Why "Strong" Men & Women Break (The Silent Killer of Vets & Cops) with Becky DiStefano

We talk with therapist Becky DeStefano about mental survivability and why mental readiness is tactical readiness for police, first responders, and military veterans. We break down stigma, trauma, proactive wellness checks, and how real strength looks like honesty and vulnerability under the uniform. 

• Becky’s path from civilian supporter to emergency responder and military psychology clinician 
• Blue Love and the value of visible community support 
• The morale hit of public judgment and how it compounds stress 
• What “holding space” means in practical counseling terms 
• How trust is earned with first responders and veterans 
• Common therapy misconceptions including fear of judgment and labels 
• Barriers to treatment including stigma and men’s mental health pressure 
• Why PTSD and police suicide research still feels new 
• What proactive police wellness checks look like day to day 
• Why suicide risk is not always obvious and why check-ins matter 
• The neurobiology of trauma including adrenaline, hypervigilance, and recovery 
• Dark humor as a coping mechanism and when suppression becomes risky 
• Why Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and fitness build resilience and connection 
• The collateral damage of untreated trauma across sleep, health, and relationships 
• Strength as vulnerability and finding the right therapist fit 

If something in this conversation resonates with you, take the first step, reach out, have the conversation. 

Connect with Becky on Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/holdingspaceforheroes/

Connect with Becky on Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/blueloveRI

Transcript

ental Survivability And The Mission

SPEAKER_00 0:57

Warriors, fall in. It's time for formation. Today we're talking about a side of readiness that doesn't always get enough attention, mental survivability. My guest today is Becky DeStefano. She's a pre-licensed therapist specializing in first responders and military with a master's degree in emergency responder and military psychology. She practices in Rhode Island and Massachusetts with Foundations for Well for Wellness. Becky, I want to thank you for joining me on the Morning Formation today.

SPEAKER_03 1:25

Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

I'm really interested in digging down and getting into uh mental health. A lot of times it's sort of a, in my opinion, it's kind of a thing that people just throw around, they talk about. But to actually talk to a professional is really refreshing for me because I know that you've got some tremendous insights having been involved with folks that have real mental health issues and also helping those folks resolve those issues as well. So thank you for being on the podcast today.

hy A Civilian Serves The Uniform

SPEAKER_03 1:58

Yeah, thank you for inviting me. I really appreciate it. I'm looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_00 2:01

So, Becky, what drew you towards supporting law enforcement and military mental health with you being a civilian?

SPEAKER_03 2:10

So in 2019, um, my best friend's brother was on the job uh here in Rhode Island where I live. Um, and we noticed the some of the mental health effects in general. We just kind of wanted to provide support for our local officers. And as we learned more about the need for mental health, we just sort of dove in and said, all right, let's provide support and mental health resources from a civilian standpoint. Uh, and it just kind of took off from there. Um, we created an organization that I've now been just running on my own for the past five or so years to provide this support and resources to let initially it was law enforcement, now it's all first responders and military, to let them know they're not alone and that there is support and that the community supports them, but also mentally there is uh professional help for those who may need it based on everything that they see on a daily basis.

SPEAKER_00 3:06

A lot of folks talk about military mental health, but I think the one thing that's not spoken about enough is first responders' mental health. And I guess maybe it's because first responders don't leave the environment until retirement. And then after retirement, that's when things sometimes can can become an internal problem. Um you kind of get in your own head. Yeah. Um in 2019, when you launched Blue Love, what problem were you trying to solve?

SPEAKER_03 3:40

Uh I think we were just trying to be visible at that point. It was just like, hey, there are people, and this is before everything, you know, popped off in 2020, right? So we just wanted people, we wanted our officers to understand that there were people out there who cared about them and saw them as people. Um and then obviously everything that happened after that and since then, uh, that support has been even more important just to just to connect and say, hey, you're not alone, or we see you, or we know you're a human being and not just a uniform. Um, and then, you know, as we got more into it and as I started kind of building the online community, I wanted to include all first responders in the military because those communities often connect, right? Like a lot of veterans go into responder roles. Uh, and there's a lot of um, you know, intertwined between those communities as well. So it made sense to provide those resources as we've gone along. And then uh I decided to go back to school to become the professional I was referring people to. So instead of being like, hey, you know, you can go see this person, I'm like, all right, I will just become that person.

SPEAKER_00 4:49

And for folks out there that that don't know, what what exactly was Blue Love all about?

SPEAKER_03 4:55

So Blue Love, we was sort of a civilian community organization. Uh, to we provided, so we did all the types of things, bringing food to stations, set up tables at events. Um, we even did some uh pro-law enforcement rallies when the defund was at its height uh and things like that. But then it was really about networking online uh and building a really solid online community, which is still going and growing to this day, to connect with officers, agencies, like-minded organizations, um, all responders, their families, supporters, um, all of us kind of coming together for this mission in various uh different levels and various different roles.

orale After Defund The Police

SPEAKER_00 5:41

Yeah. I love it when I hear about people pulling their efforts together and their superpowers together to try to make something happen and actually move the needle. You talked about uh during the height of the defund, I don't know what you want to call it, timeline in history, defund the police timeline in history. And I've actually gotten into it, people before about that, where people are like, well, technically that they didn't take any money away from you know this agency or that department or whatever. But here's the thing that people don't think about, and it's called morale. When you've got people on the news and you've got people in your own family sitting at the dinner table at the Thanksgiving uh dinner, and you've got friends and family that are sort of like on the cusp of also pieing into that, your morale goes into the trash can. So having those pro events kind of reinstitutes the idea that you're still doing an important job and you're still doing a thankless job, and you're still doing a job that people definitely appreciate. So thank you for being involved in those types of things because a lot of our uh men and women in blue uh needed to hear that from somewhere during that time. I've uh I'm a military veteran as well as a law enforcement officer as well. Um can tell you that hearing that is is a true appreciation for me. And when you were doing that project, what did you notice officers and first responders struggling with the most at times? Was it support, morale? What was it?

SPEAKER_03 7:22

It was I I think it was a little bit of of everything. And honestly, there were a lot of agencies that were defunded. And then when they found out, oh, when you call cops and they can't come because they don't have enough, now we need to refund and put money back in. You know, you had big cities who had hours, uh, empty windows of time where there were no cars. Like people were calling 911 for literally any violent crime, anything. And they're like, we don't have enough cars. So we really wanted to put our energy into support and just kind of like, hey, there are people who love you and there are people who support you. Um, you know, it was really, it was a very difficult time because you get heated, right? And you want to like go and defend them. And then, you know, I have a lot of cop friends who are like, you can't go down there, like you can't go down to these cities where these riots are happening to, you know, like it's you want to do a human chain, right? But you can't. You can't. They're like, you're gonna get hurt. You have, you know, like, so we're like, all right, where can we put our energy so that we can do something that's gonna actually help? Um, so it was just letting them know that they're not alone and that everybody feels this way. It's actually, you know, they're loud. This minority of people that um hate the police are are loud. So we had to be louder, but in a different way. So instead of just going on social media, which we did, we also went right to the officers and were like, hey, they're loud, but we're louder, and we're gonna do it in a different way that actually matters. And hopefully it did. And even if one officer felt something different than feeling attacked or feeling hated, then it was it was worth it.

ebranding Into Holding Space For Heroes

SPEAKER_00 9:04

I'll tell you what sucked the most, and I and I felt it when I was in the military when we were at war, and I felt it again when I was in law enforcement, was what sucked the most for me was being judged by the guy who sells shoes for a living. And what I mean by that is you have people that literally have jobs that have nothing, have never experienced what it's like to walk a mile in a pair of boots, whether it be military or law enforcement or first responder boots, judging and telling me about what's going on and what it's like and what it smells like. And it's because of social media, it's because people flip on their social media all day long and they watch videos and they feel like, oh yeah, I know what that's like, a thousand percent. And it's not the same as being on the ground and smelling the earth uh when things are going down. So that's what really irritated me the most. And that's I talk about morale and things like that. That's why it was refreshing to when I ran across your social media today. I was like, yeah, this is a great cause, this is a great purpose. Now, when you rebranded to holding space for heroes, um, why did you do that? And what does that name represent?

SPEAKER_03 10:15

So, excuse me. So I rebranded two years ago because um I really wanted to include everybody. I felt like the need was there, and that was what I my degree is in. Um, so right from when I started my degree program, I was learning about police suicide. I was learning about very heavy issues that we needed to go right into from the get-go. Like I had professors who were retired cops and veterans and things like that. So I thought to myself, all right, what am I going to rename it? And holding space is um a phrase that's you know used in within mental health. And I think it's a very important phrase because it means that like you've got a spot. Instead of making space, I'm holding it. So you've got a spot. You don't have to worry that there's not enough room for you. Um, and then our first responders in our military are our heroes. So that's where that came from. Uh and then my logo was designed by a company called Modified Misfits, and they are actually um NYPD cops who do logo design on the side. So I try to support as many brands that are veteran-owned, cop-owned, with, you know, responder-owned as I can, um, and just get as much, as many resources out there as we can for everybody, and then connect with other organizations who do the same to just keep sharing these messages and keep letting people know that they're not alone.

SPEAKER_00 11:38

God bless you and your work. Now, what does hold what does holding space actually look like in practical terms for a police officer or a military veteran?

SPEAKER_03 11:47

It's basically just talk about whatever you want to talk about. You know, you the it's your space. So it's like you have your your space literally, right? Like if someone's coming to sit in my office, this is your time. You can do whatever you want. You can vent, you can tell me how great things are going, um, anything in between, you know, uh for clients and things like that. And right now, like I'm doing police wellness checks for my local department that I contracted with. Um, so when they come in, you know, I'm just kind of checking in and asking questions, making sure they're good. If you're good, great. And if you're not, we'll figure it out. This, but this is your time and your space, and I'm not going to tell you what you have to say or what this is. It's what you want to make of it. And that space holds for you. So it's not like you come in for one appointment and you're gone. That your space is yours. So anytime you want to come and fill that space because you need somebody, it's yours. It's held for you.

SPEAKER_00 12:47

It's impactful. And to get down to the heart of the matter, you know, you being a civilian entering the first responder culture and the military veteran culture, how do you how do you build that trust?

SPEAKER_03 12:58

You know, I I don't know how it happened, honestly. Um, I connect. I don't uh it's been something that has cons consistently happened organically. Um it is a very earned, not given situation where when I can talk to some of the most heroic people I've ever met who have done things I could never do, uh, are willing to sit with me and tell me their stories or share with me their their vulnerabilities, things like that. Um it's it's just a calling. I I that's really the only way I can describe it is it's my calling. And I think that people can pick up on that energy and trust me. And I know that if I can have someone in those communities trust me, then I'm doing something right. And it's a sacred um form of gratitude that that they do because, you know, you guys know, I mean, you're cut from a different cloth, and sometimes it's hard to get through. And that's that's okay. That's part of the job. Um, but I overall have a really good record of being able to connect. I I can't tell you that I understand firsthand what you've gone through. I can never say that. I tell all my cops that too. Like, I'm like, I can't tell you I firsthand understand. I've never served, I've never been a first responder. So I'm not gonna tell you that I get it in that way, but I do get it to a point so that I can at least connect and try to help you uh help yourself and heal.

SPEAKER_00 14:25

You know, I think the first step that is uh for us, it feels like you you have to talk to someone that has empathy, the willingness to listen, and some understanding. Because there's people that I've spoken to before, and when I try to explain to them what it's like to be in a war zone or what it's like to be in a combat zone, like there's times where like I can tell that the lights will shut off and that in their mind they already know, so you can't tell them anything. But when you're talking to someone that is open to listen and is willing to have that empathy to try to feel uh what it was like to be there, there's a huge difference. And I think it's has to do with more of the character of the person and where their heart really lies and and what they're doing. Um have you ever experienced moments of resistance and how have you handled that before?

SPEAKER_03 15:22

Yeah, with you mean with like clients that yeah, uh yeah, um yeah, I've dealt, you know, um it it goes away pretty quickly, honestly. Uh I think that I think uh, you know, a lot of um, you know, people come into therapy either they because they want to be in therapy or, you know, for instance, like, you know, mandatory wellness checks, right, for police officers, they kind of come in with, you know, a little of their backup as they should. I mean, you don't know who I am, you don't know what I'm gonna ask you. It's, you know, it can be kind of a little bit intimidating. And not that I'm intimidating, but the whole, the whole thing, people are gonna be asking you questions. It's so, you know, they don't know what to expect when they come in. Um, but my experience has been that once they're in, they're like, oh, this is not so bad. You know, I'm not sitting there with a clipboard staring at them with, you know, I'm I'm talking and they can swear and they can say whatever they want, and I swear. And we, it's just a conversation. And then I just kind of be like, you know, I'm I'm not gonna dig for problems where there are none. But at the same time, if there's something going on, I'm here. It's more letting them know that I'm there. And, you know, some people are like, oh, this is what therapy is. Like, I can just kind of come in and just talk. And I'm like, yeah, I'm like, if you want my insight, I can give you that. If you want me to, you know, give you an opinion or or help you solve a problem, we can do that. But let's go over the progress you're making and the wins that you have too. So it's kind of turning it on its head as to what therapy is.

SPEAKER_00 16:54

Um I don't think I I guess I would imagine that if somebody shows up and they come to the table that they've got some willingness because they're already there. You're not forcing them to be there, right?

SPEAKER_03 17:06

Yeah. Yep. They are. You know, they are. And I think it just it's they have to kind of decide how vulnerable they want to be and how much they want to share.

SPEAKER_02 17:16

Right.

SPEAKER_03 17:16

Um, because it's it can be really difficult to do that, and it it can be um putting yourself in a in a very vulnerable place.

SPEAKER_00 17:24

I tried to get my dad to go to therapy. Um last time I saw him, he goes, son, I couldn't do it. He goes, I went to the therapist and I sat there for 15 minutes and then I got up and walked out. He goes, I can't. You know, I'm 76 years old, and everything that I have, I'm just gonna carry it with me when I die. And that's heavy. I was just thinking to myself, like, how? Like how how do you do that? Like I I I had to hit rock bottom before, at least my personal rock bottom, uh, before I sought the help that I needed to get to process whether it was childhood trauma or it was anything that I experienced as an adult. Um and I always say a life of service is a life worth living, um, because at the end of the day, we all have an expiration date. We're all gonna die at some point in time.

SPEAKER_01 18:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 18:16

When I'm on my deathbed, I hope that I can look back at my life and have had an impact on others in a sense of not just money, but like an a positive impact where I helped others grow and I helped others have a better life. And I think that's why a lot of us get into this stuff. We don't get into this because we're power tripping and you know, we want, you know, I think at the end of the day we have something in our soul that tells us that we're meant to serve, and we're and just like with you, just like what you just talked about, like you could go do easy therapy. What I call easy therapy. Uh that there's there's easy therapy out there, right? Yeah. But at the end of the day, some of the toughest clients that I've ever seen before are your military and are your law enforcement clients. And so I I really appreciate that. And talk about my end of the spectrum. What are the misconceptions first responders have about therapy in general?

SPEAKER_03 19:13

Uh, I think that some of the misconceptions are judgment that there's going to be this separation. Like, I'm going to be, you know, looking at you and and uh dissecting you and calling you out on things and oh, you said this, so this must mean this, and you must have this, and everybody's got PTSD and all this other stuff, and it just doesn't work that way. Um, but I get it. I I think that it's healthy to sort of be a little bit, even if they're booking the appointment, it's still okay to come in a little bit on guard. I think that's that's normal. That and that hypervigilance is also just part of the job, right? So it makes sense. Um and you don't have to trust, you know, they're not gonna trust me right away unless they they know me. I mean, I do meet people at events and stuff, so they get to know me a little bit and then they might call me to to book something that's different. Um but I think that the misconceptions are that it's it's very one-sided, that um everything's gonna be dissected, that they're gonna just be seen as a specimen and a cliche, and uh that's just not the case at all for me. That's uh for my clients, you know, and I I feel like my approach has been pretty successful so far. But you don't you don't mesh with every therapist, you don't mesh with every client, you're your people. So, you know, I don't take offense if someone's just like I'm kind of all sad, I'd rather see somebody else. Okay, well we can figure that out. But overall, it's it's been um I think that those misconceptions have kind of gone out the window once they've met me, to be honest with you.

tigma Barriers And Men’s Mental Health

SPEAKER_00 20:51

Yeah. Yeah, it's it's a tough crowd, um, for sure. Uh over the years, over the years I've seen some crazy stuff. Um what what do you think keeps strong men and women in uniform from seeking counseling initially?

SPEAKER_03 21:07

Well, there's various barriers to treatment. I mean, it's definitely the stigma um we're getting there, you know, we're chipping away at it, but it's still very strong. There's still a stigma generally about mental health in in general and the general population, but then you have um your responders and military who, you know, you you they are the strongest people in the world, right? They are the strongest. They're sacrificing, they're giving pieces of themselves away, whether it's sacrificing time or sacrificing um, I mean, lives and everything in between. Oh asking for help, it's can be you know seen as a sign of weakness. It's not, but it has been perpetuated that way. That I'm strong, I should be able to deal with this, I should be able to carry this. This is what I signed up for. But you're a human being, you know, under the uniform, behind the badge, under the helmet, you're a human being first. There's no getting rid of that. Do you carry it differently? Sure, but you still carry it. Um, so I think stigma is huge. And then, you know, you said men and women, and you're absolutely right. Um, but men are more at risk at this stage of the game. There's um we have a men's mental health crisis in this country generally, and then within these communities, um, the rate is a lot higher, the suicide rate is a lot higher. So we want to provide help to everyone. I have both male and female clients um in the responder military communities. Uh, but we also have to take that into account, too, is that a lot of times there's stigma attached to being a man and just suck it up and deal with it. And, you know, that's what men have been doing all these years. And, you know, then you look back and it's like how many war heroes um suffered with PTSD when they didn't know what it was and things like that. So we're we're dealing with Stigma that's been around a long time. So overcoming that. And then also having culturally competent clinicians, which is basically is just another word for therapists that get it. So I'm really proud to be part of a group and a growing community of therapists who specialize. And it is great to have because sometimes I'm like, I need support. Um, or I need to figure out how to do this. This, you know, I have a client who without breaching confidentiality, of course, but like, you know, networking with people who this is what we do, this is who we take care of. Um so it's just overcoming those barriers and just normalizing it, just talking about it and talking about it and um having agencies and leadership talk about it and, you know, people like yourself putting it out here and being brave enough to actually talk about it. Um, and hopefully that'll help save some people.

he Moment She Went Back To School

SPEAKER_00 23:52

Yeah. That's one thing I love about doing this sort of thing is instead of you and I just having a conversation in front in front of like a handful of people, I'm able to actually broadcast this to the world and hopefully get this, uh, get this in the ears of folks out there that need to hear this sort of conversation. Um, you you're so passionate about what you're doing that you decided to go back to school instead of continuing to be a pure advocate on this. Um, why did you consider to do that?

SPEAKER_03 24:23

I was not really happy in my original career, which was public relations, beauty, and fashion industry. It was fun, but I didn't really find any purpose in it. Uh in spring 2021, I had a cop call me who had another cop who was struggling, and he's like, Can you talk to him before I find him professional help? And I said, Yeah, you know, with a disclaimer at that point, I'm like, I'm just a regular person, I can listen. And that was the day, like I was like, all right, I'm going back to school. I don't, I don't know how, I don't know where. I've been out of college forever. I don't, I don't even know what I'm doing. But I was like, I'm gonna go back to school. And everything just kind of lined up. I found this program. Um, I work very closely with an organization called Reps for Responders out of New York. And through them, I was able to find this master's program, specifically emergency responder and military psych. And I was like, why don't I just become the professional that I'm referring people to? And that way I can actually help on that level. Uh, so I I enrolled, I worked full-time while I uh did my degree and um just kind of went from there. It's all just fallen into place. Uh looking back, it's it was um, it all makes sense, but you know, it was kind of you know up and down and can be messy and things like that as you go for your goals and things like that. But yeah, so far, uh so far, so good. And here we are.

SPEAKER_00 25:49

Yeah, that's the thing too. Like a lot of us try to forecast and predict uh what direction we want to go in life, and sometimes just maturing experience, uh, you have a change of heart, change of mind. And I've known people like that before that it sounds crazy, but they'll be on a trajectory to head into the business world, for example. And as they're taking that journey and they're headed down that azimuth of life, something happens and then they're like, well, wait a second, maybe I want to become a police officer or a firefighter, or no, maybe I want to join the military. And it sounds crazy, but as much as we try to predict like where we're gonna go and where we're gonna end up, I mean, life just happens and um we have that higher calling, right?

SPEAKER_03 26:35

That's it. Exactly. Exactly. It's you know, it's kind of God's timing, not ours. We can plan as much as we want to, but um, we end up on our our path, and it doesn't always seem clear at the time, or it can seem kind of unknown and scary at times, but then you look back and it's like, oh, that's why it went that way, and that's why the road kind of went zigzag this way. Now it all makes sense.

hy PTSD Research Still Feels New

SPEAKER_00 26:57

Right. 100%. Now you earned your master's in emergency responder in military psychology, right? Mm-hmm. Yep. So what what did that teach you that was surprising? Was there anything about that that was kind of like, well, that's uh I didn't know that before. That was interesting, or that turned over a new, a new rock for me.

SPEAKER_03 27:17

Yeah, how new it is, how new PTSD is being studied. You know, we're so many of us are so used to hearing post-traumatic stress disorder, but it's relatively new, only within the last, you know, 30 or 40 years, police suicide only the last 30 years. So you think about um the fact that it's all very new. I mean, it sounds, you know, oh, 30 years, but I mean, think about 30 years is is nothing. So um understanding that this has only been studied for a very short period of time was was kind of, I was taken aback by it. But I was in that space. So I read about it and I knew about it, but um, you know, it it's still being studied and it's still being um discovered, you know, that PTSD is really related to post-traumatic stress injuries. So when you see trauma, it can, you know, it can injure the brain, and that's what can call these, cause these, you know, these mental health symptoms. And it helps people understand that instead of just thinking something's wrong with me or I'm not strong enough, or why is it effect not affecting him, but affecting me, and and things of that nature. Uh, so I think that was what I was most surprised by. Um, but the the overall program was incredible. I mean, it was just it was just really um very comprehensive, and I had amazing professors. And unfortunately, the program actually shut down. We were thinking it would grow because of this specialty, but um, they unfortunately had low enrollment, but I got grandfathered in, so I was able to stay and graduate.

nside A Police Clinician Role

SPEAKER_00 28:48

So very cool. You know what's funny is um I was an early war veteran, I would say fairly early. I um deployed in 2004-2005. I had an experience uh running over an IED. I actually had several experiences um being in, I guess what you would call like ambush attacks or whatever with insurgents. The funny thing is, is like in 2004, 2005, TBI wasn't even a thing. Traumatic brain injury was not a thing. When we got assessed at the next base that we went to after hitting our our IED, which by the way, a piece of the IED is right here behind me under my bronze star in this frame right here. Oh wow, yeah, it's a piece that I I it's on my wall that reminds me about you know the importance of life. Um when we went to our next base, it was just a matter of, hey, you guys okay? You got any uh scrapes or anything on you? And uh, okay, you got this, you got that. And that there was no like nothing up here was examined at all. You know, and this was in 2004, 2005. And a few years later I started hearing about TBI injuries, and I'm like, what's that? And I'm I was like, I didn't get assessed for that. So you talking about PTSD. I mean, yeah, it is it is a new thing. It it's uh before that, it was suck it up and drive on. That's it. No. So you're partnering with the East Providence uh police department. Um what what's your role with them?

SPEAKER_03 30:18

Uh so that's my hometown department. So they're near and dear. I love them very much. Uh so I am their clinician. So we contracted with them to provide mental health services. So I do anything from crisis management to critical incident debriefs uh to uh these wellness checks that we're doing. So it's a proactive wellness check. It is mandatory, so that can, you know, cause a little, you know, some people don't like uh to hear that something's mandatory, which I totally understand. Um, but so far it's all been going really well. Basically, if they need anything, I'm there. I live two minutes down the street from the station. Unfortunately, in Rhode Island, we've had two uh mass casualty uh incidents in 2026. So uh I debriefed the guys that were at those calls. The Brown University shooting was a was kind of went viral around because it was such a it was such a big thing in Providence. Um so that was that was good to be able to just go and support them and see, you know, if you're okay, if there's anything we can do, um just kind of provide that support and just open the door. Basically, that's what the wellness checks are for, too. Is, you know, I and I tell every single one of them, I'm not gonna dig for stuff that's not there. If you're good, you're good. That's fine. But just so you know that if you do need to talk to me, I'm here. You know, I'm in my off, I'm in the office, which is near the station four days a week. I can always go to the station if they need me. Um we have a ridiculous amount of snow, but once it melts, uh, I do um walking sessions. So if somebody wants to meet up and go for a walk and talk, as opposed to sitting in the office, we can do that too. So it's just opening the door and like basically introducing to that like the holding space. I was talking about like, oh, hey, this is your space. And it's held for you. So if you'd like it, anytime you want to use it, you're able to use it. Um, so you know, and and they're my hometown department and they're wonderful. They they're always just amazing and take such good care of our community. So it's good to be able to serve them in this way.

roactive Wellness Checks Versus Crisis Care

SPEAKER_00 32:25

Yeah. It sounds super impactful. Now, the proactive wellness checks that you're talking about, how is that different from a crisis response?

SPEAKER_03 32:33

So these are I'm meeting with every officer. So I just have a series of questions I ask them, I just introduce myself, kind of tell them like this is what we're doing, this is what is available to you. Um, so that if they ever do want to talk or process things, and it doesn't have to be, you know, anything like someone is in crisis or someone is suicidal. Obviously, you know, we'll definitely help with that. I mean, we have resources to be able to help with any situation. Um, but it's just sort of proactive like, hey, this is what we offer if you ever need it. If you ever need to process something, not even work-related. You know, people have things going on at home, you know, um, you know, family things, relationship things, whatever the case may be. It's just sort of opening that door and letting them know, hey, you can walk through this whenever you want, and I've I've got you, basically.

SPEAKER_00 33:22

Yeah. That's uh that's super important for someone to offer because sometimes it's the quiet ones that are the most successful when it comes to suicide and just losing themselves, right?

SPEAKER_03 33:36

Yeah. I mean, it's it's really just, you know, it can be the quiet ones. It can also be the loud, laughing, strong.

unknown 33:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:44

You know, you just don't know. You just check on everybody. It's like I'd rather annoy people and check on them than risk not asking. Like I've told people that. I'm like, I'm probably going to annoy you. I really don't care because I'd rather check and make sure you're okay than not ask you, and maybe that, maybe you're not. And I'm not taking overall responsibility for people, like, but at the same time, it's like it takes two seconds to send a text or just say, hey, I haven't heard from you a while, or just just checking in, just saying hello, and and things like that. So um, you know, it's it's tough. The whole suicide thing is is very, very tough. But we just try to do do what we can.

SPEAKER_00 34:21

It's it's so tough to hear sometimes when people say, you know, when when someone does commit suicide and and you hear friends and family say, I don't understand. Like just yesterday, they were they were laughing, they were joking, they were you know, that that's so hard to hear, especially when children are involved. When you when people leave children behind, um that I mean, you just imagine like how dark things must be for them behind closed doors. And so being proactive and having a department actually take mental health that serious to where they're not being reactive, but they're being proactive, I think is that's exactly that's exactly it.

SPEAKER_03 35:02

Yes. And you you know, it's beautifully stated that yeah, it is dark. It is a dark, dark, terrible place. I uh unfortunately lost someone that I was close to um almost two weeks ago, uh law enforcement officer. And it's I mean, you just don't really know what to do with it, honestly. And it's and I've I've cried for, you know, cops and and m soldiers and responders I've never met. So to know someone um is is it's gut-wrenching. But it's like also, you know, it's like a fire that now it's like, all right, we've got to and he got help. It was just sorry, it would just um became all consuming. And it is, it's a dark, terrible place, and nothing makes sense and nothing's logical, and you can't rationalize it, you know. But at the same time, it's kind of just like lighting a fire, like, all right, we've got to get out there and at least try and at least if if you know, extend someone's life or at least try to try to help them as much as we can. And ultimately, it's just worth the fight.

hat Trauma Does To The Body

SPEAKER_00 36:08

Yeah. You've got so many things going on, you know, whether military or law enforcement, you've got the work to do, you've got personal shit going on at home, you've got your own demons that you're dealing with. I mean, sometimes you just feel like you don't have any direction to look to where anything is actually clear. Exactly. And um, you know, that can be a real challenge in itself. Talking about um traumatic uh trauma, you know, after a traumatic call from your studies and what you know and your experience, what is actually happening neurologically in an officer's body?

SPEAKER_03 36:44

Um so many things. I mean, the the rush of adrenaline, you know, um, they can get hypervigilant, hyperfocused, uh can get that tunnel vision. Um there's a lot of unknowns, so that's where that hypervigilance comes into play. So the body is tense, the the adrenaline is pumping. And the thing with adrenaline is that once it pumps into your system, it has to dump out. So once the threat is neutralized, it it's exhausting because your body is kind of, you know, resetting. Um the nervous system kind of goes into overdrive. It depends on the situation. Like I'll give you an example, the um the shooting I was talking about at Brown University in Providence. Um, this guy went and shot up a bunch of different buildings and unfortunately um killed a few people. So when my officers went in, and Rhode Island's, I mean, we're so small, every single police agency, an entire state, sent SWAT and sent people to the campus. So their mission at that point was to clear all the buildings. So it was like they were just focused on clearing every building, got backing each other up. Um got your six literally as they are going through each building on the campus, which it's a big campus. Um, so you know, they shared with me like that tunnel vision and that just like focus, like not thinking about anything else besides what I'm supposed to do. Um so that kind of, but that all takes such a toll on the body. So neurologically, you're vigilant and you're looking and you're you're watching, and you're not only just watching for yourself, you're watching for your guys, which is a different level of responsibility. Um, and then physically your body's going through all these things, and then after you have to recover. So you're exhausted, your body's dumping adrenaline. Um, and then if you do see something traumatic, it it can injure your brain. It's different than a um a TBI, but uh when you think, you know, if you see something horrible, it's it's like a it's like a cut, right? Like let's say you cut, you have a little cut. Um it'll bleed, it'll hurt for a little bit, and it'll heal, but it'll always be there. It's not like you can't have a cut on your skin and it's like it was never there. So it's the same thing with the brain. So it can cause just mental health symptoms as opposed to um physical symptoms. So with trauma, you know, it and it affects everyone differently. So, you know, three cops can be on the same scene, they're gonna have three different reactions. Somebody could be traumatized, somebody could not, someone could just have a medium reaction, and nobody's wrong. There's no wrong reaction. Um, it's it reactions are as individual as the people who have them.

arning Signs And The Truth About Humor

SPEAKER_00 39:29

I have told a story similar to that so many times. Um and it it's amazing to me how what you just said about the three cops on the scene. That's true, 1,000% true. And the the big biggest problem that I've experienced before is association. So if I see a little girl, that little girl that I see, I associate to being my daughter or a niece or a family member. And that's true, that's hard to do. And I remember when I was younger, and whenever we were involved in a fatality uh type of event outside the wire, the younger version of me was able to disassociate that person with anything that was tied to me. I was I looked at that as just a son of a bitch that signed up for the same thing that I did. If it was a dead civilian, um, then they're at the wrong place, wrong time. Whatever I had to do to not associate that person with reality, I I did that. But what was amazing to me was afterwards, other soldiers would come up and be like, well, that was somebody's uncle, or that was, you know, he had kids, or you know, because uh we, you know, fortunately, my unit we didn't take on any casualties. I didn't lose anyone in my company the entire time I was in Iraq. Um, you know, we were blessed that that didn't happen because the unit before us took on a lot of casualties, but we did take on casualties as far as civilians um that were helping us out. And for me, like I was always like, whatever. Like that guy signed up to get paid and he paid the ultimate price. And that may sound morbid or whatever, but that's how I mentally made it through that time, right? And another thing you talked about too was you talked about people expect you to just switch on when you're getting tunnel visioned and you're looking to clear buildings and things like that. People expect you to become a machine, but you're not a machine, you're a human being. Your hydration levels, what you had to eat, um, what's going on at home, all that shit plays a part in your decision-making process when you're under stress and anxiety and you're having to think on your feet. And it's so funny. I talked about the the shoe salesman that like tends to judge you, right? Um, you know, and and and what you're doing in your job. Well, then they well, one thing they don't understand is like you might have been sitting for three hours waiting and playbooking how to do this, and then now it's like get up and perform. You have to be like mentally and physically ready to do that, and it's it's so difficult to do. Um and yeah, that's that's the thing. You're not a machine, you're not a switch that just gets flipped on and off. And those are the trials and tribulations of like what law enforcement and what military members in combat go through. Um when we're looking at one another, Becky. What warning signs should fellow officers or military veterans look for e look for in one another?

SPEAKER_03 42:30

There's so many different things that you can look for, but it's not always visible. It's usually I think it's just checking in constantly on people. And not you don't have to like bug everybody, be like, hey, okay, okay, okay. Um leave that to me. But but um just kind of you know, just kind of checking on people. And if you know they're going through something, um, you know, see how they're doing. But I think it's just a matter of constant presence. You know, if you do know someone is going through something really bad at home, like a bad divorce or they've had lost people or there's something serious going on, definitely check in. You don't have to have every detail. They don't have to give you every detail, but just like, hey, I'm here for you. You know, I'm, you know, I know you're going through something. Um, you know, and and things like that. Because unfortunately, not all the the signs are are visible. And there can be somebody that's getting help that it's still, you know, may not be enough. Um, so I think it's just really checking on everyone, really, and just creating that morale and that camaraderie. You don't have to be best friends with everybody at work, but that doesn't mean you don't check on people and just make sure, you know, everybody's okay. You know, and to your point before about like it being um morbid, it's really not. A lot of um responders when they first meet with me are kind of like, like, oh, I know this is gonna sound bad. I'm like, it's not. It's actually a survival, it's a survival mechanism. Like, honestly, it's the same thing with dark humor. I mean, it literally dark humor is a scientific biological safety mechanism when you're on a scene. If you're if you're at a horrible scene where you're seeing stuff no one is supposed to see, you know, violent things and stuff like that, and you know, you make like a a dark joke. It's not that you don't care. It's because you're releasing serotonin into your system so your body can calm down a little bit so that you're not, you know, you're not, you're seeing stuff no one else is supposed to see. Yes, it's the job, but it doesn't matter. It's still not anything anyone is supposed to see. We're not, we're not um built to see so much of it as well. Your um your exposure to trauma is exponentially more than the average civilian. So dark humor and sort of, you know, kind of compartmentalizing things or just, you know, kind of not feeling anything, those are all protective measures. The only time we get concerned is if you do have a strong trauma response and you kind of suppress it because it's going to manifest. In other some other way.

SPEAKER_01 44:58

Right.

SPEAKER_03 44:58

But I tell a lot of my officers, and I think sometimes they're relieved when I'm like, it's okay if you don't have a reaction. It doesn't mean you're desensitized. It doesn't mean you've lost your humanity. You're not going to be emotionally invested in everything. You can't be. You'll burn out. You cannot be emotionally invested in everything. Are there going to be calls where you are invested? Of course. It can't be everything. So if you don't have a reaction or something doesn't bother you, it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with you. It's just the way that your your brain is processing things, and that's okay.

SPEAKER_00 45:29

It's amazing to me because I've spoken to counselors, therapists over the years, you know, on profession and on not on profession, just off to the side. And it's amazing to me how there's so many different takes on understanding, like what you just talked to me about right now. Like dark humor, for example. I had an interview early on in my podcast career where I was very new and I was afraid to say something. And I had this guy come on and he goes, There's no such thing as dark humor. Either it's unfunny or blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, bro, like your experience in the military is like compared to me, is like this, this right here. And not only that, but under stress and anxiety, it's like that. And I didn't I I end up just cutting that part out of the podcast altogether because I didn't agree with it at all. And I was just like, that's not what I want to be putting out. But yeah, like sometimes when you're looking into the abyss and you're looking into the darkness, you have to be able to laugh. You have to be able to feel something other than like dread.

SPEAKER_03 46:37

That's exactly what I'm saying. So 1,000%.

SPEAKER_00 46:39

If I could redo that interview again with that guy, I would I would tune him up. And I hope I run into him in person because I know who I know who I'm talking about. And now that I've done this for three years and I've got a little bit more uh under me now to where like I am not afraid to say something, you know, I would like to set him straight because like being a law enforcement officer and like being much older now, yeah, dark humor is a thing, and it is okay. Um it's how you look into the abyss and you laugh. It's how you process.

SPEAKER_03 47:07

Yeah, of course. And it's, I mean, you know, it's it's a I mean, uh for me, honestly, and on a personal level, it's been a connector for me for people because I have a pretty I have a good sense of humor, and I, you know, and I mean there's a lot of funny things online too, so and I've cop friends, so I'll send it to I mean, some of this stuff really pushes the envelope, but it's still funny. I can still laugh at it. I may not share it because it's like I'm a therapist, but um, but it is, you know, I I've told I've educated people on that too. I'm like, listen, it's okay. It's it's a coping mechanism, it's all right. It's just a matter of like, you know, if you laugh at things or um you have to. You have to. It's just, you know, and like you said, it's to feel something because sometimes you numb and sometimes you feel nothing and you feel frozen. And that can be okay if you don't have a reaction, but sometimes you want to just feel something. And so it's okay to, you know, you just be careful of your body cam, that's all.

hy Jiu Jitsu Builds Resilience

SPEAKER_00 48:01

And I think, and I really think that sometimes like the whole ball busting that goes on um in uniform, whether it's military or it's law enforcement, I mean, we learn to laugh at each other and all of our deficiencies. And it's a good thing. Like, I don't care. Like I'm I'm to a point in my life where like you, I've always told people before, you can say whatever you want to me, because I've probably already said it to myself in a mirror sometime. Like, you know, whatever it is, right? So um, but that's just how you gotta be. You gotta develop that thick skin and you gotta be able to be cool under the collar and and under pressure, under the stress and anxiety, like I mentioned before. And yeah, um, you talked about earlier, um, you mentioned something about tribe. And speaking of tribe, I've been doing Brazilian Jiu Jitsu for more years than I than I would like to admit because I'm only a brown belt. Um, but I've been doing uh Brazilian Jiu Tsu for a number of years, and I've been so fortunate and so blessed to have found a tribe of people that I've trained with over the years, and you show up to fitness events and BJJ seminars as well.

SPEAKER_03 49:06

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00 49:07

Um, why are those environments important?

SPEAKER_03 49:10

Uh oh, it's just the camaraderie. It's beautiful to see you guys together. I can, you know, there's one thing for us to kind of come in from the outside and help, but it's it's amazing to see you guys together. And then um to see specific law enforcement seminars, to see these like act tactics that can actually save your life and get you guys home to de-escalate situations and make uh arrests that are safe is is just a very cool thing to see. And it's just nice to just I have everybody together. It's just a very specific and very special community and camaraderie. And it doesn't matter the skill level, and it doesn't matter if you've never done it before. Um, every organization that I've worked with where I've been fortunate enough to attend, they it's just everyone is is it's just a brotherhood and a sisterhood because there's a lot of uh women that do it too and are amazing at it. So it's an incredible community. And I actually have um I think I have like two or three of those events coming up in the next couple of months, and then a um a fitness event in May for Reps for Responders. So it's it's a pretty cool combination of, you know, fitness and and getting people together to w talk about mental health.

SPEAKER_00 50:25

I can't really explain it. I don't know what it is, but for some reason I have a deep respect and a deep friendship with people who have kicked my ass and over the years, or I've kicked their ass. Because I've been I mean, there's guys that I'm still friends with today that have we've been together for almost 20 years, just no matter if we live you know hundreds of miles apart. And I was so blessed last week um that my buddy Damien Tannenbaum, shout out to Damien, he is a Brazilian Jitsu black belt. But when we were young budding bluebelts, we used to just beat the shit out of each other. And to this day, when we get together, it's just like, bro, what's up, man? It's been like 15 years since I've seen you. And like my other buddy Chris McMahon, uh, he's also a black belt. All my friends are black belts except for me, because of whatever, right? So um my training has been on and off, and I really haven't cared about belts all that much. But um, with that being said, it's just been such a like you mentioned, camaraderie between myself and other people in this environment where our egos are outside of the door, and we're just there and we're beating each other up, and then we're shaking hands afterwards, and it it it just creates that that great relationship with people. Do you think that responders open up more in a physical training environment than 100%? Yes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:50

100%. There's something about it that's just brings people together. And um I work closely with um an organization, BJJ Cops, and Brennan de Alavera is a Florida police officer who runs it, and he does uh specific law enforcement uh jujitsu and then also like vehicle extraction type tactics and things like that. So everyone brings their their vests or their belts for part of it as well. Um and just generally who is that again? His name's Brennan de Oliveira. I can send you his uh his page. Yeah, but um but yeah, I just see them coming together, the officers, and just everyone's meeting each other. What agency are you from? You know, what do you do? What, you know, um, what specific, you know, unit are you on, things like that. And everyone's there for the same reason. So there is a camaraderie to it. And it's also nice for cops to be able to, you know, physically, yes, physical health is so important for, you know, for mental health. It's all connected. Being active, being in shape. I mean, these are life-saving things. And then having the jujitsu skills when it comes to um on scene and arrests and and things like that, it's just it's just a win-win all around. But also it's just very, very good for um discipline as well and mental health and things like that. So it's all that's something that I do cover like with clients in general, is not just therapy, but it's also fitness, nutrition, wellness, hydration, sleep, all of those pieces. So uh yeah, definitely physical stuff is is great and it really does bring people together and nobody's judging on anybody's level, which is nice. It's like you just do what you can do and that's it.

SPEAKER_00 53:33

And everybody's cool. You know, the best thing about training is that I always tell people this like if I'm here with my physical training and you're here, I can always come down to here. But like if I'm trying to bump up, that's where bad decisions happen, that's when injuries happen and things like that. So a lot of us can kind of bump down to each other's. And I've it's weird because I was just at a conference in Vegas and I was talking to um a buddy and I, a buddy of mine, BJ Baldwin, and we were talking about that, about how when you're grappling with someone or you're rolling with someone, you can feel the the level and you can bump it down or bump it up. And uh the all that shit translates to real life at the end of the day. If you're dealing with a subject and you need to be lighter on them, you're better to be trained than untrained. So all this stuff is is very, very pertinent to the job. Um, from what you've seen, how does jujitsu intersect with emotional resilience?

SPEAKER_03 54:34

Um it's a discipline that just crosses so many uh different concepts of a person. So when it comes to mental, I mean, just being just being fit, right? And being being trained, um, it automatically changes your presence and your command, which automatically makes you feel better. You feel more comfortable in yourself and you feel more confident. Um, it also gets stress out. I mean, physical stress physically builds up in our bodies. So having physical activity gets stress out, which makes someone a lot more emotionally strong because they're not carrying it all around. Um, and also, you know, I can't say enough about the camaraderie. I see it every time I go to these events of people just coming together and honestly being around people like that who are disciplined, who are gonna push you to be better, who are gonna encourage you, um, who are gonna include you right away. Those are huge, huge important factors for mental health. It is the coolest thing to see. And I'm just sitting there at my table watching, and I'm just like, I love it because I'm just like seeing people who've never met each other just connect. And not just as cops, you know, talking about their lives and talking about, you know, what they do and if they train for this or they do this or what, you know, it's it's uh, you know, I think emotionally it just makes people stronger because it there's more of a bond.

he Cost Of Untreated Trauma

SPEAKER_00 55:59

Yeah. No, I 100% agree. Um, I run into uh Brazilian jujitsu practitioners um and hobbyists uh in uniform all the time, and it's like, where have you trained at? And all the, you know, it's just a cool conversation, cool icebreaker to have with people. But you're right about the confidence part because like you can tell by the way somebody walks and talks, like whether or not they've trained before. And it's just something that that you see and it's highly respected in the community. What happens when trauma, which is what we're talking about, goes untreated for years? It can have some of the hard truths.

SPEAKER_03 56:35

Yeah, it can have a lot of damage. It does have a lot of collateral damage. It can damage relationships, it can damage um, you know, whether it's it's you know, marriages or children or families, uh, it can lead to unhealthy coping mechanisms, substance abuse, addiction. Um, you know, people suppress it or they want to, you know, push it away or compartmentalize and pretend it's not there, or I can just get over it by myself. Um, it can just manifest in so many unhealthy ways. And it's not that you have to go through every single trauma. Like I'm very careful when I have um clients with trauma. I'm like, you don't have to go through every detail. I don't want to re-traumatize you, but we can talk about what you're feeling or how we're dealing with it, and we can look at it in a different light or just understand that this is not your fault. That's a huge piece of it, too, is it's not your fault. If you have trauma, it's not your fault. And and the the effects of it are not your fault. But it is something that can um we can work on healing, but healing is is a journey, it's not a destination. So it's not like, all right, you're healed, let's go. It's just um, you know, what knowing that you you can get better and you can uh feel better. But if you let it build up and build up, it can definitely manifest into a lot of negative ways and it can spread out into your life in a lot of other negative ways as well.

SPEAKER_00 58:00

Yeah. Becky, is it weird that I hate talking about mental health, but I think it's necessary.

SPEAKER_03 58:06

Both can be true at once.

SPEAKER_00 58:08

I mean, honestly, it's not something that I had planned on tackling running this podcast, but I understand the net the necessity of having these conversations. I understand the necessity of people like you existing um to help save others, and I am highly appreciative of the support that folks like you provide our community because we definitely need it. All right. There's enough haters out there, enough naysayers, enough, you know, don't beat your wife, you know, commenters out there who don't truly have any empathy at all, don't care about um the the men and women who who wear the uniform and truly want to go out there and make a positive difference in the world. If any veteran or officer out there is listening right now and is and is saying, I'm fine, what would you challenge them with?

SPEAKER_03 59:01

They I would say just understand that it's okay to ask for help and and that you might be fine right now, and that's okay. But if you're ever not fine or you feel like there's something that you feel like you want to talk about, there are those of us who will listen. Um, you know, and especially, you know, like I mentioned before for men, um it's really hard sometimes for men to ask for help. It's it's men are supposed to be strong and supposed to be the provider and supposed to be the leader and supposed to be everything, and there's so much pressure that, you know, it is okay to feel that way as a man. It doesn't make you any less of a man or less of a leader or less of a good husband or a good father or whatever the case may be. Um you don't have to go through it alone, and it's not weakness. It's just sometimes we just have a lot in our heads and we just need to organize it. You know, the chaos, the chaos and the the darkness and all these different things can get all murky and messed up in our heads. So it's kind of just getting it out and then categorizing it sometimes. Um, but yeah, I mean, we get that I'm fine all the time. I use it myself sometimes too, you know, and it's not so fine, but it's just like, yeah, yeah, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'll feel I'll figure it out. Um, but just ask yourself, am I, am I fine? And don't look for problems where there are none, but also be open to the fact that if there is, you know, you're willing to talk to somebody and just kind of um, you know, be vulnerable, but you don't have to talk about anything you don't want to talk about. You need to find someone who will tailor their therapy or their counseling to you instead of you fitting into some sort of cookie cutter.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:39

Amen to that. I've walked out of a few uh therapists' offices myself. I could say that right now. Like, all right, I've I've said, look, this isn't gonna work out. Just whatever this is, chemistry, personality, character, whatever, this isn't gonna work out. So respectfully, I'm gonna go find something else. And there's nothing wrong with that, 100%. I'm glad you mentioned that because not every it's just like teachers, it's just like any other profession in the world. It's just like doctors. Like, not everybody is gonna be your cup of tea and you're not gonna be their cup of tea. So maybe go find that right fit somewhere else.

edefining Strength As Vulnerability

SPEAKER_03 1:01:13

Exactly. And it's not personal. It's personal for the client because they need help, but it's not personal for me. If someone comes and sees me and is like, you know, I'm I don't really think this is the right fit, okay. Let me I can try to help you find somebody else, or I can wish you well and let you know that if you ever want to come back, I'm here, that type of thing. But you know, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:32

Becky, from what you've seen, your experiences, what does strength truly look like in today's first responder and military culture?

SPEAKER_03 1:01:40

Strength is being able to be vulnerable, honestly. Strength is, I mean, strength is strength, right? But it's also being able to be like, you know, I I I think I do need some help or I do need to talk to somebody. Um, because asking for help is not a sign of weakness. It's it is a sign of strength. Trying to do it all on your own. We're not supposed to as human beings. Um so strength is really admitting, like, hey, I I do need help or I do need support. Um and and being able to be honest with yourself because then it makes you stronger. Like a lot of times, you know, you can feel weak, but it doesn't mean you are weak, right? So you can be a strong person, but you can have vulnerable and weak moments, but that doesn't make you weak. And when you do ask for help, that actually makes you stronger and builds up resilience because it's hard for some people to ask for help. So if you ask for help, that was a hard thing. You've already done hard things before. So now you can do even harder things because you know you've done it already. And that's where the strength and resilience comes in. So it's sort of flipping the script and being like, all right, asking for help is actually strength because I'm gonna learn some tools to be able to deal with this and I'm gonna be that much stronger. My armor is gonna be that much tougher because I know now what to do. So it's basically just kind of adding to, you know, for like a weapon metaphor, adding to your armory, right? I just need to have these tools. So when this stuff comes at me, now I know what to do, and now I'm more resilient. And that's where the resilience comes from is is that vulnerability.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:22

Yeah, process and perspective are two big things, in my opinion, that has helped me over the years with, I guess, just getting through mental concepts and bad times, basically. And today is an interesting day for me. I had an uncle that had a massive stroke uh this morning, and then I've been at the hospital all day, and thankfully he got through a surgery. And so it having this conversation with you uh about mental health and you know being mentally strong, but also being vulnerable at the same time, being honest with yourself has been quite a refreshing conversation. It's been a great conversation so far. Is there anything that I didn't mention during this podcast that you want to mention?

SPEAKER_03 1:04:05

No, I I think it's great to um I love that you said you hate talking about it, but you're talking about it anyway. You know, I think that's I think that's honest, and I think that both can be true at once. And that's the other thing, too, is a lot of things, both a lot of things can exist simultaneously, you know. Um, but I think that even makes it even more authentic that it's just like, all right, we got it, we have to. Like there's just some stuff we have to do. And if it helps even one person, um, you know, and I, you know, I I don't save anyone, I try to help people save themselves. Um, any progress people make is usually is not in the sessions, it's in between the sessions. So when my clients do the work, they get the credit um and the progress they make, and we make sure we go through those wins. And sometimes people don't always see the progress they're making because they're they're so focused on the end game. And it's like, no, we've got to count every single little win here because they all matter. Even just booking an appointment and showing up for your appointment. I'm like, hi, that's those are wins. Because there are plenty of people who don't book the appointment or do book and don't show up, or show up and don't want to do the work. So, you know, I help them kind of build a foundation, and then we build on it from there to create progress. Um, so I appreciate the fact that you're willing to talk about it.

here To Find Becky

SPEAKER_00 1:05:27

Yeah, and I was just talking from my heart. Like honestly, I would love to talk about like kick-ass stuff and whatever and not talk about this lovey-dovey like mental health stuff. But like I said, I understand, I understand the importance of it and the necessity of it. Uh, when I run into someone that has passion and expertise, such as yourself, I gotta, I gotta have this conversation because um as a leader myself, um it's important for me to put this out into the universe um and to also be part of your journey as well to help people get notified about who you are and what you're doing, Becky. Um, if people want to follow you on social media, what platforms are you on?

SPEAKER_03 1:06:13

Um I am on Instagram and Facebook. So it's at holding space for heroes on both.

ental Readiness Is Tactical Readiness

SPEAKER_00 1:06:20

Okay. So yeah, at holding space on Instagram and at holding space on Facebook. Um Yeah, so folks out there, make sure you follow Becky on both those platforms. I'll try to remember to put that at the bottom in the show notes um and the description of the YouTube as well. Becky, I truly appreciate what you're doing. You you didn't just talk about supporting this community. You showed up, you built trust over time, and you chose to equip yours equipped yourself professionally to serve at a much deeper level. And I appreciate you taking this two to three tier. Deep with me today in this podcast and having this conversation. Formation Nation, here's a takeaway: mental readiness is tactical readiness. You can train your body, you can sharpen your skills, you can stay operationally prepared. But if you don't process what you've seen, what you've carried, and what you've suppressed, it will surface sometime, somewhere, whether in your sleep, in your leadership, in your marriage, in your health, proactive wellness, it's not weakness, it's leadership. And that's what we've learned today. And if something in this conversation resonates with you, take the first step, reach out, have the conversation. I'll have Becky's information in the show notes and the show description as well, including holding spaces for heroes. Um until next time, folks, Becky, thank you so much. I really appreciate you. Um looking forward to looking forward to working with you in the future even more.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:50

Yeah, for sure. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:52

Until next time, everyone, as always, I want you to stay tuned, stay focused, and stay motivated. Warriors, fall out.