How Great Leaders Create Trust, Growth, and Innovation

What separates a good leader from a truly effective one?

In this episode of UMBC Mic'd Up, host Dennise Cardona, M.A. '23 sits down with Karl Douglas, L.H.D. (Hon.), Graduate Faculty in UMBC's Entrepreneurship, Innovation, and Leadership (EIL) Graduate Program, to discuss leadership, communication, emotional intelligence, adaptability, and entrepreneurship in today's workplace.

Karl shares lessons from his journey from sales and marketing to Director of Talent Development, where he supports the growth and development of thousands of employees. Together, they explore what it means to invest in people, create psychologically safe workplaces, embrace change, and lead with purpose.

Learn more about the Entrepreneurship, Innovation, and Leadership Graduate Program at UMBC

#UMBC #LeadershipDevelopment #CommunicationSkills #EmotionalIntelligence #ProfessionalDevelopment #Leadership

Transcript

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Dennise Cardona  00:00:00  
Hey everyone, thanks so much for tuning in to this episode of UMBC Mic'd Up Podcast. I am Dennise Cardona, your host, and I am here with Professor Karl Douglas of the Entrepreneurship, Innovation, and Leadership Graduate Program here at UMBC. And I can't wait to dig in to talk about leadership and communication, and let's just get right into it. First of all, thanks, Professor Douglas, for being here with us today.

Karl Douglas  00:00:26  
Thank you. I really appreciate it. I'm honored to be on your platform, and anything I can do to improve the lives of others or iron sharpening iron is my thing. You and I have gotten off to a great start in other ventures, and then I'm excited just to connect with you today, so

Dennise Cardona  00:00:40  
let's do it all right. Let's do it. I would love to start off by asking you to share with listeners a little bit about your professional background and what led you into leadership and communication work.

Karl Douglas  00:00:53  
Thank you for this question. It's a loaded question, in that I didn't know I was gearing up towards this. It wound up being a passion of mine. So, I'll give you the short version, but it shows the trajectory for our listeners and viewers, you know, around, you know, how you might start off at point A, you zigzag across and get to point B right. So, starting off in sales and marketing, I'm the only dude making makeup, I'm only dude that could tell later what shade of makeup, she should be wearing all things makeup. I manage all Walmart stores for Procter and Gamble at a previous life. I got tired of living out of a suitcase and flying home and only being at home a day and a half during the week weekend, and I said, "But what can I do to improve the lives of others? And I thought heavily, "A man of faith in my church, they say, 'You should be an administrator, I think you'd be amazing. Like, what is that? Someone cold calling the resume. So I'm a licensed nursing home administrator, but I don't need in the current role that I'm doing. And that was with a nursing home that's local to Baltimore, but that's where I kind of really continue to sharpen my skills. I was always put in some type of leadership position or having responsibility of people, so all these roles have increased the responsibility, and I've found, through the, I would say, life of hard knocks, how to do some things, how to sharpen some things, and I've kind of had my own toolkit, if you will, around sharpening communication, building leaders, and it really turned out to be my passion. Currently, I'm Director of Talent Development, are responsible for the growth and development of 7000 associates between New England and Virginia. We're based here in Maryland. It's a big job, but boy, am I having fun growing leaders.

Dennise Cardona  00:02:35  
7000 people,

Karl Douglas  00:02:37  
that is correct. We have a growth and development plan internally that I've curated with the help of others from scratch, something that's really born and birthed with a blueprint for those that want growth and development. If you want to go from point A to point B, we have that. Here's the best part, Dennise. We have associates that don't want to grow, they don't want a promotion, but they still want to lend their talent. So we curated an extend pathway for them to get responsibility in their hand. There's no reason why associates should come. Our employees should come and leave half of themselves to work. So, if you like to bake, you like to knit, you know how to play music, you can cook. We want you to bring all that in and blend in to serve the lives of others. And so it's turned out to be phenomenal. Education pathways, short TED talk podcast. Hey, maybe we can put this on our website for those to kind of learn and get some learning from, so that's kind of how I got started. Boy, do

Dennise Cardona  00:03:29  
I love it! Wow, I mean, there's there's so much to unpack there, it's so exciting. What a first of all, I can feel your passion, which is amazing and incredible, and it's such purposeful work. It sounds like you're doing, you're at, you know, when it's when you make it about others, the experience is that much stronger, right? And that's exactly what it sounds like you do. You are serving others in this capacity, and when we make it about others, just only good things can come from that. Believe it, I agree. Yeah. Now, in your experience, what do you say separates good leaders from truly effective leaders?

Karl Douglas  00:04:08  
Yeah, I've been in both buckets. So, thank you for the question. Good leaders manage performance, in my opinion, but truly effective leaders, they develop people, so we have to create the environments where those that have you have responsibility for or your peers create an environment where they can grow, where they feel valued and become more capable over time. I remember the stories of my grandparents telling me, you know, my grandfather worked at the steel mill, and he was a number, literally checking in, he would do the witches put in the hole, and they really didn't care about him as a person, they were nice and kind and honest, but it was no growth, it was get in here and put the widget to the thing, and he did that for 40 years, you know, and then you know it may not have purpose, he didn't have a voice in the room, and so effective leaders also bring consistency, emotional awareness, and ability to make difficult decisions while still maintain. Any trust that's a different pivot, if you will, from those that we might have grown up with. Not organized, our organizations have that. They want to keep the power and the decision making at the top. They don't include others, and they feel if you don't like it, then you can leave this organization. I like to build an environment where everyone's welcome, everybody's voice and opinion matters, and I want them to know that you know I'm aware, and I care, and I'm grateful for their partnership. So, people with the title, they don't follow leaders who invest in them. If you think you're a leader, nobody's following you. All you're doing is taking a walk.

Dennise Cardona  00:05:35  
Yes, I mean, investing in other people. So, folks who, no matter what your job is, when you feel like somebody is vested in you, right? They want, they seek your approve, they seek your opinion, they seek your ideas. That's going to make you a lot more valuable and innovative in your, in your role. That's, that's powerful. I also have worked for organizations that have been different in terms of that, where I've been on like the bottom of the rung, and and they don't want to hear from people like me, and and it always made me feel very demoralized, and I never felt like I showed up with, I don't know, I wasn't able to put my full passion towards something, but of course, fast forward, and I'm in this career, UMBC, and I feel very valued and innovative in this role, because that's what they do. They want your opinion, they ask you for it, and when you're able to contribute in that respect, just the value you bring, some bring an organization and the people around you. It's not just the organization as an entity, it's the people.

Karl Douglas  00:06:40  
I appreciate you being transparent. I think it's another way that you and I connected so quickly. I said to myself, when I ever get in a place of influence, I won't treat people how I was treated. You know, have a lot of energy, have you know, but it needed to be directed and guided, and I got with the right people that cared enough to coach. It's something about when then people, your leaders, invest in you, and you tell them that you, they believe in you. Yeah, the sky was not the limit. It just did something for me, and I've seen this in other leaders, you know, that, that you know, have grown. I would say, in my role, I didn't know this when, when I interviewed for this role, brand new, has never been done before. I'm the first ever in this seat. My company thought it so important to invest in leadership. They made a role and hired someone that someone is me to be in it, right? And when I went through the interview process, they said, Carl, do you know how many people been promoted under your tutelage? No, I was not keeping count, and apparently I'm one of the highest, if not the highest, over the years, more than 20 in one year. My entire team of when I was an executive director, we're having dinner tonight. All of them are promoted into regional roles, so it's even bigger than the role. It's about the work, and now they're improving the lives of others. You know, I got to be a proud work dad, right? Proud work dad. I love that. Yeah, so I get what you're putting down. It makes total sense. And they didn't believe from me, they definitely can believe it from you. It's two of us, I'm sure. There's many more, exactly.

Dennise Cardona  00:08:05  
And you know, when you think about the human asset that the value of the human asset brings to an organization, if you, you know, I've worked, like I said, for organizations that don't value that, that skill that you bring, the ideas you have, and that attrition takes place, and then now they find themselves continuing to have to continue learning, developing people, training people in order to fit those roles. And how great is it when you can now focus? The leadership focuses on bringing out the values of everybody, so that they no longer feel like they have to keep looking for new opportunities out there, they found it there, they found a home for their, for their potential.

Karl Douglas  00:08:46  
Yeah, you're putting the blueprint together, that's one of the things when I'm selling the concept and the idea, the importance of this. There are benefits to doing this, and we don't do it just because of the benefits, however, we're repurposing our time. You said it, I'll lean in on your comment. I would have rather spend more time investing someone to take on more responsibility and working on soft skills than keep interviewing. Hi, I'm Carl. Welcome to Bright Blue. Like, this doesn't make sense. And so you get this turnstile effect, and you're spending money. I've learned on average is about 60 grand on board and associated in our industry, and you got a bunch of $60,000 just going in and out the door, and with you 30 days, 90 days, the onboarding experience wasn't there, they didn't feel welcome, they weren't part of their purpose, you made a bad choice based on the fit for the role, it's all the things. Well, wouldn't it be better if we can reinvest the time and money and not having to hire, get consistency, you build that through your brand, and you know, like, now we're opening new communities with individuals that have been with us, so we start each community with the Bright You Way, and it's because we invested in that, and the opportunities that we're given, the secret is out, people know, and they want to come work for leaders that have this concept, this is where you spend your time and your money.

Dennise Cardona  00:09:58  
Hm. Hmm, I love that. So, let's talk a little bit about communications, because you know, so communication skills, they obviously matter so much in leadership. What are some communication mistakes that you commonly see professionals making?

Karl Douglas  00:10:17  
Yeah, I see this a lot, and we have conversations a lot about this in the spaces that I'm in. First thing I would want everyone to know is that leadership is communication. I'm gonna say it one more time, leadership is communication. Usually see leadership and communication. No, no, leadership is communication. Why? Because every vision you have, the expectations, the corrections, the strategy, and the relationship - it depends on it. You can have them mixed in different orders, but you got to touch all of those. In today's environment, you look at kind of the landscape of those that want jobs and want to get in a good space where they can add value. The teams are multi-generational; they're not just, you know, one size fits all anymore. It's fast moving, and oftentimes leaders get overwhelmed, so you must be able to, you got to be able to communicate clarity, empathy, and purpose early and often, from the moment you meet the person. It's funny, my team, I said, y'all know I'm Urky, I show a lot of love and respect, more than asking the question I really care. How are you doing? What would you say? Tell me where I'm wrong. What did we miss? And that's a part of communication. Typically, we only want to hear the good stuff. The bad stuff, or opportunity areas, is what I call them, is where you want to live, right? So, poor communication, it creates confusion. Your associates now disengaged, and then they don't trust you. Strong communication creates alignment, it creates confidence, and it creates momentum. And so, once you learn that and understand that, that's the recipe, it is hard to disengage from that. It teaches your culture, and it's the only way it will work, it becomes contagious at everybody's doing it. You see, we do it when it's convenient, or we do it when there's a project we're working on that's super important to us. When you don't feel good, you still have to communicate well. And I would say, don't communicate and say, 'I'll get back to you if you don't have all your thoughts together. It doesn't have to be perfect, but it has to be clear. So, I think, as leaders we're responsible for that.

Dennise Cardona  00:12:24  
Yeah, and you know, it brings me to a point where I think about even personal and professional relationships rely on great communication, and one of the places I think a lot of us go wrong, myself included, where you know I'm a human being, and it's we seek perfection, but we're never going to get there, and one of the things is, is you know, when there's a maybe a difficult conversation that you need to have, where it's going to be uncomfortable, and you know, perhaps, like me, I don't like conflict, right? I've grown up thinking, I don't like conflict, I don't want to make anyone upset, I don't want. I always want equilibrium. Well, sometimes that actually can be a disservice to a relationship when you don't allow for that constructive conflict, if you will. What would you say to somebody who maybe is like myself sometimes, and we're afraid to have those difficult conversations, but we know they're pertinent. We know they're necessary. How would one go about doing that?

Karl Douglas  00:13:27  
You have to practice. This is what happens at the beginning of the new year. I see a lot of my friends and people I don't know. Sarah, I'm going to the gym, and the intent is right. And then, after a couple weeks, no judgment here. They fall off because life be life, and then life gets in the way, right? But the idea is, if you stick to it and you get in there, what happens is you become stronger. Then you begin to actually look good as a visual example of what happens. You don't have to live the biggest weight, you just have to be very consistent. So it is in this, it used to, and I'll be very transparent, having difficult conversations used to give me anxiety. Why? One, because the person you respected, you always anticipate what they're going to say, and typically what that is, is all in our brain. It doesn't mean that's exactly going to happen. Two, we're not prepared for the conversation, we don't know the cogent points, you have to remove the emotion and deal with facts. Three, we run from it, so every time you put it to the side, you're building a mountain of confusion, and it's going to be hard to deliver. I will tell you, I decided one day to stand up, and I was leading my team, and it was a tough role in a tough building, and then I would say the way I would explain it, I gained mastery in it. Dennise, I've had to turn people and hug me before they left. Here's what happens, because let's say I have one here. The pen is mightier than the sword. We're afraid to use this tool. This is a tool. What happens is. Yeah, and I'm talking to people. Hey, just want to bring you and have a conversation. I want to, I'm gonna take, you know, the onus on me. Probably was not clear with the communication. Here was the object, here was the goal. I probably was not clear. I want to read, you know, re-introduce that to you. Let's talk. Do you agree? We align, and if tomorrow the same associate or next week they do the same thing, typically what we do is disregard it and give them a pass. Nope, you get your pen. Hey, let's come have a conversation now. I just want to document what happens is you're it's a, it's a disservice not to give your leaders and your associates the feedback they deserve. It is a disservice. You have to do it. I don't believe Dennise people come to work and say, "I'm gonna be sucky today. I'm gonna just suck. I'm gonna just be bad. I've never.. I've no.. I'm gonna wake up to go drive this expensive gas, go get a parking spot, and just be sucky today. I don't believe that. So, the communication is not clear. So, they're looking for you. Folks want to be guided, they want to be led, right? And so, the difficult conversation is where you win, because the idea is when you address it, you stop having so many difficult conversations, then it's they know through the empathy and the reason that you came towards them is that you really care, right, and through them something you don't understand, so I look, I'm looking for the opportunity to have a conversation, and what happens is, watch this, Dennise, you will love your associate in your person so much, and by the way, I don't know how leaders separate the person from from the roles like they. I want to know everything about you. I know your dog, your cat, I know that's just who I am as a leader, because if I win and you don't win, I don't win. You see, so a part of this is bringing them in, having the conversation. Now you can talk to them straight up, because they know that you've shown care that you wouldn't do anything to hurt them. You see, that's how it works. Don't be afraid of it. Just be prepared, get in there, have the conversation. And what I would do is, certain leaders, I would bring them in, one as a witness, but two, to see me work, to see how I guide the conversation, and we get it down. Most, most associates, they straighten right up. The reason they don't, we have turnover because we're scared to have the conversation. You're leaking. Why are you letting your organization leak? I did. I put a lot into you. I said, "My neck is on the chopper block. Don't disappoint me. Oh my god, what are you gonna do? I love you. Let's get it together. Go to work, then you around, and you say, 'Oh, I caught your camera. Good job. You got to give the good feedback too. Bad news is halfway around the world before good news even puts his boots on. Do something bad, they talk about it. But in our organizations, we have to do and provide good feedback when folks do well, and coach them when you build this culture. I'm telling you, it's contagious. I've seen it work tremendously well, and you will have less things to focus on with regard to your communication. It will be two way, and not one way.

Dennise Cardona  00:17:55  
That right there, the two way. That's very good point. Thank you so much for bringing that, for explaining that. Those tips that you offered, just really great, solid, solid insights on that, because I think as professionals, a lot of us struggle with that, and even, like I said, even in personal relationships, working relationships, it's the same thing, it's those difficult conversations can be very, very difficult to have, but like you said, you create a disservice when you don't have them. That's just all there is to it. Thank you for sharing that. Thanks for the question. Now, entrepreneurship is often associated with starting businesses, right? But how do you define, say, entrepreneurship in today's workplace? What would you say?

Karl Douglas  00:18:40  
Yeah, I love this question. I've never been asked this question, and I think it's brilliant, because you helped me define in another way what I'm actually doing, and something that I believe in. My role is entrepreneurial, and we'll get into that shortly, but entrepreneurship today, in my mind, is someone taking ownership of overthinking, right, but it's the ability to identify a problem, create a solution, improve systems. You need systems and processes to be successful. Then you drive the value, regardless of the title. So, my team, you don't know who the leader is, because we all have the entrepreneurial spirit. Doesn't matter whether you're doing it on your own or for your organization. I'm an entrepreneur. I'll cite you a few examples. My role was experimental, and four years in, we didn't know where we were going. We had an idea and a concept, and I had to build the building, if you will, the landscape, and they put the drywall in there, and then put the front door and welcome people in, right, and part of it I was growing while I was growing other leaders, but what drove me was my, which I didn't have all of it, but I had an entrepreneurial spirit, I began to think of it more or less than a job and try to put it into a process, thinking about what the, it, the outcome. Was going to be and I took a whole bunch of meetings around the organization to ask the individuals and our associates, what did they want, and so I think the same way that I learned the light bulb came on, all of us should think about our role as an entrepreneur, you and I have had candid conversations, I think you're dopely amazing in the things that you do, and what we actually are doing right now, that's an entrepreneurial move. You thought out here's a need, here's a process that I'm going to do, here's when we do it, and here's how I get the message to improve the lives of other leaders. Oh, come on, this is good, so you can become entrepreneurial inside the corporation, inside the nonprofit, inside the school, inside the healthcare organization, the people who stand out are the ones that don't wait to be told everything. Most of us are afraid for the no. We're afraid, and no means next opportunity. Oh, I like that. That's like a quote. They think you got to think proactively, innovative and responsible, and help you know your organization move forward. Lot of times, like, I got an idea, and I got to keep noodling until it comes out, but I'm not afraid to bring other smart people or folks that I don't know that know that have expertise that I don't, and through conversation and communication the entrepreneurial spirit rises up, and this is how we develop these ideas. So, I believe all of us are entrepreneurs, whether you say I work for X Company or B Company, you're an entrepreneur, and you need to think about that spirit. Only thing is, your salary is guaranteed. Some entrepreneurs are not, but you need to think like and work like your life depended on it.

Dennise Cardona  00:21:50  
Bring that energy. I really like how you use the analogy of the house and building the walls and bringing the door in there and welcoming people into the door. You're really good with analogies, and I think for me that helps me to think through what you're, what you're talking about, and I can visually see it, and that's a great way to explain something. Really appreciate that.

Karl Douglas  00:22:13  
Call myself a storyteller, so I train and lead through stories, and I'm very transparent about my failures, the things that I've learned, and some of the wins, and I'm really good at giving people the game, giving them the recipe. Why should we duplicate, you know, a rep? Do you try and do something new? I'm gonna give you everything I got. I'm gonna give you, I'm not afraid of it. We'll go create something else new, you know. So that's how I got it connected with Gib. He's a lot of things to a lot of people, but one of my best leaders and friends and mentor and coach, and he's a professionals coach. And when he asked me to join the team, I was honored. I'm like, Who me? You think I'm good enough? Really, I'm wildly crazy. I don't teach like a regular professor. I'll bring Taylor Swift into a conversation, and how communication and how that works, something that's relevant that people can connect to, and to bring down what the lesson is that we're talking about. So he says, "Sure, join us. That's, yeah, that's four years ago, and I'm thrilled to be part of the team.

Dennise Cardona  00:23:15  
Oh, that's great. We love Gib. How can professionals become, would you say, more adaptable in rapidly changing industries, as we're kind of seeing these days with technology and advances in that.

Karl Douglas  00:23:31  
Yeah, actually, was talking with friends a couple weeks ago about adaptability, became a whole topic at happy hour, and I think through our discussions, we agreed adaptability. It starts with continuous learning and humility. Ooh, I know that's a dynamic duo. Learning and humility, you got to have some humility to be able to learn, and then teach others, you know what it is that, so you got to be adaptable. Most people are, this is my role, this is the title, you see, my badge, you see the door, and I'm not willing to bend. You might as well, you know, resign now, because that's not going to work. You're going to have a hard time. It's going to be painful. I got three points. I got three points that I would think about to give to our viewers today, but starting with industries, you know, they're they're evolving. It's the fact they're evolving too quickly. What you thought of yesterday has already been done, right? So, for anyone to rely on what they already know, you're going to miss the mark. You can bring that along, but you got to be curious. So, first thing, professionals need to stay professionally curious. I'm always curious. You want to call it nosy, whatever you want. Tell me more. I want to know all the things right, even if you think it's not in your industry or your lane, it will be. Find a way, it might be your next breakthrough. Number two, embrace the feedback. I'm always asking folks, find the holes. I'm thinking this way, what did I miss? What would you add? Does it make sense soon as you pick it up? I'm always asking that. Many people don't. Do that anymore. Many professionals don't do that. Number three, become comfortable with change. If there was a poster child for change, I would be on it. I'm the king of change, I promise you. I'm the king. It's happened, so I just learned how to embrace it. And the most adaptable people you know are not used to change. I know many people don't like it, but it comes at a cost. If you don't embrace it, you go and go through things as a leader and a professional, and it clouds your judgment of communication to be able to to really go all in and to share the vision to those that you lead. It becomes cloudy or muddy, right? So, the ones that you know are adaptable, they're the ones that's most willing to learn, most willing to pivot and evolve, without, you know, pride, pride getting away, pride before the fall. We've heard that comment before, and I know it to be true. So, adaptability is the way, because of the industries that you know rapidly changing. Be adaptable, be flexible, be willing to pivot.

Dennise Cardona  00:26:01  
Yeah, I really like how you said humility. I like that word also, coupled with curiosity, because when we allow ourselves the humility to realize we don't know everything, people might know more than we do. Then we open ourselves up to being able to say, hey, I can be curious about this, of how this person actually does this, and then maybe that's how change can actually be an easier concept for folks who are afraid to change and adapt, is having that humility.

Karl Douglas  00:26:31  
I'm glad we're recording this. You said that so perfectly and so effortlessly. I love being curious. It's a lot of things to learn. It's a lot of new innovation. I mean, I have had a conversation every day this week about AI. When my first leadership team at first was like, "Nah, we're not, and now we're leaning in, and it's the way of the world. We're taking notes, and, no, you know, how are we, you know, getting some movement off our plate to embrace and do the things we can really focus on? Like, I love all of it. I'm interested in anybody I meet, anybody I work with, about what they do, and I got a bunch of questions. I'm going to use that information some point in my life and in my career, personally and professionally.

Dennise Cardona  00:27:12  
Yeah, and you know, so an organization - I won't name them, but the one that I actually consult with, and I'm the academic, I'm an academic advisor for their curriculum for a train the trainer program. At first, they were so afraid of bringing AI into the curriculum because it just was so like way too much of a change for that, and I finally convinced them of the benefit of it, and you know, so we instituted that last year, and it was a big change for this organization, and they're pleased now, like they see the value in it, because the students that I have were really able to take that and understand the difference between their human value and the value of having a say a brainstorming partner like AI, but not as a replacement, but as an enhancement to what we're already doing, and so there I think a lot of organizations are struggling with the bringing AI into what they do, because there's a fear factor, for one, that, oh my gosh, it's going to take over my role if I, if I, if I embrace it too much. Oh, I might not look as valuable anymore, and so it's learning how to take those, take the take the wonderful asset of AI and kind of couple it with your own asset as a human being and bring that to the table.

Karl Douglas  00:28:37  
Shout out to you, and congratulations, and I'm thankful that you shared it. It inspired me. It reminded me when I was younger, and my mom, my grandmom, I was not feeling well, and they would give me castor oil, and I didn't like it. But say, you might not like it. It may feel bad at first. You don't know what you need. I know what you need, and most people, you and as a consultant and helping be the brain trust, some folks wouldn't push through the ad, you know, adversity, and you kept going, and I'm telling you, a year from now, you'll be happy, that's because some of our leaders don't stay curious, and they don't know exactly what questions to ask, they sitting around long enough, because they've let the media tell them what AI is, and they don't get into the details of what you know what folks' first impression of AI is, is because what they heard on social media or certain news outlets, and they seem what some are doing at a very high level that don't fit their industry, so they take that as a part of their own, they're like, "Ooh, this is bad. Then, by the way, they eat dinner with their family, and then their son, and their wife, like, "Oh, this is bad, you know? And this is why we should.. all that affects you, and if you don't have anything to balance that off, you're gonna say no. Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. So, you said it helped. Yes, that's good.

Dennise Cardona  00:29:59  
I love talking about. About the concept of emotional intelligence, especially as it relates to communication and leadership. So, in your opinion, how important is emotional intelligence when leading teams or trying to drive that innovation? Yeah, what a

Karl Douglas  00:30:14  
great intersecting question based on the current conversation we, you know, questions we just had, but emotional intelligence is non-negotiable. It is critical to mission. It's mission critical, right? Emission, emotional intelligence, you know, helps. It helps leaders. It will help them recognize what motivates people, what discourages them, and how to bring the best out of them. You know, and for me, that's the top three. When I think about, you know, emotional intelligence, you can't leave home without it. Leaders who understand people who bring like stronger teams, you know, it helps to navigate conflict better. It creates healthier cultures. Some of our people are lazy, and they want to do it the old fashioned way, and that's just not going to work for the multi-generational teams that we have. And you're going to have to bring your intelligence with you. You're going to come up with some people who that really matters and it cares, and you'll lose a big chunk of the brain power and innovation from your team, because it doesn't feel psychologically safe. So, innovation also requires you to be psychologically safe. People need to feel respected and heard before they will share ideas. A lot of people, like, you know, over time, I know it's like you have a lot to say. Why are you being quiet? I'll just, even my students, you know, this when we're in class, it's four weeks in, but when they haven't spoken really a lot in three weeks, I'm like, Paul, you have a lot to say, I'm waiting on you, you know, I'm just poking them, poking the bear, but it was over time that they felt, you know, safe, and that their ideas was credible enough to be heard and accepted by others, you know, challenging assumptions and taking rest, and, and when you do that, you have a recipe for success. It is the foundation for what you learned, and give taught me that. Give taught me that, and I began to go down this extra lanes, like, well, you're doing it, you just don't have a name for it, and this is the name you know for it, and so if you're, if our leaders and leaders that view this aren't, you know, into you know, EQ, EI, you need to, you know, read a few books, you know, take a few, you know, tests, and kind of feel where your strengths are, and where you can lean in to learn a little bit more. Truth is, a lot of us are probably doing some of it, but you need to understand the wholeness of it, so you can execute it well. And what you do is, you blend it into what you're already doing, you become unstoppable as a leader.

Dennise Cardona  00:32:56  
So, if somebody listening wants to become a stronger communicator, where should they begin? I'm a book guy,

Karl Douglas  00:33:07  
but honestly, you can go a lot of TED Talks for communication, you know, that comes up, and you know around strong mindsets, you know, things like that. Bigger, leaner, stronger. Michael Matthews is good. Beyond the hammer is another good one. Braver, stronger, smarter is another one that comes to mind. We, in our current organization, we currently, you know, use these, you know, as a way to strengthen our teams, and we have a book club, so it's leadership. We, yeah, we love, we're going back to the old book club, and that thing has grown. We get 3040 people and bring in perspective. It's a lot of fun. I mean, some of these I've been introduced from others on my team, and it was something. It was like, oh, is this dance? You know, it's like I got a certain style book that I like to read, and they sold me on the reason why I should consider it, and I should read it, so you know, just a few, but you can just literally Google it, or watch, I love Ted Talks on it as well, as a, you know, as a good guy option, but they can reach out to you and I as well.

Dennise Cardona  00:34:19  
Absolutely, yeah, yeah. Thank you so much, Professor Douglas, for sharing all of these wonderful insights. Gosh, I love this conversation. It could go on and on. Oh, I have some.. yeah, there's so much in you that I want to bring out and hear your, your opinions on, and your insights on, but gosh, you've shared so much wonderful stuff with us already today. So grateful for that, for your time. Thank you.

Karl Douglas  00:34:47  
It's my pleasure. I'm honored to have been thought of to be a part of this conversation. It's a part of my passion. It's very important to me, because I want all of us to win. This is important work that we're doing in whatever spaces we are. And we want to be well equipped and I think just a little bit of togetherness and soul seeking and searching will make us all better and stronger. Thank you for all that you do to put these type of platforms together, conversations together. I'm a fan, not I'm not only, not only your brother, I'm a fan, and thank you. We're stronger and better because of, because of your work. Thank you.

Dennise Cardona  00:35:27  
Wow, thank you so much for saying that. And thank you, everyone, for tuning in to this episode of UMBC Mic'd Up Podcast. If you'd like to learn more about our offerings, please click the link in the description. Thank you so much. Thanks.