U-R-G On the Go
An informative podcast for the United Recyclers Group. Each week we will feature an entertaining guest that will share their knowledge and information with you, providing you with tips and tools to help you become a more profitable business.
U-R-G On the Go
Revving Up for the Electric and Hybrid Car Recycling Boom with Andy Latham
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Are you curious about the future of automotive dismantling and recycling? Want to be prepared for the surge of electric and hybrid vehicles hitting the used market? In this electrifying episode, we plug into the expertise of Andy Latham, a U.K. automotive industry veteran who's spent a decade enlightening others about these innovative vehicles. Together, we examine the unique risks and rewards associated with handling electric and hybrid cars, and we power through the vital training required to safely dismantle their high-voltage components.
Andy guides us through the four tiers of training necessary for handling these cutting-edge vehicles, from basic awareness to advanced battery dismantling. He introduces us to the enriching online courses provided by ARA University that can ease your journey up this ladder of knowledge. We also turn our headlights onto the URG Scholarship Foundation, a brilliant initiative that provides financial assistance to industry employees and their offspring for their educational endeavors. Lastly, we rev up our imaginations and cruise into the future, where Andy shares a vivid image of what vehicle dismantling and recycling might look like in 25 years. Join us in this journey and get future-ready!
Understanding Electric and Hybrid Vehicles
Speaker 1Welcome one and all . You're there . We are here . This is the URG on the go podcast , the true voice of the automotive recycling industry . We do our best each and every episode to bring you new , informative ways to improve your business Anything that would help you improve your bottom line . We also have in house Chuck Kamp , the producer of the URG on the go podcast . We also have DJ Harrington me , better known as the cardiologist , the doctor , and today we have a special guest . Andy Latham , all the way from the UK , is online with us and we're gonna turn over today and ask Andy a little bit about himself so our listeners would know more about him . Of course , andy and I have known each other . I actually knew him when I had brown hair and hot hair . It's been a long time . He's a wonderful guy , a dear friend , a great Christian , and I'm proud to know him . So , andy , let me ask you first of all , thank you for joining the URG on the go podcast and tell us a little bit about yourself .
Speaker 2Thank you . Thank you , dj , and it is a pleasure and an honor to be part of this podcast . Thank you . For those of you who don't know me , I'm 40 something years working in the automotive industry I think if I quickly work it out , it's about 46 years and I've worked in a number of areas , both on the retail side of the industry . I then joined the biggest insurance company in the UK and I was a vehicle damage assessor for 10 years and then compliance manager in BlueCycle , which was their wholly owned salvage subsidiary for 13 years , before they outsourced all that work and laid myself and my team off .
Speaker 2For the last 10 years I've been running salvage wire . That started as a consultancy service to the automotive recycling and the automotive dismantling industry , but over the last eight years it's evolved much , much more into electric and hybrid vehicles , working at one end with the scrap , the recycling , the vehicle dismantling industry and everything around that globally , but also at the other end . I'm now working with research and development facilities , universities , colleges training the next generation of automotive engineers about electric and hybrid vehicles and then everybody else in between . So I'm working with collision repair centers , mechanical repair centers and lots more companies besides teaching on electric and hybrid vehicles , helping them to understand how these vehicles work , how they can build them , design them , make them safe , repair them , scrap them , recycle the components without killing themselves . And that's what I've been doing . And it's a global industry . This job takes me all over the world and I'm loving it right now .
Speaker 1And you have been all over the world , that is for sure , and we here in the United States really appreciate every time you come here and speak at a URG event or an ARA event and a lot of state conferences that you are appearing in and have I sat in one of your two day classes up in Michigan and it was phenomenal . It was just . You did a great job , and Barbara Utter always talks how great you are and witnessed it firsthand . You really are , thank you .
Speaker 2Thank you .
Speaker 1Tell our listeners , if you would , about the electric hybrid vehicles represent a substantial change in the ICE vehicles . What should vehicle recyclers consider when preparing to accept these vehicles into their operations ?
Speaker 2Yeah , we know and we understand internal combustion engine vehicles gasoline , diesel . We understand that , we know how they work , we know what the risks are . Electric vehicles pose a different type of risk and if you look on them , particularly the batteries that are in these vehicles , and you look on them as an energy storage system and you treat them as energy storage , then you're gonna be safe , you're gonna be able to work on them . But if you come in with that perspective and your people are educated , they're trained , they know the process and they have the right tools and the right personal protective equipment , then you will be able to work on these vehicles and stay safe .
Speaker 2We've been draining gasoline out of vehicles for years and , yes , there are risks , there are fires , there are other things that happen . But we know and understand that these vehicles slightly different risk but there is still a risk of electrocution , there's a risk of fire but treated properly , treated correctly , they are very , very safe . And as these vehicles come into the end-of-life marketplace , into vehicle disposal , then there's gonna be different things that you can sell and trade on these vehicles . There might not be an internal combustion engine but there will be electric motors , there will be batteries , there will be other components that all have value , and there will still be body panels . There will still be trims , glass and all the other stuff that we know and love on our vehicles that sell and make money . It's just that we are now working with a slightly different animal and we've got some slightly different products to sell that we didn't have before .
Speaker 1Well , I want to tell our listeners before we take a break . You're listening to the URG on the Go podcast . One of the things that Andy Latham is really an expert at is hybrid and electric vehicles . So we're gonna take a fast break and , andy , when we come back , I want you to share with our listeners some of the electrical and hybrid vehicles , the chance of fires and those type of things how to protect their yard . So when we return with Andy Latham , hang with us , we'll be right back URG can help you streamline your business for maximum efficiency and increased profits .
Speaker 3Access powerful software and unique tools . Receive top level training with industry experts . Network with hundreds of recyclers . Employee e-commerce solutions to boost business . Receive support , resources and discounts starting at just $150 a month . That's the smartest investment you will make for your business this year . Go to u-r-gcom and click on become a member . Your path to a profitable future is just a click away . That's u-r-gcom .
Speaker 1Welcome back listeners . This is the real voice of the industry , the URG on the go podcast . Every week we bring you informative information . Make sure you're available . We're on Spotify , itunes , pandora , google Play , stitcher , iheart Media , amazon or wherever you get your podcast . Before the break we had Andy Latham , and here's the next question our listeners would like to hear . We hear a lot about comments about electric and hybrid vehicles catching fire . What can you tell our listeners about the fire risk from these vehicles and how , maybe , to control the fire ?
Speaker 2Certainly and it's a big topic . We've had , as I said earlier , 120 years to understand gasoline and diesel . We've had 10 years to understand lithium . We're still learning about lithium batteries and how they react . We will get there , but it's taking a little bit of time . But stats and data that we have to hand is telling us that actually , these vehicles catch fire far less than a conventional vehicle catches fire . The problem we have is that if and when these vehicles catch fire , the consequences can be much , much more severe . In normality , a lithium battery in a passenger vehicle will burn for between three and five hours , and the fire services are looking at a number of different ways of how to deal with this , but one of the ones that they do a lot of is actually high pressure water , and lots and lots and lots of it . Sometimes many thousands of gallons of water are required to firstly control the fire in an electric vehicle , but then also to bring the temperature of the battery down , because if you don't , if you leave the battery warm , then it could reignite , and some fire services are talking two and a half thousand gallons of water in less than an hour . Now , if you're a vehicle dismantler and that's in your yard . Where's that water runoff gonna go ? You know it's gonna go down the drain . It's gonna go run off site and possibly into a watercourse or something of that nature and that's contaminated water . If it's inside the building , then you've basically just said goodbye to the building , because by the time the fire services get their act together , get a pump and a hydrant connected , then the building is gone . So other alternatives are out there and we talk a lot about the vehicle fire blanket , which is what it says . It's a blanket that goes over the vehicle and cocoons the vehicle , stops the fire from spreading and gives you time and gives the fire services time to react and then actually control the fire and stop it spreading to the rest of the building . So there's all sorts of different alternatives out there , but water is the main one that the fire services use , but a fire blanket and if you've got a fire blanket on site , then you could actually save your building if one of these vehicles catches fire Over the last data we have from a company called EV FireSafe , based in Australia , says that since 2010 , they have verified 393 electric vehicle traction battery fires globally .
Speaker 2There's 74 they're investigating and there's 21 from an unverified source that they're waiting for data on . That's globally , that's a global stats , and since January this year , first of January to the 30th of June this year , there's been 44 battery fires in passenger electric vehicles , there's been three battery fires in electric buses and two battery fires in electric trucks . Globally , in the whole scheme of things , there's not many fires . That's very , very few fires . It's just that they cause more damage . Of more concern to a lot of people is what we call light electric vehicles , electric bikes , e-scooters and things of that nature . There's been over 500 battery fires this year alone in those , with 36 fatalities as well from those fires . That is much more of a concern because those batteries are far lower quality batteries than in passenger vehicles , or trucks or buses Don't have a battery management system , which all of our vehicles do , and obviously they're commonly charged inside of homes , houses , apartments , posing a high risk to life and to property safety .
Speaker 2So that's what we have globally . But to combat the fire , then every vehicle dismantler must have an up-to-date fire protection policy . They must understand how to bring these vehicles on site , to store them properly and to assess them before they take them into the workshop , and they must have the precautions available so that if something does occur , something does happen . Then number one , they can put people safety at the top of the list . But number two , they can actually start to do something that protects the vehicle , protects the business and stops the business going up in flames and having fire extinguishers probably not that effective on an electric fire because you need high pressure water , but a fire blanket is definitely something to have a look at on those .
Speaker 1Now , andy , if I could be the person listening , some of our listeners might be saying well , you believe we should have a fire blanket . How much do they cost and where could we obtain one ?
Speaker 2Certainly they cost . There's two variations . There's two types . There's a single use blanket which is there that once it's experienced one fire , then it's disposed of Right , and then there's a multi-use blanket which the manufacturer claims can work on up to 30 fires . I think if you've had 30 fires you've got more of a problem , but they vary from about $2,000 to $4,500 . And if you talk to one of our sister companies , intac , e-i-n-t-a-c , intaccom , then the details on their website of the vehicle fire blanket and how much it costs and that can be delivered from their facility in Florida to anybody in North America .
Speaker 1Got you . Could you spell that again for me ? E ?
Speaker 2Yeah , e-i-n-t-a-c intac .
Speaker 1Intaccom E-I-N-T-A-Ccom in Florida Gotcha . All right , let me ask this question , andy . Training is essential for vehicles dismantling techniques , and what training is available for the industry , and if you would give us some opportunity to discuss new EV training that's going on , if you would be kind enough , and the Savage Wire launches this type of stuff .
Speaker 2Yeah , absolutely . Traditionally , the training the accredited training that's been available has been focused on vehicle technicians , so technicians working in collision repair centers or in mechanical repair shops who are repairing a vehicle . They're diagnosing a fault , they're assessing the vehicle , making it safe , repairing whatever it is that's gone wrong and then putting the vehicle back together and making it work again afterwards . And the vehicle dismantling industry needs something slightly different , because we need to assess the vehicle , see what condition the vehicle is in , what can be reused or not , as the case may be , and then we need to safely dismantle the vehicles . We need to safely store the parts that have come out of these vehicles and then safely ship those parts to the end user , be that a customer who's bought , who's purchased the parts , or a vehicle recycler , a battery recycler who's taking that battery to recycle the battery for reuse . So slightly different training and Over the last year salvage wire has been working very , very hard to get this training written and available for vehicle dismantlers and we're very proud to say that we have recently launched this training accredited training for vehicle dismantlers on how to safely handle , dismantle , store and ship high voltage components from end of life vehicles .
Vehicle Dismantling and Recycling Future
Speaker 2There's four levels for the training , level one through to level four . Level one is an awareness . It's education , and that's perfect for owners , managers and leaders , parts staff and sales staff . Gives them an understanding of the technology . Then we move into the technical levels for the technicians , on how to dismantle the vehicle , how to assess and to make the vehicle safe . And then level four , the highest level , is actually how to dismantle the battery and strip the battery down to its component parts , because you may be looking to either remanufacture that battery and repurpose it into something else , or you may be looking to actually utilise the core product that's there , that you don't want to pay for , the extra shipping of all of the casing and the metalwork and the heavy metalwork that's involved , and you strip it down to its modular level to then ship those battery modules to a vehicle , to a recycler .
Speaker 1Now , before we take a break , how can our listeners find out about the level one through four ? Is it on a website , or are you involved with ARA University , that type of stuff or ?
Speaker 2Yeah , with ARA University there is online training available for vehicle dismantlers and that is available for them to take within the ARA University and that's the equivalent of our level one , level two , three and four then gets practical and we actually get into practical work and actually get them hands on with the components , with the high voltage vehicles and the bits that come out of them , and you can find out more . You mentioned iNTAC just now . You can find out more from their website or you'll soon have that on my own website , salvagewirecom , and that will be there on that website as well .
Speaker 1Okay , you got it . Let's take a fast break and when we come back , our special guest , andy Latham , will talk about the dismantling and recycling down the road right up into 25 years . All right , hold tight , we'll be right back with our special guest .
Speaker 3The URG Scholarship Foundation was founded in 2014 in honor of individuals who give their talent , time and , very often , their own finances to ensure the growth and success of the automotive recycling industry . We understand college is not for everyone , so each year the foundation offers substantial financial scholarships to auto recycling employees and the children of employees that are attending four year and technical or trade schools , to assist with their education . Don't leave money on the table . If you have a child or if you're interested in attending continuing education , this money is available to you . Go to u-r-gcom and click on the scholarship foundation tab . Urg keeping our industry strong through education .
Speaker 1Welcome back listeners . You're listening to the URG on the Go podcast . If you want to hear an industry expert like an Andy Latham , we have a hotline number right here in the podcast center . The hotline number is 706-409-5603 . 706-409-5603 . And if you have an industry expert you would like to see and hear on the podcast , by all means give us a holler and chuck camp and I and the people at URG will make sure it happens , just like with Andy Latham . A lot of people said how can we get Andy Latham on the podcast ? And we went and did it , andy . Thank you so much for being here . How different will the vehicle dismantling and recycling be in 25 years ?
Speaker 22048 , that's 25 years from now . That's a scary thought actually . I'll be well into my 80s by then , and that's probably 13 years after California and a whole bunch of other states banned the sale of brand new internal combustion engine vehicles , and probably eight years after the rest of the US followed their lead and you've now got over 50% of the vehicles on the roads in the US being zero emission , be that electric or hydrogen power . And what are you looking at ? You're looking at companies who today , this year , made the decision to invest , to look forward , invest in their future , and are now excelling in their service , in their quality and their profit . Supported by the Automotive Recyclers Association and by URG , these companies got their staff trained , they got them aware of electric and hybrid vehicles using the resources available to them . They gave them a good grounding , a good understanding of the vehicles , the technology , the risks , and then they completed more training . They started to understand the opportunities that these new types of vehicles brought with them . They started to understand about the vehicles they purchased , they started exploring the marketplace . They brought the white people into the business and built relationships with other companies , with clients , with partners , with suppliers , and all of these companies then contribute to that closed loop recycling from production into build , into use , into end of life , into recycling , and those products that come out of the recycling process then go back into brand new batteries , go back into brand new vehicles . That's the marketplace Vehicle recycling in 25 years time Closed loop where products go round and round that loop and get recycled back into brand new products and there'll be a complete industry doing that . They'll be taking everything out of the vehicles .
Speaker 2You look at electric motors today and electric motors at the moment are not getting used for anything else , but companies are already starting to look at how they extract the rare earth metals from electric motors and those rare earth metals that they extract from end of life electric motors will go directly back into brand new ones . The products that come out of batteries will go directly back into brand new batteries . The steel , the aluminium or aluminum I should say that come out of vehicles will go straight back into brand new . The glass will be reused and so on . It'll be a complete closed loop and only those companies that are forward thinking , that are looking at the future , that have got the opportunity to invest in their people and to invest in their processes and what they do and invest in relationships with key suppliers and key clients are going to be those that survive and they're going to be the ones that are going to be doing that closed loop recycling .
Speaker 2The ARA URG will still be there because there'll still be a load of other vehicles on the road that still need recycle parts , because we'll still have those people that want internal combustion and want to carry on using internal combustion . We'll still have people who hit potholes , hit curbs , need suspension and steering , damage their doors , damage fenders and things like that . They're going to want all of those products , but the high tech , the high tech technology that's in vehicles in 10 , 15 , 20 years time will be closed loop recycling back into brand new .
Speaker 1Boy . Andy , I am so glad you're a guest , but I am also very glad we archive every one of these podcasts . This will be one that people will be listening to over and over again . They'll be telling their kid go back and listen to Andy Latham on the URG on the Go podcast this date and re-listen to what's going to be down the road . All right , I want to ask all of you I know our listeners are asking you launched salvage in , really during COVID , so what has happened since then ?
Speaker 2Certainly . Yeah , salvage Insight was launched and it was originally is a coaching platform for automotive recycling professionals , and that's how it was launched . That was the original thinking around that and it was due to be launched in April 2020 . Unfortunately , a global pandemic postponed that and we haven't really put much effort into it since , because our priorities shifted and what we were doing moved around a little bit . We're about to relaunch that platform and we're about to relaunch Salvage Insight , but we put a lot of effort in thinking into this and to .
Speaker 2We can't do it the same . We have to do something different , and it's a refreshed vision , a refreshed focus that's using enhanced technology and helps our salvage and our recycling industry clients connect with specialists who can then solve the problem or the idea that the client has , and they can be the guide that helps the client to do that . So people have an idea , or they have a problem , or they have an issue , and they enter the details . And they enter their name and their details , the details of their idea or the details of their problem or their issue into our new portal , which will be online next month , and that portal links the client to one of our consultants Now the issue that they could have , or the idea they could have , is all about site management . It could be about waste , it could be profit , it could be something about staffing or health and safety , competence , shipping logistics , anything .
Speaker 2And the consultant who receives that inquiry will then have , free of charge , a one hour discussion with the client .
Speaker 2And that one hour discussion is to help understand in more detail what the problem is or what the issue is or what the idea is . And following that discussion , there could be three outcomes . We could accept the work and put out a formal quotation to say , look , this is how we think this is going to go into follow and here's how we can help you . We could agree that we need to do more in-depth investigation , which will be a charge to the client , and following that in-depth investigation , we can then decide the next steps . Or it could be something that we actually turn around and say , look , we can't do this and we decline the work . An example could be that it could be a legal issue that requires a solicitor or something of that nature . But that's what we're looking at and that's what we're doing , and basically what we want to do is we want to be a facilitator who connects the clients with somebody who can help that client not just solve the problem but help that client become a leader in their industry .
Speaker 1Boy . This has been a great one , andy . I contact you at Andy at salvagewirecom . Is that the best email to get ahold of you ?
Speaker 2so we can share that with everyone . Yeah , absolutely , that is by far the best email .
Speaker 1Okay , Because I want to tell our listeners this is a podcast that you need to re-listen to and re-listen to and share it with your team so that they understand . Now you're going to be at ARA , You're speaking at ARA . I hope Yep .
Speaker 2Good , I am indeed .
Speaker 2Yes , we're coming in the week or the Sunday before ARA .
Speaker 2We're bringing a group of recyclers from the UK into the USA and we're going to do a bit of a road trip from Chicago down to Kansas City where the ARA convention is being held , and we're doing that road trip and then obviously into the ARA convention as well .
Speaker 2So at the moment we're not entirely sure of numbers , but 12 , 15 people with us as we drive , visiting yards , visiting businesses , building relationships , allowing the UK recyclers to see what the Americans do , to see how they work , to see some of the best people and the best examples of vehicle recycling and vehicle dismantling that are out there , and then into the ARA convention where they learn , they grow , they get ideas , stuff that they can take back to their own businesses back in the UK . But we've done this now , for I think this is our seventh road trip and the relationships we've built over those years by going into different dismantlers and different recyclers is immense and there are some really long-term friendships and relationships that have been built with between the people that we've brought with us and the people that we visited , and it's amazing to see that happen .
Speaker 1All right , I want to thank you as being on the URG on the Go podcast , but , as a final shot , is there anything you'd like to say that we didn't cover that you'd like to share with the American listeners ? Now , the crazy thing is wait to hear this . We have 322 in the European markets that listen to the podcast and Chris Danglis loved it because he said oh yeah , now I got all my friends listening .
Speaker 1So , as a final shot , andy , you have been a mentor to me . You are a very gifted guy . You're a gift to our industry . So is there any final thing that you'd like to say to our listeners ? And then we'll wrap this up .
Speaker 2I came into the salvage industry back in 2001 and I was an automotive engineer and I thought , yeah , I know everything about this industry . I knew such a tiny amount about the industry and , after a couple of years working in that industry , it is such an amazing , incredible industry that operates globally , has been operating for years and years and years , and this industry is one of the best industries I've ever worked in because it adapts , it changes , it's got some great people working in this industry and once you're in it , you don't leave , you don't get away from it . It is an incredible industry and long may it continue doing exactly what it's doing now , which is taking scrap cars , end of life vehicles off the road , stripping them down , making financial profit for people who do this job , keeping the industry green and clean and all of that product going back into new build or back into something else . We are the original recycling , we are the original green industry and keep it that way . Long may it continue , because it is an amazing industry .
Thanking Andy Latham on Podcast
Speaker 1Andy Latham . I thank you very much on behalf of the URG people team and all of our listeners . I thank you for being on the podcast and we'll see you at ARA .
Speaker 2DJ , it's been a pleasure . Thank you very much .