How Strength Training Improves Quality of Life as We Age with Eric Levitan of Vivo

We all know that exercise is a vital part of maintaining a healthy lifestyle. However, most people still have the misconception that strength training is reserved for young folks looking to bulk up their muscles. 

According to Eric Levitan, the CEO and Founder of Vivo, strength training can be an entirely safe and highly beneficial activity for older adults, as well. In fact, for older adults in particular, loss of muscle mass is a natural part of aging and has far reaching health and lifestyle implications. Regular strength training can prevent muscle loss which in turn lowers the risk of falls, increases mobility, and more. Strength training can also improve a person's cholesterol levels and bone health, promoting weight loss. Vivo's strength training program for older adults also offers a strong sense of community and achievement, important contributors to mental health.

Eric explains that some older adults are hesitant to embrace this kind of activity because of potential injuries or misconceptions about what kind of exercise is appropriate for their age. In this new episode of the Digital Footprint, Eric Levitan talks to Richard Simms and explains how Vivo helps people overcome these fears and build habits for a healthier lifestyle as they age.

Guest-at-a-Glance

💡 Name: Eric Levitan

💡 What he does: Eric is the Founder and CEO of Vivo

💡 Company: Vivo

💡 Noteworthy: Apart from being a successful entrepreneur in B2B and B2C environments, Eric is a passionate music lover.

💡 Where to find Eric: LinkedIn | Email

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Book a consultation: https://tyrannosaurustech.com/contact/

Connect with our cohosts Richard Simms & Carlos Gonzalez on Linkedin

Transcript

E661389B_7 - TT - Digital Footprint - Eric Levitan - Transcript

Richard Simms: [00:00:00] Hello, welcome to the Digital Footprint. I'm Richard Simms, and this podcast is brought to you by Tyrannosaurus Tech, an award-winning technology partner dedicated to designing and developing high impact software products. I'm very excited to have Eric Levitan, CEO and founder of Vivo joining us for the show today.

[00:00:19] Eric, welcome. Happy to have you.

[00:00:21] Eric Levitan: [00:00:21] Thank you so much, Richard. I appreciate it. 

[00:00:23] Richard Simms: [00:00:23] Yeah, looking forward to this. So, you and I have known each other there for a couple of years now. We actually first met when I presented about Tyrannosaurus Tech to a group of local CEOs and advisors that you were a part of. So, you have kind of known me and our business through our infancy,

[00:00:40] and you've given me some great advice along the way, so I knew you'd be a great podcast guest to have on, and excited to have you share some of that same wisdom with our listeners today.

[00:00:53] Eric Levitan: [00:00:53] Well, Thank you. I appreciate it. It's, it's, It's a passion of mine, around entrepreneurship and knowing how difficult it is, and you guys are doing such an amazing job, and  and, and really have a strong focus and a really good, good soul for what the purpose of you guys are doing, is, and any way I can be a part of it, I, I definitely want to be. 

[00:01:12] Richard Simms: [00:01:12] Awesome. Well, I definitely appreciate that. And likewise, so let's dive in. Let's get started. So first, just briefly, do you mind quickly introducing yourself, tell folks like real quick just, you know, what Vivo is all about? That would be great.

[00:01:27] Eric Levitan: [00:01:27] Sure. I actually, for the majority of my career have been a software guy. I was a tech entrepreneur for pretty much the last 28 years. I've been in IT and software. I was one of the founders of a company called Argo Systems, and joined early on and early 2000s, which was a software company, a B2B enterprise software company in the media and entertainment industry, and was very fortunate that we had a little bit of success, eventually led to an exit in 2013.

[00:01:56] And then I stayed on with the acquiring company until 2018, and part of that experience was a real well, the lesson in  in, in entrepreneurship and exits and acquisitions and what that looks like, and it really wasn't everything that I had expected. I really believed that that was the ultimate goal was to start a business, sell a business, and that would put you on this kind of mountain top.

[00:02:19] And, the experience I had was, was pretty far from that. And after we sold the business, it was, it was really challenging. And there were a lot of interesting nuggets and tidbits of wisdom that I picked up along the way, and what that did was really motivate me to start another business. And a part of that was the fact that I felt very fortunate to have been a part of an exit,

[00:02:40] and I really wanted to put that good fortune back into the universe, and not necessarily dedicate myself to just another B2B software company, but do something that really had a strong purpose behind it and that would really make an impact in someone's life. And so, at the time I was kind of remotely involved in the care of my own parents as they were getting older.

[00:02:59] And both parents started going through what I felt was a pretty typical, but also precipitous decline in quality of life as they were getting older, and it really motivated me to help them and to get more involved in this aging and longevity space, and the more I learned, the more passionate I got, and it really drove me down this path that ultimately led to this company called Vivo. 

[00:03:20] Richard Simms: [00:03:20] Awesome. Yeah, I love it. I think your background is super interesting and then now making the move kind of into the fitness and wellness space. I want to talk about that a little bit later in the episode, but so, yeah, I think as far as Vivo, it's like, I think generally, most folks are aware that there's you know, a large aging population.

[00:03:38] I think it's generation X, technically that we're talking about, that like that 55 and older crowd that you work with. And as you mentioned for me and you, like our parents fit into that group, probably for a lot of our listeners, too. And I think with what you're doing, of course, there's kind of the obvious side that we want our parents, our uncles, grandparents, to stay healthy and enjoy their lives and all of that good stuff, but there's also much larger,

[00:04:04] I think, societal implications with this big population, you know, on our health, healthcare system, workforce. So, it's definitely a huge problem or big opportunity, I guess, it's a large, large space with you know, like a lot of scale and potential there. So, I guess my question for you is you know, what made you feel like you were ready to take on something so big and yeah

[00:04:29] what are your thoughts on just like the bigger implications, aside from helping these individuals, just about that population as a whole and you know, what their needs are that you're looking to fill with Vivo?

[00:04:39] Eric Levitan: [00:04:39] Right. Well, and I think you know, you nailed it. The, this is actually the largest aging population the Earth has ever seen, and it's, most people are aware of that, and people are living longer than they've ever lived before. And you've got the boomers who are aging into this. into this demographic, and it's something like 10,000 people a day turn 55 or older.

[00:04:59] It is, it is really, really growing a great scale, and the other side of that is it's requiring a lot of care, and a lot of costs and a lot of human capital to take care of, of this aging population. And it's changing the kind of natural demographics and the  a healthy bell curve of the population

[00:05:19] that we're used to, and as a result, there's an increased strain on the healthcare system, on all kinds of, of care throughout the life cycle of, of older adults. And, the more I started to learn about this, the more I realized that there was a really, really significant thing that happens to all of us, which doesn't get enough attention,

[00:05:41] and that is the fact that we lose muscle mass as we age. And so, we talk an awful lot about staying heart-healthy, eating well. There's lots of programs and doctors are promoting walking, but there's not a lot of discussion and education and awareness on the fact that we lose muscle mass as we age.

[00:05:59] And the more I started learning about this, the more I saw there was a real opportunity to make a difference here. And what's crazy, Richard, is that the loss of muscle mass really begins in your 30s. And so, you're right. This is something that I think has broader ramifications, but it starts in your 30s.

[00:06:15] It starts pretty slowly. You'll lose about three to 5% of your muscle mass a decade, until you turn 60 or in your 60s. And that starts to accelerate, and in your 70s it accelerates again, and it really ends up being one of the more significant factors that begins to impact our function, our ability to do activities of daily living, opens us up to be more susceptible to the various aging

[00:06:38] diseases, like type two diabetes and osteoporosis and cardiovascular disease. It makes us more susceptible to falls, and even you know, standing up out of a chair, getting up off of the floor, the way that we walk and how it changes our gait, all of these things are really significantly impacted by the fact that we lose muscle mass as we age.

[00:06:58] And, on the other side of that, I learned very early on through this process that you know, the thing we all used to do when we were younger and more fit and focused on how we looked, and we would strength train, and we would try and you know, develop this, this muscle and this kind of physique. Well, that whole process actually never leaves us.

[00:07:16] So, you can do strength training at any age, whether you're 25 or 95 and you can actually rebuild muscle mass. And so, when I started learning this and seeing that there's a really significant issue, and it's a global issue by the way, this happens to every human being on the planet. It's just a part of the aging process.

[00:07:32] And then, there was a really straightforward solution. It felt kind of obvious, "Why aren't more people doing this, why don't more people know about this and why aren't there more programs available?" So, I didn't really set out necessarily with this grand vision of how I'm going to get everyone in the world to start doing strength training.

[00:07:49] I wanted to start small. I wanted to impact my own parents and see if I could make a difference. And, as it started to work, and I started getting more exposure and,  and really started developing a passion and understanding behind all of this. Those goals, kind of, you know, you progress one step at a time and that's, that's really a microcosm for any business, actually,

[00:08:06] but that's certainly how I approached it. 

[00:08:08] Richard Simms: [00:08:08] For sure. Yeah. Very cool. And I'm right there with you that I think just changing the kind of misconception that lifting weights or you know, doing pushups or squats or whatever it is, is, just about trying to get buff when you're young, you know, I, I think it's huge and you know, I think it, it resonates with me, for sure, for sure.

[00:08:30] my family, my parents, you know, and, and kind of seeing that divergence of who's able to stay pretty active you know, in their 70s or beyond, and who starts to really you know, struggle with some of those mobility issues. And, And, I do think even just at a high level, you can kind of see the lifestyle that leads to you know, activity levels and doing things that are more physical, and how much that keeps that muscle mass active is, is awesome.

[00:08:59] So, yeah, I think that's great.

[00:09:00] Eric Levitan: [00:09:00] Exactly. And, I mean, who wants to give up the things that they love doing, right? Whether it's traveling, hiking, gardening, playing golf, playing tennis, getting on the forum, playing with your grandkids, riding bikes, right? All of these are our hobbies that we all enjoy. And we think about going into retirement and enjoying these hobbies.

[00:09:17] And what ends up happening is, if you, if you lead a fairly sedentary lifestyle, which, which most older adults do, those things just continue to get harder and harder. And again, it's not, it's not rocket science, there's some very straightforward, simple things that we all can do to make sure that we maintain those levels of function and the ability to do the things that we love.

[00:09:36] And, and that's really what living's all about, right? Is, is enjoying our lives on our terms and kind of maximizing our quality of life. And so, I really feel like we've tapped into helping people get to that place. 

[00:09:47] Richard Simms: [00:09:47] Awesome. So, question I have for you is, I know that when you were still pretty early in the you know, early stages of Vivo when COVID kind of came into full swing, right. So, I know that turned things upside down for you all to a degree because obviously face-to-face training or group trainings were kind of off the table.

[00:10:08] So, how has the model you know, evolved in your vision for the business, and what the operations look like day-to-day? How has that all changed based on COVID, and then what I'm also curious is, you know, to what degree will that change again, now that things are winding down, hopefully, at least here in the US with COVID, or is a lot of what you've learned

[00:10:30] there going to stick long-term?

[00:10:32] Eric Levitan: [00:10:32] So, we had one of those classic stories that you hear from a lot of entrepreneurs, where you know, some existential change occurs, and they're forced to rethink their business. And that certainly happened with us as it did with a lot of businesses, right, because of COVID. So, we were, at the time, we had launched, we ran a pilot at a retirement community, a senior living community in Atlanta,

[00:10:52] and it had gone really well. We had a really fabulous impact on the participants who, who were engaged in this Vivo program. And we were getting ready to launch it, a couple of studios in town. And, we were supposed to launch on March 30th, 2020. and as you can well imagine, that did not happen. And at that point it was really a lot of kind of analysis on what are our options.

[00:11:15] We can kind of fold this thing up and wait, and wait it out and see what happens, or we can really understand what the landscape looks like and what are other fitness companies doing, what are the wellness companies doing and what can we do. And, the fact that we were dealing with older adults and the fact that we were dealing with a behavior that we really needed to guide people through, it wasn't obvious to take this thing online because there's a lot of risk involved, right?

[00:11:41] Someone, if you're not paying attention to them, if they're not being careful, they can get hurt or worse. And leveraging technology, whether it's Zoom or another video conference technology, it's not necessarily a skill that everybody had, certainly not in the beginning. So, we had a lot of kind of self-discovery that we had to go through, and we really

[00:12:03] just wanted to test the market. So, let's take this program that we are pretty excited about, and we know we've seen some really great efficacy behind, and let's see if we can deliver it online. And, we started small. We started with some friends and family of our trainers and something really magical happened.

[00:12:22] We decided we would just give the first week, we do three classes with a small group. We do it for free, that we wanted their feedback. And, at the end of that first week, I remember I was walking my dog, my head trainer called me and said, "Hey, Eric. I just want to let you know that I just got a call from some of our customers.

[00:12:38] They're asking when the next class is because they want to keep doing this." And, you know, when you, if your eyes are open, and you're paying attention to the universe, you, you see signs like that, and  those are special moments. And so, we did, we did more of it and we started to kind of grow organically, and it really became something that very quickly we found out we could do.

[00:12:56] And, certainly the pandemic helped with the adoption of technologies, like Zoom, platforms like Zoom, where it became a fairly ubiquitous skill, right. My mom, who was in her mid seventies and is very technology averse, she was capable of getting on a Zoom call and seeing us and their grandkids. And it really started, you know, we could leverage that

[00:13:16] and so it really started to, to benefit us to the point where, very quickly, we saw we had an ability to impact people beyond what a brick-and-mortar fitness studio could do. There's a kind of rule of thumb in the fitness industry that your studio, your gym, your real target market is a three mile radius of that location for where people work or live.

[00:13:38] And by delivering something online, we had completely eliminated that. Right? We could impact people all over the country or all over the world. And, the other aspect that got really exciting about this is we were also removing barriers for why people wouldn't want to do this. So, getting in a car, going to a gym, being surrounded by a bunch of sweaty 20 year olds in tank tops, it's not the most warm and welcoming environment for older adults,

[00:14:03] and we could remove that as a reason for not doing this. And, people could join this program and engage from the comfort of their own homes without having to get into a car, keeping them safe, keeping them you know, especially from a COVID perspective, keeping them isolated physically, but connecting them socially.

[00:14:20] All of these things really started to connect and take us down this path that we got really excited about. And, I guess to address your question of,  "What will we do now?" It's a great question. I'm not going to pretend to know what the future lies 'cause if you had told me that we would be an online

[00:14:36] strength training program for older adults a year ago I probably would have, or a year and a half ago, I probably would've said, "No way." So, I'm not going to say, "We'll never be an in-person presence," we're certainly talking to our customer base now and understanding what their desires are, and what their, their wants and needs are,

[00:14:51] but we're, we're having quite a bit of success doing what we're doing online and the ability to reach customers again, all over. We have customers all over the country. We have customers in California, and Oregon, and New Mexico, and Arizona, and Chicago, and Ohio, and Minnesota, and Georgia, and the ability to do that is, is pretty fantastic.

[00:15:09] And even our trainers, we have trainers in San Francisco and New York and South Carolina. So, we're building this network and connecting people from all over the country that it would be challenging to do and mimic that outside of this environment. So, at least for the time being, we're very focused on continuing to grow this online business. 

[00:15:27] Richard Simms: [00:15:27] Awesome. Yeah, I think it's a really neat story. And, as you alluded to early in your answer, you all are one of those uniquely positioned companies, where despite the uncertainty, and kind of, you know, I'm sure a lot of anxiety like everyone with, with COVID rolling out, it really has helped push you all forward in a really neat direction,

[00:15:49] and to your point, I think a lot of your target audience, it's hard to imagine any other circumstances where they would jump into the tech side of things, like with Zoom, with both feet enthusiastically. So, it's aligned really nicely. I mean, I feel like despite all the really, truly horrible aspects of COVID, there are some really great things that have come out of just this really, you know, appended reality we've been in.

[00:16:14] So, I think that's a really cool part of the Vivo story, for sure. So, my next question for you, we all know startups are very difficult, you know, This was not your first rodeo, so I'm sure you were aware going into it. It's excitement, but also knowing that you're you know, about to try to climb this huge mountain again, so far with Vivo, what do you think have been the biggest challenges you faced, and then, how have you all overcome them or for some of them I'm sure are still in the process of trying to figure out what that looks like?

[00:16:47] Eric Levitan: [00:16:47] Yeah, so, there's really two that come to mind when I think about kind of those, those big hills to climb, then, and we're still climbing them, by the way. So, the first was what we actually just talked about, which was we had a pretty significant decision and adjustment to make when, when COVID hit and literally shut down all the studios in the world.

[00:17:05] So, we had an in-person program. We developed the programming and what we were doing as a part of this, and then to re-imagine that was daunting. And, you know, as, as an experienced entrepreneur, while I'd never had something like a pandemic up upend my business before, what I did know, from a lot of reading and  a lot of experience that I've had in the past, is

[00:17:26] in, in real times of challenge, there's always opportunity and trying to find what that opportunity looks like. And there were certainly a lot of fitness companies that all started shifting online. So, there, there was, there was certainly a guide, you know, there was a path of at least beginning of where to start to look.

[00:17:44] And then I, I'm very much of, of the belief, and continue to be convinced that testing the market is always a good idea, and testing the market quickly. Right? Don't, we could have gone away for six months and rethought all of our programming and said, "Okay, let's build out this whole technology platform and let's redo all the program team programming to be successful and delivered remotely." It's,

[00:18:05] "Let's start small, let's start with a class and just see how this works and get customer feedback and get market feedback. And then let's build that back in and let's do it again." And so, that was a really challenging time in kind of the end of March and beginning of April, but kind of this you know, this, this path that the rest of the industry was, was going on, and our ability to get out there quickly and just start to test the market and get feedback,

[00:18:30] I think really, really benefited our ability to, I hate using the word "pivot" because everybody uses that, it's really just adjusting to what's happening in the world, but our, our ability to adjust, I think, was, was pretty successful, given that. And then the other, the second really big challenge that, that we're focused on right now is customer acquisition.

[00:18:48] And, at the end of the day, everybody knows that exercise is good for you, but most people don't do it, or they certainly, they may dabble in it, but they don't do it in a consistent basis that it's having the kind of effects and impact on their lives that it can. And so, what we're offering people in this kind of guided program that helps people build strength as they age, it's something there's a lot of resistance to, no pun intended,

[00:19:12] but there's a lot of fear-based objections that older adults have. There is a fear of embarrassment, not knowing what you're doing and looking silly. There's a fear of getting hurt. There's a fear of you know, a lack of understanding about what this means, to participate. Some people think they're going to get really bulky if they start a string training program,

[00:19:32] and  which  is not true, unless you really set out to get bulky. But there's a lot of you know, objections that we are trying to learn how to overcome because we know what we have is absolutely changing people's lives for the better, in a really significant way. And so, how do we get the word out?

[00:19:48] How do we create something that feels like they can be successful and they're not threatened by? And because what we're seeing is, as soon as people try this, they stick with it and they love it, and then they see the results and it's kind of this self perpetuating cycle that they get in, where now we've got retention, we're building community and it's having real physical outcomes, and continues to. But getting people to kind of get over that hurdle of just trying it once is a challenge,

[00:20:15] and we're still trying to figure out, "How do we get our brand out there? Is it Facebook? Is it buying Google Ads? Is it AdWords? Is it PR, is it television, radio, print, mailers? You know, there's, there's a lot of ways to market the product and really strengthen our brand. What's the best way for this demographic?"

[00:20:34] And by the way, the 55 plus demographic is massive. And I don't just mean a numbers of people, but in micro segments of the marketplace, someone who is 57 is very different from someone who's 77, and where they consume media and where they would gain the awareness and the education around this is very different.

[00:20:51] And so, trying to solve that has been a tough nut to crack.

[00:20:55] Richard Simms: [00:20:55] Yeah, for sure. I think you know, significant behavior change is always difficult to instigate and then lock in for, for longterm. And you know, I think to your point exercise especially, you know, it's, it's different than asking someone to you know, download this app and try this out. You're asking someone to

[00:21:16] put on their exercise clothes, set up their space, you know? Yeah, do something that physically is hard in that moment. That's intimidating, all of that. And I think we know it can be done, obviously because there's very successful exercise programs and regiments out there that have really taken off. And I think one thing, just from my understanding of Vivo and our conversations over the last couple years, you all have really focused on the community aspect, which I think is huge.

[00:21:43] You know, getting those folks really  in a small group where they feel accountable, they feel supported. You know, I know you all are doing a lot of like helping them stay informed of their progress, so they have that reinforcement that, you know, "Three weeks ago I was able to do this many sit stands in the chair in a minute.

[00:22:01] Now I'm able to do this many." So, I think you all have done a lot to try to overcome that, and I definitely see why that's a big, big hurdle that you'll continue to hone in on, you know.

[00:22:11] Eric Levitan: [00:22:11] For sure. And, and you actually nailed it. You know, behavioral change is hard, and this is really what we're talking about. And  there's even a line of sort of using with people that I heard once, and it goes something like this, "When you retire from work, you start a new job with exercise." And I think it's a really kind of profound statement to let sink in and absorb because, well, "You don't have to work you know, eight hours a day anymore.

[00:22:35] You do really need to focus on exercise pretty much every day for the rest of your life," which sounds daunting. And so, you know, we don't want to, to certainly overwhelm people by thinking about, "Oh my God, I have to do this every day forever. Really?"  And, the answer is, "You kind of do, but there's ways to make it easy.

[00:22:52] There's ways to integrate it into your life, just like you brush your teeth every day before you go to bed or anything that becomes a habit and what really drives that behavior." And, and, the answer, at least in our experience of the research going into the building this program, and what we're seeing really get reinforced is this concept of community.

[00:23:10] And so, if you can get a community of like-minded people together, who creates the support system and accountability, so if I don't show up at my Vivo class on Wednesday at 9:30, I'm getting text messages asking me where I'm at. You better believe that drives my behavior to join the class. And that's a really powerful thing that you can't overlook.

[00:23:32] And, and the other side of that, which you mentioned is not only having the community support, but actually seeing progress, and all of our customers feel it even before they see it. It usually takes about three or four weeks before you begin to feel different, if you consistently, you know, two to three times a week are doing strength training. But when you get your first actual progress report that shows the numbers,

[00:23:54] we, we actually, we do baseline assessments on every customer that starts our program, and then we reassess every week, and when you see that 8-week progress support, it, it it's a humongous motivating you know, factor and tool to say, "Wow, this is working. Like I knew I felt better, but I had no idea that my lower leg strength had increased by 30% in 8 weeks."

[00:24:17] And by the way, that's what we're seeing. And so, when you, when you improve someone's strength by 30% in two months, that's significant. And it's a, it's it, they feel differently, but it's a really motivating factor to get them to keep wanting to do this more. 

[00:24:31] Richard Simms: [00:24:31] Yeah, and it's amazing how adaptive the body can be, even if you're 70 years old, you know, I think that I'm sure surprises people and is, is really exciting. So, at one question I have for you, you know, you mentioned this earlier, you have an extensive background in technology and innovation, that of course, I think is very helpful in your journey with Vivo because of course there's also a big technology component, but even though I know you're a fit guy and have exercised your whole life, you don't strictly come from a fitness background or you know, wellness health background.

[00:25:03] So, has that been difficult? And then, how have you kind of bridged that gap as you've pursued Vivo?

[00:25:08] Eric Levitan: [00:25:08] Yeah. Great question. It is difficult. And, as you noted, my background is, is even more specifically than that, it's B2B enterprise software, right.

[00:25:17] So, to go into a B2C business that is focused on fitness and health and wellness, was, was a pretty big change and a, and a pretty big leap to make. And so, I knew pretty early on, I had to build a team of people who could provide this, the support,

[00:25:31] because I was going to rely on other people for their expertise, it wasn't going to be my own. And, so, the first person that I got connected with that I really clicked with and really started to understand the vision, was a gentleman named Kevin Snodgrass, who is one of, if not the best trainer I've ever met in my entire life.

[00:25:49] At this point, in the evolution of Vivo, I've probably interviewed a hundred trainers. I've never talked to anyone who is like Kevin, and Kevin has a real passion for what he's doing. He's got a ton of experience on working with limited mobility customers, and really had a vision for what we could do. And so, with his assistance, we created the programming, but really having Kevin be

[00:26:13] a core component of, of adding to you know, where our expertise was was, was absolutely fundamental to the success of what we're doing now. And then, there's the kind of medical science aspect of what we're doing also, and this concept of these assessments that we're doing. And, much like meeting Kevin just through

[00:26:31] some really extensive networking, got connected with a woman named Dr. Katie Star, who is a professor and research scientist at the Duke School of Medicine in the Department of Gerontology. And, she has been working with doing research studies for exercise and nutrition and the impact on older adults for years.

[00:26:49] And so, to have her be a part of this and buy into the vision, we really started to fill in the kind of missing components, where I think I, I brought maybe the ability to start the business, to grow the business, to understand how to create this and move it forward, but really needed the, those domain experts to fill in these individual areas. And, between the science and research aspect and the fitness and wellness aspect, really beginning to put this together and then have since added other pieces,

[00:27:17] gotten connected with a fabulous nutritionist named Jamie Rinker, who's our head of nutrition, a couple of other great advisors. We have a neurologist, we're very focused on brain health as a part of the strength training that we're doing, and a guy named Dr. Jonas, Sarah, who is a neurology professor and researcher at the Emory School of Medicine,

[00:27:35] and another gentleman named Dr. Chris Thompson, who is a professor of kinesiology at the University of San Francisco, who's also built a couple of exercise programs for older adults and has a lot of experience launching those. So, understanding where your gaps are, right, and, none of us are good at everything, and trying to hire and bring people along who buy into that vision and that passion and can contribute to kind of filling out those, those, those gaps is really, really critical,

[00:28:01] especially when you are, what is referred to as "a solopreneur." So, that is, that is a tough place to be, it's a lonely place to be, but building out a team of experts is, is absolutely required. 

[00:28:13] Richard Simms: [00:28:13] Yeah, totally. I of course couldn't agree more. I think that when you're in the early stages, especially, it's very important quickly to realize like what your strengths are and where you need to be supplemented. And I've been lucky to meet a couple of the folks that are working with you on Vivo, and they're of course, incredibly smart you know, doctor-types, that, you know, I think, gives so much credibility to what you all are teaching, and then allows you to focus on you know, more of the vision or the strategy as you should as the founder and CEO.

[00:28:42] So, I think that's great. My, my next question for you, so naturally, a lot of the conversations that you and I have had about Vivo you know, have  revolved around the role technology plays, and how that vision will evolve. So, tell me a little bit more about that. I mean, I know all of this is in flux, but I'd love to hear more about you know, how you all are leveraging technology

[00:29:03] now. We obviously know you're using Zoom, and then kind of where you see that going in time just as a part of the broader Vivo experience.

[00:29:11] Eric Levitan: [00:29:11] Right. So, what we've done, especially because we had to go to market pretty quickly, was we really pieced together what we thought were best-of-breed solutions. So, Zoom, especially with the rise of Zoom usage, as we noted earlier, it became this ubiquitous skillset that people had. It just made sense. Right? My mom understands how to use Zoom. That's who we're targeting. you know. Let's leverage a tool that people are comfortable with rather than build our own proprietary solution out of the gate. And so, we use Zoom, we use another product called Mindbody, which is a pretty standard, probably the most popular

[00:29:43] off-the-shelf kind of infrastructure for studios, fitness and wellness studios, and really leverage those two products to kind of build the foundation of our business, but as we've evolved and as we've continued to kind of expand our footprint, not only in customers, but in breadth of what we're providing to our customers, we've realized there's some real opportunities to provide some other bells and whistles and functionality,

[00:30:05] things that we want to do. And, that's where we've engaged companies like you guys, where we think there's a real opportunity to not only have this service that we're providing, where we're guiding people through, but really make it a tech-enabled service where we have the ability to do things like

[00:30:21] integrate with wearable, so you have real-time feedback on your own biometrics while you're in Vivo sessions, and have that even be informing the trainers about your level of effort. Because part of what's really important is you don't see change unless you basically have challenge, and that's actually true for any aspect of your life, but certainly as it relates to fitness and exercise.

[00:30:44] And so, we want to make sure that people are being challenged because that's what's going to lead to results, but there's a balance, right? You don't want to challenge somebody too much that they get hurt or worse. And so, having more feedback on, on those biometrics is really important, making the whole engagement interaction with what we're doing easier, giving people the ability to see their own progress log into their own dashboard.

[00:31:05] All of these things, resources of giving them access to videos and, and challenges and and education, these are all really important parts of what we want ultimately the Vivo experience

[00:31:16] to be. And so, we absolutely believe there's a future to build our own proprietary platform. And, that's something that we're, we're in the process of, of working through, but out of the gate, I think it was really important to get something quickly to market and leverage kind of a best of breed of tools,

[00:31:32] so that's what we did. 

[00:31:34] Richard Simms: [00:31:34] Yeah, I think that makes a ton of sense. And, you know, we've had a lot of fun thinking through with you how it can evolve and, and the big role technology can play. But I totally agree with that approach. I think it surprises folks sometimes because you know, we make our living building custom applications, but we were quick to advocate for off-the-shelf tools, you know, especially early on, because there's great stuff out there and it might not do everything you need right now, but it also allows you to learn so much about what your actual needs are and what your users need.

[00:32:07] And that way, whenever you're ready to invest more seriously in the technology, hopefully it's more of a bullseye, you know, in terms of what you've built out. So, I love it. I think that that makes a ton of sense. So, my next question is, and I I've seen such great accolades on the site and online, and I actually know a couple of folks that are participating in Vivo that have you know, been huge advocates and I think are getting a lot out of it, in your mind

[00:32:33] what are the biggest wins so far if you had to name a couple?

[00:32:37] Eric Levitan: [00:32:37] So it's, it's really it's two things that I'm incredibly proud of. One is the outcomes that we're seeing in our customers, you know, the efficacy of the program because we're doing assessments, we're collecting a lot of data about the changes that we're seeing, and it is nothing short of remarkable. It shouldn't be, it's not rocket science.

[00:32:55] You know, it's, if you do strength training consistently, you'll get stronger. That's just how it works. And so, we see that every day, but it continues to amaze me the rate at which people see improvements in just eight weeks. And we're averaging roughly around 26, 27% and upper body strength increase around the same thing, lower body strength increase and around a 25% increase in endurance, even.

[00:33:21] And, those are all that's just 8 weeks and those are averages. So, we are seeing really that translates to so much, that you don't even realize whether it's just more stable, being able to stand up out of a chair a little bit easier, things hurt a little bit less, you sleep better. We're getting a ton of reports of people losing weight and losing inches off of their waist.

[00:33:42] When you build more muscle mass you actually, that translates to burning more calories at rest. So, there's you know, some really interesting side effects that are happening there. We're just seeing people's cholesterol numbers improving. It is having some real significant outcomes, that  I mean, that's why we're doing this. Right.

[00:33:58] That is why we're doing this. But the second piece of that, that gets me equally as excited is our retention numbers are crazy off the chart. We have over 90% retention over the 14 months that we've been running this program now, and there's not a lot of fitness programs that can say that. And, to be fair, part of that is probably the pandemic, right?

[00:34:16] There's not a lot of other options, and we've, we've given people a live and interactive solution that's building community and, and creating education and awareness around all these things. So, I think that's, that's certainly a part of it. But we haven't seen any attrition, even since people have been going back,

[00:34:31] and it's something that we're obviously paying careful attention to, but in talking to our customers and running surveys we haven't seen attrition and real attrition yet. I don't foresee that we're going to see it in, in the coming in the near term future. And that speaks to the,  the fact that not only is the program working, but it's fun and it's engaging and building community

[00:34:51] because even if something was working, if it wasn't fun, if you didn't get engaged with what you were doing, you wouldn't keep doing it, even during COVID. Right. And so, we know we've built something that's good. We know we've built something that people want to do that people enjoy doing and are finding reward because they're paying to do this.

[00:35:09] And  and so, I'm really, really proud of the fact that not only are we making a real difference in people's lives from a physical perspective, but clearly they're, they're being engaged in building this community 'cause they're sticking with it. And so, I I'm, I'm so excited about those two things. 

[00:35:24] Richard Simms: [00:35:24] Yeah, I think it's awesome. And it's, it's cool that a lot of those results are so measurable based on what you're doing. Right. So, you know, there's all the kind of less tangible things that are still really important. Like I think just, we all know that social interaction and being a part of a community is really important for mental health and during COVID,

[00:35:44] and as people age, I know that can become increasingly problematic. So, stuff like that, that's hugely important, maybe tougher to measure, but then you can marry that with the really clear, "Here's how your strength increased over this period." you know, all those great things, blood pressure, I think that's, that's super cool.

[00:36:00] And I'm sure that, as things progress, you'll get more and more data that tells an increasingly compelling story.  Taking a step back you know, quickly, for Vivo, like, what does success look like to you one year from now, five years from now?

[00:36:16] Eric Levitan: [00:36:16] So, when I first set out to create Vivo, and we first started realizing that we had the ability to impact people, my goal, instantly my kind of shining-city-on-the-hill of vision was to impact as many people as we possibly can because this is literally something that everybody on the planet needs. Strength training is a really important

[00:36:37] part that we need to adapt into our, adopt into our behavior, especially as we get old, it becomes more and more important. And, knowing that I'm trying to touch as many people as possible, even just the sheer fact that we are, have touched a hundred people so far, and, and it had that kind of impact as is something that I'm very excited about.

[00:36:56] But now, how do we do that exponentially more? And so, within a year, we want to see what does it take to get from a 100 to 500? And how do we grow that? How do we begin to not only understand how to acquire customers better, what does that look like, what are the best channels to go down, but how to scale to continue to support and, and build out as we're, as we're growing.

[00:37:16] So, from a one-year perspective, we're definitely trying to figure out how do we go from a 100 to 500. And then from a longer term, whether it's three, five plus years, I think there's a real opportunity that this is a global company and that there's something much bigger and more significant at hand.

[00:37:30] And, whether it continues to be really focused on a more narrow kind of aspect of fitness around strength training or begins to expand horizontally, you know, it's hard to talk about strength training and not also talk about nutrition, which is why we have a nutritionist on our staff, because protein is really the building block, and amino acids really feed into, that's how you build muscle mass.

[00:37:51] And so, you have to be talking about those things, so now,

[00:37:54] we're focusing and adding nutrition, and then there's other aspects around sleep and mental health and meditation and stress management that you begin to kind of look at all the components of wellness. I think there's a real opportunity to Vivo to become kind of the, the centerpiece, this destination around lifestyle of how to

[00:38:12] focus on longevity, healthy aging, active aging, and really provide that as a resource that we turn into a global lifestyle brand. So, obviously a lofty vision, will take a lot of work to get there, but I think we're on our, on a, on a pretty strong path. 

[00:38:27] Richard Simms: [00:38:27] Yeah, absolutely. I think it's, it doesn't take much to see all the different directions it can go. And then, of course, as you said, it's a huge population and lots of smaller segments in there that probably have different needs that you know, you'll, you'll be able to target more specifically and kind of evolve into.

[00:38:44] So, I think it's cool. I totally see it. One of the last questions I had for you, this is tough to answer because there's so many things probably that will come to mind with this, but you've done this a couple of times. I mean, what, what advice would you give to someone in the early stages of, of pursuing a new business?

[00:39:01] Eric Levitan: [00:39:01] So probably there's, there's two things that come to mind immediately. The first is, as I noted before, being a solopreneur, basically being a sole founder is really hard and I would strongly recommend to anyone who's got this idea that they're super passionate about and want to make a run at, go find yourself a co-founder, at least one co-founder, because It's not even just about having someone else to bounce ideas off, which is obviously of tremendous value, but blocking and tackling, having another hand or two hands that are there with you

[00:39:34] to help just get things done because in the beginning, especially, there's so much to get done. But then, as you begin to progress, there's this crazy roller coaster that you go on, and I'm sure you and any other entrepreneur that's listening right now can, can understand. You will have three highs and three lows within a 24 hour period.

[00:39:51] And, it's not even from a day-to-day or week-to-week basis. It's literally within you know, hour to hour. And so, having somebody else being a part of that journey in that ride with you, who can help, either you know, you can, can lift up when you're on that high or they can lift up when you're on that low and vice versa.

[00:40:08] It's a really important part of the journey and doing it, doing it by yourself is, is a challenge. And it's not to say that it can't be done and it can't be done really well, but certainly my recommendation based on this experience is having a co-founder is a really important part of, of really making that entrepreneurial journey a little bit better.

[00:40:27] And then, the second one is really based on that foundation of the lean start-up methodology, which is develop some hypotheses and some assumptions and go test them without spending a lot of time, a lot of money, learn as much as you can from feedback, from the marketplace and from who your prospective customers are.

[00:40:45] And if we had, when, when COVID hit and shut down all the studios, if we had built our own technology platform, for instance, and taken six to nine months and spent  500 to 500,000 to a 1,000,000 dollars to build this technology platform, only to realize that we had missed the boat and that maybe older adults

[00:41:02] weren't good candidates to do strength training remotely with, or weren't able to effectively get on to our platform that we had built, or we didn't have efficacy with the program, it wasn't really moving the needle in terms of the physical outcomes and their health and wellness, I mean, what a tremendous waste of time and money that would have been.

[00:41:18] So, being able to get something out to market quickly, test the market, learn from the market, you know, take all of that into consideration and put another product out and continue to iterate until you feel like you've really got something that is addressing a market need, those are, that's a really important thing that really helped shaped me in terms of how I built this business,

[00:41:39] and I would certainly pass along to others. 

[00:41:41] Richard Simms: [00:41:41] Yeah, I think those are both great pieces of advice. So, it looks like we're about out of time and I think that's a good bookend for the listeners, for sure. So, I really appreciate it, Eric. This has been great, loved having you on. Before we sign off, where can visitors go to or listeners excuse me, go to connect with you,

[00:41:58] learn more about Vivo?

[00:42:00] Eric Levitan: [00:42:00] So, the website is actually teamvivo.com. That's T-E-A-M-V-I-V-O.com. We believe that when you join Vivo,

[00:42:08] you become a part of this team, this broader team, and this community that we talked about earlier. So, teamvivo.com, we do free introductory classes for anyone who's interested. That's a great way to help you overcome those fears,

[00:42:21] if it's something you're not sure is for you. I can assure you we have this incredibly wide spectrum of fitness levels for are our customers today. Our youngest client is 13, our oldest is 93. We have everything in between. So, if this is something you think you'd be interested in learning more, more about, go to teamvivo.com, you'll see a link and a button for signing up for a free trial.

[00:42:41] It's a great way to learn more about what we do. And you can always reach me at eric@teamvivo.com. 

[00:42:48] Richard Simms: [00:42:48] Awesome. Thanks again. It's been great having you on the Digital Footprint. Really appreciate it, Eric.

[00:42:54] Eric Levitan: [00:42:54] Thank you, Richard. I love it. Thanks for your time and the opportunity. 

[00:42:57] Richard Simms: [00:42:57] Absolutely. All right, bye bye.