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Speaker 1:How long does it take to get a belt in BJJ? Now there's a few belts that say you're a white belt, how long I want my blue belt? Now I've been here for five minutes. Or maybe you're a brown belt and you've been there for two, three years. You're like how long is this for it can take? It's a very good question and people ask this all the time. Now the IBJJF has their rules. Your gym might have certain rules and different people have different experience. But we're going to examine this because sometimes people get really impatient and then some people are just getting sad on and forgot about. So let's talk about it, because some people go through certain belts quicker than others and there can be reasons for that.
Speaker 1:First question do the IBJJF standards matter? They matter if you want to compete in the ghee. Let me explain. So there's a guy called Travis Stevens. He was Jujoka silver medalist in the Olympics. Savage human. He got given his Jujitsu black belt really fast because he was like a world-class Judoca and was messing people up. But because they gave him his black belt quicker than he was meant to, he can't compete at black belt in the IBJJF. So if you care about the ghee and you care about competing, getting a belt too soon can mess up your registration and your ability for them to be able to do it. That actually happened to me too. It wasn't a big deal.
Speaker 1:But I remember Adam saying he was like oh, is your brown belt registered with IBJJF? I was like no, and he's like, well, if it's not registered. But I'm like yeah, but I've had it for like five years. He's like yeah, but if they don't know about it, then you can't get a black belt, so you need to have it for two years. And so he's like he said, do you want your black belt to be recognized by them or does it not matter to you? And I was like fuck, I don't know. And he said, well, look, it doesn't really matter. But he said I think it's kind of nice to have it recognized, if it can all work out. And so he said, register your brown belt today, like do that right now, and then you know whatever. And so I don't know if I registered the black belt or whatever.
Speaker 1:But yeah, so it is an interesting thing. Of course, if you're just not competing in their comps, it doesn't matter. No, it doesn't matter. But I think if your coach is like, doesn't give a shit about their comps particularly, you know, or they're just not particularly focused on them, then your coach probably isn't even going to bring that up with you, possibly not. But then people don't necessarily know, because it's also we've talked about this before it's a faux pas to bring up your belt with your coach. Right, it's a little bit it can seem entitled. You're like so I'm killing a Wensman X belt type comp, but it's not even that. You might be like well, I've trained for a year, do I get the next belt? Or what's going on? So we have talked about how a coach might have a different standard for you because you're a competitor, or they might have a different standard for you because they're trying to make you a better person. So you're being a terrible person. They're not giving you that belt. You know like they might go. No, I want to see a bit of more patience or a little bit more something from you to get the next belt. Let's just quickly go into what the IBJGF guidelines are so we can get that out of the way.
Speaker 1:Now, I didn't know this, but there is technically no minimum requirement for white belt. Now, their whole grading system is based that you would do jiu-jitsu as a junior and work your way through the gray belts, and the gray was white stripe, yellow, orange, blah, blah, blah. Work your way out Makes sense, because white belt it's not actually like a rank. It means you are unranked, it means you do jiu-jitsu, yeah, but it's like you haven't it's ground level. So you actually haven't been given a, isn't it? So that's maybe why there's no minimum requirement. No, but there is rankings within that right, like one stripe, two stripe If your club does stripes. So some clubs do stripes on attendance. They're like every three months or every six months or whenever you're getting a stripe, provided you've done enough classes. Other places it depends on you know, submissions or comp wins and stuff like that.
Speaker 1:But essentially where the time requirement comes in is blue belt, and actually this is the longest time two years. They say that you have to spend a minimum of two years at blue belt. That's the requirement from the IBJGF. But if you don't care about that, that's cool. I just saw, we get this out of the way. Purple, they're saying one and a half years, one and a half, and then brown belt to black belt is one year. Interestingly enough, the belt I spent the most time on was purple. Wait, what's purple for one and a half? Yeah, so you're blue belt for two, purple for one and a half, so three and a half, and then brown belt, brown to black, minimum one year. So four and a half years is the shortest pathway. You could go from blue to black, yeah, right, but if we're realistic about this, like most people are not doing the full time, flat out Jiu-Jitsu life. So I would say, and we can, we will just talk about our own experience here.
Speaker 1:I went through White Belt pretty quick, as far as I was aware, 18 months. I got my Blue Belt in 18 months from when I started. But then my friend Sunny, she got hers in one year. She was just killing it straight away and they're like well, okay, here we go. Blue Belt. Yeah, it was probably similar. I was on Blue Belt for two-ish years, a little bit more, a little bit less, but I was on Purple for ages probably four, yeah, four years. I think I was there Brown Belt, not that long, probably, yeah, a bit over a year, two years. So it's just one of those things Like for different people, depending on what stage of life you're at, you can spend more or less time there, yeah, and so for a lot of people I feel this is true Brown Belt is often where you spend a lot of time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because you might have started jujitsu when you're younger or not, so you're not fucking injured and shit, you're injured. But then also life A lot of people get to Brown Belt and they're like, well, I've got kids now, I didn't have kids when I started this thing. Yeah, or a career or something, a career, you name it. Life happens and then the sheen has worn off too. You're like fuck, jujitsu is hard work, god damn it. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So I mean, that was probably more your journey, right, joe? You were pretty quick through to Brown. Yep, yep, yep, blue Belt came fast. I think it came in under a year. Wow, yeah, whatever. Then Natural, then Natural Baby, then I actually can't remember. Yeah, blue Purple was all a bit of a blur, but I was at Brown Belt for like a long time and, yeah, injuries, changing gyms, all that stuff, five years, six years or something, yeah.
Speaker 1:So you know, I guess the thing for and I plan to stay at Black Belt for a little while. I'm going to talk to Adam about that, the thing you know, if you're hearing this and you're like, oh, I'm a fresh white, because we've got a lot of listens who are like I just started, right, what do I expect? Now, here's the thing A lot of this is predicated on the idea that you're kind of training consistently and regularly and there's no real interruption to that. But me being at Brown Belt for that long was because I had numerous interruptions. Right Now, the interruptions are going to come, and here's something that can and will happen to you more than likely. You will be making great progress and you'll be very close.
Speaker 1:Maybe you know this, maybe your coach tells you, or maybe they don't, but within the you know the coach desires to be like, oh, so-and-so, you know, ready for the next stage, be it a striped, be it a belt, and then you take a holiday or you get really busy at work and you don't show up for a couple of weeks, and then that will just kind of knock you back a little bit. It will, right, and then you'll get back on a path. And then, who knows, maybe you get sick, maybe there's a COVID lockdown, maybe maybe you cop an injury, you know, whatever it is Surgery, yeah. And before you know it you're like six months ago or a year ago you were just on the cusp of getting your new belt and now you're still at that original belt, yeah, right, and it's just. It's just very important to understand because a lot of it's out of your control, not all of it always, but a lot of it's out of your control and it doesn't matter, no, it doesn't fucking matter. But most coaches are going to have a standard yes, and so, in a binary sense, like well, did you meet the standard? Yes or no? And as much as they want to like have empathy for oh, you got sick, it's like, yeah, but I need so-and-so to hit this many classes and I want to see this kind of consistency. Yeah, you know, I just put that out there for the newer cats to not get disheartened, even though you're still going to get disheartened, yeah. And look, you know I'm going to put this out there.
Speaker 1:Fabio Calloy Fabinho, who has been one of the most active competitors and I think he was awarded like Alliance's best competitor last year or something like that. That guy was on his brown belt for like four or five years because they were sandbagging him, because they wanted him to be world champion. I'm not saying this is not his choice. Like, shout out to my boy Batman Fabinho, some of the best biceps you've ever seen in your life, a featherweight guy, potentially a lightweight guy. You know, michael Lange, cobrinha, lucas, lefri, like there was so many Alliance guys ahead of him.
Speaker 1:They're like, no, you stay at brown and you stay there until you win us a championship. I don't know how many silver and bronze medals he has from that time at brown belt, but they just kept him there for ghee and no ghee. I'm like it just wasn't under his authority. He would have loved to be a black belt. But they're like no, you're going to stay here. And I'm against this idea of sandbagging, but it was just that within the ranks, that's where they kept him, even though he was one of the best in the world, yeah.
Speaker 1:So I think that people get the wrong idea. They're like yeah, but if I compete more and I do this and I do that, it doesn't mean you necessarily go up, depending on what gym you're at. If your coach expressly says to you I want to see you compete because that's a requirement of you going to the next level, sure, that's, that's cool. Yeah, but I mean look, I'll give you an example. Yeah, don't be good at jiu-jitsu. That's the main takeaway from what JJ just said, basically like fucking be sh. You know, yeah, if you get too good, you'll get help back. Yeah, that's basically what I'm saying. No, I'm just saying that's an example of someone who you would think would get their black belt ultra fast, but they didn't, even though they're one of the best in the world, yeah.
Speaker 1:So, opposite counterpoint to that Hobbs and Moorer, he's a bit of a legend founder of Nova. Well, one of the. No, he's not a founder of Nova Unial, he was one of the best at Nova Unial and he's part of RMNU, which is his association with them, and he has his own thing now. He graded from. They say he was graded from purple to black belt, but this is back in like 1995. It's kind of no, 1994, it was before the IBJJF was an official thing. But he competed, I think, at the first IBJJF Worlds Now I might be wrong about this as a black belt. They graded him to brown and then they, the team didn't have anybody at his weight at black belt. So he was technically at brown belt for I don't know eight or nine months. But then they were like we need someone at Worlds at black and they gave him a black belt and he won via six submissions, all different submissions, yeah, submitted everyone. That's kind of why he was the featherweight goat at that time, right, because it was like this kid's a purple belt, oh my God. Now he's a black belt world champion. What the freak just happened there. And it's not that he wasn't a brown belt, I think he just maybe didn't compete at brown belt. So, yeah, one of the best in the world at purple, also one of the best like basically world champion at black belt, and so he kind of it seemed like he may have skipped a step.
Speaker 1:And I think in the earlier days of Jiu-Jitsu, how long you spent at a belt didn't matter, it was more about how good you were. Yeah, we're seeing more of that now. Right, yeah, absolutely yeah, it doesn't really matter, right, yeah, rank doesn't necessarily relate to skill. Still funny is that they call you know, they call Nicky Rod the black belt player. I mean, I know he's got a black belt now, but even when they were calling him that before he got his black belt, I'm like, yeah, but we all understand, like in the no-gear game, especially the belts don't mean shit. Like, if you're a good grappler, you can be a fucking handful for anyone. And maybe you've never stepped foot on a Jiu-Jitsu mat, maybe you're just a wrestler who's done some fucking yeah, but that doesn't matter. If it's submission wrestling, right, I think it matters more.
Speaker 1:If you put the gi on him, it would matter Absolutely, but you know, so we're putting, but there's no gi on them. We're speaking in the context of giz and belts, right? The gi, yeah, right. So I think that's where it kind of is a little bit more relatable. The gi is harder. It's pretty hard to skip steps in the gi if you haven't had gi training, because it's Unless. You've done Judo, you've done Sambho. Even if you're a really great wrestler, you're not gonna be like a div one wrestler. Put a gi on him, think you're gonna be better than a black belt. You won't be. No, the leveling of the playing field there is. There's no gi here. You can't control me. I'm a big animal. What are you gonna do, you know? So what can you expect? You've just started Jiu-Jitsu. You're three months in and you suck.
Speaker 1:Anybody who says to me like what I've been hearing recently, it's from a lot of tech folks, because obviously I hang out with tech folks now. Well, I'm in their group chats and they all wanna try Jiu-Jitsu and they're like, oh, I'm gonna get so good. And then they're always like challenging. They say that I'm gonna get so good, yeah, I'm gonna be great. This is a seven year old. Yeah, tech chat, yeah, no, no, no. They're all. They're ranging from 21 to 51, but they all act like teenagers when it comes to this shit, because they don't know what they're talking about and they're like, yeah, I've got my first free trial class tomorrow, I'm gonna get so good. You're like, oh yeah, cool, cool, that's really nice.
Speaker 1:And, as you would all know, if you're hearing this, if you've done Jiu-Jitsu a couple months, you're like I still suck, I still don't know what I'm doing. That extrapolates over a longer time. Even when you're at Bluebelt, you get the Bluebelt and you're like, oh my God, I still. But when you're at Whitebelt, you look to the Bluebelt like they know what's up. They're blue. That's the next level and it changes over time. Obviously, the more you know, the more you realize you do not know. But honestly, if you, I would expect that you're gonna be on your Whitebelt for two years. That's what I would say For the average person. Yeah, I think that's a fair timeline to assume. And if you're there longer and two years of training, consistently Like whatever a week off, a holiday here and there, but on the whole, you've been showing up for two years, yeah, and we always recommend three times a week.
Speaker 1:If you can get five, wow, amazing. But I feel like that's not. It's probably not sustainable for the average human. You're gonna have weeks where it's one yeah, or two here and there and again. Our recommendation of three is based on most people who do five can't sustain it and then they end up crashing and burning and taking two months off Often then. So it's like you just come in a little bit lower and it's a more sustainable thing. I can do this every week yeah, definitely, and I mean three times a week. You're seeing your coach every couple of days? Yeah, definitely, you know that's. Yeah, it's really consistent. It's a good thing.
Speaker 1:And look, the blue belt, I feel, is possibly more challenging than it seems, because you feel like when I get to blue belt, I'll know Jiu-Jitsu, and then you just like, nope, I don't know Jiu-Jitsu, but I feel like I should be better than I am. I feel like we've talked about it before. People quitting this idea of attainment that you're gonna get there and you're gonna know is kind of bullshit. You'll get to blue belt, but I feel like people languish here because their knowledge doesn't marry up to like, oh, the rank, I've got a rank now. Well, no, blue belt is the real white belt. Now you're starting to learn. You've got an idea of the game. You know how much you suck, you're in it, now let's go.
Speaker 1:Like I feel like the hard work is really at blue belt because there's there is a little bit more expectation and coaches looking at you like, hey, but you're a blue belt. Like we've been doing this two years. Shouldn't I've shown you this? Why don't you remember this, joe? Haven't you been writing this all down in your BJJ diary, of course, coach? Haven't you been drilling this every time? Eight, my diary, bullshit.
Speaker 1:Did you feel pressure at blue belt? No, blue belt for me was different. Didn't you compete? Yeah, but I was on a tear, you were loving it. Blue belt was just like I probably I think I thought I knew everything and I was just going ham on the athleticism, just full tornado, yeah, nice, and that's mainly in devil's Very little technique. But I had, you know, I had a couple of like Moves, a couple moves, right, yeah, you know, and I mean it was a different time. Back then People didn't know a lot of jiu-jitsu, but yeah, so yeah, no, it was very much. It kind of was a different experience, right.
Speaker 1:And then I think the humbling came later, right, when I was like maybe not even purple, purple and blue kind of to me felt the same, sure, even in competition. I remember showing up and just being like doing the same shit at a purple belt comp and then just winning it and go, oh, okay, like there's, actually there wasn't a jump there Huge, yeah, yeah. And again different time, there's only like four people at a jujitsu comp, sure. And then at Brown I was like, oh shit, yeah, okay, wow, I got a lot of holes here. It's tough, this is a steep hill. But yeah, I think I was really in a I don't know whatever.
Speaker 1:I think that previously no, well, previously in jujitsu because there was no leg locks at blue and purple belt and you could start to knee bar and toe hold at Brown that did change the way the game was played. It did become more savage. But now, because people are practicing leg locks at a younger age in their jujitsu life, their games more savvy, right, they're more attacking, they're also more defensive. So I think because the games evolved, the belts have kind of gotten harder. That's my take on it. I think the older generation can look back and go, wow, blue belts today, they're crazy, like of the next generation. And then that next generation is like well, blue belts today, they're on some next shit.
Speaker 1:Like, every time the game evolves, the basic standard just goes up, and goes up, and goes up, and it's not as simple as just oh, how do we open the closed guard? It's like, no, we don't even play closed guard anymore. Bro, who cares about that knowledge? You know like it's we're talking about this morning, about, like, attacking the back, yeah. And then there's sort of more traditional belief of like, if you've taken someone's back, you're finishing. You should be, yeah, like you should absolutely be finishing. But man, if you get someone's back in no game now and they got good defense, strong chance, you're gonna have to move somewhere else. Like it's a fucking. Or even in the game, right Depending, yeah, it's just the way like and I was sort of commenting on that like back then, if you got to someone's back, they basically gave up, yeah, or if you mounted someone, they kind of basically like, we just accepted positions, whereas now it's like no, don't accept anything, no, and yeah, definitely as much as attacks have gotten better, defenses have gotten better, yeah, and people have just gotten even more improved at the smaller nuances of each thing.
Speaker 1:Because I spent my most time at Purple Belt, it was also the time I put the most pressure on myself, cause that's probably when I cared the most about Jujitsu and it doesn't mean I don't care about Jujitsu now, but it was like my life. It was the two a days, three a days. Live in Brazil, wanna be a world champion? Yeah, full commitment. This is everything, and if I don't succeed at this thing, then I am nothing. Yeah, and it was also super competitive, like when I look around at the Purple Belts at that time and I look at who they are now, it's like that's a competitive time to keep up with these cats. You know, anyway, I mean, I was how old was I Just before I was 30, it was like 20, yeah, 29-ish, 30-ish man.
Speaker 1:It was one of the things where my obsessive mind allowed me to just go into this I don't know what you call like a rabbit hole, and I couldn't see much outside of it other than just being really good at it, and that's not why it took me longer. But I mean, I just put so much time and energy there and you probably have this at different phases in your life, whether it's a business or a relationship or a hobby, where you're like, for example, someone I know got into bow hunting and then they realized how hard it was and they're like shit, I'm gonna have to practice every day and like archery basically become like an archer to wanna then turn this into a skill and they had like probably nine months where they were doing it all the time and then they got an injury at Gigi too, and then they couldn't. They couldn't do it right, they got a shoulder injury right and so Get a rifle and be a real man, that too. But yeah, it was so. It's so funny because we have these episodes in our life where we can invest the time and then the ebb and flow of life is like now you don't have the time, you can't, yeah, you can't do it. Yeah, and that might mean that you were so close, like you were saying, you're so close to getting that belt, and then you move house and you've got to change gyms and now they're going to sit on you for a year or two or whatever the hell. Right, that's right. And so they should write yeah, that's part of the process.
Speaker 1:I do remember I always loved how Adam is extremely open about, yeah, his giving of belt communication. Yeah, and I remember there was a guy, james you remember James James Diamond who trained with us. Yeah, he's up north. Now, that's right. I moved out to Brisbane, up to Queensland somewhere Goldie, I think but he was like he had bounced around gyms just because of his life, and I remember Adam was like he had to leave our gym and as was like when he gave the blue belt to him. He's like I couldn't bear the thought of this guy having to change gyms again and and again, being a fucking four year white belt when he's really good. Yeah, so he's like you know he's a blue belt. Yeah, you know, and he gave it to him and then, like that week he was gone. He did leave. Yeah, so you know, yeah, it's.
Speaker 1:It's a thing it's not as easy to be consistent in a modern life. No, and what I'd say and this is the thing I was saying about our good tech bro community they're so focused and efficient. These are the, these are our dork friends who don't do it. You did to her like, oh, I'll get good really quick, awesome. Yeah, they don't know, they. I just can't wait till they try it and then realize this is so hard. I don't know how I'm going to do this. It's like that's right. It's interesting because they are so dedicated to their business and and startups and what it takes to make that happen. They automatically think that because they've climbed that mountain, they're well, they'll just climb this other mountain real quick and it's like you have no idea. It's not. It's not like that, man. This is.
Speaker 1:This is harder than anything else you're going to do because of the injuries and because of life and because everything else that gets in the way. The chance that you're going to make your life less distracted and more boring so you can be good at this is very low Less distracted and more boring so that you can make space for jujitsu. Yeah, yeah, almost everyone will never do that, and that's the hardest thing, because we want stimulation, we want cool shit where you've got to let go of one hand to to grip on to something else. Right Like it's. You literally have to get rid of something to make space for the new thing, and jujitsu takes up a lot of space. Yeah, so For anyone out there, you're on this journey.
Speaker 1:Homeboy, you're making me reflect on all the things I sacrificed to be where I am now. She and you should be fucking proud of that. No, I'm kidding. I mean, I'm mostly very proud of that. Yeah, good, good, you should be, don't get a heavier self-joy.
Speaker 1:Look, I think, ultimately, if you're unsure of where you're at in the journey, it's this weird thing between coach and student that coaches. I've seen this before where a student has asked the coach so much, you for my belt? And the coach went no, no, no Now, because you brought a certain level of ego to it that has indicated a lack of maturity for the thing. You know what I mean. Like some coaches will want to see a degree of personal development, not just jujitsu skill, and maybe you brought a go to it, maybe you didn't, maybe you just asked an innocent question. The coach is like you're getting too tall puppy. Six months, yeah, you can wait, you can just keep waiting. Tell me, um, what's the biggest thing you've ever done? Um, what? What would be our general let's? Let's take all of this into account. Right, there's going to be interruptions, there's going to be injuries. We know what IB JJ says. We've seen, you know, people come like like go fast, go slow.
Speaker 1:How long does it take to get a black belt? It starts to finish. The general consensus is 10 years. I don't think that's realistic anymore. No, that's, that's kind of what it used to be. Right, that's, that was what it was For me. It was just shy of that. Like nine and a half years, that that was kind of it. But I did go really hard for six, six or seven of those years from white to brown. I went really hard to get those skills and so then it was like pretty quick to go from brown to black.
Speaker 1:For you out there, if you're, if you're not prepared to do two a days, and you're lucky if you can get three a week, you're probably looking at more like 15 years, including injury, because I would definitely say so. This year is my 16th year in Jiu Jitsu and I lost two to three years on injury, like broken ribs, bulged ears, torn ligaments, like how long your knee surgery took out for a while, right, yeah, a couple of years, I guess. Yeah, it's tough, right, and this is part of the journey. Yeah, it's a year and a half, not guaranteed, but it's, it could, it could be you, yeah. So I'm going to say 15 years from from white belt to black belt, with life's interruptions, 15, and you shouldn't, you should, yeah, more, you shouldn't get long fucking time. You shouldn't get, you shouldn't get dispirited Like if you're starting Jiu Jitsu right now and you're 35 years old, you're like I'm probably not going to get my back belt time 50. That's okay.
Speaker 1:Thinking about getting your black belt is not going to help you. You've got to look at your life on a day to day basis and go how can I just get to class? Yeah, how can I make it so that, even if I didn't make it to every class, but I can get to that open mat? Or I can do a drill in the garage with my mate? Like, just find a way to keep it in your life. That effort is as important as competing or doing whatever else.
Speaker 1:I think our mind somehow is incapable of even thinking about a black belt. When you're a white belt Like you remember you touched on before when you're at a comp and you're a white belt, you look at the blue belts and you're like in awe, oh fuck, that looks so strong and fit. And then when you're a blue belt, you look at the purples maybe the brown, but I didn't, I didn't even look at black belts and think that that was a reality for me. I don't think that's true. I think it's changed. Everyone's looking at Gordon Ryan, everyone's looking at Nikki Road, everyone's looking at the black belts. They might be watching, but I don't think they're seeing themselves in that. No, no, but what I'm saying is there was no social media for black belts before there is now. Like, the number of black belts that are in your feed is unparalleled compared to what it used to be. Yeah, and people like, oh, but I want to be like Gordon Ryan, I'll take his stack, I'll do, I'll contact Jones's drug supply and I'll do them steroids. No, yeah, but people are trying to act like black belts now, without the dedication and the hard work and the granular stuff. Yeah, perhaps kind of kind of.
Speaker 1:I think I'm getting at a different point, more just like seeing that and thinking that you will be there one day. All right For me. I think that we don't. Especially when a journey is that long, we just have a way of like splitting it up to be like the next milestone, which is more achievable. But I think technology has sped things up, right, right, the acceleration of technology, which is the you know Moore's Law, like every every two years, like it's, it doubles, doubles or whatever. The equation is right. I believe that that has brought our level of impatience forward. We are more impatient now than we ever were Right. But actually, because we cram more in because of the expectation of life, we are less likely to go faster in jujitsu.
Speaker 1:As strange as that sounds, the speed and evolution of technology and busyness of life will mean you're going to get your black belt slower, not faster. Just because you can access the information easier doesn't mean you'll be better at doing those techniques quicker. That's what I'm putting out there, not that you need to be dispirited by that. You will be a better blue belt than I was. You will be a better purple belt than I was, so your quality of jujitsu will, I think, ultimately be better. So you can be satisfied knowing I'm good at jujitsu. That's something you should be really proud of.
Speaker 1:But yeah, the journey is a long one. Take your time, be patient. It's worth it. Folks, we love you to bits and we really do want to see you get that black belt. Just because it takes time, you've got to chip away. You've got to chip away slowly and surely, and that's what we do. We chip away slowly and surely. At this podcast, we're constantly doing stuff to try and make it better and we take what you say on board because we love your feedback. Here's some feedback for y'all. We need you. You are our friends, our companions on this journey To us being black belt podcasters, you know what will help us get there? You subscribing and on audio, following iTunes, spotify, you name it, but leave us a five star review. Why? So that other good people like you are going to connect with this? That helps us, we help you, we appreciate y'all. Thanks, man, cheers.