some, um, um, weaknesses in their readiness to excel, um, isn't, isn't probably the best investment that we'd be better off. How do we support families and how do we support students earlier in the process, uh, so that, uh, we can help them accelerate when they hit kindergarten and first grade, not remediate.
Speaker 2:I love that. And, and actually, you know, based on your experience, AJ and some of the work you're doing, like that model of, you know, reaching all the way back to, you know, you know, birth zero to five, and it's not, it doesn't start
Speaker 3:Concept
Speaker 2:Yeah. Conception. Can you speak a little bit about that and maybe do you have an any examples just for a little context with some of the districts you work with, where you've seen a model of how districts are partnering all the way back to that, you know, again, zero to five, where, you know, in terms of a best practice, like what's working and how districts are trying to embrace what you're describing, that methodology of like, look, we can't be reactive to these students' progress, and when we get them at kindergarten, if they're already, you know, behind, we're playing catch up for the rest of their education. Yeah. What, what do you see working?
Speaker 3:Well, one of the things that I noticed, and I'm certainly, you know, not at all the first to notice, uh, stand on the shoulders of others who noticed to perform me and just pointed it out. Um, but in my last district, um, about, we found out about 40% of our students were showing up in kindergarten as much as two grade levels behind where they needed to be in order to be successful in kindergarten. No, when I first heard that I, my immediate response was, that's not a thing. Like, it's, it is not possible for children to be developmentally two years behind in kindergarten. Um, but that is, that is absolutely what we were experiencing. And so our responses could either be how do we remediate for that? How do we build a kindergarten program and a first grade, second grade program that is strong enough to take 40% of children being developmentally behind one, two or more years? And how do we help catch them up over the course of their first 2, 3, 4 years in our elementary programs? That, that is one approach. Um, but the reality is remediation is incredibly inefficient. And so we began looking at are, are there other options? And there have been cities across the country who have leaned in to trying to find other ways, um, what some folks have done, which popularized in, uh, New York, but has picked up in other places. Um, certainly we tried to create partnerships like this in Kansas City, um, San San Diego, no, not San Diego. San Antonio as well known, uh, for their community partnerships that they did citywide in partnership with the city and the district, um, and others. It's actually spread into a number of places. I believe Seattle is doing some of this, is that there's real value in creating this interwoven net of supports so that the family has all the resources and connections that it needs in order to really set st it's their children up for success, um, in a way that is aligned and continual, so people are less likely to fall through the net. So by thinking on this, is that, that actually can start, um, um, I pre, before the child is born, and through nurse family partnerships where local safety net uh, hospitals are actively working, uh, with nurses to be engaging with families, uh, when the child is still in gestation, helping, um, parents understand what are the types of things that we could be doing at this point to best set children up for success. Obviously at that point in the game, it's a lot of around nutrition, but also we now have the research to know that, uh, the stress response that mom is experiencing has a powerful impact on children, uh, while they're still, um, in the womb. And so trying to figure out how do we really create a safe and protective environment, um, for parents, you know, caregivers, uh, while gestation is taking place. Um, and that nurse, uh, family partnership generally, you know, runs from, um, from conception through six months, you know, after birth. Um, after that, then, uh, you step into the gap next with parents as teachers. There's some type of program that's designed to really help parents have all the tools that they need to be effective at helping children develop the pre, uh, academic, um, skills that they need. Um, one area that's, uh, done some of this really well is Boston. They, they have, uh, this whole citywide initiative they do around what are the, the kind of the early skills that, uh, children need, and what are the things that the adults and caregiver givers in their life can be doing to help promote the development of those things. I think it's the, I think it's the basic five is what they call it, I think. Um, but what they're really looking at is really that kind of parents as teachers, uh, timeframe from six months to three years old, we're really investing a lot of energy and making sure that, uh, again, our parents have all the things that they need to do, what our parents won't do, which is to really set their children up for success in life. And then after that, then you move into pre-k whether you're three-year olds and your four-year olds, and really what are the special experiences that they need at that point, um, that are going to set them up. Again, a lot of this is still around executive functioning, around play, around socialization, as well as other pre-literacy numeracy skills that then ultimately set you up to be successful going into kindergarten, first grade, and beyond. And so I see this as a complete continuum. Some families will have access to all the resources they need to ensure that all of those things happen without any external, um, and some families will need a little bit of support here, but not there or there, but not here. My argument is that for any family that needs access to those type of supports, that there is a benefit to us at a societal level to help make sure that those type of supports are available. Because as my neighbors, children do great. My children do great.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I love that. And, and are you, are you finding across the country, I mean, I know that there's gonna be nuance and variations from community to community, but are you finding that there's a gap? You know, we see this a lot in headlines, a gap across like demographics and socioeconomic environments that, like the resources available to students and districts varies greatly, or is it, is it not a resource issue as much as it is like an education issue in some, you know, districts in terms of like just educating families of what resources are available to them?
Speaker 3:I'd, I'd have to spend some more time thinking about that. I'm not, I'm not clear, because I can think of kind of counter examples for each of those that it, I'm thinking one particular community, it's a much more rural community where all of the supports I just described are in place, but none of them are in place through formal structures, uh, with the school system or the city or anything like that. They're in place through the local church, um, and the local community centers and things of that nature where those systems are just as available, um, to the general public. So I, you know, imagine a group of congregations making these type of things available to anyone, not just their congregants. Um, and so that those networks of safety nets still exist, but just not necessarily through the auspices of the school system. So, you know, what I'm, what I'm arguing for is that the safety nets exist. Uh, I'm agnostic to who is providing them. Um, what I would say is it insists in areas where, for whatever reason, a lot of our community organizations, faith-based organizations, if they are not, uh, bridging that gap, then I absolutely am an advocate for, uh, formal governmental structures, whether it be cities, counties, or school systems, uh, looking at should they play a role in bridging that gap, or at minimum being a coordinator of services among private providers and practitioners such that there is some continuity of support for, uh, parents and families, and that there is some alignment of, uh, curricular alignment so that what children need to learn, need to know next year over in that institution, they are receiving the, uh, pre-information they need for that and the preparation they need for that over here in this organization, in this institution, that there's an alignment so that, you know, we're really maximizing the benefit that children and families are experiencing.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And you, uh, uh, you know, I saw something that you said on that topic, you know, just doing a little bit of research for this, for this podcast, I know one of the things that, you know, you talk about like the purpose of a school board in any community is, and I, I might get this quote, not a hundred percent right, so correct me, but it's essentially like of all the other things a school board does, the focus is to improve outcomes for your students, all the other,
Speaker 3:That's the only reason school systems exist is to improve student outcomes to cause improvements in what students don't are able to do. That's absolutely right.
Speaker 2:So do you find that, that, with that in mind, like the, the approach and and acceptance of school boards that you do consulting with and contracting with that you interact with, that this notion of embracing the zero to five year old, like, look, it really starts before students get into that kindergarten age group that that's generally accepted, or is that like something that you're finding you're having to educate districts on and continue to kind of like, bring that forward? Or is that generally accepted that, hey, this starts before they actually enter kindergarten?
Speaker 3:Yeah. 15 years ago having this conversation, I think people looked at me as scans and that, that maybe it sounded weird to folks today, I don't, I don't think that concept is, uh, to people. I think the only place where we're negotiating or navigating is who is going to be the provider. Um, but that children need the supports seems to be largely recognized. And where we have debates is who should pay for it, who should provide it, who should have what's say. Um, and in some communities, they don't want, uh, the public school system or the city, uh, or the government institutions playing a role in this. They, they would rather, um, community organizations, faith-based organizations be that safety net, but then that's on them to make sure that those organizations step up. And then there, there're parts of the country where that's certainly true. Um, I, I see that very frequently and a lot of our rural communities where we do see, uh, community organizations step up in a way that is significant to carry, uh, carry the gap that might exist in that community. Uh, but I generally don't see that level of, uh, coordination among community and faith-based organizations sufficient to address those gaps in more urban areas where there's just a much more higher density of population where just the sheer numbers that we're dealing with yeah. Are just overwhelming for any one organization that it frankly isn't a government organization. And so the, again, that's why I say who is providing what children need to me seems to be fairly consistent across geography, across ideology, across political spectrum, across the, what children need is constant, how we organize ourselves as adults to ensure that those needs are met seems to be the variable.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And that kind of lines up with, you know, one thing that I, I saw over and over again and, and kind of researching a little bit about the work that you're doing, AJ, is, you know, you talk about, um, I think this is the tagline on your website too, where it's the main page is like, student outcomes don't change until adult behaviors change. That's
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:Can you speak a little bit like what, how you formed or identify that? Because if I go back a little bit in your story, it looks like maybe your very first, at least public community service as it relates to school boards was in Kansas City. And I know you did a lot of work of aligning the school system with the e c E providers and, and kind of pushing, you know, this, this thought about how we can improve these outcomes for students by, you know, being a participant in their early stages of life. But through that you kind of identified, you know, it really boils down to adult behavior. Can you talk a little bit about what that means to you and, and, and how you use that to drive change?
Speaker 3:Yeah. What's critical here is that in making that statement, the student outcomes don't change until adult behaviors change, that I am actively removing from culpability, uh, anything about the child. And, and so one, one thing that just absolutely infuriates me is anytime as adults that, that we place on the child, well, the reason that they are not excelling is because there's something intrinsically wrong with the child. I'm not suggesting that there's not circumstances in which that might be the case. What I am suggesting is that where I see organizations stand that positions them to have the largest net benefit is that they stand in a place of, if there is anything that is going to be worthful for this particular child, it will emerge from my willingness to evaluate, to interrogate, and ultimately to change my adult behavior. That I'm not gonna wait till we get the right children to show up before I step into action. And we're not gonna wait till we get the right parents or the right system. But I'm gonna constantly looking at what is it in my behavior that could be a cause for this child not having what they deserve. And inside of that acknowledgement, what is the next step that I can be taking to be of service to this child? It is a willful disobedience to the idea of casting blame anywhere else. Uh, and, and instead saying that I'm going to be personally responsible for the welfare of the children in my community, um, so much so that I'm, that I'm not going to look to share that responsibility, you know, with anyone else. I'm not gonna be looking to blame the, um, the failure of our children having their needs met on anyone else. So that's, that's the concept. And, and what I found is that when a system, uh, when a team of adults choose to stand in this place, cause I'm not suggesting to you this is some truth or something, I'm, I'm saying this is a place to stand inside of which we're more empowered to get results for children. That if I'm, that, if I'm comfortable looking for excuses, if I'm comfortable looking for someone else to blame, there will always be the occasion to blame. There will always be some rational excuse for why children didn't do what they needed. And to the extent that I'm willing to accept that children will suffer. But, but if I am, if I am willfully disobedient to my ego need, and instead say, you know what? I am personally responsible for creating the context of greatness for the children of my community, and that if there's not greatness for them right now, that the lack thereof is a demonstration of my behavior, and, and that as I change my behavior, that I can actually have an impact on what's possible for those children. That when organizations choose to stand in that place and choose to operate from that place, the great things, uh, are more likely to happen for children.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I, I mean I, obviously it's, I think that's a, a mindset and a framework that probably applies to all different, you know, areas of life for individuals of like looking at like, look, what, what can I control? It's what I'm capable of controlling. It's what I can take responsibility of. It's what I can that's right. Be responsible for, and then go make an impact with what I can do. And if everybody kind of does that in whatever, you know, environment or arena we're in, I, I love that approach to, you know, engaging with life. Do you find when you're, you know, consulting with districts, and I say consulting cuz I, I believe that you interact a with a lot of different public school systems. I know that you do more, work more closely with some than others, but do you find that mindset is prevalent? Like that mindset of, you know, I, I see a lot of headlines around, you know, how difficult it is to be a teacher nowadays and the challenges of being in the classroom with the number of students and the different constraints. And so I, you know, to, to play the other side of that card, do you hear a lot of like, well that's, you know, that's great for you to say AJ about taking responsibility, but it's a lot easier said than done cuz the environment has changed it. Would you say that, is that a fair, accurate representation of how a lot of teachers feel? Or is, is that an unfair assessment that we see in the media and do you find a lot of public educators that embrace that kind of approach that you just described?
Speaker 3:Yeah, one of the things in my, in a previous job, I worked at the state education agency in Texas, and part of my role there was to support our school improvement team. And so the school improvement team at the state agency is really responsible for reaching out to and working with the lowest performing 5% of schools across the state. Um, in Texas it's like 400 schools. I mean, it's a big state. There's a lot of schools. And so the lowest performing 4% is still a huge number. And so in this role, I, uh, my team and I, we'd go out and we'd visit some of these schools, even visiting the lowest performing 5% of schools across the state. I can't recall a single time I ever walked into a school and saw a lazy teacher who just was kicked up their feet and wasn't trying, or, uh, I can't recall a single time or ever saw a teacher who, you know, they just didn't care if kids learned or not. Like, I'm just here for a paycheck. Like I, you would think if there's any place I'm gonna see it, I'd see it in the lowest performing 5% of schools across the country. Yeah, across the state. Never saw it. What I saw without exception was people working hard, people putting in the best effort that they knew how people putting it all on the field, doing everything that they could in the service of the children in their classroom. Uh, now that didn't change the fact that clearly something wasn't working, but what was at play wasn't that there weren't people who were already willing, uh, to be, uh, the genesis of transformation. The students, like really they were just supports that they didn't have that they, like, you could row as hard as you want, but if the person on the other side of the canoe is rowing in the exact opposite direction, uh, then you're probably not gonna go anywhere. And if the person in the front of the canoe is rowing off in a different direction, and so there are things like alignment that matter. And so, you know, the first grade teachers go in that direction, the second grade teachers go in that direction, third grade teachers, then all three of them can be working as hard as they possibly can, but it's still not amount to the impact that they intend. Those are the type of issues I'd run across is people engaged in mis unintentionally misaligned behavior. But no, this idea that there are these and teachers who are hostile to the possibility for children, I've, I've not met that teacher anywhere. And so this idea that people are willing to be personally accountable for what's working now, working with children, that seems to be fairly constant. It's inside of that. And really reflecting on that and living into that and trying to identify, okay, what is it that I specifically could be doing differently, uh, the the changing of which would really accrue to the benefit of children. And, and I find people constantly struggling with that. Like, I just don't know what is the change I need to make that would have the biggest difference. But that's where I see people living the most is what is the thing that is most needed and not knowing what that is and not knowing, does that sit over there with you? Does that sit over here with me? But my experience has very consistently been that inviting people into that conversation with teachers all over the state, all over the country, that folks are eager to be in that conversation. And then what they're hungry for is, okay, then what is the specific thing I need to do? What is the next step? And then the next is across the country.
Speaker 2:Yeah. That's an encouraging narrative and story and a perspective that I think is, is valuable that, you know, we've got really talented, passionate educators, you know, across the spectrum, you know, zero to, you know, they, when students graduate, they just need resources and education and support. And it's not a, an issue of are they passionate and wanting the best outcomes for students. So I personally, I love to hear that that's what individuals who have boots on the ground are seeing in our public schools specifically. Just maybe to, to talk back to E C E and what, when we talk about early, you know, childhood education prior to that kindergarten phase mm-hmm.<affirmative> and like curriculum and like what districts, when you're, when you're talking about, hey, when a student enrolls in kindergarten, the minimum benchmarks that we're looking for that student to be able to have. Like, is there, is there a role that curriculum plays both when parents are leading the education at home, but also, you know, in in early childhood programs and in preschool settings, is are there certain educational benchmarks that you're looking for at that kindergarten level?
Speaker 3:Yes. And this ver tends to vary by state. There are a lot of different states will have a kindergarten screener that is offered by the state agency or that is fairly commonly used across the state as a way of evaluating where children when they're coming into kindergarten and how do we need to adapt the kindergarten experience to match them. If, if I had to make a, a call to action for your listeners, it'd be what are ways that our early childhood providers are partnering with the school system to really study what is it that students need to come to kindergarten successful with, and how do we back map that into the pre-kindergarten experience such that children have the greatest chance of being successful. Often I find this is just an alignment issue that people just aren't talking to people like often. It is really that simple, what I would call on, uh, on your listeners to consider, talk with your local school district, figure out when is the professional development for kindergarten teachers and can our staff, you know, join for free? Like, uh, can we come in and participate with your kindergarten, first grade teachers and professional development so that we can understand what you all are doing and we can try to figure out what adjustments do we need to make as community providers to try to make sure that we're in sync in a way that's in the best interest of our students. Uh, it's a, it's an extra effort. I'll, I'll be the first to acknowledge it's an extra effort, but it's not an effort that's designed to benefit me. It's designed a bit for my children. And I think that's something that, you know, all of our community providers will get behind that I, that I'm willing to put in an extra effort, willing to take that extra step, uh, if the district is willing to be a partner with it, uh, in the benefit of our children. I'd also be looking at alignment of instructional materials and visiting with the curriculum instruction, uh, team at the school or at or at the, or at the school system to talk about what are the materials you all are using and is there any way that we could have access to those materials. A lot of school systems are already operating their own pre-K programs themselves, which means they have their own pre-k, um, um, instructional materials, their own pre-K assessment instruments and all these sort of things. Are there ways that they'd be willing to partner with community providers to get access to those so that the community provider in the school district can be working from the same, uh, playbook, singing from the same hymnal? Again, not because that's great for the provider or for the school system, but because that would be great for children.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Because then they're gonna have a natural progression from that, you know, preschool or that enrichment environment in the care and garden, which, you know, I would imagine maybe there's studies on this, but I would imagine if a student has a seamless, you know, transition from an education standpoint, it helps with all the other, you know, the social factors and their, you know, adoption of, um, you know, making friends and, and you know, emotional wellbeing and, and those types of things. I don't know if there's studies on that, but it seems like if there's public school systems partnering with their e c e providers, like you said, to truly focus on what's best for the students in our community, that that type of partnership would play a big role in that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, honestly, I can't think of studying specifically about the transition from pre-K to kindergarten though. I'd be surprised if one doesn't exist. I have read studies that talk about the transition from elementary to middle or from middle to high. And what sometimes comes out in those is this assertion that where you see children struggle, um, in those transition years is when there are significant shifts in expectations, uh, significant shifts in norms, uh, that the students, um, aren't prepared for the offered an appropriate amount of scaffolding for. And so they need to kind of throwing children into a new environment without adequate preparation and, and just not working out for them. And, and so if that's true in those transition grades, I don't see any reason why that wouldn't also likely be true, um, in the, uh, pre-k to kindergarten transition as well. Um, such that a strong collaboration between providers could actually make a real difference for children.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I would think so too. And I, you know, from your comment earlier and, and some of what you've seen, you know, across all the work that you're doing, you know, the idea of trying to have to play catch up, it seems like such a difficult challenge with students.
Speaker 3:It's not a good plan.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's not a good plan. So the earlier you can be in front of just getting that child in the right system with the right support, all the right resources to start from day one, like you said, even before that child's born, we're supporting that child's development and education that that environment fosters the greatest chance of success for the greatest number of students it sounds like, as opposed to playing catch up.
Speaker 3:So certainly. Well, and, and I'm gonna run the risk of insulting, I don't know if this will be insulting to you or any of your listeners, but, uh, I, I wanna draw a distinction, um, that the evidence I'm looking at does not suggest that the same benefits are conferred by daycare as they are by, uh, early childhood education. You know, um, I realize I'm being a little bit flippant here, but you know, five kids in a play pen at Grandma's house while she watches these days of our lives, is not the same thing as actually having a, uh, authentic early childhood education, uh, experience, uh, that, um, is benefited by and led by, uh, professionals who have training in early childhood education development. We, we have an understanding that the neurological development taking place and a zero to five space is very different. And what is developmentally appropriate for that grade age span is very different than what would be appropriate for kindergarten first. And I, I could point to plenty of school district who said, oh, well pre-K, that's just, uh, we'll just put some kindergarten teachers there and it's the same thing, right? It's in fact not the same thing. It's like saying kindergarten's the same thing, you know, is eighth grade. Like, it's just, it's fundamentally a different thing requires different skillset, different tool set, um, and different preparation. And so to have a truly effective early childhood education program, we need professionals who have actually been trained. Um, and what are the needs of children at those age groups and, and how are we making sure that those needs are being honored in the program design that they're receiving? Uh, daycare and early childhood education are not the same thing. And I realize that's gonna be insulting some, some folks, but the evidence on this seems to be pretty clear.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I'm glad you brought up that topic cuz I think, you know, I think in our industry, and when I, again, I, when I refer to our industry, you know, the e c e space, you know, we have seen a major shift over the past, you know, couple of decades from the idea of, look, it really doesn't matter, as long as the child is alive from zero to five, once they get to kindergarten, it'll all work out fine. But I think we've seen this shift that those early years are extremely,
Speaker 3:They matter,
Speaker 2:They matter, they matter. And maybe more so arguably than a lot of the other stages throughout a child's development in terms of how the brain develops during that, you know, zero to five. And so with that in mind, your point about, you know, offending some, I think your sentiment resonates with our audience that there is a responsibility and a desire from, you know, our community to be educators to partner and to get these students on the right track and ready for that, you know, that kindergarten experience for sure. I like that. What, how did you get, uh, I'm curious, I, you usually, I would ask this at the beginning, but you know, kind of rewinding your story a little bit and the work you're doing now, aj I, if I read correctly, the first time that I saw that you were in public service was in Kansas City as part of the school board. Was there something that, like what was the, the, the seed of that for you? Uh, uh, something you've always been passionate about in terms of education? Was it your own personal experience or something that led you to kind of like dedicate your energy into these causes?
Speaker 3:So certainly there's, uh, I think all of us are in some way inspired by our own personal narrative, own personal story. I certainly had tremendous blessings from some of my public school teachers who just stepped up for me in ways that I was not even cognizant of how hard they were going to bat for me at the time that I've only learned in recent years from reaching back out to them. Uh, in fact, um,<laugh> in my book, I, uh, in the introduction to the book, I tell a story about two of my teachers who, um, just really stood up for me and, and didn't take crap off of me<laugh> and really said, no, you're gonna be great and we're gonna make it happen. And this whole surly attitude you have, we're not accepting that, um, you're going to be, you are capable of more and you're gonna be more. And so these two teachers, they pushed for that even while other teachers were duped into, uh, believing me what I pretended that I was not capable and didn't want to engage and didn't wanna learn, uh, that I tell a story of two teachers who could not be fooled. Um, and one of my favorite, favorite moments as I was writing the book is I actually reached out to, reached out to them and one of them lives in Phoenix now, actually flew to Phoenix, um, to meet with her. Um, and it's like, Hey, I don't know if you remember who I am. She's like, oh, I remember exactly who you are and I've followed you, uh, ever since, you know, high school and you know, um, when you started businesses and when you got into education and you know, all the things you're doing. I've followed you when you went to Texas and you know, I'm just so proud of all you've accomplished. And I'm like, over here like, yeah, I'm all choke it up. It's like, it's, it's the pollens, the pollen. Um, you know, but like, she poured into me and, and she told me stories that day that I had no idea some of the, the links that her and some of the other teachers went to to try to make sure that I got, uh, the education that I needed in order to be able to have this conversation with you today. Um, and so certainly, you know, when it comes to, you know, why I do this work, uh, certainly a significant portion of that is caught up in, I've just been richly blessed, richly blessed beyond all belief, beyond all deserving. And the manifestation of that blessing, uh, very often was with the hands of teachers. Um, and so what, having this deep seated desire for other children to experience the same blessings that I experienced is, is certainly a significant part of it.
Speaker 2:Do you remember going back to those teachers that you just referenced for yourself personally, like at that time in your life where they were holding you accountable and calling you your attitude out, they saw potential and they saw what you were capable of. Do you remember actually recognizing that at the time? Like, oh, wow, like I'm attracted to that in these teachers that they're not taking my act? Or was it later in life as you reflected back that you, you saw that? I'm just curious, like if students generally recognize that.
Speaker 3:No, I, I think my story is very much caught up in, um, a common story that many people share and that there's that teacher who you don't care anything about their subject going into the class, but then after being around them, the kind of the enthusiasm they bring to it, the sense of connection and investment that they show in you, all of a sudden now you care about a topic that you never cared about before. Yeah. Um, you know, you know, Mr. Deth, my senior year, um, teaching history and anthropology and was the, um, facilitator for the chess club, three things that I prior to that was like, I don't care about history, anthropology, your chest wound up being on the chess team. Um, but that's because, you know, his investment in me, his caring, his expression of love for me and his expression of love for his content areas got me excited about it. Um, you know, you know, Mrs. Murray, the economics teacher, I had no interest in economics and it thought it would be an easy, you, uh, uh, easy elective. Um, but her passion for economics, her passion for business, you know, the micro mesa and macro economics, um, got me excited and her investment in me and her unwillingness to see anything other than greatness in me and got me to, you know, get involved with, um, the, uh, junior achievement, um, program and, uh, win the regional small business competition, you know, for high schoolers that year. Uh, but this is, this, this was not a whole lot about who I was, how I showed up, and what my interests were. This is about the love and dedication that they had both for their content area and for me as a kind of attitudinal, surly student in their class.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And I can see how some of that has shaped, you know, your p philosophy, guiding philosophies and what you do now or just around Yeah. You know, taking accountability, meaning you might see a student who's acting out or shows that they're disinterested or, but you don't know that child's story. You don't know what they're capable of, and you actually just own what you can control, which is love on that student, invest in them and trust that that's gonna produce the best outcomes. And so you see it happen. Were they, were those teachers surprised? Like that teacher in Phoenix, just last question on that topic, was she surprised to hear from you that the impact that it it had on you? Was she not surprised? Was that a common theme for her? Do you know?
Speaker 3:You know, I, you know, I don't know that I fully asked that. I do know that I'm gonna be in Phoenix soon and I plan to, uh, grab a bite to eat with her again, I'm gonna add that to my list of things, you know, to ask. Cause I didn't really, I think I was so caught up in the emotion of the moment learning about the way that she stood in the gap for me, that I didn't even get around to asking how commonplace was this in her experience? You know, how often was this the need that she was finding herself, having to step into that. Um, I, I'm certainly curious about that now. And so, you know, when I, when I reconnect with her again, when I'm back in town, um, uh, that's definitely gonna be on the conversation,
Speaker 2:Ask that question. And I think it's a good, you know, to have the perspective, you know, obviously on a show like this, to, to hear a story like that, you know, so much of our audience, aj, our teachers and educators and, and just, it's just a great reminder. Cause I think teachers and educators need that. Like, you are making a difference and they're students every day that you have the ability to impact and you just don't know what they're gonna go on
Speaker 3:To do out. They're planting seeds and they don't know what the or is gonna look like 10, 20, 30, 40 years from now, but they, but they, but they're expert, expert seed sowers.
Speaker 2:That's a great way to say it. And then you reference, I know we're, we're kind of running short on time here, but I wanna give you an opportunity. You referenced the, a book that you wrote recently, and I, and I always try to give our, you know, um, you know, our guests, the ability to share how, how can our audience find you, like for people in districts across the country who maybe are interested in the work you're doing and some of the thoughts you've shared, you reference to books, so maybe you could plug that, but also how can our audience find you if they're interested in learning more about what you're doing?
Speaker 3:Yeah. In addition to working with individual schools. Um, and then in addition to being an advocate for education policies that I believe can make a difference, like early childhood education policies, um, I also work with school boards and really challenging them as the local policymaker to lean into these type of strategies. And so I finally got around to, after doing a lot of coaching on it, finding a book on it. And the book is called Great on their Behalf, you know, why school boards fail and How Yours can become effective. And, and it really, um, is the book that I wish, um, that somebody had written that I had access to. Um, ideally I'd hope that your readers would, uh, that your listeners would consider that if they really have a heart, uh, for children and they really wanna see great things for the children in their community, consider running for your local school board. Um, and that the intention of this book is to help prepare you with the knowledge, skills, and mindset necessary, uh, to be effective on behalf of the students you serve.
Speaker 2:Excellent. And it's, if I'm not mistaken, your website too. I know there's some content on there, but, um, is it ajc seven.com? Is that right?
Speaker 3:Uh, yeah, people just go to aj cra.com. Um, it gets you there. If you wanna learn more about the book, go behalf com. Um, but to connect with me personally or to see some of the things that, uh, I'm doing in the space, yeah, just go to aj cra.com.
Speaker 2:Excellent. Aj, we, uh, we really appreciate you carving out an hour of your time to spend with us. I think it was, uh, an insightful conversation. Exciting to hear the work that's happening and we'll track along and we'll follow the work that you're doing, maybe vice versa, and maybe there'll be a part two at some point in the future.
Speaker 3:Well, I'm just grateful for you making time for me and just keep doing the great work you're doing.
Speaker 2:Thank you, aj. Have a great day.
Speaker 1:Thank you for listening to this episode of the Childcare Business Podcast. To get more insights on ways to succeed in your childcare business, make sure to hit subscribe in your podcast app so you never miss an episode. And if you want even more childcare, business tips, tricks, and strategies, head over to our resource center@procaresoftware.com. Until next time,