Hi, and welcome to the final bonus episode of Math Therapy before season two starts next week. Oh my god. So excited, guys. I never thought that when I started a podcast that there would even be a season two. Like, I don't know, actually, I don't think I thought through the idea at all, but hey, here we are. So, speaking of not thinking things through, one of the most unanticipated things about making this podcast is how much listener feedback I have gotten. I just totally did not expect to have so many of you reach out to tell me how much the pod resonated with you. And I swear I'm not trying to sound conceited as fuck, but like the number of people I had being like, oh my god, I'm so glad someone is talking about this. I never knew math trauma was a thing, and now I do, and I totally have it, and knowing that has totally changed my life. Well, there were a lot of you that slid into my DMs to tell me that, and it really means a lot to me. Before we start season two, I really wanted to honor the courage and bravery of so many of you who have reached out to share your story so that our listeners can hear themselves and you, and also so that they can know that they're not alone in their math anxiety. So, without further ado, welcome to our first mailbag episode ever. Here's our first submission.
SPEAKER_03Hey Vanessa and everyone listening. My name's Maddie, and I just finished my fifth year at York University Glendon campus in the concurrent education program. I met Vanessa when she came to speak to my math class this year. I grew up with a gifted sister, a stay-at-home mom who hated everything math related, and an engineering dad. My dad, as amazing and smart as he was, had no idea how to explain my math homework to me. I remember crying so many times at the dinner table from grades one through 11, feeling stupid because I didn't understand anything he was saying. I guess as a family, we just always agreed that I took after my mom and my sister took after my dad, and I would never be a math person. I think that my math trauma really comes from the idea that I'm not smart or talented or gifted because math didn't come easily to me. But I think I'll admit now as an adult that I never really tried that hard because I gave up thinking I could succeed. I accepted that I was just bad at math, even when my grades never really fell below a C, and I don't even think that I failed anything in math. Even now I compare myself to my best friend who's a software engineer at Google. Everyone is so impressed when they find out, and then I say I'm in teachers college, and I never get the same kind of reaction. But I want to be a teacher to help kids like me who hated school and hated math, and I want them to be more confident students. Ever since Vanessa came to my class, I've stopped saying I'm not a math person, which is a big step for me, and have slowly started to accept that I never really pushed myself. Next year I have to take a math test to become a certified teacher, and I'm gonna have to start studying really early.
SPEAKER_01Wish me luck. Oh my god, I absolutely love that. Maddie, you are so brave and courageous for sharing that with everyone. Like, seriously, I think it is so badass and cool that you are using your math anxiety to get out there and change the world so that other kids don't have to suffer. And like, I would wish you luck, but girl, you've got this, you do not need it. Our next submission came by email, and it is from 57-year-old Darlene from Ferndale, Michigan, who is a badass woman who has decided to go back in her adult life to tackle math anxiety. Hi, Vanessa. I wanted to let you know that the article about you in Bust magazine and your podcast really inspired me to give math a shot again. Back in the 80s, when I was in college, I wanted to study biostatistics, but I let myself get scared off by a stats class I had difficulty with. I suffered from the backwards notion that I didn't have a talent for math, stats, and science because it didn't immediately come easy to me. Now that I'm in the fortunate position of being able to go back to school tuition-free, I feel like I've been given a second chance. I might not otherwise spend the money on such a thing at my age, but I feel like it's an imperative at this point. I hope you and your family are safe and healthy because the world needs more people like you if we are going to get out there and smash the patriarchy. Warmest regards, Darlene. Ah, are you freaking out? Because I am. Darlene, that is so cool. We are all rooting for you. Please keep us posted on your progress. We all believe in you. Our next submission is from Hunter. Take a listen.
SPEAKER_00Hi, my name is Hunter Saul and I'm 21 years old. I always knew that I had an issue with math starting in grade two. I dreaded math class and normally went from being a student who participated and spoke to sitting in the back row and keeping my mouth shut. I just assumed I was bad at math and that everyone had a subject that they were bad at. It wasn't until grade 11 when I was studying for a math exam that I realized I had math anxiety. During studying, every time I sat down and looked at practice questions, I broke down in tears. The thought of even writing this exam or studying for it made me panic and go into overdrive. I thought that not being good at math made me stupid, and less then. However, after choosing to drop down to the lower level of math, I felt my math anxiety begin to ease a little. By the end of high school, math most definitely wasn't my favorite subject by any means, but I was confident going into class and start to sit in the front row and participate. I went from getting mid-60s to finishing grade 12 with an 85 in math. With the help of the amazing team at the math group, support of my teachers, and most importantly, having faith in myself, I realized that it takes practice and a positive mindset.
SPEAKER_01Our next submission comes from Jenny, who's actually an old student of mine. She's 24 years old from Toronto and now lives in the UK, like living out her dream life. She sent us a little email, and here's what it says. Hey Vanessa. For as long as I can remember, I have never been a math person. She used quotes. Don't worry, guys. I have always struggled with math and have felt extreme embarrassment and trauma from it. Not only in school, but even in my first job, a cashier at the frozen yogurt shop Yogerties, where I was in complete terror whenever someone paid in cash as I was not a fast counter. During high school, I reached my lowest point with math. I was too embarrassed to ask for help and I was failing miserably. Ultimately, my parents enrolled me at the math guru, and though they had to walk me there just to make sure I would actually go, I finally received the help I needed and gained some confidence in math. I went from 25% to 79% in my math class, which is probably one of the biggest achievements in my high school career. While I dodged math in university, I was confronted by it again during the PR post-grad program at Humber College. During a lecture, a slide was presented about price slash earnings ratio measure. My heart just sank. We were then given sheets of problems we needed to solve and only given a few minutes. I immediately panicked and went red in the face as I was sure I wouldn't be able to figure out a single problem. Fortunately, I had an amazing and understanding professor who took me through the equations after class, but it was still traumatizing and I couldn't believe I was experiencing this at 22 years old. I got through the math required for that class and walked away thinking that would be the last time I would have to face it. I now work at a PR agency in London, England, where we are continuously using Microsoft Excel and conducting surveys. To my dismay, this did include using a bit of math, but due to the importance of my job, I worked hard to figure out the problems and I actually got quite good at it. I even had one colleague come up to me and say, I hear you're the one to come to about math. I was shocked as I had never been a math person growing up, but also thrilled since I was finally not having a traumatic math situation, but like a really positive one. Now, though I wouldn't say I'm a math person, I can confidently say that I am eager to learn and not afraid of hard work, even if that requires math. Best Jenny. Jenny, from all of us here at the Math Guru, we are so proud of you, girl. And as for that whole you're still not a math person thing, one thing we talk about on the podcast all the time is that there is no such thing as a math person. Like you're a person and you do math. End of story. Okay, our next submission comes from Anna, a 54-year-old from British Columbia. And for those of you who know the Canadian landscape, BC is like super famous for the fact that it rains all the time. And I just find this hilarious because you can fully hear a full-on rainstorm in Anna's submission. Take a listen.
SPEAKER_06By high school, I could count, add, subtract, multiply, and divide numbers, but I struggled with algebra. I had no idea what all the letters and numbers meant, and when I asked for help, I did not get it. I began to think that I was not intelligent enough to learn algebra, so I gave up and dropped out of it. When I homeschooled my children, I decided to teach myself math so I could teach them. I was often just one night ahead of them. As time passed, I learned that I had many math gaps that needed filling. As I filled those gaps, I realized that I was not only intelligent enough to learn math, but was good at teaching what I learned to others. Soon other parents began asking me to help their children with math. One night I was searching for ways to mathematically engage students when I came across a website for the Mortensen Math Program, a gateway program to the higher maths. Students explore and discover math concepts by seeing, touching, and moving colorful blocks and tiles around, creating visual pictures of mathematics. They learn through conceptualization and imagination rather than memorization. Through this program, I learned that arithmetic and algebra are related and can be introduced at the same time to even the youngest of students. I also learned that algebra is more easily understood when introduced in the concrete instead of the abstract. With the right approach and tools, we can take the fear and anxiety out of learning math and help students build confidence, self-esteem, math fluency and stamina, and problem-solving skills. There is no reason for students to drop out of math as I did. When I dropped out of algebra, I never dreamed that I would one day be happily playing math with children and adults around the world and teaching algebra to all ages of students. We talk, we laugh, we play, we move, we see, we touch, we hear, we wonder, we notice, and we learn math. Stan Guter said the essence of mathematics is not to make simple things complicated, but to make complicated things simple. And I believe that math is a road trip, not just a drive. You will never get lost if you focus on the journey rather than just the destination. I also believe that if a student is not learning math the way we teach math, then we should teach math the way the student learns math.
SPEAKER_01Preach, mic drop, love that. Love that so much. Okay, our next submission is from Claire. So Claire just finished first year university. She's 19 and from Toronto and actually an old student of ours. And guys, I want to tell you, I have seen students with math anxiety before, but like this was a thing. I have seen Claire cry a million times over math over the past four years, and I am so proud of how far she's come. She is living proof that math therapy works, and I am so, so proud of her for sharing her story with you guys. Here's the letter that she wrote me. My name is Claire, and I'm currently in university studying health sciences. Things are going well for the most part now, but my earlier days involving math and science were absolutely consumed with feeling dumber than my peers, high levels of anxiety and panic, and ultimately the fear of failure. As I was preparing for high school, the education system, in my opinion, had failed me. I had been feeling like a pretty smart kid and only realized in my first math class that I was unprepared. I had been taking tests for my entire elementary education, which were like photocopied directly from the mid-chapter review of the textbook we all had on hand. So from that, I had developed little to no application skills and struggled greatly with knowledge and inquiry fields. All I had known how to do was memorize processes and retrieve memories of solutions, which had really stunted my problem-solving growth. As I integrated, no calculus pun intended myself into high school, I struggled with the first concept of math taught, and I felt useless and incapable. No matter how hard I tried, I felt like math was my biggest new fear, my biggest trigger, and honestly, my enemy. In grade 10, I started to experience extreme math anxiety. In class, I'd pay attention and get all the notes down. I'd spend an hour a week with my tutor, usually understanding the concepts really well, and I made it a priority to tackle what I was struggling with. I put in the time. But during tests, I'd draw complete blanks on concepts I had mastered. I'd have such an elevated heart rate, a tight chest, sweaty palms, nausea, and most embarrassingly, I would sit at my test looking at it and just cry at the numbers. I'd often leave tests half blank. I came to realize with the help of my tutor that I had some big anxiety issues revolving around math, specifically tests. From that discovery forward, nothing had really changed in terms of how I approached the learning side of things. But what did change was how I reacted to situations and how I learned to control them. I began having mock tests with my tutor. He would write out a mini-test in red inked pens. This approach put me into the situation I loved to avoid and stressed me out a lot, but it showed me I could do it. I also began changing how I tested. At the top of my scrap paper on tests, I'd write a one-liner, usually like, I'm a badass or I'm fucking smart. Something to keep me from spiraling during the test. I needed a reminder from myself that I trusted myself and believed in my abilities. There is no such thing as the ideal math person. Now I do math and science day in and day out at school. I enjoy it and it's a passion of mine. Math doesn't only teach you how to compute numbers and manipulate equations, it is the idea of problem solving and using appropriate measures to do so for a successful solution. Love Claire. Okay, on to our next submission. We have Geordie, a 16-year-old from Toronto, and her submission is so cute, but also like so relevant. And I feel you. Take a listen.
SPEAKER_04Hello, podcast. Uh, my name's Geordie. I have a story when I asked my math teacher a question. Uh, it was the same as another student, but after I we both asked it, he looked at both of us, closed his eyes, put his head in his hands, and gave the most frustrated sigh I've ever heard. He looked at us like we were kind of stupid. Then he tried to explain it to us again and asked if we had questions, and I just couldn't bring myself to ask another question and risk being humiliated again. I almost started crying and I was so angry, especially because he said he loved my self-advocacy in a parent-teacher interview. He's better now, and he tells jokes before class, and he's really great, probably because he's at home. But damn, did it traumatize me in that moment? I didn't feel comfortable asking any more questions in any other classes.
SPEAKER_01Not everyone's relationship with math is a bad one. Next we're gonna hear from Rhea, who has a different take on the subject.
SPEAKER_02Hey Vanessa, my name is Rhea, and currently I am in grade nine, and I've always been a fan of math ever since I can remember. Uh, this is because the concept of math is either right or wrong. The answer is right or wrong, and there isn't really an in-between. I've been doing math tutoring for seven years now, so ever since I was in grade two, um, it has given me opportunities for my problem-solving skills to grow and not just my application of math to grow. And this doesn't just apply for in math, it applies for all other subjects and activities that I participate in, whether it's science, English, French, or even activities such as sports. Um, I do believe that the reason I am a strong, independent problem solver and able to get past any problem that comes to me is because of my experience with math and is because of everything that I've grown from. My experience of math has taught me how to problem solve without backing down. And I am and will forever be grateful for what math has taught me.
SPEAKER_01I love that submission from Rhea. I think it's so cool to have a young person remind us that math is about so much more than just solving problems in math class. Next, we have a submission from Shaylin, a 45-year-old woman from Utah, whose life changes pretty dramatically when she finally finds a math teacher to show her math in a whole new light.
SPEAKER_05As a child, a young child, I don't remember having feelings about math one way or the other. I was a good student and I was okay at basic math. And it wasn't until I reached high school that I started to feel like I couldn't do math. And it either meant that I was really dumb in a class full of smart people, or that I just didn't have the math gene. That it somehow passed by me and I wasn't a quote unquote math person. It followed me into college. And fast forward a few years from there, um I was married and had kids and was homeschooling my children and realized that I was passing on this fear and this anxiety and this hate of math, and I didn't want to. I wanted my kids to have a different experience than I did. And I came across a tutor who was teaching Montessori math methods. I watched a couple of the videos and I thought, I don't, why wasn't math taught this way? I could have learned math this way, and I was really excited about it. And I realized it wasn't me. It wasn't that I couldn't understand math. It's that I couldn't understand the way math had been taught to me. So I took this math and I took this Montessori method and started learning everything I could about it. And I was loving it and I was enjoying math, and I was having aha moments, and it felt incredible and amazing. And I was teaching my kids math, and we were having fun. And in fact, my children will ask for math. That's the thing they want to do first. I hated my math experience. I want to be able to share a good math experience with other people, so I've reached out to other people, and I do math tutoring now, and I'm passing on this love of math that math can be enjoyable and that math is for everyone.
SPEAKER_01Guys, our final submission is a long one, but it brought tears to my eyes. This is a letter written to us by Alina, a 39-year-old from Toronto and a mom of four kids. Hi, Vanessa. My parents and I immigrated to Canada from Soviet Russia when I was seven and a half years old. I didn't speak a word of English, and let's just say that socially, the first few years were rough. Within a few months, I was fluent in English and consistently scored higher in reading, writing, and spelling tasks compared to my Canadian-born peers. In the lower grades, math was also simple for me because in Soviet Russia, nothing in life is or ever could be more important than fluency in math. My dad, an electrical engineer, a whiz in math, physics, and chemistry, was on a mission to make sure that his daughter would not be dumbed down by the laughable North American math curriculum. In all honesty, it's true that the math I had done in Russia was far more advanced. Kids were expected to know their multiplication tables by grade one, two at the latest. They were manipulating algebraic expressions and solving for X by grade three. What? Oh my god, this is insane. Sorry, okay. And easily figuring out when trains would intersect if they left at two different stations at different times and traveled at different speeds. Nothing was more important than math. People who didn't excel in math had no future in this world and would never be respected. After we became Canadian citizens, my dad did some business in Europe and often took business trips. I missed him while he was away and looked forward to his return, not to mention the surprises he'd have in his suitcase for me. But little did I realize that those surprises would be Russian math textbooks. I was promised that we would go through the books together and the lessons would be explained to me and I'd get help solving the problems. What actually happened though was very different. My dad would open the book to a page somewhere in the middle, choose a random section that he felt was appropriate, and neatly circle the exercises that I was expected to complete. He then flipped a few pages back and told me to read the introduction to that lesson, look at the examples, and then do the exercises that he had circled for me. That was it. I was seven when we came to Canada, and though I learned to read and write in Russian, my literacy level was that of a first grader, and I was expected to read and understand a textbook with very technical terms and examples that I have never been exposed to. It was a total setup for failure. I would go to my room and try to make sense of the letters, the language, the examples. It was incredibly challenging. My dad would come in every so often and ask me how I was progressing. I never got far enough, quickly enough, accurately enough. This would be followed by loud proclamations of my laziness, stupidity, his disappointment in me, etc. Tears would gush down my face. Oh my god, I feel horrible reading this. Okay, tears would gush down my face because I believed what I heard. I am stupid. I am a disappointment. I will get nowhere in life. They won't even hire me at McDonald's because I can't solve this train problem. What's even more important is that from all of these statements, I also concluded that I wasn't loved, that I was worthless, that no one could ever like me because I really was stupid. And who wants to be with someone like that? Oh my God. Okay, I need to take a pause personally because this hits hard. I like, okay. I spent day after day that summer in my room, slumped over my desk, head in my hand, over my textbook, tears soaking up the pages. My window was open and I could hear the kids outside riding their bikes, laughing, playing tag, skipping rope, being kids. At first, a few of the neighborhood kids would ring the bell and ask if I could come outside to play. Needless to say, that never happened. And eventually they stopped coming to the door. I hated math. I despised it. It was stuffed so far down my throat and so forcefully that I was determined to avoid it in any way I could. So when school was back on, seeing anything that resembled math would trigger a complete shutdown in my brain. Having said that and looking back now, I wasn't even bad at math. I just believed that I was. That shame and guilt is much more difficult to overcome. There were some parts of math that I actually loved, like geometry. I think it was something about the visual and often artistic parts of it that appealed to me. But overall, I just refused to apply myself. I was stupid and I would fail. So what was the point in wasting time on it? I asked for a tutor, but my dad refused because he insisted that A, he was an excellent teacher. And B, we didn't have the money to waste on a tutor. Eventually, in my OAC year with my mom's help, I did get a tutor. He was much more gentle and patient, and I got accepted into my first choice university program with a scholarship with a calculus mark of 88%. Who knew? It has taken me many years of work on myself to self-heal and discover that I am actually good at math. I've also discussed the issues with my dad. He realizes today and admits that this was his wrongdoing. We're friends. I'm not a math whiz, but I speak five languages. I'm artistic, I'm creative, I can sing, I'm a good communicator, teacher, and presenter. I have other valuable skills and talents. Okay, whatever girl. Also, PS from me, Vanessa, the math career. You got an 88 in calculus, so like hi. Okay, back to the letter. Let's wrap it up. Alina says, The experience of becoming a parent myself has also put many things into perspective for me. The term growth mindset is used a lot in today's classrooms, and I appreciate that very, very much. I'm a mom to four amazing kids. Three of them are not naturally gifted in math, let's say, but they get by all right and they've got tutors to help them along. One of the four is incredibly naturally inclined to do math. Like he just loves it. Sometimes he even helps his brother, who's two and a half years older. It's okay. People are different. They have different strengths and uniquenesses. As parents, we naturally want the best for our kids, but our version of that can sometimes be very selfish. And I often see parents try to live out their own dreams through their kids. My goal is to see each of my kids for who they truly are and to help them realize their self-worth is not defined by the numbers that appear in red pen at the top right corner of a test. They are good people with many gifts to offer the world. They are worthy of love and respect. They are capable of learning and getting better. And even if none of them end up in actuarial sciences or medicine or finance, I'm okay with that. And they will be too. Ah! Oh my god, this is like I I are you guys okay? Is everyone bawling right now? Like, I love this. Alina, thank you so much. Honestly, from speaking with her personally, I know that this was really cathartic for her, but also really hard to do. Like, to me, this is math therapy. And that's that's actually the irony. Like, by writing this out, this is what I would prescribe to someone asking how they can start engaging with math therapy. Literally writing out, working through your trauma. Like, this is so beautifully done, and just you can see her working it. I feel like a teacher right now, being like, you can see how she like used this and that. No, honestly, it was beautifully written. Thank you for sharing. That took so much courage and bravery. Alina, you are a beautiful person inside and out, and your kids are lucky to have you. And guys, just like that, that concludes our first ever mailbag episode. Thank you all so much. To those of you who shared your story, thank you. Know that you've made a difference, that you've been brave, that someone has benefited from it. I am certain that someone's life will be better, stronger, and brighter because of you. I can tell you that mine already is. To those of you struggling with math trauma of your own, you are not alone. That's what this is all about. And for real, I really hope that sharing these stories and like letting you listen in on the math therapy that I give my guests helps you work through your own version of math therapy. On that note, it's time. Next Thursday, season two of math therapy starts, and it is a banger of a season. You're gonna laugh, you're gonna cry, you're gonna feel happy and like maybe even mad, because guys, that's what working through math trauma feels like. That's how we make progress, that's how we grow, that's what math therapy is all about. Okay, before I say bye, a reminder that math therapy is hosted by me, Vanessa Vicaria, aka the math guru, produced by Sabina Wex, and edited by David Koachberg. And our theme song is Waves by Goodnight Sunrise, aka My Band. And guys, if you know someone who needs math therapy or needs to hear someone else getting it or like needs to be in on season two, which starts next week, please share this podcast, write a quick review. Those things make such a big difference. One more thing, remember to follow me on all socials at the math guru for everything related to me and math therapy. That's all. You know what to do. Set your timer, mark your calendar, do whatever you do to like remember shit because June 4th, season two starts. Be there or be square. That was a math patch. I was gonna say be circle, but I was like, that's not funny.
unknownOkay.