Living With Madeley
"Living With Madeley" is a nostalgic TV based podcast that attempts to take a humorous look at some of the most weird, wonderful and woeful moments in UK television history.
Titled "Living With Madeley" as neither host can remember a week of their lives where Richard Madeley hasn't been on their screens, join Andrew and Liam as they take you on a journey to TV past.
Living With Madeley
Series 8 Episode 6: Blood On The Carpet: Walking With Disc Jockeys
What happens when a radio station overhauls its lineup and takes bold risks to win back its audience? Discover the dramatic story of BBC Radio 1’s transformation in the 1990s with the fascinating documentary "Blood on the Carpet: Walking with Disc Jockeys." Matthew Bannister and Trevor Dan spearheaded a mission to breathe new life into the station, challenging the reign of iconic DJs like Dave Lee Travis and Simon Bates in a bid to captivate a younger demographic. You'll gain insights into the cultural dynamics at play and the controversies stirred by these daring changes, all narrated with the rich voiceover talents of Jim Carter.
We take you on a nostalgic journey through Radio 1's storied past, reflecting on the abrupt exits of beloved DJs and the arrival of fresh faces like Joe Wiley and Lisa I'Anson. Amid the media backlash, the station's willingness to embrace change, including the edgy decision to ban Status Quo, showcased a strategic effort to rejuvenate its image. The internal shake-up even brought the irrepressible Chris Evans into the fold, thrusting the breakfast show into the spotlight with his larger-than-life personality and unpredictable antics. Our humorous recollections of the era’s outrageous fashion trends and on-air drama add a light-hearted touch to these tumultuous tales.
The saga continues with Chris Evans’ escalating demands for control and the subsequent tensions behind the scenes. His clash with Trevor Dan marked a turning point, as Evans’ refusal to share the limelight led to a dramatic fallout. Yet, Radio 1's evolution didn’t stop there; as one chapter closed, another opened with new breakfast show hosts like Zoe Ball and Chris Moyles, cementing the station's successful appeal to a youthful audience. We'll also indulge in some lighter fare, exploring current and past DJ lineups with a humorous twist, as we reminisce about iconic voices and the amusing challenges of keeping pace with today's radio scene. Join us for a journey through the highs and lows of radio history, where every twist and turn promises to entertain and enlighten.
Living with Maidly. Living with Maidly. Living with Maidly.
Speaker 2:Maidly. Living with Maidly. Hello and welcome to the podcast Living with Maidly. This is series 8, episode 6. It's a return to the normal episodes after the roadshow. I'm one of the hosts. Living With Madeley. This is series eight, episode six. It's a return to the normal episodes after the roadshow. I'm one of the hosts. I'm Liam Higginson. Is the other, Mr Higginson? How are you, sir?
Speaker 3:All right, good to be back and doing a proper episode. We haven't done one for a while. Obviously got three hours worth out of that roadshow, didn't we?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think we're going to probably touch on that more in a midweek, because we've had we've had praise, we've had hate, we've had mainly hate. We've had mainly abuse rightly so rightly so, yeah, yeah we'll go into that more in a midweek episode. We it was what it was, weren't it? You know, you live by the sword, you die by the sword, I think.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely, you live by the karaoke machine.
Speaker 2:You die by the karaoke machine.
Speaker 3:Yeah, disappointing all round, but, as we said, we'll get on to that. There were a couple of questions as well that we missed out, that we didn't realise until after, which we'll answer as well, which we tried to get through them all but, as you can probably tell, we were really drunk at the time. Elvino did flow, did get missed out. We're back to the real episodes now, and this is a documentary requested by Neil Peter Blood, on the Carpet Walking with Dishockey, from the year 2000,. And this is, as I said in the last one, it's a story by Matthew Bannister, born in Sheffield.
Speaker 3:by the way, matthew Bannister, I should have known that I didn't know that, yeah, and Trevor Dan took over Radio 1 and had a huge clear out of Radio 1 DJs in the 90s. Before we start, liam, I think we've already spoke about this. Both really enjoyed this, didn't we?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's one. I think we tried to give you a fair reflection before. I would recommend, if you've got the time it's about 45 minutes I think watch Blood on the Carpet, walking with disc jockeys on YouTube. I think it's particularly if you're sort of our age group, because I remember some of the names and it made me laugh just thinking back to some of these characters.
Speaker 3:Well, to be honest, I started laughing from. I want to play a clip, in fact the very first. Like the start of the documentary is an unbelievable voiceover, by the way, jim Carter, who were in Downton after later on.
Speaker 2:I was going to ask you that. Yeah, I thought it was him because I was trying to think for ages where I've heard his voice from and I thought it was going to be one of them where I say I was going to say the thick, woolen, dark, grey haired man, but then it came to me after a bit. I thought nice Downton Abbey. And I checked and it is him yep Downton.
Speaker 3:But this is the very start of the documentary.
Speaker 5:Dave, lee Travis, simon Bates, bruno Brooks, gary Davis. These were the most famous voices of a generation. Every week, 20 million listeners tuned in to their shows on Radio 1.
Speaker 2:Some of the music throughout this. You're in the driving seat for this and I'm not entirely sure what clips you want to play. Some of the music's great. It's like a horror film. It's psycho music, isn't it? A lot of it. Is that what it is?
Speaker 3:I'm trying to pick the way it actually came from. I'm sure it is. I'm sure it's the psycho music. It's like him walking through corridors sacking people background, like da-da-da-da-da, yeah, yeah, da-da-da-da, it's brilliant. So the documentary starts. We get a brief issue of Radio 1.
Speaker 2:Hold on. Should we just give like? Obviously what you were going to do, but should we give a summary of what this is about? Is that where you're going?
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, no, basically. Like I said at the start, it's just basically about when Matthew Bannister and Trevor Dan tried to change Radio 1.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so Radio 1 was starting to be perceived as the yeah, this is about yeah. This is not the youth scene anymore. These are older people, and they were brought into freshening things up, weren't they?
Speaker 3:Well, bannister's a talking head really early on and he said it became the sort of station that your mum listened to when it wasn't cool at all and obviously all these what are the classes, dinosaur DJs but the audience were massive 24 million listeners a week is incredible. And this is obviously pre-internet and stuff, but that's incredible. But Bannister was a young Radio 1 newsreader back in the day so he knew a little bit about it. And Trevor Dan, who's the other guy, who is the guy who reformed Radio 1, he used to produce the Dave Lee Travis show and he says one day he cried because he hated the job that much.
Speaker 2:He said there's got to be more to life than this.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there's got to be more to life than producing Dave Lee Travis' show. I mean, dave Lee Travis was before my time of listening to radio. I do remember a bit of Bruno Brooks. I think he used to do Top 40, didn't I? But the names live on like, because DJs at this point were far more famous than they are now, so, bruno.
Speaker 2:Brooks is one of the few people in life that you hear a name and like, you think, oh, wow, like, and you sort of picture Bruno Brooks, you think, oh, wow, you sort of picture.
Speaker 3:Bruno Brooks Sounds like a wrestler, doesn't?
Speaker 2:it. He looks like a Bruno Brooks. There are certain times you hear somebody's name like Scotty McClough and I'm trying to think of I don't know, like Chris Moyles, and you might hear the voice before you see him. And then you see him and you think, oh, they don't really quite look how I thought they would. Bruno Brooks looks so much like a Bruno and if you've never heard of him, picture in your mind what Bruno Brooks, like a kind of 80s slash, 90s DJ, might look like.
Speaker 2:And then go find the image of Bruno Brooks. It's perfect.
Speaker 3:When I first started doing Blaze Pods, someone said you don't look anything like I thought you would like. When a picture went up and I said in what way? And he said well, I thought you'd have air for a start. For a start, start with air, and then let's move on from there and then move on. But Trevor Danna and Matthew Bannister both left to join local radio, basically because they hated Radio 1 and what it would become.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, I think again, you've done most of the research, but I think so 10 years before they were brought back in, and this is a retrospective look, I think. So this is from 2000,. This TV show and it's talking about in 95, 96, when they were brought back in. But I think they both worked for the BBC 10 years before that, so 10 years after they left, they come back in. This is a look back a few years later, isn't it? Yeah, and what happens?
Speaker 3:So they went to work for London Radio and they sort of turned that station around in two years because that would go in no way. And they started bringing in DJs like Chris Evans and Chris Morris were on that. I don't know if you've ever heard some of his radio shows. They're incredible, they're just like brass eye. But you can't believe really that it got aired because obviously you know how close to the bone he is. But all these young DJs I think Jill Wiley were on there. They brought all these DJs through to this station. Meanwhile Radio 1 were just by the year losing its youth audience. And then in 1993, the BBC decided right, that's enough, that is absolutely enough. We need Radio 1's supposed to be the cool. You know what I mean. In hindsight, they should have just put the Radio 1 DJs to Radio 2, really.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was going to ask you this actually. This is one of my questions at the end. It's part of your energy. They've rebadged it. You fool If they just rebadged it as Radio 1A or Radio 1 Retro or Radio 1.
Speaker 3:I don't know. Yeah, a totally unnecessary way to go about it.
Speaker 2:You could have created a new station for the youth thing he wanted to create. I don't know why they had to revamp Radio 1.
Speaker 3:Maybe wages, maybe the wages thing, but I think a lot of these young people coming in not Evans, as we'll get on to, but they probably just wanted a short Radio 1, didn't they? You could have? I don't think they'd have wanted big money.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think what, as we'll get into it, some of them struggled with some of the old school kind of hosted DJs was times were changing and to them like it is almost that smashy and nice. It is that thing on the Simpsons.
Speaker 3:It is yeah.
Speaker 2:Hey, it's what? Is it wacky and the cool guy or whatever. Yeah, it's such terrible.
Speaker 3:See, we didn't grow up with this, so it'd be interesting if anyone's older than us, well, maybe we're about ten years or whatever.
Speaker 2:I think there's still a few left, if anyone's older than us, yeah.
Speaker 3:There might be a few of you walking with dinosaurs If anyone did listen to Radio 1 back in the day, because I listen back to these people now and we're going to get on to one of them who's on it quite a lot, dj Adrian Just, who's on this quite a lot. He's pathetic. I've listened to some of his shows and I've listened back to some of Dave Lee Travers' shows, just for research reasons, and it is totally hey, pop pickers, what's going on?
Speaker 2:Are we going to do this today? You've clawed out one of your eardrums, haven't you? It is outrageous. But one thing I was going to say it doesn't feature much. They only mention him a couple of times and I actually didn't know that was him almost. But is it Gary Davis?
Speaker 3:is it Gary Davis?
Speaker 2:yeah, so he, he kind of looks like someone who, which I kind of think is what he is, someone who used to be quite cool but is now like in his mid 40s and still dressing like a 20 year old yeah, well, do you know what?
Speaker 3:they're brilliant. This because later on I'm going to mention this later on, but like, in fact, I'm just going to play uh, I'm going to play a clip here. This we're jumping ahead, but I want to play this clip.
Speaker 5:Listen to how some of these djs are described within months, self-styled medallion man, gary davis whispering, bob harris, alan fre Freeman, jackie Brambles and Johnny Walker had all been banished.
Speaker 3:I love some of the names Delight Old School Wrestlers. Self-styled Medallion man.
Speaker 2:Well, you don't get the irony either, do they? So Adrian Just, who features in it fairly prominently, it doesn't seem to grasp that he's talking about this retrospectively, as like what a bunch of idiots. He went on to do nothing and obviously, ultimately it did work. Well, this is what I want to know If people are older than us.
Speaker 3:Was this called? Was Adrian just called? Because I can only go from this from a retrospective point of view and I've listened to his shows and his shows are basically just old comedy sketches, like Tony Hancock and stuff like that great stuff. Yeah, he cut together, old sort of just cut together and then he'd in the background just do a pun but and ruin the sketch. That's what I've seen. I might be wrong.
Speaker 2:I've only heard a couple of his shows, but obviously he's put lots and lots of effort into research and when I opened I open up Wikipedia, it did say exactly that yeah he puts together old sketches and mixes in some puns from himself. But it did say, though, I think I think it said it was meticulously put together imagine it was.
Speaker 3:I will fast forward on it. It's not like a show, I'll give you credit. It's not a show, it's a unique show where he's the squeakiest voice, like. I just think that, yeah, think that.
Speaker 2:It's almost like if you were going to create a joke character to play like what a DJ used to be. Yeah, welcome everyone.
Speaker 3:It's been a great day. It's been a great day tonight. But we get the first talking clip of Adrian Jost and he's furious about an incident where Matthew Bannister referred to the girls who ordered the records and filled in. He filled in, obviously, all the forms and stuff as the typing pool. This is such mock outrage. How dare he call them the typing room? He says I hate him now for that. Yeah, yeah, but he hated him before. He hated him before because he fucking sacks him, as we'll get on to. But then we get an unbelievable bit. Actually we're all about the psycho. Music gets louder. I like the. I keep, I keep in jaws, I don't know why. No, it starts, yeah, and we get black and white pictures of Dave Lee Travis, david Davis and Bruno Brooks, all looking so unbelievably uncool, like just pictures of him in a row.
Speaker 2:Even by early 90s standards, I don't think these were cool men at this point yeah, and I mean I suppose you've got your members as well, and this is kind of where I suppose exactly what they were trying to do is that, and apologies if I'm sort of tripping on things that are coming up. They're after the 17 plus audience and these guys are like in their 40s and 50s and I think it's a bit somewhere around here where Trevor Dan says no, sorry, matthew Bannister, I think, says you know, one of them was a pensioner, one of these DJs, and that's fine, there's nothing wrong with him presenting a show, but we're trying to grab a teen audience. It's so clear.
Speaker 3:It's like us doing it right. I don't know we're not still cool.
Speaker 4:It's really though.
Speaker 3:We need to get the 17 and 18 year olds back, those two pricks who talk about nostalgic TV. It's ridiculous. I don't understand and this is what gets you mad, which I'll come on to later but especially Adrian Just, who seems to feel like he should have had a job for life there.
Speaker 2:And it's like it's not that. Are you going to talk about him again?
Speaker 3:because I can tell you what he went on to do after this yeah, yeah, yeah so Bannister says, as you said, the DJs were just too old and he wanted to sack them before. But David, david Lee Travis, dave Lee Travis actually took matters into his own hands and quit live and air because he wasn't happy. And he actually says live and air. I'm not going to have a go at him about that, but it's a very sort of I'm the star here, I'm not having this, I'm out.
Speaker 2:Well, it caught him out, didn't it? Because obviously there's a bit where they refer to Trevor Dan as Dan Dan the Hatchet man. I think, that might be slightly after this bit, but yeah, they sort of want Dave Lee Travis out and he quits before they can sack him and so Bannister's fuming about this, because Bannister wants to make a couple of statements and then they fail again because the rumour is Simon Bates Again.
Speaker 3:This guy I don't know much about his radio career, but the biggest why does everyone wear massive glasses in?
Speaker 2:this era. Yeah, I don't know, it's a bit Deidre Rashid, isn't it?
Speaker 3:Again, another man that is up there with Graham, taylor and Deidre with the massive glasses awards. They want to sack him, but he's another one and he quit triumphantly, like on air, to get one over on Banister because he knew what was coming.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a bit of a pattern of that that recurs. The old dinosaurs see what's coming, so they, before they go extinct, they walk away, don't they? Yeah?
Speaker 3:with the head held high, which is fair enough. If they want to quit, they can quit. That's like you know.
Speaker 2:If you're going to get your redundancy, though, and I'm a little bit out of time frame here, so I'm not sure what minute you're up to, but there is a bit there as well where Bruno Brooks is playing Stets Quo and he's dad dancing he's in a studio where nobody can see him.
Speaker 3:He's got a shirt and tie on. It's brilliant. And he's doing as if. If you can imagine if I said to you do an uncool dance.
Speaker 2:He's like clicking his fingers, he's sort of like jogging in his seat.
Speaker 3:So he's all moving as if he's jog, he's doing primetime Radio 1. So, basically, Bannister was sacking everyone and it gained massive coverage in the tabloids. And Matthew Wright, former Showbiz editor of the Sun, which everyone will know from the Wright stuff, he says the general feeling at that time was Bannister was killing Radio 1.
Speaker 2:Well, the viewing figures were dropping, weren't they the numbers? Because some of these DJs, it didn't matter what station they were on, they just had a fan base of people who wanted to hear them. So as they started moving on to other stuff and again, apologies. I know we're normally slick as a as an oil slick, but where's the bit around here, then, where Danny Baker gets involved?
Speaker 3:so Steve Wright was one of the few older DJs that he wanted to stay on, because he was still, you know, by the way the bit where it shows him as sort of one of the cool DJs.
Speaker 3:He looks about 55, I mean it probably was in his 30s or something, but he looks like an old man, I think he was older, I think he was in his older years but he was still sort of he was getting through to the youth audience. The youth audience was still listening to Steve Wright, and obviously he went on to have an unbelievable career at the BBC, didn't he Like? Even when he left this Radio 2, until the day he died.
Speaker 2:I think, weren't it, what was it he did? What was his quiz thing?
Speaker 3:Now you're thinking of Ken Bruce, aren't you?
Speaker 2:Oh, maybe I am.
Speaker 3:Steve Wright had loads of people clapping at everything he said. That was his thing.
Speaker 2:Steve Wright in the afternoon.
Speaker 3:Anyway, steve Wright was given the morning slot, but he also brought in Joe Wiley, lisa Iansen I've not heard that name for so long, lisa Iansen, such a 90's like woman, I think Tim Westwood were brought in, which obviously now is a joke well, it's not just a joke. You know, he's a suspected sex offender he might be a confirmed.
Speaker 2:I don't actually know that, but at this point can you imagine having him on?
Speaker 3:air, compared to Bruno Brooks handing over to Tim Westwood.
Speaker 2:I tell you now, bruno boy, we've got some great stuff coming after me, bruno Danny Baker, as you mentioned, boy, yeah, we got some great stuff coming after Mizuno.
Speaker 3:Danny Baker, as you mentioned. I love Danny Baker. He's on this as a talking head. I think he's such an engaging character.
Speaker 2:He's great, but they like should I add Adrian, just again.
Speaker 3:Well, I'll play a thing about the voiceover. This is, I think, where they talk about Danny Baker's first ever show on Radio 1.
Speaker 4:Yeah, this is very conventional, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, bear in mind, the other DJs are all hey, pop pickers. This is what Danny Baker were up to.
Speaker 5:On 30 October 1993, Danny Baker went on air for the first time. 15 million listeners expecting a DLT-hosted snooker quiz were shocked to find a loudmouth cockney asking people to phone in with stories about how they got babies' rattles stuck to their heads.
Speaker 2:But I think this absolutely sums up what they were missing. Yeah, alright, I'm in my forties now. How old are we now? Forty-two are we?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think so.
Speaker 2:I'm still with it and I would love to listen to a show about how did you get a rattle stuck in your hair? Much more than hey guys, yeah, but this is the thing the era's moved on the people like in their 80s, 20s so that's out of date now maybe well, Nick Grimm.
Speaker 3:Nick Grimm shows a lot. Been in man woman, now Grim he was on it for a bit, weren't he?
Speaker 2:We were saying he was about 25 and he was about 40, weren't?
Speaker 3:he. Yeah, who's the radio one? Is it Scott Mills? No, it can't be.
Speaker 2:Scott? No, he's been filling in for Zoe Ball on Radio 2.
Speaker 3:Radio 1, DJs Let me.
Speaker 2:Have a look at this. This is what happens, we're out of touch now, adrian Just.
Speaker 3:Let me have a look at the fucking. So we've got Radio 1. The list of DJs on Radio 1. Sorry, live research and stuff here, but I've never heard of any of these. Oh Nahal's on it. You know Nahal Nahal, yeah, nahal, I don't know any of these. Liam Lenny Henry he's been on for a while.
Speaker 1:Who else?
Speaker 3:Lenny Henry, greg James I've heard of him. Jamelia Jamal these are all Hang on. This is past Radio 1. Sorry, I want current Radio 1 presenter. Why won't I give a current? That's giving me Jimmy Savile's? Just come on, I thought he's not.
Speaker 4:No.
Speaker 2:It's been a full circle. Jimmy Savile's cool again. That's a different fact.
Speaker 3:Oh no, this is old again. Have they got any DJs? This is showing me like.
Speaker 2:Like robots or AI or something. Now aren't they? Here we go.
Speaker 3:Abby McCarthy.
Speaker 2:Yasser.
Speaker 3:Kate Thistleton.
Speaker 2:Nope. Joel Mitchell no this is a sad moment where we realise we're in a corner, isn't it? This is like Sean Ellery we should play some like sad music here now.
Speaker 3:Jim and Bradley don't know who these people are. I'm sorry if anyone knows any Radio 1 DJs that we might have heard of. This is not. This is definitely not a slight of them. It's absolutely a slight.
Speaker 2:Well, I think even the Radio 2. Djs now, which was like the sort of jumping ground for Radio 1, they're becoming uncool again now, aren't they?
Speaker 3:I reckon, like Zoe Ball's on. I listen to Zoe Ball now I'm going oh, she's done all right since Live and Kick In. It's like yeah, for a show.
Speaker 1:So I have heard of Greg James.
Speaker 2:He went out with.
Speaker 3:He don't look anything like that. I thought, oh, does he go out with? No, molly King, molly King's face, no.
Speaker 2:What's her name? The singer, the blonde-haired singer. It's not that, as everyone listening knows, we love to sing. It's not that I don't want to sing it, I just can't think of the song.
Speaker 1:Oh, like British, oh God.
Speaker 2:This is just two men having a breakdown, isn't it? Well, listen to this, Brian.
Speaker 3:I know we've massively gone off tangent here, but I've got the schedule for tomorrow's Radio 1. Oh sorry, today's Radio 1, which is Tuesday, the 15th of October. So you've got Greg James, then you've got Ricky Melvin and Charlie Ellie.
Speaker 2:Goulden. Sorry, ellie Goulden, it was Ellie Goulden. Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3:Oh, she goes, oh, he went at RI. So Matt and Molly, which is Molly out of the Saturdays, and Matt I can't remember his name, his name's, matt.
Speaker 3:I can't remember his name. His name's Matt. Matt. He does that fucking Dressed to Impress whatever it's called. You will have seen him. He looks about five. So they're on. You've got Katie, and why is it all just first names? Vic, Katie and Jamie? Don't know any of them. Vic Reeves it certainly doesn't look like Vic Reeves. Jack Saunders no, sorry, Jack. Sean O'Leary. And then Martha Just Martha.
Speaker 2:Martha makes me think of Clark Kent's mum, an old woman doing a show.
Speaker 3:Yeah, martha, she's doing a Clark Kent's mum's doing a Dutch garage mix tonight. Yeah, but anyway, sorry about that, we're fucking massively going on. But we were talking about David. David, did I say Danny Baker? Straight after Danny Baker's show was Adrian Just, and I love how the voiceover here describes Adrian Just as anarchic funster. Adrian Just, anarchic funster.
Speaker 2:He says, oh, I'm going to have to go in and save the show and bring some comedy back. And we did.
Speaker 3:We did some bloody good comedy. Yeah, it says on the first show. Dave Lee Travis called him up and said are you listening to this crap? And he says that he's so angry as he's saying it, and just to me it just seems as we were just taking the piss ourselves. He just seems completely out of touch, even 30 years later.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, it still seems to be clinging to him well and, like we said, well, I mentioned him earlier but I looked into what he's done after this, because he the bit that confused me is because it's filmed afterwards and I thought, oh, he must have gone on to great success then, because he's really slagging them off on the decisions. He went on to do a little bit for LBC, some Radio Carousel and some dual FM, and after that he just did some writing for adverts.
Speaker 3:I don't know. Come down to radio for love, no money. Well, this is actually. This is annoying because he says he had to pull the station off the floor after Danny Baker was on. That's absolute bullshit. Danny Baker was still doing mainstream radio long after he was on radio.
Speaker 2:It's still bits and pieces now. Danny Baker is still a great, great man, great dog.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but he's still. You know, I think it only well. I used to listen to his Radio 5 show every morning like he was still a pride, so it's bollocks, Just as sort of like trying to spin this as if, oh, they absolutely ruined everything. And look what's happened. Now I'm top of the tree again. It's like what are you talking about? But Baker did lose the Dave Lee Travis crowd, which were obviously going to happen. The audience are off because the older listeners who listen to Radio 1 obviously didn't want to listen to him talking about sticking baby rattles on his head and he's quite open about it.
Speaker 2:He says, yeah, the audience went down from 15 to 7, but the show I was doing before this was getting 2, so I went up from two to seven, so it was all right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah, like I said, he was asked to get the youth back, and the only way he was going to get the youth back realistically was by turning the older generation off. It doesn't often happen where entertainment crosses that many generations does it? Yeah, get rid of the dead wood. Get rid of the dead wood. This is where Bannister employs Trevor Dan Dan, dan the Hatchet man, as he was called in the press.
Speaker 2:Yeah, if that's the only way we've got to that, then that's took us ages to get to that Well no, no, no, because he talks to him first and then it comes through again but anyway.
Speaker 3:The voiceover said he was. It's brilliant. The voiceover says old school DJs that had slipped through Matthew's fingers and it cuts to Bruno. That's when it cuts to Bruno dancing, clicking his fingers, and it just shows you Trevor Dam walking through Radio 1 studios, again with psycho music in the background, as if he's looking to kill people. It's brilliant.
Speaker 2:I love his. He says I was brought in to see if there's anyone Matthew missed and I'm listening. Why is Bruno Brooks on?
Speaker 3:Well, it's a brilliant yeah, he said. Like his first. He said why is Bruno Brooks on? And describes him as a behemoth striding the airwaves at dawn. I love that A behemoth striding the airwaves at dawn.
Speaker 2:We're supposed to have got rid of all these dinosaurs. And there's Bruno Brooks striding through the airwaves at dawn like a behemoth. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Brilliant. Bruno Brooks, to be fair, did have a massive audience. He was one of the biggest audiences, I think.
Speaker 2:I've misremembered this because I remember when I used to my dad had a I'm not driving a mini-metro, he had a mini-metro surf and yeah, whenever we used to go out well in my memory at weekends. But I think I've mixed up two shows because I thought Bruno Brooks did something where it was like someone would say, right, they'd ask someone like can I pop the red please? And they'd ask a question.
Speaker 3:And if you got it wrong, they went whack whack, oops.
Speaker 2:That sounds more like Steve Wright, maybe yeah, well, there's a bit later on when it says they were expecting a snooker quiz and I thought, ah, is that what it was. Anyway, yeah, I still remember listening to Bruno Brooks live.
Speaker 3:Bruno Brooks, though, to be fair, quite amazingly was an early supporter of the Acid House scene. You know that, which it sounds if you're just looking at a picture of Bruno Brooks. As I said, that that's incredible to me. Apparently, he used to play the old Acid House tunes like when they first came out and stuff.
Speaker 2:He once heard some sort of like. To be fair, I quite like it as well. It's like a sort of vocal Acid House piece quite early and I just thought, wow, this is like, this is where music's going.
Speaker 3:Yeah, brilliant, I'm with him, yeah In 1993, he accidentally played the uncensored version name-odd by Rage Against the Machine and got 143 complaints. I love that. I'd like to hear that. Because did he carry on playing it? Fuck you, I won't do it. Yes, apparently Did you see this little skip like dive into, like press stop.
Speaker 2:No, so apparently they weren't listening. They were talking about sort of future, like upcoming content, and they just played the full song in its duration. He didn't know that there was an explicit version of it, so they played a bit and panicked and turned it off. They just played the song.
Speaker 3:So good. He had an eight-year relationship with Anthony Turner, which I didn't realise. Yeah, that shocked me, though. Yeah, I didn't know that. Yeah, she left him for DJ Peter Powell, who I've never heard of Again. Talk about superheroes, he just reminds me of Spider-Man Peter Parker. Who's Peter Powell?
Speaker 2:Peter Powell. Yeah, I'd like to see him because Bruno Brooks, I'm guessing she might have made a bad move there. What's his name, Peter?
Speaker 3:I've looked long, dj Peter Powell. Anthony said he did say Bruno Brooks was abusive, but he said that was a massive exaggeration.
Speaker 2:He's quite a cool-looking man actually.
Speaker 3:Peter Powell. Peter Powell.
Speaker 2:This picture I've got. He's got like a perm long hair and an open shirt. I thought he said completely misjudged where you were going when you said she said Bruno Brooks was abusive. Maybe just because of how he looks, I thought you were going to say she said Bruno Brooks was a great lover.
Speaker 3:Bruno Brooks was a great lover. Peter Powell yeah, I do know, peter. I have seen Peter Powell before.
Speaker 2:I don't know him, I don't think, but he looks cool in the picture.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he looks cooler than Brooks, to be fair, but Bruno Brooks is still DJing now on Station 45 Radio, which I don't know what it is, to be completely honest.
Speaker 2:Great.
Speaker 3:DJ, great lover, Great guy. But this is where the documentary at least says. The turning point came for Radio One, so he he's losing all these viewers. Everyone's saying he's killing Radio 1. But then they banned Status Quo from being played on Radio 1 because they were no longer relevant to the view. I remember this. I remember this in school being front page news Quo off Radio 1 or whatever, and they were fuming and they threatened to sue the BBC. What a bunch, what a couple of fucking idiots.
Speaker 2:Realistically, yeah they asked for a full judicial review because BBC said they weren't going to play their music anymore. Stop imagining us doing it.
Speaker 3:How come you're not playing Living With Madeley theme? What like? We're suing you. What are you talking? You can't sue someone.
Speaker 2:You don't have to play it. Now I mean, it sounds like it was more luck than judgment, because they just sort of said we don't want this sort of thing anymore and played it. And actually what they said is it was the best status quo's reaction, was the best media coverage they'd ever had and all of a sudden, young kids were thinking well, yeah, we don't want all this status quo.
Speaker 3:It's brilliant if they're buying that sort of stuff well, I remember, I remember it shows you a little bit of a clip here where status quo doing doing a press conference and they look so angry they're like who do you think you are? Do you know what I mean? We don't have to play you.
Speaker 2:It shows. Obviously Trevor Downs is going to watch him as well in 2000 playing Down, down, deeper and Down. They're so shit, aren't they?
Speaker 3:My granddad used to love Status Quo. I don't mind her in the army now. Now, that's alright. And what was the other one? Matchstick Men, pictures of Matchstick Men, is it whatever it's called?
Speaker 2:well, trevor Dan says, don't he like? I was listening to the song and I thought, yeah, it's alright, but it's the same as all the other ones they've ever done well, yeah, people used to call it and I didn't know, actually I didn't know it was a blanket rule with this, but they said that from that weren't going to play anything pre-1990.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I didn't realise that. But I do remember they didn't put other than the charts they didn't play. You know, when the Beatles came back with the anthology stuff, they didn't play any of that either in Radio 1.
Speaker 2:You didn't see a lot of kicking off, though did you.
Speaker 3:Well, you know, whatever it's a drag, isn't it?
Speaker 2:Don't play the bloody songs. Don't play the bloody songs. I, I'm a millionaire.
Speaker 3:So, but things were sort of turning in because Radio 1 started looking cool, because they were like this thing about oh my God, they're getting rid of these fucking idiot dinosaurs that none of the young people want to listen to. Steve Wright, though, was not happy, and Steve Wright resigned, and that was a huge blow, because he was still the biggest star that we have.
Speaker 2:He was still the big hit. Yeah, so I wrote there after the status quo thing, my note says audience and then an upwards arrow and then it says Steve Wright in the morning still had big numbers quits, and then I put oh, no, so they were they weren't happy with that, were they?
Speaker 3:On his board in the morning. Oh no, but good. Headline from, I think it's the Mirror. Radio 1 is a write-off, as in W, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the press officer didn't write down her name. She's only in it very briefly. But she said it's weird because I don't know what they would do about it. But she said, oh God, I tell you what. We were there really late that night and we'd had the chief editor of the Daily Mail saying you're going to have a front page tomorrow. That is worse than bad.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so what? What are they going to do, realistically, what?
Speaker 2:No, I don't know what all the meetings are about. What, what?
Speaker 3:Anyway, but there's a very horrible data again where Just Adrian, just who's the villain of the piece, I think in this.
Speaker 5:I don't know the man.
Speaker 3:He might be a nice guy, but whatever, I can't stand him Now. He's so happy that Wright walks, he goes. Ooh, he's like giggling in his seat. I smell the blood of a bitter bastard, isn't it? Yeah?
Speaker 2:Oh, I achieved nothing, and now maybe they won't. Yeah but they did come back.
Speaker 3:But the weird thing about this, and this really becomes funny with Bruno Brooks. He saved Bruno Brooks because they wouldn't have sacked Bruno Brooks Because Steve Wright went. Bruno Brooks now had the biggest audience so they couldn't afford to lose him. So it cuts again to Bruno Brooks, just like looking really happy. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So my note there says a reprieve for Bruno Brooks and I've drawn like a laughing face. They really wanted him out, but I love yeah, because Steve Wright is gone. Trevor Dan went to see Matthew Bannister and, yeah, trevor Dan was expecting him to go and Matthew Bannister basically said look, we can't afford to lose those numbers.
Speaker 3:So yeah, bruno Brooks survives again to basically say, look, we can't afford to lose those numbers. So yeah, bruno Brooks survives again. Bruno Brooks survives. It's unbelievable what a survivor that man is. So he's looking really bleak for him again, even though the audiences are going up a little bit. They've lost a big talent until they manage to get hold of. Come on, liam, the man we've been speaking about a lot this series, mr.
Speaker 2:Chris.
Speaker 3:Evans.
Speaker 2:Well, there's a fantastic line. It's a bit later on actually. That refers to Chris Evans. But yeah, to start, the start of the story is so Trevor goes for a meeting I don't think he actually says who with. He says a good friend of Chris Evans, and they go for a pizza and basically Trevor says to him look, we're struggling. Actually Steve Wright's gone, we've got a problem. And this guy says well, actually do you know what? Chris might be tempted? And he says and actually the penny dropped, and I realised the reason he wanted to meet me is because Chris probably fancied this job.
Speaker 2:So, this could be done. Now, this is where Trevor gets stitched up a little bit, isn't it? So this is where the Matthew and Trevor bond breaks, because Trevor seems to have kind of created this right, let's get Chris in. Matthew goes to see him. There's an orchestrated press picture of him having a coffee and I think the headline is the one million pound cup of tea or something. But actually what Chris Evans did is he had that much sway in this decision. They needed him that badly. He was going to be the first show that wouldn't be BBC produced. His own firm were going to produce the show, which basically put Trevor on the outside.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 3:Trevor, obviously he couldn't get any staff in and his job was to get staff in and he couldn't do it for Chris Evans' show.
Speaker 2:Well, he was supposed to be the producer of these shows, but he had absolutely no skill, totally out of Radio 1's hands.
Speaker 3:Totally out of Radio 1's hands Totally out of Radio 1's hands. Evans took charge. We'll get a clip then. It never expands on what's happening, but loads of photographers taking pictures of Chris Evans in his studio. Yeah, and he's going like oh, fuck off if you want to leave Evans to a mall. And they're going oh, come on, chris, we've been waiting here ages Because my fucking fault is it, don't bring that attitude into my studio.
Speaker 3:But it doesn't actually say what's happened. You just get that, so I don't know what actually happened there, but audience figures are rising again. So this, unfortunately, is where we see the end of the Last of the Dinosaurs, mr Bruno Brooks.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and actually they don't make a big deal of it, do they Well?
Speaker 3:Adrian. I'm going to play a clip here. Adrian just talks about he gets sacked around the same time as Brooks. This is how just describes it.
Speaker 4:I was in here on the Friday night getting the Saturday show ready and we were doing all the topical stuff and the phone went and it wasn't Ballester, it was one, two, three, it was the number four, the number four down there. So when I got some bad news for you, I said oh, I know what that is. He said do you want Matthew to call you back? I said no, don't bother. I said I've got a show to get out. I said just wish him a Merry Christmas and don't give a fuck off, will you.
Speaker 3:Do you believe he said I asked exactly the same thing.
Speaker 2:I don't believe, for once. I think he said OK yeah, I'll finish and I'll get my stuff bye.
Speaker 3:Yeah, okay, I'll get my stuff. See you later. Bye, can I have a reference please?
Speaker 2:If they want me again next week, I'll be back.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so that's his sort of needless to say, I had the last laugh why is he? So angry still, does he?
Speaker 2:still think he should be on air now. Well, I just. That was his pinnacle, wasn't it? And I think in his head he could have gone and done that anywhere else, but clearly not. They just built, and some of them did so, like your Steve Wrights and your even DLT. I hate the article of DLT, dlt. Dlt so some of the old guard did go on to other stuff and did go on to do very well, self style medallion man did he go?
Speaker 2:yeah, but I don't think just went on to any success, really no um, so the things are going well.
Speaker 3:But evans ego was growing out of control. He started falling out with trevor damm. Trevor says he thinks evans had a lot. Wait well, he says something a lot on the lines of they ask him do you think you had too much power or a bit too much power? And he said I think I had a lot too much power.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean the way he sells it is that Evans would do something. He'd go and see Evans and say, look, you know we're not supposed to play that sort of thing, or you know, like that's a bit risque for this time of the day. Evans would go and tell Matthew. Matthew would come back to him and say, well, yeah, but you know we need him, so we've got to let him do it. So I just think he felt like Trevor lost all power in that moment, didn't he?
Speaker 3:And then we get. I'll play the clip. Actually this is Trevor explaining things from his side about how him and Bannister sort of drifted apart and, to be fair, Bannister- doesn't refute these claims.
Speaker 1:after, my first moment of hesitation was of popping into his office, like I always had done, and he was sitting right at me and I said drink at lunchtime. And he went oh yes, have a word with Sarah and book yourself an appointment. I thought this is going to be a different relationship. Now it's been made quite clear to me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, like you said, not only does he not refute him, he kind of acknowledges it. He doesn't seem to care, does he? He basically just said well, I'm sorry if he feels like that. I think he's a very cold kind of calculated man who brought in to do a job and did the job, and it didn't matter who fell along the way as long as he delivered on the brief.
Speaker 3:Evans, meanwhile, was coming up with more and more demands longer holidays, shorter hours. Bannister agreed to every, every one of Evans' demands. He even, like, wouldn't even use the Radio 1 toaster, would he? Because, like, he brought his own toaster in and it sounds like a little thing. But he, he just thought he was.
Speaker 2:He was like in Evans' eyes, radio 1, I can do what I want. Well, and it says he wanted longer holidays. They were growing.
Speaker 3:He wanted more control of the output and yeah just grew and grew as a power trip and Matthew writes on it. He says he was a monster who had gone slightly crazy about this point, Chris Evans.
Speaker 5:I'd like to know.
Speaker 3:I mean, I've not really seen much from Evans, but I imagine he probably agrees with the thing I've heard him say about it he was sold as that, wasn't he?
Speaker 2:Yeah, the math, the words, selling him as the saviour of Radio 1 and I think Radio 1 kind of created that reference as him, as the saviour of Radio 1. Look, come back, he saved us. And that came back to bite him because he just became, like you say, a bit of a monster really.
Speaker 3:And it all came to a head when an article in the Evening Standard said he just basically gave Trevor Dan a share of the credit of the station's success, and Evans were furious and did a radio show where he just talked about how he hated. Trevor Dan and how he deserved no credit at all. Trevor said to Bannister you've got to stop Evans from doing this. And Bannister basically said no, I agree with Evans. So Trevor Dan quits and that's the end of the relationship.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that means it's only a short show, but yeah, it did feel a bit like oh, like Folks, it's not quite.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's not quite over, because just a few days after Trevor Dan quits, evans gives Bannister a letter saying unless he could have the day off tomorrow off and every Friday from then on, he would quit For the first time. Bannister said no and Evans told him to fuck off and stormed out, which I always remember. This because I can't remember the DJ where he took over to replace him, because he just didn't turn up for one of his shifts and they played Missing by. You know everything but the girl and I miss you the rain.
Speaker 3:I'm pretty sure Mark and I took over after this and ratings massively slumped because they're not really and then was after that the second saving.
Speaker 2:And was that Moyles?
Speaker 3:after that they went through a few, didn't they Zoe Ball do it and stuff like that. And then you know, I think, like I say, I think Mark Lough for me is probably my favourite ever.
Speaker 2:I'm not slagging them off, but it weren't breakfast show time, I was going to say like Chris Moyles came in and that must have been late 1990s, so that can't be too long after this, because I remember the Sissot with Furnace, like it's like when we were in sort of I don't know Black Panther let me have a look, so I guess about 98 that Moyles came in it went Steve Evans, chris Evans, steve Evans sorry, steve Evans, brother of mine.
Speaker 3:Chris Evans, paul Evans, barry Evans, steve Wright, chet Evans, now Steve Wright, chris Evans, mark Unlarved, zoe Ball, sarah Cox you're on to rebuild society, yeah. Chris Moyles, nick Grimshaw and now Greg James yeah.
Speaker 2:Moyles had it for ages, though, didn't he, moyles?
Speaker 3:he had it for, oh yeah, eight years.
Speaker 2:He's the longest one Was Comedy Dave there for the full eight years.
Speaker 3:I don't know, did I tell you when I did that Mabley thinged it, so you know.
Speaker 2:How many days ex-wife Got such a sort of stress in it?
Speaker 3:So the top five, most like long gematame should do a top of the ports music. Number five it's Mike Reed, number four Tony Blackburn, number three Nick Grimshaw, number two Greg James and number one Chris Moy was Mark Goodyear, who did it from September 1993 to December 1993.
Speaker 2:I like how he's called Goodyear and he didn't even get a year.
Speaker 3:Ah, very good, he was in the top 40, I think.
Speaker 2:That's a short show, isn't it Anyway?
Speaker 3:Anyway, that's the end of the documentary. By the point of the documentary ends or the story ends over half of the country's 15 to 24-year-olds were actually tuning in to Radio 1. And two years later Banister were promoted to head of all TV and radio at the BBC. So it was a test.
Speaker 2:This is the bit that confused me, Because you get Asian just sort of slagging off the decisions. But even by the point of this documentary they'd done exactly what they went sent in to do. They'd turned it around. Yeah, completely turned it around, and even if numbers had gone down very slightly, which I'm not sure on the full number, but the youth audience had grown massively, which is exactly what it was there to do.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and if you're getting half of the country's 15 to 24-year-olds, that's an incredible effort. I used to listen to Radio 1 back in the day, the evening session. Mark and Lard obviously Can't remember any of us, but I used to Joe Wiley.
Speaker 2:Did you listen to Dave Pearce's dance anthems? Was that on Radio 1? It?
Speaker 3:weren't really my scene. Dave Pearce's dance anthems John Peel he was still playing around. Yeah, John Peel. Annie.
Speaker 2:Mike, yeah, this must have been kind of towards him because he went to Radio 2, didn't he?
Speaker 3:so that's been around about this time, I think who else were there around that time we used to listen to it. Can't think of who else like where?
Speaker 2:well, annie Mike started with. Was it Grimshaw or Greg James?
Speaker 3:yeah, that's got to be way after that that was a bit later, obviously, but it was a Friday night dance.
Speaker 2:Thing.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but I did use to listen to it so it worked on me anyway, what Banister did, because I was at that age at that point and yeah, and that worked. So just a little bit after Trevor Dan, after this, he launched Smash it's Radio and Smash it's TV, which I didn't realise to be fair, and he was the executive producer of the Smash Hits Paul Winters Party. Obviously, we covered a couple of those in a previous episode. Between 2002 and 2004, he presented BBC Radio Cambridge's Breakfast Show and presented a weekly radio show called it's Amazing on national DAB station Amazing Radio. Dan was appointed director of UK Radio Academy in September 2006 and his first book, Darker Than the Deepest Sea, which is a biography of Nick Drake, was published in February and he's now Director of Community Radio Station Cambridge 105.
Speaker 2:And you're now his PR, aren't you?
Speaker 3:Yeah Well, I've got more, I've got more, 've got more. If you want to know what?
Speaker 2:Matthew Bannister, what's Trevor done?
Speaker 3:no, matthew Bannister. What do you think he's up to now? It's not a big thing.
Speaker 2:I reckon he's now our chief commissioning editor for some kind of low level production company well.
Speaker 3:Since 2006 he's presented the obituary programme on Radio 4 called the Last Word.
Speaker 5:I've never heard that she died In 2008.
Speaker 3:She died. He's sitting for Jeremy Vine on his Lunchtime Radio 2 show. This is quite interesting, though this is so unlucky. Anyway, listen. Bannister married his first wife, the radio and TV presenter Amanda Walker, in 1984, and their daughter, jessica, was born in the same year. In 1988, amanda drowned while swimming in the sea of the Spanish Costa Bianca during a family holiday In that right.
Speaker 2:I'm not judging, but in 1989, it already remarried.
Speaker 3:You're not going to tell me she drowned.
Speaker 2:Well, she died in 2005, and in 2007 he married again. This is like when they find out on one of these criminal documentary shows, isn't it? What's that thing about the guy whose wife fell down the stairs? And you think, ah, I'm not sure. And then it's like and ten years earlier a previous wife had died by falling down the stairs.
Speaker 3:She's. He has divorced her now, but she is still with us. Thankfully he's married again.
Speaker 2:So four marriages it's like Henry VIII, isn't it? What is it? Divorce? Beheaded, survived.
Speaker 3:Yeah, catherine Hubber, a private equity investor, so I don't know if she would just have she might have had too many. Aragon is it yeah, four managers, four marriages, should I say? Said it again, he said it again. He said it again yeah, four marriages for Mr Bannister. I really enjoyed that. I genuinely think everyone should watch that, and thank you for Neil for reminding me of it. Do you agree, liam?
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I thought it was good. Well, I told you I actually went. I vaguely remember the Blood on the Carpet series. I went on to watch one called Ice Cream Wars about Ben and Jerry's against Hog and Daws. That was quite good as well. Probably the worst thing I'd say about it is that, because you, I can't remember what you were calling it initially, but I was calling it Blood on the Tracks and then when I learned it's Blood on the well, it's Blood on the Carpet. But for a bit I had in my head this week it was Blood on the Dancefloor, so I've been singing Blood on the Dancefloor.
Speaker 3:I keep thinking Blood on the Turnstile, but I don't know where I got that from.
Speaker 4:I don't know if that, but anyway.
Speaker 3:So thank you for that. We've got a massive treat for you, aren't we, liam, for the next episode, have we? Yeah, big time, mate, big time. We are covering Robot Wars, which I Sorry. Yeah, of course, I never really watched this. I obviously knew what it was. I've seen bits of it and, because we knew we were going to do it, I've started watching it. It's fucking unbelievable. Yeah, and because we knew we were going to do it, I've started watching it.
Speaker 2:It's fucking unbelievable. Yeah, yeah, I used to love it in the day so you're ahead of me on what you've watched. I've not watched anything yet, but I know it quite well, certainly the early series anyway. So, yeah, probably one of the most.
Speaker 3:Actually I'm looking forward to revisiting because I've seen it years and years and years but I used to love some of the early Robot Wars. Well, what we're going to do?
Speaker 2:because we didn't know, because it's a 17 series, so what we're going to do is use the Grand Finale 17 hour episode.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we're going to do a 17 hour episode. It'll be more than that, won't it? I think there's like 25 episodes in every series. We'll see what series we get to doing Robot Wars. So we're doing series 4, the grand finale of series 4. If you just put that into YouTube, we're going to use that as a base because we're going to try and talk around that episode, if you like, but we're going to use that as the base to talk about Robot Wars. We're not going to do like a and then this happened, and then this happened. We're just going to say and in the one we watched, you know, so you've got a bit of an idea.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a bit of a thing going forward, isn't it that we've decided on the roadshow. We're going to try and get it a little bit more free and easy. I think some of the episodes yeah, we don't want the ones where we go- and then this happens.
Speaker 3:I think this one was being all right, because you can just say that he does this, but I think when the and then this character is introduced, or who's this guy, do you know?
Speaker 2:what I mean. So we're going to get rid of that. Yeah, we don't like the ones where we say and it's 73 minutes, this happens right. Yeah, hopefully it's going to be like we say, a bit more free and easy a bit more easy.
Speaker 5:Well, so that's the one.
Speaker 3:It's a base point. It's a base point, so when we're going to, we could say oh, in fact, in the one that we watched, jonathan Pearce does say that as well. Yeah, expect much from JP, the magnificent JP, and that'll be next time, liam, and I will see you then yeah, and potentially you might hear a midweek before the Robot Wars episode possibly hopefully you will.
Speaker 2:I would say. If you don't, it is what it is. Farewell, liam, see thee well, my friend. If anyone wants to get in touch with us, send us anything. Find us on Twitter at livingwithmade1, or you can send us an email at livingwithmad1, or you can send us an email.