Founder Friday by Canopy Community
It is a great blessing to be able to Follow Your Dreams! To be offered the moment in time where you get to build something of your vision and take it to the world.Not everyone gets that opportunity and not everyone who does so succeeds, in fact many of us fail, many times over, and we know ahead of starting out that the dangerous rocks of the journey are most likely to get us on the way.So what makes us take that leap of faith? What spurs us to back our endeavours with our time, our energy, our money and our life force? What kind of mental and emotional make up is needed not only to start, but to survive and thrive on such a voyage of discovery?In seeking the answer to that question we look to the failures, the examples of success and the many ‘works in progress’ from which we can learn and this is what brings us to the drive behind Founder Friday.More information at https://canopycommunity.substack.com/p/founderfridaywhat-is-it-all-about
Founder Friday by Canopy Community
Why Your Co-founder Shouldn't Be Your Best Friend
Rob Cousins shares his journey from corporate banking to co-founding Scribe, a data-driven platform helping founders connect with investors and enabling financial institutions to structure private company data. His transition illuminates the realities of startup life and the critical importance of finding the right technical co-founder.
• Moving from a 7-year career at Barclays to founding a startup after identifying automation opportunities in financial data processing
• Finding a technical co-founder through Antler's accelerator program after six months of unsuccessful networking
• Building a complementary co-founder relationship based on different skills rather than friendship
• Balancing startup agility with professional client service as a key differentiator
• Managing founder stress through creative outlets like playing trumpet in jazz bands
• Maintaining mental resilience through the entrepreneurial journey's ups and downs
• Taking the first step is crucial - "just start, test things, put yourself out there"
• Recognising that building a company isn't for everyone despite startup culture romanticising it
The platform has now worked with nearly 600 companies and helped unlock millions in capital for businesses that might otherwise struggle to find investment.
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I do love a Founder Friday episode. It's not even Friday and we're doing it. That's how much I love it, right? So welcome to Rob Cousins. Thank you so much for making some time For those people that don't know who you are. Who are you, rob, and what do you do?
Speaker 2:Yeah, good morning. Great to be with you and just sort of sharing a bit about myself. So, yeah, I'm Rob, I'm one of the co-founders of Scribe and yeah, we do kind of insight on private companies, privately held data. So we work with all sorts of organizations. We help founders find angel investors with data. We help large banks to structure data about some of the private companies that they have exposure to. So, yeah, all with that sort of analysis hat on of automating a lot of that kind of stuff. So, yeah, that's kind of what we do. We launched in 2020. We've raised a little bit of VC money and now I think we work with I think it should tick over about 600 companies, if not this week, next week, in terms of the number that we work with. So, yeah, that's, in a nutshell, a little bit about us.
Speaker 1:So you say Scribe, and sometimes I see scribe labs. What's the difference between the?
Speaker 2:two help clear that one up for me um. Availability of domain names is the main reason between the two, um, I've got my eye on scribeai and we've made an offer, but uh, not quite there yet, unfortunately okay, you're not going with get scribecom or something like that, right no, maybe we should, but no, not we. Yeah, the labs was sort of, yeah, more of a legal thing so what's the origin story of all this, rob?
Speaker 1:how did you find yourself motivated and compelled to to make scribe?
Speaker 2:yeah, so maybe just wind back a little bit. So I, when I left university, I went, I went and did the thing that, um, you know, a lot of, a lot of young kind of ambitious people want to do, and went straight into banking. So I studied economics and I thought, you know, I want to work somewhere that you know I can work with smart people and do cool things, um and and, uh, you know, be successful really, or at least that's how I defined it. So I went straight into a kind of graduate job. I started at Barclays and, yeah, and I spent seven years working so those of you don't know, barclays is a huge kind of global bank and did a number of kind of different jobs there. So I spent four years in London, then three working in Germany and had a great time. I really enjoyed working there.
Speaker 1:I mean, this isn't like frontline cashier type working at Barclays, right, what is this that you're doing?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I worked in corporate credit risks, so mostly within the investment bank and a bit of the corporate bank as well. So basically analyzing whether companies can repay money that the bank would give them, like I mean, that's, I suppose, the simple way of describing it. In reality, this is, you know, m&a, leverage finance, trade finance, foreign exchange, equity, all all the rest of it, but really complex instruments right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a lot of complex stuff, technical stuff, and yeah, it was, it was good, fun, and ultimately we were kind of analyzing businesses and I suppose that's that's where, um, I kind of got the idea, or at least the the desire for, for building what we're building now is it struck me at the time that a lot of what I was doing could be automated, or at least it felt that way and it felt okay there's got to be a better way of doing automated, or at least it felt that way and it felt okay there's got to be a better way of doing some of this stuff. Um, and so, yeah, we, we started out trying to automate bits of my uh job, or at least a large part of it, because it felt like, you know, when you're sat there at sort of 11 o'clock in the evening plugging numbers into a spreadsheet, you can't help but feel that technology can automate some of that activity.
Speaker 2:Not all of it, but certainly a lot of it. So that's really where we got the idea for Scribe. And obviously we've moved around and done a ton of other stuff, but that's sort of where it started.
Speaker 1:Okay, and you don't do this alone, right? You've got a co-founder. So how did that relationship begin and how did you start this company together, or did one of you join after the other?
Speaker 2:yeah. So before um starting the business, I I spent six months in london looking for a co-founder, and particularly a technical co-founder, because what I wanted to build was quite deeply technical. It wasn't something I was going to code on my own. I mean, these days, potentially you could build something, but certainly what I wanted to build was quite deeply technical. So I spent six months looking for a technical co-founder and I quickly realized that developers don't just turn up to networking events. It's hard to find, or at least I had the wrong approach. Anyway, I joined it.
Speaker 1:What were you doing? I've got to ask what were you doing to try and find a co-founder? Were you walking into pubs with a sign saying I need? A technical go-rounder what were you doing?
Speaker 2:I was sort of I, you know I was going to events, I was asking people if they knew any developers, if they knew anyone up for a new challenge, and you know I and eventually, you know I did find um a developer who was kind of up for joining anyway, I put his photo on a deck and I went out, tried to raise some money, unsuccessfully, um.
Speaker 2:So I did sort of get there, but it was a very unstructured process, um, and I think there are probably better ways to do this. But I eventually ended up joining an accelerator called antler, which is effectively a they're a vc, but they're also. They bring together 70 or 80 people per cohort and mix of commercial product tech, get them all in one room and they all want to build businesses. And that worked really really well because I was able to meet my co-founder, emmanuel, who is um academic background, so phd in ai, postdoc really really um technically, um smart, and so now we're a very credible proposition, or at least the product is, and we're investable because we have these two things we have my kind of network, industry knowledge, commercial side and his kind of technical expertise, so we're able to get a product off the ground. So yeah, that's sort of how we came to be and obviously through that process they then invested in us, so they were the first, first investors in our business so I mean co-founder relationships.
Speaker 1:You're putting a lot of trust and faith in each other, right, but you've just met this person throughout. How on earth did you get enough rapport between you that you both wanted to take a leap of faith together?
Speaker 2:yeah, it's a good question.
Speaker 2:I would say it's much less about rapport and much more about like is this something you really want to be working on for the next four or five years? And like. That feels like quite a nebulous concept when you're speaking to a potential co-founder early on, because you never know what's going to happen. But I think if, if you broadly like the technology that you think you want to build, if you like the space and the kind of clients that you want to sell to, then the rest will sort of fall into place. But like, for example, if you are, you know, really really motivated by social impact, for example and I bring you an idea is that's going to help banks lend more money with a fairly limited social impact angle, then I'm not likely to be the right co-founder for you, and so so I think if you align on those things, the relationship naturally will grow over time, because as you win clients, as you grow, as you have good times, as you have difficult times, that co-founder relationship should strengthen over time, and I think in many cases does.
Speaker 1:It's not the case for every business, but certainly it has been at ours so do you feel I mean, this is a harsh question, feel free not to answer it but do you feel like you guys are now going to be lifelong buddies because you've worked in this startup and this intensity together? Or do you think it is a relationship of purpose that you're enjoying the journey that you're on but once you finish this startup, maybe you won't even talk to each other for a few years? That kind of thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think this is a really interesting question, and there's so. Firstly, I don't think co-founders should be best friends.
Speaker 1:Why not? Why not? I mean, there's the ultimate trust there, right?
Speaker 2:So if you take like so if I take some of my closest friends, they're very similar to me and I think we'd bring exactly the same thing to the table in a startup. So if you're evaluating co-founder, yeah, you want to get on, but ultimately you kind of need to be different to them, at least to a degree, otherwise the business won't be successful. Like if I took some of my closest friends and we'd start try to build a company, I guarantee that we'd have fun, but the company would work and I don't think we'd grow um.
Speaker 2:To answer your point about us, um, yeah, like we spend, you know, I spend more time with my co-founder on my team than I do with my wife, you know, for example, um, and so obviously that relationship has to be really, really, really strong and you do have to be good friends, for sure, um, like, but I think that comes later and I think that happens as like a natural evolution.
Speaker 2:I think if you index on like, do I get on with this person, you're probably going to ignore some of the other things that are actually going to really drive success. So you know this, some of the technical side of things, you know I, there's no way we'd be building like there were things I didn't even know was possible. But, like you know, this kind of profile, like academic background, I'm never going to come across in my day-to-day, particularly in my finance life. I just don't come across these kind of people, and so that's why getting outside of your like social circle can really help. Obviously you have to have that natural rapport, but I think it's important to know that you can unlock things by being very different to one another, for sure I mean it sounds like Ant know that you can unlock things by being very different to one another, for sure.
Speaker 1:I mean it sounds like Antler was a great program for you, sort of bringing you both together, and Antler's one of the top in the world, right, in terms of this kind of pre-idea, pre-team program. So you've got Demium, you've got Antler, you've got a place like Entrepreneur. First, what would you say is the sort of secret source of the program that really helped you the most? Um, yeah, I think I think it obviously doesn't work for everybody. Um, but what? I mean? There's not startups made by all of them.
Speaker 1:Right, you get 70 together and you might get 30 startups at the end of it maybe, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:But but I think what they do number one is they're almost like a sort of what they do is align people who are driven and smart and get them in one place at the right time. The hardest thing about you know, timing is never perfect for building a startup or building a company and I think, just aligning timing and getting everyone in the same place, you only need to have one person out of that 70 people who you align with and you want to build with, and I think that's the secret sauce. I think, like these programs obviously do lots of other stuff like capital and sessions and whatever, but the number one unlock is getting everyone in the same place at the same time. Obviously, like you know, we've benefited from introductions to investors, events.
Speaker 2:There's a ton of stuff that I could wax lyrical about the value of having one of those investors on your cap table but at its core, it's really a people thing and so, like I mean, this sounds a bit like a pitch frown we're obviously one of the companies that benefited from it but, like, if you have 3 000 applicants which I think they have for hours and you get that down to 70 with a half decent recruitment process, then, like, I'm not going to speak to 1500, 2000 engineers to find a co-founder, but they've basically done a lot of that work for me, before then getting into a room and getting us together. So that's the value to me.
Speaker 1:I think it's a very smart model interesting and I guess they've done some investment in you when you came through the program. Right, they don't do that for everybody that comes through, do they? It's not a natural cause of events, so you now have them for a little while longer in your lives, I guess. Are they, uh, are they an active or a passive investor at this point? Do they get involved day to day?
Speaker 2:uh, day to day, no, but they're very supportive, um, you know, client introductions, you know, I think and again I think this is true of any investor is you, you get out what you put in, like I would. I would never expect an investor to introduce me to a new client every day if I'm not asking them to, and so I think that's something that, again, I suppose there's a wider point here around how fast founders make the most out of their investors. Like you've got to update them, um, and you've got to, um, yeah, know how to get the best from them, because they're they, they're usually well networked people, they see a lot of the market. You know you can, you can leverage investors for sure, um, and and that's certainly what we've done with that and they've been really helpful.
Speaker 1:So nice, all right. Well, this is a founder friday, uh thing, so I'm gonna ask you a couple of founder-like questions. So what has been, for you, the best personal highlight so far in your startup journey? What's been your biggest mistake and what's been the biggest row you've had with your co-founder so far? Feel free to not answer any of those.
Speaker 2:Biggest. What was the first one? Sorry?
Speaker 1:Biggest highlight for you. Highlight yeah you then the biggest mistake and then the biggest route um, highlight is that's a good, that's a good question.
Speaker 2:I think highlight really is like a general feeling of uh, growing, like. So for the last year, like we we've spent a couple years building a product and sort of. You know we could have probably moved a bit faster, but we're now in a spot where, you know, we're getting client referrals all the time and people are signing up and paying us and all through referrals. That's really rewarding, because someone will be in a group and they'll be shouting about what you do and saying, oh scribe's great, I found 250k or 300k through their platform. Amazing, you know, that impact is huge. Like we're unlocking, like you know, on the founder side, like we're unlocking millions of capital for these people and these are businesses that you know might have been struggling like that's wow, like incredible impact really. Um, so, like that's like a general highlight and obviously, like we have a you know we have a channel on our slack that pings every time someone signs up or we get a new paying client and you know, I'd I'd be lying if I didn't say my mental health was inextricably linked to how active that channel is. Um, but it it is really rewarding just seeing that, um, that momentum and obviously we don't take it for granted, but that that's always a kind of highlight, um, in terms of like, um, maybe like low, low lights.
Speaker 2:I mean, look, we've had situations where we, you know, we've struggled to, you know, keep the lights on, as most early stage businesses do, particularly early on. But what I would say is, you know, and I don't like we, I think startups naturally lose time because they're kind of validating things. Like we set out in day one to sell to banks and we miss, underestimated, like we sort of assumed someone would maybe give us a proof of concept as, like two, three person team, the reality is like for what we were trying to do, really hard to do, without either a chunk of capital or some trusted networks or some smaller businesses, and so I think, like it, we, we then sort of shifted our focus, at least initially. We're now selling into those big banks, by the way, but it's taken us some time to get there. So you know, if I could rewrite it, I'd reshuffle how we prioritize things. But you know, I mean that sounds like a learning point rather than a mistake like what's the humdinger?
Speaker 1:something you've absolutely screwed up in the first couple years is anything you can talk about humdinger no, I I wouldn't say so.
Speaker 2:I mean we're pretty, I don't. I don't think so, because it's kind of part that's the cost of doing business.
Speaker 2:So it hasn't really stayed with me and maybe I've kind of forgotten these things oh, maybe it's good you just let it go right possibly I, I sort of don't really see it that way and also the way that we but like we've never had these moments where, like, the platform's gone down, no one can access, everyone's screaming at us or whatever, because we're not that kind of company anyway. So it's like everything's built pretty securely, it all works, and we just don't really have those kind of moments.
Speaker 1:Um, unfortunately, sorry to disappoint, no, I mean you mentioned your background and the banking and everything. Do you think you kind of operate within a mental health banding that's pretty stable, or are you like quite a few founders where you have quite extreme type mental health? Uh, balance in the day?
Speaker 2:yeah, I would say like I think your threshold, um, like it increases over time, so like when something bad happens or something good, you're sort of less affected by these swings, um, so I but I would say like, yeah, I mean, having worked in that kind of environment, you're naturally a bit more resilient. So I would, I would say like, yeah, I mean, having worked in that kind of environment, you're naturally a bit more resilient. So I would say like I'm not really impacted by these big swings, for better and worse. I think you know, sometimes it's good to celebrate some of the things you're doing as well. We're more kind of consistent. I would also say that for a startup where, and I don't really know this too much.
Speaker 2:But I would say, as a startup, we're and I don't really know this too much, but I would say as a startup we're reasonably professional. Um, even though we're a small team, I would say we're quite professional. We hire, we have really good people on the team and, I think, our client. That resonates with our clients. Um. So, yeah, I suppose in terms of the ups and the downs, we're kind of a bit more yeah, more resilient or stable, if I can put it that way when you say professional, would it be fair to say that feels a bit more corporate than a lot of startups who are kind of like no, definitely not corporate, um, but I would say, you know, we we take take our clients seriously, we take our service really seriously.
Speaker 2:We take client service really seriously and I think, like some of those things are less common than you think and start like for like you know, for example, when people are, if we have customer support things, we'll be responding to them within, you know, a minute or two, which is like a level of customer service that, like, our clients just aren't really used to, and but it's a differentiator and it's like such a key part of growth because if they have an amazing client experience with us there, they'll they'll have it with others. So I suppose, definitely not corporate like I'm wearing shorts, you know, not suit um but I would say like taking things seriously and being professional, I think is something that I think a lot of startups kind of um, you know, maybe maybe don't always operate with, but yeah, I'm not quite articulating myself well there, but hopefully it's sort of. Yeah, it's just where we kind of come from and the people that we've got.
Speaker 1:Okay. So I mean, we're obviously going to finish the interview today and just sort of ask you what your best advice is for a first-time founder, because it's really great to see role models like you in the community being successful, and I think it's amazing when first time founders hear from people like you. You know what does it take to do this. What's the advice? But before then I was super curious how do you take care of yourself, like mentally and physically? How do you optimise, rob for this journey? Because this is a journey, right, and it has peaks and troughs and ebbs and flows, but it doesn't stop until you've exited. So how do you look?
Speaker 2:after yourself? Um, before I answer that, I'm going to answer the question from before, because I don't think I did oh, the argument. I thought you were skipping it, so I was letting you know I think I think the most we've argued is actually on designs of buttons in our platform.
Speaker 2:So yeah, yeah we have a lot of creative tension around what the platform looks like, um, which is often about the most inane things, um, but we, we have different design eye, which neither of us are designers, neither of us have built any software really before, and so this kind of like tension. It ends up looking quite nice and it does work, but it's quite funny how we get there it must be blue, it must be red.
Speaker 1:I mean you joke honestly changing the website difficult to agree on anything um I mean it's a skill to argue with each other right rather than offend each other in the argument. Is this part of the professional nature that you're bringing that you can have a robust discussion and walk away, friends?
Speaker 2:I think, yeah, I think we're both adults and we sort of realise we can have that somewhat maybe heated conversation. Then just move on, leave it behind us. I would say I wouldn't call it arguing is probably a strong word. I would say it's disagreements. But we're both very, very good at like kind of agreeing and moving on. And I think that's one of these things where you have a bit of structure and you're kind of co-founders is like you know, there's so much that I'm just not going to get involved with and vice versa. And I think when you have these roles reasonably well-defined, even for a small business business, it can actually help you move faster because you know if you that's where it's tricky as a sole founder it's like if you're a sole fan, you've hired an engineer and, yeah, I, when you've got things set up in the right way, you can move really quickly. I think that's certainly the case here.
Speaker 2:Um, but yeah, to point around sort, I suppose, how to manage the general stress of it. I spend a ton of my free time playing music, for example. I go running. There's a lot that I do outside of work. I still work really hard. I'll do the odd few hours on the weekend. I'm taking fewer holidays than I did in the past, but, um, I'm pretty good at like doing something that takes me completely out of this kind of world. Um, I still work very, very hard, but I think I I'm able to switch off um here and there um, and that's that's sort of how I manage it and actually I'm much. I think we operate at a a good level. Um, look, we started in covid like, where it was just online and it was like I can't really like. So there's, I'm the kind of person that loves to hang out with other people. I like going to events. You know, I'm afraid you go to a lot of them, right?
Speaker 2:you pretty much yeah it's important for business development. But I also enjoy them and I think, like in covid, that ecosystem, that world, didn't exist. A ton of it was online and, like you know, that's where I found it way tougher. Like we were fundraising online and trying to sell to enterprise clients online and I found that like really tough going. I was like, okay, I could still decompress by watching a bit of tv, but it's not the same um, and so I think like, yeah, if I compare those two environments, definitely that sort of online world, although in some cases was good, in other cases it was like definitely not good in terms of like decompressing or like doing something else you say you play a lot of music you're happy to share.
Speaker 1:You know what kind of instrument and what sort of band, or how does this work?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I play trumpet in my spare time and a bit of piano, but mostly jazz big band. We're doing a bit of folk at the moment so I haven't posted about that on LinkedIn yet. But yeah, we've been playing some chamber jazz folk together with a good friend of mine, so that's good fun.
Speaker 1:Okay, and you do that just for fun, or you do that as gigs, you get paid for that stuff.
Speaker 2:Yeah, mostly for fun, like I'll play. I play in a couple of bands weekly and it's mostly for fun. Very occasionally you get paid for something like a function band or something, but I usually reinvest it you know into, into the art or you know, for it costs more than I earn from it, to be honest, but okay so it's a joy, right, yeah?
Speaker 1:absolutely yeah, and does that mean your brain's wired well for languages as well? Because normally people who play multiple instruments can speak multiple languages oh, is that right?
Speaker 2:I yeah interesting. Well, I I lived in germany, so I I sort of was for well, not forced, but I did learn to speak german, so maybe there's something in that so I can speak german. So maybe maybe there's something that that process of language learning was slightly easier.
Speaker 1:Um, it's supposed to be very good for stress management and for cognitive longevity as well. Having those skills and both languages and music related to that thing yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I often read about that sort of right, left, right and stuff. I'm guessing there's something there. I've not thought about it too much.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm a little bit nervous because I'm really rubbish at languages and really rubbish at music, so there's not much hope for me at this stage.
Speaker 2:Well, first step is believing that you can, and then the rest will follow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you haven't heard me sing or anything.
Speaker 2:I imagine your.
Speaker 1:Portuguese is alright by this point. No, no, I mean, I don't starve and I can do the formalities, but most conversational stuff reverts to English. I'm not good at that and part of that is because I come and go so much. I don't have that immersion. But, like I say, I don't starve and I've got most of my friends in portugal that are ones that you have good relationships with. We understand each other a lot.
Speaker 1:They obviously speak very good english. We never would have got to that level, so that it's normal for most people, particularly in the startups scene, but actually across portugal because it's a lot of tourism. So they speak english, french, sp, spanish, german, just as a natural course of affairs, and you're kind of like, wow, this is just amazing. And I've got friends who flip between those languages very quickly at a dinner table, talking in all these different ranges about quite complicated things. Sometimes I think it's quite stunning, but it is not my brain that's going to do that just yet. So let's round this one out then. What's your best advice, given your wisdom and experience today, for first-time founders who are watching this and thinking well, rob's doing something. I quite fancy doing something like that. You know what should, what should they be thinking about?
Speaker 2:so I think that probably the the, the, the most simple answer to this is, you know, to just start like, just test things, just put yourself out there, talk about what you're doing. I think in and this is as true in life is like no one really cares about you, like if you, I care about you rob no one's really like we, we care.
Speaker 2:We care about ourselves, obviously, but like we're so worried that we put something out there. We're worried about what people are going to think and actually like that's the key to building anything is just getting your idea out there and talking about it or talking to people. You don't necessarily have to put it always on linkedin or twitter or whatever it is, but like just getting yourself out there and like just doing it, like there's no, there's no replacement. You could watch and, you know, listen to a thousand podcasts, but it will not replace what you learn from actually doing it. And what you find, I think, is is like this world of are you going to be advice or are you going to do, and I think just by doing you'll learn way, way more. And that really is the best place to start.
Speaker 2:And first-time founders classically hold them back from this immensely, and it holds their business back as well, because they're not speaking to their potential clients, they're not putting themselves out there, they're not bringing something, anything into being and these days, with, you know, the cost of software falling to zero, it's never been easier to start a business.
Speaker 2:I think you know there's so much you can do to iterate to you know, charge people for what you're providing. You know, charge people for what you're providing. It's never been easier. So I think my advice would be to kind of just get out there and kind of just do it and you'll figure out pretty quickly whether or not building a company is for you, because a lot of people it's not. I think it's romanticized quite heavily of like this is like a cool thing to do, but it is immensely difficult. You know, we work with hundreds of founders and not one of those founders has had an easy ride. And I think like it's important to iterate that like not everyone should be building a company, even if it kind of sounds like a cool idea. Um, so yeah, that that would be what I would suggest just kind of get out there.
Speaker 1:I mean, I'm fully supportive of that and even when I'm teaching this stuff on the masters I give a very similar bit of feedback. But I just wondered if I bring something back from what you said earlier about being a very professional team. A lot of the resistance I get when I'm teaching this to more mature students on the Masters is it doesn't feel very professional to just get out there and try this flaky, half-baked idea with people. How do you reconcile those two things together?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's, it's a good question. I mean, I think the the issue there and obviously you know you're you're speaking to master students now the fact that they're doing a master's in business rather than starting a business tells you a lot about the psychology of how people want to de-risk their careers or their next step. So that's already. They're already in that group of people. Same for MBA students and things like this. But there's absolutely a way to do it and I think like it.
Speaker 2:It doesn't necessarily have to be like getting out there and talking about it, but I think the average individual resonates much more with you trying to do something than than you.
Speaker 2:You'd think, like, like, when I put my stuff out there, like, okay, like I'll see my friends, you know, after work and I'll catch up with them in the pub, and they'll say, like, like, initially they're just like, oh god, like really are big on the linkedin.
Speaker 2:But you know the average individual has a deep respect for what you're doing and so you know, putting yourself out there, asking a few questions, trying it out, and if it doesn't work, you know it's fine. I think you've obviously got to. You know, be careful of your tone and you don't want to just go swearing on LinkedIn about. You know, if you're trying to sell into banks, for example, there's things you need to be aware of. But on the whole, I would say the average individual can take a lot more risks, uh, with this stuff, and I think the world is the world's changing so quickly as well that those people that are sort of in the like you, you almost stand more to lose by doing the conventional thing, I think. So you stand nothing to lose by putting yourself out there and trying to do something new, and so you know if you're worried then if you're worried about putting something out there, then maybe building a company isn't for you, and that's okay as well.
Speaker 2:So it's a bit of a scattered answer, but yeah that's probably how I'd respond to it.
Speaker 1:Founder Friday is all about that kind of stream of consciousness. It's not supposed to be canned or anything like that. It's all good, and I just wanted to close out by saying thank you. Thank you for spending time today to kind of share more of your story. Thank you for bringing a product that's helping Canopy members to raise money. We really appreciate that. And you guys have solved a problem that we didn't know how to solve, like getting this access to angel investment, making more of a system system, a systematic process that can actually be driven, rather than this artisanal thing that was kind of curating all these individual bits of money. You know, it's really, really helpful, um, but thank you for just being such a gent. You know you've been an amazing contributor in the, the demo nights and supportive of other founders and just, you know really just want to say thank you so much well, thanks so much for having me and, um yeah, hopefully some of this resonates with people, and if it doesn't, then that's cool too.
Speaker 2:Thanks, rob.
