Honouring Bill Trotman | Making Sense of Trinidad's Biggest Stories

The passing of Bill Trotman is a reminder of why we must celebrate the people who shaped Trinidad and Tobago's culture while they're still with us.

In this week's commentary, I pay tribute to one of our great cultural icons and reflect on why preserving these stories matters. From there, we unpack some of the biggest issues affecting the country—from CARICOM and economic diversification to Nestlé's future in Trinidad and Tobago, government spending, public safety and the headlines that have dominated the week.

These episodes are simply a chance to slow down, look beyond the headlines and make sense of the issues shaping our country.

Topics covered:

• Honouring the life and legacy of Bill Trotman
• Remembering The Mighty Wanderer
• CARICOM and Trinidad & Tobago's role in the region
• Oil, gas and economic diversification
• Nestlé's strategic review and what it means for local dairy farmers
• Government spending and the national budget
• Public safety, politics and accountability

What are your thoughts on the issues discussed? Join the conversation in the comments.

Transcript

Corie 0:50

Celebrating the life of the great one.

SPEAKER_02 2:46

Music the move is a music.

Corie 2:53

Listen, the thing is, I hear you know, you know, you head, I hear you know, I hear in all you are hearing all the saying, a man of the loss his life, a man of the dead before we come back and do a slower episode.

Why The Solo Format Returns

Corie 3:03

Welcome back, thank you for tuning in. Some people might be seeing this format for the first time. Don't get confused. This is how the things start off, right? If you go back to episode one to about 200, you go here, is me alone I couldn't get a guess. But as I always say, something that I've missed the people who want Patreon. Thank you for everybody who pays and subscribes to the Patreon where you get early episodes, bonus episodes, behind the scenes content, and solo episodes. Or should I say, sign up for Patreon where it's really just a contribution to the cause because you're supposed to get all those things, but you don't get it often, you know. I mean, salute to the patronage, salute to everybody who supports on Patreon. Salute to everybody who's on YouTube. I see somebody the other day, I never even know like you could do that. You could send a contribution on YouTube, like pay something. So if you're enjoying it, pay something now happen. Mankind our bills to pay out here, you know. This thing is cheap to keep going, and I hope only enjoying it. Thanks for everybody, Diva's response to the podcast is overwhelming. The the interviews, I'm glad you all enjoyed it. I suppose if you're watching this by now, you probably watch. I know some old ears play catch-up, but this game is not ketchup, this game is keep up, right? And you're not gonna stop seeing episodes coming out, episodes are gonna come at a furious pace because I think we're right at about the point where we might be going to two of them a week. So if you enjoyed, I and I want to say just for some background, like the last three weeks we had Dr. Diva Amon, we had Lisa Ghani. You should be able to watch Kevin Sawyer by now. And that stretcher recordings that we did, I enjoyed. I enjoyed thoroughly. You know what I mean? Diva, Diva had the right name. Let me put it like that, right? But Diva, make we not just me, but plenty of people interested in what we don't deep down in you. I study things like this, so but D.Va did it first, and I mean Lisa is Lisa. I can't wait to record it. Lisa promised me that the next time we record, she's bringing champagne. I'm keeping her to that, I'm holding her to these things, right? I mean, pleasure, pleasure, pleasure sitting on and talking and recording with some of these people. But I do miss this format. And while it's difficult to make sure that I have the time in between research and edit and all those things to come and do this where for those of you who knew, all we really do is come here and talk about current affairs. You know, we talk about what happened during the course of the week, break down some issues that should be simpler, but people have it in their best interest sometimes to make some issues seem real complicated, to keep people in the wise words of Brigo walking in the dark, you know what I mean. It's in their best interest to do that. So we're gonna talk about it, right? But of course, as busy as it gets and as difficult as it is to do, they have some things that we started as traditions on this thing many, many, many years ago.

A Listener Meets Episode Two

Corie 5:44

Let me tell you a short story, right? You know, I was gonna tell all you what I do this week, right? I get my out my house now. These days I take a long walk in a morning and think I trying to get out. I mean the thing about recording all the time, right? And editing is you start to see when your face gain rosy wrong than rosy. It don't look good. So I say, you know what, let me do some exercising and thing. And much to my surprise, a bung on my walk, right? A man by the name of Y you shall I call his name Johan? I ain't gonna call him the last name, right? Let's pretend his name is Johan, right? We save the names of people to protect the innocent, or they say it in them documentary and thing. So fellas say, Boy, wow, see you here, you know what I mean? Nice to see you, nice to meet you. I actually now finished listening to your podcast. So, of course, I was like, Well, what episode you listen to? Like, you know what I mean? I think in Lisa Ghani, we had Diva, we had Anslam Douglas, such a great. He said, Nah, I went back and listened to episode two. I said, Alright, well, this is embarrassing. Because in my mind, I mean them thing though. I mean, I don't want to bad talk my own work because plenty of work went into all them things, and nothing better than starting something, right? But things are good at all. I was like, well, why you put yourself through that? And this is a man I'm watching who fit, this man fit. And I saying, but you so fit, and you listen to that boring thing while you're doing your run. But it reminded me of some things, and I said, But hey let me go back and hear where you are because he was reminding me that I was making a joke on episode two and saying, talking about meeting Wendy Fitzwilliam. It's so interesting to hear some of them things now because I guess you know you speak them things into being and you see it come true over the years. So to hear that from him, I was encouraged. Uh salute to Johan for taking the time to tell me that and and keep me updated on that as you know I mean is awkward because that was like episode two. I try to listen a little bit and I feel in shame now. Thank God I walk off when I play episode two because like boy, I put you on through a lot. But this is what the thing is about. We we love the interviews, we love hearing from people, but we have to talk about what has happened in the country, it's an important part of it. So, what I will do as I get back my cadence uh uh this I will keep on YouTube. Most of the time I do these solo episodes, I will keep it on Patreon behind a paywall. Number one to provide additional benefit for paid subscribers, but also because I just be frightened to talk in this in this climate. I don't know what you could say versus what you ain't gonna say, and what some people go take as a joke, and what people say as a threat. But I just I talk loose as a man, but I am joking. So somebody help me to get one of them things saying that um the thoughts, views, and opinions of the Corey Shepard help me to get one of them drops now. I need one of them drops to take to tell you that this is fiction, this is not real, you know. Corey Shepherd is a different entity and being and is a fictional character separate from Corey Shepard Barb. So if you well, I shouldn't give all your full name and thing for nobody to send no legal letter, but this is

Paying Homage To Bill Trotman

Corie 8:43

what we do. But as much as we find a struggle with the time to do it, we had to make time when these greats and these icons pass away because they have contributed so much to what we have become, what we enjoy today, what we what we have as a culture, and what I get to come and talk about and delude every week. And you know, the funny thing is like that, um, for those who don't know, Wrestling Priest is the great Bill Trotman, right? We swim to celebrate his life and what we just typically do around here. For the people who around here a long time, only bear with me, right? I'd explain to people what this is because they could be a little confused, right? But we just we we we pay homage. The time stops say homage, pay homage to the people who contribute to it and enjoy the music and enjoy the kaiso and them kind of thing. And as much as I frighten to talk, so I painting behind paywall because I warned you one time, right? You see this solo episode, I forget what I talk about and thinking, I cannot remember what I said, right? So asking me about what I say and I was wrong about this, and at a point in time, you used to get this every Tuesday morning without fail, regardless. So if I say something wrong this week, I could just correct that next week, you know. But I don't know if it is work so right now, but Bill Troutman is not one of those people who were fearful of talking. He was very direct, very outspoken. And I remember him doing an exhibition maybe last year. And I was thinking to myself, you know what, we should get Bill Trotman. You know, I mean he's talkative, you know, he could well he was always talkative, but he could talk. So one of my fears about bringing people here is I I always want to put the guests in the best light, right? Uh literally and figuratively. So affordable imports. Them fellas had the best light. But the best light in terms of how we plan for the episode, too. I wouldn't shy away from any topic. If you have things out there, we could talk. But as far as I can say, it's not that serious, you know. This is a we enjoy myself when we come here to talk. So I say, well, alright, I will go and I'll get Bill Trackman to come on. He's looking good. He just had an exhibition, so we have things to talk about. We can talk about his history and things, because he's contributed a lot to the tapestry of what we call the fabric of our culture. But have a real and only tell me if this makes sense or not, right? Tell me in the comments if I overthink in this or if only want to see this. I struggle with the idea of putting people on camera, especially these kind of camera affordable importy blemish. I wonder if you know when people might be up in age or they might be not the best of health. I kind of worry about putting them on camera like that, and then you put them on Instagram and you only go tell me if I'm overthinking that. Because over the weekend, coincidentally, I see Marshall Montano link up with Calypso Rose. And you know, she she sings his song Majesty Queen of the Road and was telling them much Marshall knows. I mean, he's a man who studied the history, both in UTT, Dr. Marshall Montano, well, Master's Marshall Montano, an honorary doctor, and also outside of the thing, he's a man who studied this thing, right? But she's telling them that day is his song that makes them change from Calypso King to Calypso Monarch. Because if you hear Sparrow and them talk about it, or you talk about people like Sparrow again, you talk about their victories, you hear them talk about the Calypso King competition. But when you have a woman there, she makes them change it to Calypso Monarch, a competition which has been over 50 years down the road and still have a lot of weight in our culture. And he's not hesitating to put her on camera. So I wonder if I overthinking it, you know what I mean? Am I overthinking it? Am I you know I mean uh but I I will do it if it's okay. I just don't want to do anything where the person is not looking, especially people like Calypso Rose or Sparrow, in this case Bill Trotman and when things like this happen, I wonder if I lose an opportunity is because of a maybe a narrow mindset for myself, you know, maybe they don't matter that much because as simple as Marshall capturing that little moment with Rose, because I'm sure that I mean after having seen how they operate, they must be f they was they might be on camera for a little while, but the fact that he pull out that little little piece where he's talking to her is because they themselves, he and his team, are conscious of the education that they're transferring to people. And um, I am very, very conscious of that, and I don't think it's anybody who have knowledge and stories and things like them. As much as we're capturing some of them. So Oli go tell me any comments, right? Oli go tell me if it makes sense. Because Bill Trotman is one of them that I feel as much as I'm happy to do this, I feel like slightly regretful that I didn't make that call and get him to come on. So we will talk some issues today, but the the music in this episode and the excerpts of this episode will all come from the great Bill Trotman. But it's some of the best music you go ever hear.

SPEAKER_02 14:18

I don't think I'm gonna be able to see that you I'll get outside but you and two me and I see me You like me, the anti two like me What I move me I like me like me I see I just played on the I could lead I see the I just played on the I look at some lead I see the I think I see the I think I'm gonna be able to do it.

Corie 15:37

I like to see I know that's the I know what to eat me when I am saying I'm pretty What do you gonna get more food or loving uncle You speak to me and you tooth speak to me But I don't know me And I see me better than you see me You like me and you tooth like me But I don't know me And I like me better than you love me I see I split me I was nicer than me I see I it's played I was nicer than me The man says who nicer than me damn right let me get into some issues of it now from the Guardian Camel's diplomatic coup there's something we've been following for a little while now, right?

CARICOM Drama And The CCJ Move

Corie 16:35

Because it I'm not sure what is the stance of Trinidad and Tobago where Carriecom is concerned, but we get some of it cleared up recently. So I written from the great Professor Hamid Ghani, one of the best professors in my days in Yui, one of the best professors I ever learned under these fellas on them not guessing, didn't know this stuff. They're well travelled, well read, and well published, you know what I mean? So he goes on to say from Professor Hamid Ghani. Last Tuesday, Prime Minister Kamla Pasadbi Sessor scored a major diplomatic coup at the CARICOM Heads of Government meeting in St. Lucia. Her proposal to use the Caribbean Court of Justice in its original jurisdiction under Article 212 of the revised Treaty of Chagaramas to provide an advisory opinion to the re-election of the Secretary General was a shot that no one saw coming. We gotta be that is a lot of words. Forget what it was like to be in Hamid Ghani class. The local, regional, and diasporic commentariat had vilified her for months over her principal position that the current Secretary General, Dr. Carla Barnett, was improperly reappointed back in February this year. She stuck to her guns and they stuck to theirs. Some of them even went so far as to say if she wants Shrindan to be able to leave CARICOM, then she should just go. The myopic approach, fighting for my life here, you know, their myopic approach in adopting the classic hegemonic culture of regional politics and never envisage a strategy of unity in disagreement. Here, you know, Hamid, Hamid, this is a lot. Why are we doing this? This is the most copyrighted. I should have known when I see Hamid Gardy was coming, you know. So here was the scene. Earlier in this year, whenever the last time we do a solo episode, I was talking about Camelot going to well, the honorable right camel Passad Bessel. Let me be careful what I say here. This is not Patreon, you know, about going to CARICOM. And basically, almost taking a position that Trendad and Tobago don't need CARICOM that much. And in summary, in my opinion, they look at it as if she was saying that, hey, we don't really need this, don't get twisted. We are still who we are. I'm not sure if that's true, but we are still who we are, and so on, and we have we have we have our own alignments now, and we will not align with anything if CARICOM have these initiatives and this viewpoint. It's time to change that, or we will be fine, you know what I mean? Which I suppose if if if everybody just be fine in the long run, I'm gonna put it like that. But one of the one of her major criticisms was the appointment of Dr. Carlo Barnett, and uh so now it's gonna go to the CCJ. Well, the agreement is that they're gonna use the CCJ to review it and see what is happening. Well, all of that has been undone with the master stroke of the letter of the PM of Trendar and Tobago or the letter that from the PM that had that laid out the case for accepting the impropriety and proposing that it be referred to the CCJ as an for an advice an advisory of opinion. The glum faces around the chairman PM Philip P of St. Lucia, when he read out the announcement of the referral, were a picture that told a thousand words of disappointment.

unknown 19:38

Dr.

Corie 19:39

Ghani, this letter is just in support of your premises. So having to concede on this matter was a major blow to the majority, who insisting that they were right, they underestimated Passad B. Cesar, who has served more time in opposition than in government. She understood clearly how to fight this battle, and she was able to show that as a minority of one, she could overcome their flawed majority decision, and she got them all to agree with her proposal. The opposition here had called upon regional leaders to resist any attempt by Passad B. Sessor to revive the matter. They ignored that call. She solved the problem. Uh and she solved the problem for the region. Alright, Dr. Ghani. So in summary, I wonder now if this is going to be reviewed. Because if you if your suggestion is that our independent body or the independent court, which is that is why it's there for review this, and they review and they said that, okay, it's proper, what do we do next? Or is it that when you review this and it's overturned, we back good friends with CARICOM, or we're still waiting on CARICOM decisions and where they're going to align and so on. The reason I keep paying attention to this issue with CARICOM, and I feel like, firstly, we should get people to write less complicated articles so that the average man can understand what it is they're reading when they're talking. And um and a balanced approach to it to say what the average person should be thinking is because the I think the average man home is not thinking about CARICOM in any major way, except when it's time for me to get work somewhere or time for time for me to travel somewhere. And uh that should not be the case because what happens with CARICOM, regardless of what people might say or where the rhetoric is now, it affects how we live here. So in my time, uh and I I talk about people like like Dr. Gandhi, people like Roger Hosign, people like Cookie Mehu. Because a lot of them were facilitators. Gandhi was undergrad, right? But when I was doing masters in the locker, they were the lecturers, etc.

Oil And Gas Dependency Explained

Corie 21:46

You know, people who who lecture in any space. Back then, and I'm talking about 2004, 5, 6, right? The discussion was a wrong trend to be a runner with oil and gas at some point in time. The year that they were talking about was around 2020. And we would not be able to produce at the levels we produced at ever again because oil and gas is a finite resource. The last time I checked, right? And I listened to them talk about this, and I listened to a lot of people talk about diversification. And the whole idea behind diversification, like any other like in personal life and household life, so whether micro or macro, diversification is just not putting all your egg in one basket, right? That's all it is at the end of the day. So that if rain starts to fall, so you have protection on this side. You know, it diversify your portfolio. So the idea behind diversification is that as a country, when you look at a bar chart of where Trinidad earns its money, Trinidad and Tobago, I want to tell you all the money is from oil and gas. Because under Roger Hussein, I mean I'm young and in academics for the first time. So I see in this thing, and it is shocking and jarring to see. Because there's a huge bar chart when they look at oil and gas and all byproducts of petrochemicals, right? And then the closest thing to it back then, I'm talking about 20 years ago, right? The closest thing to it was light manufacturing and food and beverage and those things, right? So when I look at the scholars, the best and brightest we have in the country, saying that, hey, we're gonna run out of this resource that we're so dependent on, because the oil and gas revenue is what allows us to live the lifestyles we live in, Trendada and Tobago. You could eat and get diabetes how much ever you want, and foot cut off for free. You know what I mean? We have a public healthcare system that is open and available to anybody, could walk in with any ailment, affliction, any concern, you could go in a public healthcare system. You could get free education all the way up to secondary level and advanced secondary in terms of A-levels. But it could also get free education in tertiary all the way up to PhD if you qualify. Because if you could prove that you can't afford it, you could still apply and get government funding for it, right? We get food cards, we get all these different types of things, we get uh a carnival that is heavily funded by the government. We get several religious festivals that the government contributes. Well, let me say the taxpayer, right? The taxpayer contributes to. So we live a lifestyle and then we get roads and infrastructure and all these different things that we drive on and have a good time. And if you travel to other countries, you're going to see, you see the differences between countries that are earning proper money and countries that not. So when you go to the countries that you will come up playing in now, you go to you go to the US or you go to Canada as two examples, right? You're gonna see a certain level of infrastructure and a standard and quality of life. A lot of it is hinged upon how much the country earns. Now, when they line up their industry and you watch their bar chart or their industries and you watch their bar chart, you might see several bar charts that all different height, right? But they have again a very, very diversified income stream, and we don't. We have basically one income stream, and is you when you have an income stream that is so it's strong, because petrochemicals ain't going nowhere. Remember pinning that statement, right? Petrochemicals seem to be not going anywhere. But I talking to some fellas the other day, and the amongst the people I hear now talking about switching to electric cars, for instance, you could see where the demand for oil and gas could shift, right? But when you have so much of your egg in the one basket, if that basket falls and them eggs break, we have a sharp fall off on quality of life and standard of living and what we think is normal here, that I'm not sure if we prepared for. I don't know if we prepared for it as a society. We believe that the government owe we something. And it is it comes down to that oil and gas dependency, that whole idea of Dutch disease, they used to call it, right? We feel like you should be able to walk any hospital and things should be built in the broad that's a fix. And we used to talk about things like if they have no, there's no budget for it, there's no limited income. So as far as we're concerned, the government is our uh, well, number one, separate from the taxpayer. In other words, we don't connect how much we pay in our month as tax to what the government has. We don't make them two connections at all. We also believe that the government, in which and when I say government, mean mean political party. We we think that the governments of Trinidad and Tobago have unlimited funds. And if they're not fixing the road, they're wicked and they don't like people in this area. And if they're not cutting the grass, they're wicked, they don't like people. They're only fixing them areas and they're not fixing. None of that works that way. You have a finite amount of money. I saw Mariano Brown talking the other day about um the government being more accountable to the people for its drawdowns and the heritage and stabilization fund. And again, a very learned, but these fellas and them, they're not guessing. They don't know what they're not, they don't they know what they say. They say it in a very complicated way. And for somebody like me who can't read so well, it's very hard to decipher. But he's right. We had a heavy we have a heritage and stabilization fund, which basically worked in our way at its most basic level, we set our budget every year, pegged on some kind of oil price, right? And per barrel. And when we say, all right, we expect in our oil price as $60 a barrel, we budget out what we need to do. It has two kinds of basic expenses, right? There's recurrent expenditure, like you had to pay people every month, and then it's our capital expenditure, like you had to build buildings and build hospitals and stadiums and so on. None of which you will use, of course, but you had to build them, right? So when you set your budget at $60 a barrel, and you watch how much barrel you have, you multiply the total amount of barrel you have by the $60, and you see what's your total amount of money you go have this year. And when you have that total amount for this year, this is what we're making decisions on. So when they say this goes into the Ministry of Health, $2 billion, so this going to Tobago, this going to national security, is that pool of money that they're splitting up that they expect to earn over the course of the year? So let me talk about your personal budget here, right? When last you budget, I can tell you, I just budget zero for food drop every month. Nothing. I say, food drop does not arise. And then when I see the food drop bill, I'm upset because I only making it to the 15th, 16th of the month these times. Remember to subscribe to our Patreon and do the YouTube thing. Where I don't even know why you call it the donations, donations according to Dr. Umar. Donations on YouTube, right? We accepting that because the 15th of the month, if you're only making it to the 15th, is rough times, rough times. So when you look at the lifestyle that we get accustomed to and the total, that total budget, the the government of the day trying to manage that budget, just like how we manage our household budget to see, we're going, so we're going, so we're going, so we're going. So because we had to keep these people happy, keep them living the lifestyle they're living. And hopefully, because of that, they say we're governing real good and they re-elect we and we're here, right? But that's a very, very difficult to do. Because every difficult thing to do, every dollar you take from somewhere, you're a dollar short. I don't know if we ever look at it like as I guarantee you, the average man thinks that the government has billions of dollars, and anything that they're not fixing is because they're wicked. Talk to people, you go find out, right? And I don't, if you have a degree, you're not the average man, and let me take that out of the equation. You're in about 20% of our society like this, if that, right? So when I look at that approach to budgeting, you might say, alright, well, that means we have let me talk about your household. You have a $20 for the month, bam. But every time you do something in that household that was not catered for in that budget, it affects something else you could do. So when I food drop down the place, something had to not get paid. Usually in this case, unfortunately, is me. Because at this point in my life, what it affects is my savings and those types of things and my investment. I don't take it seriously enough by any stretch of the imagination. Imagine you're living well, you you just have enough money to pay your rent and buy groceries. That is all you have, right? And your rent due the first of the month, so your last month and pay. You could take the money and pay your rent. Your rent might be. Let's say your rent is $2,500, right? You take the $2,500 and then your groceries coming up to $1,000, $3,500. And let's say your household income is $3,500. That means your money done. It's over. You don't have any more money. Now you could only figure out two things from the you could either reduce the amount you're paying in rent, which is almost impossible to do in the short run. You can't go and tell your landlord or I'll go pay a little less rent. I go change my rent to $2,200 to let it work so your rent's stuck. But if your groceries now, if your groceries are thousands, you could say, well, alright, well, I go eat a little less. I'll figure out how to eat less. You know what I mean? I'll stop wash clothes with breeze, I'll go wash clothes with lime. Whatever it is you have to do, you could adjust that figure because that variable figure there on a monthly, you could see some of that. Something major comes and happen, you know what I mean? You say, Boy, listen, you go on thing, you twist your foot, you're going. We could run any public hospital if that happened. So I could live with the 3500, and if something happened to me, put a spank. But if that facility is taken away, your 3500 now gets smaller because if something happens to you and you have to pay a doctor every time you go into the hospital, like some societies, you have a problem. Or you have to have an insurance card before they lay in, you have a problem. So we we we might see our own budgets as finite, but somehow see the government budget as infinite, and it's not. So when I have my 3500, the other option I have other than adjusting my lifestyle and reducing my cost of living is to earn more money. Now, in some societies or with some individuals, you might be included in this, I might be included in this. My way of earning more money, I automatically think of what else can I do? Podcast is one, I'm as a bust on my average, you know what I mean? But I could all talk, you know. So I saw talk for one thing and I guess sponsor it ain't what yes, but we get into. But I automatically think of alright, what else can I do? Where am I of value? What other skill I have? In other words, I could pick up another job, I could try and start another business, I could go any business I have and try and sell more products, whatever it might be, because now I'd adjust $3,500, I had to make my income into $4,500 to get to whatever it is I want. That is how we might think as individuals. I want you to appreciate that they also have people who say, my $3,500 is not working for me no more, pay me more money because I can't live and I need more money, and your money is infinite. And if you do pay me more money and I can't live, you are wicked. That is a I I mean I'm trying to stop saying that it's a trend begonian thing because that's probably a human thing. But I want you to appreciate that that is what is being said in society a lot. When I say I have basically worked and been doing the same job for the last 30 years, but I deserve more money for that job because the prices have gone up and I must now keep up with that. I don't know that if the price of the thing is gone up, that automatically means that the business makes more money. The business probably ain't make if anything, the business could be making less. But sometimes the attitude is like, pay me more. I show up here every day, it costs me this to show up every day, taxi fare gone up, pay me more. And in the private sector, you might get that, right? You might get it a little more. People might say, Alright, well, boy, listen, you think I'm a little more traveling. But I want to tell you that at some point in the private sector, you will go home. It's brutal, but it's true. At some point in the private sector, the man who owns the business go say, boy, you know, I I could only afford to pay two people. I can't keep four people. I can't keep four. I have a have an interview coming out with a man here in some time. It will be gonna take a little while. But I really like talking to entrepreneurs by the stable. I like talking to entrepreneurs because he said during COVID, he started sell just to keep his staff. He talks about how much vehicles he had, panel vans, and think he sells the panel vans. He does all it nobody they're not feeling sorry for you. Nobody feels they just feel when you hear him and you hear the name, he just say, matter of fact, a man put him in a song, he said, I was rich like Chandler. You just think that the man has money, and and with the money he could do whatever he wants, and his resources are infinite. We think that's about business people. You hear it all the time. That man has real money. He's driving a nice car, he lives in a nice area, he has real money. Why he can't pay me my and and and the attitude is that pay me more, even though I have done nothing more. It's easier to understand on an individual level or at the level of a household. I just want you to appreciate that it when you break it down, it's not much different at governmental level. Because the government has to do things to make money. One of the ways that the government is making money is to take ours, you know what I mean? Let's just take it. Render on the season. One of the main income streams of our government is to take 25% of your things or 30% of your things if you have a business, and then 25% of where you pay yourself, and then we use some, they put everything in in the car and then they say benefit in kind, so they will withdraw from the society. And it's fair taxation, I feel to be without, I don't know where's the better system. I'm not talking about the rate of tax and what they do with the tax dollars. I'm just saying that from a societal standpoint. There was a learned from Hamid Ghani and them back in the day, men like John Laguerre and Hamid Ghani and so on. And uh Dr. Bisessa was our name, too. As a society, it's our things we need. We need a road, we need lighting and them kind of things. So I okay as a society are taking a portion of whatever I earn and putting it towards a pool of money where everybody could do a little better off, right? So that's one of the ways the government's good. But also the government is earn money from selling things. So think of it like this, right? If individual income tax is 25%, the only way for the government to earn more money from income tax is for you, the individual, to make more money. Because if you're making 10,000, I could take 2,500 from you. But if you make 100,000, I could take 25,000 at the simplest level, right? So now I could get more money to fix more problems because basic economics will tell you problems are infinite, needs and wants and all them things, need, want, opportunity, problem, all them things is the same thing, and all of them infinite. But resources are finite, resources are, a matter of fact, very limited. So when you look at the individual who might go on the picket line and say, pay me more money because the cost of living is going up, and I don't care. It's not my concern if you make more money or what. I want more money, and I'm not coming to work unless I get that more money. I mean, it's I understand it, I understand it. But I just want you to appreciate that when the government had to make a decision now to pay people more money, and they're not getting anything else out of that. Because, like I tell you, if I want more money, I start a lecture, I start a podcast, let me see if that makes money. Right now, I'm looking to start our OnlyFans and you ready to go in here and say, well, I'm not trying to lose anytime I lose weight, as I have my Instagram baddy immediately. Let me see, let me see if I'll get some influencer money. But when you pay people and you do do more things, that means nothing else is produced. There's nothing else made. So the it's like, where the extra money is going to come from to pay you? Maybe I could tax people more. You know, maybe that is one of the options because when you're not doing anything more to help us as a society, to help the government make more money. And then if if in if since 2004, 5-6 the experts saying that we're gonna run out of oil and gas, the biggest buy in my bar chart, going and start to chop down, right? Then the question begs, we're going to earn less but pay people more. Think of it from a household standpoint. From a household, the household was making 10 grand. Right? I go to work today, my madam gets a pay cut by a thousand, I get a pay cut. So now the household making eight grand. And out of that ten grand, I was giving my children a thousand dollars a month as insurance, uh, what do you call that thing now, allowance? Would it be reasonable to when my pay get cut to give that child more? Maybe it is. But if you if now you go from a thousand to two thousand after your pay going down to eight thousand, that means you only have six thousand dollars left to run the household. So something have to adjust, some part of your lifestyle have to adjust. It is the reality. It is very, very difficult to adjust lifestyle on a micro level when it's just me and you talking. On a societal level, boy, it's very if it's hard on a micro level, think of it when it's millions of people or 1.5 million, very, very difficult. So I think the government of today is facing a reality. And now that we want to say of today, the government for the la because if I know in lockjack, and me, I don't know a thing, if I get a little, this episode getting chaotic. If I get a little not in lockjack 20 something years ago, these fellas know that 30 years ago, right? It's the best and brightest, as I say. So if they know this and they see in that bachard going long and don't and don't and dung, I would think that listen, number one, we had to sensitize society to where it is. They didn't like him birth on them, and they didn't like them fellas, but them fellas was doing our work to do that because he was basically saying, hey, we can't continue like this. This gate had to cut. Gate being um what is it called? Government assistance to tertiary education, uh, the food card thing that had to go, the laptop thing that had to go. So the government trying to say, I can't get a law once of a thousand again, my money going down. But society doesn't accept that well, and the likely outcome of that is it gets voted out. You know what I mean? It gets chased away into the darkness. Nobody don't want to hear from you again. That is it. Bye. Punto final. Nice knowing you.

Diversification And Regional Markets

Corie 40:14

So back to the whole idea of diversification, what the hell all this had to do with CARICOM. The thing is, when you look at, if you remove, which Roger Hossein has a to me a really good lecturer, removed the bar that was oil and gas and showed us the rest of the economy and what we earn. And I say it was food and beverage and light manufacturing. Right? I think then it's an important thing to look at those other areas and say, okay, which one of these can I support to get that bar as high, at least as the fall off of the oil and gas bar, and then really have a diversified economy. But people have been arguing this since I know myself. If I born 80, and people arguing this thing. I've meet a Dax Driver, who was the head of the energy chamber one time. He makes a lot of sense too, because he was talking about thing in the used to see just in POB and called comparative and absolute advantage and all of that. And he basically said natural and tobacco don't have an advantage in the region when it comes to the production, well, the finding all the way down to the production of oil and gas products. And he's saying to diversify the economy is not to diversify away from oil and gas, but he's saying to diversify within oil and gas. And he was always pushing this idea that okay, so we do exploration and we find crude. And I still talk about crude because I'm born a long time, right? But it's mostly gas these days. But we do we do exploration and we find crude, and then we do we we could also do refining and make petroleum, jelly, and so on, or whatever the hell he's doing a refinery. And he was basically saying to have so many things that you could do, and he, in a sense, he's right. Because now where Guyana is the oil and gas giant in the region now. If not yet, the en route. I feel it on there already because we're looking like we flounder in a little bit, you know. But the thing about it is we provide a lot of services and a lot of labor for the Guyanese market now because we've just been in the industry for longer. We're in the industry since the 70s. So that whole idea of having an advantage, and his thing is focus on your advantages. You know what I mean? Like how Argentina focusing on your referees being their advantage, focus on your advantages, and that's where we are. If you want to look at that argument differently or look at the people who say broaden it because we too we're getting even more deep in oil and gas. So if it disappears with alternative energy sources and so on coming on stream, and you want to look at the others, if you're looking at light manufacturing and food and beverage, when he managed to batch out for the oil and gas, I think at that point in time it was 80-something percent of the products that we had was being sent to the US. When you look at the other things that we have, it was 80 something percent being sent to CARICOM. So if you travel throughout the region, you would see, and it's something that that I feel proud of. I mean, and and it's be a bone of a contention up CARICOM, which I mean, I wish we would figure out how to live together and enjoy one another company. We should be, instead of arguing if double's better than patty, we should just be so glad that we live in a region where we could get both chicken versus curry chicken and chicken curry. I find some of the most stupid arguments I ever hear in my life. Like, enjoy everything the Caribbean have to all four. So when I look at our light manufacturing or that food and beverage, and I look at CARICOM being our biggest market, I was a little worried when we when we take in statements to CARICOM that say, hey, we we we embung for you. We go thing and we this so I'm I'm I'm happy when I see statements that read more like we are committed to CARICOM and we remain a vested partner. I guess I and I I am always for diplomacy. Yeah, I you see this new world where world leaders just say wild things on Twitter and think, I'm not accustomed to this. Let me whisper. I'm not accustomed to this. Me a little bit. I can't um I can't get with that. I I find that that is a very risky thing, and I I I I expect more of the people who are in power. I think if you're in power and we vote for you and we put you there and stuff, I expect your conduct to be different. So I was even looking at this. Uh there's a there's a there's a situation brewing between Suzette Lowe and Philip Alexander. Two, well, I was gonna say two political activists, but no, I mean one political activist and one out on out politician, you know what I mean? Minister any ministry of labor. You know what I mean? This would be the right honourable and all these things come in, you know. So, and and and some of the things that I see being said is that they both of them just be too outlandish and this one to say thing, and why they why they're coming down on him and they're not coming down on her because she doesn't say, and maybe that is true. I I find both of them is talking loose, but my expectation of one is much higher than my expectation of the other. Because when you say armchair, backseat driver politician, I always believe, and maybe naively so that you could talk and say whatever you want, that will work against you anyway, but maybe it's working for you now. But when you are a sitting man in the government, right, as a minister in the ministry of housing, and that 25% I take in, or they're taking from me, like my 25% that they're taking from me every month, plus my 30% that they take at the end of every year. And that going towards a pool of money, and that pool of money now, which makes the national budget. Some of that national budget going towards the Ministry of Housing. So you are charged with the responsibility of what to do with my portion of that 25%. My expectation of you is higher. I expect you to be more measured, more contained, more diplomatic, more forthcoming, more, you know, hardworking, more focused on issues. It's like I looking at our situation now where I watch an I watch in our government every day. And I I this used to really bother me back in 20 um no, 2016, I think. When when when boy listen when Rollers and the gang had get back in power the last time, I don't think anything used to irk me more than them talking about UNC or the partnership or what. I was like, listen, they lose. They lose. You beat them. I I find when you beat people, you probably shouldn't even mention them name again. Nobody don't want to hear about them, they lost. Whatever reason we put you back there, we don't want to hear about them again. We fed up with them, them gone. Focus on where it is with governance. And boy, fast forward to today, I trying to read the news and things, but I can't tell it. We have a whole government and I can't tell it the last time I hear them say anything about governance. It's insane. You know what I mean? I don't know what is going on. They're just saying all kinds of random things and picking fights with people. But when I look going back to that diversification, when I look at what CARICOM means to us in terms of market, and when I say us, I mean a businessman, you trying to make something here and sell, and you only have 1.5 million people here who could buy something. I would think that you want to sell to more than 1.5 million people to increase the amount of revenue you're making, which in turn increases the amount of that 30% that the government could collect. And that 30% could fix more road, you know, do more blogs, pay more Instagram influencers, people in Wassa, it could do all other things. So I would think that you rele want people to boost where they reach. And that's one of the that's one of the rules of governments or or even diplomacy in government to make relations from country to country to make sure that we have markets. So I I always wonder how the the biggest businesses in this country, the biggest manufacturers, feel about the rhetoric towards CARICOM and where we are. But I mean, maybe without without going into too much detail on things that happen now so that I could maintain my freedom. I wonder how the biggest business people feel in at all when the biggest manufacturers, you know what I mean? Lock up and all anything. But again, thing that me and one of part of and want to talk about. But as I say, I really here to celebrate the life and times of the great Bill Troutman. And as much as I enjoy being here talking about things like this, I think it's about things more I enjoy than Kaisona. And this is a quest, a song by the great Bill Truckman called maybe aptly named for this segment, Stupid Questions. As we continue to celebrate the life of the great Bill Trotnon, stay

Nestle’s Exit Fears For Dairy

Corie 50:58

with me. Talking manufacturing still with Nestle's future operations in the balance, dairy farmers hope government steps in to help. This from Shaliza Hassan Ali and the Guardian. Dairy farmer John Leonard is hoping the government comes up with a solution to keep them gainful, all gainfully employed after Nestle announced it had begun a strategic review of its operation in Trendar and Tobago, including exploring the possible sale of its dairy and juices business. Now, Nestle has been making changes for some years now, right? Nestle, I see Nestle reorganizing for some time. I remember when you used to play sports back in the day, all of them my new tongue boys and the gay uh Milo. Milo used to sponsor all these sports on them. And it's heavy sugar in that cuckoo, whatever the hell they used to make Milo with it. It's sweet bad. The other day I drink a Milo from my son. I used to say but it's one of the worst things I ever tasted. You know what I mean? Because we accustomed to heavy. We used to drink Milo syrup. So they've been making adjustments and changing over the years. But no, I mean Nestle is still definitely in the dairy business. But if they're gonna stop dairy manufacturing in Trinidad, I don't know that all of a sudden the market is gonna lose its taste for milk. So I'm assuming that it means they will get their dairy somewhere else, manufacture somewhere else, and export to Trinidad. Uh being a manufacturer here, you're supporting because as a business, and I think there's a general contempt sometimes we have for businesses and business people that I'm not sure that I understand, but maybe I'm the wrong side or the right side of the fence. But a business shutting down is a very sad thing. Like I we work for Unilever, I see Unilever still operating and still operating as a high level, but not the level they were at in terms of manufacturing and stuff. And this is years ago. All this affected by the same oil and gas. So I will get back to that. But when a business set up here, it's plenty of things had to happen for our business to operate because where they where they were getting milk from to manufacture, where they were getting fruits in terms of manufacturing the juices and so on, or the sugar from. So think about it. Some years ago, we wisely or otherwise showed only the the the sugar, what do you call it thing now? Usine St. Madeleine, where we used to call it again, currently 1975 Limited. We've seen this, we've seen like some of these things, not um like if he was paying attention, he'd see where some of these things go in. I'm gonna put it like that, right? But Leonard, let me go back to Leonard here. For years, Leonard said Nestle did not support and encourage farmers to make the industry viable. As far as I'm concerned, they can pack up and go from here. We don't need them. If you can't do better, pack up and go. Leonard, you're coming out hard. They have to pack up and go if they cannot take the farmers' milk. If you want somebody else, if you want to get somebody else and sell over the company to somebody else, it's better. Give each farmer a million dollars and we'll go handle his story. Yeah, Leonard, that's gonna happen. Uh Nestle is a Swiss multinational food and drink money uh processing company with a subsidiary in Val saying the company has been operating in TNT for more than 60 years. The unexpected announcement of the dairies, uh dairy plant sale has been met with mixed reaction among farmers who have supplied and sold raw milk to Nestle for decades. Prime Minister Kamala Pasabisessa has directed two ministers to meet with Nestle's representatives to work on the matter. With the company going on the market, with the company going on the market, well, meaning they're selling the company, 200 jobs could be lost. As a second-generation farmer, Leonard Simte said the news was disturbing. He says not a nice feeling. I mean, my heart reach out to him because the thing about it is you see, when you set up business, the farm is a business for him, right? He has his cows and he's getting milk and you have a guaranteed market once you have Nestle here doing processing. If Nestle comes and announced that they're gonna shut this thing down, you've set up your business to supply Nestle and they're no longer there. And there might not be anybody else to sell all this milk to. So, as anybody else, you're worried about your future. Now you're seeing a real situation here where that 10,000 you're making every month could go down to 8,000 because now what you gotta do is sell milk one-one. They're not they're not set up to do that. They might still sell milk one-one, but we'll never replace the demand for a company like Nestle. Now the hope is that another who is another major manufacturer in milk in the wheelboy meaning, but whoever is Nestle competitor, hopefully they buy the processing plant if that is what it is, and pick up from there, and then Leonard is unaffected. But how likely is that? He said, now he says, now his son is also stepping into the family business, continuing the tradition. He estimated that his family has invested five million in pens, tractors, milking machines, and equipment for his farm. He says, again, it's no little bit of cows we have. This is what sends us to school. There's a real situation. He said, but in the impending sale of the plant, Leonard said the future is bleak. Because now you had to figure out when you set up to supply a company like Nestle. I glad he said the way he says too it's not no little bit of cows. You we sometimes picture these things and you watch a farmer like some rinky dink operation. A farmer is a it's a business, and it could be a very big business if you're doing it at scale, and you have to do it at scale to supply somebody like Nestle. We live on an island and nothing to live here but by plane and by boat. So it's not like he could easily now say, Well, alright, well, I will sell my milk. You know, I mean in a big country like the states or in big land masses like Europe, you might be able to make a deal with a neighbour. You might have a neighbouring country that you could carry a thing to and sell it over there, but when you're on an island, you have a problem. Go back to my last part where I was talking about CARICOM being the biggest market we in. If Leonard could send any milk up the road, we have a good thing. But if the prime ministers here and the prime ministers up the road in Gain along because CARICOM is a trading arrangement, a part of the thing is they go treat us favorably or treat your partners favorably who within the region. So, what happens to Leonard and his milk? And how does what does any of this have to do with oil and gas? We've seen it over and over. And maybe I read about it in textbooks and them kind of thing when we had the oil boom in the 70s and then in the 80s, we born in a um according to Ozzy Merrick, great Ozzy Merrick, say you know they call it boom generation when they were talking about um Rapso back in the day, and and they had home front and thing called the boom generation. Well, we use the recession generation, the ones who born in the 80s, we know what the recession is. We know why it's negatively list, and you can't bring in this and you can't bring in that. That's that's that's what we grew up on. We knew what that was, and we I think we're living through that now, and we will live through it as children, some of us, and we know what it is because what had mattered to me then was Kellogg's frosted flake and them thing. But as adults now, who are to make decisions on behalf of families, I think we're feeling the pinch of what this society is. Because when you have an oil and gas advantage, right? And you have people who like Nestle who want to they they want to have business in this region, right? They want to they want to they they realize that all right, this region has seven million people. I mean, and if you're if if that's just English speaking, it could be double plus if you add the other languages in the region, and then we're right close to South America too. You know, we could do a deal with them. And for Nestle, they want all the markets in the world, they want the whole world drinking their milk, right? They have a choice to make now. Well, boy, we're gonna need a processing plant, we're gonna need somewhere to set up together. So we go do it. And they say, well, one they need to be able to do it. What's the thing that will cause you to do it? He said, Well, boy, you know, we're gonna need some cows. Because we want to import milk from nowhere. We want a place where have an industry for farming, right? We want to do that. You know, they had our dairy. And then they start to look around now for places to go. They say, Well, you need it, say, well, boy, the construction, we need that as a project, that is a one-off and thing, so we could get that done, we could bring in new people to do that. They say, Alright, cool. What about running the plant, boy? How are you fueling that? They say, well, boy, we need this amount of gas, this amount of that, this amount, because that had to happen. So when they're going around looking for places, we as a country, turn that on to bagel, we don't have no advantage over people in this region when it comes to farming. When it comes to farming, check Guyana, check maybe Jamaica. But we don't have we have a very small and limited amount of land. It was island small. But one of the things that we do have is oil and gas. So when we go now and Nestle come here and they say, Boy, we want to set up things in the region. I want to meet with six earlier, because six earlier have different things, or they have plenty of land long there, or they have things, or they have this, or they have that. One of the reasons that Trendad and Tobago end up with our manufacturing sector, and thank God we had something that was able to match that bar chart, right? Is because the powers that be the best, the best and the brightest, right? And I talk about the Eric Williams these days and the and the and the um the Robbie and them fellas and them, that that that era, 70s, 80s governance. We're talking about here. They go to somebody like Nestle and say, hey, just think of think of the World Cup, right? The way FIFA is work. FIFA this song and like a hife and say, alright, what you go do for me? What you gonna do for me? All you want to host the World Cup, what shall we all do for I? And then everybody say, Well, here what? We are six stadiums. This stadium is this, this city is that, Philadelphia city, brother Lila, and then we are New Jersey. Here we go partner with Mexico too. And we go, girl, Guadalajara, some of the most iconic things, remember 86 and they put together what they call a bid package. Is the same thing go happen with big companies like Nestle? You put together a package now, and you are Trinidad and Tobago, you go in in this meeting now, you hear Brazil now do the presentation. This one people want the plant. Because if I could bring the plant here, I could create 200 jobs, I could get my milk from right here, possibly have a lower cost of milk to people. I gonna get re-elected, right? So, from a governance standpoint, I had to make this thing happen. That we're here for. So I go in in that meeting, breezy, breezy. I cool. That's one of my easiest presentations if I'm turning that on to baby. Because when I go in there, I say, here, what is this seed? Them fellas and them have land them all to the call and all them kind of thing, me bong for that. So here I gain you. You see the gas store on your plant where I know it's one of the biggest expenses you have. I gain you that free for the first year and a half. And I gain you preferential prices. You're gonna subsidize the gas price. And then they will say, Wow, because that's one of the biggest expenses they have, right? They say, What? You could do that for us. It's like, yeah, oh, nobody's surprised by this. Because that's why we end up on the list to bid in the first place. But they say, You'll do that. They say, Yeah, so what? I'll give you a tax break for this amount of time, I will give you gas at a subsidized price or a thing. I hand you that. Bow. But they say, But yeah, no cow. How we go get milk? I say, you don't worry yourself. I'm gonna buy a whole bunch of cow seedlings. How cows this grow? I'm gonna buy a whole bunch of cow and bring them in from things. You see the same place with them promising the thing, the man who now leave heating there from Brazil, I'm gonna buy cow from him. Import because I remember oil and gas money. So I could give you a preferential or favorable price on oil and gas. But I could also take the earnings that I have from oil and gas as because we're earning a lot as a country on the taxes on oil and gas revenue. And I could say, well, here what? I go, I go import some cover, I'll give you some Brazilian cow. I say, What kind of Spanish? What kind of you know? I will bring in. And when I but they say, but you have no farmers. Fair not. I go and start a whole program called the blah blah blah blah blah farming program, right? And I go and teach people how to farm. I go uh ask Leonard where he gets in the farming business, right? Ask him how we know about farming. The government would have come and say, hey what? Anybody interested in farming? And then they go and say, but here what? You go up, um, we go up on the north coast and do the farming, you know what I mean? Up and then they say, No, you can't put the farming on a hell, no, brother. It's how to be flat. They say, Good, hear what? Cast and field. They say all around cashew garden, all the flat. Let me go and talk to the people down there. You know what I mean? They live in they live in country life anyhow. I go down there and I say, here where's the scene? I walk a gain to farming. I giving you all the education you need on farming through places like the Imperial Agricultural University. I go send your university or lay nobody farming. I go get you all the seeds. What the hell is make cows? Okay, cows is make cows. I I go get you everything you need. I keep saying seeds because when I feel farming and thinking wheat, right? But you get I go get the cows, I will get the thing. I go teach you about raring cows and breeding and whatever you need to do and milking cows and which cow could make beef and which cow you give you milk, and and I will I will give them to you. Right? That's yours. I will get you a start. So I gave you the education, again you the livestock. I say, you know what? Look too sharp to a gay land. I get the land. If you want to do it, I give you an acre to start. And that's where a lot of our industry starts. Go and look back at where the where we start with sugar. Well, don't look at the original start of sugar, right? That was a little bit uh we still have PTSD from that. But if you look at the way our industry starts, a lot of it is that. I always remember my partner, our partner who played music with this a little null in me too. He was telling me at a time the government giving away pump city, this time is seed, right? You say they will give you the pump city and teach you how to grow pump city if you take your land and you grow pump city on it. So if you have farming land anyway, you just had to show them that you have land to plant. I believe, and I hope I'm not wrong about this, but the land didn't even be yours. You just had to have if you have a letter of comfort from somebody who said you could use their land, they was giving you the pump city and teaching you how to plant it and helping you. Sending Ministry of Agriculture to help you with pesticides, this, that, that, you're getting business management, everything. And when you're done and your pump city grow, the government was buying all your pump city guaranteed market. This is the kind of things you could do when you're oil and gas. The reason for that pump city thing was to um, I believe at the time to supply manufacturers of ketchup on these kind of things. All they need is pulp, right? So tomato ketchup make from pump city and pumpkin and all these things. But that's where the dairy, dairy, the whole idea of we have in a dairy industry comes from that. So we set that up to put Nestle there. So when Nestle says you're gonna do all this, how long this go take you? I say, well, boy, election is in five years, so gotta take my about two, three years and because I go need them votes. Right? And they work it out, and that's where we are. So when you see we reach this point now where you're seeing in retail, in manufacturing in several sectors, you're seeing a scaling back of the bigger businesses and a pulling out in some cases of the biggest businesses. It comes down to the same thing, it comes down to the same oil and gas dependency because now we cannot give them the same guarantees that we we had. We're not as competitive as we used to be. They've been here for how much of a year. So it ain't making sense. Add that a highly inflated wage bill and our minimum wage on top of that, our inflation rate that going, you know, and and that's where we're. When I hear governance, I expect to hear about macroeconomic concerns. Well, the inflation, unemployment, all these different things, like how we're addressing that. So I'm not surprised that the government is trying to intervene and I guess reason with Nestle and negotiate and see how we could get him to stay and keep it favorable. Or even looking at other global manufacturers of milk or those types of products to see who will buy the plant. And because you want to protect not just the 200 jobs there, but you want to protect people like Leonard. Because on a micro level, now if as he says, my all my livelihood and it goes away immediately, then the society has an issue. What does Leonard do? What do his children do? Will they continue to mine their families and think and become contributing members of society? I see in it here to say, um, let me just read from here, right? So that's all you know. Uh in 2014, the sector had 150 farmers who sold 3.94 million liters of milk annually. By 2024, there were only 60 farmers with Nestle receiving 1.73 liters of milk they produce annually. The farmers are paid $5.36 a liter for raw cow's milk. The government pays Nestle a subsidy of $1.50 for each liter. So which means we we're not the most efficient producers either. I mean, let me say it's $5.50, right? To make this matter simple, the farmers gain $5.50 a liter, but the government contributes $1.50 out of that as a subsidy. Again, if the government not making the money it was making before, will we gain all these set of dollar fifty to pay per liter when you're talking about 3.94 million litres a year annually? The public sector gain smaller too. So it's not like being a case where alright we could give Leonard a CPEP walk it. Used to have a thing named CPEP, me know if it's at all. I see my lat in the same situation, but it I think it's a little easy and it's a little bit lazy if I'm being honest, for everybody to say blame the government and the government not doing this and the government not doing that. When what we should probably start looking at more than anything else is the is ourselves is in the mirror. We should talk about the governments and not the government. Because I think we politicize these things, but we I I think we were always coming to this point. So even in in cases like these, I I wonder where where where the next steps are. You're seeing um, I believe it was Metanex recently, I believe Nutrian in the same situation. So you're seeing more and more companies pulling back, pulling out, back downsizing, downscaling. So you're finding a situation now where you end up with a society that get accustomed to a certain standard of living and quality of life. Uh a society that, as I said in the beginning, get educated for free all about it, or very close to free. So you're having people coming out with all kinds of degrees, and the industries where they would be absorbed starting to look like they're pulling out. So I I always remember lecturing in Guyana for the first time. And I was as I mean, Guyana, you're talking the quality of the class in Guyana was high, you know. You're talking people who are influential people in society in a master's class in Guyana. And I was telling them, I said, boy, listen, all you have an opportunity with oil and gas here that you should just look at countries like Trinidad and Tobago and see what we do and see how far you could run from that. And unfortunately in Guyana, you're seeing the same thing. The first thing you want to do when the oil and gas come, because you have the pressure of re-election all the time, the first thing you see governments do is try to ease the squeeze on the portal to quote Brian Kwaitong, right? So you start to say, Alright, well, I could subsidize this and subsidize that and do. And when you do those things and you create a sort of a dependency on the government, then you end up in a situation where should that major product or that major revenue stream ever change or fall off, you have a real like how are you going to replace it? How are you gonna replace it? But anyway, I am here again to celebrate the life and times of the great Bill Truckman. And maybe this song is about diversification, too.

Threats To Ministers And Life In Fear

Corie 1:11:40

Reading from the Express, and Ram that's like you're going to the deep waters now, you know. I mean, Barry says, I will not live in fear. Me, you're wrong now, Barry. Live in fear of who? Big bad Barry like you. It says Public Utilities Minister Barry Pader had said he's concerned that a former government minister who allegedly attempted to place a hit on his life is still walking around freely. He, however, told the Sunday Express that he has confidence in the police service and will not live in fear. Game right. In response to questions from the Sunday Express, continued a statement made by a man who he alleged who he alleged, who alleged, he was offered $250,000 by a former government minister to kill him. Paderat said in 2025 he was contacted by the head of special branch who indicated that he needed to meet with him urgently. I was at the parliament at the time, I agreed to meet with him, Minister Saddam Hussein accompanied accompanied me to that meeting with the head of the branch, and they advised that a gang leader had given a sworn statement to the TTPS that he was engaged by a former PM government minister. I was wondering, when they say former government, I was saying something missing. I said the club for a partnership, but a former PM government minister to put a hit on my life. He said the police then shared some of the contents of the allegations with me, indicating that it was a figure of $250,000. And subsequently they insinuated without calling names who the government minister was. That was very professional of the special branch. Insinuates without calling names. I was offered additional security and I was also instructed that I should consider having security arrangement put in place for members of my family and the security of where I live. The minister said he was left stunned by the report. When only say 2025. When was the election? In 25 or 26? It was 25. This was before they was in power after. He said, yes, I was very shocked by the allegation, deeply concerned, deeply troubled by it, because of the level of detail that I was made aware of and the fact that some of the persons that were purportedly involved live in and around the vicinity where I live. And I live within a constituency and operate within a constituency that I represent at a parliamentary level. Okay. Yes, I am more concerned about my young child and the ones who mean the most to me. I've taken the necessary steps to provide additional security and safety for them. He added, it is very unnerving, particularly when you have young children and you serve in public life to those are to have those sorts of exposures, and therefore it's always at the forefront of my mind. However, I will not be deterred. You see, there's very politician welcome. I'll not be deterred from performing my public duty. I swore to uphold the constitution and the law and to serve without fear or favor, and therefore I will not be muzzled. Okay, daddy. Don't let nobody muzzle you yourself. He also disclosed that the gangster release uh remains in police custody. Now I don't know. I don't know, I don't know, I don't know. This seems to be a and and and this would be a very worrying trend. Not just a trend, but extremely worrying trend where there's more and more talk or rhetoric or people identifying that ministers, sitting ministers of government, in this case including the prime minister, are being their lives being threatened. Now I always remember having to move to Jamaica and my grandmother, poor God bless your soul, she'd tell me she said, but you don't go there and get no trouble. Because Jamaica was a place you used to hear the crime reports, and you used to feel like if you walk down the road in Jamaica, you're going to get killed. And I mean, I live there, it's not the case of vacation there, it's not the case. Jamaica is relatively safe. I mean, is is and at that point in time, the kind of numbers you used to hear as a murder toll in Jamaica, even pound for pound, we're far ahead of Trendad. Now I mean Trendad might be ahead of that race. I ain't sure where he is now. Because I know Jamaica owner had been under control or way, way better within the last couple years, if I remember right. But I mean, Trendad, I don't know that anybody in Trendad could say that they feel safe walking the road every day. I see a thing on the island here that it really hurt me. A little youth man who is a DJ. Can't remember the youth man's name. But the little fella is a DJ, he had a panel van, he has equipment and thing. He's going to play something. It looks like in T I C or something. And when he comes out, they break in the car and go on the man. And again, this idea of contempt for business people. I don't understand it because this boy is 23 years old. You start your business, he invests in it, you have your equipment and thing. The boy nearly to tears talking about how they're going to take how long. And they take his first DJ controller. And he says, you know, that's something my grandmother sacrificed and give me. And you can see how emotionally attached he is to the thing. And it's a sad state we live in where I could work hard for something and I could just be taken away, including my life. I feel like that is the country we live in. I feel like that is doubly worrying when there's this constant and consistent threat to the people who are in power. You're hearing that over and over. We heard it about this, we're hearing it about Barry Padder right now. And these are prominent figures in the government. And now we as citizens, as laymen, right? Let me talk to all you know. We have a choice here to believe this or not believe this. Because sometimes it's song like political rhetoric. You know, you say where you have to say to get ahead or get sympathy. Politicians are known for saying what needs to be said, and everything that they say seems to be to advance the cause that they have, right? But let's for a minute pretend that all of it is real. All of it is real. That there's this there's this life is being threatened and so on by people who are out of power and want to get back in power. I would say that that is an extremely worrying thing, and something that we should pay a lot of attention to. And especially when you're in a in a state of emergency and a never-ending state of emergency. I've said many times, I don't think we'll ever be out of a SOE again. I I I I think this is the new normal. This is because we see SOE and thing in in COVID times, which maybe if you want to call that understandable, because we have a pandemic and they need more control. But even after the SOE, the same things were being said about threats to the state. So now it'd be in it being posed as okay, and at least in this case, somebody who allegedly tied to the PM trying to say or gangster have a so on statement that somebody from the PM trying to get them to take out Barry. But we we've been here before. We've been here before with when the PNM was in power the last time. They the threat to the state thing is what started this whole idea of the SOE. I mean, I live through the cool. I see what that was, and I mean we got we can talk about that next time in terms of how many different reasons it have for something like that to happen. But I will say that again, it's it's it's it's frightening to see that we in a society where that is how we get recourse, or that is how we get where it's easy to threaten people's lives. Like we talk about the next side of it. No, no. If these things are being, if it's trumped up things, no, no pun intended. And the idea because there's benefit, there can be benefit to keeping your population living in fear. There can be benefit to that. And one of the benefits is that we've we all agree that we should stay in ISOE because we need the police to keep control, and we need the army in control, and we need always have the ability to go anywhere by anybody, any hour the night, and put them in detention and not try them, but keep them there for because we frighten. And if if we frighten, we could we could we could accept limited freedom when we frighten. Let me put it like that. And I'm I'm not sure where I stand on the fence now. Well, I guess it's on the fence. I'm not sure where I stand on the issue because I think if you're for the society to work the way it works, we had to you had to put some level of trust in the people who in power, right? Collectively, whether you support the people who are in power now or not, we collectively vote for them using a system that we all agreed to use and we all agree to say if I lose, I still follow. And so so regardless of which side of the political divide you're still, is is as a society for it to function, you had to put faith in the people if the people saying that this is a real threat is a real threat. What I could tell you is that the cost of doing these things starts to increase over and over because I remember before people being detained for long periods of time, pretty much for the entirety of the SOE, and then coming out and sue the state for XYZ and winning many years later. And it don't matter who win and when they win and who in government or not in government when they win, when they win, you see that same 25% we were talking about in the beginning of the episode that we pay that should have go towards healthcare, some of it leaking and going towards these things. I will say as well that when they increase security, there's more taxpayers' dollars. Nobody ain't increasing the security and up. Well, the the Minister of Public Utilities, let me say it this way, has every right to increase his security using taxpayers' dollars because we collectively need that man to be safe. Regardless, if you like him, you don't like him, you like your policies. You don't want to live in a country where government ministers get attacked. Or worse. I don't even want to say it to put it out there. You don't want that. So it is, I am all okay. We should all be okay with them if there's a threat, increase any security to the level they need to increase it because we need them there and we need them to govern. You do not want anarchy. I will tell you what Hannah Ghani tell me about that another time, right? So I agree with it, but I'll I'll use an example. There was a point in time, um I want to say it's last year, where or earlier this year, where another government minister was the claim was that his life was threatened. There was a public issue, this way in stage. And whatever side of the divide I sit on, right? Whether I believe this or I don't believe it, or feelings about control versus genuine protecting themselves and so on. I am a man who I it's hard for me to concentrate, right? Stay with me. I just can't I just can't concentrate too long when I read in something. So when I started lecturing to prepare for a course, you had to read over material that you probably know well. Uh or you you knew at some point in time, but you don't know. I know it, know it to teach it, right? So I'll go over. But I can't do that home because once he plays too quiet and I in the office and I stopped. Boy, listen, I still develop a love for cafes, right? So uh uh you could find me in a Maria's on any given day, you could find me by Adams on every given day. So Adam Aboud for some strange reason Adam Abud episode is trending. Everybody going back and watch Adam Abud, I wonder why, and Gary Abud. I wonder, like, how come they're all watching them episodes? Both of them is nearly a year old now. But um I spend a lot of time in them places because the little white noise and the people coming and maybe it's helped me concentrate and get to whatever lecture I have to do. I find myself doing that a lot with the podcast now, like to prepare for a for interview and review the things the person did and try to remember all the different stuff, or even for the solo episodes, read the news, get get get up to date. I find myself there a lot. And there's one particular cafe that I I I kind of like to go to, you know what I mean? But apparently, Wayne Sturge also likes to go to that cafe. I find like this is me personally, right? This is just my personal issue. If Barry Padra's life is under threat, or the Prime Minister's life is under threat, I find you shouldn't come where I go in and eat. I thought I don't I don't like that. And he is there doing meetings, so he will come there. And uh when I say meetings, I doubt is I mean parliamentary meeting, or we meeting with people, so you'll see him come and sit down, and then a couple people come and they meet with him and they talk, and the people leave, and then other people come. But boy, when he they uneasy, because now you have a secret service man, any man you see, me though with his make them kind of jacket them and this wear, who this guard. I mean, I hope when Barry and Chrissy security, those lady security wear them suits no more. Nobody don't wear them near neck black suit again, like the pall bearers. We need a better outfit for these security people who guarding the prime minister. We had to do better than that. But he has them now. So I sit down eating my little tuna panini, whatever the hell I eat when I go there. And his security coming in, checking out the thing, watch people saying, then they bring him in, and then and then two stand up by the door. I I I go on and say, Oh, I coming out in here and why if your life under threat, we wouldn't miss and hit me. Good, good me.

unknown 1:24:31

Good me.

Corie 1:24:32

So again, uh this is something again that we should all pay attention to. These are things that we should be very, very worried about. We must not let these issues die off because these are not matters to be taken lightly. Whether they are made in seriousness and and real threats are seen, or whether they are trumped up, no pun intended, these are things that we must take seriously. But again, the great Belt Trotman is why we're here, right? That's what we're here for.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:30

I want you to understand.

Balise House Probe And Corruption Costs

Corie 1:26:13

So to Bill Truckman. We're gonna close off on Bill Truppman, so we know, but a couple more things before we ride out. From the Express, from Anna Ramdas again, salute to Anoramdas. Prime Minister Kamla Pasadbi says so it says the police and judiciary are independent institutions, and the PNM should produce evidence before these entities to prove the lawful construction of its Balize House headquarters in Port of Spain. PNM chairman Marvin Gonzalez says to you had a three-page letter. That letter was long in line, Marvin. You had to tighten up these things. This is social media, you're right. Anytime you had to write a letter in all them kind of you just remember you're always writing things for people who are on Facebook. I mean, come on, that was that was a lot. Marvin Gonzalez in a three-page statement on Saturday, or sent a letter, or is to have a three-page statement, taking issue with police's move to compel the trustees of Balize House to explain the funding behind its construction. Gonzalez described the move as political or as a political witch hunt and rejected any suggestion that there was anything improper, unlawful, or secretive about the funding of the party's headquarters or the fundraising activities undertaken by the party over many years. Gonzalez sought to explain how the party raised funds for construction, saying that well over 15 years the PNM has engaged in lawful fundraising through party activities, public appeals, initiatives, and voluntary donations from thousands of members. So, I mean, if that is the case, then hey be a scopus. No pun intended. I mean, I don't think if the police probing this and all you build it in lawful means, it should not be an issue to show that. It should be relatively easy, to be honest, to show where you get the funds from to build it thing, especially with little I know about the PM as an institution. They're supposed to have their act together and show that. I will say, however, that similar to my issue with The PM government at the time in 2015-16, talking about the partnership and the partnership and the partnership. I just feel like if I'm back in the same cycle, I feel like the washing machine going on our errands and repeat now because everything with this government now is the PM and the PM and the PM. And as much as I like Annel Robertson, I like the doubles and coffee, is every day is the PM and the PM. And I don't know that I want to hear about them at all. It's like, right, next wrongs. I don't want to hear about them till election. So the fact that they're doing a probe and stuff, again, I'm I'm going to assume and give the benefit of the doubt, which I think it makes sense for all of us to do, that they have evidence and the police is operating independently. I cannot assume that the government is using the police to do this, that, and it's true. But if the police have information about it and they say they want to see where it is, I want that to come and go quickly. I want to raise it and decide, well, alright, we're here now. Now it turns out them fellas and them had their thing together, and then you must tell us, well, what evidence you had to do this. We had a note. Or them fellas didn't have their things together, and people must be made to account for that. Unfortunately, I tend to agree with the great Asher Javid and Shaliza Hassanali again from The Guardian, where they said, corruption investigations in TNT, high cost, little closure. In Trinidad and Tobago, most corrupt cases, if they even get there, stop at the courts. And that's before millions of taxpayers' dollars are spent on audit reports, legal fees, and commissions of inquiry. Over the past 30 years, politicians have liberal liberally dipped into the country's piss, over 25%, to pursue corruption-related matters. Yet prosecution of such cases remains low, while most are eventually discontinued or dismissed. Only last year, Justice Ricky Rahim ruled that former board of directors and CEO of the sports company at Trendad and Tobago breached their fiduciary duties by rubber stamping a $34 million contract for the Failed Life Sport Program in 2012. The court found that the board simply followed ministerial directives rather than acting in the company's best interest. And each of the 14 directors, as well as the former CEO, had to pay damages of 40,000 each, totaling 560,000. This is against the backdrop of a $34 million contract, right? The consequence of corruption in TNT have the ability to erode public trust and the justice system as decades later corruption cases involving former politicians, MPs, government ministers, executives, businessmen, and contractors bought before the courts as high-profile matters are still pending. Others had their matters dismissed, while many died waiting on the outcome of the cases. I think this is a great piece of journalistic work by Asher Jave and Shaliza Hassanali. The timing of this couldn't be better. And they have a lot of cases like these. I encourage you to read this article. Is in The Guardian of the 12th of July. The point you're making is I know they put Ishwagal Baransing face big, they put Steve Ferguson case big, they put the great Franklin can he face the big. Let me tell you all who they paid, Minister McDonald pass away in 2023 cases against Southwick corruption. So the thing about it is I feel as though, like I've I've been on record saying that the the the purpose of governance and party politics in particular and why it's so important for people to win elections is because the whole purpose of it is really to get public funds into private pockets. That seems to be where it is. The people who were most interested in win there seem to be more interested in what they had to sort out for themselves and to get rid of the enemy kind of thing. That's the way it seems sometimes. But the truth is that I feel like one of a real good way to get our money, the public spurse into the private funds, is through legal battles. So you find that government after government, party after party, administration after administration, one thing you sure go happen. You ain't sure no sort of infrastructure go bill and thing go fix, and maybe damn thing might happen or not. But one thing that you're sure to see happen is that real people are gonna go to court. Real people. Especially from the last administration, you're going to court. And the thing about it was when you go to court, it's a big deal. Because when you when you say this kind of thing about the PM, that is in terms of Balizy house, that emblazoned in the mind of the public now. I wanna leave them first corrupt for real. And now you if you had doubts, you would just if you're if you didn't like them already and you feel it was corrupt, it's like, yes, I've done to take them down and we can paint it yellow, whatever. That is what the reaction will be. If you had real faith in them, it could just be you know, something you ain't true. So it seems as though the court case is doing two things, or the court cases, I ain't talking about this one in particular, I talk about just the general idea of what administrations tend to do. Is besmirge the name of the party who came before them by throwing out things that say they're corrupt and it's an email gates and it's a life sport, and ball is in house. And like find big eye big ideas that they have that are visible, like uh, what you call it thing now, Brian, Lara Stadium or how they call it hospital in Coover. Find a big thing and say the corrupt thing and find a way to know so you be smurger your opponent in terms of the at least the reputation. Whether it's true or not, the reputation takes a hit when you do that. And then what you do now is you say, well, alright, carry to court and get a king's counsel, and then you get the king's counsel to come and do your thing and do your thing. And what happens then is by the time it finished, because 10-15 years later, the person was real passionate about this, like you see all Lys of Philip passionate about the situation with Kaya Silly, and you find that 10-15 years from now, you get a big chair and them distracted them. You even know when the case that you're so passionate about finished. That's gone. So you don't know what's the outcome of it. And most times, as it's said here by again, Asha Javidantial is arsenal, great, great, great, great work. Because people die, matter settled. People move on, matter dropped. They get found guilty or whatever you settled for 560 when the case was 34 million. So, in other words, the the the I want to say it's inconsequential. Even if you find them to be wrong, what happens? Nothing happens. A man goes to jail, singing jail, do you do things like this, man? And I know pronounce it on whether nobody's innocent or guilty. I want to make that clear. The point I'm making is it seem the what is sure going to happen is hundreds of millions of dollars are going to start to move away from the taxpayers' coffers and start moving towards attorneys from all about. So I I wonder if this is just a way to move move little monies from outside to inside. I don't know, but again, please read the article from Aliza and Asher and Shaliza. We'll get names right at some point in time in life.

Farewell To Bill Trotman And Wanderer

Corie 1:34:58

Let me let me let me let me end this and close this episode by reading from uh we really come here top of all. From Susan Shepard. Calypso Fraternity mourns the loss of two veterans in one week. Trendan Tobago's Calypso Fraternity is mourning the loss of its veteran entertainers within a week. Following the death of celebrity cultural icon Bill Trotman on Wednesday evening at the age of 92. Troutman's passing comes days after the death of uh the mighty Wanderer 85, who died last Saturday. Both men had reputations as far more than Calypsonians with successes in other aspects of the performing arts locally and abroad. I want to I want to just play a song for you if they suffer me here in um in affordable imports. We can add a girl wanderer. If you ain't girl wonder what we're doing with this, this is what the show is about. We born we born here playing Kaizo. That is one of our favorite things to do around here.

SPEAKER_05 1:35:59

Marriage is honorable in all. And the marriage bed, only fired. But there is no sin in the marriage bed. So let every man have his wife, every woman.

Corie 1:37:33

Let's see your music's like them. Listen, it is nice to talk to all you. It is always nice to do this. I would never stop saying it. You know, I mean, it's always difficult to find the time, but when you find the time, it's a nice thing. I want to get again condolences to the families of the great Bill Trotman, the great mighty wanderer. Men who contributed a lot to our society. We must always take time to remember them. And I mean, the waiting going, I will see you all here. If not next week, the week after, I will see you all here sooner now. But this is one by Bill Trotman. I leave another bit by the name of Rat Race. I hope all they enjoy any interviews. I hope all they enjoy this episode. I hope all you have a great week, productive and nice, and I will see you all in when I see you. So it's left up for me and you to fight up in this rat free. So let's stay safe, stay productive in your reference, and I'll talk to all of you next week.