Huyen: Chào mừng các bạn đã quay lại với kênh Beyond Trà Đá của Trà My và Huyền Lê. Mình là Huyền, trà đá đầu cầu Frankfurt.
Welcome to Beyond Tra Da. My name is Huyen Le in Frankfurt, Germany.
Before we get into today's talk, I want to tell you all a little story about someone let’s call him A. A was an amazing student in school. He was destined for a bright future. He wanted to do IT but his parents wanted him to be a doctor. Pressure from parents can be very effective especially in Vietnam. So he gave up his dream to pursue his parents dream instead. He became a doctor, got himself a good job…Fast Forward to now, he is miserable at his job and starts to have depression.
This is not an uncommon story. People abandoned their dreams to follow someone else's dream, or simply they were too young to know what their dream was yet when they had to make a decision. But then, after years of study, people chose to stay in their field regardless of how unhappy they are.So, that is also the topic for our talk today. Changing your career path, it is never too late.We have a perfect guest for this topic today: Rebecca. She has gone through this herself and is here to share with you her story.
Hello Rebecca! By the way, did I pronounce your last name correctly? “Chia” Rebecca: yeah I mean you know me as Rebecca so :)
Huyen: So you are one of my longest friends here in Frankfurt, we have known each other for years and to be honest I have alway been amazed by how bright you are despite your young age. Can you share with us briefly about who you are and your journey before? And how did you end up at Frankfurt?
Rebecca: Yeah, so I originally come from China and I think people always have this stereotype about Asian having to be doctors or engineers, well I’m one of those. I came to Frankfurt in 2017 and I think we met one year later. I came here of course for work as most people do because Germany is not the most interesting country. I have an engineering background and I have worked as an electrical consultant for 4 years. I studied in the UK and after graduation I found a job in Hongkong so I moved there for 2 years. After that I relocated to Frankfurt, Germany for a project. That’s how I ended up here.
Huyen: So you mentioned you studied in the UK, why did you choose to study over there and why engineering?
Rebecca: I think a lot of people nowadays are still looking for a job to provide future security and if you study anything related to engineering or IT then you would get a secured job and your life will be simple. Also my parents are engineers so they had their influence on me to go toward the engineering field. But during my bachelor's I felt like this wasn’t what I wanted, well I took their advice anyway and went through the study then finished my Master in engineering and even worked for a full year in this field. And I still felt like this is not what I want.
Huyen: So you did really give it a try because you wanted it to work, you spent so much time on studying it right?
Rebecca: No I think the problem is you have to be clear if you really like something else or you just don’t like engineering. That's a very big difference between these things. Let's say if you just don’t like engineering then changing to other things might help but later you will find out that you also don’t like something else, you don’t like the other alternative.
Huyen: That’s a very good point. Because when you told me you want to start over at the age of 27, I was surprised. Of course I admire you for doing so but engineering is a very respected profession in Germany and you had a good job and good income. So for me it was brave to start over and change your career. What exactly makes you do so? You mentioned that you gave engineering a good try and you didn’t like it. But I know for a fact that it takes a lot of courage. You know a lot of people want to change but didn’t. So what made you do it?
Rebecca: I think probably because I heard my inner voice, I did my job pretty well and if I stayed in engineering I would have a very bright future. But still this inner voice from time to time just keeps asking: “What if I do something else?”. So I don’t want to hear this voice for the rest of my life, you know. I know it’s scary, 27 is not so young anymore and also not that old. And you are only getting older. I think I was in a good position to start over as well, I was single, had no kids and I didn't need to support my family so financially I was secure. So I can say I was in a good position to pursue something that I really want. Let say when you are 30 and have a family then you have a lot more to consider to make the decision.
Huyen: Right, you mentioned the little voice in your head, I think that’s very important. In Vietnam we also have a lot of pressure from our parents like there are certain kinds of professions that women are supposed to have. I kept hearing that being a teacher is suitable for a woman as I will have a lot of time for my family which at that point I didn’t have yet. But there was also a little voice inside my head that said: “It’s just not something I want to do”. I have nothing against being a teacher, my sister is a teacher herself but I know myself and this is not something I’m good at or something I want to do. Were you at some point scared because it was a big change?
Rebecca: Of course! I think people are always scared of the thing they don’t know about, something they can’t foresee. But I think it’s also about something to do with my personality. I think I’m more like a roller coaster person :) I like to take risks. To be honest I prefer to be non-stop than knowing my life has already been written. I can explore these possibilities, I think that’s charming.
Huyen: That’s what makes life more interesting in some ways because we don’t know what is going to happen to us right? You mentioned you take risks, but I think there are all calculated risks based on your personality. You mentioned that you really gave it a try to know for sure that engineering is not something you wanted to do. So that is calculated risk taking. But it’s true that most of us are afraid of the unknown, I think it’s brave to go for a change. We only regret things we didn’t do, not things that we did. So that’s something I believe in.Did you talk to your family about it? Are you close to your mom? Do you tell her?
Rebecca: yeah but only told them after I made the decision. Because when I first graduated from the Bachelor's, I already told them I wanted to study in Business and during my studying at University I already started some small business. Through all these experiences I finally found an area I want to enter and do in the future. My mom taught me to be a persistent person, and had to insist on one thing. You know all of these successful people stick to one thing and get right through it. I think that's a very important quality and I also tried to be that kind of person, so I tried hard in the engineering field even though I don’t like it. But I know there are a lot of trade offs in your life, really successful and you have a fixed track in you that you want to go, or you can loosen up a little bit and explore other possibilities.
Huyen: Well we talk a lot about success, but the definition of success depends on each individual. Your definition of success is different from mine or someone else’s. For me, success is when you go for what you really want to do and give it a real try. For people who are watching right now, find out your own definition of success, don’t base it on of other’s.
Rebecca: Exactly, I think one awful thing is pressure in Asia culture. This pressure makes you do things like everybody else and it just doesn’t make sense.
Huyen: Right? A lot of the time you do things not because you want to but because other people are doing it.With the help of social media, this pressure is getting worse and worse.
Rebecca: Yeah I think the same in China, like once you reach 30 you have to get married, you have kids, your car and apartment, have a decent job and make good money. The top would be working for the government. I think that’s a lot of pressure, it influenced people who don’t really know themselves yet, these people probably think that: “Oh this is might be the thing I want” but later on when they grow older, they understand themselves better then they realized: “Ok this might not be the thing I wanted”
Huyen: Thank you for sharing that. We should listen to ourselves and know ourselves. By being friends with ourselves, our thoughts then we can truly know what we want.
Huyen: Making any big change is difficult, not only mentally but financially you have to be prepared as well. Going back to school means you are not working and earning for 2 years and you also have to pay for school and it is expensive here as well. How do you afford it? Rebecca: It’s actually my big plan, I already started planning this a long time ago when I was still in Hongkong. I knew then I was going to study another degree in Finance, but the opportunity to move to Germany turned up so I took it. But still I knew one day I would do that, I started saving a long time ago so I can pay for my degree. But I also really appreciated that my family supported me financially as well. So now during my studying in Germany, you can work during your study so that can be an option to finance yourself.
Huyen: Thank you for bringing it up because it’s such an important point to consider. If we want to change we also need the means to change it. Imagine in your case, regardless how much you want to study, if you can’t afford it then you can’t just change.We covered this topic in one of our episodes on BTD podcast.
So you have planned this for a long time and saved money to make it happen. So that’s one point for everyone who wants to or think of changing careers, please pay attention to this as it is such an important point. So moving to the next part, I think this will be fun to discuss. How is it like going back to school for you? What are the fun parts and challenging parts?
Rebecca: I think going back to school is nice. I was really excited about it before the semester started. And then after, I realized: “OMG I totally forgot about painful experiences as a student. You know, countless homework assignments, constant pressure on exams, papers and everything”. But I think one thing I enjoy about studying is that you get full control of your time. You are investing this time for yourself, not for work or for your employer. It’s almost like you gained full control of your life, it’s something I like about being a student. It is also nice to be with young people again.
Huyen: It still terrified me thinking about school work, exams that I have to do during my Master's. Of course there were fun parts too, I was in Belgium and our classmates alway ran out to buy beer on Saturday. It was such a distant memory but it was also fun. Students have different kinds of worries, like getting a job, you are not so stressed out compared to when you are at work. That's my take on it, my personal experiences.
Rebecca: Yeah I think as a student you have less stress coming out from your performance. Even if you do an internship you would get pushed to provide an outcome that’s so important, or people will judge you or your boss will get angry at you. Everybody just expects you to be here to learn things. So as a student you will be taken care of instead of being the one who is responsible for things.
Huyen: So enjoy it when it lasts. I know that you are a very hardworking person, you already have a few internships and job offers before you graduated. So can you share some tips with people on changing career paths such as: what should they prepare and expect?
Rebecca: I think it’s always nice to plan ahead, to set your goals, try to find ways to achieve these goals. For example if you say you want to have a job at a bank but you don’t know then check out linkedin - it’s very popular nowaday, you can reach out to the people who are actually working at the bank to see what their CV looks like, what kind of steps they took. Normally people would put their past experiences on Linkedin as well, so it can be a good reference for you to know what kind of qualification is needed to achieve your goals. That’s pretty useful in planning a career as well.
Huyen: I think it’s very useful advice for not only people who are thinking of changing career paths but also in general students who are looking for a job in a certain sector.
Rebecca: I would like to add one more thing for people who want to change their career. It’s alway nice if you can find people who have similar experience to talk to, to learn how they did it. For me it was challenging as I don’t have anyone to get reference, basically there is no one who has had the similar experience. So I had to walk through the tunnel by myself and find the way. But if you know someone who had experiences then talk to them. You can learn a lot more on how to do it, Pros & Cons of these things.
Huyen: I got one thing to add here, building up on something Rebecca just said. Asking for help! In my personal experience, most people are generous with their advice, alway the one who is already going further in their career like in a senior position, they are very generous with their advice, so do reach out! You don’t have to know them in person, but just reach out and ask for help. I got help from people that I have never met in my real life, just through Linkedin. It doesn’t cost you anything, just ask for help. Moving back to our story about changing career paths. I have never asked you in person, is it worth it? Is it what you thought it would be? Switched to Finance because you have planned this for a long time?
Rebecca: I think you can answer this for me, you know my personality :) I mean of course it has Pros & Cons, you can always argue the good side and the bad side. But after you made the decision then just go with it, don’t look back.
Huyen: And also, what I realized is when we are stuck in a situation and when we are unhappy in a situation. First of all we know that we are unhappy. Then when we change we shouldn’t think back about the Pros and Cons and why we change. There is a reason for all of it. Because you were unhappy so you decided to change. That’s my thought about it.
Rebecca: There will always be “What if”, there will always be another alternative that we didn’t choose. There were definitely some hard moments that I doubted myself. But quickly after, just like you said, there is a reason why I did what I did. Probably after sometime you will forget why, but it was there.
Huyen: I mean if you were happy you wouldn’t make that decision, right? So there must be something.So any other advice on students or people who are confused by making some important decision in their life such as: changing career paths? Any general advice from someone who did it?
Rebecca: It depends on personalities, some people are cautious and for some like me are more adventurous. In general if you really want to try something new that you have never done before and you are scared then give it a try. It won’t kill you. I mean why not, life is short. But do consider the consequences thoroughly, consider people who are around you and how your decision affects them. For example I really appreciate the support I got from my family and my friends, and as I mentioned, I made that decision because I was in a good position. I don’t have a family, I don’t have any responsibility to others, so I think there are some practical considerations for people to make decisions.
Huyen: Right, thank you for sharing. To sum up all the things you said I would requote something I mentioned early: “We only regret the things we didn’t do, not the things we did”. If you want to try something new but you are not brave enough then I hope that by listening to this podcast will help you make your decision easier, give you that final push to go for it. But as Rebecca mentioned, be prepared to make the change, to face the consequences that might not be as you wanted or what you wanted to be. But in the end, there is a reason that makes you want to change, and the destination might not be the one you want to be but the process of something makes it all worth it. So thank you Rebecca for sharing. For our audiences, if you guys have any comment, please reach out to us via email beyondtrada@gmail.com. If you have further questions for Rebecca then send it to us, we will transfer them to her. Thank you and see you in the next episode!