Meet Kate Mulh: Insights from Family and Criminal Law | Episode 238

In this episode of Divorce at Altitude, Amy Goscha introduces associate attorney Kate Mulh and explores how her background in both family law and criminal defense informs her approach to divorce, parenting disputes, and protection order cases in Colorado. Kate shares insight into managing high-conflict cases, setting realistic expectations, and navigating situations where criminal allegations intersect with family court.

Episode Outline

Family Law and Criminal Defense Overlap

• How criminal cases, protection orders, and mandatory no-contact orders impact divorce and parenting cases.

Managing Client Expectations

• Why early intervention, clear communication, and realistic goals are critical in family law cases.

Team-Based Legal Strategy

• How a collaborative partner-associate approach benefits clients in complex divorce and co-parenting matters.

Key Takeaways

• Family and criminal law often intersect in divorce cases
• Early intervention can prevent escalation and conflict
• Clear communication improves co-parenting outcomes
• A team-based approach leads to better long-term results

Related Episodes & Resources

Spousal Maintenance and Domestic Violence in Colorado – How abuse allegations affect spousal maintenance in divorces in Colorado.

What is Divorce at Altitude?

Ryan Kalamaya and Amy Goscha provide tips and recommendations on issues related to divorce, separation, and co-parenting in Colorado. Ryan and Amy are the founding partners of an innovative and ambitious law firm, Kalamaya | Goscha, that pushes the boundaries to discover new frontiers in family law, personal injuries, and criminal defense in Colorado.

To subscribe to Divorce at Altitude, click here and select your favorite podcast player. To subscribe to Kalamaya | Goscha's YouTube channel where many of the episodes will be posted as videos, click here. If you have additional questions or would like to speak to one of our attorneys, give us a call at 970-429-5784 or email us at info@kalamaya.law.

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DISCLAIMER: THE COMMENTARY AND OPINIONS ON THIS PODCAST IS FOR ENTERTAINMENT AND INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES AND NOT FOR THE PURPOSE OF PROVIDING LEGAL ADVICE. CONTACT AN ATTORNEY IN YOUR STATE OR AREA TO OBTAIN LEGAL ADVICE ON ANY OF THESE ISSUES.

Transcript

 Hi, and welcome back to another episode at Divorce at Altittude. I'm Amy Goscha, co-host with my law partner, Ryan Kalamaya. Today I have one of our associates, um, who I'm really excited to introduce you to. Her name is Kate Mulh. Kate, how are you doing? I'm great, Amy. Thanks for having me. Yeah, absolutely. Well, I think we'll kind of start with, um, you do some family law and you also do some criminal defense work.

Is that correct? Yeah, that's correct. Oh, great. Well, why don't you tell me just a little bit about yourself, you know, where are you from? How did you come to be a lawyer? Yeah. I've been an associate with Call Goscha since August, 2024. Primarily practicing family law, but I also handle some criminal defense and some civil protection order issues.

I am originally from Ohio and I moved to Colorado for law school. In my time with Cal Goscha, I have handled many aspects of family law, including trials on contested issues, mediation and arbitration motions, litigation on dense legal issues, cohabitation agreements, post decree modifications, and the intersection of family law with criminal law and civil protection orders.

Yeah, I mean, you've done a lot. Um, can you tell me what has drawn you to. The area of family law and just for our listeners, I mean, I think everyone knows, but family law has to do with, you know, divorces, you know, we don't use custody, but you know, like parenting time disputes, sometimes dealing with premarital agreements.

So how did you end up in this area of law? Yeah, I have family members that have gone through their own Divorce processes and seeing how difficult it was for them made me wanna use my privilege as an attorney to help others through that process. I found that family law is an area where I can make a tangible difference in someone's life at a very crucial stage.

So even though the work can be really heavy sometimes it's incredibly rewarding. And how did you end up joining CME Goscha? Yeah, I joined CME Goscha back in August, 2024 when I got connected with Amy. Um, and I quickly came on board and I've been really enjoying my time at Cal Mea Goscha ever since. It's, yeah, that's great.

I mean, one thing that really stood out to me, you know, that not a lot of people had, I feel like is the, the child practicum experience. So you, you, you had a lot of practice dealing with, you know, cases even, you know, back in law school back in the day. Isn't that true? Yeah. So when I was in law school, I had a family law internship.

My L year summer, after my two L year, I was licensed under the Student Practice Act. With the Denver Municipal Public Defender's Office, and I did a trial second chair, and then my third year I did the criminal defense clinic at DU, and I got to get some trial and some appellate experience well before even graduating law school.

That's great. And since you've been with our firm, I mean, we've done a, we've done some trials together, you've done some appearances and trials. Um, I think that's one thing that is, you know, really helpful to clients for, like how we structure cases. A lot of times we have the team approach. Do you wanna kind of talk about that and also what is your favorite part, you know, in practicing, you know, law, you know, at Cal Goscha.

Yeah. I think what makes our firm really unique is that we use a partner associate paralegal approach. I think this benefits our clients in a lot of ways because. Our partners are very busy and have their own caseloads, and it's really helpful for them if associates can jump on and handle some issues at our rates.

It also makes sure that we're all in the loop and we're thinking of every possible strategy in cases. I think with family law, I've found even after I've done this for so long, like there's so many ways that you can do a case that it's really helpful to have that kind of, I'll call it brain trust. You know, where you can bounce ideas off of each other to make sure that, you know, we're really looking at all aspects and doing everything that we can.

Yeah, absolutely. I think that a lot of attorneys approach cases very differently. Um, and I think it's really helpful to have everyone's input on the cases so that way we can make sure that we get the best result for our client. Yeah, absolutely. So let's talk a little bit about professional insight. How would you describe your approach to working with clients, you know, in such high stress situations?

Every client's different and is gonna have different needs, some of which I'm suited to help with and some that I'm not. So an important part of my practice is ensuring that my clients have the support that they need at our firm, with our team on the legal side, but also ensuring that they have an individual therapist or other mental health professionals, co-parenting coaches, financial advisors, or any other support that they might need to get through such a stressful time.

Because it is a really high stress situation, and I think it's really important that we recognize our strengths as attorneys, but also the areas that we can't necessarily help clients and we need to bring in other professionals to make sure that they have all the support they need. Yeah, I think that one question I always ask clients, um, you know, especially if they're going through a Divorce is, you know, what is leading up to getting a Divorce?

And I know it can be a multiple of factors, but just kind of understanding like the dynamics between the relationship. Helps me with the psychology of how am I gonna deal with this person and also the opposing party to really like move the family forward in the right direction, you know? But I think we're not therapists, but we also deal with a lot of like emotional problems.

So having those professionals that, you know, can help us and help our clients. So they have their legal team and their treatment team, I think is super. Effective and something we do really well at our firm. What is something that you've learned from working on a Divorce or a parenting dispute case that surprised you?

I think this is probably pretty cliche, but I think that family law has taught me how important communication is. I think that people always say that, but I don't think you realize until you. See those dynamics in a relationship and how breakdowns in communication affect so many different areas of someone's life.

And I think that that has made me strive to be better with my communication with clients because I know that so many issues can arise when you aren't communicating effectively and also communicating, and that people receive communication well. I think some people communicate in different styles, and it's important to make sure we meet clients where they're at.

But also when we're talking to opposing counsels or opposing parties, um, it's important to kind of know people's communication styles, how they communicate effectively, and how that impacts the issues in a case. I think a lot of the disputes come down to communication and because a lot of times, you know, people want to change the parenting time or change the decision making, but if we can figure out how to help people communicate in an effective way as co-parents, you know, like that's, that's awesome.

And I think we do a good job of that. What is one legal concept or strategy you wish more clients understood early on in their case? And we do think if you could also talk about like. How important it is for kind of like early intervention in family law cases? Yeah, absolutely. I think one of the really important parts of being an effective attorney for clients is managing a client's expectations and showing them what's realistic in a case.

And kind of the limitations of the system we're working in. So one thing that I think it's important for clients to know early on is that the core system, unfortunately it's just not perfect. A lot of jurisdictions have difficulty hearing cases as quickly as we would like. A lot of times these judicial officers have many cases with many different facts in front of them, and there's limitations to what can be done in a courtroom.

So this is why I think it's really important to try and reach agreements outside of the courtroom where we can just because the system. Isn't perfect and we wanna get the best result for our clients. But all that being said, we do frequently have to put issues before the court and we are ready to advocate for our clients on that level.

I do think that early intervention in a case is really important in family law because of the issues that we're dealing with. We're dealing with really important issues in a client's life. You know, oftentimes they're kids and their money, and I think that those are things that we don't wanna mess up.

So I think it's really important that we intervene early where there's issues, identify those issues early on, and then work with the opposing party and the resources that we have to try to get these issues handled early on in the case because it's really easy for them to blow up later and we definitely don't wanna have those kinds of results later on in the case if we can prevent them.

Yeah. You mentioned having, helping people with client expectations, which is key. How do you do that? Yeah, I try to start that out from the outset. When I meet a client in a consultation, I frequently do research ahead of time before consult, so that way I know that I have as much information as possible before going into a consult to answer their questions.

But I also wanna highlight the strengths and weaknesses of their case and possible areas for exposure, because I do think it's really important that. You know, not only do they have the feeling that we're advocating for them and that we have their back, but it's also important to know that they have all the information and just that they, they know exactly what they can expect in the case as much as they can, because it is a lot of unknowns.

I think that if we're not providing that kind of objective perspective to our clients, then you know, we're doing them a disservice by not giving them all the facts so that way they're fully prepared going into their case and they know exactly. What they can expect. Yeah. One thing I noticed that you do is you'll do check-ins with your clients and I think sometimes, you know, under meeting clients where they're at, you know, like, 'cause sometimes people might be really upset and they're probably not gonna hear, you know, everything that you're saying.

So I think you do a really nice job of, you know, like understanding when people can hear what you're saying. Which I think is really important and people sometimes need to be told, you know, like what their options are several times just because there's so many things going on. So I think you have a really nice way of kind of breaking it down and really explaining that to clients.

And you do a great job of giving people realistic expectations, which is excellent. Anything else that you would add related to, you know, how you interact with clients that's really helpful that you found? I think one thing that I try to do with all my clients is. While I am the attorney on the case, I don't want them to feel like they're in a weird position just because I'm the attorney and they're the client.

I want them to see me as an equal and as someone that they can be open with about their case. I'm very fortunate that I had the opportunity, opportunity to go to law school and be where I'm at, but I want them to know that attorneys aren't all scary and we're at the end of the day, we're just normal people trying to advocate for them.

And so I, you know, I hope that my clients can relate to me and feel comfortable talking to me, just like they would talk to anyone else. Yeah, I mean, kind of getting to that kind of personal aspect of who you know you are, Kate, what, what is your favorite thing about practicing family law and what are some things that you bring from your personal human perspective to your cases, would you say?

I think one of my favorite things about family law, like I said, is that I can make an actual tangible difference in someone's life at a crucial moment. You know, we've all been through really difficult times in our lives. Those people that help us through it are, you know, really important. And I think that one thing I really love about family law is that I get to take cases across the metro and the mountains.

So I have clients with many different backgrounds, careers, parenting styles, and ways of life. Having clients with different legal and factual issues keeps things really interesting. Plus, I love having an excuse to get away to the mountains, but it's really fun to get to help clients, you know, with something so personal like.

Their financial situations, their families, and really just how they structure their lives. So I think that that's something that I carry, how important that is with me, and I try to try to make sure that that comes out in how I practice family law. One thing I do wanna highlight is sometimes there is this crossover between the criminal practice area and family law.

Can you explain just in general some of those areas, you know, and that you've dealt with? You know, that I think gives you kind of an edge over some people, you know, 'cause you have a good understanding of those areas. Yeah, I think that unfortunately the criminal law system and the family law system often intersect in a lot of different ways.

I've seen it where, you know, I have a family law client who is a domestic violence victim, and they're trying to navigate not only a Divorce. Possibly a civil protection order. If there's a pending domestic violence case, there's a mandatory protection order, and they're kind of having to navigate being a victim in one case and having certain rights versus then navigating the Divorce case and navigating, how do I even communicate with my co-parent now that there's allegations of domestic violence?

And then that comes up in, you know, if we're talking about spousal maintenance, if we're talking about who retains the marital residence, developing a parenting plan. Even if we're talking about investigations with A CFI or a PRE, those kinds of things come into play. And so I think my role as a, a domestic relations attorney that also practices criminal defense, I can provide some insight into how the criminal.

System works and kind of what options they have and how the cases can intersect. I've also seen where people unfortunately weaponize the criminal justice system to get an edge in family law cases, so I've also seen where I have a client who might be accused of committing a crime against the other person just because they're trying to get an edge in a Divorce case.

It can happen either way, and then it has. A lot of lasting implications. If there's mandatory protection orders in place, that definitely impacts the way that we handle parenting, time exchanges, communication about kid issues and decision making. Yeah. No, that's great. It's great that we can handle all those things in house because you're not having to then coordinate with two separate attorneys.

Um, so I think that's a huge, you know, plus, um, and knowledge base that you have. And can offer your clients. Do you have a mantra saying that you live by, in law or in life? This applies to both my work life but also my personal life. But I frequently tell myself, you can only control what you can control.

It's really important for me to remember that when I'm frustrated that I can't do more for a client, or when there is so much going on in the world, if something's beyond my control, I can't let it get to me because there's so much within my control that I can do to create positive change. Yeah, and I tell clients that a lot, you know, like control what you can control.

You know, we see a lot of clients who maybe the other side is not doing X, Y, Z and I think it's hard sometimes for clients because they're like, well, he's doing, or she's doing X, Y, Z. Like, why can't I be doing the same thing? And it's always like, take the higher road and do, you know, like do the best that you can with what you can control.

Okay. So in closing, what's one thing you hope clients feel after working with you at the end of the case? I really hope that my clients can feel a sense of relief sometimes at the end of the case. I have a client that's really happy to have a decree of Divorce entered because it's been such a long ride.

They're really excited to move on in the next chapter of their life. But I've also had clients who, they're mourning the end of their marriage and it's really sad and they have all kinds of emotions about it. So either way, at the end of the day, I just hope that my clients feel a sense of relief after working with me knowing that they felt heard and advocated for.

Yeah, no, that's, that's so true. And I think that when people are going through a Divorce sometimes it's easy to always say, well, I'm sorry. And for certain clients, like that's what they need to hear. Certain clients, it's congratulations. You know, like you're moving on to the next step of your life. Um, but knowing your client and their needs, I think is something that stands out to me about you.

Um, is there anything else in closing? Like how do you define success both personally and professionally? I think success is very relative to the situation, but I try to find success in the little moments every day. If I hold myself to really high standards of success, I know that I'll always be measuring myself against that, and oftentimes we just don't.

Add up to that because we're human. So I try to find success in the little moments by, you know, really making a difference, talking to a client in a consult, even if they don't hire us, or, you know, mentoring, you know, a student who wants to be a lawyer one day, just trying to find success in the little moments.

Um, so that way I, you know, have things that I, I can look back in my career and know that I made a difference. Yeah. No, that's great. Well, Kate, thank you for being with us today. It's great to introduce you to our listeners. You can find Kate, you know, like on our website or her email is Kate at Kme Law.

Happy to answer any questions you have. Otherwise, thank you for being with us today and we always, um, appreciate any feedback that you have and we'll look forward to having you at the next, um, episode of Divorce at Altittude.