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Wild Lives Among The Graves

• Michele McAloon • Season 4 • Episode 149

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A million stories rest under the trees of Père Lachaise, and some of them still move. We sit down with curator and author-photographer Benoît Galliot to walk the avenues of Paris’s most visited cemetery and discover why it feels so alive. From neo-gothic chapels and art nouveau tombs to foxes raising kits among ivy, this tour blends cultural history with urban ecology in a way that surprises and soothes.

Benoît opens the gate on a distinctly French approach to burial: time-bound concessions that allow families to share space across generations and, when abandoned, make room for new remembrance. He explains how careful reclamation keeps the cemetery from becoming a frozen museum and why that policy matters in a dense city. Along the way, we talk about the book that sparked this conversation—full of tender photos of foxes, birds, and statuary—and the unexpected comfort wildlife brings to grieving families.

We also meet the man behind the name: Père La Chaise, a Jesuit confessor to Louis XIV, whose association with the land shaped its identity long before 1804. Benoît shares his own path from a family of stonemasons to law to public service, eventually becoming curator and living on site with his children. No ghosts here—just quiet nights, the rustle of wings, and a renewed sense that memory can coexist with growth. Come for the legends of Chopin, Oscar Wilde, and Jim Morrison; stay for the everyday life that makes this place breathe.

If this journey moved you, follow and review the show, share it with a friend planning a trip to Paris, and subscribe so you never miss our next conversation.   Follow Me at https://www.bookclues.com


You can find Benoit Gallot and the picture of Pere laChaise cemetary at Instagram @la_vie_au_cimitiere 


Michele McAloon:

You're listening crossword where cultural clues lead to the truth of the word. And my name is Michele McAloon. And some of you may be a little perplexed why I chose to interview an author, the director of the famous Perlich Cemetery in Paris. Why I would choose to interview a funeral director in the middle of the Christmas season? Because his book is so adorable. It is a great book. He has taken pictures of animals and birds, and it is a gentle read. It's a wonderful read and would actually make a great Christmas gift. So just put that in your ear if you're thinking of something kind of unusual in the book world. This is a beautiful book. I hope you enjoy the interview. And if you like this show, please rate, subscribe. You guys know what you need to do. And you can find me at bookclues.com. Thank you. God bless. We have a very special guest today, and I would almost say he is a celebrity. He is the director of the Père Lachés Cemetery in Paris, France. He has a beautiful new book out, and it is called The Secret Life of a Cemetery, The Wild Nature and Enchanting Lore of Père Lachais. And I would like to welcome Benoit Galileaux. Benoit, bienvenue.

Benoit Gallot:

Merci. Hello, Michele. Thank you for the invitation.

Michele McAloon:

Oh, we're so glad you're here. Benoit has a very different background. He was born into a family of grave stonemasons. He has been the curator of Père Lachaisse Cemetery since 2018. But he's also an Instagram star. Or his animals that he takes pictures of in the cemetery are Instagram stars. And you can find him at L A underscore V-I-E underscore A-U underscore Cemetery and C I M E T I E R E. And I'll put that up on the show notes. It's attracted a huge community of followers, captive by captivated by his photographs of the animals that have made the Parisian landmark their home. He lives on the grounds of the cemetery. He's got four children, so he has a lot to photograph on a daily basis. So we are so glad to have you. This is really great. Okay, let's talk about Pere LaChaise Cemetery. Where is Pere Lachaise Cemetery?

Benoit Gallot:

Um the the Pere Lachaise Cemetery is uh is located in the east of Paris, more precisely in the 20th arrondissement in n Paris.

Michele McAloon:

How big are we talking? What size is this cemetery?

Benoit Gallot:

Oh, it's very big. It's the largest u green space uh inside u Paris. The cemetery covers 43 hectares, about uh 106 acres.

Michele McAloon:

Yeah, about 110 acres. Okay.

Speaker 3:

Okay. Okay. But it's the biggest inside Paris.

Michele McAloon:

Let's start with a little bit of the history. How old is the cemetery?

Benoit Gallot:

Oh, the cemetery is very old. It opened its gate on May 21, 1804. 221 years old today.

Michele McAloon:

Now I have to ask, how many dead people are there in the cemetery? And we don't need the joke that all of them are, but how many people are actually in buried in this cemetery?

Benoit Gallot:

We got an estimation, we don't know the number, but more than one million. One million and three hundred thousand people are buried in the cemetery today.

Michele McAloon:

That's more than one million people. That's a lot of people in that cemetery. And we're talking bones and cremation and actual grave sites, correct?

Benoit Gallot:

Yes, yes, totally, yes, correct.

Michele McAloon:

And folks, if you've never been to Paris, or if you're planning a trip to go to Paris, go back to Paris, make sure you go by Père Lachey's cemetery. It is one of the most fascinating sites in Paris. It is a beautiful space, and there is just so many little, I call them Le Poche de l'hsitoire, the pockets of history there in that cemetery, from everybody from Jim Morrison to Benoit Gello and his foxes. So there's everything in that cemetery, and it's just it's absolutely a fascinating place. Why do you think this cemetery is so famous? It and it is the most famous cemetery in the world, I think.

Benoit Gallot:

Yes. There are three main reasons, I think. First of all, it is a landscape uh cemetery. It's a very pleasant place for strolling. You can walk, there is a lot of trees. It's quiet in Paris. Uh it's sometimes um it's a rare rare rare, I don't know what to say. It's uh also it's uh an open-air museum. You can see uh the funerary funerary art, neo-gothic chapels, our nouveau tombs, antique caskets. So uh if you like the the art, uh you can you can walk in the cemetery, and it's very pleasant for this uh uh this reason. And the last one, it's uh there is uh famous personalities, including for foreigners who are buried in this place, so Eddie Piaf, she's French, but uh there is also Chopin, Jim Morrison, Oscar Wilde, Balzac, etc. So there is a lot of reasons to come to the Perlachaise cemetery, uh, but I think this is the the three aspects uh that makes Pere lachaise a unique place. Uh disorienting, timeless, and completely free. There is no tickets to go to the Pere lachaise, which must also contribute to his success.

Michele McAloon:

Alright, so this might be a little complicated to explain, so let's let's try this. The French have a very different system of burial than what we would have in the US, and they have something called a concession, right? Or concession. Can you explain a little bit? It's basically where you rent the ground, right? The ground does not belong to you forever.

Speaker 3:

Yes. In fact, um by law, every deceased person is entitled to an individual grave, granted free of charge for five years. However, families may choose to rent a funeral concession funeraire for a fixed period, ten years, thirty years, fifty years, or even in perpetuity. And this exception became the norm. Most of people are buying a concession. One of the advantages is that you can uh you can uh put many members of the family in the same grave. That's why uh a lot of people want a concession to be buried with uh the the husband, his uh parents, his child. So um that's the interest and the success. So the the cemetery has uh cemetery at the Saint-Foy. I don't know what to say. So uh today uh you pay to have the right to be buried in the cemetery. Yes.

Michele McAloon:

This someone asked me a question today. If a grave is abandoned, if if a family has forgotten about the grave or about the tombstone, what happens to it then? And you explain it very well in your book, but I think uh especially if you've got a 221-year-old cemetery, you've got a million people in this cemetery, there's gonna be some times where families forget their loved ones. What happens to the grave when the family forgets that they have it?

Benoit Gallot:

Well, in the Pere laChaise Cemetery, there is no place anymore. So uh we have to uh to uh to take the abandoned graves. Uh so if nobody pays to to renew the concession or if the the the grave is abandoned, uh the administration can take uh some um some uh measure, I don't know what to say, to so it's it's it's techniques in difficulty in English.

Michele McAloon:

Right, understand. So let me so what happens is they can so if it's abandoned and no family no family has claim on it, then that a concession uh it's it's declared abandoned, and then someone else can use that grave. Is that correct after they've removed the phone?

Benoit Gallot:

It's correct, yes. The gravediggers remove the the bones and uh the the the plot is uh is free, so I can uh sell a new concession on the same emplacement. Uh that is uh the only way to renew the the grave in the Perlachet cemetery and and to give the permission to the new Parisians to be buried in the Perlachet cemetery. The cemetery is is not a museum, it's a real cemetery with it's a living cemetery. There is new grave, old graves are disappeared. It's important for the cemetery to not be a simple museum, but to be a cemetery. That's the only way to have some new new people who came to to pray, to it's important. It's my job.

Michele McAloon:

Absolutely. And it really is, as you point out in your book, it really is very much a living place because you have all kinds of people, and your your photo, your photographs show now, since they decided to go green, you have all kinds of wildlife now in the cemetery that you did not have before, correct? You have a fox family, you have uh a couple little animals I didn't even recognize in their earth. You've got some beautiful birds. It's that's really been kind of an incredible thing, hasn't it?

Benoit Gallot:

Yes, it's uh the space is not only a museum, it's also a garden, an open garden, um where the wildlife can find uh a refuge, refuge. Since foxes came in uh 2020 um during the COVID. And they they like to live between the waves because there is some food, there is some uh house for them, uh then they can hide during the day, and uh the cemetery is free during the night, there is no human, so uh it's very big for them, they are very happy, and every year they are doing some babies, uh baby's foxes. It's not a problem for the people who have a grave in the cemetery. The foxes are invisible during the day, but it's it's not only uh they are cute, foxes are cute, but also they are uh yes, yes, but uh they uh uh people who who have um a member of their family are very happy to know that there is some life in the symmetry. It's uh the death is a less it's more it's it's uh helps them to deuils C in Anglais.

Michele McAloon:

Absolutely. Um yeah, to get over the grief, to get over their grief. It helps some.

Benoit Gallot:

So it's interesting, it's not uh it's not only cute, it's uh uh so it's an interesting uh thing to me to know that the birds, the foxes, the cats make good for the people. And sure. And we are very proud.

Michele McAloon:

I have I can't wait to go back there to see it, to see it again, because I saw it before, but I to go and see with new eyes who was Per Lachaise, who was the man?

Benoit Gallot:

Oh, Pere Lachaise was a Jesuit. He was a special advisor and confessor to King Louis XIV. Uh he has a lot of power. The estate where the cemetery now stands was in the 17th century outside the limit of Paris. At that time it was still countryside, a place frequented by the Jesuits. The Per Lachets helped to redevelop the area and built a rather comfortable house for his fellow Jesuits. He left such a strong mark on the place that Parisians called it the estate of Per Lachaise. And he died in 1799, but a century later, when the seat was transformed into cemetery, Parisians naturally named it the Pere laCahaise cemetery. Evansuct is not buried there. He's buried in Paris. But the official name of the cemetery is Cimetiere de l'Est, the cemetery of the East. It's not Pere lachaise Cemetery, but everybody says uh Pere lachaise Cemetery today.

Michele McAloon:

You talk a lot about what are your primary duties as a you're a young man. You're not an old guy, nobody can see because we're hearing the voice, and he is Monsieur Gallot is a young man. How did you become the director of this just famous site? And I know you started off at with a law degree and with your family background. It's an unusual job.

Speaker 3:

Oh yes, I uh I did not choose. I uh when I was a child, uh I did not want to work in the funeral uh sector. I want to study a law degree, yes, and I I worked in the audiovisual TV, program TV as a um as a jurist. Uh and uh I was not uh happy in this world, yes, yes, and I wanted to to change and I uh I wanted to work for the uh Ville de Paris, Paris, and um I uh I passed an exam and uh the first job that uh the person in front of me proposed to me was to work at the Perlache cemetery as a jurist. So um it was uh the destiny, it was destiny. Destiny, it was destiny, yes, yes, it was destiny as continued me to work in the Perlache cemetery, so uh nearly uh 20 years that I worked uh in the cemetery service of the Ville of Paris. And uh it's in the 2018 that uh I worked uh as a conservator, as a curator of the Perlachez, so I'm very proud of it. But it's uh it's uh it's an honor, but it's a lot of pressure because you have to be at that level to say uh you you don't have the right to the right to say no or yes or yes. Yes uh be be up to the task, yes. Okay, okay, yes, it's a distinct uh I did not choose. That's a fun fact, but with my parents we learned a lot about symmetry because I grew up in a funeral uh uh maison. Uh so it was uh it's fun.

Michele McAloon:

That's right, and a funeral, yeah, in your house. Your parents would talk about this, so you grew up with this business, correct? Yes, you you grew up with it, so it's not that unusual for you. And as I understand it, your wife now works in the funeral business, right?

Benoit Gallot:

Yes, yes.

Michele McAloon:

Yes, you actually live in the cemetery with your family, correct?

Benoit Gallot:

Yes, yes, yes, yes. I do. I'm living in the cemetery with uh three of my four children, and they are very happy, they are not sad. Uh they have the biggest uh garden in Paris. Uh so it's still no, it's just uh sometimes a bit difficult when they um they invited um some friends to the house, to the to her house. And we have to explain why we are living in the Perlaches cemetery. It's always surprising, but uh I don't know if they um how they leave uh the fact to to live in the Perlaches, but uh I think they're happy.

Michele McAloon:

It sounds like it. I mean heck, you have a lot you have a lot of room to run around, that's for sure. Now I have to ask you, do you ever get scared? Do you is it ever a fray or you know, anguisan? Is it ever spooky in the uh in the cemetery?

Benoit Gallot:

Do you ever think a lot of people think uh it's uh there is a lot of ghosts, it's uh emptied uh uh seat uh site, but there is no no uh no Dracula, uh no ghost, uh no the zombies. It's it's very quiet. Um sometimes uh during the night when it's when it is very, very dark, and when I'm going outside uh to see uh foxes or or birds, etc. Sometimes it's impressive because uh it's very dark, there is it's very quiet, and uh every sound, every uh sometimes, but no, it's not very uh I'm not afraid of living in here. And uh no, I'm I'm I survived.

Michele McAloon:

Well, you know what? You're like me, I'm more afraid of birds than I am of ghosts. I don't like birds either. I don't I wouldn't I do not like chickens. Yeah, they're scary, they're very scary. When I was a little girl, I got pecked by hot. Yeah. Yeah.

Benoit Gallot:

I am afraid of the birds, but I like them too because uh I I take pictures of them and uh they uh they are fascinating because they they can live here, they can find food, they can hide, uh they can do some babies and uh in the grave. Uh uh it's fascinating, but yes, I uh I feel not comfortable with uh when I uh when I saw a bird in the on the grave. But uh it is um I would say uh I don't know, I don't find the word in French in phobie. How do you say in English?

Michele McAloon:

Yeah, phobia, a phobia. Yes, it's I mean I it's a phobia. Yeah, yeah. I you know what I understand. Okay, so I have to ask you one last question. What is your favorite grave? Which one's your favorite? Do you have a favorite, or is this like ask?

Benoit Gallot:

I like a lot of graves because there is so many graves that fascinating. There is one graves at the I like the wheel. I like Oscar Wild Graves because she's very impressive. She's very different from the user. I like it a lot. It's a fun because Luazo it's English. She's quite simple. Epitoph, which captures this of this in a single word. Alas in English.

Michele McAloon:

Alas.

Speaker 3:

Yes, one word. I'd say everything and I think uh it's hard to imagine more point on epitaph. So I like it a lot. And uh because of the alas I find it interesting. I find it in very interesting.

Michele McAloon:

Very wonderful. I have to tell you, I mean, I really, really appreciate my you know, I know this is a hard this is a hard interview for you to do because English is not your first language. No, no, it's you did a fabulous job. You did a beautiful job. His book is beautiful. He's got beautiful photographs in it. I mean, the pictures of the foxes and the birds and it's and the different statues. It's really kind of heartwarming. I think it would be a very, very good Christmas present, folks. I mean, because it's a very general book, and I know it's kind of weird to think about that at Christmas time, but you know what? It's part of our lives, it's our recycling of our lives. And it's not a sad book, it's not a grim book. It's a there's a lot of little history tidbits in it. I mean, we didn't even talk about Edith Piaf or Jim Morrison or I mean how about Heloise and Abelard? I mean, there's some there there's some big names in that cemetery. So two things, Benoit Gallo's uh Instagram site will be in my show notes, and go to Paris and go say bonjour to Monsieur Gallo. Thank you so much.

Edith Piaf:

Hold me fast the magic spell you guess. This is La Via Wo When you cheese heaven sight and like love's mask I see Love When you play Do you I'm in the world above the world of world And when you speak and receive from above Everyday one seem to turn into love so give your heart and soul to me and life will always be Love your wrong I thought that love was just a word they sang about in songs I heard it took you kisses to reveal that I was wrong and love is we hold me close and hold me back the magic spell you guess This is love y'all heaven the bike loads my love yell when you friend I'm in the world of world well in your speaker every day one in the time in your love leave your home enjoy with all weapons.