{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":7.649,"endTime":10.139,"body":"In this episode, we"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":7.649,"endTime":10.139,"body":"have Dr. Rachel Griffith,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":10.199,"endTime":13.319,"body":"professor of economics at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":10.199,"endTime":13.319,"body":"Manchester University Research"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":13.319,"endTime":16.319,"body":"Director of the Institute of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":13.319,"endTime":16.319,"body":"Fiscal Studies, and past"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":16.319,"endTime":20.039,"body":"president of the Royal economic"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":16.319,"endTime":20.039,"body":"society. Hi, Rachel. It's lovely"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":20.039,"endTime":22.889,"body":"to meet you. And I'm looking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":20.039,"endTime":22.889,"body":"forward to learning exactly how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":22.889,"endTime":26.939,"body":"you got here. So before we talk"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":22.889,"endTime":26.939,"body":"about where here is, tell me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":26.939,"endTime":30.299,"body":"about your background, what was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":26.939,"endTime":30.299,"body":"it like growing up in Ithaca,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":30.389,"endTime":33.839,"body":"New York? Hi, Jennifer. Thanks a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":30.389,"endTime":33.839,"body":"lot. And thanks for talking to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":33.839,"endTime":39.839,"body":"me. So I was born in Africa, my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":33.839,"endTime":39.839,"body":"dad was at Cornell University,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":39.869,"endTime":44.489,"body":"the first in his family to go to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":39.869,"endTime":44.489,"body":"university. But as we move when"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":44.489,"endTime":48.329,"body":"I was quite young, so it took"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":44.489,"endTime":48.329,"body":"about like, we're growing up in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":48.329,"endTime":51.239,"body":"general, up to maybe about the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":48.329,"endTime":51.239,"body":"age of seven. I'm the youngest"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":51.239,"endTime":55.739,"body":"of four kids. So it was a quite"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":51.239,"endTime":55.739,"body":"loud, chaotic house, if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":55.739,"endTime":59.849,"body":"like. But one in which we were"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":55.739,"endTime":59.849,"body":"all from a very young age,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":59.849,"endTime":63.569,"body":"really encouraged to express"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":59.849,"endTime":63.569,"body":"opinions. Talk about what was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":63.569,"endTime":66.809,"body":"happening in the day, my parents"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":63.569,"endTime":66.809,"body":"were politically very active."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":67.139,"endTime":71.399,"body":"And I think that actually was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":67.139,"endTime":71.399,"body":"really formative. 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And, and what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":115.829,"endTime":119.249,"body":"what was that, like amongst your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":115.829,"endTime":119.249,"body":"peer group? You know, what? Were"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":119.249,"endTime":122.579,"body":"you the only one? Yeah, so I was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":119.249,"endTime":122.579,"body":"pretty much the only one. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":122.819,"endTime":125.219,"body":"there's two different ways of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":122.819,"endTime":125.219,"body":"interpreting what my parents"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":125.219,"endTime":130.559,"body":"did. Either. 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So they were very young. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":143.219,"endTime":147.779,"body":"they were perhaps just ready not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":147.779,"endTime":151.919,"body":"to be parents anymore. That'd be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":147.779,"endTime":151.919,"body":"get on with my life. And so, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":151.919,"endTime":156.059,"body":"know, actually, it was not that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":151.919,"endTime":156.059,"body":"big of a deal. I think for them,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":156.059,"endTime":158.699,"body":"it must have been, but they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":156.059,"endTime":158.699,"body":"never let it influence me. They"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":158.699,"endTime":161.999,"body":"were very supportive of whatever"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":158.699,"endTime":161.999,"body":"I wanted to do, by myself"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":161.999,"endTime":165.419,"body":"learned after spending a year"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":161.999,"endTime":165.419,"body":"being a waitress, that that was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":165.419,"endTime":168.809,"body":"just going to be tedious and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":165.419,"endTime":168.809,"body":"boring. And so I went back and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":168.839,"endTime":173.159,"body":"got my graduate equivalency"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":168.839,"endTime":173.159,"body":"degree. But I have to give all"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":173.159,"endTime":175.889,"body":"the credit in the world to my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":173.159,"endTime":175.889,"body":"parents for and my brothers and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":175.889,"endTime":177.839,"body":"sisters for being incredibly"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":175.889,"endTime":177.839,"body":"supportive."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":179.01,"endTime":182.28,"body":"You know, for me to pursue what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":179.01,"endTime":182.28,"body":"I wanted to do. Wow. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":182.31,"endTime":185.25,"body":"yeah, because that's the thing."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":182.31,"endTime":185.25,"body":"It's kind of giving you the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":185.25,"endTime":189.03,"body":"freedom to go out and see what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":185.25,"endTime":189.03,"body":"that decision means in real"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":189.03,"endTime":192.0,"body":"life. And then, and then taking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":189.03,"endTime":192.0,"body":"the consequences. And then the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":192.0,"endTime":195.12,"body":"next steps as you like, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":192.0,"endTime":195.12,"body":"interesting, you say about which"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":195.12,"endTime":200.25,"body":"thing, I've waitress from the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":195.12,"endTime":200.25,"body":"age of like, 14, which thing on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":200.25,"endTime":202.74,"body":"and off in bar work. And I first"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":200.25,"endTime":202.74,"body":"moved to London, even though I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":202.74,"endTime":205.74,"body":"started working at The Guardian,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":202.74,"endTime":205.74,"body":"I got a part time job in a pub"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":205.74,"endTime":208.92,"body":"for extra money, and you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":205.74,"endTime":208.92,"body":"to meet people, and I say to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":208.92,"endTime":212.94,"body":"people know, that, number one,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":208.92,"endTime":212.94,"body":"I'm always very keen to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":212.94,"endTime":216.48,"body":"interview young people who I you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":212.94,"endTime":216.48,"body":"know, interview for different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":216.48,"endTime":219.45,"body":"job roles that have waitress or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":216.48,"endTime":219.45,"body":"done bar work, because there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":219.45,"endTime":223.89,"body":"definitely some sort of grit and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":219.45,"endTime":223.89,"body":"like problem solving. And if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":223.89,"endTime":227.82,"body":"can stick that out, like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":223.89,"endTime":227.82,"body":"there's a lot you can bring into"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":227.82,"endTime":232.2,"body":"any workplace, and I think, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":227.82,"endTime":232.2,"body":"also something that I think is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":232.2,"endTime":235.11,"body":"you never realise at the time"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":232.2,"endTime":235.11,"body":"because I totally relate to what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":235.11,"endTime":237.99,"body":"you said about you know, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":235.11,"endTime":237.99,"body":"like, this isn't for me."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":239.4,"endTime":241.65,"body":"It's there is something"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":239.4,"endTime":241.65,"body":"satisfying about getting to the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":241.65,"endTime":244.56,"body":"end of your waitressing shift or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":241.65,"endTime":244.56,"body":"your bar work shift. And it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":244.56,"endTime":247.62,"body":"doesn't matter how terrible it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":244.56,"endTime":247.62,"body":"was. It's over."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":248.67,"endTime":251.22,"body":"And you can tidy up and set up"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":248.67,"endTime":251.22,"body":"for the next day. And there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":251.22,"endTime":253.8,"body":"something very satisfying about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":251.22,"endTime":253.8,"body":"that. I think that we don't get"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":253.8,"endTime":258.39,"body":"in other jobs unfortunately. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":253.8,"endTime":258.39,"body":"we interesting to see to hear"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":258.39,"endTime":263.22,"body":"from you on how you how that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":258.39,"endTime":263.22,"body":"maybe not very long experience"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":263.22,"endTime":267.42,"body":"that had that part of that gap"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":263.22,"endTime":267.42,"body":"between school and going back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":267.42,"endTime":271.98,"body":"into education. What How do you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":267.42,"endTime":271.98,"body":"feel about it now looking back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":272.01,"endTime":276.24,"body":"and what? Let's say you didn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":272.01,"endTime":276.24,"body":"have the supportive parents that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":276.24,"endTime":277.11,"body":"you did?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":280.23,"endTime":283.8,"body":"Yeah, just how do you feel about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":280.23,"endTime":283.8,"body":"that being in that position? And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":283.95,"endTime":288.39,"body":"and was it you know, did did you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":283.95,"endTime":288.39,"body":"find it easy to then just switch"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":288.39,"endTime":291.0,"body":"and come back and go right,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":288.39,"endTime":291.0,"body":"well, I do need to do my GED."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":291.0,"endTime":294.36,"body":"And that's what I'm gonna do."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":291.0,"endTime":294.36,"body":"Like, how did you feel in that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":294.51,"endTime":295.08,"body":"time?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":296.1,"endTime":299.07,"body":"Yeah, so it wasn't it was a long"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":296.1,"endTime":299.07,"body":"transition. So I waitress for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":299.07,"endTime":299.97,"body":"about 15 years."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":300.0,"endTime":303.78,"body":"Actually, when I say I went back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":300.0,"endTime":303.78,"body":"to school, I paid for myself."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":303.78,"endTime":308.04,"body":"And I mean, it kind of taught me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":303.78,"endTime":308.04,"body":"a little bit. 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And in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":325.32,"endTime":329.22,"body":"fact, I think that for friends"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":329.22,"endTime":332.4,"body":"who have teenage kids, I really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":329.22,"endTime":332.4,"body":"encourage them to take a year"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":332.4,"endTime":335.34,"body":"out at least before going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":332.4,"endTime":335.34,"body":"city, I think it gives you some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":335.34,"endTime":339.15,"body":"kind of grit, it gives you some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":335.34,"endTime":339.15,"body":"kind of appreciation of how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":339.15,"endTime":342.06,"body":"completely privileged I am to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":339.15,"endTime":342.06,"body":"have the job that I currently"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":342.06,"endTime":345.18,"body":"have. Because I get to choose"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":342.06,"endTime":345.18,"body":"what I do. And I get to work"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":345.18,"endTime":349.17,"body":"with exciting people and, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":345.18,"endTime":349.17,"body":"know, having to get up and do a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":349.17,"endTime":351.75,"body":"job that maybe you don't love"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":349.17,"endTime":351.75,"body":"every minute, I didn't mind"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":351.75,"endTime":354.72,"body":"waitressing. But you know, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":351.75,"endTime":354.72,"body":"not the most fulfilling job in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":354.72,"endTime":358.08,"body":"the world pays, said, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":354.72,"endTime":358.08,"body":"it's done, and you pay the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":358.08,"endTime":358.65,"body":"bills. 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I think I've got that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":441.96,"endTime":446.04,"body":"debating ability and the ability"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":446.04,"endTime":450.9,"body":"to think critically and argue"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":446.04,"endTime":450.9,"body":"and work hard to fight my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":450.9,"endTime":455.76,"body":"corner. older brothers for that,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":450.9,"endTime":455.76,"body":"you know, made it not so high,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":455.76,"endTime":458.67,"body":"we said How hard was it to go"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":455.76,"endTime":458.67,"body":"back into education, it wasn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":458.67,"endTime":460.95,"body":"that hard, because that's what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":458.67,"endTime":460.95,"body":"it's like arguing with my older"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":460.95,"endTime":465.15,"body":"brothers. And it was, in a way,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":460.95,"endTime":465.15,"body":"something I was quite"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":465.15,"endTime":468.12,"body":"comfortable doing. Amazing,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":465.15,"endTime":468.12,"body":"George, I mean, there's so many"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":468.12,"endTime":472.05,"body":"follow up questions to just that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":468.12,"endTime":472.05,"body":"part of your story. I mean, how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":472.05,"endTime":475.05,"body":"amazing to have grown up with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":472.05,"endTime":475.05,"body":"parents who were so involved."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":475.29,"endTime":478.29,"body":"And what's interesting to me is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":475.29,"endTime":478.29,"body":"I can really see that in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":478.29,"endTime":481.92,"body":"work that you've done in your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":478.29,"endTime":481.92,"body":"research, and then in the kind"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":481.92,"endTime":485.67,"body":"of, you know, in your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":481.92,"endTime":485.67,"body":"interviews, and we'll get onto"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":485.67,"endTime":486.09,"body":"that because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":487.71,"endTime":490.29,"body":"yeah, I said in the beginning,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":487.71,"endTime":490.29,"body":"we were just chatting beforehand"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":490.29,"endTime":492.36,"body":"that there's so much of your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":490.29,"endTime":492.36,"body":"work I'm personally really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":492.36,"endTime":496.74,"body":"interested in. But I think that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":492.36,"endTime":496.74,"body":"that's something that would, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":496.74,"endTime":500.43,"body":"bet that something that a lot of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":496.74,"endTime":500.43,"body":"young people today can really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":500.43,"endTime":504.72,"body":"relate to you, because there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":500.43,"endTime":504.72,"body":"so much going on that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":504.72,"endTime":507.12,"body":"we're trying to change, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":504.72,"endTime":507.12,"body":"people are trying to improve and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":507.12,"endTime":510.21,"body":"even in lockdown when obviously"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":507.12,"endTime":510.21,"body":"it's very, very difficult and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":510.24,"endTime":513.12,"body":"you know, well COVID pandemic is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":510.24,"endTime":513.12,"body":"happening, it's very, very"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":513.12,"endTime":516.81,"body":"difficult. I one of the things I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":513.12,"endTime":516.81,"body":"value about see social media has"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":516.81,"endTime":521.88,"body":"been able to follow activists,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":516.81,"endTime":521.88,"body":"and what they do. And it's so"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":521.88,"endTime":524.52,"body":"interesting seeing people who've"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":521.88,"endTime":524.52,"body":"been activists for a very long"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":524.52,"endTime":529.11,"body":"time, and how much actual work"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":524.52,"endTime":529.11,"body":"it is, you know, it's not just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":529.11,"endTime":532.08,"body":"tweeting, it's actually getting"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":529.11,"endTime":532.08,"body":"up and doing things and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":532.35,"endTime":538.23,"body":"organising. And part of that,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":532.35,"endTime":538.23,"body":"you know, your parents trying to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":538.23,"endTime":542.07,"body":"influence the world to make it a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":538.23,"endTime":542.07,"body":"better place, I can really see"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":542.07,"endTime":546.63,"body":"that in some of the policy areas"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":542.07,"endTime":546.63,"body":"that you focused on. So I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":546.63,"endTime":548.88,"body":"going to jump in a little head a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":546.63,"endTime":548.88,"body":"little bit to some of the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":548.88,"endTime":551.79,"body":"questions. So I'll pull myself"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":548.88,"endTime":551.79,"body":"back in. But we will loop back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":551.79,"endTime":554.52,"body":"round to that, because I could"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":551.79,"endTime":554.52,"body":"definitely see how all of your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":554.85,"endTime":558.15,"body":"influences have shaped where"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":554.85,"endTime":558.15,"body":"you've gotten to now. And I just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":558.15,"endTime":560.94,"body":"wonder about maybe teenagers who"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":558.15,"endTime":560.94,"body":"are listening to this, or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":560.94,"endTime":563.1,"body":"parents who are listening to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":560.94,"endTime":563.1,"body":"this and looking at their kids"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":563.1,"endTime":567.21,"body":"and thinking, you know, what,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":563.1,"endTime":567.21,"body":"what would be good for their"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":567.24,"endTime":570.96,"body":"children to get involved in? And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":567.24,"endTime":570.96,"body":"where could they use their"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":570.96,"endTime":575.64,"body":"passions to really influence the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":570.96,"endTime":575.64,"body":"world in a positive way? And it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":575.64,"endTime":577.74,"body":"seems to me as I said in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":575.64,"endTime":577.74,"body":"beginning, I'm not I'm not an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":577.74,"endTime":581.34,"body":"economist, I don't I don't have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":577.74,"endTime":581.34,"body":"a background in that area. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":581.34,"endTime":584.34,"body":"it's not the number one thing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":581.34,"endTime":584.34,"body":"that people might jump to, to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":584.34,"endTime":588.48,"body":"see Do you know what you should"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":584.34,"endTime":588.48,"body":"look into my child is you should"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":588.48,"endTime":592.02,"body":"look into economics is not the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":588.48,"endTime":592.02,"body":"first thing that jumps out. So I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":592.02,"endTime":595.02,"body":"suppose there My question is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":592.02,"endTime":595.02,"body":"what what motivated you to pick"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":595.02,"endTime":599.13,"body":"economics what started you on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":595.02,"endTime":599.13,"body":"that particular journey into"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":599.34,"endTime":600.0,"body":"taking all of that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":600.0,"endTime":602.25,"body":"Background and all of that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":600.0,"endTime":602.25,"body":"passion and interest in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":602.25,"endTime":606.69,"body":"world. And channelling into"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":602.25,"endTime":606.69,"body":"economic Well, I only became an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":606.72,"endTime":611.19,"body":"economist a bit later on. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":606.72,"endTime":611.19,"body":"it's in my 30s. Actually, prior"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":611.19,"endTime":614.22,"body":"to that, to when I went back to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":611.19,"endTime":614.22,"body":"university actually went to be a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":614.22,"endTime":619.17,"body":"journalist first. And then did"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":614.22,"endTime":619.17,"body":"my first degree was in political"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":619.17,"endTime":619.83,"body":"science."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":620.97,"endTime":624.6,"body":"And then I worked for a while in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":620.97,"endTime":624.6,"body":"the private sector, and came"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":624.6,"endTime":628.23,"body":"back into a more academic"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":624.6,"endTime":628.23,"body":"setting. Again, kind of because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":628.23,"endTime":632.07,"body":"I was more interested in that in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":628.23,"endTime":632.07,"body":"trying to do something that had"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":632.07,"endTime":634.86,"body":"more social meaning to it, if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":632.07,"endTime":634.86,"body":"you like, I think there's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":634.86,"endTime":636.99,"body":"couple things I'd reflect on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":634.86,"endTime":636.99,"body":"from what you just said. So one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":636.99,"endTime":640.44,"body":"is, I think you can think too"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":636.99,"endTime":640.44,"body":"hard about it at 16, who knows"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":640.44,"endTime":643.89,"body":"what you want to do at 16, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":640.44,"endTime":643.89,"body":"certainly didn't identify a 16"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":643.89,"endTime":647.4,"body":"year old, I wanted to be a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":643.89,"endTime":647.4,"body":"dancer 16 know what they want to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":647.4,"endTime":650.01,"body":"do, I still don't know what I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":647.4,"endTime":650.01,"body":"want to grow up. And I'm, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":650.01,"endTime":655.65,"body":"know, nearly 60. So I think that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":650.01,"endTime":655.65,"body":"worrying too much about what you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":655.65,"endTime":658.89,"body":"want to do, ultimately, when you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":655.65,"endTime":658.89,"body":"grow up is detrimental to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":658.89,"endTime":661.83,"body":"actually going ahead. I think if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":658.89,"endTime":661.83,"body":"you talk to most successful"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":661.83,"endTime":665.1,"body":"people, very few of them, there"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":661.83,"endTime":665.1,"body":"are exceptions, but most of them"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":665.13,"endTime":668.37,"body":"are not when I was 16, I knew I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":665.13,"endTime":668.37,"body":"wanted to be this, I sound"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":668.37,"endTime":670.74,"body":"great, you know, musicians or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":668.37,"endTime":670.74,"body":"something, maybe were like that,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":670.74,"endTime":672.72,"body":"but I had no idea what I wanted"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":670.74,"endTime":672.72,"body":"to do."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":674.25,"endTime":677.22,"body":"100% The other thing, I always"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":674.25,"endTime":677.22,"body":"say to people, my personal"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":677.22,"endTime":679.98,"body":"philosophy, I think the other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":677.22,"endTime":679.98,"body":"thing, if you want to make the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":679.98,"endTime":683.55,"body":"world a better place, it can be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":679.98,"endTime":683.55,"body":"very exhausting, very hard,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":683.79,"endTime":686.01,"body":"because it's quite hard to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":683.79,"endTime":686.01,"body":"change things. And we should be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":686.01,"endTime":690.57,"body":"very ambitious and aim for the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":686.01,"endTime":690.57,"body":"most aspirational thing we can."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":690.84,"endTime":694.26,"body":"That is particularly true social"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":690.84,"endTime":694.26,"body":"media. People look like they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":694.29,"endTime":698.01,"body":"doing all this great stuff. But,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":694.29,"endTime":698.01,"body":"you know, behind the scenes,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":698.01,"endTime":700.62,"body":"they're having desperate moments"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":698.01,"endTime":700.62,"body":"where they feel rubbish about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":700.62,"endTime":703.26,"body":"what they've done. And they feel"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":700.62,"endTime":703.26,"body":"like they're a failure, and they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":703.26,"endTime":707.13,"body":"haven't things haven't gone,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":703.26,"endTime":707.13,"body":"right. Everyone has not been"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":707.37,"endTime":709.83,"body":"successful, maybe don't talk"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":707.37,"endTime":709.83,"body":"about that as much as they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":709.83,"endTime":712.68,"body":"should. And it's not that we"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":709.83,"endTime":712.68,"body":"should wallow in self pity, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":712.68,"endTime":716.13,"body":"just recognise that it's if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":712.68,"endTime":716.13,"body":"want to make the world a better"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":716.13,"endTime":719.28,"body":"place, that's a good thing to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":716.13,"endTime":719.28,"body":"start just being kind to people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":719.28,"endTime":722.22,"body":"and respectful of your next door"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":719.28,"endTime":722.22,"body":"neighbour and help the old lady"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":722.22,"endTime":727.17,"body":"cross the road and be you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":722.22,"endTime":727.17,"body":"just be nice. Absolutely do good"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":727.17,"endTime":731.1,"body":"and goodwill calm, like sort of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":727.17,"endTime":731.1,"body":"quite firm. It's that it's the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":731.1,"endTime":734.01,"body":"starfish story, isn't it? It's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":731.1,"endTime":734.01,"body":"that one of you know, throwing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":734.01,"endTime":736.11,"body":"all the starfish back into the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":734.01,"endTime":736.11,"body":"sea. And it's like, why are you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":736.11,"endTime":738.75,"body":"doing that you can never do all"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":736.11,"endTime":738.75,"body":"of them. It's never gonna make a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":738.75,"endTime":741.03,"body":"difference. Well, it made a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":738.75,"endTime":741.03,"body":"difference to that one. And that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":741.03,"endTime":744.6,"body":"is such a cliched story. But I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":741.03,"endTime":744.6,"body":"think about it all the time. No."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":744.6,"endTime":747.18,"body":"And I think I personally sit"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":744.6,"endTime":747.18,"body":"there with a friend of mine"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":747.18,"endTime":750.66,"body":"who's a professor who was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":747.18,"endTime":750.66,"body":"feeling exhausted and said to me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":750.66,"endTime":753.75,"body":"once, that I gave her the best"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":750.66,"endTime":753.75,"body":"piece of advice that she'd ever"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":753.75,"endTime":755.58,"body":"had. And I did very"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":753.75,"endTime":755.58,"body":"inadvertently, which is like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":755.58,"endTime":758.04,"body":"how do you just key How do you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":755.58,"endTime":758.04,"body":"do so much, I was like, you just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":758.04,"endTime":760.59,"body":"get up in the morning and do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":758.04,"endTime":760.59,"body":"what's in front of you. And it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":760.59,"endTime":763.59,"body":"not everything, but it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":760.59,"endTime":763.59,"body":"something again, you know, do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":763.59,"endTime":765.99,"body":"what you can feel good about."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":763.59,"endTime":765.99,"body":"And I think again, I think I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":765.99,"endTime":768.66,"body":"really got that from my parents"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":765.99,"endTime":768.66,"body":"if they were incredibly"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":768.66,"endTime":771.33,"body":"passionate about, you know, they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":768.66,"endTime":771.33,"body":"lived in America and this, they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":771.33,"endTime":774.42,"body":"lived in the south of America in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":771.33,"endTime":774.42,"body":"the 50s. And 60s, at a time when"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":774.93,"endTime":777.93,"body":"it was really horrible. Racism"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":774.93,"endTime":777.93,"body":"was terrible. And you know, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":777.93,"endTime":782.82,"body":"people were terrible to each"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":777.93,"endTime":782.82,"body":"other. And they just lived a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":782.82,"endTime":785.58,"body":"good life. And I think, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":782.82,"endTime":785.58,"body":"know, the whole thing of the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":785.58,"endTime":789.87,"body":"Freedom Riders was that of just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":785.58,"endTime":789.87,"body":"go and sit in cafes in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":789.87,"endTime":794.61,"body":"seats, white college students"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":789.87,"endTime":794.61,"body":"going and sitting in the seats"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":794.64,"endTime":797.55,"body":"that were reserved for black"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":794.64,"endTime":797.55,"body":"people because and they could"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":797.55,"endTime":800.55,"body":"get arrested. So my father got"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":797.55,"endTime":800.55,"body":"arrested for doing that. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":800.55,"endTime":803.07,"body":"he's a because he could deal"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":800.55,"endTime":803.07,"body":"with being arrested in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":803.07,"endTime":805.95,"body":"consequences, who with for him"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":803.07,"endTime":805.95,"body":"weren't nearly so bad as for the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":805.95,"endTime":809.28,"body":"black people protesting. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":805.95,"endTime":809.28,"body":"somebody with a really simple"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":809.28,"endTime":812.58,"body":"thing, but it was enormously"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":809.28,"endTime":812.58,"body":"powerful and changing social"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":812.58,"endTime":816.06,"body":"norms and changing the way that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":812.58,"endTime":816.06,"body":"the world is. It's off sometimes"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":816.06,"endTime":820.14,"body":"there's just quite little steps."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":816.06,"endTime":820.14,"body":"Yeah, we can achieve quite a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":820.14,"endTime":824.04,"body":"lot. Absolutely. And the thing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":820.14,"endTime":824.04,"body":"about that, as well as I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":824.04,"endTime":827.4,"body":"about my own parents, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":824.04,"endTime":827.4,"body":"something simple, I often think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":827.4,"endTime":830.43,"body":"back on is that so I was born in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":827.4,"endTime":830.43,"body":"1980. And I've got an older"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":830.43,"endTime":834.78,"body":"sister, and my dad left school"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":830.43,"endTime":834.78,"body":"at 14 and a half, I think to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":834.78,"endTime":837.99,"body":"start an apprenticeship. My dad"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":834.78,"endTime":837.99,"body":"was a mechanic, he retired. My"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":837.99,"endTime":843.6,"body":"dad was always home for dinner."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":837.99,"endTime":843.6,"body":"And, and he was very hands on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":843.63,"endTime":846.36,"body":"with us. Now, I don't know how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":843.63,"endTime":846.36,"body":"much of that was that he didn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":846.36,"endTime":849.54,"body":"have a choice because he had me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":846.36,"endTime":849.54,"body":"for a daughter. And he might"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":849.54,"endTime":851.97,"body":"have been embarrassed about some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":849.54,"endTime":851.97,"body":"leedy things, but he didn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":851.97,"endTime":855.84,"body":"really get choice. And so he was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":851.97,"endTime":855.84,"body":"quite progressive in his own"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":855.84,"endTime":859.95,"body":"way, within his kind of, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":855.84,"endTime":859.95,"body":"know, background and upbringing."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":860.1,"endTime":862.98,"body":"And I'm very grateful for that."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":860.1,"endTime":862.98,"body":"And I often tease him that he's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":862.98,"endTime":865.98,"body":"the first feminist I ever met,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":862.98,"endTime":865.98,"body":"although he would never ever"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":865.98,"endTime":866.61,"body":"refer to him."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":867.99,"endTime":870.63,"body":"But because he never made us"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":867.99,"endTime":870.63,"body":"feel like we couldn't do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":870.63,"endTime":872.91,"body":"something just because we"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":870.63,"endTime":872.91,"body":"weren't girls that just wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":872.91,"endTime":876.48,"body":"have occurred to him. And, and I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":872.91,"endTime":876.48,"body":"love what you said there because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":876.51,"endTime":879.63,"body":"although obviously what your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":876.51,"endTime":879.63,"body":"parents are doing, or what your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":879.63,"endTime":882.87,"body":"parents were doing is incredibly"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":879.63,"endTime":882.87,"body":"powerful and impactful. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":882.87,"endTime":886.17,"body":"that's such a big difference but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":882.87,"endTime":886.17,"body":"you're right it's we do our own"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":886.17,"endTime":889.95,"body":"little things with the little"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":886.17,"endTime":889.95,"body":"corner that we've got. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":890.1,"endTime":893.37,"body":"something my my parents always"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":890.1,"endTime":893.37,"body":"made us feel like we could"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":893.37,"endTime":896.16,"body":"change the world. Like I said"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":893.37,"endTime":896.16,"body":"education was most important"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":896.16,"endTime":897.9,"body":"thing, which is why I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":896.16,"endTime":897.9,"body":"immediately was like What on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":897.9,"endTime":899.97,"body":"earth did our parents say about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":897.9,"endTime":899.97,"body":"leaving secondary school?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":901.14,"endTime":903.57,"body":"But because my mum always said"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":901.14,"endTime":903.57,"body":"it was the gift that no one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":903.57,"endTime":905.85,"body":"could take away from you. So it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":903.57,"endTime":905.85,"body":"didn't matter what else"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":905.85,"endTime":908.49,"body":"happened, she always said to us,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":905.85,"endTime":908.49,"body":"I'm not paying for your wedding,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":908.73,"endTime":911.97,"body":"but I'll pay for your education,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":908.73,"endTime":911.97,"body":"three will God University, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":911.97,"endTime":914.67,"body":"at that time and in Scotland"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":911.97,"endTime":914.67,"body":"still now you know, it's less,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":914.79,"endTime":916.71,"body":"it's less expensive than it is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":914.79,"endTime":916.71,"body":"now."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":918.39,"endTime":920.67,"body":"So I love what you say there."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":918.39,"endTime":920.67,"body":"And I'm hoping that people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":920.67,"endTime":923.73,"body":"listening to this can really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":920.67,"endTime":923.73,"body":"feel like you know, if you look"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":923.73,"endTime":926.97,"body":"at your own parents or your own"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":923.73,"endTime":926.97,"body":"community around you and look at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":926.97,"endTime":930.75,"body":"the things that each person is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":926.97,"endTime":930.75,"body":"doing, that does make a positive"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":930.75,"endTime":933.48,"body":"difference, whether it's to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":930.75,"endTime":933.48,"body":"their tiny part of the world, or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":933.48,"endTime":937.11,"body":"a really big part of the world."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":933.48,"endTime":937.11,"body":"And again, all of this stuff, as"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":937.11,"endTime":940.02,"body":"we're talking about, it really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":937.11,"endTime":940.02,"body":"makes me think of the work that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":940.02,"endTime":943.5,"body":"you've done in your career and,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":940.02,"endTime":943.5,"body":"and some of the research that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":943.5,"endTime":946.26,"body":"you've done. So I'm going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":943.5,"endTime":946.26,"body":"skip actually a little bit ahead"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":946.26,"endTime":949.2,"body":"so that I can I can ask you more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":946.26,"endTime":949.2,"body":"about that. Because think it is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":949.23,"endTime":952.77,"body":"really fascinating. And I love"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":949.23,"endTime":952.77,"body":"how, like you said, maybe not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":952.77,"endTime":956.16,"body":"planned, but how these things"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":952.77,"endTime":956.16,"body":"kind of pulled together. Now,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":956.16,"endTime":959.1,"body":"which one of my questions should"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":956.16,"endTime":959.1,"body":"I jump into? Okay, I'll dive"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":959.1,"endTime":962.4,"body":"straight into this one. So your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":959.1,"endTime":962.4,"body":"work often touches upon the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":962.43,"endTime":967.11,"body":"impact of public policy on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":962.43,"endTime":967.11,"body":"upward mobility? I'd say. So,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":967.35,"endTime":970.53,"body":"even looking at your work on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":967.35,"endTime":970.53,"body":"nutrition as well, I feel like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":970.53,"endTime":974.46,"body":"that, too, is kind of heavily"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":970.53,"endTime":974.46,"body":"related to access to better food"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":974.46,"endTime":977.73,"body":"choices, and how that actually,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":974.46,"endTime":977.73,"body":"you know, impact social mobility"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":977.73,"endTime":981.39,"body":"as well. What what is it that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":977.73,"endTime":981.39,"body":"excites you about these areas?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":981.39,"endTime":983.61,"body":"And I suppose we've talked about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":981.39,"endTime":983.61,"body":"a little bit already, but what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":983.61,"endTime":987.12,"body":"is it that excites you about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":983.61,"endTime":987.12,"body":"studying those areas here. So I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":987.12,"endTime":990.63,"body":"would just, I would phrase that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":987.12,"endTime":990.63,"body":"a slightly differently and say"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":991.02,"endTime":995.88,"body":"much about upward mobility, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":991.02,"endTime":995.88,"body":"it's about giving people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":995.88,"endTime":1000.89,"body":"choices, to move to be mobile"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":995.88,"endTime":1000.89,"body":"where they want to be, I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1000.89,"endTime":1004.85,"body":"we focus too much on upward"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1000.89,"endTime":1004.85,"body":"mobility, not everyone wants"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1004.88,"endTime":1010.37,"body":"always to move up in the income"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1004.88,"endTime":1010.37,"body":"ladder, or the whatever, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1010.37,"endTime":1012.11,"body":"know, that are you thinking of."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1013.49,"endTime":1016.94,"body":"But I think everyone wants a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1013.49,"endTime":1016.94,"body":"better life, and to have a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1016.94,"endTime":1020.81,"body":"choice for the life that they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1016.94,"endTime":1020.81,"body":"want to have. And so I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1020.81,"endTime":1025.28,"body":"that's really what I see the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1020.81,"endTime":1025.28,"body":"power of economics trying to do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1025.28,"endTime":1028.94,"body":"is and and I think that,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1025.28,"endTime":1028.94,"body":"economists, that's not how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1028.94,"endTime":1032.12,"body":"economists are perceived by most"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1028.94,"endTime":1032.12,"body":"of the public. But actually,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1032.12,"endTime":1033.92,"body":"there's quite a lot of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1032.12,"endTime":1033.92,"body":"economists that that's what they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1033.92,"endTime":1039.2,"body":"think about is how can we make"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1033.92,"endTime":1039.2,"body":"government policy and let"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1039.2,"endTime":1043.67,"body":"markets work in ways that enable"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1039.2,"endTime":1043.67,"body":"people to make good decisions to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1043.67,"endTime":1047.39,"body":"live the life that they would"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1043.67,"endTime":1047.39,"body":"like to lead? For many people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1047.39,"endTime":1050.54,"body":"that will be getting a better"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1047.39,"endTime":1050.54,"body":"job, great, that's great, if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1050.54,"endTime":1053.18,"body":"that's where their aspirations"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1050.54,"endTime":1053.18,"body":"are, but if your aspirations are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1053.21,"endTime":1056.06,"body":"to, you know, stay at home and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1053.21,"endTime":1056.06,"body":"raise a family great, should"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1056.06,"endTime":1058.22,"body":"enable you to do that too. And,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1056.06,"endTime":1058.22,"body":"you know, whatever it is you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1058.22,"endTime":1062.0,"body":"want to do. So So how did I get"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1058.22,"endTime":1062.0,"body":"into that? You know, honestly, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1062.0,"endTime":1066.74,"body":"don't have a story for it. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1062.0,"endTime":1066.74,"body":"just, it was what interested me,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1066.92,"endTime":1071.33,"body":"it's a combination of what I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1066.92,"endTime":1071.33,"body":"personally liked doing, which is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1071.39,"endTime":1074.33,"body":"playing on the computer with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1071.39,"endTime":1074.33,"body":"large data sets in a very goofy"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1074.33,"endTime":1075.11,"body":"nerdy way."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1076.25,"endTime":1080.84,"body":"But also engaging with thinking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1076.25,"endTime":1080.84,"body":"about how people behave, and how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1080.84,"endTime":1085.85,"body":"we can, you know, where, where"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1080.84,"endTime":1085.85,"body":"there's room for policy, to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1086.12,"endTime":1089.27,"body":"operate. Better, to,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1090.44,"endTime":1093.98,"body":"to give people better"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1090.44,"endTime":1093.98,"body":"opportunities. Yeah. I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1093.98,"endTime":1095.9,"body":"that choices thing is really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1093.98,"endTime":1095.9,"body":"key, isn't it?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1096.95,"endTime":1100.34,"body":"I know, especially looking at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1096.95,"endTime":1100.34,"body":"your nutrition, your work on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1100.34,"endTime":1104.03,"body":"nutrition in thinking about,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1100.34,"endTime":1104.03,"body":"like things like food deserts in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1104.03,"endTime":1107.75,"body":"the US and that kind of stuff."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1104.03,"endTime":1107.75,"body":"And, and, you know, since Brexit"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1108.02,"endTime":1110.36,"body":"has happened, and touchwood,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1108.02,"endTime":1110.36,"body":"we're not, you know, there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1110.36,"endTime":1111.65,"body":"nothing too bad yet."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1112.73,"endTime":1115.55,"body":"That's probably our podcast for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1112.73,"endTime":1115.55,"body":"another day. You know, that is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1115.55,"endTime":1118.91,"body":"something that kind of started"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1115.55,"endTime":1118.91,"body":"to be mentioned, as you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1120.29,"endTime":1122.36,"body":"lots of people, if you didn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1120.29,"endTime":1122.36,"body":"live in those areas, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1122.36,"endTime":1126.62,"body":"wouldn't know that it was a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1122.36,"endTime":1126.62,"body":"thing necessarily. And I suppose"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1126.62,"endTime":1129.92,"body":"being an economist means that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1126.62,"endTime":1129.92,"body":"you can bring those kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1130.82,"endTime":1135.56,"body":"micro stories, and use the data"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1130.82,"endTime":1135.56,"body":"that represents those kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1135.56,"endTime":1138.23,"body":"smaller stories that aren't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1135.56,"endTime":1138.23,"body":"necessarily headline grabbing,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1138.56,"endTime":1142.37,"body":"but pull it into, like through"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1138.56,"endTime":1142.37,"body":"your research and through the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1142.37,"endTime":1145.28,"body":"outcomes and see recommendations"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1142.37,"endTime":1145.28,"body":"of your research, you can bring"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1145.28,"endTime":1148.88,"body":"it to influence policy to help"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1145.28,"endTime":1148.88,"body":"people who are in those"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1148.88,"endTime":1151.94,"body":"positions. Is that exactly fair."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1148.88,"endTime":1151.94,"body":"This is me just thinking about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1151.94,"endTime":1155.21,"body":"that's exactly fair. And in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1151.94,"endTime":1155.21,"body":"particular, what I'm interested"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1155.21,"endTime":1159.59,"body":"in is take the foods desert"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1155.21,"endTime":1159.59,"body":"example. That's a really tricky"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1159.59,"endTime":1164.33,"body":"one. Because it's definitely the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1159.59,"endTime":1164.33,"body":"case that if you go to lower"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1164.33,"endTime":1169.07,"body":"income, more deprived areas, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1164.33,"endTime":1169.07,"body":"you go to stores, you see less"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1169.07,"endTime":1173.39,"body":"healthy food in those stores."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1169.07,"endTime":1173.39,"body":"But is that because of the way"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1173.39,"endTime":1177.08,"body":"that the stores are operating?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1173.39,"endTime":1177.08,"body":"Or is that because the people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1177.08,"endTime":1181.04,"body":"who live in those areas, don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1177.08,"endTime":1181.04,"body":"buy the healthy food? If it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1181.04,"endTime":1184.58,"body":"there, you know, so is it driven"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1181.04,"endTime":1184.58,"body":"by supply or demand we say in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1184.58,"endTime":1188.81,"body":"economics, and that makes policy"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1184.58,"endTime":1188.81,"body":"really tricky in the area. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1188.81,"endTime":1192.44,"body":"trying to kind of what my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1188.81,"endTime":1192.44,"body":"expertise is in is trying to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1192.44,"endTime":1197.27,"body":"really understand what's driving"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1192.44,"endTime":1197.27,"body":"that combination of what firms"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1197.27,"endTime":1199.97,"body":"are doing and what people are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1197.27,"endTime":1199.97,"body":"doing, and how can they go"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1200.0,"endTime":1203.18,"body":"And then try and make that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1200.0,"endTime":1203.18,"body":"interaction more constructive"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1203.18,"endTime":1207.29,"body":"for everyone. It's not like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1203.18,"endTime":1207.29,"body":"firms are trying to get people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1207.29,"endTime":1209.45,"body":"to eat rubbish food all the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1207.29,"endTime":1209.45,"body":"time. I mean, sometimes they are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1209.72,"endTime":1212.72,"body":"advertising. You know, it's not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1209.72,"endTime":1212.72,"body":"that they're never trying to do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1212.72,"endTime":1216.26,"body":"that. But how do we understand"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1212.72,"endTime":1216.26,"body":"the way the market is so much"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1216.26,"endTime":1219.35,"body":"more going on? Yeah. And it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1216.26,"endTime":1219.35,"body":"not feasible for the government"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1219.35,"endTime":1223.46,"body":"really to decide what we all"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1219.35,"endTime":1223.46,"body":"need. That's not something that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1223.46,"endTime":1225.8,"body":"government wants to do wherever"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1223.46,"endTime":1225.8,"body":"you go, it's not feasible for it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1225.8,"endTime":1228.95,"body":"to decide that for everyone. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1225.8,"endTime":1228.95,"body":"we need to people need to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1228.95,"endTime":1232.25,"body":"making good choices for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1228.95,"endTime":1232.25,"body":"themselves. And so how do we"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1232.43,"endTime":1235.13,"body":"enable that? How do we, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1232.43,"endTime":1235.13,"body":"know, to where Are things going"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1235.13,"endTime":1238.67,"body":"wrong? Why are people making"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1235.13,"endTime":1238.67,"body":"what look like decisions that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1238.67,"endTime":1242.15,"body":"they themselves later regret?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1238.67,"endTime":1242.15,"body":"Not so much that I might"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1242.15,"endTime":1244.52,"body":"paternalistically think is a bad"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1242.15,"endTime":1244.52,"body":"decision, but that they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1244.52,"endTime":1247.58,"body":"themselves may later wish they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1244.52,"endTime":1247.58,"body":"hadn't taken? So how can we"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1247.82,"endTime":1252.68,"body":"empower people to be making"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1247.82,"endTime":1252.68,"body":"better decisions about food, or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1252.68,"endTime":1256.79,"body":"about jobs that they take or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1252.68,"endTime":1256.79,"body":"training that they take, or, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1256.79,"endTime":1259.7,"body":"know, all sorts of things? I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1256.79,"endTime":1259.7,"body":"love that because I feel like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1259.7,"endTime":1260.96,"body":"there's, you know, there."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1262.01,"endTime":1263.87,"body":"Again, I don't think it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1262.01,"endTime":1263.87,"body":"necessarily a social media"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1263.87,"endTime":1266.99,"body":"problem, I think it's been a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1263.87,"endTime":1266.99,"body":"mass media problem for a while"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1266.99,"endTime":1270.23,"body":"that everyone wants simple"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1266.99,"endTime":1270.23,"body":"solutions, or simple policy"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1270.23,"endTime":1275.48,"body":"solutions and simple headlines."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1270.23,"endTime":1275.48,"body":"And I've often said that, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1275.48,"endTime":1278.54,"body":"know, I think education is one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1275.48,"endTime":1278.54,"body":"of the areas that gets pulled"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1278.54,"endTime":1281.78,"body":"along with every election, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1278.54,"endTime":1281.78,"body":"know, there are promises made"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1281.78,"endTime":1285.11,"body":"and changes made, when actually"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1281.78,"endTime":1285.11,"body":"would be the benefit to leave"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1285.11,"endTime":1287.54,"body":"things for a little while, let"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1285.11,"endTime":1287.54,"body":"teachers do their job, etc, etc."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1287.54,"endTime":1291.71,"body":"And I suppose it's what, as an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1287.54,"endTime":1291.71,"body":"economist, and, you know, you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1291.71,"endTime":1294.11,"body":"not just talking about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1291.71,"endTime":1294.11,"body":"influencing necessarily UK or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1294.11,"endTime":1298.16,"body":"us. But you know, the whole of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1294.11,"endTime":1298.16,"body":"Europe or different parts of the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1298.16,"endTime":1301.22,"body":"world that you can get involved"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1298.16,"endTime":1301.22,"body":"in conversations about policy"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1301.22,"endTime":1305.03,"body":"that is so much further than"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1301.22,"endTime":1305.03,"body":"what's going on in a particular"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1305.03,"endTime":1308.57,"body":"election and what the rhetoric"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1305.03,"endTime":1308.57,"body":"is, but it was it gives you an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1308.57,"endTime":1311.72,"body":"opportunity to look at all of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1308.57,"endTime":1311.72,"body":"the things influenced that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1311.75,"endTime":1315.38,"body":"because I know growing up, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1311.75,"endTime":1315.38,"body":"even among kind of working"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1315.38,"endTime":1317.45,"body":"classes, there are certain"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1315.38,"endTime":1317.45,"body":"people who are like, well, so"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1317.45,"endTime":1320.18,"body":"and so can afford to smoke. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1317.45,"endTime":1320.18,"body":"they can't be that hard up. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1320.18,"endTime":1322.67,"body":"you know, there's all of those"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1320.18,"endTime":1322.67,"body":"kind of little things and little"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1322.67,"endTime":1325.82,"body":"messages that we give each other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1322.67,"endTime":1325.82,"body":"about the decisions other people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1325.82,"endTime":1329.45,"body":"are making, and how it's so much"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1325.82,"endTime":1329.45,"body":"more complicated than that,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1329.48,"endTime":1331.85,"body":"like, yeah, they might smoke,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1329.48,"endTime":1331.85,"body":"but maybe it's just because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1331.85,"endTime":1334.61,"body":"that's the only happy thing they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1331.85,"endTime":1334.61,"body":"get to do that day. And do you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1334.61,"endTime":1337.91,"body":"grudge that and it's, or it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1334.61,"endTime":1337.91,"body":"might just be that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1337.91,"endTime":1339.92,"body":"they've decided they want to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1337.91,"endTime":1339.92,"body":"smoke anyway, or it's addictive."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1339.92,"endTime":1343.58,"body":"And, again, so many different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1339.92,"endTime":1343.58,"body":"layers to this decision making."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1343.88,"endTime":1346.4,"body":"And as someone who's a bit of a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1343.88,"endTime":1346.4,"body":"data freak myself, I do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1346.4,"endTime":1348.92,"body":"appreciate that you take these"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1346.4,"endTime":1348.92,"body":"questions and sit in front of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1348.92,"endTime":1353.12,"body":"big giant datasets, and then try"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1348.92,"endTime":1353.12,"body":"and analyse them. I personally"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1353.12,"endTime":1357.89,"body":"find it fascinating. But also, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1353.12,"endTime":1357.89,"body":"think it's as someone who like I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1357.89,"endTime":1362.12,"body":"did an English degree, so I, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1357.89,"endTime":1362.12,"body":"know, don't have a background in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1362.75,"endTime":1365.99,"body":"science and mathematics beyond"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1362.75,"endTime":1365.99,"body":"what I did at secondary school,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1366.23,"endTime":1371.72,"body":"where I was really interested in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1366.23,"endTime":1371.72,"body":"it. And I, again, I agree with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1371.72,"endTime":1373.82,"body":"you about people making"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1371.72,"endTime":1373.82,"body":"decisions too early on, but I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1373.82,"endTime":1377.03,"body":"suppose something that let's see"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1373.82,"endTime":1377.03,"body":"discover economics, as a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1377.03,"endTime":1380.42,"body":"campaign is trying to do is just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1377.03,"endTime":1380.42,"body":"kind of plant the seed that it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1380.42,"endTime":1384.89,"body":"an option. Because I feel like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1380.42,"endTime":1384.89,"body":"you know, like you say, people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1384.89,"endTime":1387.77,"body":"change their minds and move in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1384.89,"endTime":1387.77,"body":"lots of different directions."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1387.77,"endTime":1390.23,"body":"And you might not do economics"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1387.77,"endTime":1390.23,"body":"as an undergraduate, you might"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1390.23,"endTime":1393.92,"body":"go into it later, and having"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1390.23,"endTime":1393.92,"body":"done other things, but always"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1393.92,"endTime":1397.46,"body":"knowing that it's a possibility,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1393.92,"endTime":1397.46,"body":"and why you might want it to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1397.46,"endTime":1400.28,"body":"a possibility, why that might be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1397.46,"endTime":1400.28,"body":"a good thing for you to want to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1400.28,"endTime":1405.62,"body":"do is really important. So So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1400.28,"endTime":1405.62,"body":"what would you say to young"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1405.62,"endTime":1408.02,"body":"people when they're thinking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1405.62,"endTime":1408.02,"body":"maybe not making their life"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1408.02,"endTime":1411.17,"body":"career decision choices? But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1408.02,"endTime":1411.17,"body":"what would you say to them, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1411.17,"endTime":1413.03,"body":"know, when they're sitting"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1411.17,"endTime":1413.03,"body":"thinking about the subjects that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1413.03,"endTime":1417.26,"body":"they enjoy. For me, economics"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1413.03,"endTime":1417.26,"body":"does a really good job of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1417.26,"endTime":1421.82,"body":"connecting storytelling and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1417.26,"endTime":1421.82,"body":"numbers, and data. And those two"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1421.82,"endTime":1424.4,"body":"things to me need to go hand in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1421.82,"endTime":1424.4,"body":"hand all the time. You know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1424.4,"endTime":1427.01,"body":"your statistics and data are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1424.4,"endTime":1427.01,"body":"only as good as the real life"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1427.01,"endTime":1430.64,"body":"story that they tell. And I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1427.01,"endTime":1430.64,"body":"suppose there's tonnes and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1430.64,"endTime":1433.01,"body":"tonnes of students who were"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1430.64,"endTime":1433.01,"body":"maybe like me, who saw that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1433.01,"endTime":1436.76,"body":"storytelling side, but didn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1433.01,"endTime":1436.76,"body":"quite understand that actually,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1437.0,"endTime":1441.47,"body":"there's a lot of things in maths"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1437.0,"endTime":1441.47,"body":"and science and economics that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1441.59,"endTime":1443.39,"body":"also helps you to do that. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1444.56,"endTime":1447.23,"body":"how would you talk to students"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1444.56,"endTime":1447.23,"body":"now about that kind of thing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1447.26,"endTime":1450.17,"body":"without forcing them to make a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1447.26,"endTime":1450.17,"body":"20 year career decision"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1450.17,"endTime":1450.89,"body":"necessarily?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1451.91,"endTime":1454.58,"body":"No, no, definitely. No. Well,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1451.91,"endTime":1454.58,"body":"you just said a lot of great"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1454.58,"endTime":1457.13,"body":"things. So first of all, I'd say"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1454.58,"endTime":1457.13,"body":"that for someone with it does"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1457.13,"endTime":1460.04,"body":"the English or history degree,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1457.13,"endTime":1460.04,"body":"English degree of English"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1460.1,"endTime":1463.97,"body":"English, you have a very good"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1460.1,"endTime":1463.97,"body":"economics mind your description"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1463.97,"endTime":1467.57,"body":"of issues to do with smoking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1463.97,"endTime":1467.57,"body":"were spot on there. Actually."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1467.84,"endTime":1470.81,"body":"I've talked to many policymakers"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1467.84,"endTime":1470.81,"body":"who understood that much less"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1470.81,"endTime":1475.19,"body":"well than you. And just to just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1470.81,"endTime":1475.19,"body":"before I answer your question,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1475.19,"endTime":1479.24,"body":"to go back to see my face, I'm a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1475.19,"endTime":1479.24,"body":"little pink and excited by that."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1479.24,"endTime":1480.05,"body":"Thank you very much."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1481.1,"endTime":1483.05,"body":"To go before I answer your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1481.1,"endTime":1483.05,"body":"question, to go back to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1483.05,"endTime":1486.68,"body":"something else you said, which"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1483.05,"endTime":1486.68,"body":"was that people may be looking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1486.68,"endTime":1491.09,"body":"for simple answers. I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1486.68,"endTime":1491.09,"body":"that's right. I agree with you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1491.09,"endTime":1493.97,"body":"that we probably blame that on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1491.09,"endTime":1493.97,"body":"social media more than maybe"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1494.0,"endTime":1498.29,"body":"it's true but it it ties. It"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1494.0,"endTime":1498.29,"body":"ties up something you just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1498.29,"endTime":1499.82,"body":"everything we were talking about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1498.29,"endTime":1499.82,"body":"before that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1500.0,"endTime":1503.96,"body":"The way that I live with it,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1500.0,"endTime":1503.96,"body":"it's a constant frustration,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1504.38,"endTime":1508.43,"body":"that policymakers and actually"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1504.38,"endTime":1508.43,"body":"many people just want a simple"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1508.43,"endTime":1512.0,"body":"answer. What should? How should"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1508.43,"endTime":1512.0,"body":"we tax Oda? I don't want to know"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1512.0,"endTime":1515.21,"body":"the details, I just want the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1512.0,"endTime":1515.21,"body":"answer, you know. And so going"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1515.21,"endTime":1518.69,"body":"back to the I take the steps I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1515.21,"endTime":1518.69,"body":"can, I can't change the world."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1518.69,"endTime":1520.94,"body":"And we really, I think, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1518.69,"endTime":1520.94,"body":"probably the most important"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1520.97,"endTime":1523.4,"body":"place for us to spend more money"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1520.97,"endTime":1523.4,"body":"as an education system."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1524.45,"endTime":1527.36,"body":"I could spend all my time"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1524.45,"endTime":1527.36,"body":"talking about that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1527.42,"endTime":1530.15,"body":"you take one step at a time, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1527.42,"endTime":1530.15,"body":"we'll move there gradually. So I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1530.15,"endTime":1533.72,"body":"just live with that myself. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1530.15,"endTime":1533.72,"body":"I'm down to your question. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1533.72,"endTime":1537.47,"body":"how what, how would I talk to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1533.72,"endTime":1537.47,"body":"young people to think about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1537.47,"endTime":1541.34,"body":"economics. So one of the there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1537.47,"endTime":1541.34,"body":"a couple of things, you said"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1541.34,"endTime":1546.44,"body":"that economics at its heart does"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1541.34,"endTime":1546.44,"body":"marry up for the theory, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1546.59,"endTime":1550.43,"body":"with data and maths, but the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1546.59,"endTime":1550.43,"body":"data and maths can really come"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1550.43,"endTime":1554.93,"body":"later, I didn't know maths,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1550.43,"endTime":1554.93,"body":"actually, until much later,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1555.5,"endTime":1559.22,"body":"Intel I started my master's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1555.5,"endTime":1559.22,"body":"degree, I have had no math. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1559.22,"endTime":1562.64,"body":"math is a good return. If you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1559.22,"endTime":1562.64,"body":"like, if you like math, that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1562.64,"endTime":1565.52,"body":"great. And I am athletes very"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1562.64,"endTime":1565.52,"body":"useful in economics, it's not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1565.52,"endTime":1569.51,"body":"that it's not, but that you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1565.52,"endTime":1569.51,"body":"don't have to have that. It's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1569.51,"endTime":1573.17,"body":"logic much more. So logic is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1569.51,"endTime":1573.17,"body":"related to math, of course, that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1573.17,"endTime":1576.08,"body":"is quite a distinct thing. You"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1573.17,"endTime":1576.08,"body":"don't have to have the ability"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1576.08,"endTime":1579.05,"body":"to solve all the mathematical"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1576.08,"endTime":1579.05,"body":"equations, you need to have a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1579.05,"endTime":1582.23,"body":"logical mind. You know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1579.05,"endTime":1582.23,"body":"ultimately, economics is really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1582.23,"endTime":1585.86,"body":"about trying to think about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1582.23,"endTime":1585.86,"body":"cause and effect. What, what we"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1585.86,"endTime":1591.44,"body":"want to identify is that, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1585.86,"endTime":1591.44,"body":"know, just just poverty, cause"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1591.59,"endTime":1595.22,"body":"you see that people who are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1591.59,"endTime":1595.22,"body":"poor, unhealthy, there's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1595.22,"endTime":1598.85,"body":"correlation there. But is it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1595.22,"endTime":1598.85,"body":"that poverty causes people to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1598.85,"endTime":1601.4,"body":"unhealthy? Or is it being"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1598.85,"endTime":1601.4,"body":"unhealthy causes people to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1601.4,"endTime":1601.85,"body":"poor?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1602.9,"endTime":1605.54,"body":"that's constantly the kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1602.9,"endTime":1605.54,"body":"questions that economists are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1605.54,"endTime":1609.53,"body":"trying to deal with. And that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1605.54,"endTime":1609.53,"body":"ultimately about logic. Now,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1609.59,"endTime":1613.55,"body":"mathematics is an useful tool to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1609.59,"endTime":1613.55,"body":"help us write computer"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1613.55,"endTime":1617.33,"body":"algorithms and solve models. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1613.55,"endTime":1617.33,"body":"it's not really the core of what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1617.33,"endTime":1620.6,"body":"economics is at all. And in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1617.33,"endTime":1620.6,"body":"fact, what I do is I work with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1620.6,"endTime":1622.85,"body":"people who are much better"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1620.6,"endTime":1622.85,"body":"mathematicians with me, and they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1622.85,"endTime":1626.6,"body":"do the fancy maths, and I do the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1622.85,"endTime":1626.6,"body":"logic bit. But I mean, I do have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1626.6,"endTime":1628.94,"body":"some maths, I'm slightly"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1626.6,"endTime":1628.94,"body":"downplaying my mathematical"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1628.94,"endTime":1632.36,"body":"skills. But it's, I don't think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1628.94,"endTime":1632.36,"body":"that people need to see that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1632.36,"endTime":1636.2,"body":"that's the be all and end all. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1632.36,"endTime":1636.2,"body":"think if you're interested in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1636.2,"endTime":1641.9,"body":"having learning a set of tools"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1636.2,"endTime":1641.9,"body":"to enable you to say, well,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1642.08,"endTime":1644.36,"body":"should we spend more education?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1642.08,"endTime":1644.36,"body":"Or should we spend more on the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1644.36,"endTime":1648.32,"body":"healthcare system? Right now the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1644.36,"endTime":1648.32,"body":"problem the government's facing,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1648.32,"endTime":1652.55,"body":"you know, when does it that kids"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1648.32,"endTime":1652.55,"body":"go back into school? versus how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1652.55,"endTime":1656.96,"body":"much do we protect people, older"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1652.55,"endTime":1656.96,"body":"people? You know, that's,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1657.29,"endTime":1659.12,"body":"there's economics and that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1657.29,"endTime":1659.12,"body":"there's, of course, many other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1659.12,"endTime":1662.06,"body":"disciplines in that too. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1659.12,"endTime":1662.06,"body":"ultimately, the economic"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1662.06,"endTime":1664.37,"body":"question about what are the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1662.06,"endTime":1664.37,"body":"costs to those young people for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1664.37,"endTime":1667.13,"body":"missing education? How do you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1664.37,"endTime":1667.13,"body":"think that question through"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1667.13,"endTime":1670.34,"body":"logically, that's ultimately"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1667.13,"endTime":1670.34,"body":"what economics is about? It's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1670.34,"endTime":1673.7,"body":"not about just solving some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1670.34,"endTime":1673.7,"body":"mathematical equations,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1674.06,"endTime":1677.06,"body":"mathematical equations help you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1674.06,"endTime":1677.06,"body":"do that. But it's really about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1677.06,"endTime":1679.64,"body":"thinking through people's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1677.06,"endTime":1679.64,"body":"behaviour and the choices that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1679.64,"endTime":1683.81,"body":"they want to make? And what are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1679.64,"endTime":1683.81,"body":"our aspirations as a society?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1683.93,"endTime":1687.68,"body":"And how do we try and help"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1683.93,"endTime":1687.68,"body":"people repeat those aspirations?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1687.71,"endTime":1692.03,"body":"Wow, I also that reminds me of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1687.71,"endTime":1692.03,"body":"my year of doing philosophy at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1692.03,"endTime":1694.94,"body":"university as well, like all the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1692.03,"endTime":1694.94,"body":"different you know, you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1694.97,"endTime":1698.0,"body":"you're looking at things like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1694.97,"endTime":1698.0,"body":"stoicism and utilitarianism, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1698.0,"endTime":1702.11,"body":"all that kind of stuff. It"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1698.0,"endTime":1702.11,"body":"really is about the philosophy"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1702.17,"endTime":1705.98,"body":"of it as well, isn't it? It's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1702.17,"endTime":1705.98,"body":"not just the, the numbers like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1705.98,"endTime":1708.92,"body":"you say, economics came from"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1705.98,"endTime":1708.92,"body":"philosophy. I mean, if you look"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1708.92,"endTime":1710.96,"body":"at many economics"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1708.92,"endTime":1710.96,"body":"professorships, they came out of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1710.96,"endTime":1714.62,"body":"philosophy, departments,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1710.96,"endTime":1714.62,"body":"philosophy, political science,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1714.62,"endTime":1718.28,"body":"maths, there's all kind of mixed"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1714.62,"endTime":1718.28,"body":"up. But you can be a very good"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1718.28,"endTime":1721.28,"body":"economist and be specialising"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1718.28,"endTime":1721.28,"body":"and one of those more than the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1721.28,"endTime":1721.52,"body":"other."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1722.87,"endTime":1724.97,"body":"There's something else just to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1722.87,"endTime":1724.97,"body":"reflect on what you said, again,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1725.0,"endTime":1728.42,"body":"link the link with policy, it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1725.0,"endTime":1728.42,"body":"really important to remember"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1728.42,"endTime":1731.33,"body":"that as economist, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1728.42,"endTime":1731.33,"body":"it's not my job to say what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1731.33,"endTime":1735.53,"body":"policy should be we elect"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1731.33,"endTime":1735.53,"body":"officials whose job is to decide"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1735.53,"endTime":1738.41,"body":"where policy is. So as an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1735.53,"endTime":1738.41,"body":"economist, what I learned, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1738.41,"endTime":1742.01,"body":"the reason I like studying"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1738.41,"endTime":1742.01,"body":"economics, is a set of tools to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1742.01,"endTime":1745.22,"body":"help people make those"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1742.01,"endTime":1745.22,"body":"decisions. And that's, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1745.22,"endTime":1748.28,"body":"my role is to try and help them"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1745.22,"endTime":1748.28,"body":"logically think through if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1748.28,"endTime":1750.59,"body":"do a what's going to happen if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1748.28,"endTime":1750.59,"body":"you do B, what's going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1750.59,"endTime":1754.4,"body":"happen? Not to say what should"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1750.59,"endTime":1754.4,"body":"happen, but to think through"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1754.4,"endTime":1758.27,"body":"those Yeah, think through"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1754.4,"endTime":1758.27,"body":"logically. That's how you might"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1758.27,"endTime":1760.88,"body":"answer those questions. It's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1758.27,"endTime":1760.88,"body":"going through the choices again,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1760.88,"endTime":1764.33,"body":"isn't it? Sorry, can you hear my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1760.88,"endTime":1764.33,"body":"puppy barking in the background?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1765.56,"endTime":1769.22,"body":"He stopped that. Okay, I can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1765.56,"endTime":1769.22,"body":"carry on. Unfortunately, he just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1769.22,"endTime":1771.32,"body":"doesn't understand that we're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1769.22,"endTime":1771.32,"body":"recording a podcast."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1773.3,"endTime":1776.33,"body":"I'm sure he has good things to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1773.3,"endTime":1776.33,"body":"say about this as well. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1777.17,"endTime":1779.66,"body":"He's, yeah, he likes to see them"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1777.17,"endTime":1779.66,"body":"in the middle of the night"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1779.72,"endTime":1780.14,"body":"lesson."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1781.25,"endTime":1785.21,"body":"So that actually leads me back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1781.25,"endTime":1785.21,"body":"to something I was when I was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1785.21,"endTime":1789.05,"body":"doing my research by talking to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1785.21,"endTime":1789.05,"body":"you. I loved what you said in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1789.05,"endTime":1792.08,"body":"your UBS interview for a woman"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1789.05,"endTime":1792.08,"body":"and economics where you talk"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1792.08,"endTime":1796.07,"body":"about the importance of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1792.08,"endTime":1796.07,"body":"curiosity driven research. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1796.19,"endTime":1799.97,"body":"one of the things that because I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1796.19,"endTime":1799.97,"body":"guess lecture at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1800.0,"endTime":1803.0,"body":"Redditch University in their PR"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1800.0,"endTime":1803.0,"body":"course, talk about digital"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1803.0,"endTime":1807.14,"body":"marketing. And I used to do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1803.0,"endTime":1807.14,"body":"further education and you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1807.14,"endTime":1810.8,"body":"kind of work based learning for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1807.14,"endTime":1810.8,"body":"kind of young people coming out"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1810.8,"endTime":1814.94,"body":"of say GCSE level or a level,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1810.8,"endTime":1814.94,"body":"going into the workplace. And I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1814.94,"endTime":1818.69,"body":"used to talk to them all about,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1814.94,"endTime":1818.69,"body":"the best thing you can do is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1818.69,"endTime":1821.63,"body":"just be really curious, like, be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1818.69,"endTime":1821.63,"body":"really curious about how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1821.63,"endTime":1824.51,"body":"everything works. And it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1821.63,"endTime":1824.51,"body":"something I say to my niece and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1824.51,"endTime":1828.26,"body":"nephew all the time. And I say"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1824.51,"endTime":1828.26,"body":"to anyone, and it doesn't matter"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1828.26,"endTime":1830.93,"body":"whether they're not sure about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1828.26,"endTime":1830.93,"body":"what they want to do next. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1830.93,"endTime":1833.66,"body":"if you just keep asking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1830.93,"endTime":1833.66,"body":"questions, they keep asking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1833.66,"endTime":1837.35,"body":"questions, you don't have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1833.66,"endTime":1837.35,"body":"know the answers. But be asked"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1837.35,"endTime":1841.13,"body":"the questions keep being"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1837.35,"endTime":1841.13,"body":"curious. And and, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1841.13,"endTime":1843.59,"body":"answers are often not what you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1841.13,"endTime":1843.59,"body":"think, because I know you find"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1843.59,"endTime":1847.07,"body":"out with one of your particular"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1843.59,"endTime":1847.07,"body":"areas of research, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1847.07,"endTime":1851.0,"body":"calories in declining calories"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1847.07,"endTime":1851.0,"body":"in that particular part of the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1851.03,"endTime":1854.24,"body":"the nutritional research he did."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1851.03,"endTime":1854.24,"body":"And, and I feel like that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1854.24,"endTime":1858.68,"body":"something that, you know, like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1854.24,"endTime":1858.68,"body":"you, you got a lot of your kind"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1858.68,"endTime":1861.5,"body":"of grit and experience from your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1858.68,"endTime":1861.5,"body":"parents and something I get from"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1861.5,"endTime":1864.98,"body":"my dad. And along with ADHD, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1861.5,"endTime":1864.98,"body":"think it's something else I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1864.98,"endTime":1867.14,"body":"think I got from him, although"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1864.98,"endTime":1867.14,"body":"he doesn't admit that he has it."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1868.31,"endTime":1873.05,"body":"And so that that curiosity"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1868.31,"endTime":1873.05,"body":"driven research, I think that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1873.05,"endTime":1876.11,"body":"something that a lot of students"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1873.05,"endTime":1876.11,"body":"can relate to, because it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1876.11,"endTime":1879.56,"body":"quite difficult. I think, when"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1876.11,"endTime":1879.56,"body":"you're that age, I remember"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1879.56,"endTime":1883.58,"body":"being that age and having just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1879.56,"endTime":1883.58,"body":"no understanding of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1883.64,"endTime":1886.58,"body":"what is it actually like to be a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1883.64,"endTime":1886.58,"body":"doctor, a lawyer work in an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1886.58,"endTime":1889.07,"body":"office work in the oil industry"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1886.58,"endTime":1889.07,"body":"work in this industry, that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1889.07,"endTime":1892.13,"body":"industry, you don't actually"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1889.07,"endTime":1892.13,"body":"know what any of it is really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1892.13,"endTime":1897.77,"body":"like, until you get out and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1892.13,"endTime":1897.77,"body":"start doing things? So how, how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1897.77,"endTime":1898.76,"body":"do you think?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1900.14,"endTime":1903.8,"body":"How do you think schools and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1900.14,"endTime":1903.8,"body":"parents, I suppose can kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1903.8,"endTime":1908.0,"body":"encourage that type of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1903.8,"endTime":1908.0,"body":"curiosity? From a young age?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1908.0,"endTime":1909.68,"body":"Because I think that it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1908.0,"endTime":1909.68,"body":"matter what discipline you go"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1909.68,"endTime":1913.82,"body":"into. If you've got that you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1909.68,"endTime":1913.82,"body":"basically flying, aren't you? I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1913.82,"endTime":1915.68,"body":"couldn't agree more? That's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1913.82,"endTime":1915.68,"body":"great question."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1916.73,"endTime":1920.15,"body":"So and it's not just research? I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1916.73,"endTime":1920.15,"body":"mean, I think that would be my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1920.15,"endTime":1923.39,"body":"answer in life to everything."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1920.15,"endTime":1923.39,"body":"Just be curious. And you'll go"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1923.39,"endTime":1927.71,"body":"for 100%. Yes, the most"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1923.39,"endTime":1927.71,"body":"frustrated, so I teach to very"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1927.71,"endTime":1932.15,"body":"large classes of second year"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1927.71,"endTime":1932.15,"body":"undergraduates. And the thing I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1932.15,"endTime":1938.33,"body":"find, I love teaching, I love"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1932.15,"endTime":1938.33,"body":"seeing kids learning react, the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1938.33,"endTime":1942.17,"body":"thing that I find most"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1938.33,"endTime":1942.17,"body":"frustrating is when they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1942.17,"endTime":1946.1,"body":"afraid to fail. So they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1942.17,"endTime":1946.1,"body":"afraid to admit that they don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1946.1,"endTime":1949.46,"body":"understand something. And I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1946.1,"endTime":1949.46,"body":"think that things that we, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1949.46,"endTime":1952.19,"body":"think one of the things that we"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1949.46,"endTime":1952.19,"body":"perhaps teach"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1953.21,"endTime":1959.12,"body":"this least well, especially now"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1953.21,"endTime":1959.12,"body":"is is exactly that, just you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1959.12,"endTime":1962.39,"body":"know, it's okay to fail. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1959.12,"endTime":1962.39,"body":"it's good ask questions that you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1962.39,"endTime":1965.75,"body":"don't know the answer to it. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1962.39,"endTime":1965.75,"body":"always tell PhD students this,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1965.87,"endTime":1968.9,"body":"you're basically if you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1965.87,"endTime":1968.9,"body":"smart, you're gonna learn,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1969.2,"endTime":1971.06,"body":"you're just gonna feel more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1969.2,"endTime":1971.06,"body":"stupid for the rest of your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1971.06,"endTime":1974.9,"body":"life. Because learning is about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1971.06,"endTime":1974.9,"body":"learning what you don't know. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1974.9,"endTime":1978.5,"body":"feel like an idiot all the time."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1974.9,"endTime":1978.5,"body":"You know, I'm very senior in my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1978.5,"endTime":1982.85,"body":"profession. I constantly feel"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1978.5,"endTime":1982.85,"body":"like a totally stupid person."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1983.51,"endTime":1986.87,"body":"And that's because I'm willing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1983.51,"endTime":1986.87,"body":"to always put myself on the edge"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1986.93,"endTime":1990.62,"body":"of what I know. And, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1986.93,"endTime":1990.62,"body":"teeter over into what I don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1990.62,"endTime":1993.98,"body":"know. And that's that's the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1990.62,"endTime":1993.98,"body":"curiosity. And I think that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1993.98,"endTime":1996.89,"body":"teaching kids from a young age"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1993.98,"endTime":1996.89,"body":"that that's okay, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1996.98,"endTime":1999.38,"body":"don't you don't know everything?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1996.98,"endTime":1999.38,"body":"Of course you don't? How would"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1999.38,"endTime":2002.98,"body":"you? None of us do? How could"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1999.38,"endTime":2002.98,"body":"you possibly know? What, what is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2002.98,"endTime":2005.83,"body":"most depressing is to get to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2002.98,"endTime":2005.83,"body":"meet someone who thinks they do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2005.83,"endTime":2008.74,"body":"know everything. Totally. Oh,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2005.83,"endTime":2008.74,"body":"well, and you'll never meet"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2008.74,"endTime":2010.96,"body":"anyone more boring. Exactly."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2012.52,"endTime":2016.45,"body":"Exactly. So having confidence in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2012.52,"endTime":2016.45,"body":"that. I mean, don't Don't be an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2016.48,"endTime":2018.61,"body":"idiot with not knowing things."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2016.48,"endTime":2018.61,"body":"But you know, having a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2018.61,"endTime":2021.64,"body":"confidence in that of like, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2018.61,"endTime":2021.64,"body":"don't understand that. Let me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2021.64,"endTime":2024.04,"body":"kind of explore that. And it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2021.64,"endTime":2024.04,"body":"okay, if I kind of make a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2024.04,"endTime":2027.31,"body":"mistake, or one thing people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2024.04,"endTime":2027.31,"body":"don't realise, I think a lot"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2027.31,"endTime":2030.76,"body":"about people doing research. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2027.31,"endTime":2030.76,"body":"how do you get into research?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2030.76,"endTime":2034.03,"body":"And what do you do? Most of my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2030.76,"endTime":2034.03,"body":"research I throw away because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2034.03,"endTime":2037.63,"body":"it's stupid. So get on that guy."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2034.03,"endTime":2037.63,"body":"I'm very well published. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2037.63,"endTime":2040.39,"body":"quite a successful researcher."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2037.63,"endTime":2040.39,"body":"But really, most of what I've"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2040.39,"endTime":2042.91,"body":"ever written down and thought"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2040.39,"endTime":2042.91,"body":"about is pretty dominance in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2042.91,"endTime":2046.66,"body":"bin, because you only get the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2042.91,"endTime":2046.66,"body":"good stuff by trying to do that."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2046.66,"endTime":2050.38,"body":"Right. And so that Yeah, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2046.66,"endTime":2050.38,"body":"refer to a paper about the,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2051.31,"endTime":2054.22,"body":"what's called gluttony and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2051.31,"endTime":2054.22,"body":"sloth, which is, you know, I had"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2054.22,"endTime":2057.67,"body":"a PhD student, I just giving a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2054.22,"endTime":2057.67,"body":"talk, and I just wanted a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2057.67,"endTime":2060.73,"body":"picture. And I said, Could you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2057.67,"endTime":2060.73,"body":"just do me this picture of how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2060.73,"endTime":2064.27,"body":"calories have changed over the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2060.73,"endTime":2064.27,"body":"last 30 years, and he came back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2064.27,"endTime":2066.73,"body":"with this downward sloping line,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2064.27,"endTime":2066.73,"body":"it showed that people were"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2066.73,"endTime":2070.39,"body":"eating less calories in the UK"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2066.73,"endTime":2070.39,"body":"over the last 30 years. I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2070.39,"endTime":2073.72,"body":"like, that's wrong, like you've"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2070.39,"endTime":2073.72,"body":"done something wrong. We've just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2073.84,"endTime":2076.66,"body":"wrapped it the wrong way, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2073.84,"endTime":2076.66,"body":"know? And he's like, no, this is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2076.66,"endTime":2079.33,"body":"in the data. And I'm like, No,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2076.66,"endTime":2079.33,"body":"it's not as wrong. And he"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2079.33,"endTime":2081.58,"body":"finally convinced me it was true"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2079.33,"endTime":2081.58,"body":"and and then we wrote a great"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2081.58,"endTime":2084.19,"body":"paper out of it, and it's turns"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2081.58,"endTime":2084.19,"body":"out to be easy, and it's super"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2084.19,"endTime":2087.13,"body":"interesting and turns out that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2084.19,"endTime":2087.13,"body":"people's life has become more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2087.13,"endTime":2090.46,"body":"sedentary than then the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2087.13,"endTime":2090.46,"body":"reduction in calories. So that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2090.46,"endTime":2094.06,"body":"what that explains the rise in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2090.46,"endTime":2094.06,"body":"obesity. But isn't it that's an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2094.06,"endTime":2097.66,"body":"example of you do. I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2094.06,"endTime":2097.66,"body":"you're more successful if you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2097.69,"endTime":2099.97,"body":"open to the fact that you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2100.0,"endTime":2103.99,"body":"Well, actually, so being curious"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2100.0,"endTime":2103.99,"body":"or being like, yeah, maybe maybe"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2103.99,"endTime":2107.29,"body":"my prayers about this or not the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2103.99,"endTime":2107.29,"body":"right ones, maybe I'm, I have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2107.29,"endTime":2110.14,"body":"the wrong idea about the world."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2107.29,"endTime":2110.14,"body":"And let me find out from other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2110.14,"endTime":2112.63,"body":"people who maybe have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2110.14,"endTime":2112.63,"body":"information I don't have. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2113.02,"endTime":2115.84,"body":"I think in any job, you'll get"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2113.02,"endTime":2115.84,"body":"further, if you're like that,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2115.87,"endTime":2120.04,"body":"yeah, I again, 100% it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2115.87,"endTime":2120.04,"body":"something I actually one of my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2120.04,"endTime":2124.12,"body":"favourite things about Twitter"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2120.04,"endTime":2124.12,"body":"is being able to follow so many"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2124.12,"endTime":2127.75,"body":"people that have different lives"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2124.12,"endTime":2127.75,"body":"to me. And to, I might not be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2127.75,"endTime":2130.03,"body":"able to come in contact with and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2127.75,"endTime":2130.03,"body":"especially over the last year"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2130.03,"endTime":2133.09,"body":"would not have been able to come"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2130.03,"endTime":2133.09,"body":"in contact with them, and just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2133.09,"endTime":2136.72,"body":"being able to kind of sit back"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2133.09,"endTime":2136.72,"body":"and listen. And what I've kind"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2136.72,"endTime":2138.88,"body":"of what I've learned from that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2136.72,"endTime":2138.88,"body":"is there were so many questions"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2138.88,"endTime":2141.91,"body":"that I didn't even know, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2138.88,"endTime":2141.91,"body":"wanted to ask or needed to ask."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2141.91,"endTime":2143.86,"body":"And it just so happened that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2141.91,"endTime":2143.86,"body":"they were talking about the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2143.86,"endTime":2147.46,"body":"answers in front of my eyes,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2143.86,"endTime":2147.46,"body":"although a good question is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2147.46,"endTime":2152.71,"body":"hard. Yes, it is. And often, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2147.46,"endTime":2152.71,"body":"know, it's cheesy, but it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2152.71,"endTime":2155.38,"body":"true, you know, two ears and one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2152.71,"endTime":2155.38,"body":"mouth. So you should listen more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2155.38,"endTime":2158.2,"body":"than you talk, which I'm still"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2155.38,"endTime":2158.2,"body":"working on at the ripe old age"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2158.2,"endTime":2160.21,"body":"of 40. But you know, we'll get"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2158.2,"endTime":2160.21,"body":"there."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2161.68,"endTime":2164.41,"body":"But I think that that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2161.68,"endTime":2164.41,"body":"something interesting about your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2164.41,"endTime":2169.18,"body":"work is that it really is about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2164.41,"endTime":2169.18,"body":"listening to the data. And, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2169.18,"endTime":2172.48,"body":"then, and not looking for the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2169.18,"endTime":2172.48,"body":"easy answers, necessarily, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2172.48,"endTime":2176.08,"body":"really stepping back. And one of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2172.48,"endTime":2176.08,"body":"the things I wanted to ask you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2176.08,"endTime":2176.95,"body":"about is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2178.18,"endTime":2184.51,"body":"so am i right in thinking that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2178.18,"endTime":2184.51,"body":"since you joined the Institute"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2184.51,"endTime":2187.87,"body":"of Fiscal Studies, I forgot the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2184.51,"endTime":2187.87,"body":"word studies there,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2189.16,"endTime":2195.64,"body":"that you now have a 5050 gender"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2189.16,"endTime":2195.64,"body":"party. Is that right? No. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2195.64,"endTime":2198.49,"body":"and you talk about the automatic"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2195.64,"endTime":2198.49,"body":"ones, that can't be credited to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2198.49,"endTime":2200.59,"body":"me, though, just to be clear,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2198.49,"endTime":2200.59,"body":"because you said since I've"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2200.59,"endTime":2200.89,"body":"joined,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2202.06,"endTime":2204.16,"body":"I've been there for 30 years. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2202.06,"endTime":2204.16,"body":"mean,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2205.9,"endTime":2208.99,"body":"there wasn't gender parity when"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2205.9,"endTime":2208.99,"body":"I joined and there is now but I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2208.99,"endTime":2210.1,"body":"can't take credit for that."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2211.15,"endTime":2214.39,"body":"Fair enough. Fair enough. No,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2211.15,"endTime":2214.39,"body":"sorry. I didn't mean to imply"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2214.39,"endTime":2216.85,"body":"that. But I mean, I'm sure you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2214.39,"endTime":2216.85,"body":"had an influence on it. No."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2219.13,"endTime":2219.52,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2220.57,"endTime":2223.09,"body":"But but that must have been"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2220.57,"endTime":2223.09,"body":"quite interesting to see how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2223.09,"endTime":2228.82,"body":"that's changed. But also, I've"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2223.09,"endTime":2228.82,"body":"seen you talk about look, gender"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2228.85,"endTime":2232.21,"body":"parity is one of the most"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2228.85,"endTime":2232.21,"body":"obvious ones. And and it came"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2232.21,"endTime":2235.69,"body":"up, I think, when the BBC was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2232.21,"endTime":2235.69,"body":"the BBC, when the government"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2235.69,"endTime":2238.39,"body":"published the, the pay gap"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2235.69,"endTime":2238.39,"body":"stuff, and it was like, okay,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2238.39,"endTime":2241.03,"body":"the gender pay gaps there, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2238.39,"endTime":2241.03,"body":"there are so many other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2241.06,"endTime":2245.65,"body":"different pay gaps underneath it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2241.06,"endTime":2245.65,"body":"all. And so we really, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2245.65,"endTime":2249.1,"body":"I suppose now people talk more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2245.65,"endTime":2249.1,"body":"about intersectional diversity"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2249.1,"endTime":2252.55,"body":"and how important that is. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2249.1,"endTime":2252.55,"body":"I'd really love to hear"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2253.6,"endTime":2256.42,"body":"kind of what you've learned over"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2253.6,"endTime":2256.42,"body":"that past 30 years, it's like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2256.42,"endTime":2259.9,"body":"okay, there's, there's more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2256.42,"endTime":2259.9,"body":"gender parity here now, but just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2259.9,"endTime":2262.93,"body":"within this organisation, not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2259.9,"endTime":2262.93,"body":"across economics as a whole."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2264.22,"endTime":2267.82,"body":"And, and for me, and it's the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2264.22,"endTime":2267.82,"body":"same not just for economics, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2267.85,"endTime":2273.34,"body":"any, any field across, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2267.85,"endTime":2273.34,"body":"study or work or whatever"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2273.34,"endTime":2277.69,"body":"industry, but it just seems to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2273.34,"endTime":2277.69,"body":"me that diversity, you know, has"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2277.69,"endTime":2282.49,"body":"a huge impact on public policy,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2277.69,"endTime":2282.49,"body":"and who influences it. So if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2282.49,"endTime":2284.65,"body":"you've got diversity in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2282.49,"endTime":2284.65,"body":"field of economics,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2284.68,"endTime":2289.06,"body":"particularly, it means that the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2284.68,"endTime":2289.06,"body":"people making the decisions have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2289.09,"endTime":2292.3,"body":"more diverse ways of thinking"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2289.09,"endTime":2292.3,"body":"and experiences. So hopefully,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2292.3,"endTime":2296.29,"body":"it can then start to impact"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2292.3,"endTime":2296.29,"body":"people's lives on every level. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2296.29,"endTime":2299.56,"body":"know, again, that's a big"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2296.29,"endTime":2299.56,"body":"thought and a big kind of em, if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2299.56,"endTime":2304.45,"body":"you like, but I think it is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2299.56,"endTime":2304.45,"body":"vital, isn't it? And I often"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2304.51,"endTime":2307.21,"body":"I've been the only woman in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2304.51,"endTime":2307.21,"body":"room like you, I used to work in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2307.21,"endTime":2310.48,"body":"the oil industry. And and also,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2307.21,"endTime":2310.48,"body":"even in my time at The Guardian,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2310.48,"endTime":2313.81,"body":"I was on a sales team where it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2310.48,"endTime":2313.81,"body":"was all men and me, and it was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2314.05,"endTime":2319.06,"body":"very interesting. But that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2314.05,"endTime":2319.06,"body":"probably the least challenging"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2319.09,"endTime":2320.68,"body":"as a kind of straight white"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2319.09,"endTime":2320.68,"body":"woman."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2321.7,"endTime":2324.43,"body":"You know, it wasn't particularly"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2321.7,"endTime":2324.43,"body":"challenging for me in that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2324.43,"endTime":2328.42,"body":"situation. Yes, I had things"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2324.43,"endTime":2328.42,"body":"that I had to tackle and certain"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2328.42,"endTime":2331.78,"body":"things, I did nip in the bud"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2328.42,"endTime":2331.78,"body":"quite early. But I kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2331.81,"endTime":2335.14,"body":"because I was, I'd had certain"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2331.81,"endTime":2335.14,"body":"experiences. By the time I was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2335.14,"endTime":2338.17,"body":"in those positions, I was much"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2335.14,"endTime":2338.17,"body":"more interested in looking out"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2338.17,"endTime":2341.26,"body":"for the other younger women"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2338.17,"endTime":2341.26,"body":"around me than anything else."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2342.67,"endTime":2344.89,"body":"But I really relate to what you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2342.67,"endTime":2344.89,"body":"said about that. It's like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2344.89,"endTime":2347.74,"body":"Okay, well, you can look at me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2344.89,"endTime":2347.74,"body":"as a white woman in a particular"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2347.77,"endTime":2352.45,"body":"position and the diversity if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2347.77,"endTime":2352.45,"body":"you like that brings, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2352.48,"endTime":2358.39,"body":"there's so much more that needs"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2352.48,"endTime":2358.39,"body":"to be done. So what for you are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2358.39,"endTime":2363.34,"body":"the things that that we need to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2358.39,"endTime":2363.34,"body":"do? And let's say in schools, in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2363.34,"endTime":2366.37,"body":"terms of getting people kind of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2363.34,"endTime":2366.37,"body":"trickling into economics, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2366.37,"endTime":2369.04,"body":"just across the board, what are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2366.37,"endTime":2369.04,"body":"the things that you think, or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2369.04,"endTime":2371.11,"body":"you've seen that you think, do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2369.04,"endTime":2371.11,"body":"you know what, we could do more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2371.11,"endTime":2374.92,"body":"of that, but this could work?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2371.11,"endTime":2374.92,"body":"Yeah, so another absolute great"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2374.92,"endTime":2379.12,"body":"question. So I do think that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2374.92,"endTime":2379.12,"body":"incredibly important. I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2379.12,"endTime":2381.58,"body":"gender is important, but I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2379.12,"endTime":2381.58,"body":"it's absolutely not the only"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2381.58,"endTime":2384.85,"body":"thing so for me personally, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2381.58,"endTime":2384.85,"body":"mean, it was I grew up with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2384.88,"endTime":2388.15,"body":"older brothers. I've often been"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2384.88,"endTime":2388.15,"body":"the only woman in the room"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2388.18,"endTime":2393.07,"body":"particularly a bit bit older."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2388.18,"endTime":2393.07,"body":"But that never bothered me. What"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2393.07,"endTime":2397.36,"body":"bothered me much more was that I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2393.07,"endTime":2397.36,"body":"didn't have the polished"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2397.39,"endTime":2400.0,"body":"Oxbridge ability to string"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2400.0,"endTime":2404.59,"body":"sentences together. I've learned"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2400.0,"endTime":2404.59,"body":"a bit how to speak better, but I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2404.59,"endTime":2407.89,"body":"don't you know, I didn't come"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2404.59,"endTime":2407.89,"body":"from that background. I grew up"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2407.89,"endTime":2410.23,"body":"in a household where we talked a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2407.89,"endTime":2410.23,"body":"lot that definitely did my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2410.23,"endTime":2413.29,"body":"parents both like to debate. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2410.23,"endTime":2413.29,"body":"I learned that skill from them."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2413.29,"endTime":2413.59,"body":"But,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2414.67,"endTime":2419.08,"body":"you know, I've often felt that I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2414.67,"endTime":2419.08,"body":"didn't belong in a room, because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2419.08,"endTime":2421.63,"body":"I didn't feel that I had that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2419.08,"endTime":2421.63,"body":"kind of credential. That sounds"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2421.63,"endTime":2423.37,"body":"funny from someone who's called"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2421.63,"endTime":2423.37,"body":"a dame and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2424.6,"endTime":2427.33,"body":"all that now, but that's not you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2424.6,"endTime":2427.33,"body":"know, that's not where I came"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2427.33,"endTime":2431.53,"body":"from at all. And it's, it was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2427.33,"endTime":2431.53,"body":"having the grit and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2431.53,"endTime":2435.28,"body":"determination to not want to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2431.53,"endTime":2435.28,"body":"that, you know, there's other"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2435.28,"endTime":2438.88,"body":"guys when that kept me in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2435.28,"endTime":2438.88,"body":"room. And I think that that's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2438.88,"endTime":2442.72,"body":"bigger barrier for a lot of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2438.88,"endTime":2442.72,"body":"people being different. I can't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2442.72,"endTime":2445.12,"body":"imagine him he didn't. There's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2442.72,"endTime":2445.12,"body":"all sorts of other issues,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2445.15,"endTime":2446.14,"body":"ethnicity and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2447.52,"endTime":2450.49,"body":"sexual orientation, and whatever"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2447.52,"endTime":2450.49,"body":"that I think just leads to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2450.49,"endTime":2454.39,"body":"people otherness, but it goes"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2450.49,"endTime":2454.39,"body":"back to the last question that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2454.39,"endTime":2458.23,"body":"we had, which is, you know, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2454.39,"endTime":2458.23,"body":"need to change and why is that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2458.23,"endTime":2462.82,"body":"different at irfs? It's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2458.23,"endTime":2462.82,"body":"curiosity driven place. If"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2462.82,"endTime":2466.54,"body":"you're curious, you don't care."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2462.82,"endTime":2466.54,"body":"I like to talk to people who are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2466.54,"endTime":2469.18,"body":"different than me, I know what I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2466.54,"endTime":2469.18,"body":"think I know what people who are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2469.18,"endTime":2471.37,"body":"similar to me think, because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2469.18,"endTime":2471.37,"body":"I've, you know, because they've"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2471.37,"endTime":2475.81,"body":"got the same information says"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2471.37,"endTime":2475.81,"body":"me, what's really fun is to talk"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2475.81,"endTime":2478.72,"body":"to someone who's different, who"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2475.81,"endTime":2478.72,"body":"has a different experience of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2478.72,"endTime":2481.24,"body":"the world, or who has a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2478.72,"endTime":2481.24,"body":"different set of information."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2481.54,"endTime":2485.17,"body":"And if I'm curious, I'm going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2481.54,"endTime":2485.17,"body":"want to talk to them. And so"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2485.17,"endTime":2489.4,"body":"what needs to change, it's not"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2485.17,"endTime":2489.4,"body":"just that we need to fight to be"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2489.4,"endTime":2493.09,"body":"at the table, of course we do."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2489.4,"endTime":2493.09,"body":"Whoever we is, whatever your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2493.45,"endTime":2497.71,"body":"background is, that is not non"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2493.45,"endTime":2497.71,"body":"standard, you do need to fight"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2497.71,"endTime":2502.78,"body":"to be at the table. But everyone"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2497.71,"endTime":2502.78,"body":"at the table needs to also get"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2502.78,"endTime":2505.72,"body":"their curiosity hat on, we're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2502.78,"endTime":2505.72,"body":"never going to solve the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2505.72,"endTime":2509.65,"body":"problems in that aggressive kind"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2505.72,"endTime":2509.65,"body":"of way, do even just the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2509.65,"endTime":2512.11,"body":"language I was using fighting as"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2509.65,"endTime":2512.11,"body":"I think that's actually the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2512.11,"endTime":2516.4,"body":"really the wrong analogy. Even I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2512.11,"endTime":2516.4,"body":"just used it, we need, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2516.91,"endTime":2521.05,"body":"people sitting at the table need"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2516.91,"endTime":2521.05,"body":"to accept that the world's gonna"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2521.05,"endTime":2526.48,"body":"be a better place if they listen"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2521.05,"endTime":2526.48,"body":"to a more diverse set of voices."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2526.69,"endTime":2530.89,"body":"And that's for sure true in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2526.69,"endTime":2530.89,"body":"public policy. And so from what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2530.89,"endTime":2535.09,"body":"the education system needs to do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2530.89,"endTime":2535.09,"body":"is, is partly trained people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2535.12,"endTime":2537.97,"body":"what I what frustrates me a lot"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2535.12,"endTime":2537.97,"body":"at Manchester, which of course"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2537.97,"endTime":2543.28,"body":"has a pretty good level, high"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2537.97,"endTime":2543.28,"body":"quality student intake, but they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2543.28,"endTime":2548.77,"body":"don't have the ability to debate"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2543.28,"endTime":2548.77,"body":"and write and speak that you get"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2548.77,"endTime":2553.24,"body":"from the Oxbridge education. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2548.77,"endTime":2553.24,"body":"we don't teach them that schools"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2553.24,"endTime":2556.87,"body":"don't teach them that most"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2553.24,"endTime":2556.87,"body":"universities outside of Oxbridge"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2556.87,"endTime":2560.14,"body":"don't teach them that they don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2556.87,"endTime":2560.14,"body":"have the resources to do it. So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2560.17,"endTime":2562.54,"body":"one of the things I've been very"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2560.17,"endTime":2562.54,"body":"passionate about communicating"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2562.54,"endTime":2566.92,"body":"economics is teaching students"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2562.54,"endTime":2566.92,"body":"how to speak. And there's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2566.92,"endTime":2568.87,"body":"nothing, the only way to do it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2566.92,"endTime":2568.87,"body":"is to do it."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2570.01,"endTime":2570.58,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2571.99,"endTime":2574.54,"body":"they've Cohen, who runs who's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2575.89,"endTime":2579.91,"body":"the kind of managing,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2575.89,"endTime":2579.91,"body":"discovering economics now worked"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2579.91,"endTime":2582.4,"body":"with me on a project on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2579.91,"endTime":2582.4,"body":"communicating economics first."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2582.4,"endTime":2587.62,"body":"And that really is about giving"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2582.4,"endTime":2587.62,"body":"people the tools to be able to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2587.65,"endTime":2591.01,"body":"sit at the table and participate"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2587.65,"endTime":2591.01,"body":"in those discussions. So you do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2591.01,"endTime":2592.57,"body":"need to work hard, you do need"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2591.01,"endTime":2592.57,"body":"to,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2594.28,"endTime":2597.76,"body":"you know, challenge yourself to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2594.28,"endTime":2597.76,"body":"be able to write better and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2597.76,"endTime":2600.73,"body":"speak better, because those are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2597.76,"endTime":2600.73,"body":"clearly important communication"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2600.73,"endTime":2604.0,"body":"tools. And I think those are the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2600.73,"endTime":2604.0,"body":"most important thing that we"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2604.0,"endTime":2608.41,"body":"need to give people in order to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2604.0,"endTime":2608.41,"body":"be able to get them to, to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2608.47,"endTime":2613.57,"body":"participate in decision making,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2608.47,"endTime":2613.57,"body":"in all places. That's so"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2613.57,"endTime":2616.84,"body":"interesting, because when I was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2613.57,"endTime":2616.84,"body":"teaching Effie, it's one of the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2616.84,"endTime":2619.21,"body":"exercises I used to do with the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2616.84,"endTime":2619.21,"body":"students was, you know, we call"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2619.21,"endTime":2622.09,"body":"it negotiation training. And it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2619.21,"endTime":2622.09,"body":"was fascinating to see,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2622.09,"endTime":2624.07,"body":"especially at the 16 year old"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2622.09,"endTime":2624.07,"body":"data, right, this is the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2624.07,"endTime":2626.83,"body":"challenge you have, I think one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2624.07,"endTime":2626.83,"body":"of them, one of the challenges"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2626.83,"endTime":2629.83,"body":"we gave them was you're going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2626.83,"endTime":2629.83,"body":"your boss, you want to work four"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2629.83,"endTime":2632.56,"body":"days a week and one day a week"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2629.83,"endTime":2632.56,"body":"from home, how are you going to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2632.56,"endTime":2637.21,"body":"convince them? And it was just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2632.56,"endTime":2637.21,"body":"getting them to flip that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2637.21,"endTime":2640.72,"body":"switch? of why would it benefit"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2637.21,"endTime":2640.72,"body":"your boss, so that you can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2640.72,"endTime":2643.06,"body":"convince them, you know, just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2640.72,"endTime":2643.06,"body":"little things like thought that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2643.06,"endTime":2646.39,"body":"they just never thought about?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2643.06,"endTime":2646.39,"body":"Because at that age of 16, God,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2647.29,"endTime":2650.95,"body":"I didn't care about what my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2647.29,"endTime":2650.95,"body":"decisions like, what I didn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2650.95,"endTime":2652.93,"body":"care how they impacted anyone"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2650.95,"endTime":2652.93,"body":"else in the world. Because I am"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2652.93,"endTime":2657.1,"body":"a 16 year old, I only care about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2652.93,"endTime":2657.1,"body":"myself, and not silky. So it's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2657.1,"endTime":2661.12,"body":"really interesting. So I get"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2657.1,"endTime":2661.12,"body":"communication going. So I get my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2661.12,"endTime":2663.49,"body":"students to write an email to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2661.12,"endTime":2663.49,"body":"their boss about why the gender"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2663.49,"endTime":2667.45,"body":"pay gap matters. Exactly that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2663.49,"endTime":2667.45,"body":"amazing job being moralistic"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2667.45,"endTime":2670.12,"body":"about it just be like, why does"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2667.45,"endTime":2670.12,"body":"your boss care? You know, like,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2670.21,"endTime":2671.71,"body":"what was the problem for him?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2673.72,"endTime":2676.84,"body":"And it is, it's that thing of,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2673.72,"endTime":2676.84,"body":"you know, how do we get that in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2676.87,"endTime":2680.32,"body":"earlier if you like, but, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2676.87,"endTime":2680.32,"body":"know, that's not to put it on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2680.32,"endTime":2682.69,"body":"teachers because let's face it,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2680.32,"endTime":2682.69,"body":"they've got a zillion things,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2682.69,"endTime":2684.37,"body":"especially right now that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2682.69,"endTime":2684.37,"body":"they're trying to do and I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2684.37,"endTime":2687.61,"body":"suppose you've had your share of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2684.37,"endTime":2687.61,"body":"that, you know, delivering"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2687.88,"endTime":2690.61,"body":"lectures online and and through"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2687.88,"endTime":2690.61,"body":"video at the moment is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2690.61,"endTime":2692.5,"body":"particularly challenging for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2690.61,"endTime":2692.5,"body":"everyone."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2693.52,"endTime":2696.58,"body":"And, and some actually, a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2693.52,"endTime":2696.58,"body":"different project that I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2696.58,"endTime":2699.31,"body":"working on at the moment is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2696.58,"endTime":2699.31,"body":"about you know, cross curricular"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2699.31,"endTime":2699.79,"body":"and how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2700.0,"endTime":2703.72,"body":"How giving students access to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2700.0,"endTime":2703.72,"body":"cross curricular activities when"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2703.72,"endTime":2707.11,"body":"they get back into school can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2703.72,"endTime":2707.11,"body":"hopefully help them to, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2707.11,"endTime":2709.81,"body":"know, bridge some of the gaps"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2707.11,"endTime":2709.81,"body":"that this year has taken away"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2709.81,"endTime":2712.72,"body":"from them and hopefully give"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2709.81,"endTime":2712.72,"body":"them a better experience. But"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2713.889,"endTime":2716.199,"body":"I was halfway through seeing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2713.889,"endTime":2716.199,"body":"that and the question that I had"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2716.199,"endTime":2720.309,"body":"for you went right out of my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2716.199,"endTime":2720.309,"body":"head. That's my age and lack of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2720.309,"endTime":2721.449,"body":"sleep from hobbies."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2724.45,"endTime":2726.76,"body":"Cross curricular activities is a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2724.45,"endTime":2726.76,"body":"great idea."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2727.99,"endTime":2730.33,"body":"I mean, it's so important. We"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2727.99,"endTime":2730.33,"body":"should do more of that. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2730.42,"endTime":2733.69,"body":"Oh, yeah. said we, and you do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2730.42,"endTime":2733.69,"body":"none of that at university now?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2733.72,"endTime":2737.65,"body":"Yeah. Well, it's interesting,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2733.72,"endTime":2737.65,"body":"because when I did my degree at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2737.68,"endTime":2741.46,"body":"Aberdeen University, it was in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2737.68,"endTime":2741.46,"body":"English literature. And by the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2741.46,"endTime":2744.19,"body":"time I graduated, it was split"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2741.46,"endTime":2744.19,"body":"honours in English literature"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2744.19,"endTime":2747.61,"body":"and linguistics, because and I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2744.19,"endTime":2747.61,"body":"like, oh, here's a different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2747.61,"endTime":2750.37,"body":"element of the language that I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2747.61,"endTime":2750.37,"body":"hadn't thought about. But what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2750.37,"endTime":2753.19,"body":"was wonderful is that in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2750.37,"endTime":2753.19,"body":"first two years, you could pick"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2753.22,"endTime":2757.09,"body":"basically any, any subject you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2753.22,"endTime":2757.09,"body":"wanted for extra credit. So I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2757.09,"endTime":2761.11,"body":"did philosophy, I think I did a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2757.09,"endTime":2761.11,"body":"one module and biology at one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2761.11,"endTime":2764.11,"body":"point says like, Oh, I need some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2761.11,"endTime":2764.11,"body":"science in my day, you know, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2764.11,"endTime":2767.14,"body":"just kind of, and I do think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2764.11,"endTime":2767.14,"body":"that that is really important."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2767.14,"endTime":2770.47,"body":"And I think, especially when"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2767.14,"endTime":2770.47,"body":"we're trying to do catch up, if"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2770.47,"endTime":2773.05,"body":"you like, not necessarily catch"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2770.47,"endTime":2773.05,"body":"up, because I suppose that's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2773.05,"endTime":2775.3,"body":"whole other debate for people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2773.05,"endTime":2775.3,"body":"getting back into school."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2776.47,"endTime":2779.92,"body":"But yeah, so there's, I suppose"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2776.47,"endTime":2779.92,"body":"my point was that there's a lot"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2779.98,"endTime":2785.47,"body":"of pressure on teachers and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2779.98,"endTime":2785.47,"body":"parents, especially at the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2785.47,"endTime":2789.64,"body":"moment. And what I love about"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2785.47,"endTime":2789.64,"body":"your story, and what we said at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2789.64,"endTime":2793.99,"body":"the beginning is that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2789.64,"endTime":2793.99,"body":"take a breath, it's okay, if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2793.99,"endTime":2796.87,"body":"go off and you do something else"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2793.99,"endTime":2796.87,"body":"for 10 or 15 years, it's okay,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2796.87,"endTime":2800.38,"body":"if you come with background, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2796.87,"endTime":2800.38,"body":"can still be successful, and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2800.38,"endTime":2804.4,"body":"have learned from everything"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2800.38,"endTime":2804.4,"body":"that you've done in advance of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2804.4,"endTime":2810.64,"body":"that. And I think that, that,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2804.4,"endTime":2810.64,"body":"that Lee, that kind of connects"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2810.64,"endTime":2815.14,"body":"for me as well into the whole"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2810.64,"endTime":2815.14,"body":"Oxbridge thing and the, the gap"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2815.38,"endTime":2818.95,"body":"between what what we get in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2815.38,"endTime":2818.95,"body":"different schools, like what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2818.95,"endTime":2820.66,"body":"kind of experience we get in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2818.95,"endTime":2820.66,"body":"different schools, and what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2820.66,"endTime":2822.22,"body":"students learn in different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2820.66,"endTime":2822.22,"body":"schools and different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2822.22,"endTime":2825.79,"body":"universities, is that sometimes"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2822.22,"endTime":2825.79,"body":"you have to go out into the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2825.79,"endTime":2828.94,"body":"world elsewhere to learn some of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2825.79,"endTime":2828.94,"body":"those skills and come back in."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2829.51,"endTime":2833.8,"body":"And one of my questions that's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2829.51,"endTime":2833.8,"body":"maybe not related to economics,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2833.8,"endTime":2836.8,"body":"but I just quite like to ask it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2833.8,"endTime":2836.8,"body":"is, because I've experienced"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2836.8,"endTime":2840.04,"body":"this too, where I've been in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2836.8,"endTime":2840.04,"body":"London for the past 15 years."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2840.04,"endTime":2842.44,"body":"And I think you can still tell"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2840.04,"endTime":2842.44,"body":"that I'm Scottish, I don't think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2842.44,"endTime":2843.88,"body":"that's disappeared, it's still"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2842.44,"endTime":2843.88,"body":"there."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2844.96,"endTime":2848.47,"body":"And, and like you said, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2844.96,"endTime":2848.47,"body":"know, you change the way you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2848.47,"endTime":2851.77,"body":"talk and all the rest of it. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2848.47,"endTime":2851.77,"body":"definitely talk differently when"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2851.77,"endTime":2855.88,"body":"I talk to my family. And I used"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2851.77,"endTime":2855.88,"body":"to speak to students who were"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2855.91,"endTime":2856.66,"body":"who had, you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2858.04,"endTime":2861.76,"body":"you know, colloquial accents, or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2858.04,"endTime":2861.76,"body":"who would have more working"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2861.76,"endTime":2864.1,"body":"class accents, and they were"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2861.76,"endTime":2864.1,"body":"embarrassed by it. And they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2864.1,"endTime":2866.56,"body":"didn't feel like they could"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2864.1,"endTime":2866.56,"body":"apply for jobs in certain"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2866.56,"endTime":2868.84,"body":"companies, because they didn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2866.56,"endTime":2868.84,"body":"feel like they could change the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2868.84,"endTime":2871.87,"body":"way they talked. And a big part"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2868.84,"endTime":2871.87,"body":"of me is like, Well, why should"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2871.87,"endTime":2874.6,"body":"you as long as people can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2871.87,"endTime":2874.6,"body":"understand what you're saying?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2874.96,"endTime":2877.81,"body":"There's a snobbery that we need"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2874.96,"endTime":2877.81,"body":"to cut through as well. So it's,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2878.11,"endTime":2882.85,"body":"I suppose it links into what is"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2878.11,"endTime":2882.85,"body":"the balance between helping"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2883.21,"endTime":2887.17,"body":"helping students to fit a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2883.21,"endTime":2887.17,"body":"certain mould so that they can"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2887.17,"endTime":2891.04,"body":"get their foot in the door and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2887.17,"endTime":2891.04,"body":"change things? And how much do"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2891.04,"endTime":2894.58,"body":"we need to do? Not me, because"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2891.04,"endTime":2894.58,"body":"I'm not an economists in this"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2894.58,"endTime":2897.07,"body":"particular thing? Is it my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2894.58,"endTime":2897.07,"body":"responsibility, thankfully, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2897.07,"endTime":2900.73,"body":"how much do people within an"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2897.07,"endTime":2900.73,"body":"industry or sector need to do to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2900.73,"endTime":2903.85,"body":"just go, right, guys, we need to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2900.73,"endTime":2903.85,"body":"get over ourselves. Because Hey,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2903.85,"endTime":2908.5,"body":"that person talks has no impact"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2903.85,"endTime":2908.5,"body":"on how you know how important"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2908.5,"endTime":2911.14,"body":"their thinking is? Or how"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2908.5,"endTime":2911.14,"body":"important that thing they're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2911.14,"endTime":2914.32,"body":"working on is, what are your"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2911.14,"endTime":2914.32,"body":"Yeah, what are your thoughts on"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2914.32,"endTime":2917.47,"body":"that? That kind of balance? I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2914.32,"endTime":2917.47,"body":"think it's very easy. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2917.5,"endTime":2923.08,"body":"that's, again, a great question."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2917.5,"endTime":2923.08,"body":"I think it's 100% not getting"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2923.08,"endTime":2926.53,"body":"people to fit a mould we have to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2923.08,"endTime":2926.53,"body":"and in fact, I think that for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2926.53,"endTime":2931.27,"body":"two reasons. So one is, I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2926.53,"endTime":2931.27,"body":"there's a lot of it's incumbent"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2931.27,"endTime":2934.57,"body":"on the people in positions of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2931.27,"endTime":2934.57,"body":"power to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2935.83,"endTime":2940.54,"body":"be curious, and, you know, open"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2935.83,"endTime":2940.54,"body":"open their arms to a diversity"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2940.54,"endTime":2945.07,"body":"of people. But I think if you're"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2940.54,"endTime":2945.07,"body":"a person, so one of the great"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2945.07,"endTime":2948.4,"body":"economist I worked with at the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2945.07,"endTime":2948.4,"body":"RFS had an incredibly strong"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2948.4,"endTime":2953.26,"body":"Jordy accent super strong. never"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2948.4,"endTime":2953.26,"body":"lost it. Yeah, very successful."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2953.89,"endTime":2957.64,"body":"And he just played to it. And I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2953.89,"endTime":2957.64,"body":"often said to him, and I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2957.64,"endTime":2961.87,"body":"this was true for me, as a woman"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2957.64,"endTime":2961.87,"body":"to your unusual people. You go,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2961.93,"endTime":2965.29,"body":"you know, trying to get a job."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2961.93,"endTime":2965.29,"body":"They've seen 100 white male"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2965.29,"endTime":2967.78,"body":"economists, you're the one"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2965.29,"endTime":2967.78,"body":"woman, they're going to remember"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2967.78,"endTime":2971.62,"body":"who you are, use it. I mean, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2967.78,"endTime":2971.62,"body":"know, I'm gonna use it, try and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2971.62,"endTime":2972.76,"body":"sleep with him or something like"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2971.62,"endTime":2972.76,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2974.47,"endTime":2977.5,"body":"For you, yeah. And I said with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2974.47,"endTime":2977.5,"body":"him, he had this strong jaw"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2977.5,"endTime":2981.82,"body":"react, you could see everyone"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2977.5,"endTime":2981.82,"body":"start thinking, Oh, he's going"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2981.82,"endTime":2984.52,"body":"to be stupid. And you could see"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2981.82,"endTime":2984.52,"body":"it, you could see that they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2984.52,"endTime":2988.03,"body":"think God stupid. And then he"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2984.52,"endTime":2988.03,"body":"say something really smart. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2988.03,"endTime":2992.71,"body":"it'll be like, wow. And they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2988.03,"endTime":2992.71,"body":"remembered it. Whereas if a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2992.71,"endTime":2995.05,"body":"white Oxbridge guy had said"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2992.71,"endTime":2995.05,"body":"that, that smart thing. They"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2995.05,"endTime":2997.36,"body":"wouldn't really remember it"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2995.05,"endTime":2997.36,"body":"because they expected it. So use"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2997.36,"endTime":2999.97,"body":"it. I love it. Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3000.0,"endTime":3003.09,"body":"Make it strong and make it of"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3000.0,"endTime":3003.09,"body":"you. Of course, the other side"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3003.09,"endTime":3007.83,"body":"has to be willing to listen to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3003.09,"endTime":3007.83,"body":"that too. But I think don't feel"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3007.83,"endTime":3010.35,"body":"that you have to become someone"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3007.83,"endTime":3010.35,"body":"you're not. Yeah. And it's that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3010.35,"endTime":3013.32,"body":"not apologising for getting into"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3010.35,"endTime":3013.32,"body":"the room, isn't it? Like I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3013.32,"endTime":3016.08,"body":"here? Yeah. You know? Yep. And"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3013.32,"endTime":3016.08,"body":"this is?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3018.75,"endTime":3021.3,"body":"Absolutely. And I'm aware that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3018.75,"endTime":3021.3,"body":"we're running out of time, and I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3021.3,"endTime":3023.64,"body":"could speak to you for hours."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3021.3,"endTime":3023.64,"body":"Genuinely, I've got so many"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3023.64,"endTime":3026.49,"body":"questions, so maybe we'll do a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3023.64,"endTime":3026.49,"body":"follow up. But I've got a final"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3026.49,"endTime":3029.61,"body":"question, which I haven't even"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3026.49,"endTime":3029.61,"body":"asked you about your Diem who or"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3029.61,"endTime":3033.45,"body":"anything. And that's very"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3029.61,"endTime":3033.45,"body":"exciting. Just because how cool"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3033.45,"endTime":3037.11,"body":"is it to be in the same group as"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3033.45,"endTime":3037.11,"body":"like Dame Judi Dench, and you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3037.11,"endTime":3040.2,"body":"know, what's her name from"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3037.11,"endTime":3040.2,"body":"Downton Abbey? and Maggie Smith,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3040.2,"endTime":3044.13,"body":"like, there's so many amazing"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3040.2,"endTime":3044.13,"body":"diems aren't there? anyway? I'll"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3044.13,"endTime":3046.74,"body":"ask you about that a different"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3044.13,"endTime":3046.74,"body":"day. Or you can answer that. I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3046.74,"endTime":3049.08,"body":"think it's a little bit sexist."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3046.74,"endTime":3049.08,"body":"I must admit that, Sophie?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3049.53,"endTime":3054.03,"body":"Absolutely. If you become a Sir,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3049.53,"endTime":3054.03,"body":"your wife gets to be called a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3054.03,"endTime":3057.45,"body":"lady. But my husband's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3054.03,"endTime":3057.45,"body":"distraught that because a day he"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3057.45,"endTime":3062.34,"body":"doesn't get called anything at"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3057.45,"endTime":3062.34,"body":"all. And it's terrible. There's"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3062.34,"endTime":3065.52,"body":"a slight like, So you mentioned"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3062.34,"endTime":3065.52,"body":"some good dame's. But there's a"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3065.52,"endTime":3068.46,"body":"slight comedy element that you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3065.52,"endTime":3068.46,"body":"sort of feel that you should put"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3068.46,"endTime":3072.33,"body":"a blonde wig on and be a bit"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3068.46,"endTime":3072.33,"body":"goofy with a day hood, whereas"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3072.33,"endTime":3075.6,"body":"the centre is sort of very"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3072.33,"endTime":3075.6,"body":"respected. And you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3076.83,"endTime":3080.49,"body":"but it's great. Yeah, I think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3076.83,"endTime":3080.49,"body":"pretty dense. And Maggie Smith"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3080.49,"endTime":3083.61,"body":"there too, of course, they will"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3080.49,"endTime":3083.61,"body":"think of doors. Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3084.93,"endTime":3088.62,"body":"And Emma Thompson No, do but I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3084.93,"endTime":3088.62,"body":"think because my background, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3088.62,"endTime":3092.13,"body":"think because of growing up in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3088.62,"endTime":3092.13,"body":"the 80s. And after the the you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3092.13,"endTime":3095.82,"body":"tree revelations, there's a lot"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3092.13,"endTime":3095.82,"body":"of SARS that just you know, have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3095.82,"endTime":3098.7,"body":"gone way out the windows and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3095.82,"endTime":3098.7,"body":"centre Diem, who does definitely"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3098.73,"endTime":3099.72,"body":"a better option."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3102.03,"endTime":3105.6,"body":"Anyway, that decide, let me get"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3102.03,"endTime":3105.6,"body":"to my final question. So this"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3105.6,"endTime":3108.9,"body":"might be a hard one. I don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3105.6,"endTime":3108.9,"body":"know. So just to finish off,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3108.99,"endTime":3111.81,"body":"when we're thinking about, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3108.99,"endTime":3111.81,"body":"know, how did you get here? So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3111.84,"endTime":3114.18,"body":"what would you say are and I'm"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3111.84,"endTime":3114.18,"body":"going to ask you for those"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3114.18,"endTime":3117.57,"body":"simple answers I promised I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3114.18,"endTime":3117.57,"body":"wouldn't ask earlier. But what"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3117.57,"endTime":3120.75,"body":"would you say are three things"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3117.57,"endTime":3120.75,"body":"that you would credit for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3120.75,"endTime":3124.77,"body":"getting you to where you are"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3120.75,"endTime":3124.77,"body":"today, my family?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3126.06,"endTime":3126.45,"body":"So"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3128.13,"endTime":3131.97,"body":"my parents and my brothers and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3128.13,"endTime":3131.97,"body":"sisters for teaching me to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3131.97,"endTime":3132.72,"body":"debate and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3133.8,"endTime":3137.97,"body":"the background that has so my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3133.8,"endTime":3137.97,"body":"family, my grit and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3137.97,"endTime":3144.0,"body":"determination? Yeah, I always"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3137.97,"endTime":3144.0,"body":"say my husband is much smarter"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3144.0,"endTime":3148.65,"body":"than me, but works half as hard"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3144.0,"endTime":3148.65,"body":"was a work twice as hard. So and"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3148.65,"endTime":3150.06,"body":"we're equally successful."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3151.68,"endTime":3152.4,"body":"And,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3153.72,"endTime":3156.99,"body":"and curiosity. I definitely"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3153.72,"endTime":3156.99,"body":"think that being"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3158.82,"endTime":3159.21,"body":"you know,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3160.38,"endTime":3165.63,"body":"willing to engage with the world"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3160.38,"endTime":3165.63,"body":"in its diversity, and wanting,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3166.08,"endTime":3169.71,"body":"always wanting to see something"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3166.08,"endTime":3169.71,"body":"more. I'm never satisfied with"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3169.71,"endTime":3172.41,"body":"what's in front of me. I always"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3169.71,"endTime":3172.41,"body":"want not not in a bad way, but"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3172.41,"endTime":3176.19,"body":"in a curious way. I think those"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3172.41,"endTime":3176.19,"body":"those would be the three things"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3176.19,"endTime":3180.24,"body":"I would highlight. Brilliant,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3176.19,"endTime":3180.24,"body":"amazing. Thank you so much for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3180.42,"endTime":3183.87,"body":"for letting me have your time"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3180.42,"endTime":3183.87,"body":"today. And yeah, again, just"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3183.87,"endTime":3187.2,"body":"thank you so much. I really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3183.87,"endTime":3187.2,"body":"appreciate it. Thank you. That"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3187.2,"endTime":3189.45,"body":"was really good. It was quite"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3187.2,"endTime":3189.45,"body":"fun."}]}