Embark on a tantalizing exploration of the unexplained with Andrew and Liam as we chase the shadows of history's most intriguing enigmas. Our sleuthing begins with the peculiar image of 'missing;' Joanna Lopez's image broadcast on a TV station—this unsolved snippet from 1989 serves as an appetizer for the feast of mysteries we tackle. From the icy silence of the Ural Mountains where the Dyatlov Pass incident took place, to the bizarre dancing plague of 1518, we dissect each event with a blend of scepticism and fascination that's sure to captivate your curiosity.
As the melody of our investigation deepens, we delve into the haunting disappearances of troubled souls in the limelight—the mysterious vanishing of Richey Edwards of the Manic Street Preachers sends chills down our spines. With every theory proposed, the line between fact and fiction blurs, leaving us pondering the darkest corners of human existence and the echoes they leave behind. Whether it's a meticulously planned disappearance or a silent farewell, the stories we uncover are as compelling as they are tragic.
Embark on a tantalizing exploration of the unexplained with Andrew and Liam as we chase the shadows of history's most intriguing enigmas. Our sleuthing begins with the peculiar image of 'missing;' Joanna Lopez's image broadcast on a TV station—this unsolved snippet from 1989 serves as an appetizer for the feast of mysteries we tackle. From the icy silence of the Ural Mountains where the Dyatlov Pass incident took place, to the bizarre dancing plague of 1518, we dissect each event with a blend of scepticism and fascination that's sure to captivate your curiosity.
As the melody of our investigation deepens, we delve into the haunting disappearances of troubled souls in the limelight—the mysterious vanishing of Richey Edwards of the Manic Street Preachers sends chills down our spines. With every theory proposed, the line between fact and fiction blurs, leaving us pondering the darkest corners of human existence and the echoes they leave behind. Whether it's a meticulously planned disappearance or a silent farewell, the stories we uncover are as compelling as they are tragic.
Living with Maidalee Living with Maidalee. Living with Maidalee. Living with Maidalee.
Speaker 2:Hello and welcome to the podcast Living with Maidalee. This is ATV, a nostalgia based podcast, but in the specials we give ourselves a bit more flexibility. We have a guest today who is going to be with me and co-host, andrew Hague. Hello, sir, peace out, how are things, man? Good, yeah, we're going to be after. Last time we did a Mysteries episode and we cracked a lot of cases, didn't we?
Speaker 3:so we thought really we should put our skills back in action and see if we can solve some more. I like how Clee described that, because obviously we pre-recorded this. I'm not sure when it's going to go out, but I was hammered on, sat there and I tried to describe to Webber from Tufti Club and Ege and I thought you were as pissed as me what we were doing for this episode. I just couldn't get it out. All I kept saying is right, what it is right. It's coming much easier, could it?
Speaker 2:So we looked at it and we're trying to solve them.
Speaker 3:In my head. I knew what I wanted to say. Every time I could stop to thought I've got it this time right. Nothing came out. We were like yeah, so that's it, that's all you needed. That's all I needed to say yeah, and actually we've done one previously that you could have pointed them in the direction of.
Speaker 2:so if, by the end of this, you like this, you think we've found, or maybe you've got, some theories that you think could help us if we can't solve it Similar to last time, by the way if we think we've cracked it, you're going to hear this oh mysterious girl, come on and get close to you and if we think we're not quite there, then you're probably.
Speaker 1:Well, you are going to hear this. I know you are.
Speaker 2:I don't think we played the last one. Last time I think we cracked all six, didn't we? No, there might have been one last time, but what's the one?
Speaker 1:A quite different story. Yeah, I think we got it right. I think we got it right. I think we got it right. I think we got it right I think we got it right.
Speaker 3:I think we got it right. We got all six, didn't we?
Speaker 2:No, there might have been one last time but what's the one I can't remember.
Speaker 3:I can't remember. I thought we got it right, we got a good record, though we're the devil's hoos. I don't think we've properly got to the bottom of that, did we?
Speaker 2:I don't think Well, I know some number stations, did we crack that anyway? Yeah, well, anyway, I think we did, didn't we? Yeah, we'll crack on.
Speaker 3:Let's get into it. I'll start. So this is the Joe Annelo Pesmistre. Have you ever heard of it before?
Speaker 2:then you told me you were going to do it. No, I didn't know of it.
Speaker 3:Historically, so January the 14th 1989, mwaq Channel 5 under their broadcast, in the same way that they did every night. This was on 24 hour TV. Sorry, this would be before 24 hour TV. So do you remember where the close downs used to get Obviously on the BBC and stuff like that? Obviously they did the same in America and what they used to do on this channel is play the National Anthem, same as we did actually. We used to play the Globe going round and then the station had closed down. But on January the 14th 1989, after the anthem, the station didn't close down and instead showed a blurry, black and white photo of what it looks like a woman. But it's hard to tell because the pictures that unfocused so, the previous image, the actual image yeah, the image, didn't it?
Speaker 3:yeah? And it just says missing and it says Joe Annelo Pes, and then there's a phone number which did lead to Chicago's missing persons unit. So there's no music, there's no voice over, just a blurred photo of a woman. It looks like Deidre Rashid style glasses.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she's got like sort of bug eyes, isn't she like big, massive sort of bug eyes?
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's like John Major glasses. Orchard Martin just had the eyes of a fly. That's why no one's like founder. But what's unusual with this, obviously, is a lot of missing people and stuff that never gets solved. But what's unusual with this is the image stayed on the screen all night, like all the way through the night. Imagine waking up in the middle at 9.TV and seeing that it'd be horrible. The station never shut down, which it normally does. It used to fade to black and it just stuck on this until the morning and the programme started up again and the picture were never mentioned. And this is the only time this station ever showed a missing persons photo, so it wasn't a usual occurrence and it's never been done on this channel before or since. So that weird enough for you, liam, so far.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm looking at. By the way, I don't know if you've got more to add to it, but there's like a sort of recently polished up version of the image.
Speaker 3:Someone's put something together where they've tried to like make the picture a little bit more, because it's just a blurred, horrible picture. There's no way someone's finding it, but anyway it gets weirder. So we heard nothing about this. John Loper wasn't mentioning the news in the local area, not in newspapers, nothing at all for two years. Just this one picture on this one channel. Then in 1991, two years later, on the same station, same thing happened. They played the national anthem in preparation to shut down and once again it was followed by this blurred picture of John Loper's. This time they were only for a few seconds and it went off really quick. So people have got in touch with the station who confirmed the station confirmed that the photo was sent to him anonymously and it didn't come from the place. They don't know what. It's mad, but what do they mean?
Speaker 2:Is that the mystery? Just what we've got trying crack.
Speaker 3:You've got to try and crack. There's a lot of things here. Who is John Loper's? Why does this station just put her up this one twice as well? Why is there no mention of her anywhere else? No trace of a John Loper's living in Chicago, where this would put her out, and why did they do it again two years later?
Speaker 2:So the second one could be a red herring, the second one could be somebody. I do remember that thing that happened ages ago. We could put that up again, so I don't think it's necessarily.
Speaker 3:I think the 1991 might have been an accident, because he came on for like a quick second and I don't know why they started hanging around, but they might have started hanging around and they might have sort of, you know, oh god, I've put that up.
Speaker 2:So yeah, do you dare me to press that? That put that thing up before and someone like no, you can't. I've pressed it, take it off quick.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it could be that. Why is the picture so blurred? Why is it such a shit picture?
Speaker 2:So as it stands today, then we don't know if this was a genuine missing person.
Speaker 3:I don't know if it's a missing person or a hoax or anything. We don't know, if this person existed, who. The person in the picture was like a sage. He looks like a fly.
Speaker 2:And he's polished up image. This girl looks like a girl, but it could be a boy, but this person has never been found. Never been found.
Speaker 3:Now there were a few dead ends where someone thought they got in touch with someone, called something else I'm not right like that, but it was basically a dead end. They thought he might have been there, but then she's just cut contact. But I think she would probably take it personally just to try and get a bit of fame.
Speaker 2:So I haven't looked into the theories around this, but I don't know if you have, but to me yeah, either. This is just somebody thinking I'd say what would be really funny. Let's just get a random picture of someone, put it up and just freak people out, and there was just a bit of a prank people doing it. Still find it odd that nobody's ever sort of said oh, that picture was out of a magazine and this is who it actually was.
Speaker 3:So another thing I did think of is obviously America's massive. Did it somehow get into the wrong hands? Did they mean to send it to another station and it ended up there? But why has he got the Chicago number on it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and is this actually a person who went missing? And someone didn't sort of dare to speak out formally, but then how would they get in? This has got to be right. So here's my thinking right, it's either a prank or this is a backhander. Somebody's given somebody an envelope of money and said, please, this person is missing. I can't go through the proper channels. Can you just put this up, please? And if they've managed to get hold of someone who works at the station, who's made it work?
Speaker 3:Oh, I suppose another thing is could it be like, as someone phoned up and said, put this up? Is this every anonymous call, or the photo is sent in anonymous? Have they put the Chicago thing on it? Yeah, so hold on then so where's so?
Speaker 2:the station put it up deliberately.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so the station put it up deliberately because they got it sent in and said put this up.
Speaker 2:But they weren't told by who, or yeah, so definitely then there's some cash exchange hands there. Someone's been told do, as a favor, put this up. Somebody there has just decided yeah, let's just do it. Don't know what it is, yeah, possibly they might have added in the Chicago information.
Speaker 3:I think that's might be it. I think we cracked the case.
Speaker 2:Well, I don't know though, have we, because we're still, but I don't know if it's for us to crack. Which bit are we trying to crack, because we can't possibly have a look at every person in the world to see who this person is.
Speaker 3:No, I think this possibly was a real. This is my theory. I think it might have been a real missing person, but I'm wondering if it's gone to the wrong area, like I said, and that's why they were now trace of a juvenile opus living in Chicago.
Speaker 2:I wonder if they've got all the wrong name, or if there's somebody who says look.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've got the wrong name, or something and I've been passed this information by Joanna Lopez.
Speaker 2:Can you put it up? And they've put it up with that name.
Speaker 3:Why is the evidence and that makes sense as well actually where they've never used this before? Because he's ended up in the wrong hands, if you know what I mean. But they've never done a missing thing before, so they thought oh yeah, we better do this actually.
Speaker 2:I'm not filming this at night, by the way, and I'm sat in the dining room with all the lights off and it's quite creepy with this bug-eyes thing looking at me.
Speaker 3:It's a horrible thought just put in Jennifer Lopez, joanna Lopez.
Speaker 1:I'm still Jenny from the block.
Speaker 3:I'm just saying don't you wish you'd get all friends hot like me? What is she saying? Jennifer Lopez, Jenny from the block, and I'm still Jenny from the block yeah. Wait until tonight.
Speaker 2:Whoa, I don't know if you've. I'm not sure, because now I've introduced this ex files thing. I've kind of tied us to one or the other now. So what?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think that's my theory. You can never say we've cracked it realistically, but I think that's. I think if you went into a police department and put that floor where they put, the floor We've given them enough, haven't we? Yeah, we've given them enough. I think they'd be able to sort it from there.
Speaker 1:Oh, mysterious girl, I wanna get close to you.
Speaker 2:Right. So my first one I don't know if I've done the same as you actually, because that first one I've kind of gone into a lot of detail and then I thought if I do three like this it's just going to take too long, so I've trimmed them down. My first one is it's a famous one to anyone who's kind of gets into mysteries and this sort of thing. There's loads of podcasts out there about it. There's loads of theories, but I think it's about time we solved it. So this one is the Dyatlov Pass incident. Oh yeah, referred to in Russian as the death of the Dyatlov toll group. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So this was an event, predominantly getting this from Wikipedia. Well, I'm reading it from Wikipedia, so that's exactly where I'm getting it from. So nine Soviet hikers died in the Yoram Mountains and it was February 1959. And the circumstances were really mysterious. I'm paraphrasing now because I don't want to read it all. So experienced trekking group contain lots of people who knew what they were doing. Eger Dyatlov was one of the guys who was leading it, which is why the incident was called what it is. So they set up camp on an Eastern slope of the mountain, Something I'll come to later. It wasn't actually in Dyatlov Pass, it was close to what's now the Dyatlov Pass. It wasn't actually there where the incident happened. But the camp took overnight and the summary I'll go to a little bit more detail, but the summary is during the night they cut their way out of the tent and they all leave the tent. None of them address properly, they leave all the stuff behind and they're all killed. So, in its kind of short summary, that's what happened. Have you heard about this before?
Speaker 3:I'm going to fill up a bit more detail. Some of them were found naked and stuff, weren't they?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so if we're going to sort of so all the groups. Bodies were discovered the term is. Six of them died of hypothermia, while the other three had been killed by physical trauma. One victim had major skull damage, two had chest trauma, one had a small crack in his skull. Four bodies were found in running water, three had soft tissue damage to head and face, two had missing eyes, one had a missing tongue, one had missing eyebrows and the investigation said a compelling natural force caused their deaths. There's been loads of theories put forward.
Speaker 3:I'll go on to some of them in a bit more detail, but my initial thought for this and I've read about it before, I'm not really like thought about it too much is did something happen? Obviously, the campsites have a tendency and everything. As you said, it sort of I don't know. They were a massive snowstorm or something like that, so they had to run out. That's why some of them cause they weren't wearing shoes and stuff, were they? So I wonder if, like some of them, were just running out and oh my God, it's snowfall and they've just had to run out and then the snowfall that has got some of them, you know, killed them and that's why you've seen all these?
Speaker 2:Well, these are experienced people. Yeah, they know the best place to be in a snowstorm is in the tent. So the theories and actually some of the details aren't listed on Wikipedia but are quoted in other multiple different things that I've looked to and listened to. So one of the guys had burns on his head and one of them actually apparently, according to a couple of things, were a bit in a piece of his hand and it was in his mouth when they found it.
Speaker 3:I wonder, though, that is, if they're dying of, you know, freezing to death. Obviously you go mad, but yeah, you eat your hand, but you do obviously your oxygen, your brain and all that. Did he just sort of? Is it just almost like, I don't know, like mania?
Speaker 2:you know panic, yeah, possibly but it's mad for the full group to kind of panic in the same way and somebody injured, they sustained, they said we're a really serious trauma.
Speaker 3:I think it makes sense that there were some of them had no clothes on, because, obviously, when you get hypothermia, you start to burn up, don't you? Your body feels like it's burning up, so you are hot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so what you're talking about there, which I didn't know the name of this, but is paradoxical, undressing, which is when people get hypothermia, that's what?
Speaker 3:because I know that happens because obviously when I went to take well tangerine breeze, I always, like I forgot, stuck in fridge what happened. And then I read into it and it turns out you get quite hot, so it's all right, is it just for when they find you naked in the fridge?
Speaker 2:This is your alibi.
Speaker 3:Thanks to her. It's some I don't know.
Speaker 2:Paradoxical, undressing Chicken nuggets. So yeah, some of the theories are avalanche, but actually and again this is quite sketchy and obviously this is kind of a Soviet Union in the Cold War.
Speaker 2:So the information is difficult to get, but avalanche is a common one but they weren't really in a place to. There's something more recently called a slab avalanche that's been proposed. There's a different type of avalanche but it doesn't seem to work. There's actually sort of pictures of the camp with ski sticking up and things that it couldn't really have been an avalanche without damaging the camp. Yeti has been proposed, so some kind of monster came. No real evidence of that, hold on.
Speaker 3:So obviously these are the Russian people thought they'd been done in battle, They'd seen something and the Russian intelligence had to kill off. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So catabatic wind was something which is really violent wind that caused them all to leave, but again they were safer in the tent. Infrasound, which is that the wind created a frequency that creates terror and they all ran out that certain sounds.
Speaker 2:How did that happen? That's interesting Military testing. So there was apparently pictures that they took that showed lights in the sky and potentially, as you said, either some kind of military explosions going off around them and they panicked, or possibly that actually I don't know they'd seen something they hadn't and they had to be done away with. Like you said, something that I came across today on a YouTube video that seems a little bit more makes sense, but I don't know. It's apparently in it they were trying to get like uranium rich soil.
Speaker 2:So they were a geologist team in the area and they used these kind of like these bombs that explode above the ground and what they do, something to do with loosens of soil for further investigation. I don't know the technical side of it, but that to me seems to make perfect sense that because they found some trees in the area that had been burned on the tops and also the guy with a burn on his head was he outside Did something go off nearby and it just caused them all to think they were under attack and they all ran out. Yeah, that's good, yeah so, but there's no answers on this. There's loads of theory. There's some people who kind of think it's now being solved. I think the biggest thing to me is that, well, one of them apparently as well had potential KGB connections, so he was a lot older than the rest, a military man covered in sort of military tanks and all those things, and there's things that he was.
Speaker 2:He had a camera that none of them knew about, which people suggested that perhaps they were in the area to take pictures of things, or at least he was that he shouldn't also. Yeah, yeah, I don't know. It's another one that I think I don't know if you can actually solve this one, because it's difficult on this because obviously you're never really going to know the truth.
Speaker 3:But I'm doing this in a you know, you're the officer, you're the judge, should we say and these theories are being put forward, Are you accepting any of these theories? Are you happy to go on with your conscience clear that, yeah, I think that's probably what's happened. That's enough for me. That'll do for me Bang.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a good way of looking at it. I suppose like this with my family, one of them would be happy. I've got all the answers.
Speaker 3:That's the way we'll do it. We're in halfway through. Obviously, we always do these things on the hoof. If you're a family member, you say, yeah, that sounds good enough for me. Fuck it. Yeah so I'm saying I feel like my parents off jam when he goes. Oh yeah, that'll be him. Yeah, he's got glasses on.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think I don't know, I don't know. Look, when you look at some of the one of them's got eyebrows missing and stuff Like is this mental?
Speaker 3:I won't accept it.
Speaker 2:Where's?
Speaker 3:the correct answer.
Speaker 2:I think what's happened is this is my summary, but it doesn't seem to quite cover all bases and I'll tell you what. I think I might just solve it Right. Explosion at night, either military or geology, yeah, damage is one guy's head. They all panic, they think they're under attack, they think there's some kind of mass explosions. Well, there is. There's explosions all around them. They panic, they run out the stuff around, kind of what happened to him. A lot of that has been added in by kind of just to create mystery, because what people to do is to think, oh God, there were military explosions and we killed a load of students. So all the stuff around the injuries and stuff was either didn't actually happen or was done when they found the bodies.
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, the one solved right by next one is the dancing plague of 1518. I know I've sent you these, but I'm not meant to Too much about this, but this one is crazy, to be honest.
Speaker 3:I am at a loss for this one. So dancing plague of 1518. This is an event in where hundreds of citizens in Strasbourg, which was then a free city within the Holy Roman Empire, now in France dance uncontrollably and apparently unwillingly for days and end. The mania lasted for about two months and it ended as mysteriously as it began. So here's the story in July 1518. A woman whose name was given as Frau I think it's Frau Toffira or Trafura, something like that she stepped into the street and began dancing, and she was unable to stop. She kept dancing until she collapsed from exhaustion. After resting, she resumed the compulsive, frenzied dancing. She continued this way for days and within a week more than 30 other people were similarly afflicted in the city, all dancing the same. They kept going long past the point of injury, so they were having broken legs and all you know what I mean Just constant soles everywhere and stuff like that. In August, the dancing epidemic had claimed as many as 400 victims.
Speaker 3:Historical documents, including physician's notes, cathedral sermons, local and regional chronicles and even notes issued by the Strasbourg City Council, are clear that the victims danced, and it is not now why Historical sources agree. There was an outbreak of dancing after a single woman started dancing, and the dancing did not die down. It lasted for such a long time that it even affected the attention of the authorities until the council gave up to the authority to the doctors who prescribed the afflicted to dance themselves free of it. So the doctors were saying, yeah, carry on. You know you're fine, carry on, keep doing it, it'll be alright. But then people started dying. A stage was constructed and professional dancers were actually brought in to help them dance the way out of it. Yeah, I know, yeah, the town even hired a band to provide backing music. I think the doctors thought. I know the doctors thought.
Speaker 3:You know, they just get it out of them, you know what I mean. Like dance it out of them. But it wasn't long before he took his toll. Most dancers collapsed with sheer exhaustion, Some died from strokes and heart attacks. The Strange episode did not end until September, where the dancers were whisked away to a mountain top shrine to pray for absolution. Some sources claim that for a period the plague killed around 15 people a day, but that's you know, but the general acceptance of theories. It killed around 400 people. Explain that.
Speaker 2:So straight away, I'm thinking that there's massive exaggeration in this. I'm thinking like when you told me go to a fellow last night and there are hundreds of people watching and then it turns out like just you and Egi there. I just think this has got inflated over time. I agree with this.
Speaker 3:I do agree with this, However there's something behind it.
Speaker 2:There isn't a substance.
Speaker 3:There there's historical documents, as I said. You know, you've got doctors, now you've got sermons, chronicles, which is like the you know because of the newspapers. Then it's not like a A no-line city council.
Speaker 2:Some kind of advertising ploy where it ties into a Jive Bunny release or something like that.
Speaker 3:Jive Bunny, come on. Yeah right, this is a weird one and, as you're right, I've done a lot of research into this one. See, it blew my mind. There are few people say look, there's no actual evidence that 400 people died. That's the theory based on what people know about. Obviously it's that long ago.
Speaker 2:We don't have the sort of when is it Sorry, what was the day again?
Speaker 3:1518.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, this is stories told about stories. I mean, what written evidence is there at the time then? Is there evidence?
Speaker 3:Well, this is what I mean, this is what's weird about it. The written evidence from the time definitely was the doctors now from the sermons and the chronicles and stuff are all from there, and they all mentioned that there was a mania sweep in the town where people couldn't stop dancing. So the point where the council gave up their powers to the doctors to try and stop it, that did happen.
Speaker 2:But let's think logically right. So you've only got so much energy before you collapse. You cannot. Nobody like ultramarathon runners.
Speaker 3:But he says, though, like frow to free Trophyre, however, the first one she had a rest for a bit and then, as soon as she woke up, that's just someone who likes a bit of dancing in it.
Speaker 2:She's done some dancing and then she's had a rest and then she's.
Speaker 3:It's a bit of a frenzy dance, but yeah, but yeah. She kept going past the point of injury, going to the notes. Right, this is the problem with this. One is like again, you have to take it at face value. I don't know why these are historical. If you'd have said this to me, I'd say oh, wifetail myth never happened. These are historical documents and stuff are really really odd. There's no documents that anyone actually died, but I don't understand why it was seen as like this there was some sort of yeah okay, so there was some kind of hysteria.
Speaker 2:It's not like the invention of the piano or something, is there? Just somebody's playing some good songs and all of a sudden, everyone has a little shuffle.
Speaker 3:Maybe the notes have been sort of misinterpreted through time, where they've said like oh, the mania swept the town. It would be because they were a good band or something. You know what I mean. But like I'd say, Is this then?
Speaker 2:because I don't know why it exists from 1518. Is this paper work or is this real documents that have been dated from the time? Or is this reports from the 1900s that say documents at the time said there is real evidence from the time of people reporting this.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm just reading now on historycom and it says well, the best document of these plays historical documents of the time. All agree that in the dual life that year in the streets of Strasbourg a single woman began to dance in a frenzy way and more people joined in.
Speaker 2:Gas attack.
Speaker 3:I was thinking because we've only been in this place, this one city. Could there be something in water? A bit mad.
Speaker 2:Yeah, somebody spiked him either deliberately or accidentally.
Speaker 3:Yeah, or someone selling something nuts.
Speaker 2:Or someone with a barrel of mead that had some fungus in it or something, or did they all go to the same.
Speaker 3:I don't know restaurant. I don't know if they had restaurants then, but I don't know magic mushrooms, or Do you know?
Speaker 2:what I mean. Yeah, some kind of psychedelics, and maybe if it was in certain batches of barrels, they were all still drinking it every day?
Speaker 3:Yeah, because even when they were dancing, so they were just constantly, until it ran out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so they were going home at night for their rest and they were having another drink of spiked.
Speaker 3:Pure MDMA, by the way.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:I think that's the most.
Speaker 2:I think, you've cracked it. I think it's spiked sort of mead or porridge or something like that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so it's something that everyone I end up drinking it every day.
Speaker 2:She would first want to have it. She opened the first barrel of this contaminated batch. She's off. Others seeing her having a bit of a dance. They took the same thing. Oh, look at that. Yeah it's like a rave, isn't it? It's like a rave every day.
Speaker 3:Do you remember Space? What's his name of Space? Is it Tires? You know he just dances to everything, Like Kettles going off. He's just took that many pills. Would you like to die this way, Linn?
Speaker 2:Yeah, maybe. Yeah, that off your head, that like all the sounds around you, like you're sort of dancing like horses walking past.
Speaker 3:What kind of music were they having in those days?
Speaker 2:I mean, I know it weren't like I think it'd be early for the rave scene, wouldn't it?
Speaker 3:I'm not the first I see. That'd be amazing, that wouldn't it. We've just got quite documents there.
Speaker 2:When rave was invented.
Speaker 3:Another document from the council said it was thought to be the first electronic music ever.
Speaker 2:I bet if you've got like old pictures of time, Bez will be there like dancing in background.
Speaker 3:I'm not sure, apparently, organ and lute pieces that they used to listen to. So you know a bit of the old organ now, yeah, so yeah, that's it. I think we've cracked that one.
Speaker 2:Right. Next one, another famous one I've not got as much detail the Mary Celeste, apparently often wrongly pronounced the Mary Celeste. So on December the 4th, not 1872, a British-American ship called the Mary Celeste was found empty and adrift in the Atlantic. It was seaworthy, with cargo, fully intact, except for one life boat, which appeared to have been boarded in an orderly fashion. So, sailing from New York for Genoa in Italy, captain Benjamin Briggs, seven crew members including his wife and two-year-old daughter, loads of supplies enough for months and months. Really luxurious sewing machines on there, a piano was on there.
Speaker 2:The kind of general reviews, regardless of kind of why they weren't on there, is that it's really, really unusual for a crew just to leave in the way that they did. Obviously ships get abandoned, but generally there's some evident reason why there was no damage to the boat. The last diary entry before they left nothing unusual, nothing in there at all. That wasn't different to the day before. So it was discovered and found and yeah, that's it, not much more to it than that. I mean, often on films you sort of see that they were halfway through a meal and things, but I couldn't really find any evidence of that.
Speaker 2:It was just said that it was left and it was fully ship-worthy loads of supplies. I mean, there's almost a bit of an obvious sense to this, isn't there? But let's see what you think and then I'll tell you some of the theories. Errr.
Speaker 3:Is it just a case of I don't know, like they sort of just fucked off? You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:That's kind of what I'm hinting at. If the lifeboat was gone something. Obviously. I suppose the mystery is what we know, that presumably we assumed they got on the lifeboat, unless that was already herring to make us think they got on the lifeboat. But if we assumed they got on the lifeboat and just left, why, when they had supplies and the boat was in good working order, why did they just leave?
Speaker 3:Did they see another boat? They want to go to another country, Like you know what I mean. I don't know what.
Speaker 2:Halfway through me. Is that another boat? Yeah, should we go to another country?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2:Do you know what I mean Is?
Speaker 3:that the same thing Did someone like, or did they get hijacked?
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, I mean. So some of the theories are mutiny. So they wanted to turn down the captain and killed him and his family and then they left Insurance fraud. So not quite get that, but some kind of insurance scam. I don't quite know who would be that. So the rescuers said about the found them the day Gracia people said did they find them in distress for some reason, you know, possibly somebody ill, and enticed them onto their boat and then killed them and say there was nobody on the boat Because they tried to claim salvage for so sort of claim it was theirs now because they salvaged it.
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I like that so pirates.
Speaker 2:but that's pretty much dismissed because.
Speaker 3:What about an explosion of sob and salt, like if it just sort of I don't know?
Speaker 2:There is a slightly mad theory that's not too far away from that. Yeah so pirates, but they said because they didn't take any of a lot of the expensive stuff on there seems crazy, yeah, no point. Water spouts don't quite get that. I don't know if that's like tornadoes, but I don't know why you would see that and think right time to go. It's more dangerous on a lifeboat.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah yeah, seacwakes, so earthquakes on the seabed. That yeah, it's sort of said. Possibly this is to me is clutching a little bit of straws, but this is kind of where you got to almost. Is that? Potentially that could have dislodged some of the sort of storage and some of the alcohol fumes could have got up and then that possibly ignited and Really I'm okay. Yeah, it's a bit, but I suppose all these belts maybe had to happen once and this was the one, the old alcohol fume explosion. But yeah, then they reckon that could have made him think the belt was exploding because the fumes ignited. So they all left.
Speaker 3:What about? What could they could? They've just like lost, lost the direction of where they were going in things and they were just in middle of nowhere.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that is a theory is getting lost. They potentially I mean so this one kind of seems to make a little bit more sense to me. So previously and this is all from the Clue Collective, by the way, this is what I'm reading now ClueCollectivecom so previously the boat had carried coal and they say potentially again, this is kind of trying to put several things together but it could have clogged up some of the pumps Because he had a full cargo in there. Without a working pump he wouldn't have any way to know how much water was actually on the boat. And also there seemed potentially there could have been something wrong in a chronometer that made them think they were slightly closer to the coast than they were. So potentially they thought we don't know how much water we got on board. We're not far away from the coast, let's just go.
Speaker 2:But again I struggle a little bit with it. They've got a really expensive loaded with cargo. It's fully stocked. I get it. If some go, you know, if maybe three or four left to get help, why just leave the boat with nobody on it? It's worth a massive amount of money.
Speaker 3:It seems like the giant squid, by the way, is another one. Oh yeah, obviously, yeah, the old giant squid. They've obviously left the boat for some reason and dive seemingly, you know, just moot. They must have thought something wrong, that boat, in terms of poison smoke. Did they think it wrong? I said, did they think it wrong Fire? And it wasn't, I don't know.
Speaker 2:You said they could have eaten some bread that had a fungus in it that made them go mad.
Speaker 1:They had some bugs again.
Speaker 3:I said they were all sold out. I said they were all sold out and Bezair again.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, apparently the bread that was left that they tested didn't show any signs of that, so they've dismissed that. I mean, the first part is did they leave the boat willingly? So did they want to go, or were they ordered to go?
Speaker 3:But there's no sign of a struggle, though I don't think they say nothing's been taken.
Speaker 2:No, so it seems like they left the boat willingly, yeah, so then it's just why I think, are we going back to your alcohol explosions.
Speaker 3:I think the explosion one is the best theory out of those people.
Speaker 2:And the shit. I think I've always thought about it before. I've always thought no, but like something more, like the water, the running low water. They think they're close to the coast, they make a dash for it, but as I'm thinking about it now, I don't believe some of them wouldn't have stayed on the boat. I don't know why everybody just abandoned the boat.
Speaker 3:Yeah, why everyone would?
Speaker 2:have. So I think the only reason everybody leaves Is if something you need a trigger, don't you? You need something, and I think this was the one. This was the alcohol fumes that lit on fire. That's it.
Speaker 1:Oh, mysterious girl, I want to get close to you.
Speaker 3:So my last one and you have to bear with me, Elyon, because I want to write rabbit, all of this. I thought this was when I was working on the album because I liked the clear coat, and it said what happened to Richie Edwards, the Manic Street Preacher's, guitarist and lyricist. You're aware of this guy, aren't you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, when you said it, I thought you meant Emma does the podcast. What's he called? Is he Richie Edwards?
Speaker 3:Jake Humphries. Oh yeah, I don't know why. I knew you meant Jake Humphries. Actually, that's way, way than itself. That's a mystery. Why did I know exactly that you meant Jake Humphries? The?
Speaker 1:Manic Street Preacher's guitarist. So bear with me, there's a lot to go out here. I thought this when I was growing up and I were into Manic.
Speaker 3:I thought I just you know he's topped himself. So he went missing on the first of February 1995, 27 year old, and no evidence has ever been found. So I'm going to tell you the story is pretty simple in that he went missing. But I just want to give a bit of background to whether he actually the questions are is he still alive, did he fake his disappearance or is he dead? So that's what we're at. So he was a troubled man. He once took a ride To his own arm after Steve Lemak in an interview question whether the Manics were for real or just a gimmick band, because at this point Manics, like they, used to wear makeup and had slogans like oh, he did it in the interview. Yeah, so in the interview he took out a razor blade.
Speaker 3:You can get pictures on it online, if you really want it, it's horrible and he razor blade it into his arm Far real, yeah so. And he took out a razor blade. He took it out into his arm Far real, yeah so. And Ed was later explained. He said he saw Lemak, saw the four of us, as hero, worshiping kids trying to replicate our favorite bands. There was no way we could change his mind. I didn't abuse him, I didn't insult him, I just cut myself to show that we were no gimmick and that we were pissed off and that we were for real. Well, mac had to call an ambulance. Like I said, there's pictures on the net, it's good. And he printed the picture and everyone went mad about it because obviously, but that doesn't prove the real does it?
Speaker 2:It just proves he's got issues.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it just proves he's a fucking madman. Yeah, so this guy yeah, this is a guy who was really troubled. His lyrical content backs up that as well, especially on the Holy Bible the unbelievable dark lyrics on the Holy Bible album, which was the last one before he disappeared that he was involved in the Last Manics album, but people weren't sure if he was. This is why the far real thing came in, because Steve and Matt were basically saying are you for real? Do you actually believe all this stuff, all this depressing stuff that you talk about, or are you just playing like a Nile-ish rock and roll, nile-ish? Sort of thing.
Speaker 3:So just an example here. I just want to read one of his lyrics. He was an anorexic as well. I don't know if it was officially like an anorexic, but he struggled a lot with his way and he did a song on the Holy Bible called Full Stone Seven Inch. One of the lyrics goes I eat too much to die, not enough to stay alive. I'm sitting in the middle waiting. Do you know what I mean? Like horrible, it's a horrible song. You're in an art hospital due to depression and alcoholism. And in one of his last ever interviews for MTV. This is not a clip I think we're going to play, but all our mystery is this Again, this is just a. I just wanted you to fit all the people listening to realise what kind of mindset this guy was in just before he disappeared. It was.
Speaker 4:I mean I think the older you get, the more life becomes more miserable, definitely. I mean all the people you grew up with died. You know your parents die, grandparents die, your dog dies, your energy diminishes, there's less books to read, there's no more groups to discover. You know, you just end up with barren wasteland, just trying to find something now, which never really occurs.
Speaker 3:By the way, do you know? I've sent you this clip, Liam, that guy with his mac, the guy interviewing him, I think about what he just said. He's got the biggest smile on his face, aren't I? He's like? So are I? And do you know who that is? I didn't realise, because we're doing something next week. Do you know the fucking song, the king King song, what's it called? You were going to have it and you're.
Speaker 2:Love and pride.
Speaker 3:Yeah, love and pride. It's him Really. Yeah, why? It's honest. What's this interview? He's saying all this horrible stuff about how depressed he is and he's got a big smile on his face.
Speaker 2:He's not even like a blind-kicks person, it's a grin like a massive grin.
Speaker 3:So you're probably thinking this is a shut case. Depressed man commits suicide. But this is the other side of it. He always said he'd never kill himself because he was stronger than that. His family and friends said he would never, ever talk about suicide. He'd never tried suicide in the past.
Speaker 3:In 1995, january 1995, he went missing. In February he started taking out £200 a day from his bank the maximum you could draw out. Then. Edwards withdrew a total of £2,800, which is £5,500 in today's money, and nobody has any idea where that money is or where it was spent or anything. So on the 1st of February 1995, it was seen in a London hotel ready to fly to America, with James Dean Bradfield, singer of Manic Street Preachers from Perotian Altaur Ian is a singer. Bradfield checked into the London Embassy Hotel. I had a flight across the Atlantic the next day.
Speaker 3:The following morning when Bradfield went round to rouse his bandmate, no answer came from the room. When our hotel staff opened the room they found the room empty, apart from a handful of personal items. His sister said that immediately sent alarm bells ringing because it was completely out of character for him. Edwards had took his wallet, his car keys, some Prozac and his passport. He then drove to his flat in Cardiff and left behind his passport on Prozac. In the two weeks that followed, edwards was spotted in the Newport passport office at the Newport bus station by a fan who was unaware that he was missing. Eventually we're getting to the crux of it now.
Speaker 3:A silver voxel was found at the now defunct Austin Ost service station next to the old seven bridge, which is known as a suicide site. This is why I believe that it's just jumped from this bridge, but the steering wheel had a lock in it. His sister says why would you worry about someone stealing your car if you were in that sort of chaotic thinking about ending your life? The arguments against the suicide all pretty much come from one book called With Drawn Traces, which was Searching for the Truth about Richie Manig, by Saara Howes Roberts and Leon Noakes. They did this book in collaboration with Richie's sister, and in this book it's revealed that other people in his family had also shut themselves off from family and friends and just disappeared, just moved away, didn't speak to anyone.
Speaker 3:His notebooks and diaries are full of analysis of characters and literature of people staging disappearances and how they do it. One book talks about in his notebooks called A Novel with Kel Kaine and this is the book he gave to a friend the day before he went missing and just said just read the introduction of this. And in the introduction of that book the author starts talking about he's in a mental asylum and then he disappears and he's planning his disappearance. Did you like this? He also used to say his favourite show was the Rise and Fall of Reggie Perrin. I was just thinking.
Speaker 1:Reggie Perrin.
Speaker 3:He always used to say that his favourite show was the Rise and Fall of Reggie Perrin. If people don't know, reggie Perrin is a guy who stages disappearance and comedy. There's a theory that he had an undiagnosed autism as well, and this is really really odd as well. He had a meeting in the hospital with a woman who later left for Israel when he was in a rehab for his alcoholism, and he kept saying he wanted to go to Israel to meet, and he had tattoos all over his body about Israel because he was that desperate to go and meet this woman that he met in this thing. No one's been able to trace her whatsoever. That's it, liam. It's a long one, but dead alive.
Speaker 2:What happened? A couple of things there. So Reggie Perrin someone we knew at Sainsbury's who recently died came up with one of the best nicknames I've ever heard. So when somebody left Sainsbury's again another mate they left all the clothes behind in the canteen. So Craig Shaw used to call him Reggie Perrin because he left his clothes on the beach.
Speaker 3:Brilliant. You left that day. You didn't like quitting in a hole, if it was just the final day yeah yeah, they don't have to do any uniform, so he took it off and just left the incantation and walked out. Reggie Perrin. So, I always say in Liam, this depressed guy killed himself. But that's the one hand of it. On the other hand, this is the guy who was obsessed with staging disappearances.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, you can't get away from that, can you? And I think but one thing I'd say about the car lock so I, why won't it be now, about 20 years ago? I just passed my driving test and I rolled my car over onto its roof.
Speaker 3:It went straight to suicide bridge.
Speaker 2:No, I was driving in the Peak District bit an experience that night got my road drunk, locked my brakes, spun the car and flipped it onto its roof and I climbed out with a broken glass everywhere. The windscreen was all shattered, but for some reason I went back in to try and turn the radio off. I had it in my head that I should turn the radio off so, and obviously I wasn't thinking straight like it was kind of all over the place, but for some reason I just remember thinking, oh, I should turn the radio off. So I don't think it's impossible that if he has gone there to kill himself, there could still be some routine part of his brakes.
Speaker 3:Yeah that, I get that and he could put the steering lock on just because it's habit.
Speaker 2:It's what he does. Why did you say that?
Speaker 3:What was my name?
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I mean to me. To me there's too much for it to be coincidence that he's not done a Reggie Perry, and I think he's gone off somewhere.
Speaker 3:Richie Perry. Yeah, and another thing, obviously what backs up that is, why would he go? He went back to his flat in Newport and just left his old passport and his Prozac, which is Prozac, obviously. Imagine you can't get through customs. He's left his old passport, presuming like because he's faking a new one. I would have thought, yeah, he's got another one.
Speaker 2:Doesn't need that one. I mean, all that money was that to buy a fake passport, was it?
Speaker 3:to send it somewhere else.
Speaker 2:I just think like to me normally it'd be like ah, yeah, but. But actually he did once read a book about a man who vanished and reinvented himself. But there just seems to be too much there for it to be coincidence, it's like a bit of a Reggie Perry.
Speaker 2:He gave his friend a book telling him about that, yeah, taking all his money out or taking as much as he could out, I've done about necessarily the Israel thing. I think that's not necessarily true. I think probably he's had to go somewhere. I think you could go there and reinvent yourself. I think if you went to Israel and he, you know, grew long hair and a beard and just kind of lived by their customs and didn't stand out, and I think you probably could do that, I think you could probably vanish in Australia if you could get over there. I think that's big enough.
Speaker 3:I think you could easily go off the record over there I know every family would say this His family, I've said that they don't. They don't think he'd he'd have done it to him what he's done. But then again, the opposite is he killed himself, which is yeah. And if it was?
Speaker 2:that if it was kind of either look, I can't carry on like this, I'm either going to kill myself or I'm going to have to just become somebody else, then I don't know which is. Yeah, I don't want to get into the psychology that. I don't know which is better, worse for his family.
Speaker 3:I don't know. Do you know what's interesting about it? I forget. The Manics still keep, so they split the royalty four ways. They still keep money in his bank, like for him.
Speaker 2:Does he still withdraw the maximum amount every day? Probably if he did. He just stays closed in here.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's what I mean. I mean, I don't know it's, but it is bizarre, it is bizarre.
Speaker 2:I think in this day and age, I think it's very hard to just vanish. But I mean, when are we talking? 91, did you say yeah?
Speaker 3:sorry, 94. 95, 95, beginning of 95.
Speaker 2:I mean 95,. What would that? Would you be able to go and get on a plane and not be on every security camera? And if, if it wasn't really an issue for a few months, would the security camera footage be recorded over, or I don't know, because presumably, like freedom of information or whatever it is like, it's finally surely kind of requested videos from airports and things like that. Like how would you do it If you wanted to vanish? Would you go? I think I would go and get on a ferry to France, yeah, and then kind of just go off. Yeah, he has been spotted.
Speaker 3:He has been spotted.
Speaker 2:He's spotted. A new port, only what?
Speaker 3:No, no no, since people say they've seen him in India. Wansarotta yeah. The linnekes bar. Yeah. And there's quite a lot of the like sightings, but people fucking think they see Elvis. You know what I mean. I don't think that it's not conclusive, is it? Yeah, the investigative he is now he's not declared, he's not been declared legally dead, but he's presumed dead, you know. But he's still in the missing persons place because his family refused to declare him dead, which I don't think it's something a bit odd though in there, isn't it?
Speaker 2:So he's told his mate, read this book. And this is almost like you know, don't worry, I might have just gone off somewhere, but then he's left his car at a super side spot. It's like what.
Speaker 3:But that is that part of the disappearance, the perfect disappearance. Before I looked into this I thought no, was his mate not supposed to say anything.
Speaker 2:Maybe Was his mate supposed to keep it under his arm.
Speaker 3:There's another thing as well, by the way, that I didn't think of. Just before he vanished, a week before, a taxi driver picked him up and he said he will all the way through the journey. He was laid down in the back seat and he started speaking in a Cockney accent, which he wasn't a Cockney, he's a Welshman. And he said it were a really bizarre conversation. Was Reggie Perrin a Cockney? Was he from London, leonard Rossiter, weren't he? He was in London, rossiter, anyway, but he's yeah. So yeah, that's another thing.
Speaker 2:Was that him trying to create a new persona? I don't know. Was there even almost like I don't know, some split personality? Yeah, I could have been that, yeah. But then it's got conscious that if he's taking money out seems a conscious decision that he's preparing for something, doesn't it?
Speaker 3:And also I'd like to know.
Speaker 2:Like so, he's taken 200 quid a day out on the two weeks before he went missing. But is that unusual for him? Is there a pattern in the past where he's took 200 quid a day out and it's just that he's paying for his holiday or something?
Speaker 3:I don't know, is that unusual? Nothing that I've read in that. I think that's the thing for me. I think that money thing is the biggest sort of because if I were about to do my, I wouldn't, like you know, deprive my because obviously his money would go to his family. I wouldn't deprive them of that money, if you know what I mean. It's obviously quite a lot of money £5,500.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I think that's the point. I mean cashing your pocket if you're just going to go and finish it. So yeah, it seems like it was planning something. I think it's a Reggie Perrin, reggie Perrin, right, last one, I don't know. I've sold a lot of stuff, so last one for today, I'm putting a big ticket item out there for us to solve Ghosts.
Speaker 3:Ghosts, just Ghosts. I know you've not talked about this because you were going to do the B incident, weren't you?
Speaker 2:Well, I'm including that within this. So yeah, the famous B incident we will come to, but I've not gone for a specific example of a haunting or a certain sighting of a ghost, so just gone for Ghosts in general, because I think we should aim high. I think we can solve this. So I've not really like, I say, I've not got specific examples, but obviously over time there's been hundreds, thousands, countless sightings of ghosts, rumours of poltergeist I'll even put them in of incidents of things happening. Where do you stand on it? Do you think it's possible? I don't, First of all, so necessarily. Do you believe? First of all, do you think there's any possibility that Ghosts, some entity of something that's died that still exists? Do you think that's possible?
Speaker 3:I'm not arrogant enough to think that I know everything that you know. There's obviously loads of things that we can't understand, so you're obviously not beyond the realms of possibility, but is it? Oh, I don't know if I am arrogant enough to think that, but speaking it doesn't make any sense whatsoever, as far as I know anyway. But yeah.
Speaker 2:There's so much Things like you know, like these things when somebody's dying, and they're going towards a lie and I don't. I'm opening the door even bigger here, but in terms of after death, do you think there's anything, or could there be anything?
Speaker 3:It could be. I don't think there is, because I don't like again. I always think about these sort of things as like sort of you can only use what evidence you've got and I've got no evidence to suggest that is the case whatsoever.
Speaker 2:So we're going to come to some evidence that contradicts what we're going to say.
Speaker 3:Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah but yeah, but it's as, like the afterlife thing nothing suggests and as far as I know, like I mean, look, there's people far smarter than me who believe in an afterlife. You know satanism, or have you?
Speaker 2:but from the majority of things that I've read, so I think I've taken us down a bit of a wrong route there, a bit of a cul-de-sac. Let's forget whether there could be, or there is, anything after death.
Speaker 3:I struggled with it. There is nothing.
Speaker 2:Yeah well, unfortunately it's kind of what I believe. But then I've seen people in my family who kind of have faith or something further has added to their lives and maybe no, dad, does he get Irish Catholic, can I? Yeah, I mean he doesn't go to church as much as he did. But yeah, I mean my grandma I'm thinking more and even something great aunt was a nun and they've certainly sort of found some comfort in religion. But we're not sorry, I don't like where we're going with this.
Speaker 3:Let's just come back to ghosts.
Speaker 2:Let's just come back. Have you ever seen a ghost?
Speaker 3:I've never seen a ghost, no, but I have one thing that I can't. I think everyone has got something that they can't explain. I listened to the uh, what's it called? Come on, uh, scarf of Life podcast. Brilliant, absolutely fantastic podcast. It's about things that scared you when you were a kid and one of the house on there says he doesn't believe in ghosts, he doesn't believe in afterlife or anything like that, but he used to work in a shop that everyone said were haunted and he says he often comes up with stories about things in there that he can't explain. And if you're going to go on to the bead store, right then, that's something I can't explain.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so so I don't believe in ghosts. If I read this from I think this is from Wikipedia, where I took this but the overwhelming consensus of science is there's no proof. Ghosts exist. Their existence is impossible to falsify and ghosts aren't classified as pseudoscience. Despite centuries of investigation and this is the kind of key phrase despite centuries of investigation, there is no scientific evidence that any location is habitable by spirits of the dead. So, despite hundreds of thousands of hours of recordings of video and pictures, there's never been one provable instance of a ghost however, I'm on quora now and someone's put do ghosts exist?
Speaker 3:and he's put yes, they do, because I speak with my dead girlfriend every day as you commit suicide in 2013.
Speaker 2:So yeah, and that's so, that's fine. So what I would say there is, you know, if he's built some kind of coping mechanism, that's fine.
Speaker 3:I personally, sorry, it shouldn't be laughing. He says he tells her jokes. Imagine him just sat around his look, it's a no-one laughing what?
Speaker 2:are you doing? Yeah, my dead girlfriend is just telling me a cracker. Yeah, I think you can, but I think if you go somewhere that you that you told is haunted, you can. You can be overstimulated and you can see things and hear things you wouldn't normally.
Speaker 3:I understand that. So I just put in him, because I want to just give like examples of what you're talking about. There there were ones. I were in bed and I woke up and everything was flying off my walls. Clock came off wall. This sounds like a doobling ghost doing it. From this beginning of this. Speakers fell on floor, like everything, just like the wardrobe didn't fall. But you're like and I thought, well, that has to be a guy, there is no other possibility. That has to be a poltergeist. I couldn't get back to sleep. I was downstairs and I kept hearing things, thinking oh my god, that's a creak, there's a creak, there's something happening. They said I'll put TV on about three hours later and it was fucking earthquake. But what I mean is that I started hearing in that moment yeah, in that moment that I genuinely even I remember, like looking at my shoes, thinking they were.
Speaker 3:I swear they weren't there a minute ago. They've moved and that was obviously a man on head yeah, and I think yeah, so so there are instances.
Speaker 2:If you're somewhere, that's creepy, by the way, yeah, absolutely creepy situations can happen that you can't always explain in the moment, because exactly that's a prime example you've just given, but yeah, there's nothing ever provable. I've kind of got two weird examples. One of them were just I was walking on a field at night and 100 well, I doubt myself. I'm sure somebody was walking not far away from me because I thought it's a bit weird. Are they just walking along the same sort of route as me, like they're not crossing me or walking away from me? And then a car came around the corner and lit the field up that I was walking on and there was nobody there. That that was a bit odd.
Speaker 2:But I think that was just in my mind I was, it was dark, it was late, I was walking back and I just sort of imagined something maybe.
Speaker 3:But I thought I'd go stond the train track at Milhouse's, you know, behind sage bruce. But I don't think I did. I was walking home from work and I lost and I looked you know you do a double take and I thought I saw a woman walking up. It did shit me off, but it probably just my imagination that sounded like a uh oh, it's a monkey's look at that that at Milhouse's last neat I saw a ghost on the track at Milhouse's right.
Speaker 2:So so here's the incident that can't be explained, despite the fight, right, I think the solution is no, there are no ghosts. But and what? The reason I'm sort of saying all that stuff is because I think, if you're, if you're in the wrong mindset you creeped out, you can imagine something but me. And you were once sat in your living room. Yep, and what would the time of this be about? Dinner time, about half 12, yeah this was ages ago.
Speaker 3:This was one month. We took in 20 years ago something like that, yeah, and we were sat.
Speaker 2:Your mum, I think, was making us a sandwich or something in the kitchen, so so just me and you and your dog in the living room yeah and a bowl of glass beads behind us, absolutely out of nowhere. It wasn't just like you're sort of something moved, it went and like really rattled, right we both thought again.
Speaker 3:I'm getting the old shivers now thinking about it.
Speaker 2:We jerked around like what, what the fuck was that? Your mum come in and said we stopped messing about with them beads to you, assuming you'd done something with them. And we said we aren't moved that you went shut up, we're both just sat here, we aren't moved, that you ain't no way you're having me on. We said honestly, we aren't moved. What? All three of us just staring at the glass beads. You don't think a?
Speaker 3:dog would have bothered. No, you would just now, you would just blade. That I mean yeah, yeah, but not absolutely happened there's another time when it did happen right.
Speaker 3:That fucking did happen right, and I can't. That is everyone's got. What a story like this, I reckon, and if you are, please let us know it's. I love all this shit. I'm not a believer, but I don't know what happened there. The dog I can't explain that now and because I thought, like was the dog there, but the dog wasn't a dog used to be a dog, no way. And that one sulfur, because I think it might have been in his final years at that point and he used to be like he wasn't there.
Speaker 2:They were only us two in that room and my mum who were in the kitchen nobody in their room and and like, sometimes I sort of try and tell myself that maybe they were just stacked in such a way that the temperature changed and one of them moved and it just sort of dropped. But it was a definite like it, someone put their hand in and mixed them up it wasn't.
Speaker 3:Yeah, my mum came in going what you're doing?
Speaker 2:because it was like yeah, I've been in your bedroom once when a video sort of come out and fell off, but I can just think that was just balancing yeah, yeah, that could happen with anything that kind of though like there's loads of stuff but I mean the other thing. Like I, I stay in your spare room a lot. When we used to go out and obviously you told me that I think someone had died in the bath or something or died in the house or something. Yeah, and I was sorry go.
Speaker 3:I remember when um I made Mark said he he was sexually assaulted by a guy yeah so.
Speaker 2:But I used to have some like weird nights in there, never like terrified, like never sort of scared, but like used to think, just feel like someone was in the room when they were in the room. But if I said to you.
Speaker 3:You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Someone died in there, yeah exactly, and that's what I mean. So. So there's things that that I've sort of experienced in your house, that would be I never sort of terrified like not like a sort of nasty presence that I thought, fucking hell, I don't want it what about in yours?
Speaker 3:like, have you, have you no, never, really.
Speaker 2:No, I mean we're in your mum's. Uh no, I'm trying to give an example, like I mean, I suppose when you sort of stay in old country pubs and places like that and you sort of, it's a bit things are creaking and moving and once went to Birmingham for a.
Speaker 3:I went for a gear camera at work and then there were a pub. We were in a pub before and there were loads of ghost hunters in there, like about 20 of them. They all had like cameras and fucking contraptions and they're all writing things down. So probably the most haunted pub in England. And then I weren't scared because it was a full pub. But again I remember looking at an empty chair. There we were. It's on a phone. That's a bit weird. I wonder if that you know what I mean, like you can tell you something yeah, and that's kind of all.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, people might say I was, but I love that the stories are always like I was on my own, it was dark, it's like well, yeah, then you're already kind of we've got two witnesses here, three, yeah, but but our story was from a relaxed environment in a in a daytime. Well, it and I can't explain it. I mean, it's not. It's not to say it's ghost. I mean I suppose you could. You could just as likely say it was aliens, couldn't you that fired some sort of?
Speaker 2:yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, it's just something that.
Speaker 3:I can't explain. But honestly, if anyone's got any ghost stories, please let me know.
Speaker 2:We could do a fucking podcast just on ghost stories yeah, maybe, maybe we'll look at doing that, but yeah, I ain't got any. I mean a sort of prime example for me of kind of where these things come from. So I was once in Spain and we missed my flight. So I said, well, I'll have to stay the airport then and get on the first flight in the morning. Everybody left our our, so drive back to where we were. I don't think I had a mobile at this time, I'm not not sure, but or if I did, it run out of battery or something, something anyway. But they kicked me out the airport.
Speaker 2:It closed at night. It's in the middle of the woods in Granada. There's a car park there, not much else around it, and it it was horrible. It was the worst night of my life. I think I just had to walk around in a sort of abandoned car park in the woods. We like sort of dogs barking all around me and stuff and just just really eerie. But every single car. By the time it got to about 2am and all the lights had gone off like so they're hardly lit every car looked like there was somebody sat in it looking at me. Every, every shadow looked like somebody came around the car at me.
Speaker 2:It was so eerie and I think I get that your brain can can do things to you. I understand that. But yeah, if anybody's got examples of things that can't be justified by, oh, I was a bit creeped out and this happened this is case closed, by the way.
Speaker 3:So I'm just attacking ghosts and the first thing that come up was the independent ghost. Definitely don't exist, says Brian Cox. That's it, yeah, so I can't remember how many of them we sold, but I think we sold them all. We might have not been. I can't remember, obviously right an hour ago that we started or whatever, so I can't remember if we sold them all, but you know good to crack some cases on a on a Tuesday evening.
Speaker 2:Yeah if it can help some of the sort of officials on the way to get things done, then yeah, we're happy, to happy to help. Now sweat, always happy to help next up.
Speaker 3:It's another bonus episode and we were going to do again songs that we found ridiculous because we enjoyed doing that last last time. But we had a change of heart, emily, and you want to announce what it's going to be uh, it's probably a shudu, except forgotten.
Speaker 2:I know we did say a minute ago.
Speaker 3:It's going to be guilty pleasures, so we're going to pleasure. This course. It is five songs that we class as guilty pleasures and we've got a. So we've discussed a few of these Liam's like sent me a few and I've sent a few of them. Uh to to him should have said, and we've. We said like, oh, does this can? Because what counts as a guilty pleasure? So the way we've framed it is based on one of our mates, aren't we big Steve? Yeah, um, so I once getting a lift home from this guy, big Steve, big, I don't know, big, tough Yorkshire man, and he's about six, seven, four, not only the bastards, the fucking, do you know?
Speaker 3:I mean no, no, nonsense, and I yeah yeah, and I've got in his car and and, um, he fit his car and obviously he's left. It was taped, this all along. He got taped again and lady in red came out and he dived to take the cell. He dived to press stop and like inject to get he goes. He was like so ashamed that he had it on because and I just like there's what, what without me, he went uh, christyberg, live in Ireland. I love the island, live in Ireland. So this is how we're going to do it we're picking, we're taking someone home from work, a new starter. We're putting our you know putting the engine on what songs. We would be thinking oh fuck, I can't believe I was playing that before and this is gotta be guilty about him.
Speaker 2:This is harder for me than you, I think, because yeah, you've got no morals yeah, I wasn't gonna word it quite like that, but I'm not as bothered as you, so like it wouldn't embarrass me that much if I got in when I'm working on site, got in the car with a lot of lads and I'd got a raise your own, or if I've got spy skills on that, no, but this is the thing.
Speaker 3:We're good. We're trying to do songs that we have to like these songs and each song's there, yeah, the songs that you genuinely like, but I think you can't turn it off, you've got it on, you know, and you've got a new starter maybe I tell you what a girl, a girl, a girl's getting into your car. You're quite like the look of her. You know what I mean. She's.
Speaker 2:I just think, yeah, you've, maybe you've gone to uni and you've got a new friendship group and they get in your car for the first time and you think, oh, fucks sake, well, I was playing that again. It's harder for me, because I don't care that much about anything that I do play, but I can't think of example you'd have to defend after I think. I think that's yeah that's, I think, how we try to explain it in it, that potentially somebody could call you out on it and say what, what?
Speaker 1:are you?
Speaker 2:listening to and you feel that you've then got to defend yourself.
Speaker 3:You've got to make a case for it, yeah yeah, yeah, so songs that you'd have on you think, oh god, so you're all. You seem back of your head that you might have to explain this one yeah, I suppose like guilty pleasure as well, something like that.
Speaker 2:Maybe if you're in a group and it and it come on the radio, you kind of wouldn't acknowledge it, but if you just on your own in the car you might start sort of just dancing along to it, a little bit like. So people are probably sitting around in people's probably sitting around in.
Speaker 3:But I've looked at guilty pleasures less and they don't count to me as guilty people have got like Phil Collins in there and stuff like that. That's not enough for me.
Speaker 2:Well, I don't think you can write a standard list for guilty pleasure, because it's a very personal thing, like I think yeah, it's something that you think, oh god, I'm trying to impress this group of people and that was the last song I was playing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah yeah yeah, that's it, it'll be different, for it'll be different for all people. So, yeah, there's no right or wrong answer, but yeah, feel free to send us yours and we'll, we might. We might mention some at the end if anybody's got any yeah, yeah, yeah, right, enjoy that then, liam.
Speaker 3:More mystery solved, always good, always good, and I will speak to you next time yeah, yeah, nice one.
Speaker 2:Are we gonna give a time frame for the next one or just put it out when it's out?
Speaker 3:just put it out put it out, mate, put it out whenever it's out, it's out out if anyone wants to get in touch with us, send us anything.
Speaker 2:Find us on twitter at livingwithmade1 or you can send us an email at livingwithmadelycom.