Ask Caleffi
Welcome to the Ask Caleffi podcast series, now featuring our powerhouse tech team! Join Cody, Ryan, Matt, and Dan as they dive into the tricky heating and plumbing challenges they tackle every day.
These field experts share real-world insights to help contractors navigate even the toughest jobs with ease. Count on the team to keep things lively, mixing professional wisdom with the entertaining, relatable stories you’ve come to love.
Ask Caleffi
#22 5 Things You Need to Know About Why Your PRV Screams (with Cody Mack)
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
A return guest joins Greg and Dan during this Episode: Cody Mack, Caleffi training and education manager. They get right to the point as they dig into perplexing PRV behavior. You'll learn:
1. Got noise? How to size a PRV CORRECTLY.
2. Step down pressure and how to manage.
3. PRV maintenance
4. PRV configurations
5. Familiar with 5 Things You Need To Know? Check it out on YouTube!
Thanks for joining us today.
Want to hear YOUR QUESTION on Ask Caleffi? Take this quick 4 question survey for your chance to hear your question in a future episode.
00:06
welcome to ask Caleffi the podcast that
00:09
dives into real life problems that
00:10
plumbing and hvac technicians face in
00:13
the field we're your hosts from the
00:14
Caleffi tech support team i'm greg tubbs
00:17
and i'm dan ferkus welcome we look
00:19
forward to sharing some stories from our
00:21
tech calls and using our background and
00:23
expertise to make your days a little
00:25
easier
00:26
[Music]
00:30
hey folks welcome back to another
00:32
episode of the ask caleffi podcast
00:36
greg here coming at you with
00:38
my buddy dan yeah we're back
00:41
we got a returning guest we do we're
00:43
pretty excited yeah you're lucky i came
00:45
back oh
00:47
someone just said you're lucky we let
00:48
you back
00:52
there you go
00:55
yeah sitting here in the studio with
00:57
bunsen and beaker
00:59
it's real funny isn't it yeah yeah if
01:02
you guys could be uh sesame street
01:04
characters i got bunsen and i got
01:07
beakers uh here we go i'm i'm beaker by
01:09
the way
01:13
and for those of you that don't know our
01:15
guest is cody mack our training and
01:17
education manager
01:20
yeah thanks for having me guys it's good
01:22
to be back um yeah
01:24
we're going to talk another five things
01:26
you need to know yeah another five
01:27
things we might even find a sixth thing
01:29
while we're at it okay maybe hold on a
01:31
little bonus yeah yeah so cody's here to
01:34
talk more about his series the five
01:36
things you need to know
01:38
yeah so yeah i mean you know it's a big
01:39
training initiative and we talked about
01:41
it last time the the fact that you know
01:42
we're trying to get stuff that's real
01:44
concise to the point and get that
01:46
information out to everybody that needs
01:48
it as quickly and easily as possible and
01:50
and i mentioned it before you know
01:52
attention spans are growing shorter and
01:54
shorter and so we're trying to keep
01:55
these videos really short with the five
01:57
things you need to know series and uh
01:59
you know usually they're about five
02:00
minutes give or take a little bit you
02:02
know um but again very straight to the
02:04
point very concise and uh gets you guys
02:06
uh the information you need cool we're
02:08
going to talk noisy prvs today aren't we
02:11
pressure reducing valves yeah not
02:13
pressure relief valves if those are
02:15
noisy you got a really big problem right
02:16
pressure reducing valves is what we're
02:18
going to talk about one of those makes a
02:19
noise louder than a drip you got a major
02:21
problem yeah oh yeah definitely a
02:22
popular phone call here at the ask
02:24
fluffy line yeah yeah here at cleffy you
02:27
know you know we've been really diving
02:29
pretty hard into the plumbing product
02:31
and and pressure reducing valves we've
02:32
had them for i don't know three four
02:34
years now it's been a while easily i
02:35
mean well we've always had the autofill
02:38
right so that's the pressure that's a
02:39
prv yeah for boiler systems you got it
02:41
yep yep but you usually don't hear a
02:43
problem with noise going through that
02:45
correct yeah that's usually kind of a
02:47
one and done kind of deal you know they
02:48
fill up the boiler and and if the prv is
02:50
still working chances are you got bigger
02:52
problems on the boiler system but but
02:54
you know like with with a pressure
02:55
reducing valve for you know potable
02:57
water that's a whole different ball you
02:59
know so kalefi italy they came out with
03:01
these prvs a number of years ago as a
03:04
global initiative so these these prvs uh
03:06
you can go all around the world and you
03:08
can see prvs that look exactly the same
03:09
from calefi which i think is really
03:11
really cool
03:12
but uh we you know we do
03:14
i'm not gonna
03:16
i'm not going to sugarcoat it we get
03:18
calls about them because you know the
03:19
things happen and uh and that's what
03:21
we're here you know you guys especially
03:23
you know you guys are taking the brunt
03:25
of most of the tech support calls you
03:27
guys do a fantastic job thanks but uh
03:29
i'm not you greg danny
03:32
back
03:34
back in the corner
03:35
oh yeah i'll shun you every time where's
03:38
that womp
03:39
right yeah
03:41
but anyways uh no so so we get some
03:44
calls about them you know and and
03:47
i say particularly with prvs it's it's
03:49
usually noise issues and and uh you know
03:52
uh so we we get some calls about them
03:54
and i think we've got some great
03:55
information in this particular five
03:57
things you need to know about
03:58
a little video that we can talk about
04:00
today you know um i guess what do you
04:03
guys want to start with
04:05
well we know one of the biggest things
04:07
is a valve being undersized or oversized
04:10
yeah yeah yeah selections bigger is not
04:13
always better you mean right right or
04:16
smaller better
04:17
you tell me where's goldilocks i think
04:19
you just size it based on pipe size
04:21
don't you oh man boy you just made life
04:24
so much easier for every contractor out
04:26
there the way you do
04:32
if it was that easy i don't think we
04:34
would have jobs gentlemen right he
04:36
packing it up hitting the road no i mean
04:38
we get that question a lot and
04:40
unfortunately it comes after the fact
04:43
that it's been installed
04:45
oh yeah and then you start reverse
04:47
engineering
04:49
what size pipe you have how big is the
04:51
house what kind of demand do you have on
04:53
right
04:54
oh
04:54
oh oops
04:56
yeah we didn't we didn't know you know
04:58
one inch one inch valve one inch pipe
05:00
should be able to install it walk away
05:02
and all good right not always the case
05:04
yeah we we get a number of calls i would
05:06
say on the regular where you know as far
05:09
as valves being oversized i mean for one
05:11
thing you're paying more for a valve
05:12
that you don't need you know um yeah i
05:14
mean we get plenty of calls where
05:16
they've got a three-quarter inch prv and
05:17
they could have used a half-inch prv and
05:19
then just fine you know you get a
05:20
single-family residential you don't have
05:22
any of the giant raining shower heads
05:24
and all that other fun stuff or or the
05:26
six gallon per flush toilets and and you
05:28
know um irrigation systems yeah or
05:31
irrigation systems whatever yeah and so
05:34
i mean
05:35
getting that valve to the proper size i
05:37
think is is really important i think
05:39
i didn't even mention it in my five
05:40
things you need to know video but there
05:41
are some great uh water demand
05:43
calculators out there the one that i'm
05:44
thinking of
05:46
is uh is from iapmo and iatmo has a
05:49
water demand calculator out there to
05:51
where you can actually plug in for i
05:53
believe it's single-family residential
05:54
or multi-family residential but you can
05:56
plug in all your fixtures into that and
05:58
it'll give you a demand for for potable
06:02
water which is fantastic you know and
06:04
you can figure out exactly what you need
06:06
um you know
06:07
obviously it'll get you in the ballpark
06:09
it might not be you know 100 but it'll
06:11
get you to 90 as opposed to just a wild
06:14
guess you know right exactly yeah
06:17
sometimes it's hard to get guys to wrap
06:18
their mind around the fact that you know
06:20
what it might be three quarter inch
06:22
coming into the home or or one inch but
06:24
you're stepping down one or two sizes
06:26
with your prv yep but again sizing more
06:28
based on the demand absolutely
06:31
yeah so yeah definitely uh i think
06:34
that's probably the biggest thing that
06:35
we get calls about is either undersized
06:37
or oversized um you know uh whether
06:40
whether again whether they be undersized
06:42
or oversized you get that undersized
06:43
scenario which
06:45
uh you know let's be honest that doesn't
06:46
happen you know usually undersizing is
06:48
not that much of an issue but if it is
06:50
undersized you know you get too much
06:51
flow through through that guy you get a
06:53
lot of velocity you're going to get a
06:54
lot of noise and everything like that
06:56
but on the oversized uh end of the
06:58
spectrum
06:59
you're you're not working within the
07:01
good control range of that pressure
07:02
reducing valve and so that that prv um
07:05
it has the ability to allow a lot of
07:07
flow through at one time well if you're
07:09
just running you know small fixtures uh
07:11
single family residential you know that
07:13
prv is going to say for example you got
07:15
a small powder room sink on or something
07:17
like that that prv is going to open and
07:19
close really fast because it's going to
07:20
hit that pressure mark and it's going to
07:22
want to shut off so that's going to lead
07:23
to some chattering or some thumping or
07:25
vibrating of the pipe vibrating of pipes
07:28
and things like that so it's you know
07:30
it's it's really important to get these
07:32
sized properly and and you know it's
07:34
kind of a blessing and a curse the fact
07:36
that the khalefi prvs we have the
07:38
ability to flow so much through these
07:40
prvs uh compared to a lot of our
07:42
competitors that is something that you
07:44
just need to be aware of right
07:47
yep that's for sure the other thing
07:48
would be your pressure range and and how
07:50
you're adjusting your your pressure
07:53
your step down pressure right for sure
07:55
yeah yeah we we get that call quite a
07:58
bit um you know we we talk about it
08:00
frequently
08:01
if you've got a big differential between
08:03
inlet outlet man that can you know say
08:06
you got 250 psi coming into a building
08:08
for one thing you know there are certain
08:10
particular uh even prvs that you know we
08:13
do have a pressure range on the inlet
08:15
side you can you know as far as going
08:16
too high but if you're trying to take it
08:18
from 200 down to 50 you've got a ratio
08:21
of four to one inlet to outlet that is
08:23
really high and and so
08:25
it doesn't take a lot uh of of uh flow
08:28
going through that valve in order again
08:30
to bring that pressure back up and so uh
08:32
you know usually we recommend two to one
08:35
sometimes up to three to one give or
08:36
take a little bit but the closer you
08:38
start getting to that three to one range
08:39
that's where you're gonna start running
08:41
into more noise issues for sure yeah i
08:43
actually took a call the other day
08:45
about something similar to that it was
08:47
making noise
08:48
and they were closer they were just over
08:50
the two to one closer to three to one it
08:53
was working but it was noisy
08:56
so they're like well you think it's a
08:57
bad prv i'm like you might be getting
09:00
close to that threshold where yeah
09:01
you're gonna hear some noise
09:03
now here's a really fun fact
09:06
if you do have that huge drop in
09:08
pressure say you live in a mountainous
09:09
area you got a lot of elevation things
09:11
like that and you need to bring it down
09:13
from you know you know 200 or more down
09:15
to 50 or 60 or whatever
09:18
as contractors this is your opportunity
09:20
to not sell one prv but two prvs and two
09:24
funny thing you mentioned that because i
09:26
took a call about that last week yeah
09:28
and it was the same situation well in
09:30
the mountain it's coming down the
09:32
mountains building pressure yeah and
09:34
they had single prvs from a competitor i
09:37
won't mention names of and they were
09:39
they were only last in three months yep
09:41
and they were going out yeah and so and
09:43
so you know the idea with two prvs well
09:45
how how on earth do you do you pipe up
09:47
two prvs to make this all happen you
09:49
actually just pipe them in series
09:50
literally one right after the other and
09:52
you create a staging
09:54
type of scenario to where that first prv
09:56
you know might take it from 200 down to
09:58
100 or 200 down to 120 and then the
10:00
second one takes it from 120 to 60 or 70
10:03
or whatever the case may be
10:05
and now you've got this staging scenario
10:07
to where it's not just one valve taking
10:09
the brunt of the work and and again this
10:11
isn't you know this isn't a calefi issue
10:12
this is every prv issue you know every
10:15
pressure reducing valve that's out there
10:16
is going to have these same kind of
10:18
scenarios or or potential rules and so
10:21
again if you've got that opportunity i
10:23
mean you're doing right by the customer
10:25
sell them two prvs you can make a little
10:27
bit more money the customer is going to
10:28
have a system that works really really
10:30
well and everybody's going to be happy
10:32
very good exactly
10:34
yeah
10:35
now i would say the other big one that
10:38
we get a lot of calls about is uh dirty
10:41
prvs yeah dirty povs now
10:44
despite greg i know you do a lot of jobs
10:47
here at gallefy but do you add dirt to
10:49
the pressure reducing valves before we
10:50
send them out
10:51
or is that dan's job no i think that's
10:53
dan's job no no okay all right
10:55
somebody must get paid because uh you
10:57
know it's one of those things where we
10:58
get i've got this brand new prv
11:00
installed and everything like that and
11:02
then and uh you know
11:04
there's there's certain symptoms that
11:06
come along with dirty prvs what do you
11:07
guys run into yeah so
11:09
i can kind of say that all three of us
11:12
here
11:13
sitting at this table talking into these
11:15
microphones have gotten packages back
11:17
addressed to us saying prvs are they
11:20
care packages right they're definitely
11:21
not carrying are they
11:23
no it's not and we crack them open and
11:26
there's prvs in there and we don't even
11:28
get the cartridge out of them and
11:30
there's debris falling yeah yeah you can
11:31
see chunks of solder in there chunks of
11:33
solder rust
11:35
yeah ferrous material i mean threading
11:38
tape yeah there's a lot of different
11:40
things sand
11:41
but it makes it through that filter
11:43
screen that's in there
11:44
and it's it's not even in the filter
11:47
screen it's actually in the bottom of
11:48
that cartridge right right where that
11:50
it's right in the seat yeah right where
11:52
it closes off well if you've got a
11:54
pebble or something in there just a
11:55
little chunk of copper can do it yeah
11:57
yeah and it does have shavings it's a
11:59
very small fine surface area that it
12:01
needs to be able to pinch off and if it
12:04
can't because of a little piece of
12:05
copper grits of sand or whatever it is
12:08
it's it's going to allow that system
12:10
pressure to creep up right or cause
12:13
noise yeah and i think that's one thing
12:15
that our prv does really really well is
12:17
that we do have a screen that goes
12:18
around the entire cartridge it's a 360
12:21
degree screen as opposed to a lot of our
12:23
competitors that just have a screen at
12:24
the inlet that's you know three quarters
12:26
of an inch in diameter or whatever but
12:28
you know obviously the screen is only
12:30
going to catch the stuff that's bigger
12:31
than the holes in the screen right so if
12:33
you've got dirt and debris that gets
12:34
past there
12:35
what's going to end up happening is the
12:37
dirt and debris is going to prevent that
12:38
cartridge from closing off and so during
12:41
times of little to no demand you're
12:43
going to start to see a rise in pressure
12:45
and you're going to think well that prv
12:46
is not controlling it must be bad you
12:48
know and and then you're going to send
12:51
greg a care package because he loves
12:52
care packages and and uh and then we're
12:54
gonna open it up and we're gonna clean
12:55
it we're gonna put it in the lab and the
12:56
thing's gonna work like a million bucks
12:58
right and so yeah definitely i mean it's
13:00
something to consider you know as far as
13:02
upstream strainers or media filters uh
13:04
going into the home or the business or
13:06
whatever the case may be but
13:08
just remember
13:09
our prvs you can take them apart so
13:11
easily and clean them out and put them
13:13
back into service uh you know when we
13:15
test these when they come back we put
13:17
them in the lab and put them on the wall
13:18
they don't work they creep up you know
13:20
they do that
13:21
we pull the cartridge we clean them out
13:23
and and they're back up and running
13:24
beautifully in like five minutes yeah
13:27
it's so easy yeah it's pretty quick and
13:29
with that cartridge it's so easy to just
13:31
throw it out it's easy to yeah room pull
13:33
it out and clean it flush it out and but
13:35
it's it's also just as easy if you had a
13:38
spare cartridge which we do sell
13:40
to do a cartridge replacement if you
13:42
really had to yeah if they're really
13:43
gummed up yet yeah or if something's
13:45
wearing out in it but that's going to be
13:47
over time yep
13:49
so yeah there's there's a number of
13:50
things you know um
13:52
you know
13:53
one thing that wasn't really even part
13:54
of uh my five things particular video
13:56
but i think is something that needs to
13:58
be addressed is um whenever you have a
14:00
prv in the in the circuit or coming into
14:02
the home that's it's it's not really
14:04
meant to be but it does act as a bit of
14:06
a check valve have you guys run into
14:08
that before yes yeah yeah sure yep
14:11
my uh that's that's a
14:13
pretty good phone call that we get why
14:16
why is my system pressure creeping up
14:18
and now my pressure relief valve on my
14:21
hot water tank is yeah it didn't do that
14:23
before the prv yeah and then yeah we
14:26
don't have the old school technology
14:28
where it's allowing water to push back
14:30
but hey wait a second though like okay
14:32
so so you brought up a great point greg
14:34
there there are some manufacturers out
14:36
there that in their pressure reducing
14:37
valve have what's called a bypass valve
14:40
and so with most pressure reducing
14:41
valves water can flow through in one
14:43
direction and the idea is that it
14:44
doesn't go backwards and it's not meant
14:46
to be that way it's not meant to be a
14:48
check valve but that's just what happens
14:50
but
14:51
some of our competitors do have a bypass
14:53
valve and that bypass valve i think is
14:54
really important to note that it's i
14:57
think it's a terrible idea for one thing
14:59
okay
15:00
and so this bypass valve the idea is
15:02
that if the downstream pressure of the
15:04
valve is more than the upstream pressure
15:06
the bypass valve allows it to go
15:07
backwards
15:08
uh can you name off on your hand greg
15:11
how many or dan or what water
15:13
municipalities that want water back
15:15
after it's entered your house
15:17
not a one are you sure yeah i mean come
15:20
on who wouldn't want the water back
15:21
after it's been in my house and so is
15:23
there a buyback program on it there you
15:25
go yeah
15:26
now you're on to something yeah we'll
15:28
have to look into that uh but the idea
15:30
is you know a lot of these
15:32
municipalities are required it's
15:33
considered contaminated contaminated
15:35
yeah they don't want it back and so you
15:38
know a lot of places are requiring
15:39
backflow prevention going into homes and
15:41
businesses and and and things like that
15:42
whether it be double checks dual checks
15:45
rpg type stuff but a prv can act as this
15:48
too and and so if you have a prv in
15:50
place
15:51
and it's not dirty like what we talked
15:52
about before but chances are you're also
15:54
going to have a domestic hot water
15:55
source which as we all know when you
15:57
heat water what happens it spans it
16:00
expands it's going to want to increase
16:01
the pressure and so you need to have an
16:04
expansion tank so if you're
16:06
this is another great cell technique for
16:08
you guys not only did we we talk about
16:10
you know two prvs uh you if you're
16:13
selling a prv it's never had a prv in
16:14
place before definitely look into an
16:16
expansion tank as well absolutely
16:18
water's gotta have somewhere to go it
16:19
does it's not gonna blow your pipes up
16:22
like a balloon it's got to have a place
16:24
to expand so
16:26
put that or you can sell them a bucket
16:28
to put it on the relief valve on the
16:30
water heater
16:31
there you go you can get a custom
16:32
branded bucket with your company name on
16:34
it
16:35
yeah it's it's there's we get a lot of
16:36
interesting calls you know i mean uh
16:38
pressure reducing valves are are an
16:40
interesting one and and you know greg
16:42
you talked about it before as far as
16:43
undersizing and over sizing and and you
16:44
always need to make sure the valve is
16:46
sized to to meet the maximum demand okay
16:50
but the other thing that you kind of run
16:52
into is that if if you size a prv to to
16:54
meet the maximum demand um that prv in
16:57
particular might not be the best prv to
16:59
handle that little itty bitty load from
17:01
you know a small bathroom sink like a
17:03
half a gpm or whatever right and um
17:07
and so it's something
17:08
something that you got to be aware of um
17:10
the fact that you know a big prv is
17:12
great for that that high capacity or
17:14
that that that design day if you want to
17:17
call it that but
17:19
but for that guy that's just trying to
17:20
wash his hands in the middle of the
17:21
night it might not be your best scenario
17:23
uh have you guys ever run into that
17:24
before oh yeah definitely yeah yeah i
17:27
mean you you know one thing we look at
17:29
is we always recommend sizing between
17:31
that three to six feet per second range
17:33
so totaling up your load looking at the
17:35
flow characteristic chart and picking
17:37
the model that fits within that three to
17:39
six feet per second
17:41
minimum flow rates what we recommend is
17:44
really down to one foot per second yep
17:45
so it's not uncommon i mean you look at
17:48
our one inch valve that's got a high
17:50
flow capacity it's 10 to 19 gpm right
17:52
but at one foot per second it's still
17:55
looking for it's still able to deliver
17:57
about three three gallons per minute
17:58
yeah that's pretty crazy yeah so i mean
18:01
you know obviously most of your bathroom
18:03
sinks and whatnot are not gonna be three
18:04
gallons per minute
18:06
and uh you know in a lot of scenarios it
18:07
can work pretty stably under that one
18:09
feet per second velocity range but
18:10
that's kind of the recommendation
18:12
but if you do have a scenario where
18:14
you've got a high flow demand and
18:16
everything like that again you need to
18:17
size that big prv to handle that but
18:20
this is another scenario ding ding ding
18:21
ding ding you can sell two prvs this is
18:24
really awesome and instead of a staging
18:26
type scenario you're gonna actually run
18:27
it in a high low scenario so you're
18:29
gonna have a big prv that handles that
18:31
that big load uh when everything's on uh
18:34
the design day so to speak but then
18:35
you're gonna have a smaller prv that's
18:37
actually piped in parallel to the bigger
18:39
prv and you're gonna set that smaller
18:41
prv to a slightly higher pressure
18:44
so that way when there is a drop on the
18:46
the distribution system that small prv
18:48
is going to pick it up and and you know
18:50
replenish but then if the pressure drop
18:52
gets too great then that bigger prv in
18:55
parallel will open up and it will kind
18:56
of take it over from there so so it is a
18:59
parallel type thing it is also it's a
19:01
nice redundancy thing too i mean it is
19:03
if you ever need to service them clean
19:04
them out or anything you don't have to
19:05
take down the whole building um and not
19:07
only this i mean two in parallel is one
19:09
thing if you've got a big enough demand
19:10
you can do multiple
19:11
two three four four yeah in parallel
19:14
depending on the size and the need for
19:15
the building and everything like that so
19:17
so again something to think about there
19:18
with prvs sizing is super important
19:21
though i mean good grief maybe
19:23
sizing is super
19:25
yeah i mean that's the majority of our
19:26
calls the problems is it wasn't sized
19:28
correctly to begin with yeah yeah when
19:30
it comes to noise the sizing is is
19:33
pretty important the parallel pipe thing
19:35
is great i mean especially for larger
19:37
homes with multiple different
19:40
sizes of varying loads with uh
19:43
irrigation systems we see a lot of that
19:45
with irrigation systems i've had i don't
19:47
know how many guys call me yeah i got an
19:49
irrigation system they got a prv but i
19:50
don't think you can keep up well this is
19:52
what you have to do right now so you
19:54
talk them through parallel piping a
19:56
bigger one and then smaller ones or a
19:58
smaller one and it works out great for
20:00
them and never hear back from them right
20:02
for sure
20:04
yeah so you know ed khalefi you know
20:06
like i said we've we've had these prbs
20:07
for a few years we've been doing
20:08
fantastic with them um you know if you
20:11
guys ever have questions you know don't
20:13
hesitate to reach out to us we've got a
20:14
lot of great resources available online
20:16
you know with uh with a lot of our
20:18
webinars on youtube but uh we've got
20:21
some great people like lefty here too um
20:24
yeah we're always happy to help yeah we
20:26
pride ourselves on being able to help
20:27
everybody out in the field yeah yeah so
20:29
we're happy you could join us again
20:30
today cody and promote your five things
20:32
you need to know series you guys can
20:34
check that out um on our youtube channel
20:36
or yeah all the social media social
20:38
media yeah check anywhere you can find
20:40
kolofi you can find that
20:42
all right thanks for having me guys i
20:43
really appreciate it alright great
20:44
thanks cody
20:46
thank you for tuning in if you ever need
20:48
help please feel free to contact our
20:50
tech support team anytime at
20:52
techsupport.us
20:55
caleffi.com
20:57
or call us during our business hours at
21:00
7 30
21:01
to 4 30 pm
21:03
central time
21:04
at 414-238-2360
21:14
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