PREP Athletics Basketball Podcast
PREP Athletics Basketball Podcast
Dan McHale: D1 Coach Reveals Recruiting Realities
Dan McHale—former D1 head coach at Eastern Kentucky and long-time assistant under Rick Pitino, Tubby Smith, and Kevin Willard—joins Cory Heitz to pull back the curtain on what college coaches actually look for in recruits. From his start as a student manager at Kentucky during their 1998 national title run, to coaching in the Big East, Big Ten, and Mountain West, Dan’s career is packed with insider knowledge.
In this episode, Dan shares what really matters when trying to land a D1 scholarship, why relationships are everything, and how families should think about prep school, JUCO, and international players in today’s landscape. You’ll hear how recruiting boards work behind closed doors, what qualities walk-ons need to succeed, and why some D2 or D3 paths might be better in the long run.
For families navigating the college basketball journey, this episode delivers blunt, practical advice from someone who has lived it at every level.
💡 KEY TOPICS
📌 How college coaches evaluate recruits behind the scenes
📌 Building and leveraging relationships in basketball recruitment
📌 Truth about walk-ons, transfers, and D1 expectations
📌 Starting a placement company to help kids navigate recruiting
📌 Importance of prep school, JUCO, and academic fit
📌 The role of exposure events in 2025 and beyond
🏀 About Dan McHale:
Dan McHale is a former Division I head coach at Eastern Kentucky University and has served as an assistant at Kentucky, Louisville, Seton Hall, Minnesota, and New Mexico. With over two decades of experience at every level of college basketball, Dan now co-runs Collegiate Recruitment Consultants (CRC), helping student-athletes get placed at D1, D2, D3, and JUCO programs.
🔗 Connect with Dan McHale:
X | https://x.com/CoachMcHale
Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/dmchale01/
Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/mchale_basketball_academy
🔗 Connect with Cory:
Website | https://www.prepathletics.com
Twitter | https://twitter.com/PREP_Athletics
Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/prep.athletics/
Facebook | https://www.facebook.com/PrepAthletics
Email | coryheitz@gmail.com
Phone | 859-317-1166
🔖 Subscribe to the PREP Athletics Podcast:
iTunes | https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/prep-athletics-podcast/id1546265809?uo=4
Spotify | https://open.spotify.com/show/6CAKbXFiIOhoHinzsReYbJ
Amazon | https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/3c37179d-3371-47f9-9d97-fd569e8802a7/prep-athletics-basketball-podcast #AmazonMusic
Cory Heitz (00:00)
Welcome to this week's episode of the prep athletics podcast. I'm proud to have joining us, former D1 head coach, Dan McHale and Dan McHale grew up in New Jersey and then came to the university Kentucky and his first year, he was a manager there under Tubby Smith. And guess what? They won the 1998 national title. Um, he talks about all the pros he worked with, both in the co both in the coaching staff world. So just Frank Vogel who won a national title and the world championship with the Lakers as their head coach.
I worked with a bunch of pros there and then talks about senior year, getting a job to be a graduate assistant for Rick Pitino when he took over the Louisville job. He also had stints at Seton hall at Minnesota, New Mexico, and he was the head coach at Eastern Kentucky. So we talk all about kind of what goes on behind the scenes, how he would recruit in today's day and age, how he would hire assistance. ⁓ the best part of being a D one coach, the most challenging part players he missed on players. He, really, ⁓
You know, worked out great what walk-ons do and some of his best stories in that regard. And then we talk about recruiting and placement and Dan has a company now where he's no longer coaching, but he's helping place kids in college, both in the D1 level, D3 level, Juco level. And he reiterates what we say all the time. It's all about relationships, right or wrong. It's all about relationships and he's got a big black book. So if you liked this episode, be sure to subscribe on all the major podcasting platforms and YouTube.
And check the show notes below and see the information about Dan's company. It's very interesting if you want to look into potentially going straight to college. So stick around and enjoy this week's episode of the Prep Athletics Podcast with former coach Dan McHale.
Cory Heitz (02:01)
Dan, welcome to the podcast.
Dan McHale (02:02)
Cory thanks for having me, man. Great to see you.
Cory Heitz (02:05)
Yeah, good to see you again too and walk me back. Where did you grow up and what got you into basketball?
Dan McHale (02:10)
Well, I grew up in Chatham, New Jersey, about 45 minutes outside of New York City and ⁓ was a decent little high school player, ⁓ but knew at an early age I wanted to coach. My dad was a Division 1 player, a really good basketball player at the Naval Academy. So it was always ⁓ in my blood, but knowing at a young age I wanted to coach ⁓ was an awesome feeling for me.
Was fortunate to get accepted to the University of Kentucky and I go on my visit and I'm still figuring out, do I want to try to play small D three basketball? Do I want to coach? And young man by the name of Frank Vogel was a manager at Kentucky at the time. I remember sitting with him in the film room. He said, if you want to coach, this is where you got to go. And little did I know that he'd go on to be the coach of the Lakers and win an NBA championship. And my coaching journey would take me to stops along the way in the big East, the big 10 and become a division one head coach at Eastern Kentucky. Uh, was.
An awesome, awesome experience for me. And I owe a lot of it to my roots growing up in New Jersey, but then my next life in Kentucky.
Cory Heitz (03:11)
When you're in New Jersey, why was Kentucky on your radar? Was it because of the basketball and the opportunities you might have? Was it that specific?
Dan McHale (03:18)
Yeah,
I mean, I was growing up in the in the mid 90s, right? I Kentucky basketball, as you know, was rolling at that time. And Rick Pitino being an East Coast guy. And I used to watch him when he was coaching the Knicks when I was a younger age. So him being at Kentucky was definitely a lure. But every kid, every kid wants to go right and work at the University of Kentucky for Rick Pitino. And I remember talking to some of my dad's friends. My dad had a good buddy in Lexington at the time and said, look, everybody wants to be a manager in Kentucky. I'm just being honest with you. And I said, well, not everybody's me. And I was able to kind of kick the door down.
Bill Kitely, the great Mr. Wildcat, gave me a chance as a young 17 year old freshman. And even on my drive from New Jersey to Kentucky, my dad was driving me and he's like, are you sure you're gonna be working with the team? I'm like, dad, I promise you. They told me. And so sure enough, I saw my name on the door at Wildcat Lodge and kind of the rest was history. was fortunate enough to, Coach Pettino left to go to the Celtics and I was fortunate enough to work for Tubby Smith as a freshman.
And you remember that year in 98, we won the national championship and got to go to the White House and meet the president. And it was just a whirlwind. And I remember saying, this basketball, this is easy. This is awesome. This is what you always do, right? And everyone looked at me like, yeah, welcome. You had a great freshman year. And it was awesome. It was memorable.
Cory Heitz (04:30)
You
Yeah, what a freshman. mean, really it's, it's, it's hard to like get back to that level again, unless you win another national title in some programs. So you, don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing starting at the top, but.
Dan McHale (04:44)
Yeah, I remember
talking with Tubby a couple of years later because, they want to run me out of town. I think I won too early here. Sorry. That stuck with me as a young manager turned into coach. The type of business it is, the highs are high, the lows are low, but very thankful for all the stops along the way. And like I touched upon, I went from Kentucky, actually, Coach Pitino then left to Celtics and got the Louisville job. And that was kind of the same conversation. I was a senior.
Cory Heitz (04:53)
Yeah.
Dan McHale (05:13)
living in the Wildcat Lodge. And everyone said, everyone wants to go work for Rick. He's back in college basketball. I said, you know what? Not everyone's me. I told him my story about why I came to Kentucky and had a couple of connections to him and his staff. And was fortunate to get hired at Louisville, ⁓ April of my senior year living in the Wildcat Lodge, which was a very memorable month because I remember he got the job. I showed up on campus. He said, you start tomorrow. And I said, coach, I haven't graduated yet. He said,
You start tomorrow. So it was one of those deals where I was ⁓ leaving the Wildcat Lodge, kind of covered up Louisville gear, making the hour drive to Louisville, doing the workouts with the players, trying to figure out my class schedule, coming back at night. Having the Kentucky players give me a hard time for walking back into the lodge where Louisville gear. So it was a fun month. And then obviously I graduated in May and it took off from there.
Cory Heitz (06:09)
So let's back up at Kentucky, you're working for Tubby in that program with Sean Brown, all the NBA players that came through. Like what are some big takeaways from that time with Tubby and that national powerhouse program that you still use or you incorporated when you, you know, throughout your coaching career?
Dan McHale (06:25)
Yeah, Tubby taught me lot. mean, every coach I've worked for, you you try to take something from it. I just remembered Coach Smith was, ⁓ you know, thrown into the pressure cooker and won the national championship and was able to really keep Kentucky basketball to where Coach Pitino went left it. ⁓ It was just an amazing experience to learn from him and his staff about, you know, everybody coaches differently. He found his own voice, right? was in, God, I was replacing Rick Pitino. It was a big deal.
at that time and he knew who he was. Obviously he was one of coached teams assistants, but he became his own man. And that's one thing that always stuck with me. Wherever you're going to go, obviously take bits and pieces, but be who you are. Be comfortable in your own skin. And obviously a great recruiter, a great program developer, ⁓ a great mentor to a lot of the kids in the program. So a lot of fun watching those guys and lifelong friendships with NBA players like Naze Mohammed and Teishan Prince and Jamal McGlore, Keith Bogans.
⁓ Guys, I still keep in touch with today
Cory Heitz (07:26)
Yeah. And then Patino, right? You start working with him at Louisville. What's a big takeaway you got from being in his family tree?
Dan McHale (07:32)
Wow.
I mean, he had just come off probably the worst experience of his life professionally with the Celtics and he was ready to go. It was awesome. It was literally I was 21 years old, 22 years old, eat, sleep, breathe basketball. The staff was incredible. was, Mick Cronin was on my left at the staff meetings. Kevin Wheeler was on my right. Pitino was right in front of me. mean, the guys you learn from right there, it's like getting a job as an intern, you know, at Goldman Sachs.
Cory Heitz (07:52)
you
Dan McHale (07:58)
graduating college, right? That's the way I looked at it. I look back now, I I was with basketball royalty. I just remember Kevin telling me, Kevin, I'm still coaching Maryland now, goes, Danny boy, listen about 10 more times than you speak. And even when you want to speak, listen 10 more times. So it was great advice to learn and learning from those guys. And coach Patino was obviously destined to flip that little program and recharge his career. And to say that I was part of that first staff where he kind of got his career back on track was, it was awesome.
Cory Heitz (08:00)
Yeah.
Dan McHale (08:27)
And I'm very thankful for him, his guidance, and for the coaches that I've developed lifelong friendships with.
Cory Heitz (08:35)
Yeah, now you coach with Kevin at Seton Hall, you went to Minnesota with Richard Pitino, Rick's son, and New Mexico with Richard. And Richard, you when I grew up, played, I was teammates with Michael Pitino in high school, the oldest one. So I never really hung out with Richard much, but like, tell me the similarities that Richard and Rick had as far as coaching styles and personalities go.
Dan McHale (08:45)
Right, right.
Yeah,
he knows just to say to me all the time, especially when we got to Minnesota, right? He was a 29 year old head coach in the Big 10 and I was a 32 year old, you know, associate head coach with him in the Big 10. And we're looking around every night. We're playing Tom Crane. We're playing John Beeline. We're playing, you know, Tom Izzo. And it was just like the who's who. I remember standing next to him during national anthems. Sometimes he goes, are we ready tonight? I said, we got it coach. We're ready. And we had a very good, lost success. You know, we won 50 something games in two years.
He'd always say, well, I'm nothing like my dad. And I was like, you're crazy. He goes, I'm more like Billy Donovan. I was like, you're not, you're just like your father. You're driven, you're hungry. ⁓ But with Richard, I will give him this. He was his own person as well. He knew who he was, he knew who he wasn't. He didn't want to be Rick Pitino's son. He wanted to be Richard Pitino. I think that's why he's been so successful at multiple stops. I think he's in his 13th or 14th year as a head coach, which is hard to believe. ⁓ But Richard was awesome to work with. We were obviously very close in age.
I had known Richard since I was working his dad's camps, right? I knew him a long time and to be his right-hand man for a couple different years, a couple different stops was an awesome experience.
Cory Heitz (10:03)
Yeah, now here's something I want you to do. Since you've been at Kentucky, Louisville, Seton Hall, Minnesota, New Mexico, we'll get into your head coaching job in a second. I want you to take players and parents that are listening and watching this right now behind the scenes, right? And specifically to the recruiting board. All right? You guys, most schools have it on a computer, on a whiteboard, depth charts, who you guys are recruiting. Now it's even crazier with the transfer portal.
Walk me through those conversations and what families need to know, what power five coaches and low major, mid major, all that, what they're talking about and what they need to know and how they can get on those boards themselves.
Dan McHale (10:40)
The first
piece of advice is touching upon that. You have to get on the board. That's step one. And that's what recruits seem to know. When you become a prospective student athlete in the seventh grade, now are you walking into most conference rooms and they have a depth chart that has rising seniors through seventh grade? Not so much. It's really seniors through freshmen. And you have to be able to get on their boards. ⁓ That goes for a lot of things, right? mean, what type of kid are you? Obviously the education you're getting. ⁓ Can you fit in this system?
Are you a guy that's bounced around from multiple high schools? mean, that's a red flag these days. ⁓
Cory Heitz (11:16)
Is it a
red flag though with all the transfers going on? Like does that really? Okay.
Dan McHale (11:19)
Yes, look, look at you look
at a kid, you know, I think he just left Wisconsin AJ store. I just read on social media. It's his fifth college in five years, but it's also his fourth. He went to four different high schools, so he's been to nine different places. So look, will somebody take a chance on you? Yes, but the grass isn't always greener and kids learn that. So ⁓ obviously being upstanding, you know, individual in the community, obviously being a great player on the court and getting good education is one.
And then you got to have relationships with coaches, know, coaches come and go, and especially at the power five level, you might have a relationship with an assistant coach as a freshman. Well, that assistant coach more than likely won't be there by the time it's decision making time as a senior. And so it's building relationships with the whole staff. And then it's ⁓ seeing where you really fit in and asking those type of questions. OK, it's it is evolving. It is one year contracts for kids these days. And that's a tough that's a tough pill to swallow. But that that's the nature of the business these days.
Cory Heitz (12:19)
All right, let's talk about New Mexico only because you were there most recently. All right. And they've got so many, so many experiences from these different rooms, but New Mexico being the most recent with assistant coaches, right? You had, say three to four on that staff and they're each recruiting players. Like did Rick as a head coach need to make sure he bounced out how many players he offered from each assistant or would he just look at the best players and maybe one assistant got all the best players he was bringing to the table? Like walk me through the politics of like that.
Dan McHale (12:46)
Yeah, every coaching
staff is different. We took pride in this kind of goes back to to Big Rick's philosophy is it's not my recruit. It's not my kid. And that that that causes divisiveness among staffs. I've seen it. So we always try to team recruit. Now I might be spearheading a kid, but I would want the other two assistants to go take a look at him. Or hey, I talk to this kid every night. ⁓ Isaac Chu, who's still with Richard now at Xavier. Isaac, him a call to see if I'm missing anything. What's your vibe? So.
Cory Heitz (12:57)
Mm-hmm.
Dan McHale (13:13)
We compare notes a lot and I think that's what's made the Patino Family Tree so successful is there's no eye in recruiting. You don't get credit for a kid if you bring him in and he becomes a pro. all do. We all share in each other's credit because we all want to have success. So every staff is different, but that's, in my opinion, the best way to do it is kind of the team recruiting approach.
Cory Heitz (13:34)
All right. And so when does Richard actually reach out to the family? Is that when like multiple assistants have signed off on it and said, he's watched the film and he checked, what walk me through that. Cause he got that giant board with all his players and Rick's time is limited. Like when does he make the call?
Dan McHale (13:44)
Oh yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. He's a coach. We're down the line with him right now. He never wants to be first couple calls, right? He wants us to do the homework first. The biggest thing is you don't want to waste time. don't want waste time. A, the kid might not love you back or B, he might not be our type of kid. So once we know as an assistant coach, okay, he's our type of kid. He's definitely interested in us. Now it's time to bring the head coach in. And a lot of times, we used to say kids hide behind text. You make mistakes in a career.
Cory Heitz (13:56)
Yeah.
Dan McHale (14:14)
I would think coach for right there with this kid. Trust me. You know, I have a good relationship with him. And the next day he comes out this top five list and you're not on it and you have to learn those lessons and, you got to learn who loves your back or look, we're in New Mexico. I'm recruiting a kid from New Jersey. Is he really a good fit here? Is he really going to move his, you know, come across the country? So you got to find out who loves your back, who who you can get, ⁓ who's the best fit. And then you bring the head coach in. and a lot of times with the transfers that moves quickly. now.
Head coaches are spending a lot of time focusing on the transfers and they have the assistant coaches worrying about the high school kids knowing that, we have five scholarships open. We're going to take three to four transfers. We're only going to take one to two high school kids. You guys have them ready when that time happens. And so that's kind of your job as the assistant to develop the relationship with the kids and to realize, you know, what we're looking for as a staff.
Cory Heitz (15:07)
All right. So you guys get the job in New Mexico, you move down there, bam, you're an Albuquerque, you're a New Jersey guy, Minnesota, New Jersey, Kentucky. You don't have New Mexico connections. So, and you've got limited bandwidth. So walk me through like how much time are you going to spend or what are you going to do first? You're going to reach out to local AAU programs. Are you going to find out the best players in the state? Are you going to reach out to ⁓ Jukos regionally? Like how do you like, where do you start?
Dan McHale (15:29)
Right? Yeah, combination everything right?
I've been fortunate to coach and all I was in the Big East. was in the Big 10 now the Mountain West, so this adds a little bit different dynamic. And it helped me spread my wings a little bit. I'd always recruited the Texas area and some West Coast, but until you're really there, you gotta learn the dynamics. So yes, most important thing is to get to know the local high school coaches, whether or not they can help you or not. Still the right thing to do, because you never know when they can. You never know when you can help them. You're a big deal. I New Mexico.
probably the best assistant coaching job I had to be honest with you. You are a big deal there to be a Lobo assistant. So it's reaching out to the local guys, then the AAU guys, and then obviously the Juco's as well. So you want to cast a big net. You your first 90 days on the job are the most important. You know, you have to come in and make great relationships like anything else. You know, you want to make people feel important. You want to make them feel wanted. And you want to come in and say, look, I'm coming in here to be a fabric of the community, to be part of this area. ⁓
really want to genuinely get to know you. Because that's what relationships are. Whether you're recruiting a kid, a parent, a coach, you have to be genuine. And the people that are genuine are the ones that are going to be successful ones.
Cory Heitz (16:30)
Yeah.
And how much of this business is based on relationships? Yeah, 100%. That's what I just...
Dan McHale (16:39)
It's 100 % relationships. Well, that's not as many else is
selling the ability goods. that's what it's it. Look, it's a relationship business where if I can help you not to still want to help you. You know, I want to help kids. There might be a kid that I'm recruiting that, listen, we just recruited. You want to come here, but unfortunately, we have a scholarship right now. Let me still help you. You know, let me call a friend of mine who's coaching, who has a need for a player like you. And that's what it's about.
Cory Heitz (17:04)
All right. Let's see you get a job in the OVC right now today. You got to hire four assistant coaches. How do you do that? Like, especially with like, let's, let's back up first. Like, okay, you got it. Everyone leaves your team. They're going fresh and that's not even worried about collective money right now, but you once again have local high school. You've got prep school kids. got Juco kids, you got internationals, you got transfer portal. How are you Dan McHale going to divvy up your bandwidth as far as recruiting right now in 2025?
Dan McHale (17:30)
Yeah, I want to
find guys that fit me best, right? I have a vision. I know the way I want to play. I know the way I want to coach. I know the types of kids I want in the program, and that's what I'm going to focus on. Do I want to get some high school kids and develop them? Sure. You know, is the game change where that really doesn't happen as much? Maybe, but I'm still going to recruit some high school kids because I want to be able to mentor 17, 18 year olds. Am I going have to get old and stay old? Yes. I like to get some transfers that I've played before, whether they've played in the OVC level.
Maybe they're a really good Division II player who wants to get a shot playing Division I. Maybe it's a kid from the Power Five that thought he was going to be an NBA player in two years and went to Kentucky or Ohio State and hasn't worked out. Well, now I got a place for you here at Eastern Kentucky or in the OVC. So I want to kind of spread my wings across all of them. I don't want to just pigeonhole and say, I'm only going to recruit this one way. You can't do that. International, same way. Look, that's success recruiting a lot of international kids. Sometimes...
international kids, they don't have it as well as some of the American kids. So they come over here and they're really appreciative because they can't believe how great this is. So it's all walks of life. ⁓ That's probably what I would, the advice I'd give, that's probably way I would do it if I got the job today.
Cory Heitz (18:41)
Alright, and then when you're hiring assistants, are you focused more on this guy can teach defense, this guy can teach offense, this guy's a heck of a recruiter, this guy's got prep school connections, this guy's a Juco guy. How do you coach or how do you, let's just keep it to you, how would you build your assistant? Like what, I don't care where they're from, but like what kind of characteristics would they have?
Dan McHale (18:59)
Yeah,
I think all the above who complements me best, right? Who's going to make Dan McHale the best version of myself as a head coach? I don't need a guy that are yes guys. I want guys that can be able to challenge me. I want guys that are going to have my back and then well rounded guys. Am I a defensive guy? Am I an offensive guy as a head coach? You gotta be responsible for everything. So yes, well, I like the higher guy to run the defense. I gotta run the offense. I gotta be the head of recruiting. I kind of like to build my staff that way, but I want everybody involved as don't want to hire guys. OK, you just coach the defense. I want you.
I want you to specialize in that, but I want you to have input on everything across the program. Because if all my assistants have input in all walks of the program, then that's only going to make the program better. And that's the most important thing.
Cory Heitz (19:43)
Alright, what's, you're a former D1 head coach, what's the biggest misconception families and players have about the D1 level?
Dan McHale (19:52)
That's it's probably the end all be all right. It's not, ⁓ you know, being a division one player is awesome. It is a great experience. And if it can open doors for you after graduation, then that's the game plan. You know, how many of these guys are playing in the NBA fraction? How many are going to be able to play overseas? You would hope, but how long is overseas? That's probably three to four years is your shelf life. You know, are you going to get a great degree? Are you going to have connections in the community? Are you going to be able to go back one day?
and say, I'm done playing. I have a degree. I was a great representative of the university. People are going to want to hire you. And whether that's at a Division 1 school or whether that's at Division 2 or Division 3 school, the way you represent on that campus is going to help you when you're looking for that next part of your life. It could be coaching. It could be in the business world. It could be working at the university as a fundraiser. You never know. So make the most of whatever education you get.
Make the most of whatever relationships you can make at these institutions because more than likely they're going to give back to you when the time is right.
Cory Heitz (20:59)
Yeah. Love it. ⁓ in your entire coaching career as a head coach and assistant, who's a player that no one else believed in that you did. And then when you got them on campus, they, they outperformed and did exactly what you thought they would. Like, do you have an example of that? An overachiever.
Dan McHale (21:14)
Yeah, I mean,
I've been fortunate to coach a lot of great kids. I had one story, you you might know the family, ⁓ kid by the name of Dylan Avar that played at Lexington Catholic ⁓ went to Louisville to play for Coach Pitino. ⁓ I was fortunate to be ⁓ very close with him as a kid. I coached him as a young kid.
Cory Heitz (21:26)
alma mater
Dan McHale (21:39)
So to get the opportunity to give him a Division I scholarship at Eastern Kentucky and for him to come back and he made 52 threes as a junior for me in his first year with wins over Western Kentucky, Belmont, Marshall, some wins that we had never done in over 50 years at the university. To see him come back for a kid that was a scrawny five foot nine, five foot 10, 150 pounds, know, kid from Lexington, for him to come back and thrive in certain situations, it was an awesome, awesome experience.
for me to coach Dylan.
Cory Heitz (22:11)
Yeah. Good to hear the alma mater getting mentioned there. Thanks for that. I'll send you a check. All right. How about this? How about a player that came across your plate that you passed on or just missed that became big time. I know that happens to everybody, but like, is there any that stand out to you in that regard?
Dan McHale (22:13)
There you go. Go Knights.
I mean, John Morant was in my
league at the same time I was East Kentucky. was at Murray State. remember talking to my assistants and I'm on the bus and I'm finally getting to Murray film, right? In the OVC you play on a Thursday and a Saturday. That's kind of the way they paired it. And we had just played Austin P and lost an overtime on a Thursday night and we had like a two hour bus ride to Murray. I was finally diving into Murray film, you know, it's probably one o'clock in the morning. And I'm looking, I'm like, who is this kid? And I remember.
Waking my assistant up, go, he's like, coach, I've been telling you about this Morant kid for a couple of months now. like, I just hadn't watched him. And I'm like, how are we going to guard this kid? He's like, it's going to take a lot. I remember we lost the game, but we held him in check. think John probably only had 22, nine and nine. So that was a win for us at that time. yeah, John was in my league. A couple others that got away as an assistant that I was really, really high on.
Donovan Mitchell was one, ended up going obviously to Louisville and playing for Rick. When I was at Seton Hall at the time, I thought we could get him. But now there are a lot, there are a lot, but those two would probably stand out, Donovan Mitchell and John.
Cory Heitz (23:39)
All right. At Eastern Kentucky, you were head coach there. What's, was the most rewarding part of being a D1 head coach? then what was the most challenging part?
Dan McHale (23:46)
Yeah, most rewarding was look, it's all your hard work. It's all the staff meetings, all the long days that, like I said, to be a GA at 21 with that incredible staff, Coach Cronin, Coach Willard, fast forward to head coach at 35. mean, any kid would sign up for that, right? I was just a kid from Chatham, New Jersey with big dreams that was able to accomplish it. And that's the way I look at it. I was an average player that had a well above average heart and knowledge of the game of basketball.
Sometimes that doesn't always work out. become a division one head coach at a young age was a dream come true. Second part of your question, that seat, move over those six inches, it becomes way different. I knew I was fortunate to work for Kevin Willard for 10 years, and for Rick Catino and Richard and some great guys. Sometimes it's not in the handbook. Sometimes there's things that happen that, wait a minute, I'd never faced this before. I'm not prepared for this, right? And I'm not talking basketball wise, I'm talking about-
off the court things that you can't control. You know, you have 18, 19 year old kids on small campuses that sometimes things don't go your way. Well, now you're the leader of that group and you have to stand tall and you have to be able to, you know, right the ship during tough times. And sometimes you're just not prepared for certain opportunities, but you look back and you learn from it. And how can I lead better the next time I'm in a situation like that? And that's what you learn from.
Cory Heitz (25:06)
Yeah. Thanks for sharing that. so you're now not in coaching, but you're doing college placement. and you've got a new company with that. Tell us about that and how you help families.
Dan McHale (25:15)
Yeah, I'm really excited. We started a company, a former player of mine, Jaren Siena, that played for me in Seton Hall. He's a high school coach in the area now. We started a company called Collegiate Recruitment Consultants, CRC. Our website's CRCAthlete.com. And it's been awesome. We've been able to help kids all walks of life. Division one players, division two, division three, kids end up going to junior college, play college basketball. And it's very important to have an advocate. I knew that as an assistant coach, as a head coach, you want to learn and listen to people that you trust.
Everyone's going to say, look, my kid's the best. My kid can do this. That's maybe he can, but being an expert in the industry now working with kids, can now pick up a phone and call, you know, whether it's Fordham University, where we placed the kid or Wheeling Jesuit, where we just placed the kid and say, look, this kid fits your program. I've got to know him and his family really well. First-class kid, style of play. I've watched him play multiple times. He fits the way you play.
and kind of connect the dots. And it's been really, really fun. We've got a 100 % success rate, which has been remarkable in two years. And I've been able to help, you know, 40, 50, closer to 60 kids play college basketball with another couple hundred on the way, hopefully over the next couple of years.
Cory Heitz (26:28)
Yeah, love it. Thanks for sharing that. And that's a, that's a service. You need an advocate. And right now you're an advocate who's actually been at that level and can tell, you know, when families say, I'm going to play D1. ⁓ everyone's played D1. Like what do you say to that? If the kid doesn't really measure up.
Dan McHale (26:44)
So you know what? That's
great. Depending upon where you are in your career, whether you're a freshman or whether you're a senior, I kind of explain, okay, you're a freshman, you want to play D1. We'll see how you project, right? You still have some growth in you. Who knows? You're young, but let's map it out. Let's get some five D1 schools you want to look at. Let's get five or 10 D2, D3 schools you want to look at. Let's get some high academic schools you want to look at. Let's cast a big net. Now, if you're a senior and you haven't been recruited and you think you're a D1 player, I'm going be honest with you. I'm not going to waste your time. I'm going say,
Maybe five years ago you were, the way the Lambskate is changing right now, it's harder and harder. So there's nothing wrong with going the D2 route. Your story's not over. Look at Jack Gulk, you beat Kentucky in the tournament a couple of years ago. eight threes for Detroit, right? I'm sorry, for Oakland. He was riding a bus playing D2 basketball the year before, and now he's a hero of March Madness. So I tell these kids all the time, there's nothing wrong with taking the D2 and D3 route. Then you can blaze your own path. And if you become the all-time leading scorer at the school,
Or you become an All-American at the school, or you graduate with a great degree. That's great. Or two years from now, you're very wanted because you're 20 years old. You're more mature. You just put up really good numbers at that level. Some D1 schools are going to look at you. That's just the way the game is changing. So your story's not over when you're 18. It's just beginning. Go where you know you can play. Go where you know you're going to get a great education. Go where you know you have a great trust in the coaching staff. That's my advice.
Cory Heitz (28:08)
Are you having NIL conversations with your clients too?
Dan McHale (28:10)
We are, yes. Now it's changing so much that you educate them. You know, what's real, what's not real. ⁓ Like I said before, grass is always greener some places. Now kids are going for the money and I get it. I get it. Some of these places, it's life changing. ⁓ But you got to understand what you're getting yourself into as well.
Cory Heitz (28:30)
Yeah, when you were recruiting as a college coach, did you look at prep school players differently than high school players?
Dan McHale (28:37)
Yes and no, right? Prep schools have really evolved over the past couple of years and some kids are late bloomers or some kids are young and they need another year. So yeah, I'm going to look at the top high school kids, but I'm also going to look at the top prep schools because some of these leagues are, it's like playing in college. It really is. It's like, I think even before you and I were, you know, growing up, lot of schools had freshmen teams, right? And some of these schools even had JV teams, even the great Kentucky team in 96 had a J, Naze Muhammad.
who ended up being a pro first round pick as a junior played on the JV team at Kentucky as a freshman. Now schools don't have JV teams. So I look at that as a prep school sometimes where your kid just gets an extra year to develop, to grow, to nurture. ⁓ And if you can play, you can play. For she.
Cory Heitz (29:23)
Yeah, what's it take to be a guard at the D1 level in 2025?
Dan McHale (29:27)
Yeah, you gotta be able to score at all three levels, right? If you can't shoot, it's very, very difficult to be a D1 guard. So you gotta be able to score at all three levels. You gotta guard the position. A lot of it's positionless basketball, switching a lot of ball strains. So you gotta be able to guard one through five at a lot of different places. And then you gotta understand, you know, it's a game that's fast paced these days. Everyone talks about pace and space. So getting in the best shape possible, working on your...
weaknesses in the offseason. If you want to be a D1 guard, got to live in that gym.
Cory Heitz (30:02)
All right. During the final four in San Antonio, you had an exposure event that brought a lot of good high school players from around the country. You had coaches there. Like, what was your vibe? Like what, what were the players thinking? What was their kind of thoughts? And then college coaches, like with the transfer portal, what, what it is now, what were they saying and thinking about this?
Dan McHale (30:20)
I kept asking, I said, why hasn't this been done before? NABC is the National Association of Basketball Coaches, over 3000 members. You get 2500 coaches going to the Final Four every year. It's a celebration for these guys. And there's no dead period for Division Two, Division Three, NII and JUCO. Obviously Division One can't come. But we threw this event at the Final Four, CRC Final Four Showcase. We had 68.
kids, freshmen through senior come to the event. We had scouting services. We had over 40 college coaches show up. It was awesome. It was really, really good. I had a handful of kids pick up scholarships. One senior, couple juniors, connected them with coaches. And then it took off from there and it was, was great. It was, it was a great event. We're going to do it again next year in Indy. I expect to have triple the amount of kids in Indy, just from the direction we can get there. ⁓ And it just gave kids an opportunity to perform at the final four.
Cory Heitz (30:58)
Awesome.
Dan McHale (31:16)
where coaches already were. 10 minute drive away. was easy on a Saturday morning before the national championship games. We talked hoops and ⁓ it was just a great exposure showcase for kids that might not get it. And very thankful that we did it.
Cory Heitz (31:30)
So you're telling me now if a kid has the right performance at the right time, in front of right coach, you can still get a scholarship offer on the spot that still exists in 2025. All right.
Dan McHale (31:36)
Correct. Still exists. Still exists. We had a couple kids that
moved heads and coach was like, can I speak to that kid? said, you sure can. And picked up scholarship offers on the spot.
Cory Heitz (31:48)
All right. That, is refreshing to hear because you know, that's kind of dropped off in the past five years since COVID, but it still exists. So I just tell families over and over again, like you never know who's going to be in the gym and what kind of power they have. Remember the game named Charlie Givens? So Charlie, for people that don't know would go out and watch high school games in Kentucky, ⁓ at people that Patino is recruiting because if Rick came in the gym, right, kids would play differently. But on a Tuesday night in November, if a guy in a trench coat is in the top level, ⁓ watching you.
Dan McHale (32:01)
Absolutely.
Cory Heitz (32:18)
He could determine whether Rick Pitino is going to offer you or not. Right. So I always tell kids and you can back this up, Dan, you never know who's in the gym. Guys have, you know, dudes out there that just blend in that are watching you for somebody else. So you never know when you step on a court who's watching and what opportunity can change your life. So it's, it's, it's worth it to be a little bit paranoid. And I tell us to all my players going to prep school. You have no idea on a daily basis, if your life will change based on who sees you perform that day. Right. That's pretty heady and pretty.
Dan McHale (32:45)
Yeah, I
Cory Heitz (32:46)
big consequences, but it's true.
Dan McHale (32:47)
it's awesome. I mean, I've seen it and I've seen it firsthand with I remember Coach Bettina with that, you know, diving back into this, but this is really good story. He went on a recruiting visit to go watch a five star player in North Carolina. And I remember ⁓ he went and didn't like the kid, but right away he saw this scrappy little kid and said, look, I want to offer that kid a preferred walk on spot. I want that kid part of my program. I don't care if he doesn't score a point for me. That kid is going to impact my program.
Sure enough, the kid had some low major interests, some low major scholarships, the UNC Asheville's of the world. Anyway, took the preferred walk on spotted Louisville, ended up starting multiple games. I was there his senior year and then he made what he wanted. He said, coach, I want to work on Wall Street one day. Sure enough, fast forward 15 years, the kids at Investment Bank are on Wall Street doing fantastic. And it was all because Coach Pitino showed up at his game to watch somebody else and that changed his life because of the way he was acting.
Cory Heitz (33:44)
Yeah. And that's Javon Carter and Bobby Huggins. know that story, right? Uh, this is for those that don't know, but Javon Carter, uh, was playing like at a 9 30 AM side court in an AAU event and coach Huggins was walking through the gym and coach Bobby Huggins hall of famer from West Virginia. And he was going to see someone else and saw at this side court at 9 30 AM, this kid just giving it his all, busting his butt. Next thing know, that kid gets a scholarship offer to West Virginia. It becomes one the all time greats and made it to the NBA, right? So you never know who's watching. Now walk me through this. You make.
Dan McHale (33:46)
Yes, of course.
No, he played defense. That was it.
Cory Heitz (34:14)
That's right. Here's something that you brought up a walk on. Walk me through like the walk on experience, right? And like you've seen it at different schools and how different coaches treat them. What's your thoughts on a walk on at the D1 level?
Dan McHale (34:26)
Just like I look at a lot of things, if it's not, you got to earn it, right? And that's the best thing about walk-ons. They know their role, especially if they know their role. Some walk-ons don't know their role and it doesn't work. They think they should be entitled. And so the best type of walk-ons are the ones that are invisible, right? That are not going to be a problem in the locker room. are going to be an extension of the coaching staff in the locker room, to be honest with you. And guys that know their role, right? I might be a walk-on at a Division I school.
might not see the court tell them a junior and that's okay. My job is to make the starters better, is to make the guys in the rotation better. ⁓ And then when my time comes, I'm gonna be ready because I've been guarding the best players in practice every day. And that's what it's about. I mean, these guys understand their opportunities. They understand it's a privilege to be part of the team, whether you're the 13th man, 15th man as a walk on or best player, it's a privilege. But I also saw the flip side, coaches that take great care of the walk ons. Some schools walk ons don't travel. I always made sure my walk ons traveled, right? Whether or not
They have to put three or four guys in a room and they're sleeping on the floor. That's fine. That's all part of the experience. And Coach Pitino, Coach Willard and Richard were the same way. I these kids are going to be part of the program. Well, we're going to reward them and they're going to be held to the same standards. ⁓ But I've seen guys who will walk on earned scholarships. I've seen guys like I touched upon get jobs after basketball because of the impact that they made on the community. And those are the success stories that you want to see.
Cory Heitz (35:55)
Yeah, love it. Last big question. You've been around Kentucky a lot. Tell me about Kentucky High School basketball and what makes it special.
Dan McHale (36:01)
That's amazing.
mean, anytime everyone sees I was the Sweet 16, you play at Rep Arena and that's just a fan fair and you get 16,000 people on a Wednesday afternoon at noon to fill up Rep Arena. It's an amazing experience. But then, you you go recruiting like I did at Eastern Kentucky and you go to the back roads of Kentucky and you pull into a gym that's, I don't know, I lost cell service probably 45 minutes ago when I pulled off the highway and now I'm in the gym. ⁓ And just to walk in and just see.
small town atmosphere, Kentucky basketball on a Friday night, Saturday night. There's nothing like it. I'll be honest with you. There's nothing like it. And it's fun to see the state is obviously crazed. For me, I look back, I was fortunate to become a division one head coach in the state of Kentucky. That's a pretty awesome thing to say because it was an honor, a privilege, ⁓ but Kentucky high school basketball, there's nothing like
Cory Heitz (36:55)
Yeah. Yeah. Played for the home state there. So, ⁓ some quick hitters here. Who's the best player you've ever coached against.
Dan McHale (36:58)
That's it.
best player I've ever coached against.
Cory Heitz (37:08)
Maybe the one who lit you up the most, maybe Ja.
Dan McHale (37:11)
Yeah,
I'd say job down for Mitchell. One of those two definitely.
Cory Heitz (37:15)
Alright, what's your favorite movie?
Dan McHale (37:17)
Hoosiers, of course.
Cory Heitz (37:20)
Good call. And what are your hobbies when you're not doing what you do?
Dan McHale (37:23)
You know, I'm really into my my kids sports right now. I've got a seventh grade son of fifth grade daughter there. Just playing my my daughter in 10th grade. I kind of missed her window for coaching here younger because I was coaching with coaching them now is really, really fulfilling. And it's not just basketball, whether I'm the third base coach on tonight for my son's baseball game or I am coaching him in the gym this weekend. That's been awesome. ⁓ Like to play golf. I say it every year. I want to learn to surf. I haven't yet.
Maybe this is a year, Jersey Shore, who knows? But no, that's it, just being with my family.
Cory Heitz (37:58)
Yeah. Is there anything you want to touch on that we didn't mention during this conversation?
Dan McHale (38:01)
No, I just think life comes full circle. Right, Cory? You and I knew a lot of similar people that I went to school with that you went to high school with. And then you and I kind of reconnect a little bit a couple of years ago. I think we were playing at Richmond when I was at Minnesota. I talked with you then. We share a really good common friend and Sean Brown and just to kind of connect because my business is kind of parallel to your business and we can trade stories and talk to each other about what works, what doesn't work. And at the end of the day, you and I are in the business of helping people.
and helping kids and helping student athletes play in prep schools and play from prep schools into college. And we kind of work hand-in-hand together. So it's just a joy to be able to kind of reconnect different walks of life and see people and work together. And it's pretty awesome. So I really appreciate you having me on.
Cory Heitz (38:48)
Or when I appreciate having you on, like you said, it's all about relationships, right? And ours kind of goes back to Matt Heisenbuttel, 1998 or 99. ⁓ yeah. So it really goes back and it's a pleasure seeing, you know, your progress throughout the years and what you're doing now, trying to help kids get into college. Cause that's the whole thing. Like, you know, my way of getting kids into college is via prep school. You're doing it via your advocacy and connections you have. And that's the name of the game. Like anyone out there, like trying to do this on your own or trying to rely on a high school or AAU coach, you can do that.
Dan McHale (38:54)
Yes he does.
Cory Heitz (39:17)
But you got to find an advocate, someone who's connected because like Dan just said, it's all about relationships and who you know, which may or may not be fair, but it's just the reality. So Dan, joined the podcast. Thanks so much for joining. And if you guys liked this, be sure to subscribe on all the major podcasting platforms. Go to our YouTube channel subscribe for bonus content. Sign up for the newsletter at prepathletics.com, which comes out once a month, which has all the latest in the prep school world. And I answer everyone's email that comes to me with questions. So feel free to reach out.
Dan McHale (39:18)
You know.
That's it.
100%.
Cory Heitz (39:47)
If you got any questions on the prep school world and recruiting and Dan's contact information, let me in the show notes. So Dan, thanks for joining us today. All right. We'll see y'all next time on the prep athletics podcast. Take care.
Dan McHale (39:53)
Cory, thanks for having me, man. Have a great day.