{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":0.78,"endTime":1.62,"body":"Hello and welcome to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1.62,"endTime":2.49,"body":"the fire science show."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2.49,"endTime":3.84,"body":"Episode 38."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":4.41,"endTime":8.58,"body":"First, if you came here because"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":4.41,"endTime":8.58,"body":"someone referred this podcast"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":8.58,"endTime":13.02,"body":"episode to you as a good source"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":8.58,"endTime":13.02,"body":"of knowledge about wood in fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":13.5,"endTime":15.21,"body":"And the issues with"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":13.5,"endTime":15.21,"body":"fire resistance."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":15.24,"endTime":16.35,"body":"You're in a great place."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":16.368,"endTime":18.016,"body":"Please listen till"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":16.368,"endTime":18.016,"body":"the end, because."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":18.384,"endTime":22.45,"body":"This episode is jam"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":18.384,"endTime":22.45,"body":"packed with, insights that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":22.553,"endTime":24.173,"body":"it's very hard to find."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":24.356,"endTime":24.986,"body":"Elsewhere."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":25.466,"endTime":27.116,"body":"In such a convenient form."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":27.386,"endTime":27.776,"body":"So."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":28.029,"endTime":31.233,"body":"Dear listener if you're here,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":28.029,"endTime":31.233,"body":"because you're curious about."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":31.263,"endTime":32.163,"body":"The wood in the fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":32.546,"endTime":33.656,"body":"You're going to like it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":34.046,"endTime":35.726,"body":"I guess, well, maybe not."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":35.906,"endTime":39.446,"body":"What we have to say, but you're"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":35.906,"endTime":39.446,"body":"going to enjoy the new knowledge"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":39.506,"endTime":41.336,"body":"that is being shared here."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":41.353,"endTime":44.023,"body":"By people who actually research"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":41.353,"endTime":44.023,"body":"timber in burning fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":44.533,"endTime":47.128,"body":"And to  All of my"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":44.533,"endTime":47.128,"body":"trustee listeners."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":47.428,"endTime":49.378,"body":"Welcome again to the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":47.428,"endTime":49.378,"body":"Fire Science Show."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":49.828,"endTime":52.078,"body":"It's going to be a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":49.828,"endTime":52.078,"body":"fun episode again."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":52.108,"endTime":56.061,"body":"I know timber in fire is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":52.108,"endTime":56.061,"body":"one of the favorite topics"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":56.061,"endTime":58.791,"body":"on the podcast, and I'm"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":56.061,"endTime":58.791,"body":"going to bring more of that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":59.271,"endTime":61.911,"body":"And today I'm bringing you Dr."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":61.911,"endTime":66.441,"body":"Daniel Brandon from RISE in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":61.911,"endTime":66.441,"body":"Sweden, who is a researcher"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":66.441,"endTime":69.801,"body":"on timber in fire, on mass"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":66.441,"endTime":69.801,"body":"timber in tall buildings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":70.341,"endTime":73.911,"body":"Who has done multiple large"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":70.341,"endTime":73.911,"body":"scale fire experiments"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":73.941,"endTime":75.441,"body":"with exposed timber."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":76.041,"endTime":79.401,"body":"And knows quite a bit"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":76.041,"endTime":79.401,"body":"about the difficulties"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":79.401,"endTime":80.841,"body":"related to this subject."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":81.351,"endTime":84.381,"body":"And for this talk I chose"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":81.351,"endTime":84.381,"body":"the theme to be fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":84.381,"endTime":88.185,"body":"resistance because, I am"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":84.381,"endTime":88.185,"body":"very curious was Daniel"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":88.215,"endTime":91.665,"body":"opinion on fire resistance,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":88.215,"endTime":91.665,"body":"but as you will hear."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":92.025,"endTime":95.085,"body":"Well, we ventured quiet away"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":92.025,"endTime":95.085,"body":"from that in the episode."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":95.185,"endTime":97.941,"body":"Into some of the very"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":95.185,"endTime":97.941,"body":"important things that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":97.941,"endTime":100.611,"body":"matter when designing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":97.941,"endTime":100.611,"body":"timber building in fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":100.911,"endTime":104.601,"body":"So yeah, maybe, maybe the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":100.911,"endTime":104.601,"body":"topic is not correctly picked."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":105.021,"endTime":105.921,"body":"But I like it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":105.921,"endTime":107.241,"body":"So I left it like this."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":107.721,"endTime":110.055,"body":"And, yeah, I hope"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":107.721,"endTime":110.055,"body":"you stay to the end."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":110.085,"endTime":111.555,"body":"It's a great episode."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":111.585,"endTime":113.805,"body":"Full of great insight."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":114.285,"endTime":115.635,"body":"I hope you enjoy it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":115.635,"endTime":117.385,"body":"So, yeah, lets go."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":117.533,"endTime":120.245,"body":"lets spin  the intro and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":117.533,"endTime":120.245,"body":"jump into the episode."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":143.774,"endTime":144.494,"body":"Hello everybody."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":144.614,"endTime":146.054,"body":"I'm here today with Dr."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":146.054,"endTime":148.634,"body":"Daniel, Brandon"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":146.054,"endTime":148.634,"body":"from RISE in Sweden."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":148.704,"endTime":149.244,"body":"Hi, Daniel."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":149.274,"endTime":149.984,"body":"Great to have you here."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":150.064,"endTime":151.144,"body":"Hi, good morning."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":151.219,"endTime":151.939,"body":"good to be here."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":152.003,"endTime":155.469,"body":"we've met"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":152.003,"endTime":155.469,"body":"like in 2019, I think it wasn't."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":155.469,"endTime":159.019,"body":"You were, at this point"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":155.469,"endTime":159.019,"body":"receiving some NFPA awards"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":159.049,"endTime":162.169,"body":"and I think it was also"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":159.049,"endTime":162.169,"body":"related to timber fire, right?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":162.544,"endTime":163.042,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":163.042,"endTime":166.32,"body":"That was a project we did,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":163.042,"endTime":166.32,"body":"in collaboration with NFPA"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":166.342,"endTime":168.502,"body":"and NIST and NRC, Canada."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":168.532,"endTime":170.305,"body":"And we got an award"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":168.532,"endTime":170.305,"body":"for the project."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":170.543,"endTime":171.983,"body":"That's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":170.543,"endTime":171.983,"body":"so cool, because today I've"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":171.983,"endTime":175.197,"body":"invited you to talk about"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":171.983,"endTime":175.197,"body":"another aspect of timber"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":175.197,"endTime":179.023,"body":"in fire, which is a very"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":175.197,"endTime":179.023,"body":"popular theme in the podcast."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":179.593,"endTime":183.263,"body":"And, so far I I've talked"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":179.593,"endTime":183.263,"body":"with Danny Hopkin about, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":183.383,"endTime":186.993,"body":"overall fire engineering of,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":183.383,"endTime":186.993,"body":"mass timber buildings and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":187.003,"endTime":190.198,"body":"implications of that, both the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":187.003,"endTime":190.198,"body":"positive and the negative ones."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":190.38,"endTime":194.43,"body":"I had Felix Weisner who did,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":190.38,"endTime":194.43,"body":"talk in depth about the role"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":194.43,"endTime":197.927,"body":"of adhesives the physics"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":194.43,"endTime":197.927,"body":"of, moisture transport in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":197.927,"endTime":201.287,"body":"wood and some really, really"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":197.927,"endTime":201.287,"body":"interesting things about"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":201.287,"endTime":202.683,"body":"how it behaves and that's."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":203.102,"endTime":205.842,"body":"in all of these talks, we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":203.102,"endTime":205.842,"body":"often come to the concept of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":205.842,"endTime":209.158,"body":"fire resistance and I need to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":205.842,"endTime":209.158,"body":"talk with someone about this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":209.158,"endTime":210.628,"body":"concept in relation to fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":210.628,"endTime":213.418,"body":"And so I figured out you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":210.628,"endTime":213.418,"body":"were going to be a great"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":213.418,"endTime":214.888,"body":"guest in, in that topic."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":215.098,"endTime":219.002,"body":"So to set the theme of our"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":215.098,"endTime":219.002,"body":"talk today, we're, going"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":219.002,"endTime":221.308,"body":"to be talking about, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":219.002,"endTime":221.308,"body":"concept of fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":221.308,"endTime":222.448,"body":"in timber buildings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":222.988,"endTime":225.028,"body":"Maybe you would like to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":222.988,"endTime":225.028,"body":"introduce the listeners"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":225.028,"endTime":228.178,"body":"to, to like, what is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":225.028,"endTime":228.178,"body":"the fight resistance?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":228.178,"endTime":231.718,"body":"Because I have this feeling,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":228.178,"endTime":231.718,"body":"you know, that, fire engineers"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":231.718,"endTime":236.712,"body":"who work in laboratories or are"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":231.718,"endTime":236.712,"body":"researchers have a completely"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":236.712,"endTime":238.932,"body":"different comprehension of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":236.712,"endTime":238.932,"body":"what fire resistance would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":238.932,"endTime":242.448,"body":"be then an architect or a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":238.932,"endTime":242.448,"body":"non-fire stakeholder, which"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":242.478,"endTime":243.588,"body":"is the root of the problem."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":243.588,"endTime":244.218,"body":"In my opinion,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":244.397,"endTime":246.917,"body":"Yeah, sir,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":244.397,"endTime":246.917,"body":"there are many misconceptions"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":246.917,"endTime":250.064,"body":"about fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":246.917,"endTime":250.064,"body":"testing and I will get to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":250.064,"endTime":251.754,"body":"the misconceptions later."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":252.081,"endTime":255.249,"body":"but fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":252.081,"endTime":255.249,"body":"testing, is usually done"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":255.279,"endTime":257.036,"body":"on, structural members."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":257.066,"endTime":262.272,"body":"It could be walls ceilings or"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":257.066,"endTime":262.272,"body":"floor slabs, columns and beams."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":262.696,"endTime":266.176,"body":"then we have structural fire"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":262.696,"endTime":266.176,"body":"resistance testing and we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":266.176,"endTime":269.712,"body":"have, a compartment dividing,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":266.176,"endTime":269.712,"body":"fire resistance testing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":269.772,"endTime":271.392,"body":"and a combination thereof."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":271.422,"endTime":275.659,"body":"So you can have fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":271.422,"endTime":275.659,"body":"sets where you look at, the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":275.659,"endTime":277.749,"body":"ability of a wall to, define."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":278.187,"endTime":283.1,"body":"Compartments, to bear the loads,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":278.187,"endTime":283.1,"body":"in a building during a firearm."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":283.85,"endTime":287.253,"body":"And, the problem is that we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":283.85,"endTime":287.253,"body":"don't actually look at real"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":287.253,"endTime":289.818,"body":"fires in a fire resistance test."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":290.023,"endTime":292.093,"body":"weave in a fire assistance test."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":292.093,"endTime":295.635,"body":"We follow prescribed, time"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":292.093,"endTime":295.635,"body":"temperature curve,  and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":295.635,"endTime":300.741,"body":"that is actually defined by"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":295.635,"endTime":300.741,"body":"the, ISO 8 3, 4 standard."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":301.256,"endTime":301.916,"body":"So the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":301.916,"endTime":304.646,"body":"thing is that it's not a fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":304.886,"endTime":308.876,"body":"It's more like temperature,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":304.886,"endTime":308.876,"body":"boundary condition in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":308.876,"endTime":310.292,"body":"posts on the sample."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":310.589,"endTime":315.346,"body":"And, we know it, let's say"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":310.589,"endTime":315.346,"body":"worked for hundred years more"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":315.346,"endTime":317.956,"body":"or less, even if we hate the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":315.346,"endTime":317.956,"body":"concept and that we know it's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":317.956,"endTime":321.578,"body":"unphysical, but, but it's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":317.956,"endTime":321.578,"body":"somehow worked for the industry"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":322.063,"endTime":324.073,"body":"so what, why coming"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":322.063,"endTime":324.073,"body":"back to it now?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":324.073,"endTime":327.243,"body":"W what is the difference"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":324.073,"endTime":327.243,"body":"when you put the timber frame"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":327.243,"endTime":329.839,"body":"or combustible wall inside?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":330.353,"endTime":332.974,"body":"well, if,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":330.353,"endTime":332.974,"body":"if you're a specimen is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":332.974,"endTime":337.371,"body":"combustible, and it becomes"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":332.974,"endTime":337.371,"body":"involved during the fire test,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":337.371,"endTime":339.858,"body":"it actually adds to the heat."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":341.803,"endTime":342.553,"body":"the furnace."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":342.673,"endTime":346.319,"body":"So you're, combusting wood"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":342.673,"endTime":346.319,"body":"adds to the heat energy"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":346.349,"endTime":347.429,"body":"and the temperature."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":348.283,"endTime":351.613,"body":"however the temperature is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":348.283,"endTime":351.613,"body":"controlled and that means"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":351.613,"endTime":354.773,"body":"that you somehow have to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":351.613,"endTime":354.773,"body":"lower the energy input."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":355.193,"endTime":358.252,"body":"And the only way you can"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":355.193,"endTime":358.252,"body":"actually do that is by lowering,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":358.269,"endTime":360.676,"body":"your fuel input in the furnace."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":360.676,"endTime":364.686,"body":"And that means that your"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":360.676,"endTime":364.686,"body":"burners will you have to reduce"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":364.686,"endTime":369.382,"body":"the burner efficiency in your"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":364.686,"endTime":369.382,"body":"furnace, um, It is actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":369.382,"endTime":373.855,"body":"possible that your, specimen"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":369.382,"endTime":373.855,"body":"contributes enough to completely"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":373.855,"endTime":375.175,"body":"shut down the burners."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":375.715,"endTime":378.895,"body":"And in those cases you can"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":375.715,"endTime":378.895,"body":"still control the temperature"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":378.895,"endTime":382.942,"body":"by increasing the ventilation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":378.895,"endTime":382.942,"body":"through your furnace and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":382.942,"endTime":385.611,"body":"reduce the temperature by"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":382.942,"endTime":385.611,"body":"reducing the ventilation,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":385.708,"endTime":386.758,"body":"through your furnace."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":387.451,"endTime":389.073,"body":"I'll"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":387.451,"endTime":389.073,"body":"ask you a brutal question"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":389.073,"endTime":392.823,"body":"that I'm often being asked"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":389.073,"endTime":392.823,"body":"by, people who disagree"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":392.823,"endTime":395.666,"body":"with with me, questioning"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":392.823,"endTime":395.666,"body":"this feature of furnaces."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":395.696,"endTime":399.896,"body":"And I also feel uncomfortable"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":395.696,"endTime":399.896,"body":"turning off my furnace when"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":399.896,"endTime":401.336,"body":"I'm doing fire resistance test."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":401.766,"endTime":404.253,"body":"In that case, maybe we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":401.766,"endTime":404.253,"body":"should call it, the cooling,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":404.253,"endTime":405.543,"body":"fire test or something."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":405.573,"endTime":408.243,"body":"When we use the furnace"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":405.573,"endTime":408.243,"body":"to reduce the temperature"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":408.243,"endTime":409.233,"body":"rather than increase it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":409.653,"endTime":411.419,"body":"But, I'm often being asked."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":411.899,"endTime":415.993,"body":"So what I mean, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":411.899,"endTime":415.993,"body":"sample burns, but the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":415.993,"endTime":417.343,"body":"temperature is inside."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":417.373,"endTime":422.236,"body":"So what, it doesn't change the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":417.373,"endTime":422.236,"body":"temperature condition, but I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":422.236,"endTime":423.886,"body":"feel that it's still wrong."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":424.046,"endTime":424.966,"body":"What's your opinion."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":425.533,"endTime":426.823,"body":"it depends."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":426.823,"endTime":429.223,"body":"It's actually, this is a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":426.823,"endTime":429.223,"body":"very difficult question, but"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":429.223,"endTime":432.76,"body":"it does depend, when people"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":429.223,"endTime":432.76,"body":"talk about these kinds of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":432.76,"endTime":436.863,"body":"questions, they somehow refer"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":432.76,"endTime":436.863,"body":"to real building fires as well."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":436.863,"endTime":441.057,"body":"So we actually have to look at"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":436.863,"endTime":441.057,"body":"both and real building fires."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":441.087,"endTime":444.143,"body":"The energy contribution"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":441.087,"endTime":444.143,"body":"of wood go somewhere."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":444.233,"endTime":446.633,"body":"I guess there are three options."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":447.115,"endTime":451.995,"body":"The energy combusts inside the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":447.115,"endTime":451.995,"body":"compartment, the energy commerce"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":452.015,"endTime":455.295,"body":"outside of the confinement,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":452.015,"endTime":455.295,"body":"or it doesn't combust at all."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":455.625,"endTime":458.165,"body":"and I guess, it is possible"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":455.625,"endTime":458.165,"body":"that it doesn't combust"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":458.165,"endTime":461.155,"body":"at all, but because it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":458.165,"endTime":461.155,"body":"just combustible gases that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":461.365,"endTime":464.855,"body":"eventually don't combust, but"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":461.365,"endTime":464.855,"body":"it's not actually very likely."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":465.215,"endTime":467.765,"body":"So it's either combusting"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":465.215,"endTime":467.765,"body":"inside or outside."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":468.134,"endTime":470.675,"body":"when it combusts inside,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":468.134,"endTime":470.675,"body":"it actually increases"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":470.675,"endTime":471.515,"body":"the temperature."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":472.058,"endTime":475.358,"body":"however, in a ventilation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":472.058,"endTime":475.358,"body":"controlled fire, the gases"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":475.358,"endTime":476.648,"body":"cannot combust the inside."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":476.648,"endTime":479.318,"body":"There is not enough"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":476.648,"endTime":479.318,"body":"oxygen in that case."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":479.318,"endTime":483.079,"body":"It combusts outside and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":479.318,"endTime":483.079,"body":"it might influenced a fire"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":483.102,"endTime":484.572,"body":"exposure to your facade."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":484.968,"endTime":488.098,"body":"but it doesn't increase, the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":484.968,"endTime":488.098,"body":"temperature inside the room."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":488.702,"endTime":493.055,"body":"What it can do is actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":488.702,"endTime":493.055,"body":"extend, the fire duration."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":493.412,"endTime":496.978,"body":"so in, most cases, the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":493.412,"endTime":496.978,"body":"fire is influenced by the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":496.978,"endTime":498.237,"body":"contribution of the wood."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":498.265,"endTime":501.458,"body":"and that is not the case"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":498.265,"endTime":501.458,"body":"in fire resistance testing."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":502.068,"endTime":505.186,"body":"However, if the ventilation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":502.068,"endTime":505.186,"body":"controlled condition,  in real"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":505.186,"endTime":508.803,"body":"buildings, the contribution of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":505.186,"endTime":508.803,"body":"the wood has the least impact"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":508.833,"endTime":511.22,"body":"on, the internal compartment,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":511.255,"endTime":511.52,"body":"fire"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":511.52,"endTime":512.21,"body":"conditions."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":512.614,"endTime":513.034,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":513.034,"endTime":517.39,"body":"I'm just writing a rebuttal for"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":513.034,"endTime":517.39,"body":"a paper about fire testing of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":517.39,"endTime":518.59,"body":"food that this will be helpful."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":518.8,"endTime":522.954,"body":"And, but, for seriousness, I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":518.8,"endTime":522.954,"body":"think you touch a very important"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":522.954,"endTime":526.842,"body":"thing that, when, We question"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":522.954,"endTime":526.842,"body":"and the fire resistance, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":526.842,"endTime":530.202,"body":"discussion is magically move"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":526.842,"endTime":530.202,"body":"towards fires in buildings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":530.712,"endTime":533.099,"body":"Whereas, as long as we don't"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":530.712,"endTime":533.099,"body":"discuss timber in buildings,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":533.099,"endTime":537.155,"body":"fire resistance is, discussed,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":533.099,"endTime":537.155,"body":"you know, as a testing protocol,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":537.155,"endTime":538.775,"body":"not, a real fire phenomenon."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":538.955,"endTime":542.432,"body":"So I feel that there's some"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":538.955,"endTime":542.432,"body":"acrobatics happening, you know,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":542.445,"endTime":544.665,"body":"when did you justify an opinion?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":544.665,"endTime":547.835,"body":"We, we suddenly start, saying"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":544.665,"endTime":547.835,"body":"that that fire resistance is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":547.835,"endTime":550.325,"body":"a good representation of a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":547.835,"endTime":550.325,"body":"building fire when or it's not,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":550.865,"endTime":554.675,"body":"especially not, a fire on its"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":550.865,"endTime":554.675,"body":"ventilation control, not a fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":554.675,"endTime":557.405,"body":"in a fairly small compartment"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":554.675,"endTime":557.405,"body":"that is ventilation controlled,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":557.855,"endTime":560.735,"body":"which we know that may have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":557.855,"endTime":560.735,"body":"much higher temperatures"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":560.765,"endTime":564.222,"body":"than the standard fire in,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":560.765,"endTime":564.222,"body":"the first 30, 60 minutes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":564.222,"endTime":564.762,"body":"For sure."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":565.332,"endTime":565.767,"body":"And."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":565.767,"endTime":568.372,"body":"There's also this, you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":565.767,"endTime":568.372,"body":"know, parametric fires and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":568.372,"endTime":571.552,"body":"there's this magical gamma"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":568.372,"endTime":571.552,"body":"parameter, which describes"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":571.552,"endTime":573.712,"body":"the ratios of openings,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":571.552,"endTime":573.712,"body":"the walls and everything."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":573.712,"endTime":577.552,"body":"And there's the value of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":573.712,"endTime":577.552,"body":"that, which is one where the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":577.552,"endTime":582.322,"body":"fire is exact as the standard"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":577.552,"endTime":582.322,"body":"time temperature relation."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":583.012,"endTime":586.182,"body":"And I must admit in some"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":583.012,"endTime":586.182,"body":"fire experiments I've"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":586.182,"endTime":588.822,"body":"seen the configurations"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":586.182,"endTime":588.822,"body":"like that in any truly did"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":588.852,"endTime":590.555,"body":"look like a standard fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":590.615,"endTime":593.645,"body":"So I'm not saying that fires"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":590.615,"endTime":593.645,"body":"like that do not exist in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":593.645,"endTime":598.055,"body":"reality, but I've seen so many"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":593.645,"endTime":598.055,"body":"where the peak would emerge"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":598.085,"endTime":601.145,"body":"so early in the fire and would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":598.085,"endTime":601.145,"body":"be like in the, in the range"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":601.155,"endTime":604.315,"body":"of one thousand one hundred"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":601.155,"endTime":604.315,"body":"thousand one hundred degrees,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":604.345,"endTime":607.402,"body":"much more higher than, and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":604.345,"endTime":607.402,"body":"then the standard curve or the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":607.402,"endTime":611.332,"body":"peak would arrive very late"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":607.402,"endTime":611.332,"body":"when, when we did traveling"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":611.332,"endTime":614.152,"body":"fire experiments and that the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":611.332,"endTime":614.152,"body":"peak arrived after 30 minutes"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":614.152,"endTime":615.585,"body":"of, very, low temperatures."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":615.915,"endTime":616.335,"body":"So."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":616.699,"endTime":619.939,"body":"You cannot put the parallel"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":616.699,"endTime":619.939,"body":"between the furnace and the real"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":619.939,"endTime":626.065,"body":"fires, and you cannot use real"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":619.939,"endTime":626.065,"body":"fires to defend, the furnace"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":626.065,"endTime":629.155,"body":"when something is not right."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":629.515,"endTime":632.485,"body":"I wanted to ask you, because"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":629.515,"endTime":632.485,"body":"I know you have been involved"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":632.485,"endTime":635.959,"body":"in, a large mass timber project"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":632.485,"endTime":635.959,"body":"Fire Safe Implementation of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":635.959,"endTime":640.849,"body":"Mass Timber in Tall Buildings"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":635.959,"endTime":640.849,"body":"carried in RISE and, you've"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":640.849,"endTime":644.869,"body":"observed firsthand the behavior"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":640.849,"endTime":644.869,"body":"of, of large compartments"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":644.899,"endTime":648.189,"body":"with, multiple surfaces"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":644.899,"endTime":648.189,"body":"exposed, of exposed timber."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":648.695,"endTime":651.155,"body":"how did that fire dynamics look?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":651.185,"endTime":654.722,"body":"Did you observe differences"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":651.185,"endTime":654.722,"body":"in the compartment fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":654.722,"endTime":657.642,"body":"dynamics when changing the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":654.722,"endTime":657.642,"body":"amount of exposed wood?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":657.675,"endTime":659.055,"body":"Because you had the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":657.675,"endTime":659.055,"body":"same compartment"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":659.055,"endTime":659.925,"body":"over and over, right."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":660.475,"endTime":660.871,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":660.871,"endTime":664.56,"body":"So we, did do a number of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":660.871,"endTime":664.56,"body":"tests actually in total"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":664.67,"endTime":667.798,"body":"I've being involved in 18"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":664.67,"endTime":667.798,"body":"compartment, fire tests."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":668.128,"endTime":671.837,"body":"So not only that project,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":668.128,"endTime":671.837,"body":"but, , the exposed wood"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":671.867,"endTime":674.857,"body":"does contribute, , to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":671.867,"endTime":674.857,"body":"fires in several ways."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":674.857,"endTime":677.71,"body":"And, the project you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":674.857,"endTime":677.71,"body":"talked about, most fires"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":677.71,"endTime":681.79,"body":"for ventilation controlled"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":677.71,"endTime":681.79,"body":"in those fires, you don't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":681.91,"endTime":685.31,"body":"actually increase the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":681.91,"endTime":685.31,"body":"temperature inside compartment."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":685.837,"endTime":688.61,"body":"if the baseline test with"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":685.837,"endTime":688.61,"body":"everything without exposed"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":688.65,"endTime":691.501,"body":"wood  is already ventilation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":688.65,"endTime":691.501,"body":"controlled, you can"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":691.501,"endTime":694.351,"body":"actually expose wood and the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":691.501,"endTime":694.351,"body":"temperature doesn't increase."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":694.741,"endTime":697.437,"body":"However, the duration"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":694.741,"endTime":697.437,"body":"of the fully developed"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":697.437,"endTime":698.517,"body":"phase did increase."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":699.397,"endTime":704.317,"body":"And also, the external"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":699.397,"endTime":704.317,"body":"combustion did increase, in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":704.317,"endTime":708.011,"body":"compartments for the larger"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":704.317,"endTime":708.011,"body":"opening we actually saw that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":708.161,"endTime":711.714,"body":"you can actually increase"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":708.161,"endTime":711.714,"body":"the temperature, in those"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":711.714,"endTime":716.006,"body":"cases, the fire is ventilation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":711.714,"endTime":716.006,"body":"controlled, and it might,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":716.199,"endTime":717.999,"body":"extend the fire duration."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":718.409,"endTime":722.059,"body":"but we haven't seen a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":718.409,"endTime":722.059,"body":"significant extension"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":722.059,"endTime":724.599,"body":"of that failure duration"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":722.059,"endTime":724.599,"body":"for those compartments."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":725.128,"endTime":728.158,"body":"I guess the conclusion is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":725.128,"endTime":728.158,"body":"the energy goes somewhere,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":728.176,"endTime":731.141,"body":"but if it's a ventilation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":728.176,"endTime":731.141,"body":"controlled fire, it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":731.141,"endTime":734.831,"body":"doesn't really go inside"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":731.141,"endTime":734.831,"body":"until the end of the fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":734.831,"endTime":737.978,"body":"When, when your, fuel on the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":734.831,"endTime":737.978,"body":"floor starts to burn out."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":738.419,"endTime":741.343,"body":"Then it's still possible"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":738.419,"endTime":741.343,"body":"that your, timber structures"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":741.373,"endTime":744.273,"body":"keeps your, fire fully"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":741.373,"endTime":744.273,"body":"developed for a while."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":744.638,"endTime":744.752,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":744.752,"endTime":748.668,"body":"So, that would be the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":744.752,"endTime":748.668,"body":"consequence in fire dynamics"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":748.998,"endTime":750.737,"body":"now in terms of exposure, right."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":750.745,"endTime":752.785,"body":"I you say plots and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":752.785,"endTime":753.085,"body":"you say"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":753.085,"endTime":755.263,"body":"that the ventilation"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":753.085,"endTime":755.263,"body":"control doesn't increase"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":755.263,"endTime":757.818,"body":"when you expose wood but"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":755.263,"endTime":757.818,"body":"you are already touching"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":757.818,"endTime":760.488,"body":"like 1200 degrees Celsius."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":760.908,"endTime":764.048,"body":"So, I mean, there's not much"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":760.908,"endTime":764.048,"body":"more space to increase from"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":764.048,"endTime":766.088,"body":"that because you're almost"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":764.048,"endTime":766.088,"body":"at the flame temperature"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":766.088,"endTime":767.538,"body":"with your upper smoke layer."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":767.988,"endTime":771.048,"body":"So, so there already has"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":767.988,"endTime":771.048,"body":"been, yeah, there they are."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":771.288,"endTime":774.182,"body":"I mean, in standard fire,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":771.288,"endTime":774.182,"body":"this temperature would be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":774.182,"endTime":776.822,"body":"reached I don't know, at sixth"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":774.182,"endTime":776.822,"body":"hour of sun or something."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":776.822,"endTime":780.9,"body":"So after 30 minutes, you, you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":776.822,"endTime":780.9,"body":"have, 800 something degrees."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":780.9,"endTime":782.79,"body":"After one hour we have 930."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":782.82,"endTime":786.09,"body":"So that's a quite"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":782.82,"endTime":786.09,"body":"a vast difference."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":786.51,"endTime":789.62,"body":"And, in real fire you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":786.51,"endTime":789.62,"body":"can expect temperatures"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":789.62,"endTime":790.73,"body":"well above a thousand."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":791.24,"endTime":794.84,"body":"And in a test, you subject"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":791.24,"endTime":794.84,"body":"your specimen to temperatures"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":794.87,"endTime":798.86,"body":"around 800, 900 ish Celsius."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":798.92,"endTime":802.55,"body":"And, we need to remember that,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":798.92,"endTime":802.55,"body":"radiation is in the fourth"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":802.55,"endTime":804.02,"body":"power of, of temperature."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":804.02,"endTime":807.29,"body":"So the differences between"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":804.02,"endTime":807.29,"body":"these two values in terms of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":807.29,"endTime":810.35,"body":"the heat flux are insanely high."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":811.42,"endTime":813.64,"body":"degrees between"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":811.42,"endTime":813.64,"body":"and a thousand is a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":813.775,"endTime":817.241,"body":"I mean, a hundred degrees"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":813.775,"endTime":817.241,"body":"between 900 and a thousand is a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":817.241,"endTime":818.531,"body":"really, really big difference."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":818.903,"endTime":822.985,"body":"so now in your compartment,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":818.903,"endTime":822.985,"body":"fire experiment, you have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":822.985,"endTime":826.568,"body":"completely different exposure"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":822.985,"endTime":826.568,"body":"of the surface of the woods than"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":826.778,"endTime":828.815,"body":"you would have in the furnace."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":829.355,"endTime":829.505,"body":"And."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":830.21,"endTime":833.066,"body":"In the, in the furnace,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":830.21,"endTime":833.066,"body":"we know that, we sometimes"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":833.066,"endTime":835.18,"body":"do, well, maybe not us."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":835.24,"endTime":837.58,"body":"Maybe it's the costumer,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":835.24,"endTime":837.58,"body":"so the clients, but."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":838.343,"endTime":840.653,"body":"you know, you design a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":838.343,"endTime":840.653,"body":"sample to pass the test."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":840.653,"endTime":843.113,"body":"You don't design a sample"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":840.653,"endTime":843.113,"body":"to be the best sample"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":843.113,"endTime":844.133,"body":"in the world of samples."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":844.463,"endTime":846.113,"body":"You design the sample"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":844.463,"endTime":846.113,"body":"to pass the test."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":846.803,"endTime":851.603,"body":"And in terms of passive fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":846.803,"endTime":851.603,"body":"protection, you choose how many"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":851.693,"endTime":854.57,"body":"protection boards or what's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":851.693,"endTime":854.57,"body":"the depth of the intumescent"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":854.6,"endTime":858.14,"body":"paint, or how much wood you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":854.6,"endTime":858.14,"body":"need to put on it to just pass"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":858.14,"endTime":862.99,"body":"the test in terms of wood,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":858.14,"endTime":862.99,"body":"this engineering is often"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":863.006,"endTime":864.566,"body":"done in terms of chairing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":864.836,"endTime":868.076,"body":"Like you would have this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":864.836,"endTime":868.076,"body":"depth of char in your, test"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":868.076,"endTime":871.226,"body":"specimen, which will make"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":868.076,"endTime":871.226,"body":"it okay at this exposure."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":871.526,"endTime":873.506,"body":"But then you go into"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":871.526,"endTime":873.506,"body":"real compartment."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":873.546,"endTime":876.52,"body":"It changes completely that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":873.546,"endTime":876.52,"body":"you observe, quicker child"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":876.52,"endTime":880.03,"body":"formation or stronger char"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":876.52,"endTime":880.03,"body":"fall off in this experiments"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":880.24,"endTime":883.21,"body":"compared to what would you see"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":880.24,"endTime":883.21,"body":"in, in, in a resistance tests?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":883.979,"endTime":884.609,"body":"yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":884.639,"endTime":885.539,"body":"Yeah, definitely."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":885.619,"endTime":889.489,"body":"the charging rates are much, uh,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":885.619,"endTime":889.489,"body":"they can be much higher in a, in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":889.489,"endTime":894.455,"body":"a real compartment test, than we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":889.489,"endTime":894.455,"body":"speak of without delamination."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":894.475,"endTime":898.062,"body":"You can have one millimeter"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":894.475,"endTime":898.062,"body":"per minute, quite easily, with"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":898.062,"endTime":902.133,"body":"delamination, , temporarily, it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":898.062,"endTime":902.133,"body":"goes really much beyond that."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":902.253,"endTime":906.05,"body":"It goes two millimeters"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":902.253,"endTime":906.05,"body":"per minute, for a while,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":906.05,"endTime":907.946,"body":"and then it quickly lowers."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":908.348,"endTime":912.141,"body":"yeah, I think, one thing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":908.348,"endTime":912.141,"body":"that, is important to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":912.141,"endTime":917.268,"body":"mention is that affects of de"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":912.141,"endTime":917.268,"body":"lamination in a compartment."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":917.268,"endTime":920.75,"body":"Fire are much more"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":917.268,"endTime":920.75,"body":"significant than effects of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":920.9,"endTime":922.168,"body":"delamination in a furnace."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":922.178,"endTime":926.201,"body":"So in a furnace test, we might"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":922.178,"endTime":926.201,"body":"have some additional charring."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":927.091,"endTime":931.168,"body":"and, eventually to meet the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":927.091,"endTime":931.168,"body":"criteria and to, to meet the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":931.168,"endTime":936.538,"body":"requirements, you might need an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":931.168,"endTime":936.538,"body":"additional amount of material."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":937.198,"endTime":940.198,"body":"So you can say you need a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":937.198,"endTime":940.198,"body":"certain percentage of extra"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":940.198,"endTime":943.108,"body":"material to together fire"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":940.198,"endTime":943.108,"body":"assistance of two hours."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":943.474,"endTime":946.661,"body":"but in reality, if you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":943.474,"endTime":946.661,"body":"allow, delamination in a real"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":946.661,"endTime":950.655,"body":"compartment fire, it actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":946.661,"endTime":950.655,"body":"can have very significant"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":950.655,"endTime":953.388,"body":"consequences actually can"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":950.655,"endTime":953.388,"body":"mean, the difference between"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":953.388,"endTime":957.498,"body":"a building with standing of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":953.388,"endTime":957.498,"body":"full natural fire, or are"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":957.498,"endTime":962.065,"body":"actually a building collapsing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":957.498,"endTime":962.065,"body":"eventually, during the fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":962.361,"endTime":964.941,"body":"and then we don't talk"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":962.361,"endTime":964.941,"body":"about a certain percentage"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":964.941,"endTime":965.991,"body":"of additional material."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":965.991,"endTime":969.455,"body":"You just talk about,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":965.991,"endTime":969.455,"body":"a very significant"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":969.815,"endTime":970.115,"body":"You've"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":971.165,"endTime":971.825,"body":"of the fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":972.668,"endTime":975.038,"body":"In ITB and we did let's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":975.038,"endTime":976.358,"body":"say a funny experiment."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":976.548,"endTime":980.155,"body":"we've built a walls"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":976.548,"endTime":980.155,"body":"with OSB sheets on a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":980.215,"endTime":981.655,"body":"timbers substructure."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":982.015,"endTime":985.075,"body":", very simple wall that was"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":982.015,"endTime":985.075,"body":"calculated to withstand"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":985.075,"endTime":987.685,"body":"something like 30 minutes"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":985.075,"endTime":987.685,"body":"of standard fire exposure"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":988.375,"endTime":990.085,"body":"and we've went into, okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":990.115,"endTime":992.981,"body":"So if we want the furnace,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":990.115,"endTime":992.981,"body":"we have this standard"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":992.981,"endTime":994.451,"body":"temperature relation in it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":994.788,"endTime":995.568,"body":"Let's find."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":995.81,"endTime":999.698,"body":"How much heat the furnace does"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":995.81,"endTime":999.698,"body":"need to actually hit itself up"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":999.728,"endTime":1001.708,"body":"to this standard temperature."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1002.278,"endTime":1004.891,"body":"So we've closed the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1002.278,"endTime":1004.891,"body":"furnace, with, a wall"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1004.891,"endTime":1007.111,"body":"that's built from the same"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1004.891,"endTime":1007.111,"body":"material as the furnace."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1007.111,"endTime":1009.434,"body":"So there was no sample,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1007.111,"endTime":1009.434,"body":"it was just a furnace."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1009.814,"endTime":1013.108,"body":"and we've run a 30 minute"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1009.814,"endTime":1013.108,"body":"fire resistance test"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1013.108,"endTime":1014.278,"body":"on the furnace itself."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1014.908,"endTime":1017.441,"body":"And we've captured,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1014.908,"endTime":1017.441,"body":"this, we called it the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1017.441,"endTime":1019.278,"body":"baseline heat release rate."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1019.308,"endTime":1021.888,"body":"Like we we've captured"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1019.308,"endTime":1021.888,"body":"how much heat does the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1021.888,"endTime":1023.781,"body":"furnace need to heat itself."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1024.891,"endTime":1026.991,"body":"Then we've placed the OSB wall."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1027.141,"endTime":1030.035,"body":"We've done a standard"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1027.141,"endTime":1030.035,"body":"fire resistance test."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1030.395,"endTime":1032.915,"body":"It didn't go well"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1030.395,"endTime":1032.915,"body":"because we couldn't"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1032.945,"endTime":1034.325,"body":"control the temperatures."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1034.63,"endTime":1038.29,"body":"we maybe have used two small"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1034.63,"endTime":1038.29,"body":"furnace for that, but, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1038.29,"endTime":1041.39,"body":"temperatures were already"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1038.29,"endTime":1041.39,"body":"like a hundred degrees above"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1041.39,"endTime":1043.22,"body":"both the standard curve"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1041.39,"endTime":1043.22,"body":"and we couldn't have not"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1043.7,"endTime":1045.05,"body":"do anything more about it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1045.83,"endTime":1048.86,"body":"It was very hard to control and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1045.83,"endTime":1048.86,"body":"then we've did the same test"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1048.86,"endTime":1052.61,"body":"repeated it, but we've imposed"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1048.86,"endTime":1052.61,"body":"the condition on the furnace"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1052.85,"endTime":1056.83,"body":"that, okay, you can lower the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1052.85,"endTime":1056.83,"body":"heat release rate, but you can"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1056.83,"endTime":1060.04,"body":"never go below this baseline"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1056.83,"endTime":1060.04,"body":"curve that we determined"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1060.052,"endTime":1061.432,"body":"that you need to hit itself."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1061.462,"endTime":1062.771,"body":"And the idea was that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1063.491,"endTime":1068.607,"body":"wood is a very good insulator"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1063.491,"endTime":1068.607,"body":"So, we will impose at least"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1068.607,"endTime":1070.643,"body":"this amount of heat that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1068.607,"endTime":1070.643,"body":"you would need to heat up an"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1070.643,"endTime":1074.393,"body":"insulator to the standard 10"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1070.643,"endTime":1074.393,"body":"time temperature relation and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1074.393,"endTime":1078.773,"body":"whatever would contributes"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1074.393,"endTime":1078.773,"body":"from itself it's contributed."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1078.833,"endTime":1081.383,"body":"And it will just"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1078.833,"endTime":1081.383,"body":"raise the temperature."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1081.833,"endTime":1086.393,"body":"And here we got like 200, 300"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1081.833,"endTime":1086.393,"body":"degrees above a standard curve."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1086.723,"endTime":1090.803,"body":"The test duration has decreased"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1086.723,"endTime":1090.803,"body":"from 28 minutes to 23 minutes"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1090.803,"endTime":1091.943,"body":"if I recall correctly."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1092.365,"endTime":1094.447,"body":"so the, difference"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1092.365,"endTime":1094.447,"body":"was quite striking."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1094.477,"endTime":1096.713,"body":"It was so much quicker"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1094.477,"endTime":1096.713,"body":"to destroy the, sample."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1097.133,"endTime":1100.773,"body":"And then we did a third test in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1097.133,"endTime":1100.773,"body":"which we have, done the same."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1101.568,"endTime":1104.988,"body":"I in the second one, but we've"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1101.568,"endTime":1104.988,"body":"over ventilated the furnace."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1104.988,"endTime":1108.138,"body":"So we said, okay, now you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1104.988,"endTime":1108.138,"body":"have the baseline heat."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1108.858,"endTime":1112.518,"body":"You can combust and you have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1108.858,"endTime":1112.518,"body":"all the oxygen in the world"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1112.518,"endTime":1113.718,"body":"you want for combustion."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1113.718,"endTime":1115.272,"body":"So burn as much as you want."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1115.932,"endTime":1119.142,"body":"And we actually lost"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1115.932,"endTime":1119.142,"body":"some turmeric couples."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1119.202,"endTime":1120.072,"body":"It was insane."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1120.072,"endTime":1125.682,"body":"The fire in the furnace and the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1120.072,"endTime":1125.682,"body":"sample got destroyed in like 16"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1125.682,"endTime":1129.462,"body":"or 17 minutes half of the time,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1125.682,"endTime":1129.462,"body":"then it took to destroy the same"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1129.462,"endTime":1131.022,"body":"sample in the standard test."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1131.562,"endTime":1135.035,"body":"And of course it was just,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1131.562,"endTime":1135.035,"body":"an OSB wall, nothing fancy,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1135.335,"endTime":1136.445,"body":"nothing really designed."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1136.445,"endTime":1140.008,"body":"It was not structural timber"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1136.445,"endTime":1140.008,"body":"or not nothing really like, it"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1140.018,"endTime":1141.248,"body":"was a sample that that's it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1141.428,"endTime":1144.178,"body":"We didn't have any, agenda"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1141.428,"endTime":1144.178,"body":"behind it to show that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1144.178,"endTime":1145.708,"body":"OSB walls can be great."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1145.738,"endTime":1148.218,"body":"We just wanted to test the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1145.738,"endTime":1148.218,"body":"conception, that idea that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1148.258,"endTime":1152.448,"body":"if you impose like a baseline"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1148.258,"endTime":1152.448,"body":"heat released and the test"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1152.448,"endTime":1154.838,"body":"goes quite different and."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1155.087,"endTime":1159.0,"body":"The funny aspect is if we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1155.087,"endTime":1159.0,"body":"have put the same condition,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1159.0,"endTime":1161.71,"body":"like there is the minimum"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1159.0,"endTime":1161.71,"body":"heat release rate into any"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1161.71,"endTime":1165.58,"body":"other tests, like any other"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1161.71,"endTime":1165.58,"body":"non-combustible test, it would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1165.58,"endTime":1168.46,"body":"not do anything because the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1165.58,"endTime":1168.46,"body":"tests were already above the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1168.46,"endTime":1171.85,"body":"threshold because of the furnace"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1168.46,"endTime":1171.85,"body":"action and the, he transferred"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1171.85,"endTime":1174.07,"body":"the sample and sample not"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1171.85,"endTime":1174.07,"body":"contributing to the furnace."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1174.46,"endTime":1178.75,"body":"So it only affected, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1174.46,"endTime":1178.75,"body":"sample in the furnace."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1179.05,"endTime":1183.747,"body":"So I found it really astounding"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1179.05,"endTime":1183.747,"body":"that when you change this little"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1183.747,"endTime":1187.0,"body":"in the test, And we did add"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1183.747,"endTime":1187.0,"body":"literally 200, 300 kilowatts"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1187.0,"endTime":1189.85,"body":"to the furnace was not a huge"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1187.0,"endTime":1189.85,"body":"amount of heat that we add."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1190.27,"endTime":1194.45,"body":"And you suddenly cut the fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1190.27,"endTime":1194.45,"body":"resistance period by 30%,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1194.45,"endTime":1196.85,"body":"by 50%, that's astounding."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1197.06,"endTime":1200.21,"body":"And now in your ventilation"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1197.06,"endTime":1200.21,"body":"control room, we know that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1200.21,"endTime":1202.73,"body":"there is damaging going in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1200.21,"endTime":1202.73,"body":"the, in the compartment."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1202.76,"endTime":1204.95,"body":"You may lose doors,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1202.76,"endTime":1204.95,"body":"you may lose windows."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1205.31,"endTime":1209.337,"body":"You may, have cracks in the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1205.31,"endTime":1209.337,"body":"wall that suddenly give some"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1209.367,"endTime":1212.607,"body":"oxygen near the sample, and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1209.367,"endTime":1212.607,"body":"then it will contribute."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1212.937,"endTime":1216.177,"body":"So it will be somewhere between"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1212.937,"endTime":1216.177,"body":"our experiment two and three."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1216.447,"endTime":1219.63,"body":"So I wondered if you ever"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1216.447,"endTime":1219.63,"body":"tried, something like that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1219.876,"endTime":1220.146,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1220.206,"endTime":1222.451,"body":"And that, that is, very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1220.206,"endTime":1222.451,"body":"difficult question that I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1222.451,"endTime":1225.635,"body":"don't have the answer to, but"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1222.451,"endTime":1225.635,"body":"I think,  it's good to discuss"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1225.635,"endTime":1227.135,"body":"the problems that we face."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1227.135,"endTime":1230.129,"body":"So in a furnace is designed"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1227.135,"endTime":1230.129,"body":"to maintain the heat."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1230.304,"endTime":1234.417,"body":"and we have very insulated"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1230.304,"endTime":1234.417,"body":"walls small ventilation, very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1234.417,"endTime":1236.007,"body":"little ventilation usually."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1236.355,"endTime":1239.987,"body":"and if he add the contribution"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1236.355,"endTime":1239.987,"body":"of wood, yes, it will be"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1239.987,"endTime":1242.794,"body":"very significant, and it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1239.987,"endTime":1242.794,"body":"will be more significant"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1242.794,"endTime":1244.704,"body":"than in most building fires."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1245.074,"endTime":1248.842,"body":"So in a building compartment,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1245.074,"endTime":1248.842,"body":"we have, lost his through"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1248.842,"endTime":1252.276,"body":"walls, but it will be, likely"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1248.842,"endTime":1252.276,"body":"more than the heat loss"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1252.426,"endTime":1253.669,"body":"through, uh, furnace wall."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1254.109,"endTime":1257.336,"body":"we have usually much more"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1254.109,"endTime":1257.336,"body":"ventilation, especially"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1257.336,"endTime":1258.686,"body":"in case of a flash over."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1259.926,"endTime":1263.467,"body":"if he add the energy of wood in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1259.926,"endTime":1263.467,"body":"a compartment fire condition,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1263.531,"endTime":1266.771,"body":"it will have a different effect"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1263.531,"endTime":1266.771,"body":"than the energy of wood and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1266.781,"endTime":1270.371,"body":"a furnace condition it's is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1266.781,"endTime":1270.371,"body":"however, very interesting."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1270.757,"endTime":1275.171,"body":"it's a good attempt to include"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1270.757,"endTime":1275.171,"body":"the contribution of wood."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1275.411,"endTime":1280.367,"body":"However, there doesn't seem to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1275.411,"endTime":1280.367,"body":"be a very easy way to do that,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1280.494,"endTime":1281.964,"body":"in a way that is relevant."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1282.264,"endTime":1285.881,"body":"So another method that,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1282.264,"endTime":1285.881,"body":"includes to contribution of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1285.881,"endTime":1289.581,"body":"wood in addition to the fuel"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1285.881,"endTime":1289.581,"body":"is, a radiant panel testing."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1290.157,"endTime":1293.771,"body":"we, at the university of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1290.157,"endTime":1293.771,"body":"Edinburgh developed, , the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1293.771,"endTime":1297.881,"body":"H Tris test where a radiant"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1293.771,"endTime":1297.881,"body":"panel moves towards a specimen."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1298.511,"endTime":1301.841,"body":"Actually, those were the first"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1298.511,"endTime":1301.841,"body":"fire tests I've ever conducted"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1301.971,"endTime":1305.792,"body":"at the university of Edinburgh"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1301.971,"endTime":1305.792,"body":"and what it does is it oppose"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1305.852,"endTime":1310.924,"body":"imposes, radiation to a specimen"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1305.852,"endTime":1310.924,"body":"and the specimen combis and,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1310.962,"endTime":1312.829,"body":"it leads to, flames as well."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1312.829,"endTime":1315.289,"body":"And those flames radiate"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1312.829,"endTime":1315.289,"body":"to the specimen as well."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1315.289,"endTime":1318.671,"body":"So there, you can see"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1315.289,"endTime":1318.671,"body":"you actually, separated"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1318.671,"endTime":1322.046,"body":"the heat source, and the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1318.671,"endTime":1322.046,"body":"fuel contribution, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1322.076,"endTime":1326.006,"body":"both are included in the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1322.076,"endTime":1326.006,"body":"test and this test can be"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1326.216,"endTime":1328.556,"body":"relevant in some scenarios."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1328.556,"endTime":1332.756,"body":"However this test is actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1328.556,"endTime":1332.756,"body":"done, in room conditions"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1332.756,"endTime":1336.682,"body":"and you have a lot of oxygen"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1332.756,"endTime":1336.682,"body":"available, and that is sometimes"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1336.682,"endTime":1340.082,"body":"the case, in a building,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1336.682,"endTime":1340.082,"body":"but actually only right."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1340.847,"endTime":1343.761,"body":"When most of the times, when you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1340.847,"endTime":1343.761,"body":"have a flashover fire, you do"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1343.761,"endTime":1349.337,"body":"have a low oxygen concentration"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1343.761,"endTime":1349.337,"body":"close to your, timber surface."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1349.487,"endTime":1353.557,"body":"And, what we found is that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1349.487,"endTime":1353.557,"body":"this age stress test, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1353.567,"endTime":1357.431,"body":"guess it's useful for some"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1353.567,"endTime":1357.431,"body":"scenarios, but not to represent"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1357.524,"endTime":1361.882,"body":"a fully developed fire or a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1357.524,"endTime":1361.882,"body":"flesh over fire where oxygen"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1361.934,"endTime":1363.507,"body":"concentrations are low."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1364.339,"endTime":1367.879,"body":"one issue that timber has an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1364.339,"endTime":1367.879,"body":"high oxygen concentrations is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1367.879,"endTime":1371.819,"body":"that the char that comes to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1367.879,"endTime":1371.819,"body":"exist, starts to oxidize and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1371.819,"endTime":1376.169,"body":"that results in additional"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1371.819,"endTime":1376.169,"body":"energy and in low oxygen"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1376.199,"endTime":1379.229,"body":"concentration environments"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1376.199,"endTime":1379.229,"body":"this char doesn't oxidize."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1379.269,"endTime":1383.209,"body":"At least it can, reach very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1379.269,"endTime":1383.209,"body":"high temperatures of around"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1383.209,"endTime":1385.549,"body":"1200 degrees without oxidizing."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1385.852,"endTime":1388.519,"body":"and therefore it doesn't,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1385.852,"endTime":1388.519,"body":"lead to this additional"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1388.519,"endTime":1392.099,"body":"energy, but it also, it also"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1388.519,"endTime":1392.099,"body":"maintains the char layer,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1392.466,"endTime":1394.026,"body":"which is also an insulated"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1394.987,"endTime":1397.106,"body":"it's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1394.987,"endTime":1397.106,"body":"really, nice that you've already"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1397.156,"endTime":1399.886,"body":"made the paralell between the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1397.156,"endTime":1399.886,"body":"fence and the environment that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1399.886,"endTime":1404.161,"body":"in fact, in a furnace edition"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1399.886,"endTime":1404.161,"body":"of the timber combustion will"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1404.161,"endTime":1407.631,"body":"be more severe because of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1404.161,"endTime":1407.631,"body":"the, of how the furnace is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1407.631,"endTime":1410.391,"body":"constructed versus how the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1407.631,"endTime":1410.391,"body":"compartment is constructed."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1410.961,"endTime":1412.731,"body":"And we need to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1410.961,"endTime":1412.731,"body":"keep that in mind."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1412.731,"endTime":1413.121,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1413.151,"endTime":1414.441,"body":"Thank you very much for that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1414.441,"endTime":1416.691,"body":"That's a very important thought."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1416.758,"endTime":1418.532,"body":"and obviously there"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1416.758,"endTime":1418.532,"body":"is no simple answer."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1419.061,"endTime":1422.704,"body":"We did it as in literally"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1419.061,"endTime":1422.704,"body":"exploratory experiments"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1422.734,"endTime":1424.834,"body":"because we just wanted"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1422.734,"endTime":1424.834,"body":"to see what happens."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1424.834,"endTime":1427.518,"body":"You know, we are and I,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1424.834,"endTime":1427.518,"body":"I guess you say you share"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1427.518,"endTime":1428.988,"body":"the same passion for fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1429.318,"endTime":1431.648,"body":"You know, there is only one"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1429.318,"endTime":1431.648,"body":"way to find out what happens"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1431.668,"endTime":1433.408,"body":"it is by setting it on fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1433.948,"endTime":1437.231,"body":"And, I think, and H-Tris is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1433.948,"endTime":1437.231,"body":"also an interesting approach,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1437.261,"endTime":1441.711,"body":"but I think we somehow need"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1437.261,"endTime":1441.711,"body":"to fit the, the timber in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1441.711,"endTime":1446.301,"body":"the furnace because of the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1441.711,"endTime":1446.301,"body":"paradigm of the industry."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1446.331,"endTime":1450.308,"body":"You know, fire resistance is so"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1446.331,"endTime":1450.308,"body":"prevalent in the industry that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1450.473,"endTime":1453.918,"body":"If you want to have an"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1450.473,"endTime":1453.918,"body":"effect on how buildings"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1453.918,"endTime":1456.948,"body":"are built, you need to go"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1453.918,"endTime":1456.948,"body":"back to fire resistance."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1457.548,"endTime":1459.818,"body":"The architect will"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1457.548,"endTime":1459.818,"body":"not care about whether"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1459.818,"endTime":1461.298,"body":"wood oxidizes or not."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1461.388,"endTime":1464.298,"body":"They will care if it's 60"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1461.388,"endTime":1464.298,"body":"minutes or two hours, because"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1464.328,"endTime":1468.054,"body":"that's what the code tells"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1464.328,"endTime":1468.054,"body":"them to put in this, barrier."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1468.564,"endTime":1471.692,"body":"And I think the battle"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1468.564,"endTime":1471.692,"body":"may be already lost."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1471.692,"endTime":1474.272,"body":"Like we will not be able"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1471.692,"endTime":1474.272,"body":"to change the paradigm,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1474.272,"endTime":1475.292,"body":"at least not easily."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1475.622,"endTime":1478.136,"body":"Like we will not be able to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1475.622,"endTime":1478.136,"body":"tell from today, we're not"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1478.136,"endTime":1481.466,"body":"working with fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1478.136,"endTime":1481.466,"body":"periods because It would be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1481.466,"endTime":1483.476,"body":"too difficult for the other"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1481.466,"endTime":1483.476,"body":"stakeholders to comprehend."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1483.986,"endTime":1489.219,"body":"So we need somehow to find a way"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1483.986,"endTime":1489.219,"body":"to, give a number on the timber"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1489.219,"endTime":1495.059,"body":"structure that is maybe a little"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1489.219,"endTime":1495.059,"body":"more realistic, but, would be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1495.089,"endTime":1496.709,"body":"comparable with everything else."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1496.709,"endTime":1498.299,"body":"And I have no idea"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1496.709,"endTime":1498.299,"body":"how to do that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1498.329,"endTime":1499.655,"body":"That's a hell of a problem."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1499.699,"endTime":1500.299,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1500.689,"endTime":1502.532,"body":"I do have an answer, I guess."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1502.785,"endTime":1504.195,"body":"I've got, I've got an opinion."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1504.255,"endTime":1508.709,"body":"So the problem is that, we work"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1504.255,"endTime":1508.709,"body":"in and prescriptive regulations."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1508.709,"endTime":1513.012,"body":"We work in, classifications and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1508.709,"endTime":1513.012,"body":"this system has been used for"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1513.012,"endTime":1516.192,"body":"classification for a long time,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1513.012,"endTime":1516.192,"body":"for more than a hundred years."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1516.675,"endTime":1520.629,"body":"and in artists you use that in a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1516.675,"endTime":1520.629,"body":"useful way, that led us actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1520.629,"endTime":1524.932,"body":"to challenge and, whether we can"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1520.629,"endTime":1524.932,"body":"use it is actually, dependent"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1524.932,"endTime":1526.282,"body":"on what you want to achieve."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1527.142,"endTime":1531.049,"body":"if you ignore timber or the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1527.142,"endTime":1531.049,"body":"combustibility of timber, if"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1531.049,"endTime":1534.395,"body":"we look at concrete structures"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1531.049,"endTime":1534.395,"body":"in the past, fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1534.395,"endTime":1538.925,"body":"testing has been to some"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1534.395,"endTime":1538.925,"body":"extent, useful to, to prevent"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1538.955,"endTime":1542.885,"body":"collapses in buildings who can"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1538.955,"endTime":1542.885,"body":"say, okay, the, the exposure"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1543.245,"endTime":1547.212,"body":"is not very realistic, but"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1543.245,"endTime":1547.212,"body":"you can say if you, if your"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1547.512,"endTime":1551.952,"body":"fire resistance requirements"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1547.512,"endTime":1551.952,"body":"is high enough, let's see we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1551.982,"endTime":1555.77,"body":"take a fire assistance of, six"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1551.982,"endTime":1555.77,"body":"hours In a concrete building,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1556.04,"endTime":1560.24,"body":"it's very, very unlikely that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1556.04,"endTime":1560.24,"body":"your structure will collapse."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1560.654,"endTime":1564.074,"body":"and no matter what the fire"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1560.654,"endTime":1564.074,"body":"curve is, you need such a high"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1564.074,"endTime":1568.59,"body":"fuel load and such a severe"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1564.074,"endTime":1568.59,"body":"condition that is actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1568.59,"endTime":1571.08,"body":"in reality, very unlikely."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1571.18,"endTime":1575.234,"body":"So for timber, and that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1571.18,"endTime":1575.234,"body":"actually changes a bit because"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1575.234,"endTime":1579.086,"body":"there is a scenario where"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1575.234,"endTime":1579.086,"body":"your timber just continuous"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1579.086,"endTime":1580.527,"body":"to contribute to the fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1581.037,"endTime":1584.404,"body":"You can say if the, a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1581.037,"endTime":1584.404,"body":"contribution to the fire of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1584.404,"endTime":1588.234,"body":"your timber structure, doesn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1584.404,"endTime":1588.234,"body":"stop, until it's fully consumed,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1588.471,"endTime":1590.584,"body":"then you have a problem"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1588.471,"endTime":1590.584,"body":"because then you don't have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1590.584,"endTime":1591.844,"body":"a timber structure anymore."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1591.844,"endTime":1595.11,"body":"You will have a collapse"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1591.844,"endTime":1595.11,"body":"and that's, one difference."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1595.17,"endTime":1597.607,"body":"Uh, so if the assignment"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1595.17,"endTime":1597.607,"body":"is, the goal is."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1597.986,"endTime":1602.672,"body":"prevent collapse in any"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1597.986,"endTime":1602.672,"body":"natural fire, without relying"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1602.672,"endTime":1607.382,"body":"on something or someone"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1602.672,"endTime":1607.382,"body":"extinguishing the fire, then you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1607.382,"endTime":1609.212,"body":"need more than fire resistance."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1609.212,"endTime":1612.172,"body":"You would need a whole set"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1609.212,"endTime":1612.172,"body":"of prescriptive regulations."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1612.172,"endTime":1616.609,"body":"You need a limitation of how"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1612.172,"endTime":1616.609,"body":"much timber you can expose"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1617.239,"endTime":1620.309,"body":"you need, , requirements"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1617.239,"endTime":1620.309,"body":"regarding material behavior."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1620.939,"endTime":1624.669,"body":"For example, if your CLT is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1620.939,"endTime":1624.669,"body":"allowed to de-laminate, it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1624.669,"endTime":1629.151,"body":"becomes really difficult to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1624.669,"endTime":1629.151,"body":"actually guarantee that the fire"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1629.151,"endTime":1630.801,"body":"will extinguish at some point."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1631.475,"endTime":1633.829,"body":"so you need to prevent"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1631.475,"endTime":1633.829,"body":"those things you need to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1633.859,"endTime":1636.88,"body":"prevent, gypsum fall off,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1633.859,"endTime":1636.88,"body":"which has pretty much the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1636.88,"endTime":1640.637,"body":"same effect of your gypsum"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1636.88,"endTime":1640.637,"body":"boards protection falls off"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1640.637,"endTime":1642.697,"body":"from your, , timber wall."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1642.697,"endTime":1646.093,"body":"Then it actually, will suddenly"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1642.697,"endTime":1646.093,"body":"start to contribute to the fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1646.093,"endTime":1650.07,"body":"If the fire is hot enough,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1646.093,"endTime":1650.07,"body":"you also should probably"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1650.07,"endTime":1653.49,"body":"prevent a significant"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1650.07,"endTime":1653.49,"body":"contribution of protected"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1653.55,"endTime":1656.7,"body":"wood, even if it's still"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1653.55,"endTime":1656.7,"body":"protected, but it's charring."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1656.7,"endTime":1658.707,"body":"It still contributes"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1656.7,"endTime":1658.707,"body":"to the fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1659.067,"endTime":1663.027,"body":"And unfortunately this, this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1659.067,"endTime":1663.027,"body":"heat produced can be trapped,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1663.537,"endTime":1666.737,"body":"partially trapped between"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1663.537,"endTime":1666.737,"body":"the gypsum and the, wood."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1666.917,"endTime":1669.737,"body":"And it might actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1666.917,"endTime":1669.737,"body":"make extinguishment,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1669.787,"endTime":1670.89,"body":"completely impossible."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1671.652,"endTime":1675.454,"body":"but those sets of regulations,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1671.652,"endTime":1675.454,"body":"plus, potentially more,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1675.754,"endTime":1680.464,"body":"you need to prevent a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1675.754,"endTime":1680.464,"body":"collapse in real buildings."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1680.524,"endTime":1682.804,"body":"So you would need a whole"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1680.524,"endTime":1682.804,"body":"set of, prescriptive"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1682.804,"endTime":1683.944,"body":"regulations to do it."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1684.629,"endTime":1687.77,"body":"Or you go to a performance-based"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1684.629,"endTime":1687.77,"body":"approach and where you need"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1687.77,"endTime":1690.954,"body":"to Marin, you need to show"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1687.77,"endTime":1690.954,"body":"that your fire, actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1691.274,"endTime":1692.904,"body":"decays at some point,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1693.514,"endTime":1694.234,"body":"which is also"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1694.239,"endTime":1697.329,"body":"that's this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1694.239,"endTime":1697.329,"body":"is good one Uh, already a good"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1697.384,"endTime":1697.834,"body":"do that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1698.138,"endTime":1699.158,"body":"That's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1698.138,"endTime":1699.158,"body":"this is a really good"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1699.158,"endTime":1700.285,"body":"one there was already a good"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1700.285,"endTime":1700.465,"body":"one."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1700.465,"endTime":1704.995,"body":"Then if your tests, your let's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1700.465,"endTime":1704.995,"body":"say concrete wall, and it gives"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1704.995,"endTime":1706.765,"body":"you two hours fire rating."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1707.431,"endTime":1710.1,"body":"When you put the two hour"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1707.431,"endTime":1710.1,"body":"wall into the building,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1710.128,"endTime":1712.678,"body":"I will now make horrible"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1710.128,"endTime":1712.678,"body":"mistake, but it's loud."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1713.678,"endTime":1714.598,"body":"You could say that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1714.598,"endTime":1714.868,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1714.868,"endTime":1716.848,"body":"It can take two hours of a fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1717.088,"endTime":1717.871,"body":"And, and."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1718.949,"endTime":1721.413,"body":"or if the fire is shorter,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1718.949,"endTime":1721.413,"body":"it will just survive."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1721.413,"endTime":1723.753,"body":"And be there in reality"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1721.413,"endTime":1723.753,"body":"is more complex than that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1724.023,"endTime":1726.363,"body":"because of the, of the, how"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1724.023,"endTime":1726.363,"body":"he transferred works and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1726.363,"endTime":1727.863,"body":"how natural fires developed."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1727.863,"endTime":1731.073,"body":"But in essence, you would have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1727.863,"endTime":1731.073,"body":"just let this wall can stand"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1731.073,"endTime":1732.423,"body":"for two hours and that's it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1732.753,"endTime":1735.193,"body":"Then you turn off the fire,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1732.753,"endTime":1735.193,"body":"the walls, still stands."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1735.693,"endTime":1739.076,"body":"In terms of, of combustible"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1735.693,"endTime":1739.076,"body":"structural component, your two"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1739.076,"endTime":1743.126,"body":"hour span, you say, okay, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1739.076,"endTime":1743.126,"body":"fire is gone and now we have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1743.216,"endTime":1745.736,"body":"to put out the construction"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1743.216,"endTime":1745.736,"body":"because it's still burning"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1745.736,"endTime":1746.756,"body":"and still contributing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1747.146,"endTime":1749.563,"body":"So, so that's the paradigm"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1747.146,"endTime":1749.563,"body":"shifting difference, you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1749.563,"endTime":1753.456,"body":"know, that, in the previous"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1749.563,"endTime":1753.456,"body":"world where we didn't really"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1753.456,"endTime":1756.366,"body":"have that much exposed"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1753.456,"endTime":1756.366,"body":"combustible, structural"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1756.366,"endTime":1759.14,"body":"elements, you passed your."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1759.193,"endTime":1761.445,"body":"test duration and you're"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1759.193,"endTime":1761.445,"body":"done with the test it's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1761.505,"endTime":1765.645,"body":"it has passed a high five"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1761.505,"endTime":1765.645,"body":"and let's sell it in here."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1765.885,"endTime":1769.725,"body":"You pass the two hour test and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1765.885,"endTime":1769.725,"body":"you are left with the problem"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1769.725,"endTime":1773.715,"body":"of, the structure contributing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1769.725,"endTime":1773.715,"body":"now, not just the fire that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1773.715,"endTime":1778.305,"body":"has gone off or has burnt out"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1773.715,"endTime":1778.305,"body":"completely, but you have a,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1778.305,"endTime":1781.335,"body":"still a contributing source of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1778.305,"endTime":1781.335,"body":"a fuel that you would not have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1781.335,"endTime":1783.105,"body":"before if it was in combustible."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1783.645,"endTime":1787.251,"body":"And now I'm now in a two story"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1783.645,"endTime":1787.251,"body":"building, build of wood and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1787.251,"endTime":1788.751,"body":"I'm very comfortable in it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1789.051,"endTime":1789.981,"body":"And I love it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1789.981,"endTime":1793.001,"body":"And I can imagine why people"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1789.981,"endTime":1793.001,"body":"would like to, have in the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1793.001,"endTime":1797.128,"body":"city center the same, feel of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1793.001,"endTime":1797.128,"body":"the warmth and beauty, as I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1797.128,"endTime":1802.23,"body":"have in here But when you have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1797.128,"endTime":1802.23,"body":"a 30 floor skyscraper, It is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1802.23,"endTime":1806.256,"body":"a challenge to, you know, put"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1802.23,"endTime":1806.256,"body":"that structure of, on the 30th"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1806.256,"endTime":1809.72,"body":"floor, compared to what you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1806.256,"endTime":1809.72,"body":"can do from the ground level"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1809.75,"endTime":1813.11,"body":"to apply water, to, to do an"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1809.75,"endTime":1813.11,"body":"external action, to actually"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1813.11,"endTime":1814.73,"body":"stop this, contribution."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1815.45,"endTime":1818.75,"body":"So I guess that's the most"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1815.45,"endTime":1818.75,"body":"challenging aspect of tall"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1818.78,"endTime":1821.96,"body":"timber in fire, not the fact"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1818.78,"endTime":1821.96,"body":"that it has insufficient fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1821.96,"endTime":1825.766,"body":"resistance, not the fact that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1821.96,"endTime":1825.766,"body":"it, will it generate char layer"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1825.796,"endTime":1828.916,"body":"quick enough or not, will it"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1825.796,"endTime":1828.916,"body":"laminate or not that, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1828.916,"endTime":1832.126,"body":"these are technical issues,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1828.916,"endTime":1832.126,"body":"but the true issue is like,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1832.16,"endTime":1835.55,"body":"if the structure is a part of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1832.16,"endTime":1835.55,"body":"the fire after the fire has"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1835.55,"endTime":1837.23,"body":"ended, what do we do with it?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1837.23,"endTime":1838.73,"body":"And that that's the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1837.23,"endTime":1838.73,"body":"biggest challenge, right?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1839.078,"endTime":1839.692,"body":"yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1839.812,"endTime":1841.102,"body":"I agree with that."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1841.282,"endTime":1845.089,"body":"I think that that part of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1841.282,"endTime":1845.089,"body":"the research, challenges,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1845.145,"endTime":1846.622,"body":"hasn't been focused."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1847.072,"endTime":1849.688,"body":"The focus wasn't on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1847.072,"endTime":1849.688,"body":"that for a long time."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1850.318,"endTime":1851.41,"body":"and I guess it, it is."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1851.682,"endTime":1855.732,"body":"for a reason, like 20 years"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1851.682,"endTime":1855.732,"body":"ago, it was very unlikely"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1855.732,"endTime":1860.742,"body":"to build a higher than four"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1855.732,"endTime":1860.742,"body":"stories actually in timber."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1861.136,"endTime":1864.583,"body":"now the world is changing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1861.136,"endTime":1864.583,"body":"and people are really"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1864.583,"endTime":1867.583,"body":"pushing to build higher"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1864.583,"endTime":1867.583,"body":"with timber structures."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1868.093,"endTime":1870.403,"body":"It becomes a much more"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1868.093,"endTime":1870.403,"body":"important question."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1870.793,"endTime":1874.813,"body":"Something that you may"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1870.793,"endTime":1874.813,"body":"reasonably assume in a three"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1874.813,"endTime":1876.783,"body":"or four story building is."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1877.227,"endTime":1881.247,"body":"At some point, someone will"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1877.227,"endTime":1881.247,"body":"either extinguish the fire or"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1881.607,"endTime":1886.44,"body":"it is somehow acceptable that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1881.607,"endTime":1886.44,"body":"the building could collapse."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1887.119,"endTime":1891.136,"body":"and that becomes"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1887.119,"endTime":1891.136,"body":"increasingly less reasonable."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1891.359,"endTime":1894.129,"body":"if you build taller and taller"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1891.359,"endTime":1894.129,"body":"and I don't think there are"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1894.129,"endTime":1898.176,"body":"many people would, who would"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1894.129,"endTime":1898.176,"body":"say, yeah, but, it's a 30 story"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1898.176,"endTime":1903.396,"body":"building everyone left, so it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1898.176,"endTime":1903.396,"body":"can collapse it's then that's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1903.426,"endTime":1904.911,"body":"actually quite unreasonable."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1904.986,"endTime":1908.416,"body":"It will damage many things"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1904.986,"endTime":1908.416,"body":"that it will cost a lot."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1908.536,"endTime":1911.926,"body":"It will be a risk to neighboring"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1908.536,"endTime":1911.926,"body":"buildings, but it will"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1911.926,"endTime":1914.056,"body":"damage the whole industry."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1914.639,"endTime":1919.026,"body":"so they shouldn't allow"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1914.639,"endTime":1919.026,"body":"such a building to collapse."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1919.644,"endTime":1924.291,"body":"It's also very, unreasonable"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1919.644,"endTime":1924.291,"body":"to rely on the fire brigade,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1924.321,"endTime":1931.364,"body":"extinguishing a fire on the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1924.321,"endTime":1931.364,"body":"30th floor or 20th floor it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1931.394,"endTime":1934.847,"body":"and it's actually also not,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1931.394,"endTime":1934.847,"body":"good to rely on sprinklers"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1934.877,"endTime":1939.407,"body":"only because also sprinklers"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1934.877,"endTime":1939.407,"body":"have a limited reliability"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1940.052,"endTime":1946.832,"body":"though"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1940.052,"endTime":1946.832,"body":"they are even have Uh, I to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1947.145,"endTime":1950.462,"body":"even though they have fairly"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1947.145,"endTime":1950.462,"body":"high, reliability, I guess"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1950.462,"endTime":1954.962,"body":"from 85 to maybe 95%, actually"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1950.462,"endTime":1954.962,"body":"I'm supposed to do a podcast"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1954.962,"endTime":1957.272,"body":"episode on that and that's,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1954.962,"endTime":1957.272,"body":"that's going to be a good one."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1957.622,"endTime":1960.652,"body":"but it it's, you know, sort"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1957.622,"endTime":1960.652,"body":"of Russian roulette with fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1961.102,"endTime":1964.312,"body":"If, if your sprinklers, if your"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1961.102,"endTime":1964.312,"body":"sprinklers work, you're fine."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1964.552,"endTime":1967.402,"body":"If they don't, you lose your"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1964.552,"endTime":1967.402,"body":"building and it's, even if"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1967.402,"endTime":1971.662,"body":"it's like 5% chance that you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1967.402,"endTime":1971.662,"body":"lose your building, is it,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1971.742,"endTime":1975.792,"body":"acceptable that you have 5%"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1971.742,"endTime":1975.792,"body":"chance of a one in the 50"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1975.792,"endTime":1977.462,"body":"year events that you lose?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1977.782,"endTime":1979.312,"body":"No,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1977.782,"endTime":1979.312,"body":"it's  I think it needs"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1979.312,"endTime":1980.565,"body":"to be in, imbalance."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1980.565,"endTime":1983.565,"body":"So if you say we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1980.565,"endTime":1983.565,"body":"rely on sprinklers to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1983.625,"endTime":1984.821,"body":"extinguish the fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1985.099,"endTime":1989.315,"body":"well, if it's in one in 10 of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1985.099,"endTime":1989.315,"body":"the cases that the sprinkler"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1989.375,"endTime":1992.882,"body":"doesn't work, the damage,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1989.375,"endTime":1992.882,"body":"shouldn't be much more than"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1992.882,"endTime":1994.772,"body":"10 times as high, right."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1994.822,"endTime":1998.842,"body":"Then you basically reduce,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1994.822,"endTime":1998.842,"body":"on a big societal level."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1998.842,"endTime":2001.982,"body":"You reduce safety by,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":1998.842,"endTime":2001.982,"body":"reasoning like this."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2002.315,"endTime":2003.995,"body":"It's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2002.315,"endTime":2003.995,"body":"also, you know, the fact that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2004.505,"endTime":2008.615,"body":"in many types of structures"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2004.505,"endTime":2008.615,"body":"you would receive completely"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2008.615,"endTime":2012.335,"body":"different outcomes depending"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2008.615,"endTime":2012.335,"body":"on your location, which"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2012.335,"endTime":2014.855,"body":"means, for example, you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2012.335,"endTime":2014.855,"body":"have open plan compartment."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2014.855,"endTime":2018.515,"body":"If you have the fire at the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2014.855,"endTime":2018.515,"body":"facade, you could maybe expect"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2018.515,"endTime":2020.885,"body":"the larger damage to the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2018.515,"endTime":2020.885,"body":"facade in the first 60 minutes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2020.885,"endTime":2023.435,"body":"If you have it closer to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2020.885,"endTime":2023.435,"body":"the core of the building,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2023.435,"endTime":2026.705,"body":"you might have the damage"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2023.435,"endTime":2026.705,"body":"to the core of the building."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2026.975,"endTime":2029.915,"body":"If you have it in the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2026.975,"endTime":2029.915,"body":"bathroom, you're okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2029.915,"endTime":2032.261,"body":"If you have it in the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2029.915,"endTime":2032.261,"body":"your, sleeping room that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2032.291,"endTime":2034.931,"body":"that's probably was, if you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2032.291,"endTime":2034.931,"body":"have it in the kitchen is a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2034.931,"endTime":2037.531,"body":"different like every of this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2034.931,"endTime":2037.531,"body":"fire leads to completely"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2037.531,"endTime":2038.611,"body":"different set of outcomes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2038.611,"endTime":2040.321,"body":"And each of them has"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2038.611,"endTime":2040.321,"body":"their own probabilities."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2040.831,"endTime":2043.894,"body":"While  if you imagine the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2040.831,"endTime":2043.894,"body":"building with all surfaces of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2043.894,"endTime":2047.354,"body":"exposed, combustible material,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2043.894,"endTime":2047.354,"body":"wherever the fire happened,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2047.739,"endTime":2050.826,"body":"It will eventually lead to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2047.739,"endTime":2050.826,"body":"the structure being involved."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2050.826,"endTime":2053.676,"body":"And that can lead to pretty"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2050.826,"endTime":2053.676,"body":"much the same set of outcomes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2053.676,"endTime":2056.796,"body":"You either put it out or it will"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2053.676,"endTime":2056.796,"body":"destroy the building, right?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2057.546,"endTime":2061.069,"body":"I could imagine the location or"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2057.546,"endTime":2061.069,"body":"the size or the, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2061.099,"endTime":2065.509,"body":"triggering event stops having"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2061.099,"endTime":2065.509,"body":"this huge impact on the outcomes"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2065.509,"endTime":2069.953,"body":"of the fires, where in normal"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2065.509,"endTime":2069.953,"body":"building you, that would be a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2069.953,"endTime":2072.893,"body":"factor like you might have small"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2069.953,"endTime":2072.893,"body":"fire, you may have large fire,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2072.893,"endTime":2074.243,"body":"you may have a flashover fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2074.483,"endTime":2076.313,"body":"You may have a local"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2074.483,"endTime":2076.313,"body":"fire of a trash bin."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2076.883,"endTime":2079.386,"body":"They all have different set"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2076.883,"endTime":2079.386,"body":"of outcomes, but here, each of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2079.386,"endTime":2082.836,"body":"them can lead to ignition of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2079.386,"endTime":2082.836,"body":"the, of the structural elements."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2082.836,"endTime":2085.356,"body":"And once they burn, they"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2082.836,"endTime":2085.356,"body":"will not just magically"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2085.356,"endTime":2086.256,"body":"go out themselves."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2086.256,"endTime":2088.566,"body":"They will contribute"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2086.256,"endTime":2088.566,"body":"until it's being stopped."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2088.566,"endTime":2091.626,"body":"And it all leads to the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2088.566,"endTime":2091.626,"body":"same level of damage."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2091.726,"endTime":2094.236,"body":"That's really frightening to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2091.726,"endTime":2094.236,"body":"me because we lose this, you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2094.236,"endTime":2097.626,"body":"know, margin of safety from the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2094.236,"endTime":2097.626,"body":"uncertainty of the firesides."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2097.626,"endTime":2098.496,"body":"We usually have."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2098.577,"endTime":2099.147,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2099.567,"endTime":2099.867,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2099.889,"endTime":2104.757,"body":"so I think in many countries,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2099.889,"endTime":2104.757,"body":"the fire development, part is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2104.847,"endTime":2108.113,"body":"regulated choosing, reaction"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2104.847,"endTime":2108.113,"body":"to fire classifications,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2108.133,"endTime":2108.933,"body":"at least in Europe."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2108.933,"endTime":2109.953,"body":"That is the case."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2110.11,"endTime":2113.17,"body":"yes, and it, it can be,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2110.11,"endTime":2113.17,"body":"in some cases, ignored."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2113.378,"endTime":2117.358,"body":"I know in, in a country"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2113.378,"endTime":2117.358,"body":"like Sweden, you can install"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2117.358,"endTime":2120.418,"body":"sprinklers in a building where"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2117.358,"endTime":2120.418,"body":"it doesn't, it isn't required."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2120.708,"endTime":2124.998,"body":"And then you can exchange it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2120.708,"endTime":2124.998,"body":"for, another requirement such"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2124.998,"endTime":2127.028,"body":"as the reaction to fire class."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2127.058,"endTime":2130.415,"body":"And that, that is actually,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2127.058,"endTime":2130.415,"body":"the something that, that not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2130.415,"endTime":2133.115,"body":"be very reasonable to do."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2133.41,"endTime":2135.93,"body":"that's,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2133.41,"endTime":2135.93,"body":"the I think this considerations"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2135.93,"endTime":2139.62,"body":"are the things that are being"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2135.93,"endTime":2139.62,"body":"missed by the society a lot."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2140.1,"endTime":2143.61,"body":"Like when we only focus on this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2140.1,"endTime":2143.61,"body":"one parameter, which is fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2143.61,"endTime":2146.78,"body":"resistance, which we already"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2143.61,"endTime":2146.78,"body":"discussed is partially flawed"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2147.63,"endTime":2149.13,"body":"in terms of timber structures."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2149.49,"endTime":2150.99,"body":"Like you cannot"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2149.49,"endTime":2150.99,"body":"just focus on that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2151.02,"endTime":2152.58,"body":"There's so much more into that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2152.58,"endTime":2155.55,"body":"And maybe these things that we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2152.58,"endTime":2155.55,"body":"omit are actually more important"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2155.55,"endTime":2159.42,"body":"than the fire resistance,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2155.55,"endTime":2159.42,"body":"because technically if I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2159.42,"endTime":2163.71,"body":"saw an engineering of a tall"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2159.42,"endTime":2163.71,"body":"building that took into account"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2163.71,"endTime":2167.1,"body":"the growth of the fire, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2163.71,"endTime":2167.1,"body":"compartment, fire dynamics, and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2167.1,"endTime":2170.377,"body":"how the wood will impose the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2167.1,"endTime":2170.377,"body":"management of this additional"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2170.467,"endTime":2172.117,"body":"energy, which will go somewhere."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2172.717,"endTime":2174.767,"body":"If I saw that, then someone"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2172.717,"endTime":2174.767,"body":"said, okay, and then my"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2174.767,"endTime":2175.897,"body":"walls will be 60 minutes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2175.897,"endTime":2177.097,"body":"I have nothing about the walls."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2177.127,"endTime":2178.117,"body":"I mean, they, okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2178.117,"endTime":2179.107,"body":"Let them be 60 minutes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2179.107,"endTime":2180.777,"body":"If you manage all the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2179.107,"endTime":2180.777,"body":"other threads, that's,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2180.777,"endTime":2181.387,"body":"that's beautiful."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2181.387,"endTime":2182.617,"body":"That's the case is solved."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2182.887,"endTime":2185.077,"body":"You did your fire engineering"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2182.887,"endTime":2185.077,"body":"because the problem was"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2185.077,"endTime":2186.667,"body":"not in the fire resistance."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2187.057,"endTime":2187.614,"body":"It was."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2187.614,"endTime":2191.66,"body":"The other things it's just, it's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2187.614,"endTime":2191.66,"body":"so hard to convince the society."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2191.97,"endTime":2195.394,"body":"Think about the other things"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2191.97,"endTime":2195.394,"body":"that I feel we need to do"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2195.394,"endTime":2197.494,"body":"something with the fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2195.394,"endTime":2197.494,"body":"resistance to already include"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2197.494,"endTime":2198.664,"body":"some of these ethics in it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2199.054,"endTime":2200.914,"body":"That's that's my"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2199.054,"endTime":2200.914,"body":"personal opinion."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2201.488,"endTime":2201.788,"body":"okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2201.815,"endTime":2204.672,"body":"So, to go on with the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2201.815,"endTime":2204.672,"body":"effects of the fires, you've"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2204.672,"endTime":2207.792,"body":"mentioned the extinguishing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2204.672,"endTime":2207.792,"body":"and we sometimes talk about"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2207.792,"endTime":2209.192,"body":"self extinguishment of wood"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2209.588,"endTime":2211.568,"body":"and, uh, that's a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2209.588,"endTime":2211.568,"body":"challenging thing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2211.585,"endTime":2214.045,"body":"I would love to hear"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2211.585,"endTime":2214.045,"body":"your personal opinion as"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2214.045,"endTime":2217.135,"body":"a, as a fire engineer,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2214.045,"endTime":2217.135,"body":"who, who researches wood."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2217.547,"endTime":2219.977,"body":"When would you say it"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2217.547,"endTime":2219.977,"body":"has self extinguished?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2220.007,"endTime":2221.957,"body":"Is it when the flaming"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2220.007,"endTime":2221.957,"body":"action stopped?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2222.227,"endTime":2224.117,"body":"Is it when the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2222.227,"endTime":2224.117,"body":"smoldering stopped?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2224.447,"endTime":2226.817,"body":"Is it when it burns out"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2224.447,"endTime":2226.817,"body":"completely and disappeared?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2227.295,"endTime":2229.813,"body":"well, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2227.295,"endTime":2229.813,"body":"actually try not to use the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2229.813,"endTime":2233.168,"body":"word self extinguishment,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2229.813,"endTime":2233.168,"body":"but, um, I usually refer"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2233.168,"endTime":2235.058,"body":"to continuous decay."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2235.354,"endTime":2239.074,"body":"well, so some people refer"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2235.354,"endTime":2239.074,"body":"to, extinction of flames."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2239.434,"endTime":2240.991,"body":"I think that is just not enough."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2241.731,"endTime":2245.694,"body":"Because that can occur at"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2241.731,"endTime":2245.694,"body":"a very high, heat fluxes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2246.114,"endTime":2249.351,"body":"And it, could correspond"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2246.114,"endTime":2249.351,"body":"to around 600 degrees plate"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2249.351,"endTime":2253.124,"body":"thermomete r temperature, which"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2249.351,"endTime":2253.124,"body":"is still very high and you still"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2253.124,"endTime":2256.904,"body":"get structural damage and still"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2253.124,"endTime":2256.904,"body":"get charring and smoldering,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2257.425,"endTime":2261.655,"body":"extinction of smouldering"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2257.425,"endTime":2261.655,"body":"is better, but it's actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2262.255,"endTime":2266.905,"body":"an impossible task to design"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2262.255,"endTime":2266.905,"body":"a building for extinction"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2266.905,"endTime":2268.495,"body":"of smouldering, I guess."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2268.887,"endTime":2272.657,"body":"It may work, but you might"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2268.887,"endTime":2272.657,"body":"just have, the users of the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2272.657,"endTime":2277.36,"body":"buildings, installing some piece"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2272.657,"endTime":2277.36,"body":"of equipment and choosing a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2277.36,"endTime":2279.49,"body":"screws and a hole in the timber."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2279.52,"endTime":2281.754,"body":"And it might just,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2279.52,"endTime":2281.754,"body":"keep smoldering there."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2281.754,"endTime":2286.82,"body":"Or you might have a piece of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2281.754,"endTime":2286.82,"body":"furniture, that is close to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2286.82,"endTime":2291.127,"body":"a wall like I've got in my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2286.82,"endTime":2291.127,"body":"house, a tree trunk table."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2291.157,"endTime":2292.447,"body":"It's very thick."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2292.747,"endTime":2297.127,"body":"It will burn for a very long"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2292.747,"endTime":2297.127,"body":"time if it is placed next to a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2297.127,"endTime":2300.747,"body":"wall, which is the case and the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2297.127,"endTime":2300.747,"body":"wall would be exposed, I guess"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2300.977,"endTime":2303.337,"body":"there will be an interaction"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2300.977,"endTime":2303.337,"body":"between this table and the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2303.337,"endTime":2304.747,"body":"wall for a very long time."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2305.184,"endTime":2306.144,"body":"and the smouldering."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2306.204,"endTime":2308.544,"body":"Wouldn't stop XD."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2308.544,"endTime":2308.934,"body":"It wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2309.024,"endTime":2309.624,"body":"I so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2311.514,"endTime":2311.604,"body":"you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2311.604,"endTime":2312.546,"body":"table, is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2312.546,"endTime":2312.94,"body":"gone."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2312.94,"endTime":2313.24,"body":"with"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2313.41,"endTime":2315.19,"body":"I guess it would likely not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2315.19,"endTime":2315.47,"body":"stop"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2315.842,"endTime":2317.282,"body":"I don't"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2315.842,"endTime":2317.282,"body":"know if you saw the recent"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2317.282,"endTime":2322.462,"body":"paper by CERIB and ARUP with"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2317.282,"endTime":2322.462,"body":"Imperial I think CodeRed,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2322.546,"endTime":2323.459,"body":"it's, it's called, I think."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2323.939,"endTime":2326.192,"body":"And, in that paper, they"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2323.939,"endTime":2326.192,"body":"have this example of, a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2326.192,"endTime":2328.142,"body":"smoldering above a beam where."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2328.3,"endTime":2331.482,"body":"after like 40 something"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2328.3,"endTime":2331.482,"body":"hours after the flame"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2331.482,"endTime":2333.869,"body":"extinguished, there is no more"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2331.482,"endTime":2333.869,"body":"flaming, but the smoldering"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2333.879,"endTime":2334.919,"body":"is ongoing above a beam."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2334.919,"endTime":2339.869,"body":"And eventually after two days"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2334.919,"endTime":2339.869,"body":"have burned a hole through"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2339.869,"endTime":2343.829,"body":"the above the beam, like all"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2339.869,"endTime":2343.829,"body":"the way through the ceiling."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2344.189,"endTime":2347.129,"body":"And we also saw something"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2344.189,"endTime":2347.129,"body":"similar in our experiments where"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2347.129,"endTime":2351.282,"body":"we had a beam and a CLT slab"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2347.129,"endTime":2351.282,"body":"above it and above the beam,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2351.282,"endTime":2355.152,"body":"you know, there was this funny"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2351.282,"endTime":2355.152,"body":"configuration of surfaces, which"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2355.152,"endTime":2357.772,"body":"retaliated on each other and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2355.152,"endTime":2357.772,"body":"just to stay in this smouldering"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2357.852,"endTime":2359.892,"body":"action on and on and on at that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2359.972,"endTime":2361.662,"body":"And it went really, really deep."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2361.662,"endTime":2364.452,"body":"So I would assume that if"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2361.662,"endTime":2364.452,"body":"we have not extinguished"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2364.452,"endTime":2367.452,"body":"it with water, it would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2364.452,"endTime":2367.452,"body":"just go on and continue."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2367.962,"endTime":2371.759,"body":"So eventually you're"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2367.962,"endTime":2371.759,"body":"allowed with the problem."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2372.284,"endTime":2373.544,"body":"You need intervention."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2373.544,"endTime":2376.214,"body":"Like you assume that there"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2373.544,"endTime":2376.214,"body":"must be intervention."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2376.244,"endTime":2379.647,"body":"Otherwise, this will continue"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2376.244,"endTime":2379.647,"body":"out until all the fuel is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2379.647,"endTime":2382.527,"body":"consumed in the region where"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2379.647,"endTime":2382.527,"body":"this phenomenon happens."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2383.204,"endTime":2385.137,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2383.204,"endTime":2385.137,"body":"so I think that's right."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2385.304,"endTime":2389.034,"body":"you need at least someone to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2385.304,"endTime":2389.034,"body":"check, uh, whether they're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2389.034,"endTime":2392.034,"body":"a smaller smouldering and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2389.034,"endTime":2392.034,"body":"extinguish that smoldering."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2392.214,"endTime":2395.394,"body":"So that's sort of what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2392.214,"endTime":2395.394,"body":"we try to incorporate"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2395.394,"endTime":2396.754,"body":"in our last, project."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2397.306,"endTime":2400.87,"body":"so after the test we use thermal"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2397.306,"endTime":2400.87,"body":"cameras, we had the fire brigade"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2400.88,"endTime":2404.557,"body":"checking where they actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2400.88,"endTime":2404.557,"body":"need to check for awhile."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2404.617,"endTime":2407.527,"body":"You kind of just check off"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2404.617,"endTime":2407.527,"body":"sort of fire and leave."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2407.527,"endTime":2408.277,"body":"You need to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2408.914,"endTime":2409.634,"body":"Monitor yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2409.69,"endTime":2410.14,"body":"there."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2410.41,"endTime":2410.8,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2410.87,"endTime":2413.764,"body":"And we don't know how long,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2410.87,"endTime":2413.764,"body":"but  we saw after half an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2413.764,"endTime":2415.204,"body":"hour, you can, actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2415.354,"endTime":2415.714,"body":"in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2415.714,"endTime":2416.284,"body":"solve the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2418.088,"endTime":2418.625,"body":"Ensign"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2419.013,"endTime":2419.393,"body":"there."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2419.563,"endTime":2420.913,"body":"They extinguish smoldering."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2421.302,"endTime":2422.592,"body":"was he"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2421.302,"endTime":2422.592,"body":"then some specific points,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2422.592,"endTime":2424.182,"body":"like, I dunno, join, solve the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2424.182,"endTime":2425.839,"body":"structure, or you mentioned"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2425.839,"endTime":2426.229,"body":"stats."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2426.229,"endTime":2426.769,"body":"Ensign"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2427.359,"endTime":2428.192,"body":"yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2428.193,"endTime":2431.188,"body":"Connections that, most"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2428.193,"endTime":2431.188,"body":"connections didn't need it,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2431.188,"endTime":2435.098,"body":"but if the sealant wasn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2431.188,"endTime":2435.098,"body":"correctly applied, then,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2435.188,"endTime":2437.018,"body":"then yes, then it continues."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2437.018,"endTime":2441.894,"body":"And,  we also saw, where we had"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2437.018,"endTime":2441.894,"body":"lamella stat didn't follow up,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2441.924,"endTime":2447.714,"body":"but they stuck to the wall or"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2441.924,"endTime":2447.714,"body":"the ceiling that behind lamellas"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2447.734,"endTime":2449.724,"body":"between the CLT and the lamella."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2449.724,"endTime":2450.761,"body":"It, continues."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2450.971,"endTime":2454.481,"body":"However, I think that is a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2450.971,"endTime":2454.481,"body":"location where eventually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2454.871,"endTime":2458.501,"body":"it might die out by itself,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2454.871,"endTime":2458.501,"body":"but the connections,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2458.878,"endTime":2461.518,"body":"led probably continues."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2461.633,"endTime":2463.943,"body":"Until it burns"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2461.633,"endTime":2463.943,"body":"through, at some point."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2464.093,"endTime":2466.883,"body":"And I know, I know they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2464.093,"endTime":2466.883,"body":"experienced it in a set of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2466.883,"endTime":2471.083,"body":"German tests that also the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2466.883,"endTime":2471.083,"body":"next day there was a hole but"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2471.633,"endTime":2475.813,"body":"I believe that in that test,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2471.633,"endTime":2475.813,"body":"uh, it did lead to a hole"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2475.813,"endTime":2477.553,"body":"in the wall, in the floor."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2477.553,"endTime":2480.456,"body":"I believe that, it didn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2477.553,"endTime":2480.456,"body":"need extinguishment"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2482.196,"endTime":2487.956,"body":"We build there's not a part"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2482.196,"endTime":2487.956,"body":"of a structure or a building"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2487.956,"endTime":2488.946,"body":"it's hard to tell what the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2489.006,"endTime":2490.086,"body":"here if"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2490.236,"endTime":2491.146,"body":"that's interesting because"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2491.236,"endTime":2492.106,"body":"now we're experiments."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2492.106,"endTime":2494.956,"body":"We usually build a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2492.106,"endTime":2494.956,"body":"insulated compartment."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2494.956,"endTime":2496.756,"body":"You know, that there's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2494.956,"endTime":2496.756,"body":"not a part of a building"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2496.756,"endTime":2498.316,"body":"structure or a building frame."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2498.676,"endTime":2503.116,"body":"And here if the damage is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2498.676,"endTime":2503.116,"body":"to the joints or into some,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2503.656,"endTime":2508.306,"body":"let's say fragile connections,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2503.656,"endTime":2508.306,"body":"it, it will be very hard"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2508.306,"endTime":2509.746,"body":"to fix that afterwards."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2509.746,"endTime":2514.576,"body":"The fire, like in, in general,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2509.746,"endTime":2514.576,"body":"I assume fixing a timber framed"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2514.576,"endTime":2517.936,"body":"building after a fire could"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2514.576,"endTime":2517.936,"body":"be like quite challenging to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2518.036,"endTime":2520.096,"body":"replace a slab in the building."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2520.096,"endTime":2521.386,"body":"That's standing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2521.726,"endTime":2523.916,"body":"Was this a part of any"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2521.726,"endTime":2523.916,"body":"considerations of your group?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2523.949,"endTime":2525.179,"body":"fixing after the fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2525.782,"endTime":2527.942,"body":"Yeah, so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2525.782,"endTime":2527.942,"body":"that is a very new area."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2527.942,"endTime":2534.185,"body":"So we, uh, repaired a part of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2527.942,"endTime":2534.185,"body":"the ceiling after our very last"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2534.185,"endTime":2537.489,"body":"compartment fire tests, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2534.185,"endTime":2537.489,"body":"there was a CLT ceiling and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2537.619,"endTime":2540.259,"body":"that was relatively successful."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2540.319,"endTime":2543.712,"body":"I guess we, got, the,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2540.319,"endTime":2543.712,"body":"bending capacity back and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2543.712,"endTime":2545.002,"body":"the fluctual stiffness."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2545.372,"endTime":2549.072,"body":"it is, more difficult if you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2545.372,"endTime":2549.072,"body":"have, cavities and walls."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2549.072,"endTime":2551.616,"body":"So timber frame will"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2549.072,"endTime":2551.616,"body":"be, more difficult."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2551.616,"endTime":2555.559,"body":"However, I know one example"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2551.616,"endTime":2555.559,"body":"in Sweden,  I don't think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2555.559,"endTime":2558.919,"body":"they published a report yet,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2555.559,"endTime":2558.919,"body":"but where there was a real"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2558.919,"endTime":2564.223,"body":"building fire, this building"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2558.919,"endTime":2564.223,"body":"was built of modules, so no"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2564.283,"endTime":2566.653,"body":"parts of the compartments"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2564.283,"endTime":2566.653,"body":"were made in the factory"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2566.653,"endTime":2568.273,"body":"and then assembled on site."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2568.809,"endTime":2571.629,"body":"but they disassembled the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2568.809,"endTime":2571.629,"body":"modules, brought them back"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2571.629,"endTime":2574.629,"body":"to the factory and then"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2571.629,"endTime":2574.629,"body":"repaired the module separately"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2574.629,"endTime":2575.679,"body":"and brought it back."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2576.136,"endTime":2580.466,"body":"and in that case, they, at"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2576.136,"endTime":2580.466,"body":"least what I've heard, not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2580.466,"endTime":2584.216,"body":"officially through the report"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2580.466,"endTime":2584.216,"body":"is that the costs were,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2584.316,"endTime":2588.496,"body":"reduced very significantly"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2584.316,"endTime":2588.496,"body":"to 10% of the original"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2588.496,"endTime":2589.416,"body":"building cost"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2589.968,"endTime":2590.148,"body":"is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2590.183,"endTime":2593.093,"body":"in previous cases, it,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2590.183,"endTime":2593.093,"body":"it actually did occur,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2593.159,"endTime":2595.169,"body":"that the whole building"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2593.159,"endTime":2595.169,"body":"had to be demolished"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2595.799,"endTime":2596.069,"body":"and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2596.981,"endTime":2599.861,"body":"all of this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2596.981,"endTime":2599.861,"body":"is, is, is really interesting."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2599.861,"endTime":2600.281,"body":"and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2600.521,"endTime":2604.247,"body":"I love how we, opened with,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2600.521,"endTime":2604.247,"body":"you know fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2604.247,"endTime":2606.857,"body":"and finished with all"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2604.247,"endTime":2606.857,"body":"these important aspects"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2606.857,"endTime":2609.827,"body":"of what you can consider"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2606.857,"endTime":2609.827,"body":"beyond the fire resistance."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2610.307,"endTime":2613.521,"body":"Maybe I've put the wrong"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2610.307,"endTime":2613.521,"body":"question into the title of this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2613.521,"endTime":2615.171,"body":"episode about fire resistance."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2615.171,"endTime":2618.321,"body":"Maybe it should be all about"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2615.171,"endTime":2618.321,"body":"the consequences, but I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2618.321,"endTime":2619.521,"body":"think it's still was needed."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2619.541,"endTime":2620.751,"body":"I still think."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2621.167,"endTime":2625.517,"body":"It's necessary for people"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2621.167,"endTime":2625.517,"body":"to hear how the discussion"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2625.517,"endTime":2629.987,"body":"can be separated between"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2625.517,"endTime":2629.987,"body":"the fire resistance and the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2629.987,"endTime":2632.387,"body":"consequences of, of the fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2632.867,"endTime":2636.32,"body":"And if more people did"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2632.867,"endTime":2636.32,"body":"separate these things from each"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2636.32,"endTime":2640.25,"body":"other, the least problems we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2636.32,"endTime":2640.25,"body":"would have, and least stupid"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2640.31,"endTime":2643.79,"body":"articles on LinkedIn would be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2640.31,"endTime":2643.79,"body":"published every, every week."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2643.94,"endTime":2646.12,"body":"and that I would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2643.94,"endTime":2646.12,"body":"truly love that world."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2646.425,"endTime":2650.1,"body":"For the end, I will link"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2646.425,"endTime":2650.1,"body":"the resources, that we've"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2650.1,"endTime":2651.3,"body":"discussed in this talk."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2651.3,"endTime":2654.593,"body":"And I will link the project on,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2651.3,"endTime":2654.593,"body":"mass timber in tall buildings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2654.623,"endTime":2657.363,"body":"There's a YouTube channel"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2654.623,"endTime":2657.363,"body":"with all the experiments."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2657.363,"endTime":2661.263,"body":"You can see what Daniel"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2657.363,"endTime":2661.263,"body":"meant by additional fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2661.773,"endTime":2663.176,"body":"energy going somewhere."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2663.176,"endTime":2666.586,"body":"if you open them side by"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2663.176,"endTime":2666.586,"body":"side two experiments, I would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2666.586,"endTime":2667.756,"body":"recommend experiment three."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2667.756,"endTime":2668.446,"body":"I liked that one."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2669.046,"endTime":2670.306,"body":"It seemed interesting."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2670.696,"endTime":2673.486,"body":"I think it's the one that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2670.696,"endTime":2673.486,"body":"you had the coroners exposed,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2675.023,"endTime":2677.093,"body":"from your perspective as a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2675.023,"endTime":2677.093,"body":"scientist, did it make such"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2677.093,"endTime":2679.546,"body":"a difference to expose the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2677.093,"endTime":2679.546,"body":"corner of, the experiment?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2679.886,"endTime":2682.125,"body":"something that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2679.886,"endTime":2682.125,"body":"we don't know much about and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2682.125,"endTime":2685.785,"body":"I'm trying to, um, perform more"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2682.125,"endTime":2685.785,"body":"research on is the interaction"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2685.785,"endTime":2687.495,"body":"between exposed walls."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2687.507,"endTime":2690.505,"body":"and if you want the fire"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2687.507,"endTime":2690.505,"body":"to decay, at some point,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2690.535,"endTime":2694.615,"body":"this interaction should,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2690.535,"endTime":2694.615,"body":"be, insignificant To"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2694.615,"endTime":2696.295,"body":"allow a fire to cool down."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2696.295,"endTime":2699.635,"body":"If you have two timber slabs"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2696.295,"endTime":2699.635,"body":"that are very closely spaced"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2699.635,"endTime":2703.245,"body":"with that high fuel factor to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2699.635,"endTime":2703.245,"body":"each other, they might burn"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2703.259,"endTime":2706.951,"body":"forever until one of them"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2703.259,"endTime":2706.951,"body":"is completely burned out."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2707.611,"endTime":2709.911,"body":", and the same happens"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2707.611,"endTime":2709.911,"body":"a bit in corners."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2709.911,"endTime":2713.755,"body":"So you have interaction"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2709.911,"endTime":2713.755,"body":"between the walls, and we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2713.755,"endTime":2717.401,"body":"think it is, any creation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2713.755,"endTime":2717.401,"body":"of many things, but, one of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2717.401,"endTime":2719.171,"body":"them is the oxygen content."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2719.261,"endTime":2721.481,"body":"and that's why we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2719.261,"endTime":2721.481,"body":"think we saw it,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2722.351,"endTime":2724.721,"body":"the effect mostly in the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2722.351,"endTime":2724.721,"body":"bottom of the compartment."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2725.128,"endTime":2728.901,"body":"and another part of the equation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2725.128,"endTime":2728.901,"body":"is the material behavior itself."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2729.111,"endTime":2729.321,"body":"So."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2729.936,"endTime":2732.751,"body":"Behaves like a rock"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2729.936,"endTime":2732.751,"body":"solid, timber member"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2732.751,"endTime":2734.218,"body":"or whether it's, let's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2734.443,"endTime":2735.433,"body":"I Sweden"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2736.303,"endTime":2738.973,"body":"of dating structures this famous"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2739.198,"endTime":2740.338,"body":"opens up a little bit"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2740.503,"endTime":2740.983,"body":"at least we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2741.703,"endTime":2745.993,"body":"the Swedish the timber like"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2746.128,"endTime":2748.253,"body":"I think"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2746.128,"endTime":2748.253,"body":"in Sweden you are masters of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2748.433,"endTime":2751.493,"body":"rear dating structures There is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2748.433,"endTime":2751.493,"body":"this famous camping technique"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2751.523,"endTime":2754.463,"body":"called at least we referred"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2751.523,"endTime":2754.463,"body":"to it as the Swedish fire log"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2754.883,"endTime":2758.423,"body":"where you cut a log of the of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2754.883,"endTime":2758.423,"body":"the timber like with a chain."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2758.423,"endTime":2761.963,"body":"So in like a four, you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2758.423,"endTime":2761.963,"body":"make four cuts or six"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2761.963,"endTime":2763.523,"body":"cuts in the, in the log."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2763.523,"endTime":2766.543,"body":"You you put some something"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2763.523,"endTime":2766.543,"body":"inside to ignited and then"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2766.543,"endTime":2768.823,"body":"all the walls burn each"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2766.543,"endTime":2768.823,"body":"other and you can cook on it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2769.003,"endTime":2771.193,"body":"you can, you can,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2769.003,"endTime":2771.193,"body":"you can, you cook it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2771.313,"endTime":2772.873,"body":"That's a, that's the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2771.313,"endTime":2772.873,"body":"Swedish fire log."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2773.143,"endTime":2777.693,"body":"and so it's the but to use"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2773.143,"endTime":2777.693,"body":"the for the benefit of having"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2777.693,"endTime":2781.023,"body":"delicious meal in your camp,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2777.693,"endTime":2781.023,"body":"not a burning, a building"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2781.353,"endTime":2782.938,"body":"and any where are you going"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2782.938,"endTime":2783.108,"body":"right."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2784.173,"endTime":2786.053,"body":"that's really good"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2784.173,"endTime":2786.053,"body":"to like  Swedish"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2786.053,"endTime":2787.043,"body":"used it for ages now."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2787.043,"endTime":2788.063,"body":"They used it in buildings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2788.063,"endTime":2788.753,"body":"That's frightening."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2790.553,"endTime":2791.558,"body":"one last question."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2791.563,"endTime":2793.938,"body":"where are you going now"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2791.563,"endTime":2793.938,"body":"with the timber research or"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2793.988,"endTime":2796.028,"body":"you're dropping the field"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2793.988,"endTime":2796.028,"body":"and you're going to do"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2796.028,"endTime":2797.138,"body":"batteries like everyone else?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2798.161,"endTime":2801.831,"body":"Uh, no, I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2798.161,"endTime":2801.831,"body":"there actually many questions"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2801.831,"endTime":2803.881,"body":"that still need answering."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2803.881,"endTime":2806.738,"body":"So, I guess the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2803.881,"endTime":2806.738,"body":"smouldering aspect in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2806.738,"endTime":2808.238,"body":"the end is interesting."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2808.268,"endTime":2811.515,"body":"It's I know it's challenging,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2808.268,"endTime":2811.515,"body":"but well, we can improve."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2811.515,"endTime":2812.145,"body":"Definitely."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2812.418,"endTime":2815.255,"body":"there is, rehabilitation"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2812.418,"endTime":2815.255,"body":"after a fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2815.335,"endTime":2818.695,"body":"Well, I think it's very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2815.335,"endTime":2818.695,"body":"interesting after the test at,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2819.245,"endTime":2823.793,"body":", CERIB in collaboration with"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2819.245,"endTime":2823.793,"body":"Arup is how to, , Actually been"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2823.793,"endTime":2826.703,"body":"in the in the experiment uh,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2827.948,"endTime":2829.658,"body":"use noncombustible structure"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2830.343,"endTime":2832.65,"body":"I've been"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2830.343,"endTime":2832.65,"body":"in the in the experiment one,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2832.7,"endTime":2835.22,"body":","},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2832.7,"endTime":2835.22,"body":"the one we did with"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2835.22,"endTime":2836.905,"body":"use noncombustible structure"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2836.92,"endTime":2838.03,"body":"with the same fire load."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2838.03,"endTime":2841.73,"body":"And I remember how huge and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2838.03,"endTime":2841.73,"body":"frightening that fire was."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2841.75,"endTime":2845.44,"body":"And then Guillermo  told me"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2841.75,"endTime":2845.44,"body":"that the, the CERIB fire was"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2845.44,"endTime":2848.89,"body":"like twice a peaker and I, I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2845.44,"endTime":2848.89,"body":"really cannot comprehend how big"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2848.92,"endTime":2850.33,"body":"the fire must have been ended."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2850.35,"endTime":2851.97,"body":"it's really scary."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2851.97,"endTime":2855.03,"body":"And, especially the aspect of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2851.97,"endTime":2855.03,"body":"the, in that paper that they"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2855.03,"endTime":2858.15,"body":"show that the spreads through"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2855.03,"endTime":2858.15,"body":"the ceiling, which for me,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2858.15,"endTime":2861.963,"body":"it was surprising, how quick"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2858.15,"endTime":2861.963,"body":"the fire accelerated through"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2861.963,"endTime":2864.694,"body":"the, through the compartment"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2861.963,"endTime":2864.694,"body":"then that I, I'm also doing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2864.694,"endTime":2866.674,"body":"a lot of experiments with OFR"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2867.111,"endTime":2870.711,"body":"on CLT for Structural"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2867.111,"endTime":2870.711,"body":"Timber Alliance, Special"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2870.711,"endTime":2875.084,"body":"Interest Group CLT, and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2870.711,"endTime":2875.084,"body":"we did burn, compartments."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2875.084,"endTime":2876.254,"body":"That was seven meters long."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2876.254,"endTime":2877.814,"body":"We've seen this propagation."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2877.814,"endTime":2879.524,"body":"It was really fascinating."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2879.914,"endTime":2882.551,"body":"Now we are doing, small"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2879.914,"endTime":2882.551,"body":"compartments with different"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2882.671,"endTime":2885.861,"body":"parts of it exposed or,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2882.671,"endTime":2885.861,"body":"encapsulated with the differing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2885.861,"endTime":2889.168,"body":"amounts, like a parametric study"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2885.861,"endTime":2889.168,"body":"on an encapsulation, which is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2889.168,"endTime":2890.578,"body":"really, really interesting."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2891.088,"endTime":2895.318,"body":"So, having this ARUP experiment"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2891.088,"endTime":2895.318,"body":"on, on, on the bigger side,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2895.438,"endTime":2897.968,"body":"our experiments, with the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2895.438,"endTime":2897.968,"body":"with the ceilings, your"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2897.968,"endTime":2901.628,"body":"experiments with compartments,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2897.968,"endTime":2901.628,"body":"I think we're eventually"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2901.628,"endTime":2906.294,"body":"reaching a point where we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2901.628,"endTime":2906.294,"body":"have really overwhelming"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2906.294,"endTime":2910.101,"body":"amount of experimental"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2906.294,"endTime":2910.101,"body":"contribution, to propose some"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2910.101,"endTime":2913.001,"body":"general ideas on the timber."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2913.022,"endTime":2916.553,"body":"Compartment fires, you know,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2913.022,"endTime":2916.553,"body":"in three or four years when"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2916.553,"endTime":2919.043,"body":"every of this is finished,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2916.553,"endTime":2919.043,"body":"all of this is published."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2919.343,"endTime":2921.953,"body":"We will have small compartments"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2919.343,"endTime":2921.953,"body":"with small openings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2921.953,"endTime":2924.113,"body":"We will have small compartment"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2921.953,"endTime":2924.113,"body":"with huge openings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2924.473,"endTime":2927.353,"body":"We have your compartments,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2924.473,"endTime":2927.353,"body":"which were medium-sized and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2927.353,"endTime":2929.219,"body":"had different, opening factors."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2929.699,"endTime":2933.216,"body":"We have our experiments with"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2929.699,"endTime":2933.216,"body":"all of our, where the opening"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2933.216,"endTime":2936.369,"body":"factor was irrelevant , like"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2933.216,"endTime":2936.369,"body":"the opening was, was like"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2936.399,"endTime":2939.629,"body":"on the, on the far, far"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2936.399,"endTime":2939.629,"body":"side of, ventilated regime."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2940.049,"endTime":2944.726,"body":"We have, a CLT compartment,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2940.049,"endTime":2944.726,"body":"fires 300 square, 270 square"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2944.726,"endTime":2947.439,"body":"meters from France where"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2944.726,"endTime":2947.439,"body":"they also play with like,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2947.439,"endTime":2948.639,"body":"we are reaching this point."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2949.146,"endTime":2951.366,"body":"maybe you remember"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2949.146,"endTime":2951.366,"body":"Cardington papers where"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2951.366,"endTime":2954.066,"body":"they had this, , charts have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2951.366,"endTime":2954.066,"body":"different opening factors"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2954.066,"endTime":2955.446,"body":"in sizes of compartments."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2955.866,"endTime":2958.686,"body":"And from that they would,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2955.866,"endTime":2958.686,"body":"they were able to, to produce"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2958.686,"endTime":2962.716,"body":"some generalized, theory"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2958.686,"endTime":2962.716,"body":"for steel frame buildings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2963.106,"endTime":2965.566,"body":"Maybe, maybe we will be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2963.106,"endTime":2965.566,"body":"able to reach something"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2965.566,"endTime":2969.412,"body":"like that in mass timber"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2965.566,"endTime":2969.412,"body":"soon ish in like five years."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2969.802,"endTime":2971.032,"body":"And that would be amazing."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2971.493,"endTime":2972.063,"body":"yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2972.111,"endTime":2975.616,"body":"I think, I think that's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2972.111,"endTime":2975.616,"body":"possible as long as the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2975.616,"endTime":2978.676,"body":"goal is clear, what is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2975.616,"endTime":2978.676,"body":"acceptable and what isn't."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2978.976,"endTime":2982.066,"body":"And that, that is probably"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2978.976,"endTime":2982.066,"body":"the big, biggest challenge"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2982.096,"endTime":2983.026,"body":"to agree on that."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2983.566,"endTime":2987.253,"body":"And then it becomes, different"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2983.566,"endTime":2987.253,"body":"for different occupancies"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2987.253,"endTime":2990.193,"body":"of a building, but also"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2987.253,"endTime":2990.193,"body":"the height of a building."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2990.193,"endTime":2994.753,"body":"So I guess most people would"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2990.193,"endTime":2994.753,"body":"agree a two-story house doesn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2994.753,"endTime":2998.106,"body":"need a lot of requirements"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2994.753,"endTime":2998.106,"body":"and, they do agree that,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2998.156,"endTime":3000.406,"body":"very tall buildings need"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":2998.156,"endTime":3000.406,"body":"much more requirements,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3000.406,"endTime":3002.116,"body":"but everything in between."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3002.626,"endTime":3004.486,"body":"Uh, it's just a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3002.626,"endTime":3004.486,"body":"matter of opinion."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3005.458,"endTime":3008.849,"body":"so we, I guess, if there"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3005.458,"endTime":3008.849,"body":"is some kind of system in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3008.849,"endTime":3010.979,"body":"that, then you can see okay."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3011.139,"endTime":3012.094,"body":"To achieve that."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3012.128,"endTime":3015.048,"body":"Either, this set of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3012.128,"endTime":3015.048,"body":"requirements and it shouldn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3015.048,"endTime":3016.638,"body":"be only fire resistance."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3017.328,"endTime":3021.038,"body":"It should be some specific"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3017.328,"endTime":3021.038,"body":"location of how much wood"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3021.068,"endTime":3025.178,"body":"can be exposed if at all at"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3021.068,"endTime":3025.178,"body":"a certain height, what the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3025.178,"endTime":3029.048,"body":"material behavior should be and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3025.178,"endTime":3029.048,"body":"everything that is protected,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3029.078,"endTime":3033.631,"body":"how much protection there should"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3029.078,"endTime":3033.631,"body":"be on those, members, also their"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3033.631,"endTime":3037.171,"body":"reaction to fire, classification"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3033.631,"endTime":3037.171,"body":"should be sped a specified."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3037.301,"endTime":3040.954,"body":"It actually, it needs"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3037.301,"endTime":3040.954,"body":"a whole framework, but,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3040.974,"endTime":3042.164,"body":"at least in Europe and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3044.684,"endTime":3046.334,"body":"felt Please say something"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3046.334,"endTime":3047.064,"body":"good agreement"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3047.064,"endTime":3049.348,"body":"between what is needed"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3047.064,"endTime":3049.348,"body":"at which, building"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3049.348,"endTime":3049.738,"body":"height"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3049.918,"endTime":3052.468,"body":"and what is needed for"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3049.918,"endTime":3052.468,"body":"different occupancies."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3052.696,"endTime":3054.226,"body":"You're"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3052.696,"endTime":3054.226,"body":"leaving me here with very"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3054.226,"endTime":3057.316,"body":"uncomfortable felt Please"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3054.226,"endTime":3057.316,"body":"say something positive."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3057.436,"endTime":3059.026,"body":"Can we build safely with timber?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3060.163,"endTime":3062.383,"body":"well, I, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3060.163,"endTime":3062.383,"body":"didn't want to indicate that you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3062.383,"endTime":3064.633,"body":"cannot build safely with timber."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3064.693,"endTime":3069.156,"body":"I just stated that, uh, using"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3064.693,"endTime":3069.156,"body":"fire resistance alone, doesn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3069.156,"endTime":3072.483,"body":"always get, it gives you a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3069.156,"endTime":3072.483,"body":"sufficient level of safety,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3072.483,"endTime":3075.855,"body":"especially in buildings, where,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3072.483,"endTime":3075.855,"body":"a collapse would lead to very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3075.855,"endTime":3077.595,"body":"high consequences and also."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3078.004,"endTime":3081.24,"body":"Buildings where you cannot"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3078.004,"endTime":3081.24,"body":"rely on, someone or something"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3081.24,"endTime":3082.987,"body":"extinguishing your fire."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3083.75,"endTime":3086.797,"body":"if that is the case, if you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3083.75,"endTime":3086.797,"body":"actually, cannot rely on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3086.797,"endTime":3090.182,"body":"these things, you, can have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3086.797,"endTime":3090.182,"body":"a good set of prescriptive"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3090.182,"endTime":3094.895,"body":"regulations, that would next to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3090.182,"endTime":3094.895,"body":"just requiring a fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3094.915,"endTime":3099.145,"body":"would also require or give"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3094.915,"endTime":3099.145,"body":"limitations of how much you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3099.145,"endTime":3102.942,"body":"can have feasible and related"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3099.145,"endTime":3102.942,"body":"to the potential consequences"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3102.942,"endTime":3104.059,"body":"of, fire in such a building."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3104.725,"endTime":3108.242,"body":"But also, um, the configuration"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3104.725,"endTime":3108.242,"body":"of what can be exposed and what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3108.242,"endTime":3112.119,"body":"can be feasible, how far can"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3108.242,"endTime":3112.119,"body":"they be a part of what could"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3112.119,"endTime":3115.902,"body":"be the view factor between them"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3112.119,"endTime":3115.902,"body":"and, for the protected services,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3115.932,"endTime":3118.849,"body":"there needs to be a requirement"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3115.932,"endTime":3118.849,"body":"of, um, much protection."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3119.032,"endTime":3120.502,"body":"Those surfaces need."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3120.532,"endTime":3123.772,"body":"If it's gypsum boards, how much"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3120.532,"endTime":3123.772,"body":"gypsum boards would they need"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3123.772,"endTime":3127.012,"body":"our in, Europe, you have the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3123.772,"endTime":3127.012,"body":"key classes and they should"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3127.012,"endTime":3131.137,"body":"be used, but then based on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3127.012,"endTime":3131.137,"body":"research of, fires that actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3131.137,"endTime":3133.344,"body":"aims for, decaying fires."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3133.962,"endTime":3136.242,"body":"but if you don't have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3133.962,"endTime":3136.242,"body":"that, there are only few"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3136.272,"endTime":3139.742,"body":"countries that actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3136.272,"endTime":3139.742,"body":"have, adjusted to recent"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3139.742,"endTime":3143.562,"body":"research and that research"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3139.742,"endTime":3143.562,"body":"has led to improvements."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3143.622,"endTime":3145.472,"body":"It's not only research"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3143.622,"endTime":3145.472,"body":"at RISE for you."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3145.472,"endTime":3149.532,"body":"You also talked about the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3145.472,"endTime":3149.532,"body":"OFR tests and the whole, fire"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3149.532,"endTime":3151.392,"body":"safety engineering community."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3152.169,"endTime":3156.039,"body":"Actually has worked a big"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3152.169,"endTime":3156.039,"body":"part of the fire safety"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3156.039,"endTime":3159.409,"body":"engineering community has"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3156.039,"endTime":3159.409,"body":"worked, to improve the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3159.409,"endTime":3161.719,"body":"performance of such buildings."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3162.167,"endTime":3166.444,"body":"but if the national regulations"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3162.167,"endTime":3166.444,"body":"didn't adjust to that yet,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3166.741,"endTime":3171.274,"body":"then it usually comes down"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3166.741,"endTime":3171.274,"body":"to, just safe engineering."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3171.314,"endTime":3174.484,"body":"You need a very competent"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3171.314,"endTime":3174.484,"body":"engineer, especially if"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3174.484,"endTime":3175.724,"body":"you need performance based."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3176.303,"endTime":3179.513,"body":"you need a competent engineer,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3176.303,"endTime":3179.513,"body":"but even a competent engineer"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3179.543,"endTime":3182.043,"body":"would need validated methods."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3182.583,"endTime":3185.223,"body":"And, those, we were"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3182.583,"endTime":3185.223,"body":"still working on them."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3185.223,"endTime":3187.803,"body":"There are a few methods,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3185.223,"endTime":3187.803,"body":"but all, all methods have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3187.803,"endTime":3189.033,"body":"their own limitations."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3189.453,"endTime":3191.933,"body":"And I think there need"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3189.453,"endTime":3191.933,"body":"to be more in the future."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3192.229,"endTime":3192.439,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3192.439,"endTime":3194.029,"body":"That that's, that's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3192.439,"endTime":3194.029,"body":"much more positive."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3194.539,"endTime":3195.649,"body":"I like that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3195.889,"endTime":3200.889,"body":"So there is a way out to build"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3195.889,"endTime":3200.889,"body":"safely with timber, maybe not"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3200.908,"endTime":3205.036,"body":"with a fire resistance as the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3200.908,"endTime":3205.036,"body":"ultimate proxy of fire safety"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3205.426,"endTime":3209.925,"body":"on its own But considering"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3205.426,"endTime":3209.925,"body":"all the circumstances, basing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3209.944,"endTime":3215.364,"body":"On peer reviewed science and,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3209.944,"endTime":3215.364,"body":"having competencies in place."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3215.454,"endTime":3217.644,"body":"That's the elements you need."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3217.794,"endTime":3221.784,"body":"The fire resistance is not"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3217.794,"endTime":3221.784,"body":"enough, but we can make it work."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3221.814,"endTime":3222.144,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3222.164,"endTime":3222.314,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3222.834,"endTime":3223.944,"body":"Yes, I think so."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3224.944,"endTime":3227.271,"body":"That's good"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3224.944,"endTime":3227.271,"body":"that I can leave you now that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3227.301,"endTime":3228.711,"body":"on this point we can finish up."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3229.278,"endTime":3232.278,"body":"I like a positive ending with"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3229.278,"endTime":3232.278,"body":"the way out and especially"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3232.278,"endTime":3235.091,"body":"one that, emphasizes on"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3232.278,"endTime":3235.091,"body":"why we need fire safety"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3235.091,"endTime":3236.171,"body":"engineers and why we need."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3236.36,"endTime":3237.86,"body":"Competent once in the field."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3237.89,"endTime":3238.91,"body":"Thank you so much, Daniel."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3239.345,"endTime":3239.615,"body":"yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3240.475,"endTime":3240.935,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3241.31,"endTime":3242.87,"body":"it"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3241.31,"endTime":3242.87,"body":"was a great pleasure to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3242.9,"endTime":3245.15,"body":"have you on the show and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3242.9,"endTime":3245.15,"body":"they asked you around."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3245.795,"endTime":3247.025,"body":"Yes,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3245.795,"endTime":3247.025,"body":"it was an honor."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3247.205,"endTime":3247.745,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Daniel Brandon","startTime":3247.775,"endTime":3248.735,"body":"Thank you very much."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3249.314,"endTime":3250.844,"body":"It"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3249.314,"endTime":3250.844,"body":"starts to be slightly boring."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3250.844,"endTime":3253.334,"body":"Whenever I get an"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3250.844,"endTime":3253.334,"body":"expert on fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3253.371,"endTime":3256.101,"body":"It usually ends up the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3253.371,"endTime":3256.101,"body":"same way we need to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3256.101,"endTime":3257.361,"body":"fire safety engineers."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3257.361,"endTime":3258.471,"body":"We need competencies."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3258.501,"endTime":3261.264,"body":"We need holistic view"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3258.501,"endTime":3261.264,"body":"on compartment fires."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3261.294,"endTime":3264.474,"body":"We need to look beyond"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3261.294,"endTime":3264.474,"body":"fire resistance."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3264.504,"endTime":3265.284,"body":"We need."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3265.311,"endTime":3268.971,"body":"To include all the effects this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3265.311,"endTime":3268.971,"body":"will have on the building fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3269.661,"endTime":3272.901,"body":"And as Daniel said, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3269.661,"endTime":3272.901,"body":"energy will go somewhere."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3272.961,"endTime":3275.211,"body":"So we need someone"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3272.961,"endTime":3275.211,"body":"who can consider that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3275.211,"endTime":3275.541,"body":"And."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3276.201,"endTime":3279.561,"body":"Why does those experts cannot"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3276.201,"endTime":3279.561,"body":"just say that wood is stronger"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3279.561,"endTime":3284.001,"body":"than steel in fire or the char"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3279.561,"endTime":3284.001,"body":"layer will prevent anything."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3284.001,"endTime":3286.611,"body":"And you can say for the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3284.001,"endTime":3286.611,"body":"build to a thousand meters"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3286.611,"endTime":3289.901,"body":"with wood, Well, They seem"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3286.611,"endTime":3289.901,"body":"to be unconvinced  um,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3290.471,"endTime":3293.636,"body":"obviously I'm, I'm sarcastic"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3290.471,"endTime":3293.636,"body":"as usual, but yeah."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3293.858,"endTime":3296.828,"body":"As you see from this episode"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3293.858,"endTime":3296.828,"body":"from episode with Danny,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3296.828,"endTime":3298.058,"body":"from episode with Felix."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3298.544,"endTime":3300.314,"body":"It is a complex issue."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3300.884,"endTime":3303.284,"body":"It is an issue so complicated."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3303.914,"endTime":3307.32,"body":"There's just absolutely no"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3303.914,"endTime":3307.32,"body":"way you can frame this problem"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3307.32,"endTime":3309.0,"body":"into a fire resistance problem."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3309.33,"endTime":3312.21,"body":"It never was a fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3309.33,"endTime":3312.21,"body":"resistance problem."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3312.39,"endTime":3313.23,"body":"To start with."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3313.98,"endTime":3318.512,"body":"It's just one measure, one"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3313.98,"endTime":3318.512,"body":"out of many that we can, and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3318.512,"endTime":3320.492,"body":"we should use when designing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3320.495,"endTime":3321.468,"body":"Timber buildings."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3322.008,"endTime":3325.368,"body":"And well, then you're sad"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3322.008,"endTime":3325.368,"body":"about unit configurations,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3325.428,"endTime":3328.098,"body":"the arrangement of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3325.428,"endTime":3328.098,"body":"materials to view factors."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3328.728,"endTime":3331.458,"body":"How much encapsulate,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3328.728,"endTime":3331.458,"body":"how much do you expose?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3332.178,"endTime":3334.818,"body":"This, this is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3332.178,"endTime":3334.818,"body":"happening right now."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3334.848,"endTime":3337.998,"body":"We are researching that there's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3334.848,"endTime":3337.998,"body":"many groups researching that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3338.342,"endTime":3338.732,"body":"already."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3338.732,"endTime":3343.742,"body":"Now you could probably use the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3338.732,"endTime":3343.742,"body":"knowledge we have and applied"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3343.802,"endTime":3347.822,"body":"and design quite a robust timber"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3343.802,"endTime":3347.822,"body":"structure that will be safe."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3348.452,"endTime":3351.392,"body":"And in few years, you will be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3348.452,"endTime":3351.392,"body":"armed with excellent research"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3351.392,"endTime":3353.882,"body":"with excellent peer reviewed"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3351.392,"endTime":3353.882,"body":"research on this subject."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3354.392,"endTime":3357.332,"body":"That will allow you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3354.392,"endTime":3357.332,"body":"to design safely."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3357.642,"endTime":3360.552,"body":"I'm just really worried"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3357.642,"endTime":3360.552,"body":"that no matter how much"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3360.552,"endTime":3363.432,"body":"research, we do no matter how"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3360.552,"endTime":3363.432,"body":"much we publish, no matter"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3363.432,"endTime":3365.052,"body":"how much insight we gain."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3365.192,"endTime":3369.302,"body":"It will be difficult to beat"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3365.192,"endTime":3369.302,"body":"the fire resistance paradigm."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3370.022,"endTime":3373.242,"body":"And show to the world"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3370.022,"endTime":3373.242,"body":"that it's just a measure."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3373.602,"endTime":3375.942,"body":"I hope you will help"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3373.602,"endTime":3375.942,"body":"me on that mission."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3376.362,"endTime":3379.198,"body":"By sharing this episode"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3376.362,"endTime":3379.198,"body":"and having informed"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3379.198,"endTime":3382.858,"body":"discussions with your"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3379.198,"endTime":3382.858,"body":"colleagues about this issue."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3382.858,"endTime":3386.765,"body":"And I hope all three episodes on"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3382.858,"endTime":3386.765,"body":"would in fire have brought you."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3386.78,"endTime":3389.898,"body":"Some really good insight"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3386.78,"endTime":3389.898,"body":"into how it can really work"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3389.898,"endTime":3391.608,"body":"and where the issue is."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3392.012,"endTime":3394.682,"body":"that's my dream that the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3392.012,"endTime":3394.682,"body":"I did army with this and I,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3394.682,"endTime":3395.912,"body":"I hope I've achieved that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3396.392,"endTime":3400.198,"body":"So, thank you very much"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3396.392,"endTime":3400.198,"body":"for being here with me."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3400.738,"endTime":3403.169,"body":"And, Some housekeeping items."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3403.792,"endTime":3407.239,"body":"First I'm very thankful to all"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3403.792,"endTime":3407.239,"body":"the supporters to the podcast."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3407.239,"endTime":3408.709,"body":"Who donate to the show with."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3408.829,"endTime":3411.979,"body":"From my website, then I really"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3408.829,"endTime":3411.979,"body":"appreciate that every dime"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3412.009,"endTime":3415.639,"body":"you send goes to equipment"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3412.009,"endTime":3415.639,"body":"and software and licenses and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3415.639,"endTime":3419.289,"body":"servers and so by participating"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3415.639,"endTime":3419.289,"body":"in this, you helped me a lot."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3419.799,"endTime":3423.039,"body":"And, I would also"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3419.799,"endTime":3423.039,"body":"like to ask you, to go"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3423.039,"endTime":3424.629,"body":"through your podcast app."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3424.929,"endTime":3426.819,"body":"That you're using"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3424.929,"endTime":3426.819,"body":"wherever you're listening."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3426.962,"endTime":3429.422,"body":"And maybe pop a five"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3426.962,"endTime":3429.422,"body":"star review there."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3429.752,"endTime":3432.482,"body":"Which helps me with"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3429.752,"endTime":3432.482,"body":"algorithms and stuff."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3432.591,"endTime":3436.431,"body":"So the podcast is more easily"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3432.591,"endTime":3436.431,"body":"available or more easy to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3436.431,"endTime":3440.241,"body":"find for ones that don't know"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3436.431,"endTime":3440.241,"body":"about its existence, but may,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3440.241,"endTime":3441.471,"body":"may need it at some point."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3441.861,"endTime":3445.131,"body":"So thank you for all of this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3441.861,"endTime":3445.131,"body":"and see you next Wednesday."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3445.431,"endTime":3445.731,"body":"Bye."}]}