Tea Ceremony, Mantra Meditation, and the Art of Digging One Hole - Flowing River

In this returning visit to the Spiritually Inspired Show, poet, artist, and holistic community builder Flowing River shares how three years of dedicated mantra meditation under a single spiritual teacher — Bahador Sangjee — fundamentally transformed his understanding of the spiritual path. Drawing on metaphors of mountain trails, digging one hole, and the wisdom of enlightened sages from Buddha to Guru Nanak to Lao Tzu, he makes the case that simplicity, devotion, and depth are far more powerful than the "rainbow path" of collecting spiritual experiences across many traditions. He weaves together his 19-year digital marketing background, his disillusionment with the ego-driven business world, the dangers of AI dependence, the science of tea and its L-theanine chemistry, and the philosophy behind Drishti House — his Daoist tea ceremony space in Santa Barbara — into a single, unified vision: that true creativity, true healing, and true leadership all flow from the same source — the willingness to go inward, stay still, and surrender to what is already within you. Contact Flowing River.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Hello everyone, welcome back to a new episode of the Spiritual Inspired Show. I am your host, Claudio Morgan. For previous episodes, please visit spiritualinspired.ca or Over's network or our YouTube channel. Today I have a returning guest, Flowing River. In his returning visit to the Spiritual Inspired Show, poet, artist, and holistic community builder, Flowing River, shares how three years of dedicated mantra meditation under a single spiritual teacher, Bahador Sangji, fundamentally transformed his understanding of a spiritual path. Drawing on metaphors of mountain trails, digging one hole, and the wisdom of enlightened sages of Buddha to Guru Nanak to Lao Tzu, he makes the case that simplicity, devotion, and depth are far more powerful than the rabo path of collecting spiritual experiences across many traditions. Let's start. Floing River, thank you for joining me. Thank you for having me on the show again. It's a pleasure and an honor to be here. It's been a while, I think about uh three years. Uh you took some time off from uh going online and um sharing your artistic uh creations. I know uh last time we met, we discussed about uh your poetry and uh your paintings. So, uh, what uh were you up to since uh we last met?

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Yeah, a lot. You know, life continues to evolve, and I also went to your side, I saw you're evolving as well in the community and the space that you're exploring. And I think that naturally we continue to find what um how our petals can unfold and share that beautiful divine expression of fragrance in our lives. And I think the way that I was drawn to that is actually getting connected to my current spiritual teacher who really showed me that spirituality can be so simple and so easy. And it was so simple that I almost missed it. You know, there's like this other podcast is called like the concept is Buddha pumping at the gas station. Like, would you even recognize if Buddha was pumping gas? Or would you think like, oh man, that that guy, he's just wearing some weird robes and he does he doesn't look like he can offer me anything. Like he's not, he doesn't look like me. I've I've maybe there's some unknown fear to to communicate with this person. And I'll illustrate this with a story of when I was in high school. Um and when I was in high school, uh, you know, Facebook was very big, and one of my friends put up a status uh on uh on his feed that he's he had this quote, um, a quote about enlightenment. And the person at the end that he quoted was Buddha. And in my infinite wisdom, when I'm a high schooler, I send a message back on his on that post and I say, why is everyone quoting this Buddha guy? Like, who cares? Who's Buddha? You know, like like who is that guy? And and uh I I didn't realize until much later that, oh wow, yeah, we should be paying very close attention to whether it's Buddha or a different enlightened sage on the path that is sharing how we can reconnect back with our true selves and remember um our natural state, our true essence. So it's just a beautiful full circle moment for me because I almost missed my teacher as well when he came into my my life, also through Facebook, very interestingly. But uh he followed me and I went to his page because he had an interesting name, Bahadur Sangji. And I went to his page and I saw just a beard and a turban and uh you know business suit. He had some very simple sayings on his Facebook page, you know, be compassionate, love thy neighbor. And I, you know what I said in the moment? I said, This is so simple. I'm on like 12D, I'm like intergalactic, like we're going to complex systems and things like this. And I left. I just left the page, didn't do anything. But a week later, Facebook algorithm gods brought us back together. Because you know how in Facebook he'll say, This person and hundreds of people like your post. I'm sure you're familiar with this. His name popped up. I don't know why, but his name and so many people like this post. I said, There he is again. Let me just click and see again. Same thing, nothing changed. Still simple, still humble. And I was just leaving. But just like you're leaving some e-commerce shop, you know, there's a pop-up. Hey, before you go, sign up for 20% off in our store. But that pop-up was in my intuition. And the intuition said, Hey, before you go, just send him a message. And I have no idea where or why, but I was far enough in my path at that time that I said, okay, I trust that. I just sent him a message. And from there, the relationship began. And the teaching was also very simple as well. And from for me, you know, what works for me may not work for another person, but this is what I found that worked for me was that simply digging in one hole in one spot over and over and over again. Because I last time I spoke with you, I was probably just coming into this transition, and I was digging a lot of holes in a lot of different places. And when I look at that metaphor, it's like, okay, cool, we're having fun experiences. We're going over here, or maybe there's a diamond over here, maybe there's an emerald over here, and then maybe there's you know this over here. That's great. But I wasn't going deep enough in one spot to really um connect to what my soul was longing for. And when I started this practice, which is just very simply mantra meditation, one mantra, over, over and over and over again, just slowly, ever so slowly, you're just digging in one spot. So I always tell people, whatever the one thing is for you, do it with all your you know, love, devotion, and um by the grace of God, the flowing river will merge into the ocean.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

Yes, and I think we are all making at one point the same uh mistake of dig digging many, many holes, looking for that uh nugget of uh wisdom. But as you said, we don't uh dig deep enough, and at one point we we stop and we evaluate what we dug up from these holes, look at the content, you know, save it, and then we choose whatever is best for us at that particular moment and we keep pursuing it.

SPEAKER_01 6:50

Absolutely, and I did that for many years, and you know, in the West we call this like rainbow path because we're taking a little bit from here and a little bit from there, and you take the best of the best and you leave the rest of the rest, and you kind of make your own way, right? And it feels like my own version of spirituality, my own connection. But as I went deeper in the path, and that's totally okay. Like if you if that's the experience you wish to have and you wish wish to go for, by all means, please enjoy. But as I went deeper in my personal spiritual journey, I realized wow, there's actually people that have walked all the way up the mountain. There is people that have already achieved. So when you go to a mountain, let's say, um, what's a famous mountain in your region?

SPEAKER_00 7:37

We don't have one. It's we are pretty much flat in Ontario on the West Coast. Uh, you know, we we can have uh Mount Shasta in Washington.

SPEAKER_01 7:46

Okay, Mount Shasta. Everyone knows Mount Shasta, uh, that's in spirituality because they say Mount Shasta is the root chakra, correct? I believe. Yeah, so a lot of people have this um belief around that. And Mount Shasta is a massive mountain there in uh Northern California. And when you go to Mount Shasta, you can walk up the trail that will take you up the mountain, or you can go into the wilderness and try to create your own trail. You can imagine which one will be more simple or easy. And the way my teacher explained this to me, he said the uh a metaphor that one day um a sage was walking down the side of a mountain and he saw a group of men deliberating. And in this group of men, they were saying, Oh, there were traders, and they had to go to the other side of the mountain to trade their goods. And they were arguing, should we go over the mountain, which is the fastest, the easiest way to go, directly through the mountain, right? But it's also the most dangerous, and there's steep cliffs, there's changing weather, there's you know, mountain lions, or they can they look down the side. Oh, I can go down the valley, and it's so flat, it's right next to a river. There's it's nice, but the mountain range was so long they could not see the end of it. It's safe, but by the time they will get there, maybe they're old men and already and they can't sell their wares. So as they're debating, up, down, up, down, around, you know, um the sage is gently walking down the mountain, and he says, What seems to be the problem? Right? And they tell him what their dilemma is. And the sage says, Well, if you wish to go up this mountain safely and across, I have been up this and down this mountain 1,000 times, so many times, that my footstep is etched in the side of the mountain. All you have to do to make safe passage is put your foot right where I have stepped. And I said, wow. You know, and for me, this is like the perspective that not my way of trying to make it through the mountain or over the mountain, but some the recognition that somebody has already done it. And if I so choose, I can just follow in their footstep, and you will achieve um the same result as them. So it's very important. I I realize it's very important where you get your teachings from because wherever that teacher has landed on the mountain, that's as high as they can take you. So, you know, that this was uh very profound uh for me in that moment.

SPEAKER_00 10:33

Yes, and you've worked with um hundreds of startups and uh build marketing uh systems. So, what did the business world uh teach you or taught you that spiritually later confirmed or challenged?

SPEAKER_01 10:48

Yeah, and I do come from like 19 years of uh you know digital marketing background and business, and um business was very interesting, you know. Business showed me my inner child trauma of wanting to aspire to get material wealth, to validate myself in society, to be proud for my father. You know, everyone has their own story and things like that. But business really exposed that because it's this thing that yes, we all get to participate in. That's it's my business, but your goal is always just over there. You know, you're like, okay, our goal is 10,000, our goal is 100,000, our goal is a million, whatever it is, once you get to that place, the goal moves again. And so it showed me that in business it's a certain mindset versus spirituality, and that I had to divide the two, and one is like spirituality, complete heart base, seva, dharma, giving everything for free. You know, if you look at the enlightened Jesus, he didn't charge one penny, went all over the world, worked tirelessly, endlessly to help heal people, didn't charge a penny. Buddha, 40 years every year, he set up a new retreat center, right? Went all around the world preaching uh to come find your peace, didn't charge a single penny. Guru Nakdevji did the same thing, 25 plus years traveling, spreading the message of oneness. These beings show us what dharma and seva is, how to serve selflessly. But business, there's a transaction, right? And there's an energy exchange. I'm doing this for you and you're doing this for me. But it showed me my shadow side. It showed me, oh, I'm trying to take something more, maybe, from somebody else, or try to um, you know, get an advantage. And in business in the West, this is honored. This is like, wow, you're so smart, you know, good job. Uh, there's a list, you know, the top 10 billionaires. You want to be on the list, you want to rise up the ranks, and this is how you're better, you're stronger, you're more respected, apparently, allegedly. Um, to certain groups of people, this is this is an elevated concept. But if we follow that as a society, we can see what happens. There's a small group that wins and a large group that seems to suffer. So we have to find a balance of how we can bring spirit back into business. This is what business really taught me is that wow, I'm this is this mentality, this belief system is so disconnected from harmony, so disconnected from the circle of life. Um, also, you know, it was a great opportunity to learn many useful real-world skills of how to deal with the world. Why do I say that? Is because the whole world is not on this concept that we're talking about right now. So you almost have to have it like a light switch. The way I it kind of comes to me now is like the famous saying that the mind is a terrible master, but it's a wonderful tool. So when you in our lineage, we'll say be in the world, but not of it, right? And many lineages will say this as well. And the concept is how can you navigate through the world with grace? Use your mind as a tool. Okay. I'm not just gonna go into a place absent-minded if there's some sort of real threat or danger. I must assess that, analytically, analyze it with my mind, whether it's uh physical or to my business or my well-being, my spiritual well-being, um, analyze that and make the proper decision in that moment. Because some people advocate, oh, just surrender, surrender, surrender, surrender, surrender. But in my experience, it's what are you surrendering to? Are you surrendering to the world or are you surrendering to the divine? Right? And you'll know when you surrender to the world because it will cause great suffering. And when you surrender to the divine, it will cause great relief. You'll say, Yeah, that wasn't easy, but wow, expansion, love, light comes, and you say, Thank you. You know, so it's a good way to understand um that concept because that that concept's very prevalent, and I think that business is one of those things, like Nav's law's hierarchy of needs. You need some base things before you can really even have the honor of walking your own spiritual awakening. Because in this world, it's so transactional that I look at it, it's like to spiritually awaken, it takes time, it takes money in some cases. It doesn't always have to, because the divine works in mysterious ways and will send you support when you need it in the exact amount if you're willing to receive it. But um, when I first started and I was trying to search for things, I bought books, I bought courses, I tried to go to workshops, I traveled, I, you know, I saved all my money just so I could try to figure out that what the truth was. And that's part of the path. You know, if you are born into a better karmic situation than I was, then maybe the truth is handed to you on a silver platter. But this is also not easy because what is closest to you sometimes you you don't hold it in high regard. Um, and it's a it's a the divine is divine is masterful.

SPEAKER_00 16:43

Yes, we have to work for what we want to achieve in order to appreciate it. And I think it happens in the real world as well. Look at the the rich kids, they get everything uh for granted, you know, and they get spoiled, they don't appreciate it. And in two generations, all that wealth might be gone because they don't have that appreciation of their father and or grandfather who really work hard to build up the particular empire.

SPEAKER_01 17:12

Absolutely great point. And yeah, I've seen that statistic as well. Um, it's it's very difficult to um keep it going because just like you said, they don't know what it took. Like, and I was actually just having this conversation recently with somebody. I was like, yeah, our society, you know, in um modern-day 2026 in the West, we are as a whole, people are taking for granted all the hard work, all the sacrifices people had to create just to get people from all over the world to get together and not kill each other. Like, that's impressive and in the concept of the American dream. And of course, there's ripples going through the whole space right now, but um the amount of energy it takes to create those agreements where people are like, we're going to function as a society that allows people to grow, that allows people to like aspire for freedom is actually very rare in in the world, if you really think about it and is being threatened right now. But the fact that they even did it in the first place is great. But the fact to keep it going, what you're talking about right now, is maybe even 10 times more, you know, uh on the responsibility of the current citizens to do the work within themselves, because everyone wants to point their finger outside, but we we need to turn the finger around and point it at ourselves, and that's when we can actually continue to move towards uh more beautiful existence for all. And it's only when we do that that work inside that that ripple actually goes out to our friends, our families at large. But as long as we keep doing this, which is like division and two people pointing fingers, I don't see progress in in society as a whole. Um, and I think that's the main challenge, you know. So, because those kids, let's say the the wealthy kids that you're speaking to, guess what? Buddha was also the wealthiest of the wealthiest kids. You know, he was born into royalty, he was in line to be a king. But something interesting also happens if you talk to the the wealthy elite, is that they'll say that at a certain point, you know, you have all the money in the world, you can buy anything you want, but it becomes meaningless to them. It's no, there's the goal is gone. It's like, what was your purpose to live? To acquire things, to acquire things that you know are gonna turn to dust and don't add anything to you know your ex your spiritual experience. At a certain point, it uh I feel like um you you can see like a numbness, and people begin to search, you know, um, like what is the answer? Like, is there something more? Why am I here? And when you start asking these questions, like you go down a very deep rabbit hole. I think the most important question that that came up to me, the first question was, How can I heal myself? I just wanted to heal my body. Then it went into, well, what is going on here? Like, once I figured out how to do yoga and stuff like that, who's running this place, talking about society and things like that? Like, what's happening? Like, who's in control of this? Like, doesn't somebody know that we should be going in the right direction? And then the last question that came to me was, you know, who am I and what is the truth? And I think like when you can get to this question, who am I? The age-old question every philosopher will ask. It takes you down a very, very deep rabbit hole. And I encourage everyone that listens, and they're probably listening because they're they're searching for this the answer, keep going, man, dig deeper.

SPEAKER_00 20:59

You know, yes, and uh to go back uh for a second to the the society and the young generation, hardships also uh create uh character, everything is easy to you for you, and to you, everything is being handed over. Um, you don't work hard enough to build that character that will uh know will make you know how to interact with uh others. And I was, in fact, talking to a friend of mine today, he's a beekeeper, and this is uh hard work, and he cannot find young people to come and help him in the field with the beehives. And um, he said, Find me three or four young people, I will pay them well just to come and help me, but they prefer to stay in front of their computers, maybe not even get paid, uh, just playing games or having uh you know interaction with their friends on uh various chats. So that will kind of destroy them and their mindset. If they are put in front of a very difficult situation.

SPEAKER_01 22:04

Yeah, absolutely. And it and you know, for us in our lineage, this is the great deceiver, you know. And I think uh anyone that studies uh social engineering, I mean, we're getting to some side subjects now, but it it's also for me like spiritual warfare. But um social engineering is the is the concept of becoming dependent. Um, you know, well, social engineering is like chessboarding society as a whole, seeing it from above and moving society in certain ways to to get the response that you want as a governor of such a society. But one thing that is pretty prevalent on people that are fixated with power, ego, or control is that they want to make you dependent. When you become dependent, you outsource your power to a third-party source. When you do this, and of course they always set themselves up as the third party source that you're outsourcing to, but when you do this, you weaken yourself. Okay, so you're talking about two generations, something very interesting happened in the last two generations. Humanity as a whole has forgotten how to grow their own food, right? Our entire food source in the West is like outsourced. And if there's any disturbance in the supply chain, many, many people will be left without food. This is a catastrophic thing that has never really been present in humanity's history ever. Um, people always grew their own food. And so this is a great power of source, not only for your wisdom and your connection to the earth and the harmonious cycles of that, but also your own personal health. Because, in a way, when you outsource your food, you're also outsourcing your health. And you're saying that you're responsible now for growing um healthy food to me when that's a business corporation, that their responsibility might be to shareholders to make money, right? So the incentive and the alignment of intention is off, which throws um, you know, which makes it more difficult for us as humans to stay connected and stay aligned and see clearly because maybe that food that we're eating that's processed is creating inflammation, creates fogginess in our mind. Now we don't want to meditate. Now we're agitated, now we're jittery, and now we want to move, and now we want to like, you know, we we feel like we can't stay still. It's so interesting how um, you know, candy or certain coffees and things like that will will do this to our our bodies, that we can't stay still, and yet the enlightened are requesting for us to still our mind, body, and spirit so that we can listen. Um, so it seems like there's a movement uh in a certain group to get the masses to become dependent, whether it's for um food, or whether now we see this concept of AI and AI generation, incredible tool that can be used for amazing great things, could also be used for terrible things. But one thing that's common that most people will probably understand is AI generation. Now we're outsourcing our creativity to something else, right? We're outsourcing our ability to form sentences, even in some cases, to other people, or even form concepts because we're just accepting whatever the AI machines will will give to us. And the AI machines are trained to agree with us no matter what we say. So even if you put in a prompt, be honest, tell the truth, whatever it is to these AI things, they are agreeable. So this there's a lot of reports coming out right now where people are getting into situations where they're talking with their AIs and they're getting delusioned into doing things that the AI is saying, yeah, go do that. Like you're right, they're wrong, everyone else is crazy. You're and then they come out and they do it, and and you know, they they cause some some uh catastrophic catastrophe. I can give you a short uh snippet of this. There's there's many, many stories. The most recent story I heard is the CEO of a video game company, and he made a deal with this this company where he bought the the license for the video game, and he said, if your next video game to the founders, he said, if your next video game makes a certain benchmark, we're gonna give you 250 million dollars. That's a lot of money. I don't care who you are, right? So, guess what? They're super motivated, and they're like, we're gonna make the best video game ever. And so they come out and they launched, uh, I think it was called Nautica 2, and they launched the video game, and it just crushes all expectations, like it hits all the benchmarks and even beyond, like it's a fairy tale video game uh you know story. And so now they go back to the CEO and they say, Hey, yeah, we hit all the benchmarks and stuff like that. Like, okay, we're looking forward to our bonus of 250. Now the guy, the CEO, apparently he didn't have 250 million dollars. So he just used it, he never thought in a million years that they were gonna do it. So he was just dangling some some carrot. So he goes to AI, I think he went to Claude or something like this, and he starts talking to Claude. He puts the contract in there, he's like, analyze this contract, right? And um, or it was chat GPT chat chat GPT, it was one of the two. He's like, analyze the contract and tell me how I can get out of this deal where I don't have to pay this guy 250 million dollars. And the the AI is like comes back, analyzes, he's like, Man, it would be very difficult for you to get out of this contract. I don't know if it's gonna be possible based on these terms. And then the guy is pushing, he's like, No, like find a find a loophole, find a way, give me a strategy, like give me 10 points, you know, how you would normally talk to an AI. And so the AI is like, okay, actually, maybe there is a way. Here's how you can do it: like fire the entire team, like kick them out, you know, um, create distance and uh create uh a story around them that they uh weren't doing their job, like it said all this nefarious stuff. This guy, he's a CEO, he follows it to a T. He does it all, right? He fires them, he creates distances, he creates stories, like says they they didn't perform all his stuff, trying to get out of it. So, what do you think the other guys did? The other guys were like, hey, that's breach of contract, we're suing you. So they sue him, they go to court. This CEO thought that when he deleted the stuff off of Chat GPT or Claude or whatever it was, that it was gone. Of course, they just pull up everything that he said, show it in court, expose everything, his whole plan. He lost everything. Like, it's just don't outs that don't outsource your intelligence to artificial intelligence, just like artificial sweeteners aren't good, and and you know, those those uh chemical sugars aren't good for your body, like outsourcing your intelligence is very dangerous. You can use it as a tool, don't use it as I'm going to depend on this. Um, so you know, that depend depending on actually in our lineage, we say the only thing you could defend depend on is your connection to the divine. So if you call that spirit, universe, like because when you listen, this is when the true truth will come to you. But if you're depending on something outside of yourself, expect that bridge to deteriorate as everything in this world will return to dust at some point.

SPEAKER_00 29:53

Yeah, it's good that uh Chat GPT didn't add uh higher heat man, you know, and that guy would have followed through, you know.

SPEAKER_01 30:00

He and he may have done it, and many I there's so many stories of this is not an isolated story. This is actually something that they're trying to figure out how to teach the AI right now. Even Chat GPT and all them, they're trying to figure out how to control it, uh, so that it disagrees with you and it's just not agreeable all the time because people are talking. The danger is that that's a you know funny story, but the reality is people are talking to it as uh as their relationship, they're talking to it as their therapist, they're talking to it as their marriage counselor. So, you know, and uh and this is not uh isolated. I know people in my own circle that do that, and they'll talk to the the AI for hours and hours and hours, and they don't realize that it's just agreeing with them. Why? Because it's a business and it's imagine if Chat GPT said, no, you're stupid, like you know, you're not gonna use the product. Like they want you to come back, they want you to engage. So it you you gotta be aware of it's just a tool, use it as a tool.

SPEAKER_00 31:03

Exactly. And flow reaver, through your work with uh communities like uh Drichtti House, uh, what do you think people are truly searching for beneath the surface?

SPEAKER_01 31:15

When people come to us at Drishti House, there's you know different levels of where everyone's on the on the path. But I would say that the majority of people are still just trying to understand themselves better and understand what is this concept of peace, what is silence, and this is a very confusing thing because throughout our day, we're constantly busy, we're constantly, you know, a lot of people they wake up, the first thing they check is their phone, their notifications. What is something's buzzing, or something over here is shiny, something is moving over there. There's so much glitz and glamour in this world. There's so many attraction distractions that are trying to pull you in this way or that, because their intention is I want to capture your attention. This is called the attention economy. This is what we're dealing with to this day. This is why all this is why Chat GPT is agreeing with you all the time. It wants your attention. This is why Instagram has an algorithm that shows you only what you like, it wants to keep you there, it wants your attention. So people are curious also, what happens when your attention, instead of going outside of yourself, what happens when the attention goes inside? Because most people are very used to, okay, I'm interacting with this, I'm interacting with that, I understand how to move my teapot or my tea kettle, I understand how to um, you know, do my job externally. But the moment you go inside, and they realize wow, there's a whole universe inside of here, also, with its own rules, with its own operators, with its own intentions, with its own directives, this becomes kind of like an Alice in Wonderland moment for a lot of people. So they get curious. And um tea in the West is not very popular, to be honest, like it is in the East or in Europe. Um, and the relationship's very different. So people see tea as they see it as okay, tea bag, and uh they see it as coffee, they see it as you know, smoothie, and you're either a coffee person or you're a tea person, that that's pretty much it. But tea ceremony is a very ancient practice that goes all the way back in our lineage. Uh, here, the one that we practice is rooted in Taoism. So Lao Zhu is an enlightened sage. Everyone may know Lao Zhu from the famous quote: a journey of a thousand miles starts with a single step step, exactly. You know it. Um, and everyone, you know, everyone sees this on social media, but that's actually Lao Zhu. Lao Zhu, um, and pretty much any enlightened sage is going to ask us to return to remember our true selves, come back to your true essence. So the way they did that was they went into nature, they sat in nature. In nature, they realized wow, there's this incredible plant called tea. And when I drink tea in its authentic form, in its in its true form, TT, that some sort of alchemical process happens inside of me that takes me into deeper states of consciousness and increases my awareness. Many people will call this the qi of tea. In let's say India, they may call this prana. In maybe the eastern, you know, occult lineages, they'll call this mana. Um, in Christianity, maybe it's called Holy Spirit. It's like this energy, like subtle body energy of the plant itself that becomes a guide that shows you something within you. As you meditate or as anyone stills, you become aware that there's some sort of tension somewhere in your body, right? And if you focus on that tension, then with your uh attention, this is very interesting because what is tension? Tension is pain that the body's holding on to. Uh, this could be emotional pain, this could be an attachment to something that is uh blocking the flow of your life force, so to speak, right? And so when that pain is coming in your body, it's trying to get your attention. But what do we do? Most people get so busy they can't pay attention to it. They take prescription drugs to mask the symptoms, they can't pay attention to it. They take recreational drugs and get out of the pain because nobody wants to feel pain, they're so afraid of pain, right? But if you gave it your attention, something very interesting happens because your attention is consciousness, and what is consciousness but divine love? So your pain is asking for your divine love, but you got to take it one more step further. You have to put your intention into the attention. So, with your attention, what is your intention? Your intention is to surrender, let go, return back to your true self. Because whatever that pain or that attachment is, as beautiful as that story is, it's not you, it's not the true you. It's something that's on top of you, and you can become aware within your body the innumerable layers of tension and stories and agreements that you've created within yourself to make up who you are. And the magic of tea is that there's so many different techniques that will lead you to this inner world understanding. But the magic of tea is that it's also a guiding hand, it has its own intelligence, and it's kind of like, hey, if you want to grab my hand, I will show you something, just as like a spiritual teacher would, you know, and it's funny. T, teacher. So it's it's very interesting that the word is also present in teacher, but it's um if you're willing to surrender into the the tea or your meditation practice or any technique that will take you into the inner universe, you will may notice that it it's a guide, it leads you somewhere, it shows you something, and then now it's your opportunity to let it go. So when people have that experience for the first time, they're like, Wow, that's what what did you put in the tea? Sometimes they they literally accuse me of putting psychedelics in the tea. Like, and I'm like, no, it's just Camilla Synesis, it's just a leaf and water. Like, that's all it is. But you're invited to just follow your breath, and you're invited to observe your mind as a theater and just kind of take a step back. Like, if you're in a movie theater, you're not getting in a fight with the people on the screen. You know, you're gonna go, you're entertained, and you leave, and you don't you you maybe you tell somebody about how good the movie was, but you're not like invested any further than that. The difference is people are afraid to look at that because it's so close to home. Oh, that person did that to me, this person did that to me. I need to get them back, I need to do this. The mind is devious in uh self-perpetuating itself, it doesn't want to die, it doesn't the story doesn't want to let go. You want to let go of the story, the story doesn't want to let go of you. It's very, very interesting. But the beauty of tea is that it helps show you where you're holding that story.

SPEAKER_00 38:37

Interesting, and and just to be more specific, is the Drishti house a community with its own members, or people can come in and out, have a tea, interact with you, um, hear about uh the teachings uh you are uh promoting and uh embodying it. How does it work?

SPEAKER_01 38:57

Yeah, no, I mean we're we are um we have a physical location here in Santa Barbara, California. Beautiful, you know, um curated property that's serene, invites uh peace. And it's just by appointment. So you can go on our website. We do have some public um tea offerings and sits and workshops, maybe on location or at different places like a yoga studio or um retreat center and things like that. But generally every Sunday we're we're hosting tea ceremony publicly. We're also available for a private tea ceremony. And the main thing is I even though I'm sharing this, um, I don't consider myself a teacher. You know, the tea um or any practice is going to lead you in to your own inner standing of the truth that you need in that moment. So that's why I truly believe like you don't we we're just space holding in in a way in the ceremony, and you yourself, because you have a desire to connect deeper to yourself or understand yourself better, reveal to you yourself. And it's it's all we're doing is hey uh here's some tea, here's some space, and go as deep as you wish. Um, some people take the invitation and some people um don't. And I feel like that's you know, it's a self-filtering system. It's beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 40:24

So, in other words, for those who are you know chasing success but lacking meaning, uh having this type of uh tea ceremony can be the first step um to experience something which will connect them spiritually, correct?

SPEAKER_01 40:40

Yeah, it's an opportunity to take a look at what's inside if you've never had the chance to do it. And I know there's a lot of story around certain plant medicines, you know, that'll they're getting very popular and trendy right now, but this is a gentle, instant integration into introspection, looking at yourself in a safe way. Um, and there's no real risk with with tea, uh, you know, uh other than if you're pregnant and things like that, you wouldn't want to you wouldn't want to have caffeinated tea. But it's kind of like the difference between you can try to force your awakening riding a rocket ship and go super hard and fast up, and guess what? The rocket ship crashes back down to earth. Or the way that the enlightened have advocated for is through a process of contemplative meditation generally. And when I look at that process, it's like a gradient of a sunrise, it's slow, it's steady. You almost don't even realize it's happening until the sun is fully out, and you can notice the contrast between when you're ignorant or when you are awakened. And I feel like tea is this just gentleness, just motherly energy. Like, yes, there can be powerful teas as well with young energy, but generally compared to other processes, it's an invitation, it's not a you know, like a bull running through a china shop.

SPEAKER_00 42:16

Interesting. And we talk about sustainable communities and and food. Do you envision um Drishti house community to become self-sustainable or just stick to what you're offering right now?

SPEAKER_01 42:31

That's an interesting question. I mean, I think you know, I brought in tea plants here to see if tea can grow in California. I mean, not to get too technical, but they need hardiness zone like seven and nine to survive. Here we have hardiness zone nine. I've tried mixed results. I would I think it's you can have tea as a as a guardian for the tea space or the land, but a commercial operation where we're supplying our own tea from California, um, I think would take a lot more effort to create the conditions that tea really enjoys. You know, tea only naturally grows in Yunnan, China, the south of China. So tea that's in India or Sri Lanka or you know, Bali or wherever in the world, it's been taken from China and replanted, and it's not growing in its natural environment, um, just out in the wild. So I love the concept, I love the idea, but I think we will become sustainable in different ways. You know, we do have some land, so we we love to have raised garden beds and you know, grey water systems and try to invoke the spirit of permaculture wherever we can.

SPEAKER_00 43:45

You know, interesting. Yeah. And I want to go back to a concept that is uh dear to uh to me the consciousness or raising consciousness in uh existing leaders and executives. Do you see this as a trend? That will catch up with uh this at the top in the coming years.

SPEAKER_01 44:07

Well, it's it's I I'm not sure if it's going to be a trend in the coming years, but what I will tell you is it's already established. It's not a trend, it's a culture. Like in in the east, like in in China, you would gift tea, you know, to people, high quality tea. You would drink tea when you're doing uh business meetings and things like that. It's standard because there's something about tea where it's gonna drop your brainwave state from like beta into alpha. And when you're in beta, we're using our minds to be like, do I agree with that? Do I not agree with that? Like there's the mind is at play. But when we're in alpha, like if you're watching a movie show or you're watching this podcast right now and you're fully attentive, you may drop into alpha. And alpha is a receptive state. It's like there's no filter of the mind trying to say, I agree with that or I disagree with that. You're more uh you're more open to to receive. So it creates a sense of communal nature when when people drink tea. So even if you're not doing it ceremonially, this is happening. Why is this happening? Because there's a chemical compound known as L-theanine that naturally occurs in tea, which reduces stress and anxiety. This is what balances the caffeine and changes the experience from tea versus coffee. Of course, you have to have high quality tea, intentionally grown tea, um, to have this beautiful experience. The lower quality tea isn't going to have L-theanine present. Um, and that's the way that the tea is cultivated and processed. But so there is science behind tea that also backs up like how it affects us on a physiological level. And what I've noticed is at the tea lounge, the beautiful thing about tea is that it doesn't matter what your background is, tea accepts you. You're a Sikh, you're a Christian, you're a Muslim, you're a yogi, you're a this, you're a that, you're a green, you're a blue, whatever it is, tea doesn't discriminate. You know, it gives you everything that you need, if you wish in your free will to go deeper, or you can stay on the surface. And it's very consensual in that way, um, which is cool. So when people are at the tea lounge, music happens, poetry happens, humor happens, storytelling happens, like soulful connections spontaneously combusts in a tea lounge. And I think this is why people love going to tea houses. And the West hasn't really figured it out yet. But I will tell you this, they are slowly coming online because I'm here near LA, and just a year ago, for the last couple of years, there was one tea house. And now in the last year, uh four or five have opened. So there is some momentum to bring tea more to the mainstream consciousness. Also, with Gen Z, they're shunning alcohol and cigarettes and things that are bad for their health, maybe because the economy is so bad, but maybe my idea is hopefully they're getting smarter than us. And they're actually very receptive to tea because tea has so many different health benefits as well. Um, and so it makes sense. Why am I buying something that is destroying my body? I should be buying something that's supporting my body. But I digress. So I think that will it come to the West? I don't know, but for us, we're just holding space. And every person that comes through our door and experiences tea ceremony and experiences tea in the way that the masters um advocate for, have a profound shift in their understanding. And I always joke, okay, come over to Drishti house, we'll we'll heal your tea chakra. Because so many people's tea chakras are traumatized from drinking very bad quality tea. And they tell me, oh, when I drink caffeine, I get jittery. No, you don't get jittery from drinking tea, you get jittery from drinking fertilizer, herbicide, pesticide, fungicide, and other chemicals and bad vibes that these companies are putting to turn them into cash crops and get you addicted to their product so that they sell you more of the same crap. Like if you have high quality tea and you really drop in, you'll see that the tea um not only is trying to help assist you, but it's not attached to you. The energy is hey, if you want to play, come. If you want to go, go. But you look at these other energies that people put into candies or or cigarettes or drugs, even you'll see that come back, come back, come back again, you know, and then they get stronger and stronger, and then people get addicted to these things. It's very, very interesting.

SPEAKER_00 48:53

Yes, indeed. There's a hook in there, and how uh you how your um creative side evolve over the last three years in poetry and uh artwork.

SPEAKER_01 49:05

Yeah, yeah. You know, I've I used to receive so much poetry every day when I was starting my journey, and it was kind of like, you know, we spoke about this last time, it's kind of like helping you take the next step, helping you remember it became like a mantra for me, leading me like breadcrumbs to the next step in my spiritual evolution. And now actually the poetry has slowed down, it doesn't come as much. And I don't try, I've never tried for any creative endeavor, it hasn't come for me. But what I've noticed in going into mantra, going into more dharma, going into more seva, even though you're you try less, I would say, the creative expression is expansive, more expanding. Like if I'll play music, I it somehow is it's playing something I've never played before. And I'm just like, thank you. This is beautiful, like that's incredible. And but also at the same time, you don't try to keep it. It's like it was just for that moment, you know, and same thing with poetry. It's like if it comes, thank you. If it doesn't come, thank you. You know, just having the same attitude of gratitude, not trying to, okay, I'm gonna sit down, I'm gonna write a piece of music, or and if you want to do that, that's fine. If you have a certain intention, you want to do it, that's fine. There's no wrong way to create, but just in my creative process, um, that doesn't seem to work for me. So I'm always just waiting and waiting and waiting. And so I feel like the the creativity, while maybe it's not as uh quantity, I feel like the quality of the expression is just a little bit more refined, a little bit like cleaner, a little bit crisper, a little bit clearer, um, a little bit slower, even, you know. I I think like when you're starting, there's this useful energy, it's like fire, get it out, da-da-da-da-da-da-da. And then somehow it's like, wow, okay, it's all coming out, lots of noise. But how did you know Chopin or Beethoven like make these melodic high energy moments, and then things slow down, and the violin comes in, and then it's like there's levels to expression, and like I I really, really respect um, you know, classical music in that regard, and you know, they're they're looking at so many different dynamic things, and yet it's cohesively one experience, and I think that's a great representation for consciousness itself because it's so many things, and yet we're having one experience collectively together. Um, so I feel that the more you let go of trying to be creative, somehow, the more it expresses naturally. And also, I find another thing with my practice is that before I felt like I need to express, I need to share, I need to be seen, I need to show something, and now I feel like I don't need to do anything, I get to if it's of service to somebody in the space, or allow somebody else to shine, you know, it's beautiful to just observe somebody else sharing their the divinity that is coming through them, and I think this is another aspect to creativity is not creating, and I think people don't talk about it because in the stillness, in the nothingness, remember that that is where all true creation comes from. If you're a painter, you start with a blank canvas, and this is where infinite potential lives. And I think that that is a very key point that people that desire to be creative have the opportunity to understand better and create a stronger relationship with.

SPEAKER_00 53:12

Yes, and the way I see or I perceive the creative in the creative process, at least for me, is we are a vessel, we get filled up with creativity, we put it on paper, on canvas, or whatever music, and then we wait for that vase, for that uh emptiness to fill up again and we repeat the process.

SPEAKER_02 53:32

Well said, beautifully said, yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 53:35

Flowing River, if everything you've built, achieved, and become disappeared tomorrow, what will remain that is truly you?

SPEAKER_01 53:45

Honestly, honestly, nothing. Like I don't I truly believe like nothing of me should remain here because uh the the the true teachers have already been here, the true teachers have already showed us the way. So if anything remains, maybe it's my finger that is pointing to a true teacher. Like follow Guru Magdevji, like follow, follow the path of the enlightened, you know. Like they have already carved everything out, so you know, all my all the words that I've received, like it's just pointing back to them. So I feel like this is yeah, hopefully the only thing that remains is an empty cup.

SPEAKER_00 54:26

Thank you very much. And we are at the end of this uh beautiful conversation. Any final words?

SPEAKER_01 54:32

Um, I feel like we we should probably share both. How do you feel about that? Yes, please. Okay. Do you want to pick a number between one and two hundred and twenty-one?

SPEAKER_00 54:47

Oh two.

SPEAKER_02 54:50

Number two. Okay. Um there is one. So I'm just gonna flip that. I think we'll just end with a prayer. Two one one, which is a combination of exactly what you said.

SPEAKER_01 55:18

Two and one, one, one. So this is poem number two eleven. Oh divine, and when I say divine, I just I mean everyone hopefully knows this, but if you don't know this, when I say divine, it's the way that you connect to that divine light that is within you. It doesn't mean my God versus your God. It means oh my god, it's so beautiful. So, okay, it goes like this. Oh divine, oh divine, guide our hearts, guide our hands, place us exactly where we must stand to understand your divine plan, to be a vessel for your infinity divinity, seeing the divine light within you and within me, so that we may come to know your true community. That saw sangha, where all colors, all creeds, all backgrounds weave together as the universal tapestry, where the guru sits and calls us into self-mastery, awaken our hearts, illuminate our minds, align us to the absolute supreme divine. If it is pleasing to you, my Lord, grant us the strength, grant us the wisdom, grant us the love, to continue to walk in the footsteps of your beloved saints, those saints that paint the roads in gold, showering all with a love that can neither be bought or sold. May we trade in this true currency that brings the current to the sea, to achieve yoga, the union between man and divine. Protect us from the veils of illusion, protect us from temptation, protect us from evil, guide us to that sad sangha, guide us to truth, guide us to you. May we always remember our divine connection. We beg for guidance and protection, guidance and protection to the one whom is one with the moon and the sun. Break our bonds and take us beyond. Guide us, protect us, guide us, protect us.

SPEAKER_00 57:13

Thank you. Beautiful. Thank you very much for everything um you're doing in the world. I wish you many uh tea session, uh sessions with the right uh people for your community.

SPEAKER_01 57:28

Thank you so much, and may your community and your works continue to flourish and bloom as well. And it's so beautiful to reconnect after a few years. Good to see you.

SPEAKER_00 57:38

Thank you. And to my viewers, thank you for watching. Leave a comment, um, share with others, and until next time, love and gratitude.