The Problem With Open Mats

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Transcript

The Open Mat That Got Ugly

SPEAKER_00 0:00

This fucking guy shows up with a black eye today. I thought you're doing strongman's son. Well, I also occasionally do some BJJ. And I tell you what, I was not ready for the storm that was coming my way at Open Mat. Anzac Day, long weekend um here in Australia. And I went to Kumite, which um which is uh Ari and Josh and Hope's gym. Yeah. And there was a lot of people there. Are they got they got a permanent home now? They do. No, no, they got a permanent home. Lovely spot. And I my first proper role was with a two-striped bluebelt, young, athletic man, man child. Like when was your last Jut session? Well, this is the Ghee. So I haven't trained Ghee in So when was the last time? Oh no, I probably two weeks ago or a week ago, I trained no Ghee. Okay. But I put the Ghee on and it felt different. And let me tell you, I was thinking, oh yeah, people rolling in the gi, it'll be cool. Ooh, it got hot. It got hot. And uh this guy had a really good blast double. I think he trains wrestling at Sydney Wrestling Academy. Okay. And which I mean Sydney Wrestling Academy Academy is one of the only wrestling, like actual wrestling schools here in Sydney. In Sydney. Like there's like a couple, and so the ones that the two that exist that have good wrestlers. Yeah, and look, I just by our standards. I I just sensed that like he didn't look like he was pulling guard. And and I and I was like, oh, oh, oh, hey, the energy. Oh, uh and I was like, all right, I think he's come for this double. Wasn't it no, which is the opposite of just the Hodger Gracie. I'm just reaching for some reaching for some lapel. He was like down low. Well, he wouldn't let he wouldn't let me make grips. Okay. So I was like, oh, okay. All right. Like he's not, he's not chilling. And he his intent was big. And he he yeah, his shot's good, but I got the underhook, like I kind of anticipated. And at the kind of last second, I was able to just as my butt's kind of hit the ground, I was able to kind of turn him over, much to his uh displeasure, shall we say, or to his surprise. I think he thought he just had me. And I and in that moment where I was trying to consolidate, like to just keep him on the ground, he just snapped like spaz, like and he just shin kicked me in the face. And I was like, in the heat of the moment, I was just like, oh, stay where you are, like, come here. Just trying to grab him, you know, to kick. I just yeah, yeah, it was just like a split second. Um and then it's very hard to keep down. Look, I can't remember if it was in that moment, but eventually I was able to kind of pass his guard and control him, and I got an armbar. And to my mind, I'm like, whoo, thank God for that, because the rest of that was a mess. And mate, it's a startle. Was it oh fuck, sorry, man, I just kicked you. No way, no way, bro. He was trying to pull the gi off me. He tried to like pull me forward for like a but he just pulled, literally just pulled the gi off the top of me. Right. Was like, look, mate, buy me a drink before you start undressing me, okay? Um, I just couldn't work out why this guy's going so hard. I was I was keen for it. Fucking dude from the podcast. No, but he no, we we didn't even say, hey, what's your name? What's my name? It's just like you want to roll? All right, cool. It wasn't even like that. He didn't know who I was, I didn't know who he was. He's clearly very good, no question. I will say he eventually succeeded in his double legs, right? Because I was just like, once I got the submission, I was like, oh, to me, that's the role is ticked. Yeah, but this guy was like not like he just ramped up. I'm like, oh, okay, Jesus, all right. And I was not being very successful in my takedown attempts. Like his sprawl was good, blah, blah, blah. Anyway, my eye got fat. It kind of shh. It gets that little hang. Like, is that water? Like this, it starts again in your vision. Like, what's it got? Oh, oh, weird. Anyway, um I thought the round timer went. I don't even know how long the rounds were, and I misunderstood what was going on. I'm like, good round, shake hands. Boom. I was like, Oh, we're still going. Okay, okay, because it's open, Matt, right? So you can just roll multiple rounds. Oh, the communication was not clear. Oh, so no, I want to continue into the next there was no discussion had. So from a communication level, this guy's still coming out. Is that like a Toquinho kind of Pal Harris type character? No, no, he was like a young, slightly more aggressive Nico Majlic. Right on. Like McGlisic. Maglisic, sorry. He just learned that recently, bro, big, big frame kid. Very good. I'm just thinking there's just some credit. There's some norms there though. But let me explain. One is apologize. No, no, he didn't give a fuck. And it's fine because I was like, it's gonna happen. I'll I'll bro. If you don't tap this armbar, I will wrist lock you. Like, you're gonna roll me hard or roll your hard back. Like, it's just it's respect, it's fine. I'm I'm good with it. I had enough energy to deal with it. Anyway, finally, when he got tired, which is I don't know how long we were rolling for, finally it was like a okay, fall on the mat type thing. But then I looked over and his dad was speaking, his dad was sitting on the couch watching him intently. I didn't know his dad was watching, and his dad, I don't know what language they were speaking, his dad was like talking to him on the roll, and he was just on the ground like dying. I'm like, oh, dad was there, coach was watching, you know. I was like, wow, now I understand why this guy was scrolling so hard, right? He he couldn't let his dad down or his coach down. One of my fucking arch nemesis, not not the arch nemesis, not bean. No, not bean. I mean he was he was a you know a former no he wasn't a he wasn't an arch nemesis, he was he was the distilled because we were mates and we trained together, you know. But yeah, this this is I'm talking, I mean that cunt that you fucking hate. Yeah, yeah, that I would compete for. Shout out sandbag and creonte. Yes, for you, that's right. Um, I can't remember this guy's name, but he was a judo guy who was also, I think we first competed at Blue Belt, yeah, and he was big and tall and stronger than me, and he beat me in two finals. Oof. And he was just he just had the personality of a fucking cardboard box, just a prick. And for me, that's like red flag. I'm like, you're a dickhead. You're a dick. Because I said hello and smiled, and he was like, uh, you know, but his dad was always watching. Oh and same thing, um, European of some sort. Yeah, dad was always talking to him, and I was always like, Fuck this cunt here with his dad. Yeah, you know, like it felt unfair. Yeah. Um, anyway, he beat me twice. Yeah, never

When Family Pressure Fuels Intensity

SPEAKER_00 6:50

let it go on the list for life. Oh bro, but uh yeah, I I it all became clear to me when I because I didn't know his father was sitting there, like on the couch, literally next to the mat where we were rolling. Yeah, I thought the people on the couch were people who were gonna train or just family or friends, like people were just hanging out, you know. And then it it occurred to me because I looked over and this guy was just like look, like stank face looking at me. I'm like, bro, I'm a black belt. He's a bluebelt. Like, I don't know what you think he is. He's not he's great, but he's a bluebelt. Like, yeah, don't be mad. Anyway, it was a good roll. So open mat and and then um yeah, got to roll a couple other people. It was great to roll in the ghee. Rolling in the ghee's plenty of fun. Uh, it is harder in general on all the fingers and all the bits, yeah, you know, cop and ghee grazes in the face and just yeah, all of that. But um, no, it was really good training. Um, had a good role with a white belt who was also like a judo guy. I knew he wasn't a white belt, he looked too seasoned. And to his credit, he looked younger than his actual age because I tried to play the age card and he was like, nah, man. I was like, I'm 43. And he's like, I'm 50. And I was like, dang. Oh wow. He hit me with the Asian youth, you know? Yeah. He didn't he didn't look Asian dude. Oh, yeah. So I think I think Korean background because he'd done Taekwondo and he'd done some judo. Remind me to tell you the story about my Korean neighborhood. Yeah, go on. Right. So we just chat and you know, we had some good roles and he was tough, dude. I couldn't he was. What did you say? You say he was judo guy? Uh judo guy, judo background. Like how any idea what belt he was in judo? Um, I think blue or bright, like decent, decent level. Yeah, right. So I just pulled guard. No, I stood up with him and and did some grip fighting because I was like, I got some shit. Yeah, but um anyway, he's significantly he's a 72 kilo guy, very strong for his size. Very strong. I couldn't just crush him. Yeah, wow. And I did try and I did try and like crush him with pressure, but wouldn't tap. Well like, oh shit, I might I might break this guy's ribs. Yeah, Korean guys, Japanese guys, would not tap. Pressure doesn't work against the bigger. He was so good. And I said to him, mate, you're really tough. And he's like, oh eh, whatever. And then his coach was watching, his black belt coach, who was sitting there observing, right? And I was like, and they're like, he was like, Oh, you should run my coach on it. Everyone's got their fucking team here tonight. Mate, I was like, wow, it's it's reverse dojo storm. I just came for open, Matt, and there's like teams, and it's because it's Kumite Jiu-Jitsu motherfucker shot like it's blood sport. You raid Jackson? You're not like Jackson, start him with a dim muck. Nah, man. I and the first thing I was like, oh, I chatted to him in the change room. He had a really tough old school judo geek Mizuno. Uh, if you know, you know, it's super thick, it's like you can tell the judo they're like 10 or 15 years old and they just live forever. Yeah, super thick. Can't get a grip on them. But the sleeves had shortened significantly, right? Like super comp illegal, you know. And um, straight away he just hit me with the he hit me with the headbutt double, like headbutt to the sternum, grab both legs. Oh, the fucking Galval penna. Yeah, boom. Like, you know, and and I just I didn't expect it. I thought he was gonna do some judo shit. He just went bum. And I down blocked to not to not let him grab my legs, and I just ate the headbutt to the sternum and didn't move much. And he's like, Oh, you you counted my baby double. Baby double? What was baby about that? Big bloody baby, mate. Like right, we don't change levels in jujitsu. That's a double leg, son, mate. And then it would just kind of went from there, and it was uh it was uh it was a strong guy war, and I I prevailed, thankfully. But um then it was great, it was great to see Hope and Ari and Mia and their little baby Achilles. Oh wow cute little dude, and yeah, just roll with folks. Like I caught up with a few people there from Legacy and just ended up having a few roles and then afterwards doing that thing where it's like, oh, you did this, I did that, and it turns into yeah, jujitsu discussion, which is awesome. That's cool. So I was very um thankful for that because I've I think I've missed that with no gi training. I haven't I haven't been feeling that when I go and do no gi. You don't sit down and break down bits and pieces afterwards necessarily, depending on where you trained. But um, yeah, man, that was that was the long weekend and it was good to be back in the game.

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SPEAKER_00 11:30

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The Hidden Value Of Post-Roll Talk

SPEAKER_00 13:05

You know, I was just thinking that, like, that's a really valuable part of the the training when you can have that little exchange with folks. Or when you've got time as well. Yeah, I the late the uh I find just from like just thinking back to a lot of the open mats I've been to, they often don't have a defined endpoint. No. So people just leave when they leave and you don't get actual closure of the session. Yeah, you end up rolling, and then at some point you're like, oh, I'm leaving now. And then you're usually saying no to people because they're like, Do you want to no, I'm gonna go, and then you kind of leave and you're like, it would be nice uh in a way if it was like, hey guys, we're gonna finish at whatever time. Yeah. And then you know, you can exchange, fuck around, stretch, whatever. Yeah. Give space for that. Yeah. Well, I think the value in it, but having it it being a long weekend, and also the fact that both Hope and Ari and Josh too, um, they they were also doing extra stuff at the end after their rounds. Just and so that meant like what, like extra training? Yeah, extra training technique, stuff, draw stuff, whatever. And so what that meant is you could kind of stay as long as you wanted. Right. And most people don't necessarily have that luxury, is what I was gonna say. And for me, I didn't have any other commitments. Not that I I think it's probably it ended up being two hours all told, which is plenty of time, but it felt like the time felt like it went long because there was space to chat or roll or don't roll, or yeah. It was good, man. So I was stoked. Did you roll with Ari?

Why We Skip Rolling With Ari

SPEAKER_00 14:34

I didn't roll with Ari actually. It's a good day when you don't roll with Ari. Look, man, he's going to worlds, and I am there to help his body get stronger. I don't need to tarnish this relationship. I don't want to hurt it because I've last time I rolled with Ari, like, if I don't go a thousand percent on a sub to try and break his shit, he will not tap. Yeah. And I don't want to do that. I also don't want to get bashed by him either. Like, I have made him way stronger. So it's like it's kind of not in my interest. Like, before it's like, oh yeah, he used to be like skinny and kind of wiry and hard to hold on to and couldn't do shit to him. And then it's like now, dude has come with the force. So I'm gonna save that for after after worlds. Yeah, fair. Yeah, I I expect it to not go well. Because this is like he's been he's a fucking nightmare, right? He's a nightmare. You've got to think Cole Abate could not pass Ari's guard. Oh, that's right, yeah. Like that match is amazing. I think that's a testament to his prowess, flexibility, and just general just wiriness. You can't do shit to his guard. Yeah, Cole Abate is the champ at that weight, and he couldn't pass his guard. It's just very significant. So, what the fuck am I gonna do? That's crap, sit back on a footlock. But uh but you haven't judged too. I remember Adam saying the only thing you can do, bro, is just stack the shit out of him and just fucking use all of your weight and all of your pressure. Just when you're six foot six tall, this is how you beat them. It's like sure, sure, Adam, whatever you say, bro. Um mate, I haven't been training.

Building Back After Knee Pain

SPEAKER_00 16:15

I think last time we caught up on it, my knee had flared up back when we had Raspberry Ape on. Yeah, yeah. Um, so I've been I've been, you know, not doing the thing. Um, and we've had a couple of long weekends, holidays like school holidays here, public holidays. So my regular coaching schedule has actually been yeah. I haven't I think I taught last week, but then I was like, no, I yeah, I taught once like in the last few weeks. Um so anyway, my knee's feeling pretty good. So I think I'm gonna go back and do some training next week. I've stopped training for a number of weeks. My knee feels great, hence time to train again. Well, I've been, you know, to give a bit more context to the to the listeners, I've been pushing it, you know, progressively at the gym. I'm now expressing full range of motion, under load. Uh, I've started running again. Perfect. Yeah, I've introduced like hard like running on concrete, and that's and it's all feeling pretty good. So I'm like, oh, I'll go back to rolling just with some chosen individuals, people I know I can just keep it chill with. Yep. Um I won't show up to any Open Mats for some time. No, it's it's chaos, bro. I I mean, I I think it's you know, it's that's what's so fun about OpenMats is the unknown. You show up, you're like, fuck, what's gonna happen today? Who's gonna be there? Yeah. And it's always a good vibe. You're always like, fuck, you've seen people that you haven't caught up with phrases, new people. There's always that person that you're like, oh shit, they look like a real handful. You know, there's always some like dark

The "Casual" Who Wins Medals

SPEAKER_00 17:40

horse or a few of that you're like, never seen this person, they don't seem to be anybody, but then you you start exchanging and you're like, oh my god, this motherfucker's an animal. It's gonna be a hand. It draws you out of your you know, relative comfort. Um, which I still I find that exciting. Hearing you talk about, I'm like, oh, I'm from that, yeah, that would be fun, but I'm like, not yet. No, I'm very happy that I didn't turn up at such a thing on the weekend. I just I want to just the last little point I want to say on this. I I finished rolling uh with this black belt, this heavyweight black belt, and I was pretty cooked at this point. I'd done probably meh, maybe eight rounds all up and the infinite round with the young blue belt. Who knows how long that went? Um and I was pretty done, but you know when you could kind of do one more. And then this very tall athletic man walked over and he said, Oh, hey man, I I train with these guys. Do you want to go one more? And he was doing no gi. And I was like, Oh bro, I'm just rolling in the ghee today. He's like, I'll put my gi on. And he had a little twinkle in his eye. And I was like, nah. Nah, you're the one more that's gonna get me injured or fucked. Like, and he's like, mate, I'm just a casual. I don't even know I'm just he's like, mate, I I wouldn't even roll once a week. I just go to open mats, and I'm like, yeah, me too. And you guys don't know me, and I just beat your mates up. Like I so I saw I saw you sitting on the side watching me squash your mates, so it's like I think I feel I sense vengeance is coming for me right now. And I said, No, I said, no, not today, man. Anyway, later, his name is Simon, so shout out Simon if you even I said the fact you don't follow the podcast is insulting. No, I was like, that's fine, that's cool. But later I checked out Simon's profile on Instagram. He got silver at the Asian Championships last year in Japan. It's just yeah, it's not casual, casual as like bro. I just showed up on a whim. He's there in in Japan with the silver metal. I was like, bro, get out of here. Yeah, so you gotta fucking be careful, right? That's the thing. When people show up just wearing like, you know, sports shorts and a very neutral rash guard, you don't know what they got. No, you know what I mean? And so, but I set the the keenness. I think he could see I was tired, and he was like, Oh, maybe I could get this guy. A little bit of froth around the corner of the mouth. I was just like, not today, buddy. I see you coming a mile away. So that's the thing you gotta be careful with the open mat that

Knowing When To Stop

SPEAKER_00 20:05

um it is fun, but you can't get carried away, and that can dude. You were smart, like you gotta know where to draw the line. Oh, and that, and that, and that's like like whatever, like you could have you could have done the role with him and he you could have got the shit beaten out of you, and or could have been fine, or it could have been fine, but it also like it you also could have ended up really kind of ruining the whole training experience you'd had by by just getting yourself into some war and being like that was fucked and now I'm wrecked and I'm a bit sore, and I you know, like I think moderation, knowing when to call it like it doesn't matter if you're you're drinking, um, you're lifting, it's that little thing in your head, which is like, this has been so good, more will be better. No, yeah, there is a quit while you're ahead. There is a natural endpoint to many things, whatever that is. And I think on a gut level, you feel it, you're like, that was nice. And someone's like, hey, you want to go one more? Whatever, whatever that is, right? Whatever the the Oh, you're about to go home. Let's get another round of drinks. Oh, and you're like, no, no, I said I'm going home. No, no, it's been a good night, it's been a good day, whatever it is. And and so I I I think I made the right decision. But next time, Simon, I'm coming for you, baby. First round, I'm gonna see you at Open Matt. We've all we've all dodged a few fucking big athletic brown belts at Open Mats. Right. Makes me think of that guy that I dodged because Leo was crying. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Alliance that day. Yeah, sorry, man, my son's upset, you know. Actually, I saw a comedian recently saying that um your wife is like the best excuses, man. If someone tries to get you to do something you don't want to do it, you're like, I gotta talk to my wife. I gotta ask my wife first. No one will question that. If you bring that to another man, you're like, let me just check with my wife. You're like, No, that's respectful promises. So we'd do something afterwards, yeah. But he was saying, if it was the other way around, it's a problem. Like if a woman says to another woman, Oh, I gotta check with my husband, you're like, Why? What's is he? Just wink if you're in trouble. Is he hitting you? What's going on here? Like, it's not acceptable. Does he control your finances? Yeah, of course. It's not acceptable. But it it's just funny. Sorry, man. I gotta pick my wife up from work. People like fair. Yeah. Good man, good man. You're not a coward, you're a you're a you're you're a you're a gentleman. You know, when I when I um we can close on this, when I was in uh I did a ski season in Whistler.

Never Call Your Last Run

SPEAKER_00 22:24

Oh yes. And I was snowboarding any good Australian backpack. Yeah, that's right. I I don't think I met one Canadian on that in that six-month period. Um we had a thing, which was never declare your last run of the day. Oh never say, all right, one more, or this is my last one. Because that's when you get injured every time. Yep. So it was just like you just ride the day, and then when you're done, you're like, hey guys, I'm out. And it was and it was actually really hard to do. But same thing, right, with Jits. I think you can tell yourself, like, this will be my last one, but to declare it, you open up, you know. You can fucking create problems for yourself. Yeah, definitely. And I and I think knowing how much is enough of any given thing is a key skill. And it takes time, it takes a lot of mistakes to get to that conclusion. But some may call it wisdom. Uh yeah, yeah, some may call it hindsight. Bit of both. Boom, boom. Good to catch up, bro. Nice.