S6E04 Milano Unfolded with Evelien Reich

Together with design hunter Evelien Reich, we dive into the essence of Milan Design Week 2025. She shares her favorite installations, the standout colors, materials and textures of the week. Which are the key themes that defined this year’s edition and how has Milan Design Week changed over the past years? Listen to our conversation on all that is Milano!

Evelien Reich is the editor-in-chief of MANERA Benelux, a new English-language addition to the MANERA family, that is set to launch in September. With a decades-long career in media, she has built up extensive expertise in design and interiors. Evelien is a sought-after host at design events and is known for her sharp eye and deep understanding of interior aesthetics. She has a particular passion for the power of color in homes—how it shapes atmosphere, brings joy, and makes spaces feel alive.

Transcript

Judith van Vliet: Good morning everyone and welcome back to the fourth episode on the Color Authority podcast for 2025. We just all came back from Milan, at least most of lucky ones. We just came back from Milan and that's why today I'm going to be speaking to Evelyn Reich. She's the editor in chief of Manera Benelux, a new English language addition to the Manera family in Spain, Spain and Mexico, and is set to launch in September. She has a decades long career in media, has built up extensive expertise in design and interiors. I'd call her a design hunter. She's a sought after host at design events and is known for her sharp eye and deep understanding of interior aesthetics. She has a particular passion for the power of color in homes, how it shapes atmosphere, brings joy and make spaces feel alive.
Let's listen to her and see what she saw in Milan that was of interest.

Good morning, Eveline. I hope you're well and I welcome you to the Color Authority podcast.

Evelien Reich: Thank you for having me. It's a pleasure.

Judith van Vliet: We were just talking about how we are still recovering from Milan. I think Milan, we're going to talk a lot about Milan, of course, but I think Milan is getting crazier every year.

I think just on the Tuesday, there were over a thousand events. Oh, what were your first impressions?

Evelien Reich: Yeah, I keep, I keep joking that I should look into either getting a hologram made or, you know, looking into cloning so that you could be in like different places at the same time. It is indeed a crazy week and it seems to be getting crazier. Some of that's good, some of that I'm not too sure about, but I was certainly an eventful week and my feet have just about recovered. But yeah, no, it was, it was good to be there.

Judith van Vliet: Yeah, it's always good to be there. I think it's. Well, we're going to talk about that in a while. I think especially it's common ground for the whole world to meet because I think you got people from China, you got your friends, your professional friends from Australia. There's the Mexicans, there's the Colombians. Everybody's there.

Evelien Reich: Everybody's there, indeed. And I try to keep enough space to meet new people. The people that I already know. Oh, from the Netherlands or from England or from Spain. It's not that I try to avoid them, but this is the place where you can actually meet new people.

Luckily, that's still a possibility. I had the pleasure of connecting with new people as well. So you can sort of expand your worldview. I think that's really important.

Judith van Vliet: No, exactly. Well, before we're gonna tap into what we saw in Milan and you know, the new, the novelty, perhaps also things that you were like, okay, I'm gonna skip that part.

Next year, we are also gonna talk about color. Cause that's what the podcast is called. You know, we are gonna talk a bit. A bit more about color, but first I wanna know what color means to you personally, Evelien.

Evelien Reich: Yeah, color is. Is one of the most important things in life, I think. I. I try to imagine sometimes what my world would look like if. If it wasn't there. And then it just, you know, the.

Drains it of life. And so I like to surround myself with a lot of color. I'm in my home right now, and when we, when this house was built, we sort of made a.

A game of it to avoid using what is in Holland, the norm, which is the RAL 9010. So there was no white in our house. And that actually forced us to think about what we like in color and which colors do.

Do we feel comfortable with. And it turned out that I like, and luckily my husband as well, we like quite moody colors. These sort of new neutrals, I guess, so like a moss green and a blush pink.

And it kind of envelops you like a, like a warm blanket. So color is incredibly important, and I am really heartened to see that this is.

This is an idea that is spreading that people are incorporating color in their life more and more, not just in their homes, but also in their wardrobes.

I think it's really not just fun, but also important to find out which colors do something to you, which colors make you feel happy, which make colors make you feel comfortable.

It's part of becoming a functioning adult, I think.

Judith van Vliet: Yeah, I love that color is. So the color application is being part of being a functional adult. I quite like that.

Evelien Reich: But it's the same thing, like if you are, if you grow up, then you figure out what kind of music you like, what kind of food you like. And most people aren't chefs and, or normal musicians, but they still know what kind of music or what kind of food they like.

And then sometimes people are flabbergasted when you ask them about color and they usually refer to something. They go, I'm not an expert, I'm not a designer. And then I'm like, well, how does that matter?

Like, you get dressed every morning, you figured out what you feel comfortable with, you know, presenting yourself to the rest of the world. Why not Expand that and look what color can do in the rest of your life.

Judith van Vliet: Yep. I think that's the issue about trends. I think when people, because a lot of people hear about trends, but also color trends and they feel that they have to apply those.

And when they're not an expert in them or knowing how to apply them or knowing what they are, they're like, okay, I'm just gonna sk the whole part. That's not what color is.

You know, color is not just what trend is. Color is obviously exactly what you said. It's emotion.

Evelien Reich: Well, it's not just that. And if you talk about trends, then I always like to think of trends as a reaction to what is already happening in society.

And the trick is to find out what it's referring to. Like what is, what is color reacting to?

I always find that to be an interesting puzzle to figure out what is happening in the world and how we are responding to it. And color is one of the most immediate things that we are drawn to.

So if you just pick a color because it is on trend, then you're not really delving into what that color means. It might sound a little philosophical, but there is a sort of Newton type action reaction that we have with color, which I find infinitely exciting and interesting to investigate.

Judith van Vliet: I think also that that also happens with design and shape and material. You know, round shapes, edgy ones, you know, whatever we're looking at. And you are a design hunter, you know, and that's what you do.

I mean, I call you a design hunter. You hunt for what is new. You hunt what is different. Sometimes it's not always new, it's just if, like it's put in a different jacket.

You know, what, what do you search for when you're looking for something that's new or different? How, how does that come about?

Evelien Reich: Oh, wow. Yeah. I sometimes refer to it as my sort of internal bingo card. So, yeah, so if you are at an event like Milan Design Week and you walk around, you start to notice sort of common threads.

If you pay attention, you will see things pop up again and again.

If you see something once, you might like it, you might not. That's sort of a lizard brain reaction to it. If you see it three times, then it's time to start paying attention.

If you see it nine times, then you can consider it like a fully fledged trend that will have an impact on the market and on, by extension, our lives.

So that is what I do. I try to. I'm kind of like a collector. So I, you know, I'm in a little basket and I walk around and I think, oh, this is fun.

This is. And then all of a sudden I think, this is like the third time I've seen this thing. And then I kind of. My. My ears just ***** out and I just kind of go, all right, this is time to pay attention and to sort of look out for it and to avoid this sort of confirmation bias where you only look for those things and ignore everything else,

really. Just looking for something that'll see what I mean. I was right all the time, which, you know, can happen. But that's kind of what I look for. I look for the things that stand out, things that I.

That may be presented in a different way or. Or things that. Like, there's this weird thing that happens. Like, no matter if we are across the world, we are all responding to the same elements in the.

In the universe, in this. In this world that we live in. And so people oftentimes respond in quite similar ways. And that's how these. Doesn't matter. If it's a designer from Mexico or from the Netherlands or from Asia, it doesn't matter.

They all respond in similar ways. And so you get these similar trends popping up again and again. So that's kind of what I look for. I look for the similarities and try to find these.

These threads to combine them into my own personal super string theory.

Judith van Vliet: I love that. And when you look into color, so obviously, because, as you said, color is one of the first things we notice, and that is obviously also, you know, they've.

They've confirmed that it's the second information that arrives to our brain. So it is very impactful. When you look for color in design and also interiors, because obviously you're very much also in.

In interior and architecture world, what do you look for that you find really new? Like, because, you know, color, you can't reinvent color too often. It's more the application that you can reinvent.

Evelien Reich: Yeah. What I noticed recently is I was reminded of something that a designer from Sweden, her name is Tekla Severin, she said once during a talk, she said, I tried to combine something dirty with something flirty.

And for the longest time, we had a lot of very clear colors. And so what I found really exciting this year is that there was this little bit of dirty coming in, and it was combined often with a. Like a texture, like a pronounced texture, whether it was really fluffy or grainy, and then combined with something really clear. And so this sort of grit that was coming in, which makes Things a little less polished. I think for a long time, things were quite polished and very, very clean.
And now we've tried to muddy the waters a little bit. So that's something that stood out to me, that there was quite a bit of that. And I thought that was really.

There was a sofa design. It's designed by a Dutch design jeweler called Raw Color,
and they presented it a number of years ago, but it was now presented in this very gritty, fluffy fabric that had, like, a myriad of colors in this one fabric with a lot of black at the basis of it.

So that gives it this little bit of grime. And it was presented on this bright blue floor. I thought, oh, that's new. I saw it quite in a number of places. Edra as well, had fabrics that had this depth to it. So if you make a fabric very cleanly with, like, a minimal amount of different threads, then you kind of. Then it becomes quite flat. And for a long time, we loved this sort of flatness to it. It was just this solid block of color. And now these fabrics are getting some depth again. And, yeah, this was something that I found that. That stuck out to me when I look at.

Judith van Vliet: Also listening now to you. And I think we all know what's happening geopolitically, obviously. I mean, there's something we can't ignore. Absolutely. And it's influencing everybody. It's that darkness to color, the dirtiness, and also that grittiness.

I think it's coming through a bit of the darker times that we are living, but yet there's optimism, you know, because there's the flirty color, as you said, there's the clean colors as well.

So it's. I think it's an interesting period of time in design and what's happening color wise and the combinations.

Evelien Reich: Yeah, And I think this year. Last year as well. But this year it was very pronounced that we were sort of looking back towards. Looking back to the 70s and the 80s, which were also times of quite extreme turmoil worldwide.

And so it isn't weird that we refer to these times in our past that remind us of this status in, like, the. Whether it's the political or the environmental. When I grew up talking about the environment, this was quite a new conversation, but we talked about it incessantly.

And now this is come to the fore again. And so this is just one element, but we are looking back a little bit towards that time, and that is also influencing this Prevalence for these type of colors, but also finishes.

So this combination with quite a. You know, quite a lot of glossy finishes combined with. Yeah, I see you laughing. But like this. Like, the glossy finishes, definitely. Where I live, like, there's a. I saw a table in this caramel color, a Tacchini, and, oh, my, I'm already married, but I might divorce him just to marry that table.

I think we might be quite happy together, like, for the rest of our lives. I think we could do it. Yeah.

And so. Yeah. And so there is this sort of. And I think that's also something I haven't seen for a while, is that design is quite sexy again.

Yeah.

And it was really inviting. And this combined with this love of set design that is now in Milan everywhere.

I think, for instance, the show that Di Mora Studio did with Loro Piana is a very clear case of one that they would love to make a movie. And I would say, go for it.

We need something in this line. But also this love of set design to completely envelops, like, us and reminds us that these places are for living.

Judith van Vliet: Yeah, yeah, definitely. Well, talking. I mean, we're already talking a bit about the things that we really love, but what was your.

You know, on my Instagram, it put the top 10, but in the end, it's five. The ones that I truly loved.

Evelien Reich: I'm really curious to hear what you liked. If we agree on things, let's. Oh, it's gonna sound maybe a little too obvious, but the installation by Hermes, I thought, was a step that it's in the same space that they have held this exhibition for years and years and years now.

So, you know, the space. And so this year, what they did is they took away that space and they made this white box with these floating columns that reflected color underneath.

And it reminded me instantly of the work of James Turrell is all about color and our perception of it. And so you weren't immediately presented with the objects that they've also developed this year.

Those are all at the back, but if you just looked in, there were just these floating shapes that reflected a color, like a red and a green and a blue.

And I thought it was so striking just to take away this entire space and just to refocus.

Yeah. Our mind and our. On this. On just this color.

So I thought that was really striking. What did you think? Did you like it?

Judith van Vliet: I actually. I put my phone underneath to see how they did it, because obviously I was. I mean, that's just the color girl in me. And I was like, how did it.

Evelien Reich: But apparently a lot of people. There were people lying on the floor trying to figure out how.

Judith van Vliet: I was like, are they going to arrest me now? Like, do they even want us to? And I was like, they were fine with it. So luckily they were fine with it.

But it's. I think it was.

I. I didn't quite. Like last year.

Evelien Reich: Okay.

Judith van Vliet: Although it was very material,

but I was a little bit like, okay,

this time I was. I like. I liked how architectural. It was architectural, very clean. And I liked the simplicity of it. I think. I think that's. That's what I. I liked.

I think that they created the surprise effect with color, which I think what everybody's looking for.

Evelien Reich: I think that there were quite a few people sitting on these steps on the edge of this space, just looking at it just yet inviting it in. Just this. The installation as a whole, which I thought was very clever.

And then if it's. If we're just talking about. That's just the presentation,

but there's also these sort of single products.

So I was at the fair, it was an Irolucha year. And so there's an Australian band called Recumba, and they have a collaboration with Studio Truly. Truly, who are also Australian, but they live in Holland.

So I claim them as ours. And they have this beautiful light made from wool.

And I think wool is such an interesting material because right now, wool on one hand of the spectrum, it is a waste that sheep farmers don't know what to do with.

They have to get rid of it. These sheep were raised almost engineered that they need to get rid of this coat, but farmers have to pay to do that. They won't get any.

They won't make any money off that wool. And then you go all the way to the other end of the spectrum, and then you're in a store and someone says, this is premium.

This is 100% wool. And I don't know how that happens. I don't know how we allow that to happen. Right now in the Netherlands, we destroy about a kilo million and a half kilo of wool every single year.

And the excuse is that it's not good wool, but it's just because we've lost the ability to do anything worthwhile with it. And so I'm really excited by the fact that a studio like Trudy.

Trudy has taken this material and actually highlighted it in a. In a beautiful lighting design that it was also, if you touched it, it's like this soft ball. The entire stand just turned off.

Which I thought was really. It must have been terrible to work there an entire week, like lights going on and off all the time with people touching these balls. But it was just stunning.

And so that there is room at a commercial fair for this type of storytelling to highlight this material that we really need to reexamine, which is used more and more also not just outside of fabric, outside of products, but also inside.

Because actually, you know, inside sofas, it's. It's an amazing material. You could use it for a number of applications. So we need to re examine it and sort of rediscover it.

So that's also something that I really liked. It's not just about like these big installations that have this wow effect, but also like these small, smaller stories that I. I think if you take the time to discover them, are really worthwhile.

Judith van Vliet: Yeah, no, no, absolutely. I think I haven't seen it.

Evelien Reich: That was like my number two.

Judith van Vliet: And then number two, which of three.

Evelien Reich: I really liked the Muto apartment.

This used almost like a single single color per room, which was, I thought was outstanding. And not in an obvious way. They weren't all the colors that you've come maybe to expect from the Danes.

And so on the other side of the spectrum, there was an apartment called Casa Ornela, which was very, very busy. They had a Mediterranean theme this year. They've done this for a few years now.

And this was just fabulous.

If you think that you are in a house and you think that you've done too much, I suggest you look up pictures from of this apartment because you will realize that you were about like 10% in on what is, you know, where you reach the limit, where you think,

well, maybe now we've gone overboard. There was everything. There were stripes and there was a geopontesque ceiling, a mirrored finish on a beautiful kitchen with a hob over it. Like it was in a sort of also this caramel color.

It was just like, let's just do everything. Let's just do everything and see where we are. There were tigers. There were these poofs made of rope. It was just everything.

And it blended together fantastically just to.

Judith van Vliet: See tigers in more places. Now that you mentioned tigers, I saw it in the Drowlers apartment, which was also fantastic. That's in my top five. And I saw also, I think, Lidwa Edicort at Rosanna Orlandi.

I think there was a tiger in one of her carpets as well. So it's interesting that the tiger, for some reason, you know, it's. And it's not the year of the tiger, so let's also make that clear.

It's not. It's funny that the. I saw several tigers.

Evelien Reich: Yeah,

it's a good. It's a good animal. And it's also something that I really like that you just now reminded me of is this.

This sort of tequila sunrise effect.

So there was. There's still quite a few gradients around, not as many as before,

but there's like one that is now being used all over the place. And it goes from like a sort of citrusy, like a limoncello yellow to quite sort of almost like a pink key orange.

And I was thinking, oh, this would look great anywhere but where I live.

Because I think sometimes we like to use these strong colors and then, you know, the light that we have in the Netherlands doesn't really allow for it. I have. My sister lives on a tropical island.

She lives on Curacao, and so her children grew up there. And my niece has an amazing sort of color style, but she likes all these super, super bright colors because she's used to the effect it has when you have sun on a bright color.

And so they look sometimes a little out of place here, but she doesn't care. I think that's just the most fantastic thing. Just so these are my colors. I grew up with these colors.

I feel comfortable with these colors. I'm going to live with like orange and apple green and bright blue. I think it's just amazing thing just to find out where you.

Where you live, color wise.

Judith van Vliet: For fifth, which one, which is your last one that you would put in.

Evelien Reich: I have to give a little shout out to design duo called Rive Rochon, who were showing in not one, not two, but three places, and all of them outstanding. So they showed a number of objects at Resona orlandi that were 3D printed with sand.

It's by a German company called Santhelden, if I'm getting that right. And they had this beautiful. Also a little bit of a gradient finish.

And then for their next,

they took over the fountain at the big palazzo at Alcova. And this is like a half circle also with this sort of takiya sunrise gradient. And it wasn't just like a beautiful object, it was also a solar panel.

So when everyone, you know, left at the end of the day, that thing lit up and it's just stunning. They actually work with a glass factory in the Netherlands. The factory makes all their glass pieces, which they.

They make. They work with glass a lot. And so the son of this Company is actually. I think he's studying engineering and figured like maybe we can make solar panels a little bit more interesting.

And so he's now patented this new.

I have to refer to him about the technical aspect of this. But you're actually able to make these beautiful objects and not just have be like a black finish or you know, like a print.

This was like through and through. So I think there's films in between, but it was stunning. And then three, it was the 10 year anniversary of the studio exhibition in Cinque Vie, which is a really great sort of.

It's an area of Milan that has sort of grown over the. Over the last couple of years to real prominence. And so they had a beautiful installation combining not just their own pieces made out of glass, but also light and music.

It's just. Yeah, I think a lot of people had that. The experience, it was quite. People always say it's an immersive experience and this was actually an immersive experience that I thought was stunning.

And I have to just say one more thing. On my first day I had. I arranged for some bikes and then the first day I had to sort of road test them a little bit because I was the one who took them out of the boxes as well.

And so I did a little ride around Cinqueville and I went to Boon Room. Yeah. Oh my God.

This only happens in Milan that you find a former bank building that isn't in use, is still in its original. It has all the original features and they all look fantastic.

And then you get and light and boom. Broom taking over this place and just filling it with the most fantastic furniture. Yeah, that was like, wow. Really? Yeah, it's really great.

If you like your first day and the first thing you see is like spot on. You think, yeah, this, this will do. This will do just fine.

Judith van Vliet: Yeah. So that was like a functional, timeless and it's material. And I think those are three so important keywords when it comes.

Evelien Reich: Yeah. And also I think to just add to that.

I think it's really funny that in a year that when there's the Luce at the fair that there were so many outstanding lights in town as well. And the use of light was so important in a lot of exhibits.

I thought that was. Yeah, that stuck out to me because.

Judith van Vliet: The Muto apartment, which also I like very much because they adapted the light to the season that the room was projected in. So autumn had a different light. So the whole sensorial part I think was.

Was really, was really, really trending. What Colors. Did you really see? Because you said caramel, and you're definitely in love with caramel. That's clear. What else did you.

Evelien Reich: Yeah, there's a floor in my house that will pretty soon be painted in that color. I think I'm just gonna give a little moment. I think I have to convince my husband that it needs to be gloss as well, because I think I'll just look.

Fabric. How do I put this color? Use of color is in,

like, how we. It's quite cyclical.

So we go round and round and round. And so we are now in our warm. Warm. I think maybe at the warm most phase of where we are,

you know, that we are just at the tipping point. I think we are just like, if you went to this fair, and I urge anyone who's listening and went and they have to look in their pictures and go looking for the blues, because you won't find a lot of them.

There were not a lot of blues anywhere. And if they were blue, they were like a really warm petrol blue. So we are now in this phase where we were in love with the burgundy and the caramel and the browns and the yellows.

There's a lot of that. And then we kind of throw in a little bit of this sort of. That's, like the only blue. There was like, this Eve Klein blue.

This is very, very strong, but, like, not a lot else. And then combined with.

I. I was quite surprised that there was still this.

How do I. How do I describe this? It's like a. It's a very, very, very light, but very punchy pistachio. Does that make any sense?

Judith van Vliet: Yeah, I saw it was the mood color as well, you know.

Evelien Reich: Yeah. And that's been. That's been around for a while. Just like the. This butter yellow. All right. I have to tell you, like,

I think maybe eight years ago, I went to visit Kvarad in Denmark,

and it was like, if you've ever been, if you've never been, you should definitely swing an invite to go see them. And so we got the whole tour, and we're in the studio, and there's all these people working on, like, the new fabrics and the new colors.

And the head designer said, yes, I really strongly believe in butter yellow.

I remember going home thinking, well, you know, that was fun, but body yellow, like, who's going to use that? And completely, completely missing the mark on that. Like, absolutely. That's like a thing that's been going on for quite a while,

and it combines very well with all these other colors. So there's like a.

Almost like a grimy eau de mule, like a green, but it has a little bit of. And so I think that's why it's still kicking around, because it combines so well and also because I think it's a really good alternative to white.

I think that's also why that that very light green is still around, because it's.

Judith van Vliet: It's.

Evelien Reich: You can use it as a base on your walls and on your ceilings, and it won't be white, but it would still be light. I think a lot of people still like most of their rooms to be quite light, you know, apart from me.

And so, yeah, so those, I think, were the standout colors. Also this Bordeaux red. And so I'm really curious to see what next year whether we will invite these cooler tones.

Like, there is a coolness because, like, also, like part of this sort of, you know, trend. Bingo. Like, I defy anyone to find the gold at this fair because there was silver everywhere, but there was no gold.

Judith van Vliet: Like, because it was smattering of copper.

Evelien Reich: But, like, the gold was gone.

Judith van Vliet: Yeah. Look at the price of gold. I think that's logic.

Evelien Reich: Yeah. But also this idea of using gold seems. Seems wrong right now. I think that has a little bit, like, this ostentatiousness that sometimes we identify with the use of gold.

I think we're just not feeling it.

And also, the use of metal in its rawest form also relates to this idea of it being like, there's a lot of aluminium being used right now. And one of the reasons that people like using aluminium is because it's 100% recyclable.

So it feels very much like a sustainable choice. So you can make it part of a. Of a circular production. And so the best way to use it then is in its purest form, which is to not do anything to it.

Now, I love me some anodized colored aluminium. I really do. There's a studio in Rotterdam called Studio Loop Loop, who do amazing things with plant dyes. You should everyone, like, go grab your phone and look it up.

But that's also something that I. That I really liked. This use of this really cool metal, it gives it a bit of, I don't know, a bit of toughness that I think we need right now.

Yeah. What about you?

Judith van Vliet: It's a mix. Well, I was just going to comment about the gold thing because when I was in Art Week Mexico in February,

for obvious reason, it's the continent that produces most of the gold, you know. You know, Latin America. General, there was a lot of gold because there were the Bolivians, there were the Colombians, and they obviously all had silver and gold in their artwork.

So that was interesting because art obviously probably is a longer investment than the design piece. So that was interesting. I think that's what makes it different. You're close to the source, it might be cheaper.

And also, art pieces are obviously not always also produced this year. I mean, they may, you know, have been produced a couple of years ago, I think definitely what I saw is a lot of the warm cold.

So the cold didn't come from the color. The cold came from the chrome,

aluminum, the reflective surfaces.

But then it was mixed with the fluffiness. There was so much fluffiness this year, wasn't it? Like this, the Morozo,

the Niloufar, obviously exhibition. It was all. I mean, you even had to put on sockies, you know, to get into the. Into the space. And I think that's interesting how there is more contrast with the shiny metal and then.

Which is obviously also cold, even a touch. And the warm fluffiness. Like lily teddy bear style.

Evelien Reich: Yeah, yeah. Like, almost like.

But this,

it had almost like a Muppet, like,

texture. You know, muffins are. It's not like a fake fur, per se, although the. The nidophy that you referred to, that was fake fur. But this, it had a bit more stringiness to it.

In. In the most places I saw it, they were like, ah, that's like Oscar, you know, the Muppet from the Sesame street who lives in the bin. This one is very old reference because I am advanced in my years, I guess, but that's what it reminded me of.

I really like. I really like that reference. I'm just quite happy I'm gonna stick with it. Yeah, but that's true. That's true that the gloss was coming from. From something.

The. The coldness was coming from the material itself. That's a good point. Lots of mirrors as well. Lots of mirror finishes as well.

Like, very interesting.

Judith van Vliet: Yeah, it's all reflective. You know, it's a reflection of where we are, where we're going and what we want. I mean, that's a little bit how I always see reflectiveness and light, because light was.

Obviously, there was a lot of different ways to design with light. What did you think, shape wise, what was happening? Shape wise,

There is still a lot.

Evelien Reich: Of this organic form around.

But what I found interesting is that there seems to be sort of a return to a bit more formality,

if that makes sense.

This also connects to the fact that a lot of brands are showing fewer new pieces,

which I am very happy about. Like, at my first real Solana, which is a long time ago,

I had the pleasure of speaking with Patricia Acciola, who at that moment said that she would be quite happy if Solana took place once every two years, so pieces would have time to find their way into the market.

You have to see something a number of times before you actually find a place for it. Like, you think, ah, this belongs here, or this is how I can use this there.

And that goes across the board. Whether it's lighting or furniture or even the color, it takes time. And so if we keep bombarding the market with new, new, new, new, more pieces, like, lots and lots of pieces, you get a market that's inundated, and lots of these people don't.

Lots of these pieces don't have time to connect with its, you know, audience, which is, I think, also a reason why still, a lot of these classic designs are still doing so, so well.

But I was quite heartened by the fact that brands were showing fewer pieces or just decided to forego new pieces and just focused on how they presented them, to use new fabrics and new finishes to make people look at them with new eyes.

So I know, I've forgotten your question. Does that make sense?

Judith van Vliet: No, it was on the forms and shaves.

Evelien Reich: So we are reinvestigate still, still, still reinvestigating these, these classics,

looking at them again.

And that means that we are moving away from a lot of the sort of blobbiness. I mean, it's still there, but I think we are sort of rediscovering that, you know, a chair can still look like a chair.

And this also is something that I. And this might just be me, it might just be wishful thinking on my part. But for a fair number of years, the design community as a whole has had decided that if someone was going to change the world and was going to save everything,

it was going to be design. Like, completely forgetting that there are also, I don't know, engineers, doctors, scientists, like, artists, like, that maybe a little humility might be okay. Like, we need designers, we definitely need designers and we need companies and we need manufacturers and we need all of it.

But the only reason that's going to work,

as we work together, and it doesn't mean that design just works with design. We have to connect to all these different industries.

So the great thing about Milan and a lot of other fairs is that they have now incorporated a lot of talking and A lot of connecting. And so you see that also in the design.

So there are a lot of designs that actually cater to this connection. So circular sofas where you can gather and talk about how we are going to save, you know, this,

this, this ball of rock. And so I think that's quite interesting. But this humility also comes into like what we, what we actually put out.

And to re like this, I was, I visited the fair of Arco. It's a Dutch brand and they recently required the rights to a design that was originally made for Pastu.

It's called the Vision Cupboard. And it went to Arco because the designers wanted it to go to Arco, which I thought was like the greatest compliment.

And this factory actually went back to the drawing board and said, okay, so how are we going to make this cupboard? It's made out of blocks and you can basically make your own.

It's beautifully made.

And what they did was like some was made with MDF and now they want to also make it like in, in wood, like it's all wood.

And so you get all these beautiful finishes just to fine tune these designs and make them like more than they were. Tufti Time by Patricia Keola has been re examined to make it, give it a bit more depth because for tall people, like, you know, most Dutch people, it was like a little too,

it wasn't deep enough, so lacked a little bit of comfort. And so this reexamining and just to sort of say maybe we should also work on ourselves a little bit and what we've already put out, I thought that was welcoming, that was like really, this is like a welcome change,

I guess. Yeah.

Judith van Vliet: I think coming back to your comment, like you could just also do Milan biannually. I fully agree with that. And I think also honestly speaking, if you skip Milan a year, you're not going to miss a lot either because in my very humble opinion, I do think that it was harder this year to find what was different.

I think there is a lot more chaos and that's the lines, it is the amount of people and it's sometimes also I feel brands are just trying to scream very loud without having the substance.

And I think getting to the nitty gritty was a little bit more difficult. And honestly speaking, I felt then we need more sustainable projects as well. I think that was removing again away from that.

And I think that is a, a dangerous direction for a fair that every year produces so much. You know exactly what you said. You know, you, we need time as consumers to absorb Something and then we're already planning Milan next year.

You know, they already have the dates out. So everybody's like, you know, yeah, yeah, it let's.

Evelien Reich: I understand that the city of Milan, Milan relies on having this fair every year. It needs it.

And I, I bumped into Marcel Vanders on the street across from Louis Vuitton. There's a huge queue outside.

Judith van Vliet: His beautiful black jacket. Yes.

Evelien Reich: And he actually the brand Moy was showing at the fair for the first time and they now have a permanent showroom in, in Milan as well. So they've actually grown up a little bit.

That's what he said, I think. Yes.

And I asked him like, what he thought about all these exhibits that have these long, long lines in town.

And he said like this, these, all these exhibits in town, they don't exist if there isn't a fair. The fair is the thing.

And you know, if there's like, if you, if nobody comes to the fair, nobody actually buys things and you know, if there's dealers and, and all, all these, then you're just left with, with these exhibits which might be lovely to, to visit, but they don't like in the long run maybe mean that much.

I personally would. And this might be controversial. I'm so sorry but apologizing in advance for saying this, but I could do without the Google like these kind of exhibits, like they're night.

But I don't really understand what it has to do with what I'm there to do. And so that is part of it. Like a lot of people are showing up to visit these large installations which might be fantastic to view, but maybe have like these companies don't really have a role to play in what that event is actually about.

Range Rover was like, spend this money on something really, really worthwhile for most people. You know, like that'd be great. Like, you know, spend the money on, I know, curating your own platform to make sure that, you know, we don't get inundated with AI websites.

I don't know, it's just a thought,

but I think that that has a lot to do with it to actually get back to what that event is actually about and to build out in a way that is sustainable for the long run.

So I would be very happy.

Who was this I heard from? Also a Dutch designer, Heli Ohirius. Someone ran into her, I think two years ago and asked her had she been to an erosion Orlandi.

And then Helen said, oh no, no, no, I only go to the.

I come here only for the Talks. Like, I've seen the stuff. I'm only gonna go to, like, the places where we can actually have a conversation. And that'd be really great.

It'd be really great if we could sort of divide it. Maybe we could even do, like, one year you have only this sort of talks, and the other year you have, like, the stuff.

And then we'll give everyone a bit of a breather.

I don't know. Just the thoughts, like, consider it. Like, I'd be. I'd be quite happy to do that. I have to. Maybe this won't make it into the podcast, but I have to mention something that I think I'm still upset about.

And so there was a. There was an installation by Paolo Santino at the fair,

and so we had to show up early. We were told to show up early, and we got into this long, long line,

and as press maybe, you know, sometimes you.

Judith van Vliet: Annoying.

Evelien Reich: Yeah, it's. Well, when you can sidestep it a little bit. But we have to get in this line. We get into finally, finally, finally get to these sort of sliding doors.

It turns out it's an elevator. The elevator goes up, I don't know, maybe a meter off the floor. Not even that. I could have stepped. You know, I've done. I could have taken that step.

And so we look past, and I just. We just said, like, listen, this thing only takes two at a time. Like, this is a fair that attracts 400,000 people, like, every edition, and you design an installation that only takes two people at a time.

Like, even, like, do the math. This whole experience, like, if you went through the whole thing, I won't spoil it for anyone, but it really wasn't worth it. And then to be told when you came out that the whole point was that it was about the sort of beauty of waiting.

Judith van Vliet: And I'm thinking, exclusivity, what they do.

Evelien Reich: Yeah, but it's. I was there to work.

Like, why am I standing in line for, like, an hour just to be told that actually, you know, the. This waiting is, like, a part of life and whatnot. Like, I already knew that.

And I didn't need, like,

Paolo to tell me that at the fair where I had, like, a number of appointments. Sorry, small beef. Like, if he wants to reach out and tell me why it was actually worth my time and everybody else's, then I'm happy to hear about.

But, God, please, no more installations like that at the fair, because that is the. That is the place where we actually need to see. I mean, not just the Products, but also the people.

We need to have time to talk to you. So I went to the fair like twice, like spent an entire day there and I still hadn't seen everything.

Judith van Vliet: And I think this, it's the exclusivity which is getting an issue for Milan. But we are happy that we went and we had.

Evelien Reich: Yes, we were very. Yes. And I saw, I connected with so many great people and I saw a lot of good,

good, even great exhibits with fantastic use of color,

which we can then build on. I think in our prospective roles like that we can translate into thing into. Into our own, into our own jobs.

Judith van Vliet: Tying that into talking about roles and excitement and new journeys. You just embarked on a new journey and it's. September is going to be an exciting month for you. Tell us a little bit more about this, you know, super announcement of the Benelux edition of Manera.

Evelien Reich: Yeah, yeah.

For people who don't know, I was running El Decoration in the Netherlands for about nine years,

and when I left last year, it was, I guess, time. And sometimes when people leave a job, they think I could maybe do something completely different, apart from the fact that after about three weeks I had the pleasure of meeting Enrique Pastor, who's the founder of Maniera.

And we, the first time we spoke, we spoke, I think, for about three hours. And then when we departed, we just turned to each other. It's like, so. So we work together now, I guess, and we were just like, yeah, yeah, we are.

I've very rarely in my life met someone who I had this instant connection with. Like, it was. Yeah, it was kind of amazing. And so what we decided on is to build on what they've already, like Eric and his team in Spain have built with Monera is, I think,

a fantastic new media title which takes everything about that edition. If you hold a copy of Monera, it communicates that it takes the subject matter, its readers and the people who contributed seriously.

And I think that is sorely needed in this time that you actually have like a magazine in this case that takes time to show you, to tell you these stories.

And so we are launching the Benelux edition of Manera, which will be in English and will have international distribution, just like the Spanish does. Yeah, I think it's really exciting.

And we are now,

like I told everyone, like, after Solana, we will sort of decide what will go into the first issue. And it is now officially after Salona. So I came back and I had 300 unopened emails from people saying, so it's up to Solana, like, so what are you going to do?

And it's all good. It's all good. I am enjoying this entire journey immensely. Like, every day is an absolute joy, and I'm really happy to be part of this new family.

I think that what you can do as media is not just inform the public, but you also serve a community.

We do that through print, but we also do that through design. I have some ideas on a podcast as well. So who knows, you might be part of mine in the near future to cater to that connection and to show people what is happening in this industry that we.

That we love.

There are a lot of people out there for whom design and interior, it is their whole world.

Judith van Vliet: Yeah, true.

Evelien Reich: And, yeah. And I don't care if those people live in Paris, in New York, in Amsterdam, in Madrid. I don't care. I will serve them, like, to the best of my abilities, together with the team that we've put together, just like Anglic does with the Spanish title and Maria with the Mexico edition.

And so, yeah, it's been. It's been really great. That was also one of the things,

the standouts for Milan. I got to spend a lot of time with the team from Spain, and I also brought some of my own team members along. It felt like we're building this new family.

And so if anyone's out there thinking, I should be in Monera, you should reach out.

I love hearing from people. I love people showing me their work and see if we can spread the word. The idea is to tell primary local stories, so I want to be able to share a lot of what is great about the region that I'm in with the rest of the world.

Our primary focus will be the Benelux. But, like, if you. Yeah, like, in September, if you're at Barnes and Noble, New York, you can pick up a copy of Monera.

You have to. All right, so this is final anecdote. So I'm listening to a podcast, right? And it's with Nancy Pelosi, speaker of the House, former Speaker of the House in America.

And she wrote a book because she'd been in Congress for eons.

And the interviewer asked her,

what's the special source? How come you were so successful? And she said, well, I'm not the person who knows every bill in and out, and not everyone likes me, so I'm not super convincing.

He's like, okay, but that makes it even more impressive. I still don't know why you were able to do this. And then she says this. She says, I know better than most people when it is time to make a decision, and then I make it.

I don't always know if it's the right decision, but I know it's time to make a decision.

And so then the action lies with me because I'm the one moving,

you know, this thing forward because I have made this decision, and if it's not the right decision, that will become clear very, very quickly, and then I just make another.

And that whole idea has been living rent free in my head since I heard it.

So I am now sort of, and I invite everyone to do the same, is to be aware of when it is time to make a decision and then just to make it, because it is always very hard to figure out what the right decision is.

And you can, you know,

think about it forever, and then you're still not making decisions and nothing changes. So I'm very happy that when I met Enrique and he asked me to come on board, I just said yes.

I said yes. Ridiculously, like, almost embarrassingly quickly, I was like, yes, yes, I'm doing this.

Judith van Vliet: What happened to you is Enrique happens. Because Enrique to me, and that's just what he does, you know, that's his superpower, I think.

Evelien Reich: You know, I think so. I think so. He has this knack for connecting with people in a very profound way.

Judith van Vliet: Thank you so much, Evelyn, for being on the Color Authority. Journey to everything that is color.

Evelien Reich: Oh, you're so welcome. So it was an absolute pleasure speaking with you, and I hope people will find it interesting and they should let us know. I think so. You're on Instagram.

I'm also on Instagram, so I'm Evelyn Reich. I E I C H. Just let me know, like, if you think I'm talking out of my behind, then just tell me what I'm getting wrong, because that's also part of life, to figure out the things that you're not getting right.

All right, thank you.

Judith van Vliet: Thank you for listening to another podcast of the Color Authority. I hope you enjoyed it. Please rate, comment and feedback the show. This is now a beautiful option on most podcast directories.

So let us know what you think, and next month we will come back to you with another colorful episode.