How financial security affecting career choices (English Audio)

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Who has never heard of these motivational quotes: “Follow your heart, pursue your dreams…”? It seems that we are living in a world where the focus falls (sometimes way too much) on one’s passion when it comes to career choices. We forget the fact that unless our families are wealthy, we still need to work to earn money, to be financially independent. What would you do if you have to choose between a job that you love or the job that gives you a stable income?

How do you make decisions that are not based on fear? Just close your eyes, imagine you have lost everything, you will realize you can always start over…

And lastly, a successful career, how important it might be, should not be your sole focus your whole life. 

Chris Saye who is executive chairman of Green School International will share his opinion and experiences about these topics in episode 9 of Beyond Trada. 

#VietnameseOversea #Passion #CareerChoice #Fear #FinancialSecurity

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Transcript

Huyen: Xin chào các bạn! Chào mừng các bạn đến với Beyond Trà Đá podcast của Huyền Lê và Trà My. Mình là Huyền Lê ở đầu cầu Frankfurt.Welcome back to another episode of Beyond Tra Da. My name is Huyen Le in Frankfurt, Germany. Today’s guest is very special to me personally, if you watched the 2nd episode of BTD podcast or came across my article on VNexpress then you would know I referred to my former boss as my mentor since I started working in his company in Singapore -  Christopher Saye. It’s actually funny how I never knew your full name is Christopher until you send me your full name for this talk. I have always called you Chris and I assumed that’s your name. Anyway, here is some background information about Chris: he is a founder and managing partner of MarcWhittaker Singapore - it’s a family office that provides strategy and guiden in the area of wealth management, legacy planning or corporate strategies or corporate advisory. He has served and continues to serve in a fiduciary role as a non-executive director on the boards of many privately-held companies, representing the interests of shareholders and clients.
In 2018-19, He traveled the world with his wife visiting the “Blue Zones" of longevity. Chris and I will discuss a topic about Career choices and how the fear of lack of money and financial stability affect your career choices. Let’s get started!
Hi Chris! How were your Easter Holidays? I heard that you just want to spend time with your grandkids and family. How’s everyone doing? And you guys were in Bali right?
Chris: Yes we are in Bali. We have been here since November and I came here for some work related things I need to do here. I helped oversee Green school in Bali which is a great project started by a client of mine. And I oversee as a chairman of the board. Given the situation of Covid and all the challenges that many businesses over the world are facing, my wife and I decided to come here in November as based here while we navigate through Covid. But it has been a great place to be, you are right! For Easter Holidays my family is from the State, our older daughter who lives in America and she has 3 kids, so they came to Bali for a month which is fantastic over the Easter Holidays. And the elder of the 3 which is 3 years old, she actually staying with us for another 2 months since she attending Green School
Huyen: Oh that’s awesome
Chris: We are actually being parents again! It has been a lot easier this time, we are much nicer. It’s funWe were really enjoying the family time here and continuing. So we are in Bali right now until further notice.
Huyen: That’s awesome you know. When I’m here in the winter all I can think of is to be somewhere at the beach in Asia, I really miss the beach so much and the sun as well. So lucky you! For me Easter I went hiking on Easter morning. We went up to the mountain with my friend because we wanted to see the snow for the last time. But it was so cold and rainy, so I am really looking forward to summer now. Anyway I’m done with the winter and the cold!
Chris: it’s coming.
Huyen: I hope so. Anyway thank you Chris for your time today, I know you are busy and you have your grandkid there. You have been the source of advice for myself and I hope today you can share your wisdom and knowledge with people who are listening to this podcast.

Chris: I’m happy to be here.
Huyen: So to get started, can you please share with us your career journey so far? And how did you end up setting up your company in Singapore? And what are your projects at the moment?
Chris: Gosh it’s a lot! 25 years of career or more I think. I started my university studying path in Radio in Television, I wanted to go into career of making movies, I was a Dj on a radio

Huyen: What? I didn’t know that
Chris: Yeah, I said it because it is an interesting part of the story. It was really where my heart was at the time. That's what I wanted to do. Again this is a part of what we're gonna talk about today, because half way through I looked at the people who graduated with a degree like that and what kind of jobs they were getting, many of them couldn’t even get a job, they had to work in restaurants and such. And I got scared “What am I gonna do?”. I need to get out of school to earn money so I can live. So I changed my degree to Accounting because that is where I can get a good job. So I went to an accounting profession, which is now the Big 4 - Accounting Firm, it was a big … at the time.  I was working as an Orderer, straight out of University in Houston, that was 1990. In 1992, the Soviet Union just collapsed so the whole economy of Soviet Union was opening up. So my company was looking for volunteers to go to Russia to work, do what I was doing in Houston but in Russia. Frankly that saved me and allowed me to be able to do what I was doing. I was quite frustrated working as an accountant in Houston, what I felt was rather boring but I was doing it for the money. But then the opportunity came up, and I was thinking “If I continue to be an accountant and do a boring job, I might as well do it somewhere exciting” and Russia at the time sounded exciting. So I moved to Moscow in 1992, originally I thought it would be for a couple of years but I ended up in that part of the world for 15 years. Got married in the process, had kids. We lived in Russia, Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan. Most of the jobs I did were in the oil and gas industry while working at the same accounting firm for 10 years in Russia. And you were probably too young to remember the Enron Crisis
Huyen: I read about it.
Chris: Yeah people are studying it now in Europe. So the accounting firm I worked for was the Editor of Enron - Big global scandal…Everything was kind of thrown upside down. That was a catalyst for me to change gears a little bit. I spoke Russian by that time, so over the course of 5 years I worked for 2 different companies in the metal and oil and gas industry. I still did accounting, financial reports - basically being the bridge between the pure Russian side of things and the external side. Many companies were raising money in London so it was all of that era in the early 2000s which was an exciting time to be in Russia. And interestingly in that time I managed to make a lot of money, more than I could ever imagine I could have made. And my kids were at an age when one started to go to University, the other one was young and it was time to take them out of Russian school. So we decided to forget about working full-time and moved to America where my parents were at the time.
We spent a few years there and we decided to make our life around our kids. For the next 10 years of our life we built around where our kids wanted to go to school. We actually moved to Slovenia out of all places. Where I got involved in a school project. There was a founder of a school there that I knew there and he needed some help. We were there for a couple of years then we heard about Bali and a school called Green School which I’m still a part of as I mentioned earlier. We heard about that and decided “Let’s take our kids to Green School for a year!” to Bali, that was before we moved to Singapore. During this time we were planning where to send our boys to school and we really wanted them to go to an international place with a high education standard and a place they can grow up as young men. And picked Singapore, we picked a school there which we really like - this was around 8 years ago. Both of our boys finished school there then we decided we don’t want any more children who are living in the house. We became empty nesters. That’s the personal side of things but I said it first because for the last 10 years we have made decisions primarily around family and not professional life. Back when I was in Russia and made all of this money, I had a bit of an identity crisis as to what I was going to do with my life at that time. At some point I became crazy which my wife still mentions until now, “Yeah you went nuts when you got all this money”. It was the classic case of “Be careful what you wish for”, as professionally I have been working because I didn’t want to be poor, I wanted to have enough money. But I defined how much was enough for me. But suddenly I made a lot of money, “That was enough, now what do I do?” in order to what to do with my life. Which was really confusing because I have made every decision I made professionally because of the money frankly. It took me years to figure that out, like now I’m talking about it so obviously, in hide sight, but at that time I didn’t know that. It took a number of years, we traveled with the kids to places to put them into school. I tried different positions professionally while we were traveling, but by the time we got to Singapore I realized money doesn’t last forever, and it doesn’t grow on trees. I was only 40 or in the early 40s at the time, and I realized “might run out of money before I died so I started working again”.
So that gave me the opportunity to set up MarcWhittaker where we worked together a number of years ago. That was really an opportunity that came about because the founder of Green School - John Hardy, he is here in Bali. We met when I was living in Bali and he asked me for help with his personal finances, at the time he was going through a transaction in his life and he needed some help. So that idea came to me, I can use the tool as I know as an accountant - I didn’t love accounting but it’s still a tool that I have to use to help John to navigate in his personal finances. Sold his business, he was running Green School and wanted to take it global. He is a typical entrepreneur with a lot of energy, sometimes he doesn’t care so much about the details he just wants to get things done - which is great but he really needs someone like me, helping him to clean up his messes, take things forward in an instructive way, non-chaotic way. So that was the way that formed my multiple family business Marc Whittaker in Singapore, we had a few contacts of mine - people who were in similar places. Like some wealthy guys who need help with managing their funds and businesses - that’s why I based my business in Singapore around. I found my dream, I found a way to help people with their ambition without losing the skills of an accountant.



Huyen: I’m so glad we are having this talk today, I have known you for 6 years but a lot of your stories I don’t know about, for example you were planning to be a DJ. I remember one time we were in a club with your wife and you couldn’t even dance. So that came as a surprise for me
Chris: As I recalled you weren’t dancing as well.
Huyen: Yeah that’s true! You know me, I couldn't dance for my whole life, but you, you wanted to be a DJ - that’s interesting!Also it’s an interesting point that you mentioned when you had a personal crisis when you dream came true. It’s actually funny as people often set their goals and when they get there - my personal opinion would be: it should feel fantastic, it should feel great right? But in a lot of cases it’s contrary
Chris: It can come across contrary if your goals do not align with your values. I think even if you have a positive goal and when you achieve it, it will feel great for about 5 minute and then it was like “Well what’s next?”
Huyen: Yeah for example when I was in Vietnam, we went a bit sidetrack a little bit here. So when I was in Vietnam, my dream was doing an MBA and working in a international company in Europe or somewhere else. But when I got that - and you are right! - I was happy for like a day or so then I thought “What’s next”. I reached the goal that I dreamed about, so what do I do now?

Chris: And I think that’s the key thing to understand and accept as well, because it will be that way until we die. So for me at least, I set the goal and I know when I get there I will be asking “What’s next?” Then I set another goal and that’s okay. Sometimes it might take some time to figure out what the goal is but to me life is just a series of goals, that’s what gets me out of bed every morning. As soon as you lose motivation for life, it can quickly turn on you and end quickly, especially when you get old ;)

Huyen: Yeah of course, so the next question is: A lot of our viewers are people who are on their way to forming their career path or want to change their career path. So what you have been sharing with us is really relevant. In your opinion, what is the main criteria that people should take into consideration choosing a career path?
Chris: Well I think one thing you should be certain about is: What are you good at? Which often is the thing you like to do. I can say for me, having money is the primary driver that something at least you should be aware of. Money is a big deal, I don’t want to underestimate the importance of money in life because it really does make things easier, even necessary if there is enough money. But if the goal is just to be rich, I can guarantee it will not gonna make you happy. So there is the concept I learned from my traveling days - you mentioned I traveled to the Blue Zones before, I was in Japan and there's a concept named Ikigai, there’s a book called Ikigai. I didn’t prepare for this so I don’t have the exact definition of it but it's helpful when you need to make a career choice because Ikigai talks about what you are good at, what you enjoy doing and what you can make money with. Where there are those things, those key element intersec is where you can find your Ikigai or your purpose and is the reason you get up in the morning. It’s different to everyone, but money should only be a factor. Some people are just born into a wealthy family - well that is a whole other crisis for people potentially. But for most people money isn’t an issue so make it a part of the equation but don’t make it as a driver of the equation. I think you should really look after the things you are enjoying doing or you are good at to choose a career.

Huyen: Yeah, it’s interesting what you mentioned. One of my friends here gave a career in engineering to go back to school because she doesn’t like it even though she is very good at it. Another friend gave up a career also in engineering in Japan to come to Europe to become a full-time artist. So when people choose a career path, it comes down to: choosing from what you love doing or something that has potential income stability. In some cases some people might be lucky enough to have a career that can give them both, they can do what they love and make a lot of money from it. But I think those are the lucky ones, most of the time people have to choose. So you mentioned it earlier, can you elaborate if people have to choose then what it's gonna be?
Chris: I have always used examples of the rock star, right? Like Jon Bon Jovi who obviously loves making music, singing for the crowd, then gets paid 9M$ to stand up there and sing, do a concert. That’s a classic example of someone doing what he or she loves and able to get paid for it, have a very good living doing so. But I would like to challenge the notion of: Is it have to be one or the other? And if it does have to be, it may have to be but life isn’t just about one thing. Life isn’t just about having a job, I think we talk a lot about following your heart, following your passion which is all good. But unless you were born wealthy then you do need to make money. So I think it’s a little bit too much on promoting people should follow their hearts and not necessarily think about the financial side of things.

So I think if one can do both things in life, I don’t think it’s necessarily wrong to take a job that provides you a good life as long as you are not ignoring the other parts of your life which are things you are passionate about. For example someone who is passionate about music but for whatever reason or maybe they are not even good at it, they can’t pursue anything in the music industry, it’s very competitive business. So coming beyond that to saying: “You know what I’m still gonna play in a band down at the local bar on the weekend while I have a job as accountant or engineer to get paid” So I don’t think it’s necessary to be this or that, one over the other. But it is a difficult thing as a lot of people get told “Follow your passion” on one extreme. The other extreme is sometimes parents tell their kids “you have to be doctors, engineers, lawyers to support us in our old age. Because I didn’t have the opportunity like you do and you are wasting those if you don’t become lawyers or engineers”. So I understand that pressure from parents which is real.
Huyen: Especially in Asia, I’m not sure about other countries but in Vietnam it is very very real. Sometimes the parents will choose what major the kid will be studying or what kind of job they should get. I think the interfacing is too much sometimes, the pressure for the kids is too much.
Chris: right it is a big deal in Asia, I lived in Singapore for 6 years so I can see that, so called Tiger moms. It’s an issue even for wealthy families, they put pressure on their kids to do well, to have certain careers. I coached a number of people who are in that situation and there is not a right answer. The easy answer would be: “Follow your heart, don’t listen to your parents” that’s the librelated kind of “Me first” thing to do. But it is not necessarily the right answer for everyone. I mean for some people, depending on what their values are, they actually made a choice saying “I’m gonna do this, going to the family business for example even though I don’t really want to, I rather doing that” But they actually made a choice to do that because they value their relationship with their parent. Let’s be honest here, sometimes you will have to choose. Do I want to keep a relationship with my parents or do I say goodbye to my parents and go on to do my own thing. So it is real.
Huyen: You mentioned being aware and making a conscious decision and it has to be your choice.
Chris: That is huge and that’s something I have learned in my life recently only, in terms of almost anything in life that we are struggling with or not wanting to do, like “I’m not really want to do it but I’m doing it”. The thing is you alway have a choice, unless someone really holds a gun against your head and says “You have to do this” then there is alway a choice. It may come with a cost, for example your relationship with your parents, with your spouse, you know there are lots of potential costs of those choices. But actually being conscious of that then making decisions then the power is still with you, you made the choice yourself to say “I’m gonna stay in this relationship with my parents and do this” and that’s huge. And that really potentially changes your whole outlook, sometimes you complain about doing things in your life, when I this in my life I really changed a lot. Like when I say “oh I don’t want to do this” well if you don’t want to them don’t, but what’s the price you gonna pay? You would think if I don’t do that, then my boss is gonna fire me then I lose my job but I actually like my job. So you're gonna go through that decision making process and figure out what you really want. Then you can back it up and tell yourself “Ok then I’m choosing to do this even though I’m not like it but I chose to do it because I know the result otherwise”. And then you are the person who is in power, and that thing doesn’t have the power over you anymore.
Huyen: Well what you just said is already covering my next question, the question I wanted to ask was actually: It’s great and empowering to be able to make your own decision. The problem is - and I know from my personal experience - getting there, making the decision is hard. It’s easy to make a decision when you can make a Pros & Cons list. But when it’s not so clear just what Pros & Cons are, it’s just harder. The problem is we can’t know for sure what will happen. We can’t just go into the future and check what it will be like. And that is something I sometimes struggle with.  So can you please share more about this? Is there any strategy for making decisions?

Chris: It’s funny because I was just talking to my son the other day, talking about decision making. There is nothing wrong with making a Pros & Cons list, when you are making that list where are those Pros and Cons coming from? 
Huyen: well what do you mean?
Chris: Is it coming from your head or your heart? 
Huyen: Probably from the head. 
Chris: Again there is nothing wrong with that. Different people with different personality types analyze things, but the Pros & Cons are things that by definition are the things coming from your head, the way we think. And like you said, we can’t go to the future and see what might happen because that itself says if one thing happened it might change my decision. It’s a fear-based way of looking at things, it’s about “What if”. You made this Pros & Cons list, I’m gonna put 5% on this and 10% on that, basically you making a balance sheet to make a decision. And I actually think that if you want to get to the bottom of things, that won’t be the way. Most decisions we can make in life, we actually do know what we want. But we have to make passes to the head to get to the heart or the gut, you know we normally talk about “Well what do your gut say?”. That’s often hard for people to do, like yourself - who want to analyze things and make a list which keeps you in your head as opposed to making decisions from the heart. The first thing I would say, and I guess your next question would be “How do you get to the heart? How did you figure it out?”Well I would say first put down your pen and your paper! Again, it is ok to do that if it makes you feel better, do that. For me, the best way to come up with hard-making decision is to have a conversation with somebody. Whether someone as a coach or just a friend, ideally someone as objective as possible, not someone like your parents unless they are attuned to this thing. Ideally someone can ask you questions and have you say things from your heart not your head to come up with the decision, for me it’s really the key to make a decision is looking into what your heart got to day. Because usually we are the creatures, like animals in the forest when they get signals they actually know where the food is, where to go, who to mate with, where to find new food. We know all this stuff, but often the Pros & Cons list get in the way. 
Huyen: You are right, sometimes I think the list is made to convince ourselves from the thing that our “gut” wants to, it is what we want to do but our head tries to convince us it should not be.  
Chris: Or the head is scared of all the things might happen so you better make a list to figure out. Or sometimes you make the list just to convince yourself that you are right, which again maybe you are. But you gotta dig deeper than what the Pros & Cons list is saying. 
Huyen: I think that’s the very good point to not making decisions based on fear, because we can not let our lives be dictated by fear. That’s not how we should live our lives right? So I want to come back to the point you mentioned earlier saying: “We should not let financial insecurity affected too much our career choices” But knowing you I want to ask you another question, do you think it’s easier for you because you already have the financial abundance, so imagine you don’t have all this money and not where you are now. Let's say you chose another career path and now you don’t have the financial cushion like now, would you think that you would still be happy?
Chris: I hope so! Now I’ll be honest, quote on quote “having a financial cushion” - actually is something very important to me and I actually feel like no matter what position I’m in, I will work to check that box in my life. For me one of my core values is independence or wanting to be independent in terms of how I live my life, the freedom of going to different places and not being tied by an employer. I felt like an entrepreneur since the time I can remember. So that’s been very important to me, so I can’t imagine my life when I don’t have the financial cushion already and I’m working toward it. I feel good about working toward it. For me it’s a huge moment coming to understand this when I was in the car, strangely enough, and I have been struggling about with finance, this was after I made a lot of money but I was still afraid, because once you made money you will get scared of losing it. So fear it doesn’t go away, I know people with 100 million $ and they are not happy, they are afraid of worth 50 millions, the stock market gonna crash and they will lose 50 millions tomorrow. If that financial fear drives you then doesn’t matter how much you have. And that was the position I found myself in after I made money then I let the fear of losing it consume me. Wasn’t until - now we went back to the point where I was sitting in the car - when I said “Forget it, I just gonna lose all my money right now” and I shut my eyes - and no one told me to do this but I read about this after, I should have read a book. I shut my eyes for a few minutes and realized that I have lost everything. You know, no more money, all my worst nightmare in the sense came true: my wife left me, my kids became idiots for losing all my money and what am I left with? I was just me. And in that moment looking down to my hands and told myself: “I can start over, I can do this, I can rebuilt” I don’t how exactly it would look like or what I would do, but that point I was internalized that I have the ability to make money, doesn’t have to be millions, I have the ability to take care of myself and my family well, provide well. Just having that realization really changed things for me, is the big step of me moving away from financial fear. 


Huyen: That’s a very good tip. So you used negative visualization to get over your fear, I think I read it somewhere - imagine the worst thing can happen based on your fear then you realize it is not as bad, like you said you can always start over. Or if someone’s biggest fear is to lose a person then you can alway find someone else. 

Chris: it’s true, you actually go there. There is an impression that I used a lot with clients and my family is: “When it comes to fear, the only way out is through”. So whatever it is, jumping into the water, losing money… The only way to get out of the fear is to face it. It doesn’t have to be literal, it can be through imagination which did the job for me. 
Huyen: Right, very good tip. For my personal financial security is also very important, I’m not ambitious to become rich or anything like that, I just don’t want to live in fear of when my next meal is gonna come. Because it is very stressful, and also you mentioned something that I completely agree is that financial security is also the freedom to choose what you want to do. Of course I’m not yet where you are now, doing what I want to do.What do you think is the right balance between securing stability and not let the fear of money completely dictate your life?
Chris: Well I think the first thing is to face the fear and we already talked about that. To be honest with yourself and whatever that fear is, figure out a way even if in a mental way to go there and go through it. And the other aspect of it that we talked about before was the practicality of money, I mean they are needed to function in life, living in a nice place. So I think it’s really about being honest with yourself about that number, how much money do I need to make on a monthly basis to feel like I can have those things, do those things. It’s not the bare minimum but the comfortable minimum. And there is an actual number around that happiness point, the of the US University did a study on this and not many people know about it. It’s 75,000$ per year. 
Huyen: Yeah I heard about it. 
Chris: it’s probably hasn’t changed. That’s the number where you don’t have to worry about getting sick, and be able to feed yourself and have a bit to spare versus having to struggle. So be realistic about that number and how you're gonna make that money. Not everyone cut out to be an entrepreneur to set up their own business and have a website selling whatever they are selling in Tim Feriss’s style. Making 20,000$ per week on this… It may well be that having a stable job with an employer is the way to go. Now back to the decision making process. If that is what it is, make that choice and don’t resent it, you made that choice for a reason. So made the choice and be good with it. 
Huyen: Yeah, it’s true. It comes to the point when you made the decision you will have to make peace with that decision. Like you said don’t resent it, we made that choice for a reason. Wise as always!So actually I want to tell you about one of my friends - the one that gave up her engineer job in Japan and came to Europe to be a full-time artist. She is amazing, she is a singer songwriter and she does calligraphy and I’m actually in her course doing colorgraphy. But she still has sort of a part-time job which she is working for a trading Japanese company. So her approach is: she knows that being a completely full-time artist will not be able to pay her bill, she also takes a part-time job to get paid and she can work on what she loves like singing, writing and colorgraphy. It’s a nice approach, as you mentioned before, sometimes it’s not either or, sometimes we can do both: we are doing a job that we are not really like but we are aware that this job gives us enough money to do what we love on the side. Actually I want to know if you are still doing anything related to music?
Chris: Ah music, the Djing. It’s funny you say that, not consistently no. It’s still a part that is somewhat locked away for me. While I was living in Singapore I bought a piano for a while to play, but I found myself playing the same song over and over again and my family didn’t like that. And it was the time to hit the road so we sold it. But when I got to Bali recently I started to take Dj lessons for fun. So that was fun, it’s not something that I want to make a career even a second career out from. But in case I feel the need to do something with that so yeah. 
Huyen: Yeah why not, right? It’s alway something you want to do and it gives you joy so why not? And you are now one of the people that can afford to do that. To do whatever you want to do
Chris: Right, I know what I have been more aware of for the past few months was doing things I enjoy outside as well like diving, playing golf, those kinda things, I have been doing a lot of those things in Bali which is great. 
Huyen: Maybe one time when Covid thing is over, if I happen to be in Bali and you graduate from your Dj course. You can be the Dj for our private party. 
Chris: On a golf course, after diving, yes! 
Huyen: What is the general advice that you give to young people on their career path, or what would you say to the 20 year old version of yourself?
Chris: I’ll say, the first thing that comes to mind is “Don’t take things quite seriously”. You can relax from time to time, that’s something when I got into my career, I look back at something as I was a kid throughout highschool, colleague, doing things that I enjoy. When I got into a career I became more serious, just focused on making the money, “I’m gonna do this, carrying the weight of the world on my shoulder”. Then I became a more boring person, not living life to the fullest. There was a number of years when I was too focused on, again I’m not saying I should have done those career choices because they are pretty much a part of who I become. But I could have been a bit more relaxed. Honestly. That’s the main thing I would say. 
Huyen: So basically career is important but it’s not the only thing important in life. 
Chris: Absolutely!
Huyen: You also live your life beside your career, doing something fun on the side. 
Chris: again doing something fun or starting a family, then you can alway go back and continue to focus on your career. They brinked and their kids grew up and they realized it.
Huyen: I think it’s a bit of a sad life. I mean for the kids.
Chris: Can be for the person too. Nobody lying on their deathbed saying “I wish I earned more money” or “I wish I spend more time in the office” 
Huyen: That’s completely true. You know because we are talking about career choices today so I did a bit of research and I’m curious myself as well, but what would be a career field that still is good in the next 10 years? What are your guesses?I combined a few that I found on the internet.
Chris: So I think with the way the world is going, with technology probably going into blockchain, I would say crypto currency bit blockchain is better - that's the technology side. I think engineering, medical engineering will be big. The other thing that I think people underestimate is entertainment, it is getting bigger and bigger. My mind can’t still process how many TV channels are still available with cable TV… When I grew up there were only 3 or 4 and it is the world that has time to consume so much entertainment and it does. There are so many trends going right now. So being an artist like your friend is not a bad place to be. I think being an artist or having an artistic career will be easier in the future than it was say 15 years ago.

Huyen: I hope that is true because I know a lot of artists that have been having a tough time for the last year or so. Go back to the list that I found, you are right! Software, engineering, database and tastitic also is something that is important. And of course healthcare. Also teaching, so teaching, coaching. You are in the right place.And of course finance. But you are right about entertainment actually, that's an interesting point, maybe you should contact the writer of this article and tell them as to their list. Thank you Chris for today, it has been a great, very interesting point of view from your side and as alway you are very energetic and I love that energy and the viewers can definitely feel that.Thank you again for your time today, if you guys have any questions for Chris please reach out to us. If you have any topic that you want us to cover, please send us an email or to our website. 
Interestingly, our topic today is about career choices but Chris has covered other things as well like decision making, how to get over your fear. All very good tips. Christ will also be sharing more in details about this topic in his upcoming book “‘FLY' - An Empty Nester’s Search for Longevity in Life and Marriage”. Well it is upcoming the time of this recording but by the time we publish it, it will probably be published. I’m looking forward to getting a copy of that book. By the way, how is the book?
Chris: It’s the process I really enjoyed writing, it comes to 2 rounds of editing now and will receive positive review from 2 editors. It’s ready to be published, my next state will be working on the cover and get it physically out in the channel. So you get this ready and I get mine. 
Huyen: Yeah of course, I love reading your article in Linkedin when you publish it. I love your writing so I am looking forward to your book. It will be available on Amazon right? Chris: Yes it will. Huyen: Thank you Chris and thank you guys for listening!Hẹn gặp lại các bạn vào các tập tiếp theo nhé!