What has Joe Camilleri been up to lately? OR Which is tougher, thriving in the music industry or surviving a 12 year old's birthday sleepover?

Join Cheryl Lee - That Radio Chick on STILL ROCKIN' IT for news, reviews, music and interviews with some of our favourite Australian musicians.

Prepare yourself for an intimate rendezvous with the legendary Joe Camilleri. Here, the iconic frontman of Jo Jo Zep & the Falcons and the Black Sorrows lays it all bare. We traverse his musical journey, discuss the creation of his new album, and get a firsthand account of the current state of the music industry. He shares experiences from a recent gig at the Bridgeway in Adelaide, where he relished performing with Wilber Wilde and interacting with his beloved fans.

The path of a musician is not always rosy. Joe opens up about the trials he faces, both in his personal life and in the grueling music industry. From health struggles that led to show cancelations to the rigors of doing live performances, Joe's narrative is a testament to unwavering resilience and a fierce love for his craft. His wish for his children to steer clear from the music industry due to its challenges offers a sobering perspective on the glamour often associated with this profession.

As we delve deeper into Joe's prolific career, we get a glimpse of his unique talent for creating a soulful connection with his audience during live performances. He recounts his journey of selling hundreds of thousands of records and earning multiple gold singles.  Wrapping up our enchanting conversation, Joe extends nuggets of wisdom, serving as valuable advice for budding musicians. Join us for this extraordinary narrative filled with trials, triumphs, and timeless tunes.

Includes Songs:

Jo Jo Zep & the Falcons - Security
The Black Sorrows - Chiquita
The Rolling Stones - Paint It Black
The Black Sorrows - Harley & Rose
John Denver - Chained To the Wheel
Kevin Borich featuring Joe Camilleri - Don't Cry

What has Joe Camilleri been up to lately … let’s find out!

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Transcript

Cheryl Lee: 0:06

That Radio Chick, Cheryl Lee here. Welcome to the Still Rockin' It podcast where we'll have music news, reviews and interviews with some of our favourite Australian musicians and artists. Today we chat with legendary frontman of Jo Jo Zep and the Falcons and frontman of the Black Sorrows, Joe Camilleri. He's exhausted from organising a 12 year old birthday party and if he thinks he's exhausted now, wait until tomorrow, when it's all over, 20 twelve year olds at his house. Good luck, Joe. To catch up on podcasts from other favourite artists, simply go to that radiochick. com. au. You're with Cheryl Lee. We're chatting today to Aussie legend Joe Camilleri. Welcome, Joe. Thanks for chatting with us today. I know you're a very busy man.

Joe Camilleri: 0:56

It's a pleasure, it's a real pleasure to talk to you again. We haven't spoken for a while.

Cheryl Lee: 1:01

No, we spoke last time in 2021 I think, just as we were sort of getting ourselves out of COVID and we spoke about your, which was your new album then, St George's Road.

Joe Camilleri: 1:14

Yes, St George's Road, and I had Rosary of Tears. I had a Bakelite Radio record out as well. It seems like yesterday, yet when I recorded that record it would have been about a year before the release. I'm just about to finish this new one. While I'm in the makings of it, it seems to be taking a lot more time than it used to take making records.

Cheryl Lee: 1:36

Does it. I wouldn't have thought, with all the technology it might have been a little bit quicker.

Joe Camilleri: 1:41

No, I think what happens is people they used to be one takers and then of course they had multi-tracks and then they worked on them a bit and now you can just keep going back. You can make a record on your phone. It's just one of those things I think people don't let go. Just getting vinyl takes six months. You can have a record finished. While I'm working on two records a Bakelite Radio record I've got two more mixes and that won't be up until probably April next year. So what's that? That's six months nearly seven months.

Joe Camilleri: 2:13

You could be sitting on a record three years before it's released. I've been questioning myself. You know these are just vanity records. You know you're making vanity records even though I don't believe I am, but you're write songs, you want to release them and record them. But you know, sometimes you think, oh, I've made enough people to buy your old stuff. On the other hand, you could be making new fans. It's hard. I just don't know where it lies anymore. I knew where it might in the 70s and 80s and 90s because there were record companies. There wasn't that many records out. You know you might be dealing with 200 records a week or something like that. From a record industry point of view. Now there's something like 60,000 albums a week. It's pretty hard to sort of deal with that sort of volume.

Cheryl Lee: 2:59

It's certainly a different animal now, the music industry, but I don't think retirement is in your vocabulary. And apart from working on the new record, you've also been touring, and you've just come to our wonderful town, the Bridgeway in Adelaide. Thank you very much. What a great night that was, that was great.

Joe Camilleri: 3:17

It was good on many different levels. I have fond memories of that gig, of the area, fond memories of Adelaide during the mid-70s, on a lot of different levels. And of course Wilber Wilde joined me on stage and that's always a treat. What I love about Wilber, he's got such a musical ear. You can throw anything at him, he'll just start playing and it'll just be pretty good. And it's kind of always nice with the two saxophones, a certain sound that we had that I don't think no one else has had that sound in this country anyway.

Cheryl Lee: 3:48

No, I was going to say that duelling saxophones. It was great to see you both up there playing off of each other.

Joe Camilleri: 3:54

Yeah, and we played differently to each other. I went to a different school of saxophone playing. Because I'm a singer, I tend to want to play this to a large degree until I become Picasso and I'm just flying all over the place. But I sort of normally play melody saxophone. He's more of a jazz player, so he can embellish things in a different way. He approaches this instrument from a different place and I think those two elements really kind of connect and that's why that sound exists, I think.

Cheryl Lee: 4:27

Yeah, it sort of bounce off of each other and it's created a great atmosphere. Everyone had such a great time.

Tommy Kaye: 4:35

You are listening to Still Rocking it. The podcast with Cheryl Lee.

Cheryl Lee: 4:41

Joe Camilleri's is great friend Wilber Wilde joined Jo Jo Zep and the Falcons back in 1977 as saxophonist and backing singer. Hard to believe we just saw them perform together 46 years later. Here's a song from that year, first track from Don't Waste it, their debut album, Security, originally written by Otis Redding.

Cheryl Lee: 7:57

And you know what I noticed afterwards? Because I was there giving out pamphlets for a Support Act South Australia event that we've got coming up there. I could see you at your merch table afterwards. You were so, so generous with your time. You have the patience of Job. You chatted to everybody and had photos with everybody. It was just so lovely to see you connecting with the audience. It was amazing.

Joe Camilleri: 8:25

Well, you know the audience. That's the main ingredient. You know that's the flour in the cake, it's everything, and so you have to respect the people that you're playing to. That's, you know, one-on-one, the whole concept behind merchandise. It's not about. Yeah, you know there's t-shirts, but really what you want to do is sell your music because that's the best way to sell the music to the people that are there. It's an opportunity, if you've got a new record out, to have a listen to this. You know this is some new things here that you might enjoy.

Joe Camilleri: 8:58

The hardest thing about the music business is that it was one of the first things to sink when things just changed. You know the way people bought their music. The record companies didn't catch on to it quick enough. You know, man, streaming now is they don't pay anything for your work, like it's 0.000%. We were sold down the river for a string of beads and they weren't even pearls. So the only opportunity bands and I've sold a lot of records in my time and St George's Road was one of the best records I ever made.

Cheryl Lee: 9:30

I love it. I've got it on vinyl. Yeah, it's beautiful.

Joe Camilleri: 9:32

It's a beautiful record. I'll never recoup the money that I spent on it, and I say that not because I want to recoup. I went into that project and into this project doing it because I want to do it. You know, I understand there's no return, but what I do want to be able to do is to encourage people to have a listen to something that's coming from me now, and there's a lot of artists doing exactly the same thing, you know. So you can sort of represent the fact that you're not just standing still. Yeah, I love my old stuff. I'm grateful that some of that music stuck. I really am.

Joe Camilleri: 10:09

You know the outlets for music is slim, you know. Plus, we're going through this incredible nostalgic time and I think COVID created this to some degree. I think cover bands do better than original bands, so it's flipped on itself really. You know you can get a cover band at the Bridgeway. You can have 1,300 people. I understand that. You know they're doing KISS and they're doing Queen and they're doing Elton John covers and stuff like that. They become a thing, you know. So original music is kind of being pushed over to the side.

Cheryl Lee: 10:43

So if there's no original music being made soon, the cover bands won't have anything to cover.

Joe Camilleri: 10:50

Well, that is true. You know, someone was telling me that the David Bowie early David Bowie style is coming back into folk, you know. So it goes with attitude, clothes, it goes with fashion. Then they trick it up a little bit, you know which is fine.

Joe Camilleri: 11:05

All I'm saying is that, to answer your question, which was about 10 minutes ago, of course you want to be nice to people. You know I am nice anyway, but they're paid to come and see you. They line up just to say hello and they buy something, whether they want to buy it because they want it or just to support you.

Cheryl Lee: 11:24

Well, I take my hat off to you, because not every artist does it and you did it and were very, very generous. I was lovely to see.

Joe Camilleri: 11:35

Well, thank you you know, but I do that all the time and if I'm going to go out there, I'm going to go out there with the spirit I go out when I play music. You take that spirit on stage and you kind of do that. I've got to put whatever my day is aside and just say we're here to play. Be the best you can be, Especially as I get older. I cherish every show. I don't necessarily like getting there sometimes, but I do.

Joe Camilleri: 12:03

Yeah, I'm OK with that. I had that time and I couldn't fly, but I'm OK with it. I still have to go through a certain routine. It's all about anxiety. It's all about how you feel. I notice that heat is something that brings on anxiety. If you're in an enclosed area, you know, if you're in a plane and the plane hasn't moved. I'd love to follow through this. You know, because I know that if you're in an elevator and it doesn't move, you panic. But if you can feel it move, you don't panic because you know it's going somewhere. And I think it's the same for me with flying If I know the plane is moving, then I feel that I'm going somewhere.

Joe Camilleri: 12:47

A couple of weeks ago we were in Western Australia. For some unknown reason, the plane didn't take off and all of a sudden I over heat. And then you become aware of it. So you just become aware of it. You have to go through your processes. You know it's a strange thing, but anyway, look, and everybody deals with their own versions of that. You know, I finally found a way many years ago to get across. As I said, you know, I'm normally in Europe this time of year. Yes, I've got to get there. If you don't get on the plane, you ain't going to get there.

Cheryl Lee: 13:22

You can't swim.

Joe Camilleri: 13:25

It's going to be a long walk.

Cheryl Lee: 13:29

When we last spoke to Joe Camilleri exactly two years ago this month, we played the title track of St George's Road, as mentioned beautiful album. So this time let's hear Chiquita another great song from a really great album. And back to speak some more with Jo Jo Zep, aka Joe Camilleri, after this.

Joe Camilleri: 17:04

I still love doing what I do. I think there lies the secret. You've got to want to do it, because if you don't want to do it, even though you're doing it, it just feels longer, harder.

Cheryl Lee: 17:18

I think that's saying where they say you know, love what you do, Be passionate and you'll never work a day in your life.

Joe Camilleri: 17:24

Yeah, I think that's pretty, you know, you can feel it. You know, after I saw you and I said goodbye to everybody and went backstage and packed up my stuff, you know, about 20 minutes later I'm feeling every bone in my body and it's swelling up, you know. So I've got my barnacles, that's just part of your thing, you know, because you've got to carry on. You know, I didn't do the Byron Bay Blues Festival. I had to cancel. On the day I had just finished doing a tour of Victoria regional areas. I woke up and I couldn't walk. You know, I had a bulging disc, you know, and that took me out for nearly three months, even though I was able to do a little bit of work. But that's only now that I'm sort of feeling pretty good. I had to play under the medication, which I didn't really enjoy, but for those first three weeks it was just. I don't know how people could do it. I don't know how people can survive. I couldn't get to the kitchen.

Cheryl Lee: 18:23

You keep on keeping on.

Joe Camilleri: 18:26

But you keep on. You know, as soon as I was able to and I'm trying I was called my manager.

Joe Camilleri: 18:30

I say I don't think I can do it. I can't walk to the door and I said I'm going to wake up in the morning and hopefully, if I can walk to the door and back three times, I'm going to get on the plane. He says you're not going anywhere, mate. I couldn't do it. I couldn't walk 20 metres. I was in a lot of pain there for a while. But you know there are people that are in a lot more pain and you sort of start getting an understanding of what happens. You can be 30 and have that. You can be any age.

Cheryl Lee: 19:01

It really makes you appreciate when you do have your good health.

Joe Camilleri: 19:05

Yeah, absolutely so. You know, and that's what I'm saying, sometimes the hard part is getting there, you know, because a gig is not just what you see. You've got to get to the airport, the equipment, you've got to get all that stuff, the hotels, the hotels. You know, hotels and airports are probably the most two horrible things that you can deal with.

Cheryl Lee: 19:29

The waiting.

Joe Camilleri: 19:31

Yeah, there's all that. There's just hanging around. You know Charlie Watts was right. You know, 60 years of playing, 55 years hanging around.

Cheryl Lee: 19:48

Let's have one from the Rolling Stones with the late great Charlie Watts. Paint it Black. Brian Jones brings the exotic stairs, but it's Charlie Watts that's the jittery heartbeat of this all-time favourite. Back to speak to our guest on the podcast today, Joe Camilleri shortly.

Cheryl Lee: 23:05

Yeah, we spoke about you've got a child with a birthday coming up, so you've got five children. Did I ask you last time, Joe, have any of the children followed you into the family business of music? Are they musical?

Joe Camilleri: 23:40

Well, they're musical. They've seen what I have to go through. I think they carry music and I think that's they're in fashion. M y youngest is 12. She's going to be 12 and she's a really good singer. But I'm pushing for something else. You know I'm doing this all the way because it's a lot of carnage. You know the show business.

Joe Camilleri: 24:02

Here's the thing that I, you know, and I've been very fortunate because I'm not the best saxophone player around, I'm not the best singer around, I'm not the best songwriter, I just do all these different things and there was a place in time where what I was doing happened to be something that people really wanted over that 30 year period. You know I'm writing better songs and singing better and playing better now, but at that time there was a certain kind of energy that was happening with the Falcons and then with the Black Sorrows, you know and sold many, many hundreds of thousands of records. I know that there were a lot of people that I thought had so much talent and just couldn't get arrested, they couldn't get the break that they needed. You know, there's no rhyme or reason for that and I feel it now. So I really do have this really great collection of songs, you know. But I used to sell 300, 400,000 records, 500,000 records of the same album, yeah, and now I'm only selling two or three thousand records and they're better records. There's a better understanding.

Joe Camilleri: 25:06

But you know, it's your time. I've had to some degree. I'm not saying that I might have some more of it, but I had my time. I had that wonderful time where I couldn't do no wrong in some ways. You know, not every song was a hit record, but I had so many songs in the top 20. I had, you know, gold records. I had gold singles. It feels like somewhere down the line, all the time just stopped and something else happened and I wasn't part of that. You know, I wasn't part of that new guard anymore, you know. I was part of the old guard, you know.

Cheryl Lee: 25:39

I have heard you say before that you've got popular by accident, but I'll be to differ and say there's a lot of bloody talent there and the X Factor. We just love, you know, watching you enjoying yourself so much on stage that it's infectious.

Joe Camilleri: 25:57

Yeah, I think that that's something I don't understand, but I mean, I do have fun. James Black put it in a way. So you know, I always want to play with you, Joe, because you don't want to be like the record, you want to be like a band playing at any given moment and there's something going on, I want to be part of what's going on and when it works and we go on this wonderful journey, you know, we're on this wave and we're riding this wave and whether the audience know the song or they don't, they'll come with you.

Cheryl Lee: 26:29

And James Black is a pretty busy boy too. Amongst other things, he's been on Rockw iz since 2005.

Joe Camilleri: 26:36

He said a lot of bands don't do that, they just play. They have a song list and they play from that songbook. I don't have a song list. I asked the band what are we going to do? What should we play? You know, this is what I do. I mean, it's a ritual now because I know that I'm not going to listen to what they're going to say anyway, so they'll say any weirdo thing. To a large degree, that's it's kind of the connection between me and you being the audience.

Cheryl Lee: 27:05

Yeah.

Joe Camilleri: 27:05

I'm trying to create some kind of soulful vibe that we can do this together in a way. You know it's not about how good you're seeing if the song's become a relevant to a degree. You know it's always nice to have the Harley and Roses. If you can carry people along, it's just a really beautiful. You can see I'm smiling, I'm having fun. Yeah, I'm having fun with it, I'm not. I'm not trying to ruin the song, I'm just trying to enhance it in a way. You know, this is how we do it today today, yes, it wasn't like this when we recorded it.

Joe Camilleri: 27:39

You know this is how we're doing it today. I've been fortunate enough that people have been able to pick up on that with me.

Cheryl Lee: 27:47

I think it's a shared energy. So you give us your energy and we, in turn, as the audience, as the punters, give our energy back to you and it sort of builds like a crescendo.

Joe Camilleri: 27:58

Yeah, well, that's right. If there's no reaction, there is no connection. Therefore, the music will suffer too.

Tommy Kaye: 28:05

You are listening to Still Rocking it. The podcast with Cheryl Lee.

Cheryl Lee: 28:10

Let's have that great song now that everybody loves to hear Joe Camilleri and the Black Sorrows, Harley and Rose.

Cheryl Lee: 31:52

he other side of it is that a good song is also just a good song, like I discovered since I spoke to you last time, a couple of people that have done some covers of your song, like I discovered, Elvis Costello, did So Young.

Joe Camilleri: 32:29

Yeah yeah, we were on his first tour of Australia the Falcons I had just written that song and he was very. The whole band were very generous. We were supporting them and they were very, very generous and he loved that song. Frankie Miller did a version of that song as well. You know I've had a few covers, but normally my songs seem to be. I've never heard anyone sing Chained to the Wheel or well, I have guess what, John Denver.

Cheryl Lee: 32:59

He's got three of your songs on his different directions album, including Chained to the Wheel and and Hold On To Me in the Chosen One. That was a surprise to me that's a surprise to me too.

Joe Camilleri: 33:12

But you know what they like. Sometimes people get. You know, people like Bob Marley and Paul McCartney get hundreds and hundreds of people, Bob Dylan, covering their songs.

Cheryl Lee: 33:23

Now we were to get on to some dates because you're still out and about for the rest of this month in October. So Queensland, Kings Beach, Sound Lounge, Savannah, in the Round, you're everywhere man, back to Victoria and all through till December when you're in Lizotte's yeah, well, I'm looking forward to that too, you know, because Brian is a beautiful host and it's a lovely place to play.

Joe Camilleri: 33:48

You know, you're always. It's like the Bridgeway there's a guy called Victor who runs oh yes. Victor, how's Victor? Yeah, he's gorgeous, gorgeous man you know loves his music. You know you want to hang out those guys. You know Brian Lizotte is very similar. You know a musician himself. They look after you in a certain way. They know what you need. They not that you need, but but they know how to make you feel comfortable and welcoming. That's always a really good thing.

Cheryl Lee: 34:18

Victor Marshall is a little bit of a legend in our town, and especially for someone so, so young yeah, well, he brought in a couple of posters from the Black Sorrows playing in Norway.

Joe Camilleri: 34:31

You know, I've never seen them. You know he said, I bought these online the Black Sorrows in Norway and in Sweden on an auction site or something like that, you know. So he does a lot of things and he knows a lot about Australian music. I thought our support band was really terrific. Yeah, I thought they were really good they were great, Mum's Favorite yeah, and he put that together. You know it's a really good band and I could see them doing good things and Victor put those two elements together.

Cheryl Lee: 35:00

You know it's good yeah, he genuinely loves music and he's a fan and he knows a lot of stuff, like you say, and he knows a lot of stuff.

Joe Camilleri: 35:09

Yeah, he knows a lot of stuff and, just like you, you know you know a lot of stuff and it's always good to talk to these people. That makes a big difference. I found myself talking to him about all kinds of different things, of Australian bands and different things.

Cheryl Lee: 35:25

You know he was across it he was, he's very knowledgeable so he's a good guy. Still Rockin' It podcast with That Radio Chick, Cheryl Lee. As I said before, a good song is a good song. And here is one of the other artists to play tribute to Joe Camilleri's fabulous songwriting John Denver, with Chained to the Wheel. Back to speak some more to Joe after this.

Cheryl Lee: 40:11

I was speaking to another friend of yours earlier today. Finally got to speak to Kevin Borich about his Duets album and you do a song with him on that.

Joe Camilleri: 40:21

Yeah. Yeah, that was really nice to do. I wasn't sure if he was going to like what I did, but he seemed to.

Cheryl Lee: 40:27

He does, I reckon.

Joe Camilleri: 40:29

Yeah, he said he loved it. You know, and I enjoyed doing it too. You know, this is what we're doing now we don't have to be in the same town. You know, you just send me the file, I'll sing on it and play on it.

Cheryl Lee: 40:41

We have the technology.

Joe Camilleri: 40:43

We've got the technology. I've known Kevin since from the late 60s. Once again he rang the bell. He was doing all kinds of different great things and two of the world, and I felt this record came together very well for him. He had some good songs and good duets you know it's a hard thing to do, that I reckon you know the concept's easy.

Cheryl Lee: 41:04

But but to pull it off. No, he's done a great job. I love who he's got playing on there. It's a great mixture To keep up to date with what Joe Camilleri is up to joecamilleri. com. au on the Google Internet.

Joe Camilleri: 41:17

Yeah, I think that's what it is. Yeah, and of course there's the Black Sorrows website as well, so do it. If you need to find me, you can find me. I'm not that hard. In fact, you know, at the supermarket someone said I said I know that voice. I said, oh, I'm sorry, I'm singing, I'm too happy. Oh, you know, we could be too happy.

Cheryl Lee: 41:40

That's right. Can't be too happy. So get on and see when the Black Sorrows and Joe are coming to your town. Queensland. You've got some beautiful spots up there, very generous, Don't you need a tambourine player?

Joe Camilleri: 41:54

You always need tambourine player? I'm there Always.

Cheryl Lee: 41:59

It's been lovely to speak to you, Joe. I'd better let you get going. You've got a big day tomorrow, so I appreciate you being so, so generous with your time.

Joe Camilleri: 42:07

It's an absolute pleasure and thank you.

Cheryl Lee: 42:16

Okay, here it is from his new duets album, Kevin Borich, with guest artist Joe Camilleri,