#55: Johan Unger on the Power of Memes

Johan Unger is the Co-Founder of Meme.com, a place where explorers meet to share their meme discoveries and creations.

In this conversation, we discuss:
- Meme.com
- Memes and social media
- NFTs
- Virtual land
- Memes in the Metaverse
- 'Chief Meme Officers'
- Dogecoin
- Marble Cards Arena game

Meme.com
Website: meme.com
Twitter: @MemeExplorers
Telegram: MemeExplorers

Johan Unger
Twitter: @johanunger
LinkedIn: Johan Unger

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Transcript

Matt Zahab: 0:00

Hey folks, Matt here from crypto news. This is your host and I am extremely excited about today's episode. If you're a fan of memes, you are absolutely going to love this one. Today's guest is a meme expert, literally, and owns one of the coolest companies and domains around meme.com. Our guest is a software professional who specializes in Java, HTML, CSS, PHP and SQL. He's used his knowledge to establish and grow several startups he co founded including koolart Strassel and winner, present day. He's the chief meme officer and ancient alien at meme.com and marble cards, which has received venture capital funding and is growing like wildfire. I'm very pleased to welcome to the crypto news podcast, Johan Unger. Johan, welcome to the show.

Johan Unger: 0:54

Thank you. Happy to be here.

Matt Zahab: 0:56

Really excited to have you on. meme.com, what a name. I got to start off by asking you a question. I'm sure tons of people would love to know. And you don't have to answer this. How much of that domain cost you?

Johan Unger: 1:07

I mean, it's public, the seller announced that 1.2 million USD.

Matt Zahab: 1:12

Wow, and well worth it, I assume?

Johan Unger: 1:15

Definitely well worth it. So we actually paid for it with the revenues from Marble cards. And some luck, so our revenues was in MATIC tokens. And then we were very early on MATIC. So we received a lot of MATIC there. And then as we did MATIC went up and up and up. And we said, okay, we've been this lucky, we should really invest this in something that we believe will have long term value. And so we said as we're in memes, we need to have, as nobody owns means. our one competitive advantage really could be what real estate that would build on. And so we believe meme.com is a very, very powerful brand in a sort of meme economy. So that's where we went with that.

Matt Zahab: 1:56

That's crazy. What? That's absolutely insane. 1.2 mil for a domain that's got to be up there. But I absolutely love that and memes alone, what made you get so hooked on memes? Everyone loves them, like even boomers are starting to fall in love with memes, because they start seeing the same pictures circulating around the internet time after time after time. And then you get familiarized, and then you sort of fall in love. Okay, I get the meaning behind this. What was it about memes that got you to fall in love?

Johan Unger: 2:24

So I've always been interested in how people consume content on the internet, and sort of share content. But it wasn't until early on in 2018, when we started marble cards, that I got really interested in it. And I think that that was because there was this financial aspect. So, brief backstory on what marble cards is. It could be described as a way to bookmark web URLs using NFTs. And so the way it works is if I find a bookmark that I like, it could be a meme on know your meme or like a tweet or a Wikipedia page or something I can quote unquote marble that thing into a NFT containing the URL and the sort of link back to the content. And when we launched that we do that on a site by site basis. So when we launched that we started with the site, know your meme, and so everybody was marbling memes. And initially, right away, people want to have the best cards right? And to be able to determine what are the best cards, you need to learn about all the different memes, right? And so ever since then, I've always considered memes to be these like cultural artifacts that people use in different ways. And they have different values. And so I just went down that path and more and more and more get into why they are important and why I think they will be like the pop culture icons of the future.

Matt Zahab: 3:43

Why the name Marble cards?

Johan Unger: 3:47

Good question. So a marble card consists of an image from the URL taken from the Open Graph. So it's the same image as when you share a link on Twitter or on Reddit or whatever. And around it is a generative art pattern that is slightly similar to a marble pattern. It isn't really, but it kind of looks like it. So marble cards just sounded like a good name. So we're still, now that we're meme.com but the NFTs are still marble cards that will continue to be so. But we are launching more types of entities.

Matt Zahab: 4:24

And we will get into that in a couple minutes. I didn't mean minutes, but we'll get into that later on down the shop. Now, I do want to go back to the inception of meme.com when you were telling and again, you dropped out of uni had a couple successful startups receive VC funding for meme.com What did that pitch look like when you and VCs are in a room or on a zoom? And you're pitching them asking for money. Now of course they know the power of memes but are you literally like we are operating at the intersection of memes it's like NFTs and social media and on your website you describe yourself as what would happen if Doge and Wikipedia had a baby, which is hilarious. What did that conversation look like in the room of VCs?

Johan Unger: 5:05

So more like, more serious than you might think are more like people. The concept of a meme market is something that's been around for a long time, especially in crypto. And obviously, it's things like Dogecoin. But also, later things like the NFT hypersea. Now it's all meme markets, people are speculating on the popularity of different trends, and the people believing in them. And so when we pitch this as a sort of, you know, we want to really dive into this, we want to build tools for the meme market, and being able to capture value of memes and measure them against each other sort of pulled more people in by having these monetary, political games. The people were intrigued investors were intrigued right away. And it was crazy to see the reception we got is very easy round to raise, to be honest. And that's coming from us trying to raise capital since early 2018 on the idea of marble cards. I guess it's due to the NFT hype this year as well. But where we before had received pips in there. This is interesting, but we don't get it at all. And we think that NFTs are interesting, but yeah, we don't know what will happen with that. To them coming into raising funds earlier this year was like this extension of what we're already doing qith all this experience we have and being at the right time in the NFT space, it turned out to be fairly, fairly quick race in terms of time.

Matt Zahab: 6:31

Right time, right place, it seems like that's the secret sauce that you need. Now, you're an NFT expert yourself. And I had LK Shelly on the pod from Affinity. And she's also an NFT expert. And I asked her a question, I'm gonna ask you the same question, a little pretext first. When you go on opensea, and you look at sort of the top 50 NFT projects right now. They're sort of that stencil or that blueprint that keeps being used. It's pick an adjective, and pick an animal, right, like cool cats, lazy lions, and it seems to work. And on top of that, you have these 10,000 NFTs within said collection. And there are eight to 12 characteristics or properties to get randomly generated. And that sort of gives it its utility and its uniqueness and the whole scarcity aspect. Are we going to keep seeing that moving forward? Is this just a trend like what's your whole two cents on this current NFT boom that involves adjective plus animal?

Johan Unger: 7:28

So first of all, I don't check opensea leaderboards basically at all anymore, because I don't think that they you know, it's pure hype right, very little substance. I think that a sign of bubble in crypto has been copycats. We saw it with ICOs we saw it with food ponzies last year, you're seeing with it 10k PFPs now, so I think that this is something that will continue, and most of those will be worth less than what they are now. That said, all bubbles are a sign of something interesting, and I think that this is the first really big bubble I've seen in the NFT space. I've been in since inception in 2017 on aetherium. And so I think as the whole the space will just keep growing and, you know, producing more and more interesting things. I don't think that the 10k copycats are a part of that though. Some are interesting. I think some of them will remain, obviously and I don't count crypto punks, not necessarily board apes to that, but with everything that's coming out now, I think is Yeah, just copycats, which I think are lasting value.

Matt Zahab: 8:42

No, you got a point there. So what's your secret sauce then? If you're going NFT hunting, let's say you know, someone airdrops you a bag of, you know, you got 10k USD in$ETH. Where are you looking to spend that money on if you had to throw it into NFT's right now?

Johan Unger: 8:55

I often get that question from friends and people. So I always answer crypto voxels land. Because I think long term virtual worlds are very good. A very good use case for NFTs because it enables property rights and people to build on property rights to build experiences and real estate. So I always say that and I don't think that's especially hyped at the moment. So that will be my answer now as well. Obviously, things like crypto punks, and early super rare art and art blogs and so on. I think those long term are good investments as well. But obviously they're more hyped at the moment.

Matt Zahab: 9:34

Going back to the whole virtual land thing. Which projects are you most bullish on? Are you a sandbox guy you decentraland guy Somnium Space? Who do you think has the most

Johan Unger: 9:44

It's a good question I have done in all of potential? them. So it's a very difficult question to answer because it's very, very hard to sort of see the future where it's going but I'm definitely most bullish on on crypto voxels. Because I think it's just a such a, one the vibe is the one It feels most authentic to me. It's the first one. I've been one of the biggest. I've been very bullish on crypto voxels since the start. So we're one of the first projects to have like a location there and we have a bunch of plots there, the center and so on. So I'm obviously a bit biased, but I just feel that every time I go there, and that's what gives me the most satisfaction. That said, it's difficult to say they all have their different approaches. The answer might even be that they all will be successful and be a part of like a broader metaverse and play together. So that's what I hope, obviously, but if I had to pick one, it would be crypto voxels.

Matt Zahab: 10:39

I'm gonna ask you a tough question. And I apologize in advance because this one sucks. And I've been asked this as well. How do you measure? You just talked about how it makes you feel? How do you measure that qualitative aspect? Because again, I like going for me, I could spend literally 24 hours every single day, just looking at shitty NFT projects on open sea, I absolutely love it. If I'm on at, you know, 12 midnight, and I go on opensea and go to the projects that are trending over 24 hours. I'm buzzing, I'm up, I get energy. I got a little adrenaline right. It could be Rarible, whatever. What are those feelings you're looking for when you're researching these projects? like can you try to describe what that feeling looks like? For me, I'll look at you know how happy it makes me perhaps like is the sentiment of the NFT? Or the art? Is it happy over sort of sad or maybe violent? That's like one thing for me? How do you explain that qual? And again, my apologies such a tough and weird question.

Johan Unger: 11:35

No, I think it's obviously how it makes me feel at the time is something which, it's a box that needs to be ticked. Sometimes, you know, you follow to follow on Twitter and you buy something that looks okay. I might as well buy this because other people like it, but the big moves I do is when I feel that something, when I can't really see the end of what it is. And I feel that there are so many possibilities and direction that this thing can go that I can squint to see some of them, but I can't see all of them. And that really that really gets me excited. And so projects like that are again, virtual worlds. Virtual clothing, like brands, obviously, our own product product like Marble cards and meme.com can take and the creative platform superare and so on. So that would be my answer.

Matt Zahab: 12:30

So you're looking for infinite potentials, you're looking for?

Johan Unger: 12:34

Yeah, I would say that. Obviously, it's different for art. Art I buy because, you know, a combination of who the artist is and you like what it looks like. But what really gets me excited are those those ideas that you can sort of grasp, but you don't see where they might end up. As opposed to penguin I you know, obviously you can see where, even though I might extrapolate on that. But yeah.

Matt Zahab: 12:58

Of course, and that leads to the next question. Social media, where do you, that's where memes go around. How do you source memes? When you see a meme? How do you know? Or do you have the same feeling like are you like, wow, this meme could have infinite potential? Are you sort of waiting for it to circulate? How does that work, like how do memes become popular?

Johan Unger: 13:19

So memes become popular by having people remix them and share them and sort of engage people with them. For me, personally marble cards always tells you if there is a new meme that is trending or that is sort of bubbling because somebody will have marbled it. Currently there are 130,000 marble cards created. So people really, really want to get the best memes early. So I would say and also that's something what we're trying to achieve, right? We're trying to achieve this very effective skin in the game curation mechanic where people pay money to amplify something. And when they do that, the crap is sort of filtered out because you know, when you share something on social media, I can share anything at no cost. I could just keep spamming everything but we actually have to pay for it. Then sort of filters out and so I would almost say marble cards is my go to source for the latest memes.

Matt Zahab: 14:18

Johan, I'm so curious about the metaverse, how are memes going to play in the metaverse moving forward? What is their purpose in the metaverse?

Johan Unger: 14:26

I think memes are part communication part entertainment. So I think that there will continue to be so in the metaverse. To me the metaverse is digital sort of realm where you can work and sort of spend your time and have fun. And I think that meme creation and extension, communication creation and attainment creation is something that will be very, very important in the metaverse and so I think that the meme economy and creating good memes and spreading them will be something that you not only can have fun work but also profit from if you're good at it.

Matt Zahab: 15:03

Profiting from meme. That's crazy. You are sort of the chief meme officer, I know you and your co founder are both chief meme officers at meme.com

Johan Unger: 15:13

I'm actually only an ancient alien. So we don't have, we have a very flat organization we don't want like, anybody being over and above anyone else.

Matt Zahab: 15:22

Love that.

Johan Unger: 15:22

So, I'm a co founder.

Matt Zahab: 15:24

Okay, so co founder no chief meme officer, but there are actual companies, there are fortune 500 companies, hiring chief meme officers, and paying them hundreds of 1000s of dollars to monetize memes by turning profit and creating communities that is absolute bananas. Imagine if you told someone five years ago that your title would be the chief meme officer and we're gonna pay you 100k that's, again, that's batshit crazy, absolute banana lands. Are we gonna see more of this, like, how integral are memes to a company's social footprint moving forward?

Johan Unger: 15:55

So in this sense, I would equate memes and marketing. Memes are a way, you know, it's a storytelling medium, it's a way to get distribution. And so what they're actually looking for are good marketers that are able to create messages that people want to share. It's the same thing if you look at some like madmen, you know, people they were creating memes, that's essentially what they were doing. So I think it's just a fancy word, like a fun hip where, you know, Boomer is trying to be hip with a no I'm kidding. You know, it's a fancy word for being good at marketing, and being able to understand what gets people to engage.

Matt Zahab: 16:32

That's the first time I've heard that Mad Men reference that's bang on. That is what they were doing back then. That's crazy. And then meme itself, who started the word meme?

Johan Unger: 16:42

Richard Dawkins in the 70s, I think as a way to describe an idea that spreads, basically, so a meme is anything. But then we have internet memes that are ideas that's spread natively on the internet. And so then you have this sort of cultural trace with all these different icons like Doge, and Pepe and hide the Herald, nyan cat. The list goes on.

Matt Zahab: 17:07

Which one's your favorite? You got to pick one. Give me one favorite?

Johan Unger: 17:10

It's a good question. If I were to pick one, I would pick Doge. Just because I think everybody can relate to a fondo dog. And also because I own the Marble card of the first Doge card. So I'm biased. And trying to pump my bags.

Matt Zahab: 17:27

What is that marble card worth right now?

Johan Unger: 17:29

It's a good question. I will never sell it. But if I were to sell it, at least a couple of $ETH, probably more

Matt Zahab: 17:34

That much already?

Johan Unger: 17:35

I mean, it's made in early 2019.

Matt Zahab: 17:38

How did you get it so quick? Were you in on Doge back then?

Johan Unger: 17:41

Marble Card launched on test net in 2018. And then we launched on $ETH main net, early 2019. So we're actually one of the first NFT projects on there. So I made it. Day one, obviously right at the launch of marble cards.

Matt Zahab: 17:58

Okay, so that's some crazy foresight going on there. Why did you think Doge would blow up? Clearly, you thought it would blow up? Or did you just think the dog was cute?

Johan Unger: 18:06

So Dogecoin is actually a very big inspiration of already before we started marble cards, it's the first thingthat has value just because it's a meme. You know, you could argue that Bitcoin to some extent is that as well, but it has all these attributes, but Dogecoin is just valuable because it's the meme. And it's funny, and you know, people buy into that because of that reason. And so that was the inspiration to marble cards, it's the same thing can a card made out of a URL that has no IP claim, or any value from what is actually marbled. But it still is valuable because it's has a memetic connection. So that was the inspiration for Marble cards. And obviously, what we're doing now with with meme.com, as well.

Matt Zahab: 18:54

How big is your Doge bag, you must have gotten nice and early. I see that smile. Folks you can't see a smile at home, but he's smiling big. It's a nice healthy bag. Congrats on that one. Going back to marble cards here. Tell me the process of how they are created. How do I go about minting one? If I see a meme and I'm like, Hey, this is going to be the next big one. I got to get in on this. How do I go from see meme, like it and turn it into a marble card. What does that process look like?

Johan Unger: 19:20

So what you would have to think about, so Marble cards is still all these years, it's still a complicated project. And we're doing it with that intention just because we want to slowly iterate and see what works. But right now there are a limited amount of sites you can Marble from, around 40 to 50, something like that. You can't marble from Twitter or Instagram yet, but that will be possible in the coming weeks. But in terms of memes, we would think that the best source of memes is know your meme, or potentially Reddit. So if you want to capture the most value of a new meme, you will probably try to get the URL from know your meme and marble that, maybe get something from Reddit one of the early sources from there. And technically what you do is you copy the URL, you go to marble cards, there's a credit card button, you just paste it there, check if it's available. If somebody marbled that before you, you can't make it again. If it's available, you pay with meme coin, which is our token, which you can buy on the site. If you don't have any. You're good to go.

Matt Zahab: 20:17

And that's it? No other stipulations no other hidden BS?

Johan Unger: 20:21

No It's a very, very open.

Matt Zahab: 20:24

You said it was complicated?

Johan Unger: 20:26

I mean, it's complicated in the sense that you need to understand, okay, what are the sites that are available. And since there's a limited amount of sides, a lot of URLs are already taken, it's a challenge to find any meme on know your meme. They're like, 10,000 cards created from know your means like, right, like 10,000 memes are created. So in that sense, it's a bit complicated, but yeah, we're just, you know, we see healthy growth in marble cards, people more and more get attached to it. And so I just think it's gonna get better and better. And we have some new features coming up that will also bring support creators and bring royalties to them, which is one thing that we've been lacking.

Matt Zahab: 21:06

That's incredible, and the coin itself. You thought$MEM. Was meme already taken?

Johan Unger: 21:13

Yeah I mean, it's a meme project sort of DeFi NFT project from last summer where you stake meme to get something that you then can buy art from?

Matt Zahab: 21:25

Gotcha.

Johan Unger: 21:26

Okay, so I was saying so yeah, we picked mem up. It's actually Meme in Swedish.

Matt Zahab: 21:31

Oh, that's, it's called mem?

Johan Unger: 21:33

Yeah, I mean, no, it's called meme. It's the same.

Matt Zahab: 21:38

Gotcha. Okay, good to know. Another part about marble cards that is very intriguing is the arena game, I'd love you to tell our listeners a little bit about that.

Johan Unger: 21:47

So the two goals that we're trying to achieve is one curate the value or measure the value of internet content, trends and so on. And the second one is we want to reward content creators, and curators. And step one, what we did with marble cars was we built this platform that let people create these cards out of the URLs, but then you couldn't do anything with it. And if you look at web two platforms, there are always two components, you can create the content, and then you can curate it by liking stuff in the different feeds. That is a very tried approach. And we think coming with the same thing is very difficult. And so we wanted to find a, some like a crypto gamified approach to content curation, so what we came up with is a hot or not, like we have two different sides, you have a or b which you can choose from which you like most. And so that is the arena, it's a set of sub arenas around different topics like memes, or art or movies or just best cards in general. And people can go into those and vote. And as they vote, they earn crypto like play to earn. And on the other side, people submitted cards, and if their cards do well, they also earn meme coin from having put up this great content. That is from marble cards. And so what we're now doing is we're expanding this to all NFTs on meme.com. So you will be able to battle any NFT against any other NFT. So you will have arenas, it could be like best art or best animals or best, whatever thing. And then people battle them against each other, the best ones, win some meme coin, the poor ones lose some because there's a small fee to submit the NFTs to the arena. And then you have these voters, these curators who come in, they can come in daily and vote a little bit now earn some extra crypto from that as well.

Matt Zahab: 23:36

That's a brilliant way to get people to log hours on the platform like you could easily go into rabbit hole and be doing that for hours at a time just clicking yes or no to which one's better. Kudos for that. But the long term community aspect, what is the long term goal of meme.com in regards to creating community and monetizing memes?

Johan Unger: 23:54

It's supporting the meme economy, having people not only artists, but anybody who wants to express creativity in some point to today, to get into one of the NFT... sure you can publish on opensea, obviously, but they have some other content restrictions. But we want people to create memes to create stories who remixed content in different ways. They should be able to come using our our tools. And if they're good at what they do, they should be able to earn a decent amount from that and be able to maybe not entirely, but at least support parts of their life from that. That I would say is like a very, very long term goal. And then in the other side of that, having these creators and curators being rewarded, that that output actually provides a good like a financial signaling mechanism for the value of trends to be able to come to the site and see what is actually trending right now, what do people believe in. People have skin in the game and in doing this curation signals. So those are the two sides one measuring the value of content using crypto incentives and then when doing that rewarding creators and curators.

Matt Zahab: 25:02

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Johan Unger: 26:59

Totally, we're already seeing it. So just in the past months two months or so, we've had one sponsored arena by maker DAO. So people were you know, creating memes of die and these things. And then after that we got approached by their currencies, Rye? So stable coin, so they wanted to do something similar, right. And so as more and more people, you know, become parts of the sort of meme Council, which is the DAO around meme.com. We aggregate all this, the community aggregates all this memetic skill. And so having projects and people who want distribution to come and use the platform, they will hopefully get very, very high quality memes and passion from the community because they really want to prove themselves.

Matt Zahab: 27:52

Why did you form a DAO? Do you think that was an integral part of creating community?

Johan Unger: 27:57

I think it's the way to go out for crypto produce.

Matt Zahab: 27:58

Can you just explain what a DAO is for our listeners at home who might be unfamiliar?

Johan Unger: 28:02

So the term is a decentralized organization or decentralized autonomous organization, it's essentially a camp or a project that don't run on real world company, a real company system, but it rather lives on chain. So you have token holders, and you have people who put out propositions and token holders voting on what should be done and what shouldn't. And then profits, gets decided what should be done with them should some be rolled back to token holders. So it's essentially a decentralized way of running a company or a project. And so we think just the critical thing for us is having a community that is engaged, and that feels that they are part of what we do just as much as we are. And so running this it's actually one overarching DAO. But then every meme club is also a DAO. So it's a structure of incentives and coordination around these things that we're building.

Matt Zahab: 29:05

I like to think of dows is like back in the, you know, the medieval times when maybe there wasn't an actual government and it was just a bunch of smaller tribes. Heck not even medieval times, still happens in countries around the world where you know, you don't need to always go to the big dogs up top to get in charge. Everyone actually has an equal voice kind of thing. If you chip in, you know, you got to eat at the Big Boy table too. It's such a cool aspect.

Johan Unger: 29:31

That's actually a funny, funny way to describe it.

Matt Zahab: 29:33

Yeah. It's like, it sort of is it's sort of not but that's just for people who aren't in crypto. That's sort of the explanation I like to give there. It's just incredibly interesting. I do want to talk about socials here. Obviously, you have Reddit you have Twitter, you have Insta, probably the big three for memes. But in the crypto space specifically, are there any hidden gems or are there any websites where you're like, wow, I this is gonna turn into a meme that aren't on those big three.

Johan Unger: 30:02

Know your meme, obviously, right? But also marble cards looking at what is being marbled from Reddit and Twitter and Instagram. And then I mean obviously outside of that I personally don't use more than a Twitter to be honest it's like a big information source for me when it comes to crypto

Matt Zahab: 30:21

Same Yeah.

Johan Unger: 30:23

I don't use Tik Tok for example, even though I maybe should.

Matt Zahab: 30:27

You guys are crushing it on Tik Tok? You just, it's the thing with Tik Tok is you got to, you need video content. Most memes are still photos.

Johan Unger: 30:35

Yeah, for now. But hope so, we'll work on is having these bounties to have the meme token. And we don't want to use much of it for like staking rewards, and this will probably not what to use them for. But we want to use that for creation bounties basically. And so we can have one week or one time period, we're actually focusing on creating Tik Tok content and having people, having a token model support the efforts of people that can actually give the effort and get something back. So I hope that the creation efforts of the platform will also follow the trends of even if your new platform comes out, then you can quickly adapt and start creating content relevant for that as well. And crowdsource the best one out.

Matt Zahab: 31:20

You're a step ahead of the curve. That's no surprise there. Johan this has been incredible. Couple more questions before we wrap up here. The future of meme.com What does that look like?

Johan Unger: 31:32

Again, I want it to be a platform where anybody can come who is interested in diving deeper into memes that they can understand which are popular memes, which ones should they know about which ones are the valuable ones and try to maybe get learnings from that they can use in their own marketing efforts or just you know, social media for instance and things like that to stay ahead of the curve on what is trending. And what is not trending obviously you can see if memes are dumping as well. And then on the other side, being able to support meme creators, they don't have to be artists, they can just want to tell a story or one you know, express themselves in different ways. If they're good at that they should be able to be supported by the platform. In return of the scale or the entertainment that they provide.

Matt Zahab: 32:19

Any quantitative goals like you want meme token to hit 100 bucks a coin?

Johan Unger: 32:29

1 billion market cap and 1 million daily actives. Just throwing it out there

Matt Zahab: 32:36

That's an achievable goal. I absolutely love that. Any questions for me before we wrap up?

Johan Unger: 32:43

Not really.

Matt Zahab: 32:44

Good to go?

Johan Unger: 32:46

Yes, this was awesome.

Matt Zahab: 32:48

Hey, and last but not least, where can our listeners find you and meme.com on socials?

Johan Unger: 32:53

I'm on Twitter at Johan Unger. I'm most active in discord and discord channels. So if you want to talk to me, I would maybe recommend going there just to post on top of the project but also if you want to talk to me.

Matt Zahab: 33:04

Okay, and now I have one follow up question to that. Discord. I've been getting a lot more into discord over the last couple of weeks. So many incredible NFT projects on discord and just crypto projects in general. Are there any tips or hidden gems to get the most out of discord to get every ounce of knowledge and future profitability at discord? What do you do? What do you recommend there?

Johan Unger: 33:27

So I get a lot of the information from our own Discord. Obviously we have like a very big community there. So I guess it's for me it's a bit different but I've been super bullish on discord since Yeah, since we started marble cards in 2018. So I would highly recommend everyone to get very very, really put in the effort to learn how it works. And if you don't know where to go, I mean maybe look at some of the popular DAO like friends with benefits or some of the others. Check out which are the most popular ones. I think that is a good way to get information maybe before. Stay ahead of the curve, also the Marble cards slash meme.com discord, that's a great, great place to hang out.

Matt Zahab: 34:12

It is and we will plug all of that in the show notes. Johan, thank you so much for coming on. You are a classic Swede. You and your country men and women are just the creme de la creme just great people absolutely phenomenal people and as a huge hockey fan. Tons respect for you guys. Everyone in the hockey community is always like the classiest people they just do everything the right way. And it shows so appreciate you coming on. Really big fan of meme.com and wish you guys all the best moving forward and would love to have you on for round two.

Johan Unger: 34:42

Totally. Thank you for saying that. Warms my heart.

Matt Zahab: 34:46

No problem. Folks, this was Johan Unger from meme.com. What a treat of an episode as a huge meme fan, this one hit home I absolutely love this and some great knowledge bombs as well. We are always dropping on Mondays and Thursdays in the summer. And back to Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays when September rolls around. Appreciate you all listening, love you all stay safe, do your thing. Keep on making those bags, keep growing those bags love you all and we'll talk soon bye for now.