{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":0.354,"endTime":0.954,"body":"Hello everybody."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":0.954,"endTime":2.634,"body":"Welcome to the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":0.954,"endTime":2.634,"body":"Fire Science Show."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3.234,"endTime":7.284,"body":"Having this podcast, I really"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":3.234,"endTime":7.284,"body":"like how it allows me to react"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":7.284,"endTime":10.147,"body":"on what's happening around"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":7.284,"endTime":10.147,"body":"in the fire science world."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":10.657,"endTime":15.487,"body":"And just two weeks ago, I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":10.657,"endTime":15.487,"body":"received a very, very good news"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":15.487,"endTime":19.657,"body":"and that was the announcement"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":15.487,"endTime":19.657,"body":"of the winners of E R C"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":19.657,"endTime":21.097,"body":"starting grants in Europe."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":21.549,"endTime":25.31,"body":"And this year, actually"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":21.549,"endTime":25.31,"body":"for the first time in the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":25.31,"endTime":28.467,"body":"starting grand scheme, there"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":25.31,"endTime":28.467,"body":"was a grant about fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":28.527,"endTime":32.294,"body":"This is huge This is amazing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":28.527,"endTime":32.294,"body":"that it has happened."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":32.714,"endTime":37.064,"body":"The grand benefactor is,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":32.714,"endTime":37.064,"body":"uh, no other than Professor"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":37.064,"endTime":39.91,"body":"Ruben van Co Multiple"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":37.064,"endTime":39.91,"body":"guests of the podcast,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":39.91,"endTime":41.05,"body":"a friend of the podcast."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":41.05,"endTime":44.987,"body":"I'm super happy for Ruben's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":41.05,"endTime":44.987,"body":"achievement and yeah, you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":44.987,"endTime":47.387,"body":"may think getting a grant,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":44.987,"endTime":47.387,"body":"that's not a big deal."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":47.777,"endTime":50.627,"body":"Everyone's getting a grant"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":47.777,"endTime":50.627,"body":"all the time and it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":50.627,"endTime":53.707,"body":"just something that runs the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":50.627,"endTime":53.707,"body":"coquilles of, of science."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":53.707,"endTime":56.227,"body":"But no, this scheme"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":53.707,"endTime":56.227,"body":"is, is special."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":56.737,"endTime":61.477,"body":"This is something meant to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":56.737,"endTime":61.477,"body":"fund breakthrough research."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":61.477,"endTime":64.447,"body":"Research that can"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":61.477,"endTime":64.447,"body":"truly change the."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":64.754,"endTime":69.004,"body":"Discipline, their research"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":64.754,"endTime":69.004,"body":"represents and the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":69.009,"endTime":70.454,"body":"project you can imagine."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":70.454,"endTime":73.154,"body":"I, I've invited Ruben and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":70.454,"endTime":73.154,"body":"we're gonna talk about it all"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":73.154,"endTime":74.884,"body":"the episode, this project."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":75.554,"endTime":77.954,"body":"Is something that can"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":75.554,"endTime":77.954,"body":"change fire engineering"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":77.959,"endTime":80.804,"body":"and fire science, and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":77.959,"endTime":80.804,"body":"I'm super happy about it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":81.224,"endTime":85.364,"body":"To get a ERC grant, you get"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":81.224,"endTime":85.364,"body":"through an insane process."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":85.394,"endTime":90.384,"body":"There's, I think up to 12 review"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":85.394,"endTime":90.384,"body":"as per each grant application."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":90.834,"endTime":93.474,"body":"The applications must"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":90.834,"endTime":93.474,"body":"be absolutely excellent."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":93.804,"endTime":95.514,"body":"Good is not enough for erc."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":95.514,"endTime":96.534,"body":"They must be excellent."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":96.534,"endTime":98.094,"body":"They must be super well thought."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":98.094,"endTime":99.714,"body":"They must be super"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":98.094,"endTime":99.714,"body":"well prepared."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":100.194,"endTime":102.804,"body":"They must be extremely"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":100.194,"endTime":102.804,"body":"well laid out."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":103.434,"endTime":106.518,"body":"So, even submitting a grant"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":103.434,"endTime":106.518,"body":"is already an achievement"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":106.518,"endTime":110.855,"body":"because you had to really think"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":106.518,"endTime":110.855,"body":"out what do you want to do,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":111.245,"endTime":113.438,"body":"and, getting one is approved."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":113.478,"endTime":118.897,"body":"That, that your Sound and it"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":113.478,"endTime":118.897,"body":"may change the world we live in."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":119.142,"endTime":122.907,"body":"So I'm really excited that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":119.142,"endTime":122.907,"body":"such a grant has happened"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":122.907,"endTime":124.137,"body":", in the world of Fire."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":124.677,"endTime":128.277,"body":"It used to be my dream to get"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":124.677,"endTime":128.277,"body":"an ERC founding one day, but"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":128.282,"endTime":129.937,"body":"then I started a podcast and I."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":130.312,"endTime":133.312,"body":"prefer this, this pathway"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":130.312,"endTime":133.312,"body":"actually  rather than,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":133.361,"endTime":134.638,"body":"fighting for funding schemes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":134.848,"endTime":137.998,"body":"But I'm happy that there are"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":134.848,"endTime":137.998,"body":"researchers at the absolutely"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":137.998,"endTime":140.908,"body":"highest level who do fight for"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":137.998,"endTime":140.908,"body":"these schemes and they win it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":141.328,"endTime":143.928,"body":"And today, yeah, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":141.328,"endTime":143.928,"body":"episode is all about"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":143.928,"endTime":145.128,"body":"Ruben, his achievement."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":145.128,"endTime":146.058,"body":"He's your C grant."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":146.118,"endTime":146.628,"body":"Let's go."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":170.287,"endTime":171.007,"body":"Hello everybody."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":171.097,"endTime":172.957,"body":"Welcome to the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":171.097,"endTime":172.957,"body":"Fire Science Show."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":173.017,"endTime":175.59,"body":"I'm here today with,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":173.017,"endTime":175.59,"body":"Ruben Van Coil again."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":175.62,"endTime":176.19,"body":"Hey, Ruben."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":177.12,"endTime":178.01,"body":"Good to see you."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":178.77,"endTime":179.16,"body":"man."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":179.22,"endTime":181.62,"body":"That's such a nice,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":179.22,"endTime":181.62,"body":"uh, opportunity to meet"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":181.62,"endTime":184.02,"body":"because you just received"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":181.62,"endTime":184.02,"body":"ERC starting grant."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":184.02,"endTime":184.56,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":184.797,"endTime":185.467,"body":"Amazing."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":185.467,"endTime":186.307,"body":"Thank you very much."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":186.722,"endTime":187.472,"body":"Amazing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":187.472,"endTime":188.282,"body":"Absolutely amazing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":188.282,"endTime":192.848,"body":"And, for those who don't know,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":188.282,"endTime":192.848,"body":"this is the, um, European"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":193.088,"endTime":195.971,"body":"Research Center grants"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":193.088,"endTime":195.971,"body":"that are awarded yearly."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":196.54,"endTime":198.215,"body":"are five years projects."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":198.222,"endTime":199.915,"body":"probably the biggest"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":198.222,"endTime":199.915,"body":"research grants."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":200.228,"endTime":202.718,"body":"single researcher can,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":200.228,"endTime":202.718,"body":"can receive in Europe."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":202.778,"endTime":207.165,"body":"And, it's very rare that the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":202.778,"endTime":207.165,"body":"fire, I mean, it's very rare"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":207.165,"endTime":209.385,"body":"for a civil engineer to get one."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":209.385,"endTime":212.862,"body":"And for fire, I think, for"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":209.385,"endTime":212.862,"body":"fire engineering only Guillermo"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":212.862,"endTime":216.135,"body":"had had, e R C funding and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":212.862,"endTime":216.135,"body":"we actually covered that in,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":216.14,"endTime":217.395,"body":"in a podcast in episode two."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":217.693,"endTime":219.935,"body":"if you want to check out"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":217.693,"endTime":219.935,"body":"the, the, the scale of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":219.935,"endTime":221.345,"body":"a grant towards the end."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":221.99,"endTime":224.33,"body":"Today we're gonna talk"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":221.99,"endTime":224.33,"body":"about the scale of a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":224.33,"endTime":225.63,"body":"grant at the early day."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":225.87,"endTime":230.423,"body":"So I'm gonna read the title and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":225.87,"endTime":230.423,"body":"you give me, uh, your elevator"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":230.423,"endTime":234.053,"body":"pitch because you, I know you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":230.423,"endTime":234.053,"body":"must have had, had trained that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":234.083,"endTime":238.097,"body":"So I, I read the title, you give"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":234.083,"endTime":238.097,"body":"me elevator pitch about what it"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":238.097,"endTime":239.837,"body":"is, and then we go into details."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":240.407,"endTime":242.667,"body":"Adaptive fire testing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":240.407,"endTime":242.667,"body":"and new foundation"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":242.667,"endTime":243.927,"body":"Stone for Fire Safety,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":244.393,"endTime":245.003,"body":"Indeed."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":245.573,"endTime":249.757,"body":"I would say my official elevator"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":245.573,"endTime":249.757,"body":"pitch, I'll, leave that for"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":249.757,"endTime":252.72,"body":"now cause it was like, it's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":249.757,"endTime":252.72,"body":"very, let's targeted and also"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":252.72,"endTime":254.8,"body":"for people who actually already"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":252.72,"endTime":254.8,"body":"read the proposal, right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":255.06,"endTime":260.135,"body":"So what we want to do is we want"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":255.06,"endTime":260.135,"body":"to develop, Tools and methods to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":260.135,"endTime":264.338,"body":"just change how we, demonstrate"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":260.135,"endTime":264.338,"body":"fire safety and buildings."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":264.878,"endTime":266.738,"body":"And there are different"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":264.878,"endTime":266.738,"body":"aspects to this."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":266.768,"endTime":269.838,"body":"So first of all, if you think"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":266.768,"endTime":269.838,"body":"about how, Demonstrating"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":269.838,"endTime":270.888,"body":"safety and buildings is done."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":270.888,"endTime":274.925,"body":"Now we have this prescriptive,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":270.888,"endTime":274.925,"body":"uh, fire testing, which with"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":274.925,"endTime":277.232,"body":"pass fail criteria, and what"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":274.925,"endTime":277.232,"body":"we want to do is want to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":277.232,"endTime":282.422,"body":"move towards testing, which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":277.232,"endTime":282.422,"body":"actually teaches us or how"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":282.427,"endTime":285.872,"body":"the build the building product"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":282.427,"endTime":285.872,"body":"will behave in a real fire."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":286.218,"endTime":288.198,"body":"And, and this, there, there's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":286.218,"endTime":288.198,"body":"lots of uncertainties there."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":288.198,"endTime":290.398,"body":"So this is definitely,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":288.198,"endTime":290.398,"body":"it's not an easy question."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":290.598,"endTime":293.082,"body":"You want to quantify how"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":290.598,"endTime":293.082,"body":"the building, the product"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":293.082,"endTime":294.222,"body":"behaves depending on the."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":294.607,"endTime":295.027,"body":"Itself."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":295.49,"endTime":299.963,"body":"Secondly, when you have"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":295.49,"endTime":299.963,"body":"that, we also want this to be"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":299.963,"endTime":302.397,"body":"incorporated in demonstrating"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":299.963,"endTime":302.397,"body":"safety for a building."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":302.673,"endTime":305.373,"body":"So we don't want to just"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":302.673,"endTime":305.373,"body":"have prescriptive rules and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":305.373,"endTime":307.653,"body":"saying, ah, it has to be"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":305.373,"endTime":307.653,"body":"this kind of product and we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":307.653,"endTime":310.713,"body":"don't want to propose better"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":307.653,"endTime":310.713,"body":"classification methods."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":310.923,"endTime":313.693,"body":"No, we want to have an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":310.923,"endTime":313.693,"body":"evaluation, a real-time"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":313.693,"endTime":317.077,"body":"evaluation of the risk"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":313.693,"endTime":317.077,"body":"profile of buildings and what."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":317.505,"endTime":318.24,"body":"allows you to do that."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":318.24,"endTime":320.52,"body":"I mean, it allows you to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":318.24,"endTime":320.52,"body":"do many things, but what it"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":320.52,"endTime":324.193,"body":"allows you to do is, just"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":320.52,"endTime":324.193,"body":"step away from what you think"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":324.193,"endTime":325.453,"body":"of as prescriptive guidance."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":325.753,"endTime":327.073,"body":"So there are no rules anymore."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":327.463,"endTime":330.147,"body":"What you now have to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":327.463,"endTime":330.147,"body":"have is a building, which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":330.152,"endTime":331.437,"body":"passes safety criterion."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":331.751,"endTime":333.543,"body":"And we can talk about"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":331.751,"endTime":333.543,"body":"safety criteria later."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":333.543,"endTime":335.748,"body":"Cause I mean it's not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":333.543,"endTime":335.748,"body":"an easy statement there,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":335.748,"endTime":338.558,"body":"but fundamentally you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":335.748,"endTime":338.558,"body":"evaluate the risk of a."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":339.598,"endTime":341.853,"body":"and if the risk is too high,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":339.598,"endTime":341.853,"body":"you have to change something."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":342.177,"endTime":344.817,"body":"but if you think about this,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":342.177,"endTime":344.817,"body":"say like, okay, this, uh,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":344.997,"endTime":347.637,"body":"this all sounds very nice, but"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":344.997,"endTime":347.637,"body":"you have to change something."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":347.637,"endTime":351.267,"body":"And then how can I now possibly"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":347.637,"endTime":351.267,"body":"evaluate what to change?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":351.537,"endTime":353.397,"body":"Well, yes, it's a very"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":351.537,"endTime":353.397,"body":"difficult question."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":353.607,"endTime":354.717,"body":"You need to do"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":353.607,"endTime":354.717,"body":"medical calculation."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":354.717,"endTime":357.177,"body":"So we're also going to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":354.717,"endTime":357.177,"body":"do surrogate modeling."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":357.772,"endTime":360.792,"body":"We're going to do, basically,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":357.772,"endTime":360.792,"body":"you can call this machine"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":360.792,"endTime":364.092,"body":"learning, but we're going to do"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":360.792,"endTime":364.092,"body":"physics based machine learning."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":364.092,"endTime":366.522,"body":"So physical constraints,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":364.092,"endTime":366.522,"body":"physical backgrounds"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":366.522,"endTime":367.032,"body":"to the model."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":367.212,"endTime":369.975,"body":"So getting to machine"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":367.212,"endTime":369.975,"body":"learning, which actually"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":370.365,"endTime":374.035,"body":"make, where we make sure"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":370.365,"endTime":374.035,"body":"that our results, comply with"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":374.305,"endTime":375.595,"body":"the basic physics really."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":376.705,"endTime":378.415,"body":"So that's the core"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":376.705,"endTime":378.415,"body":"of the project."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":378.642,"endTime":381.295,"body":"There is one additional"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":378.642,"endTime":381.295,"body":"point, I like very much."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":382.205,"endTime":384.245,"body":"abdo would be a challenge"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":382.205,"endTime":384.245,"body":"as well, is that there's a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":384.245,"endTime":387.458,"body":"work package on, let's say"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":384.245,"endTime":387.458,"body":"convincing stakeholders really."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":387.818,"endTime":392.348,"body":"So we're going to do a cost"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":387.818,"endTime":392.348,"body":"benefit evaluation of compliance"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":392.378,"endTime":396.262,"body":"frameworks, the existing"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":392.378,"endTime":396.262,"body":"framework, what we propose and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":396.262,"endTime":399.788,"body":"alternatives possibly so that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":396.262,"endTime":399.788,"body":"then at the end, hopefully."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":400.157,"endTime":403.457,"body":"Show, or at least we, we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":400.157,"endTime":403.457,"body":"provide a method to show"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":403.503,"endTime":407.923,"body":"that this approach, which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":403.503,"endTime":407.923,"body":"we are proposing actually"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":407.928,"endTime":411.063,"body":"has a benefit to society"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":407.928,"endTime":411.063,"body":"compared to just sticking"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":411.063,"endTime":412.293,"body":"what we have done forever."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":413.147,"endTime":415.857,"body":"So, and that's the starting"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":413.147,"endTime":415.857,"body":"point of, of the proposal"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":415.857,"endTime":418.312,"body":"really saying like, look,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":415.857,"endTime":418.312,"body":"We need to change this."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":418.322,"endTime":421.552,"body":"We need to have a new way"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":418.322,"endTime":421.552,"body":"of testing, and this new"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":421.552,"endTime":424.912,"body":"way of testing should not be"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":421.552,"endTime":424.912,"body":"one with pass fail criteria,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":425.252,"endTime":430.552,"body":"but one where we test to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":425.252,"endTime":430.552,"body":"increase our knowledge, so"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":430.662,"endTime":433.832,"body":"either it's very specifically"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":430.662,"endTime":433.832,"body":"product development."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":433.832,"endTime":436.032,"body":"We're going to increase"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":433.832,"endTime":436.032,"body":"our knowledge and reduce"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":436.032,"endTime":439.032,"body":"uncertainty in the behavior"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":436.032,"endTime":439.032,"body":"of a building product."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":439.872,"endTime":443.462,"body":"In fire or very case"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":439.872,"endTime":443.462,"body":"specific and targeted."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":443.602,"endTime":446.102,"body":"You have a specific"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":443.602,"endTime":446.102,"body":"building, could be even an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":446.422,"endTime":450.782,"body":"existing building, and you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":446.422,"endTime":450.782,"body":"want to perform a test so"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":450.782,"endTime":453.662,"body":"that you demonstrate that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":450.782,"endTime":453.662,"body":"your building is safe."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":454.122,"endTime":458.176,"body":"Now, this might raise lots"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":454.122,"endTime":458.176,"body":"of questions, but we can talk"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":458.376,"endTime":459.536,"body":"about that later, of course."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":460.036,"endTime":463.274,"body":"Now, to enable all of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":460.036,"endTime":463.274,"body":"that, you need lots of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":463.274,"endTime":465.394,"body":"stuff you need to do."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":465.394,"endTime":466.274,"body":"Uncertainty, quant."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":466.935,"endTime":470.305,"body":"You need to, do what"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":466.935,"endTime":470.305,"body":"is actually a value of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":470.305,"endTime":471.705,"body":"information assessment."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":472.015,"endTime":476.345,"body":"What that means is that you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":472.015,"endTime":476.345,"body":"are going to evaluate before"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":476.345,"endTime":479.305,"body":"you do a test, what you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":476.345,"endTime":479.305,"body":"think the test is going to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":479.305,"endTime":482.145,"body":"give you, and that way you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":479.305,"endTime":482.145,"body":"can compare different tests."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":482.455,"endTime":484.746,"body":"I mean, this might"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":482.455,"endTime":484.746,"body":"sound very weird when"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":485.026,"endTime":485.842,"body":"you hear first time"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":486.117,"endTime":486.747,"body":"We we're gonna"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":486.747,"endTime":489.165,"body":"jump into that in very details."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":489.165,"endTime":493.895,"body":"So my attempt at summarizing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":489.165,"endTime":493.895,"body":"that, are designing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":493.895,"endTime":495.155,"body":"buildings based on."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":496.445,"endTime":500.496,"body":"century assumption of what"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":496.445,"endTime":500.496,"body":"fire performance is, fragmented"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":500.501,"endTime":503.115,"body":"into elements, parts of it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":503.685,"endTime":504.825,"body":"Like not a building at all."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":504.825,"endTime":507.883,"body":"I just had a Cardington episode"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":504.825,"endTime":507.883,"body":"in the podcast where it was"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":508.273,"endTime":511.053,"body":"1990s, where they, for the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":508.273,"endTime":511.053,"body":"first time, I think, looked"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":511.053,"endTime":514.023,"body":"at the building as a whole,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":511.053,"endTime":514.023,"body":"not as a sum of its elements."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":514.023,"endTime":514.353,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":514.783,"endTime":515.193,"body":"1990s."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":515.732,"endTime":518.272,"body":"given that fire testing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":515.732,"endTime":518.272,"body":"is a hundred something"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":518.272,"endTime":519.052,"body":"years old, right."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":519.882,"endTime":523.159,"body":"so, we need, to at it in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":519.882,"endTime":523.159,"body":"a, in a different way."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":523.159,"endTime":527.399,"body":"And, and, uh, current fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":523.159,"endTime":527.399,"body":"testing that's based on fail"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":527.419,"endTime":532.042,"body":"pass and just, single element"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":527.419,"endTime":532.042,"body":"test is not meeting that at all."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":532.047,"endTime":534.007,"body":"So, so you would rather"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":532.047,"endTime":534.007,"body":"keep the fire testing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":534.007,"endTime":536.437,"body":"I appreciate that as someone"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":534.007,"endTime":536.437,"body":"who is running a fire lab"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":536.647,"endTime":540.457,"body":"thank you, It's great that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":536.647,"endTime":540.457,"body":"you see a future for us too."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":540.922,"endTime":544.074,"body":"but you would like us to not be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":540.922,"endTime":544.074,"body":"the judge and say, this failed"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":544.074,"endTime":547.761,"body":"this past, but you would like"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":544.074,"endTime":547.761,"body":"us to build up any information,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":547.91,"endTime":549.37,"body":"Yes,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":547.91,"endTime":549.37,"body":"we can maybe even be a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":549.37,"endTime":550.29,"body":"bit more targeted there."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":550.29,"endTime":553.77,"body":"So you had the, the episode"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":550.29,"endTime":553.77,"body":"of On Fire Resistance,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":554.04,"endTime":555.274,"body":"some, say, weeks ago."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":555.734,"endTime":558.394,"body":"And at, at some point"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":555.734,"endTime":558.394,"body":"in that episode, if I"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":558.514,"endTime":558.794,"body":"remember correct, you."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":559.024,"endTime":561.994,"body":"You're talking about, okay,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":559.024,"endTime":561.994,"body":"you can do testing and you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":561.994,"endTime":566.034,"body":"can do numerical evaluations,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":561.994,"endTime":566.034,"body":"and uh, if I remember that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":566.034,"endTime":568.991,"body":"correctly, it's like, well,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":566.034,"endTime":568.991,"body":"numerical evaluations are the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":568.991,"endTime":572.351,"body":"alternative and we, we know"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":568.991,"endTime":572.351,"body":"this is not the way to go."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":572.351,"endTime":573.871,"body":"There cannot be an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":572.351,"endTime":573.871,"body":"alternative to testing."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":574.253,"endTime":578.263,"body":"I would say, look, let's not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":574.253,"endTime":578.263,"body":"split those things fully."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":578.893,"endTime":579.013,"body":"Hmm"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":579.063,"endTime":581.103,"body":"Actually, you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":579.063,"endTime":581.103,"body":"integrate them and it is your"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":581.103,"endTime":584.663,"body":"numerical evaluation, which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":581.103,"endTime":584.663,"body":"defines which test you should."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":584.999,"endTime":587.795,"body":"And it is your test,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":584.999,"endTime":587.795,"body":"which then informs your"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":587.795,"endTime":588.595,"body":"numerical evaluation."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":588.595,"endTime":592.096,"body":"I mean, it's, it's logical,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":588.595,"endTime":592.096,"body":"but, and this is the, the core"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":592.139,"endTime":595.809,"body":"of the proposal as an, okay,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":592.139,"endTime":595.809,"body":"it's easy to say that, but how"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":595.809,"endTime":597.169,"body":"are we actually going to do it?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":597.439,"endTime":598.309,"body":"Yeah, yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":598.347,"endTime":601.767,"body":"you got me at the pass file"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":598.347,"endTime":601.767,"body":"criteria, like, uh, I, I really"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":601.767,"endTime":605.457,"body":"see no point if I'm doing a fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":601.767,"endTime":605.457,"body":"test for a, a person and, they"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":605.457,"endTime":609.627,"body":"have a 60 minute wall and, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":605.457,"endTime":609.627,"body":"the test stands at 59 minutes"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":609.627,"endTime":611.157,"body":"and they haven't passed it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":611.247,"endTime":612.617,"body":"And, uh, then they have."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":612.717,"endTime":615.957,"body":"To come again, the same"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":612.717,"endTime":615.957,"body":"wall, 58 minutes, then"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":615.957,"endTime":617.007,"body":"again the same wall."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":617.007,"endTime":617.727,"body":"62 minutes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":617.727,"endTime":617.997,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":617.997,"endTime":621.241,"body":"Now this wall is good"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":617.997,"endTime":621.241,"body":"And, and that's, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":621.818,"endTime":622.885,"body":"that, that's ridiculous."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":623.358,"endTime":626.058,"body":"that's a system that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":623.358,"endTime":626.058,"body":"existed for Century."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":626.272,"endTime":631.771,"body":"And has led to, whole industry"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":626.272,"endTime":631.771,"body":"focused on passing the tests"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":632.061,"endTime":633.321,"body":"that that's what we have today."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":633.445,"endTime":636.718,"body":"it doesn't mean that it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":633.445,"endTime":636.718,"body":"work, our buildings are safe."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":636.741,"endTime":640.171,"body":". But then again, we, we did,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":636.741,"endTime":640.171,"body":"uh, with my friend Grzegorz"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":640.191,"endTime":643.675,"body":"um, he was also on the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":640.191,"endTime":643.675,"body":"podcast a very unformal survey"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":643.735,"endTime":647.16,"body":"with, Building managers, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":643.735,"endTime":647.16,"body":"construction managers in Poland"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":647.16,"endTime":650.34,"body":"who were doing, uh, large"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":647.16,"endTime":650.34,"body":"investments like shopping"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":650.34,"endTime":653.34,"body":"malls, airports, like very"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":650.34,"endTime":653.34,"body":"large building skyscrapers."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":654.09,"endTime":657.63,"body":"we were very informally asking"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":654.09,"endTime":657.63,"body":"them like, do you think, how,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":657.63,"endTime":660.6,"body":"how much of the whole building"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":657.63,"endTime":660.6,"body":"cost that you are building,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":660.72,"endTime":663.45,"body":"how, how much of that would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":660.72,"endTime":663.45,"body":"be like fire safety, like, or"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":663.45,"endTime":664.95,"body":"everything fire safety related."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":665.37,"endTime":667.8,"body":"The, the passive active fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":665.37,"endTime":667.8,"body":"protection, everything design."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":668.22,"endTime":670.38,"body":"And the, the answer was"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":668.22,"endTime":670.38,"body":"very consistent between"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":670.38,"endTime":672.37,"body":"10 to 15% of the building."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":673.17,"endTime":676.995,"body":"So we are actually spending"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":673.17,"endTime":676.995,"body":"quite a lot on fire safety."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":676.995,"endTime":680.295,"body":"If you think that 10 or 15%"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":676.995,"endTime":680.295,"body":"of the building industry,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":680.625,"endTime":683.14,"body":"which is one of the biggest"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":680.625,"endTime":683.14,"body":"industries on the planet"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":683.148,"endTime":684.468,"body":"is related to fire safety."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":684.798,"endTime":687.528,"body":"So that's a tremendous amount"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":684.798,"endTime":687.528,"body":"of, of resources, global"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":687.528,"endTime":690.558,"body":"scale that we may be using in."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":691.308,"endTime":694.038,"body":"In a stupid way, to be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":691.308,"endTime":694.038,"body":"honest, because, what's the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":694.038,"endTime":697.918,"body":"difference between two and a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":694.038,"endTime":697.918,"body":"four hour wall in a skyscraper?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":697.918,"endTime":700.138,"body":"Like really for the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":697.918,"endTime":700.138,"body":"the love of God?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":700.438,"endTime":703.578,"body":"If the fire lasts, seven"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":700.438,"endTime":703.578,"body":"or eight hours to destroy"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":703.578,"endTime":707.018,"body":"a four hour wall, the fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":703.578,"endTime":707.018,"body":"resistance of that wall is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":707.018,"endTime":707.958,"body":"the least of your problems."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":707.958,"endTime":708.768,"body":"To be honest."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":709.658,"endTime":713.314,"body":"so, I guess your, your grant"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":709.658,"endTime":713.314,"body":"is also looking in into that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":713.314,"endTime":716.314,"body":"because, you want to change the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":713.314,"endTime":716.314,"body":"paradigm like completely right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":716.564,"endTime":718.094,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":716.564,"endTime":718.094,"body":"so you, you raised an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":718.094,"endTime":718.974,"body":"important point there."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":718.974,"endTime":720.574,"body":"So when, when we talk about."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":720.914,"endTime":723.901,"body":"our prescriptive,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":720.914,"endTime":723.901,"body":"regulation, but regulation"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":723.901,"endTime":724.621,"body":"can also be guidance."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":725.004,"endTime":728.134,"body":"That terminology there doesn't"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":725.004,"endTime":728.134,"body":"matter too much for now."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":728.541,"endTime":730.581,"body":"we are not so clear on"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":728.541,"endTime":730.581,"body":"what we want to achieve."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":730.611,"endTime":731.741,"body":"That's, that's one."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":731.741,"endTime":736.298,"body":"And very importantly, if we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":731.741,"endTime":736.298,"body":"think about how innovation is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":736.298,"endTime":739.768,"body":"moving so fast, and this is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":736.298,"endTime":739.768,"body":"subjective, I admit, but I'd"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":739.768,"endTime":744.228,"body":"see no way how a government"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":739.768,"endTime":744.228,"body":"body or any other institution"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":744.328,"endTime":749.064,"body":"can just keep up with it and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":744.328,"endTime":749.064,"body":"keep on, improving or adapting"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":749.064,"endTime":750.264,"body":"their prescriptive guidance."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":750.894,"endTime":751.414,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":751.414,"endTime":752.534,"body":"So something has to give."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":752.784,"endTime":756.494,"body":"So either your prescriptive"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":752.784,"endTime":756.494,"body":"guidance just lags behind."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":756.614,"endTime":759.494,"body":"Maybe that's the traditional"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":756.614,"endTime":759.494,"body":"way where you wait for failure"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":759.494,"endTime":762.174,"body":"to happen and then we'll,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":759.494,"endTime":762.174,"body":"we'll try to sort things out."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":762.664,"endTime":766.624,"body":"Or either you are hampering"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":762.664,"endTime":766.624,"body":"innovation, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":766.624,"endTime":769.264,"body":"You, you just say, ah, this"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":766.624,"endTime":769.264,"body":"is not allowed, and why not?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":769.264,"endTime":773.201,"body":"Well, because it doesn't meet"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":769.264,"endTime":773.201,"body":"this requirements, although"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":773.201,"endTime":773.881,"body":"it doesn't make sense."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":774.251,"endTime":778.358,"body":"So what we also want to do"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":774.251,"endTime":778.358,"body":"within this proposal, is use"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":778.358,"endTime":780.998,"body":"this adaptive fire testing"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":778.358,"endTime":780.998,"body":"we talked about earlier where"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":780.998,"endTime":784.838,"body":"will now get a much better"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":780.998,"endTime":784.838,"body":"view on the behavior of a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":784.918,"endTime":790.404,"body":"building product to get a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":784.918,"endTime":790.404,"body":"risk-based evaluation of the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":790.404,"endTime":791.484,"body":"fire performance of a building."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":791.774,"endTime":796.004,"body":"So if you do this in a proper"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":791.774,"endTime":796.004,"body":"way, and this so conceptually,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":796.514,"endTime":800.071,"body":"make it it simple, but it'll"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":796.514,"endTime":800.071,"body":"be very difficult to achieve."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":800.448,"endTime":801.598,"body":"an architect."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":801.738,"endTime":806.768,"body":"Design the building, submits"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":801.738,"endTime":806.768,"body":"the plans electronically to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":806.768,"endTime":811.544,"body":"the building authorities, and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":806.768,"endTime":811.544,"body":"then their computer system was"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":811.904,"endTime":812.664,"body":"probably a surrogate model."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":812.664,"endTime":816.818,"body":"Then evaluates the risk of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":812.664,"endTime":816.818,"body":"this building, taking into"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":816.818,"endTime":820.578,"body":"account all of the information"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":816.818,"endTime":820.578,"body":"it has on building products,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":821.058,"endTime":822.058,"body":"previous designs, and."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":822.979,"endTime":825.779,"body":"so, and then you get a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":822.979,"endTime":825.779,"body":"evaluation of the risk of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":825.779,"endTime":827.779,"body":"this building, and this is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":825.779,"endTime":827.779,"body":"what has to be accepted."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":827.849,"endTime":830.059,"body":"I mean, this is the only"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":827.849,"endTime":830.059,"body":"thing that really matters"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":831.058,"endTime":831.618,"body":"You, you, you've brought"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":831.618,"endTime":832.278,"body":"something new now."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":832.564,"endTime":834.514,"body":"there we, we talked"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":832.564,"endTime":834.514,"body":"about the, the product."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":834.514,"endTime":837.784,"body":"So I guess it would be the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":834.514,"endTime":837.784,"body":"um, manufacturer of the product"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":837.784,"endTime":840.994,"body":"in interested in this, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":837.784,"endTime":840.994,"body":"approach or, or, or one of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":840.999,"endTime":842.314,"body":"the stakeholders involved."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":842.734,"endTime":846.424,"body":"There's an building designer"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":842.734,"endTime":846.424,"body":"and now, now we've mentioned"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":846.429,"endTime":850.381,"body":"building author, like, what"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":846.429,"endTime":850.381,"body":"is their place in your."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":851.136,"endTime":853.566,"body":"Like today and, and within"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":851.136,"endTime":853.566,"body":"the adaptive framework."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":853.566,"endTime":856.176,"body":"So you said that  the goal"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":853.566,"endTime":856.176,"body":"would be to provide them"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":856.176,"endTime":860.766,"body":"some sort of automated"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":856.176,"endTime":860.766,"body":"tool metric, uh, system."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":861.091,"endTime":861.511,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":862.151,"endTime":865.511,"body":"Although we have to, make a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":862.151,"endTime":865.511,"body":"distinction maybe for the,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":865.511,"endTime":869.261,"body":"for this project between,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":865.511,"endTime":869.261,"body":"so the, the vision, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":869.601,"endTime":872.581,"body":"And I can imagine many people"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":869.601,"endTime":872.581,"body":"have this kind of vision"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":872.581,"endTime":875.741,"body":"where vision, where of a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":872.581,"endTime":875.741,"body":"instantaneous evaluation"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":875.741,"endTime":878.381,"body":"of fire risk for buildings."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":878.877,"endTime":881.624,"body":", which means that the authorities"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":878.877,"endTime":881.624,"body":"do not have to prescribe"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":881.624,"endTime":884.144,"body":"things anymore because you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":881.624,"endTime":884.144,"body":"have the risk evaluation."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":884.204,"endTime":886.664,"body":"The prescription is just some"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":884.204,"endTime":886.664,"body":"kind of substitute, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":886.954,"endTime":889.584,"body":"So what you actually care"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":886.954,"endTime":889.584,"body":"about is fire performance."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":889.658,"endTime":891.168,"body":"So this is what we want."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":891.168,"endTime":891.768,"body":"That's the vision."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":892.348,"endTime":893.608,"body":"Now, how do we get there?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":893.918,"endTime":896.528,"body":"Well, therefore you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":893.918,"endTime":896.528,"body":"need some tools."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":896.528,"endTime":899.956,"body":"You need methodologies"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":896.528,"endTime":899.956,"body":"within the proposal."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":899.956,"endTime":904.416,"body":"Different work packages, we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":899.956,"endTime":904.416,"body":"are developing some of those"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":904.466,"endTime":907.416,"body":"methods, some of those tools,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":904.466,"endTime":907.416,"body":"but you should not think them"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":907.579,"endTime":909.329,"body":"as, uh, a finished product."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":909.799,"endTime":913.649,"body":"It's more like, okay, if we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":909.799,"endTime":913.649,"body":"manage to do this prove of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":913.649,"endTime":917.843,"body":"concept, then hopefully we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":913.649,"endTime":917.843,"body":"can convince other people,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":917.943,"endTime":921.803,"body":"institutions, researchers,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":917.943,"endTime":921.803,"body":"government, and so on industry"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":921.893,"endTime":923.523,"body":"to invest in this and."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":924.715,"endTime":928.473,"body":"With our, uh, proof of concept,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":924.715,"endTime":928.473,"body":"build this new way for, uh,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":928.473,"endTime":929.553,"body":"demonstrating fire safety."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":929.926,"endTime":930.496,"body":"Fantastic."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":930.496,"endTime":931.066,"body":"Fantastic."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":931.341,"endTime":931.581,"body":"okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":931.726,"endTime":934.327,"body":"let's talk the case study"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":931.726,"endTime":934.327,"body":"because I, you, you picked"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":934.327,"endTime":937.547,"body":"an interesting case study,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":934.327,"endTime":937.547,"body":"which is, glazing and, um,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":937.937,"endTime":939.497,"body":"and Lord burying glazing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":939.947,"endTime":941.987,"body":"What, what, um, made you."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":943.082,"endTime":944.522,"body":"Pursued this path."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":944.522,"endTime":947.852,"body":"Like why, why, why glazing as"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":944.522,"endTime":947.852,"body":"your case study to demonstrate"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":947.852,"endTime":948.752,"body":"this new methodology?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":948.821,"endTime":951.071,"body":"Well, that's .that's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":951.071,"endTime":951.871,"body":"a funny question."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":952.216,"endTime":953.326,"body":"I find it intriguing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":953.386,"endTime":953.536,"body":"It"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":953.536,"endTime":954.436,"body":"wouldn't be my first"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":954.436,"endTime":954.796,"body":"choice."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":954.961,"endTime":956.591,"body":"so"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":954.961,"endTime":956.591,"body":"writing the C proposal."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":956.797,"endTime":959.607,"body":"I go through different"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":956.797,"endTime":959.607,"body":"stages, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":959.617,"endTime":964.227,"body":"So almost a year in advance,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":959.617,"endTime":964.227,"body":"uh, some preliminary ideas,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":964.227,"endTime":965.347,"body":"but don't go into depth."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":965.347,"endTime":969.227,"body":"And then I, I think in, in"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":965.347,"endTime":969.227,"body":"the summer before, submission"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":969.227,"endTime":972.667,"body":"really going into detail and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":969.227,"endTime":972.667,"body":"went to different versions"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":972.667,"endTime":975.227,"body":"of it, the glazing was not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":972.667,"endTime":975.227,"body":"there in the first version."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":975.786,"endTime":977.442,"body":"And then you ask feedback."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":977.512,"endTime":980.692,"body":"And feedback is because I"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":977.512,"endTime":980.692,"body":"was working with concrete,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":980.692,"endTime":982.732,"body":"which is the typical thing"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":980.692,"endTime":982.732,"body":"which we do in our lab."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":982.906,"endTime":986.759,"body":"and some Gibson burst, as well"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":982.906,"endTime":986.759,"body":"and said like, why concrete?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":987.086,"endTime":990.599,"body":"Like, oh, cause it makes"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":987.086,"endTime":990.599,"body":"me feel comfortable,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":991.579,"endTime":993.159,"body":", and then in, right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":993.369,"endTime":998.667,"body":"So what, and, and say, well,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":993.369,"endTime":998.667,"body":"Highlight that within the E R C,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":998.667,"endTime":1000.627,"body":"it's about high risk, high gain."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1000.627,"endTime":1001.901,"body":"What is challenging?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1001.901,"endTime":1004.037,"body":"What is, a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1001.901,"endTime":1004.037,"body":"breakthrough and swamp?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1004.727,"endTime":1005.087,"body":". Okay."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1005.087,"endTime":1007.664,"body":"That's tricky what we have now."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1007.664,"endTime":1009.504,"body":"And so there are different"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1007.664,"endTime":1009.504,"body":"arguments than in"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1009.504,"endTime":1010.384,"body":"favor of the glazing."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1010.384,"endTime":1012.824,"body":"What we have now on the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1010.384,"endTime":1012.824,"body":"structural engineering side"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1012.994,"endTime":1015.984,"body":"is that there is a new euro"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1012.994,"endTime":1015.984,"body":"code coming for glazing."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1015.984,"endTime":1018.464,"body":"This will not have a fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1015.984,"endTime":1018.464,"body":"part yet, so this fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1018.464,"endTime":1019.504,"body":"part has to be developed."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1019.504,"endTime":1022.264,"body":"There's a lot, lot of research"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1019.504,"endTime":1022.264,"body":"which is needed there."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1022.264,"endTime":1022.704,"body":"So, okay."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1022.944,"endTime":1025.574,"body":"That's, one reason why"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1022.944,"endTime":1025.574,"body":"glazing is, is relevant"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1026.424,"endTime":1027.934,"body":"on the fire part then."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1028.689,"endTime":1031.869,"body":"Our glazing in buildings,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1028.689,"endTime":1031.869,"body":"not load bearing glazing,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1031.869,"endTime":1034.662,"body":"but just, genital glazing,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1031.869,"endTime":1034.662,"body":"defines how our fires develop."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1035.086,"endTime":1036.166,"body":"Glass breakage."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1036.216,"endTime":1040.246,"body":"So from that perspective,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1036.216,"endTime":1040.246,"body":"although there has been a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1040.246,"endTime":1043.526,"body":"lot of research on glass"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1040.246,"endTime":1043.526,"body":"breakage, there is still a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1043.526,"endTime":1047.626,"body":"lot which can be done, to just"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1043.526,"endTime":1047.626,"body":"improve how we, how we do fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1047.626,"endTime":1048.946,"body":"dynamics calculations, really."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1049.156,"endTime":1050.346,"body":"So provide input there."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1050.406,"endTime":1050.796,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1050.852,"endTime":1053.022,"body":"this, uh,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1050.852,"endTime":1053.022,"body":"these are two arguments"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1053.022,"endTime":1054.342,"body":"in favor of the glazing."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1054.809,"endTime":1055.929,"body":"Actually, there is also a third."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1056.224,"endTime":1057.704,"body":"Just being complete here."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1057.704,"endTime":1060.081,"body":"Is that within, the department?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1060.081,"endTime":1063.641,"body":"One colleague of mine is, uh,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1060.081,"endTime":1063.641,"body":"let's say expert in glazing."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1063.641,"endTime":1065.281,"body":"So that's also really"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1063.641,"endTime":1065.281,"body":"nice and convenient."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1065.391,"endTime":1065.751,"body":"That's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1066.061,"endTime":1066.551,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1067.023,"endTime":1068.261,"body":"I'm not surprised that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1068.261,"endTime":1069.461,"body":"glazing is interesting."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1069.466,"endTime":1073.114,"body":"I, I had a podcast episode"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1069.466,"endTime":1073.114,"body":"with  Yu Wang and that, uh, was,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1073.121,"endTime":1076.881,"body":"fascinating, like to learn the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1073.121,"endTime":1076.881,"body":"complexities of glazing and,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1077.396,"endTime":1081.211,"body":"also have been testing multiple"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1077.396,"endTime":1081.211,"body":"types of, of, of glazing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1081.261,"endTime":1083.626,"body":"So glazing is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1081.261,"endTime":1083.626,"body":"interesting as hell."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1084.316,"endTime":1086.146,"body":"just hard it's really tough."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1086.151,"endTime":1089.746,"body":"But I imagine for e r c,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1086.151,"endTime":1089.746,"body":"you're, uh, not, uh, like"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1090.186,"endTime":1090.946,"body":"concrete as a safe path."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1091.231,"endTime":1092.111,"body":"Yeah, it depends."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1092.111,"endTime":1094.431,"body":"So indeed that was"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1092.111,"endTime":1094.431,"body":"then the motivation."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1094.751,"endTime":1097.871,"body":"Although I do admit that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1094.751,"endTime":1097.871,"body":"within the set of reviewers,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1097.871,"endTime":1101.631,"body":"cause there are many reviewers"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1097.871,"endTime":1101.631,"body":"for the E R C that there is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1101.681,"endTime":1105.311,"body":"at least one reviewer who"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1101.681,"endTime":1105.311,"body":"said, well maybe you should"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1105.311,"endTime":1106.671,"body":"have taken concrete, but."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1107.621,"endTime":1107.711,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1107.891,"endTime":1108.581,"body":"And you replied."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1108.581,"endTime":1109.151,"body":"Yeah, that's what I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1109.151,"endTime":1109.631,"body":"told them."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1109.631,"endTime":1110.031,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1110.511,"endTime":1112.221,"body":"No,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1110.511,"endTime":1112.221,"body":"no, there is no reply,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1112.221,"endTime":1113.381,"body":"which you actually have."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1113.381,"endTime":1114.581,"body":"You don't have this opportunity."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1114.951,"endTime":1118.581,"body":"Uh, you, I only got the comments"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1114.951,"endTime":1118.581,"body":"after everything was closed, so"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1118.581,"endTime":1120.901,"body":"after even getting the award."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1121.616,"endTime":1121.916,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1122.036,"endTime":1127.006,"body":"so talk about, um, the pathways"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1122.036,"endTime":1127.006,"body":"that, that you've, drawn"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1127.006,"endTime":1129.562,"body":"for your, for your project,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1127.006,"endTime":1129.562,"body":"with the structure of work"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1129.562,"endTime":1131.112,"body":"packages, how you want to."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1131.797,"endTime":1135.547,"body":"End up in this new paradigm"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1131.797,"endTime":1135.547,"body":"for a fire's design acceptance"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1135.547,"endTime":1136.657,"body":"in the 21st century."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1137.157,"endTime":1139.344,"body":"and you start with, with"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1137.157,"endTime":1139.344,"body":"work package that, that's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1139.344,"endTime":1142.464,"body":"related to, to the information"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1139.344,"endTime":1142.464,"body":"value of fire tests."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1142.794,"endTime":1146.621,"body":"So let's go back to the value"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1142.794,"endTime":1146.621,"body":"of information theory and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1146.771,"endTime":1149.951,"body":"what, what do you really mean"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1146.771,"endTime":1149.951,"body":"by, by value of information?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1150.161,"endTime":1153.884,"body":"How, how do you when an"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1150.161,"endTime":1153.884,"body":"information is valuable"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1153.884,"endTime":1155.081,"body":"and, what, what is."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1157.641,"endTime":1159.611,"body":"Okay,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1157.641,"endTime":1159.611,"body":"so I'll, I'll try a sh"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1159.611,"endTime":1161.211,"body":"uh, shorter answer first."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1161.211,"endTime":1163.571,"body":"We can go into more"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1161.211,"endTime":1163.571,"body":"depth necessary."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1164.121,"endTime":1164.611,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1165.021,"endTime":1168.371,"body":"Uh, that's one also, but, and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1165.021,"endTime":1168.371,"body":"I'm already expanding now."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1168.421,"endTime":1171.031,"body":"Uh, one of the things I've"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1168.421,"endTime":1171.031,"body":"learned, or I'm trying to learn"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1171.031,"endTime":1174.251,"body":"following the e c is, which I"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1171.031,"endTime":1174.251,"body":"should, answer more, concisely"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1175.544,"endTime":1177.134,"body":"."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1175.544,"endTime":1177.134,"body":"uh, so value of information."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1177.794,"endTime":1179.734,"body":"the point being when you do a."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1180.362,"endTime":1182.562,"body":"and in our field a fire test."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1182.982,"endTime":1186.226,"body":"You would want to know"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1182.982,"endTime":1186.226,"body":"beforehand, which test"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1186.331,"endTime":1187.556,"body":"gives you the most value?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1187.976,"endTime":1190.586,"body":"Are you going to do as"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1187.976,"endTime":1190.586,"body":"now with an example,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1191.016,"endTime":1193.289,"body":"a 60 minute fire test?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1193.766,"endTime":1194.326,"body":"standard fire?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1194.426,"endTime":1196.886,"body":"Are you going to do a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1194.426,"endTime":1196.886,"body":"fire with a cooling face?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1197.156,"endTime":1198.526,"body":"What fire do you want?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1198.874,"endTime":1201.866,"body":"Because yeah, you are not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1198.874,"endTime":1201.866,"body":"going to have infinite"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1201.866,"endTime":1202.826,"body":"number of fire tests."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1202.826,"endTime":1206.226,"body":"You can do test costs, money"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1202.826,"endTime":1206.226,"body":"tests, have environmental"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1206.226,"endTime":1207.346,"body":"impact and so on."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1207.546,"endTime":1209.492,"body":"Which one should choose?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1209.673,"endTime":1212.359,"body":"And I would argue that for"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1209.673,"endTime":1212.359,"body":"the moment, at least in our"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1212.359,"endTime":1213.359,"body":"field, this is not obvious."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1213.58,"endTime":1217.293,"body":"So within value of information,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1213.58,"endTime":1217.293,"body":"we will actually quantify."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1217.642,"endTime":1217.762,"body":"Hmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1217.937,"endTime":1220.074,"body":"and have an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1217.937,"endTime":1220.074,"body":"an answer to that question"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1220.114,"endTime":1221.834,"body":"about which test you should do."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1221.968,"endTime":1225.069,"body":"And here"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1221.968,"endTime":1225.069,"body":"you use, examples of, risk"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1225.069,"endTime":1229.249,"body":"metrics that are used related,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1225.069,"endTime":1229.249,"body":"into the value of information"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1229.249,"endTime":1230.919,"body":"like FN, curves, all arp."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1231.511,"endTime":1235.491,"body":"How, how does display, is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1231.511,"endTime":1235.491,"body":"this like, done in the further"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1235.491,"endTime":1237.861,"body":"steps or already like the test?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1237.866,"endTime":1240.741,"body":"The purpose of test is only"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1237.866,"endTime":1240.741,"body":"to give the, the information"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1240.741,"endTime":1242.361,"body":"and inform the fir the rest of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1242.561,"endTime":1242.881,"body":"the process."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1243.343,"endTime":1244.848,"body":"that's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1243.343,"endTime":1244.848,"body":"next level, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1244.978,"endTime":1248.728,"body":"So, I'll, I'll park"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1244.978,"endTime":1248.728,"body":"the, the risk parts for"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1248.728,"endTime":1249.768,"body":"a second, let's say."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1249.768,"endTime":1253.788,"body":"Okay, so if, I hope this is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1249.768,"endTime":1253.788,"body":"make sense to, to the listener."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1253.798,"endTime":1256.531,"body":"So if you say, okay, I want"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1253.798,"endTime":1256.531,"body":"to, know which test, is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1256.531,"endTime":1257.731,"body":"the most valuable to do."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1257.731,"endTime":1258.691,"body":"Okay, great."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1258.691,"endTime":1261.331,"body":"Then of course you need"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1258.691,"endTime":1261.331,"body":"to have a, a metric."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1261.563,"endTime":1264.046,"body":"Which you're trying"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1261.563,"endTime":1264.046,"body":"to, let's say optimize."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1264.506,"endTime":1268.213,"body":"And if you are a manufacturer"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1264.506,"endTime":1268.213,"body":"within the current paradigm"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1268.483,"endTime":1271.726,"body":"with standard fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1268.483,"endTime":1271.726,"body":"testing, and I'm just using"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1272.446,"endTime":1275.606,"body":"structural, uh, examples"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1272.446,"endTime":1275.606,"body":"here, but I mean, can change"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1275.606,"endTime":1279.218,"body":"to anything else, then this"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1275.606,"endTime":1279.218,"body":"could be, an evaluation of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1279.218,"endTime":1282.098,"body":"the uncertainty on your, uh,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1279.218,"endTime":1282.098,"body":"just justify resistance time."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1282.398,"endTime":1282.958,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1282.958,"endTime":1283.678,"body":"And you want."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1283.929,"endTime":1287.179,"body":"Make sure that you are on"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1283.929,"endTime":1287.179,"body":"the safe sides, that you have"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1287.289,"endTime":1290.299,"body":"your fire resistance time is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1287.289,"endTime":1290.299,"body":"definitely more than 60 minutes."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1290.479,"endTime":1293.539,"body":"The average is 65 standard"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1290.479,"endTime":1293.539,"body":"deviation and so on."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1293.539,"endTime":1296.214,"body":"So you could target"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1293.539,"endTime":1296.214,"body":"something like that within"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1296.214,"endTime":1297.454,"body":"the current paradigm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1297.966,"endTime":1299.192,"body":"within product development."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1299.192,"endTime":1301.752,"body":"So if you're not even testing"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1299.192,"endTime":1301.752,"body":"for compliance within product"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1301.752,"endTime":1305.872,"body":"development, you could just"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1301.752,"endTime":1305.872,"body":"test your specimen to reduce"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1305.872,"endTime":1307.152,"body":"the uncertainty on its perform."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1307.857,"endTime":1310.457,"body":"because you're in a, you're"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1307.857,"endTime":1310.457,"body":"a developer and you just"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1310.457,"endTime":1312.978,"body":"want to know if, how the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1310.457,"endTime":1312.978,"body":"product is actually behaving."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1313.638,"endTime":1318.962,"body":"Now, next level is, okay,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1313.638,"endTime":1318.962,"body":"we are now within a approach"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1319.252,"endTime":1322.202,"body":"of evaluating the fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1319.252,"endTime":1322.202,"body":"performance of buildings,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1322.202,"endTime":1323.842,"body":"really quantifying that."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1324.196,"endTime":1328.323,"body":"That means that we are"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1324.196,"endTime":1328.323,"body":"evaluating, for example, the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1328.323,"endTime":1329.963,"body":"risk, high risk of a building."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1330.61,"endTime":1334.145,"body":"Because of the uncertainties"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1330.61,"endTime":1334.145,"body":"we have, our building does not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1334.425,"endTime":1336.745,"body":"first comply with our target."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1336.791,"endTime":1337.31,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1337.345,"endTime":1340.243,"body":"Which test"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1337.345,"endTime":1340.243,"body":"should we do so that we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1340.483,"endTime":1344.643,"body":"think that we will switch"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1340.483,"endTime":1344.643,"body":"or move our risk assessment"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1345.053,"endTime":1346.603,"body":"so that now it'll comply."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1347.683,"endTime":1349.113,"body":"So you have an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1347.683,"endTime":1349.113,"body":"existing building."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1349.403,"endTime":1352.833,"body":"It has maybe an existing"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1349.403,"endTime":1352.833,"body":"masonry wall or an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1353.113,"endTime":1353.913,"body":"existing timber column."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1354.443,"endTime":1358.271,"body":"Um, it does not comply"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1354.443,"endTime":1358.271,"body":"with, our risk target."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1358.551,"endTime":1361.745,"body":"Which tests are we now going"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1358.551,"endTime":1361.745,"body":"to do, which gives us a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1361.745,"endTime":1365.174,"body":"better assessment of the risk"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1361.745,"endTime":1365.174,"body":"and hopefully if the test"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1365.174,"endTime":1367.134,"body":"outcome is positive, but okay."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1367.134,"endTime":1369.374,"body":"Shows that uh, our"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1367.134,"endTime":1369.374,"body":"building is safe."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1369.709,"endTime":1373.204,"body":"And, and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1369.709,"endTime":1373.204,"body":"that is, through understanding,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1373.204,"endTime":1376.663,"body":"performance of a completely"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1373.204,"endTime":1376.663,"body":"new untested, previously"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1377.403,"endTime":1379.813,"body":"material composition setting"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1377.403,"endTime":1379.813,"body":"of materials, building"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1379.813,"endTime":1383.563,"body":"element, or through reducing us"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1379.813,"endTime":1383.563,"body":"uncertainties of something that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1383.563,"endTime":1384.843,"body":"we already knew maybe right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1385.27,"endTime":1385.926,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1386.136,"endTime":1387.696,"body":"So here's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1386.136,"endTime":1387.696,"body":"the feedback loop that, that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1387.756,"endTime":1390.696,"body":"you first want to understand"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1387.756,"endTime":1390.696,"body":"the full building performance"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1390.696,"endTime":1394.956,"body":"as proposed and find out, okay,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1390.696,"endTime":1394.956,"body":"what I'm missing here to, to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1394.956,"endTime":1398.676,"body":"get a better information of this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1394.956,"endTime":1398.676,"body":"risk or get the risk profile"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1398.676,"endTime":1402.156,"body":"that is acceptable because"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1398.676,"endTime":1402.156,"body":"I received unacceptable risk"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1402.156,"endTime":1403.035,"body":"profile, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1403.178,"endTime":1403.649,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1403.801,"endTime":1405.351,"body":"So there, there is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1403.801,"endTime":1405.351,"body":"always uncertainty."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1405.481,"endTime":1409.116,"body":"So uh, you have a small"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1405.481,"endTime":1409.116,"body":"building, low rise,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1409.116,"endTime":1410.996,"body":"nothing special, not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1409.116,"endTime":1410.996,"body":"nothing fancy on it."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1411.176,"endTime":1414.076,"body":"And then there's quite some"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1411.176,"endTime":1414.076,"body":"uncertainty on the fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1414.076,"endTime":1415.116,"body":"resistance of some slap."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1415.787,"endTime":1419.807,"body":"But you, within the risk"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1415.787,"endTime":1419.807,"body":"evaluation, it is quite"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1420.361,"endTime":1420.561,"body":"possible"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1420.871,"endTime":1421.361,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1421.421,"endTime":1424.081,"body":"you don't need more"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1421.421,"endTime":1424.081,"body":"information on the fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1424.081,"endTime":1425.068,"body":"performance of the slap."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1425.164,"endTime":1428.054,"body":"That within the mean, there is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1425.164,"endTime":1428.054,"body":"uncertainty on it, it's taking"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1428.054,"endTime":1431.104,"body":"into account, but actually"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1428.054,"endTime":1431.104,"body":"having a better assessment"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1431.114,"endTime":1434.544,"body":"of the SLAP fire performance"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1431.114,"endTime":1434.544,"body":"doesn't teach you anything"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1434.664,"endTime":1435.784,"body":"regarding the building."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1436.344,"endTime":1437.184,"body":"While maybe."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1437.39,"endTime":1440.621,"body":"Again, structurally, but"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1437.39,"endTime":1440.621,"body":"maybe there is a column which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1440.861,"endTime":1442.981,"body":"actually this thing is the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1440.861,"endTime":1442.981,"body":"thing you should be testing,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1443.131,"endTime":1443.741,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1443.901,"endTime":1446.461,"body":"So, and this"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1443.901,"endTime":1446.461,"body":"is, I would say, not taken"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1446.461,"endTime":1449.181,"body":"into account really in the,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1446.461,"endTime":1449.181,"body":"in the current approach and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1449.181,"endTime":1450.821,"body":"within the risk-based approach."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1450.821,"endTime":1451.661,"body":"You could do that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1451.851,"endTime":1452.651,"body":"Fantastic."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1452.944,"endTime":1456.064,"body":"I always thought that, that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1452.944,"endTime":1456.064,"body":"there's a space for performance"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1456.064,"endTime":1458.284,"body":"to base engineering in fire lab."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1458.524,"endTime":1462.953,"body":"That, that it could, give,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1458.524,"endTime":1462.953,"body":"than just index and, you are"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1463.072,"endTime":1466.129,"body":"actually showing, a realistic"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1463.072,"endTime":1466.129,"body":"pathway to, to achieve that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1466.129,"endTime":1469.039,"body":"That that's, I mean, everyone"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1466.129,"endTime":1469.039,"body":"could say, okay, we could test"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1469.039,"endTime":1472.399,"body":"the things in different way"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1469.039,"endTime":1472.399,"body":"and then receive other things."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1472.579,"endTime":1475.999,"body":"The, the framework is necessary"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1472.579,"endTime":1475.999,"body":"here to make it useful for"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1475.999,"endTime":1478.249,"body":"the industry because if"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1475.999,"endTime":1478.249,"body":"there's no framework, then"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1478.639,"endTime":1482.766,"body":"we, we cannot, now to enable"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1478.639,"endTime":1482.766,"body":"the adaptive fire testing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1482.766,"endTime":1487.026,"body":"You also have work package too,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1482.766,"endTime":1487.026,"body":"which is surrogate modeling."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1487.502,"endTime":1489.332,"body":"I guess this is what you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1487.502,"endTime":1489.332,"body":"said in the beginning of the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1489.332,"endTime":1491.726,"body":"interview, that we shouldn't,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1489.332,"endTime":1491.726,"body":"treat them sub barely."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1491.731,"endTime":1495.386,"body":"They, their simulations"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1491.731,"endTime":1495.386,"body":"and, and testing could be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1495.386,"endTime":1496.796,"body":"used all the way together."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1497.006,"endTime":1499.706,"body":"Is this circuit modeling also"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1497.006,"endTime":1499.706,"body":"a part of, of this thinking?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1500.176,"endTime":1500.596,"body":"yes."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1500.596,"endTime":1502.859,"body":"So model modeling"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1500.596,"endTime":1502.859,"body":"definitely is a part of it."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1503.219,"endTime":1506.789,"body":"the point there being"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1503.219,"endTime":1506.789,"body":"that if you have advanced"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1506.789,"endTime":1510.199,"body":"modeling, then just the, the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1506.789,"endTime":1510.199,"body":"computational expense quickly"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1510.199,"endTime":1511.439,"body":"becomes very big, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1511.679,"endTime":1514.917,"body":"And if you do the value of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1511.679,"endTime":1514.917,"body":"information approach, What you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1514.917,"endTime":1520.244,"body":"need to do is evaluate before"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1514.917,"endTime":1520.244,"body":"doing the test, what a specific"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1520.244,"endTime":1522.011,"body":"test results will teach you."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1522.731,"endTime":1526.001,"body":"So you need to actually update"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1522.731,"endTime":1526.001,"body":"your model in many different"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1526.001,"endTime":1529.681,"body":"ways to then find out which test"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1526.001,"endTime":1529.681,"body":"you actually want to perform."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1529.991,"endTime":1531.931,"body":"And you could think"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1529.991,"endTime":1531.931,"body":"of this as confirming,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1532.261,"endTime":1533.811,"body":"um, which model to choose."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1533.811,"endTime":1534.211,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1534.663,"endTime":1536.373,"body":"Almost"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1534.663,"endTime":1536.373,"body":"like a sensitivity study"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1536.373,"endTime":1537.393,"body":"before you do the test."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1537.393,"endTime":1538.053,"body":"Like which test"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1538.163,"endTime":1538.963,"body":"would matter the most?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1539.104,"endTime":1539.524,"body":"yes."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1539.524,"endTime":1541.244,"body":"This is, you could"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1539.524,"endTime":1541.244,"body":"put it that way."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1541.244,"endTime":1541.764,"body":"Definitely."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1542.064,"endTime":1546.024,"body":"but it means in that way that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1542.064,"endTime":1546.024,"body":"you would have to evaluate"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1546.024,"endTime":1547.891,"body":"your model lots of times."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1548.261,"endTime":1549.451,"body":"So it becomes computation."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1549.451,"endTime":1551.091,"body":"Very expensive,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1549.451,"endTime":1551.091,"body":"very, very quickly."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1551.405,"endTime":1555.501,"body":"So the obvious approach, would"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1551.405,"endTime":1555.501,"body":"be to use circle modeling"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1555.881,"endTime":1557.221,"body":"and called machine learning."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1557.607,"endTime":1558.087,"body":"either way."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1558.297,"endTime":1562.447,"body":"So a, a model which is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1558.297,"endTime":1562.447,"body":"computationally very efficient"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1562.587,"endTime":1567.007,"body":"and which approximates very"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1562.587,"endTime":1567.007,"body":"well, a more advanced model."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1567.445,"endTime":1568.424,"body":"Okay, that's great."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1568.884,"endTime":1573.641,"body":"Now I have subjectively some"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1568.884,"endTime":1573.641,"body":"concerns with black box."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1574.019,"endTime":1578.149,"body":"surrogate models, and just"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1574.019,"endTime":1578.149,"body":"as an example, When you ask"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1578.429,"endTime":1582.029,"body":"somebody to do a, to use a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1578.429,"endTime":1582.029,"body":"machine learning methods on"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1582.029,"endTime":1585.179,"body":"a fire engineering problem,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1582.029,"endTime":1585.179,"body":"then very often you will"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1585.179,"endTime":1588.579,"body":"find non-physical results,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1585.179,"endTime":1588.579,"body":"as in they've trained their"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1588.579,"endTime":1591.299,"body":"model and the the results are"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1588.579,"endTime":1591.299,"body":"excellent and whatever, whatever"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1591.299,"endTime":1592.402,"body":"you, where all the metrics."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1592.702,"endTime":1596.882,"body":"And then when you go into detail"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1592.702,"endTime":1596.882,"body":"and you, you push the model a"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1596.882,"endTime":1600.292,"body":"little bit, you find out that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1596.882,"endTime":1600.292,"body":"there are combinations where,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1600.432,"endTime":1603.012,"body":"for example, there is a fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1600.432,"endTime":1603.012,"body":"and everything cools down."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1603.344,"endTime":1606.609,"body":"Just because the surrogate"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1603.344,"endTime":1606.609,"body":"model has interpolated and,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1606.709,"endTime":1610.649,"body":"has been trained in a way that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1606.709,"endTime":1610.649,"body":"it gives non-physical results"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1611.159,"endTime":1615.366,"body":"work package two gray surrogate"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1611.159,"endTime":1615.366,"body":"modeling is the same approach."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1615.816,"endTime":1619.586,"body":"So it's, still these methods"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1615.816,"endTime":1619.586,"body":"of surrogate modeling machine"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1619.746,"endTime":1621.826,"body":"learning, but with physical co."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1622.471,"endTime":1625.221,"body":"So physical constraints in"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1622.471,"endTime":1625.221,"body":"both within the model itself,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1625.651,"endTime":1627.141,"body":"within the cost function."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1627.141,"endTime":1629.501,"body":"So when you do machine learning,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1627.141,"endTime":1629.501,"body":"you have a cost function, which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1629.501,"endTime":1630.821,"body":"you're trying to, to minimize."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1631.105,"endTime":1633.011,"body":"and also as putting"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1631.105,"endTime":1633.011,"body":"those constraints."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1633.011,"endTime":1634.251,"body":"So we're going to explore that."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1634.511,"endTime":1638.901,"body":"Can we develop again, proof"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1634.511,"endTime":1638.901,"body":"of concept, ways of making"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1638.991,"endTime":1642.621,"body":"machine learning tools, which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1638.991,"endTime":1642.621,"body":"actually comply with what we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1642.621,"endTime":1646.021,"body":"know about how fire behaves,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1642.621,"endTime":1646.021,"body":"how structures behave."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1647.061,"endTime":1649.031,"body":"Man, this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1647.061,"endTime":1649.031,"body":"is, uh, it's like a dream."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1649.361,"endTime":1649.991,"body":"It's so funny."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1649.991,"endTime":1653.085,"body":"You're gonna get to do"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1649.991,"endTime":1653.085,"body":"this now, another question."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1653.711,"endTime":1656.781,"body":"you were kind enough to send me"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1653.711,"endTime":1656.781,"body":"the short proposal for e r c."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1656.781,"endTime":1659.061,"body":"You're sending the short"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1656.781,"endTime":1659.061,"body":"one and the, the long one."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1659.511,"endTime":1662.481,"body":"So maybe this is covered"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1659.511,"endTime":1662.481,"body":"in, in the long version."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1662.855,"endTime":1665.515,"body":"but I couldn't find it"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1662.855,"endTime":1665.515,"body":"anywhere in the short one."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1665.695,"endTime":1668.125,"body":"I, however, however, I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1665.695,"endTime":1668.125,"body":"spotted in on a figure,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1668.575,"endTime":1672.036,"body":"so, on the pathway between"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1668.575,"endTime":1672.036,"body":"the designer and architect"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1672.096,"endTime":1673.506,"body":"towards the authorities."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1673.956,"endTime":1676.696,"body":"You said that they submit"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1673.956,"endTime":1676.696,"body":"um, digital blueprints"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1676.701,"endTime":1679.316,"body":"and, on the framework"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1676.701,"endTime":1679.316,"body":"it's, it's b i m model."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1679.526,"endTime":1682.703,"body":"So I wondered like, how"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1679.526,"endTime":1682.703,"body":"critical is b i m technology"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1682.708,"endTime":1685.866,"body":"for your project and, how do"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1682.708,"endTime":1685.866,"body":"you intend to work with that?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1686.262,"endTime":1688.322,"body":"The easy"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1686.262,"endTime":1688.322,"body":"answer is it's not included,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1688.67,"endTime":1689.48,"body":"It's not included."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1689.61,"endTime":1691.7,"body":"Oh, no, Okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1691.7,"endTime":1695.493,"body":"There's a space for the second E"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1691.7,"endTime":1695.493,"body":"R C grant, you take it as this."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1695.796,"endTime":1696.736,"body":"not even that."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1697.076,"endTime":1697.976,"body":"Not even that."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1698.386,"endTime":1698.731,"body":"So,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1698.826,"endTime":1702.309,"body":"this is a bit of a, a different"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1698.826,"endTime":1702.309,"body":"perspective maybe on, on the,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1702.612,"endTime":1704.532,"body":"proposal or on the, the E r C."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1704.862,"endTime":1706.316,"body":"So I, I was struggl."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1706.712,"endTime":1710.766,"body":"in the beginning to have a,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1706.712,"endTime":1710.766,"body":"let's say, a compelling story,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1710.956,"endTime":1714.985,"body":"then showing that this is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1710.956,"endTime":1714.985,"body":"research worth supporting."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1715.236,"endTime":1715.986,"body":"So I have,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1716.065,"endTime":1721.592,"body":"wrote down this, let's say,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1716.065,"endTime":1721.592,"body":"Vision where you have inin"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1721.592,"endTime":1725.032,"body":"instantaneous evaluation of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1721.592,"endTime":1725.032,"body":"the risk profile of buildings."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1725.039,"endTime":1727.019,"body":"and how would that be possible?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1727.019,"endTime":1730.219,"body":"Feasible in a right would be,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1727.019,"endTime":1730.219,"body":"for example, with, as far as I"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1730.219,"endTime":1734.672,"body":"understand, BIM models, being"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1730.219,"endTime":1734.672,"body":"evaluated by a surrogate model."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1735.072,"endTime":1735.632,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1736.186,"endTime":1738.182,"body":"So that's the storyline."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1738.655,"endTime":1739.265,"body":"Hmmhmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1739.342,"endTime":1741.599,"body":"I say, well,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1739.342,"endTime":1741.599,"body":"if we want this, we need to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1741.599,"endTime":1744.839,"body":"develop these kinds of tools"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1741.599,"endTime":1744.839,"body":"or proof of concept tools."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1745.659,"endTime":1748.376,"body":"And then those are,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1745.659,"endTime":1748.376,"body":"different work packages."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1748.796,"endTime":1752.116,"body":"so the actual, how are we"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1748.796,"endTime":1752.116,"body":"going to extract data from"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1752.116,"endTime":1755.556,"body":"the bim and which specific,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1752.116,"endTime":1755.556,"body":"Things do we need and so on."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1755.556,"endTime":1758.827,"body":"This is not part of this"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1755.556,"endTime":1758.827,"body":"proposal and actually, um,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1758.889,"endTime":1762.169,"body":"now jumping forward to some,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1758.889,"endTime":1762.169,"body":"maybe some other work package,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1762.849,"endTime":1766.289,"body":"actually, I do recognize that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1762.849,"endTime":1766.289,"body":"within the proposal in sense"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1766.289,"endTime":1770.676,"body":"that I highlight a lot that,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1766.289,"endTime":1770.676,"body":"there, if this will move"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1770.676,"endTime":1774.236,"body":"forward, there will be large"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1770.676,"endTime":1774.236,"body":"follow up investments needed"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1774.392,"endTime":1778.052,"body":"and which is why there's an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1774.392,"endTime":1778.052,"body":"entire work package really"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1778.052,"endTime":1779.486,"body":"targeting, if stake call."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1779.881,"endTime":1780.541,"body":"Very good."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1780.717,"endTime":1782.245,"body":"that's, that's a smart move."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1782.25,"endTime":1785.275,"body":"And, uh, I think there's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1782.25,"endTime":1785.275,"body":"a lot of, uh, movement in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1785.605,"endTime":1788.648,"body":"BI and fire, uh, mainly"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1785.605,"endTime":1788.648,"body":"in, um, Code compliance."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1788.998,"endTime":1792.535,"body":"this is a path for BIM for"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1788.998,"endTime":1792.535,"body":"sure where, prescriptive"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1792.535,"endTime":1795.525,"body":"code compliance could be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1792.535,"endTime":1795.525,"body":"assessed through the BIM"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1795.525,"endTime":1797.355,"body":"model almost automatically."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1798.075,"endTime":1800.945,"body":"I think that would be a very"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1798.075,"endTime":1800.945,"body":"compelling, uh, thing to see,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1801.335,"endTime":1805.431,"body":"such an assessment done in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1801.335,"endTime":1805.431,"body":"parallel with, estimation of the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1805.431,"endTime":1806.601,"body":"risk profile of the building."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1806.601,"endTime":1811.371,"body":"You know, the, the fundamental"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1806.601,"endTime":1811.371,"body":"question that that lies, uh, is."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1811.522,"endTime":1815.93,"body":"According to Low Safe and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1811.522,"endTime":1815.93,"body":"how safe it is, uh, which we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1815.93,"endTime":1819.77,"body":"don't have a good answer for"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1815.93,"endTime":1819.77,"body":"that in, in your framework."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1819.77,"endTime":1822.17,"body":"I, I don't think that, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1819.77,"endTime":1822.17,"body":"that's, that important is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1822.175,"endTime":1825.68,"body":"safe enough, uh, with pro"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1822.175,"endTime":1825.68,"body":"because you, like, you are not"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1825.68,"endTime":1827.24,"body":"interested in the prescriptive."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1827.245,"endTime":1830.44,"body":"You want to break this, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1827.245,"endTime":1830.44,"body":"You want to shift it completely"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1831.101,"endTime":1833.151,"body":"Well, I still"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1831.101,"endTime":1833.151,"body":"call it prescriptive, what"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1833.151,"endTime":1836.111,"body":"I call it, uh, let's say the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1833.151,"endTime":1836.111,"body":"21st century prescriptive."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1836.111,"endTime":1836.511,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1836.513,"endTime":1836.753,"body":"okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1836.753,"endTime":1836.993,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1837.001,"endTime":1837.351,"body":"So,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1837.513,"endTime":1839.883,"body":"you replace"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1837.513,"endTime":1839.883,"body":"just a set of rules with, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1839.913,"endTime":1841.683,"body":"risk profiles and inform the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1841.683,"endTime":1842.735,"body":"metrics and,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1842.735,"endTime":1843.303,"body":"surrogate"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1843.411,"endTime":1844.081,"body":"exactly."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1844.391,"endTime":1844.881,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1845.101,"endTime":1846.001,"body":"And then if,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1846.392,"endTime":1849.072,"body":"Somebody who hears this is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1846.392,"endTime":1849.072,"body":"things, well, this is definitely"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1849.072,"endTime":1852.112,"body":"not possible for every sit"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1849.072,"endTime":1852.112,"body":"single situation and so on."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1852.132,"endTime":1853.472,"body":"Yes, fully acknowledged."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1853.762,"endTime":1857.212,"body":"So within this called"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1853.762,"endTime":1857.212,"body":"vision again, 21st century"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1857.212,"endTime":1859.412,"body":"prescriptive risk evaluation."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1860.002,"endTime":1861.882,"body":"then you still have"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1860.002,"endTime":1861.882,"body":"your performance"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1861.882,"endTime":1863.122,"body":"based design approach."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1863.454,"endTime":1866.594,"body":"But now with better"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1863.454,"endTime":1866.594,"body":"data and better input."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1866.624,"endTime":1869.794,"body":"Also the adaptive fire testing"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1866.624,"endTime":1869.794,"body":"approach, where if something"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1869.794,"endTime":1873.474,"body":"is not working out all within"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1869.794,"endTime":1873.474,"body":"your performance based design"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1873.474,"endTime":1877.451,"body":"that you can know or at least"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1873.474,"endTime":1877.451,"body":"assess which test you should"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1877.451,"endTime":1878.531,"body":"do to get a better assessment."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1878.901,"endTime":1883.291,"body":"So definitely I am not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1878.901,"endTime":1883.291,"body":"saying that there is no space"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1883.291,"endTime":1885.051,"body":"there for fire engineers."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1885.051,"endTime":1887.291,"body":"On the contrary, I think within."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1888.017,"endTime":1892.146,"body":"Framework, I concept fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1888.017,"endTime":1892.146,"body":"engineering is much more"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1892.426,"endTime":1895.359,"body":"engineering than maybe"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1892.426,"endTime":1895.359,"body":"sometimes it is today."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1895.588,"endTime":1897.238,"body":"I had a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1895.588,"endTime":1897.238,"body":"discussion with Xinyan Huang"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1897.418,"endTime":1900.531,"body":"at some point, and, We were"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1897.418,"endTime":1900.531,"body":"talking about machine learning"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1900.531,"endTime":1903.995,"body":"in, in general, and, he,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1900.531,"endTime":1903.995,"body":"said something that really."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1904.496,"endTime":1907.006,"body":"Resonated with me that,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1904.496,"endTime":1907.006,"body":"you know, we can describe"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1907.006,"endTime":1909.803,"body":"nature with, an equation"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1907.006,"endTime":1909.803,"body":"or a set of equations."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1909.803,"endTime":1912.583,"body":"We can describe nature with,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1909.803,"endTime":1912.583,"body":"with a three-dimensional"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1912.613,"endTime":1913.993,"body":"CFD model or something."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1913.993,"endTime":1916.933,"body":"And, And, there's a neural"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1913.993,"endTime":1916.933,"body":"network that describes the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1916.933,"endTime":1919.486,"body":"the, the reality or, you know,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1916.933,"endTime":1919.486,"body":"some phenomenon in a way we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1919.486,"endTime":1920.476,"body":"don't completely understand."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1920.476,"endTime":1922.64,"body":"But it's a different"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1920.476,"endTime":1922.64,"body":"language of, describing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1922.64,"endTime":1923.754,"body":"If you can, build that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1924.268,"endTime":1924.838,"body":"It works."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1925.35,"endTime":1926.225,"body":"it's not the same thing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1926.225,"endTime":1928.895,"body":"And in here again, you can"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1926.225,"endTime":1928.895,"body":"describe your building with."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1929.018,"endTime":1932.468,"body":"you know, requirement that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1929.018,"endTime":1932.468,"body":"walls shall be R 60 and the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1932.468,"endTime":1936.638,"body":"windows shall be R 30 or EI30"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1932.468,"endTime":1936.638,"body":"30, and the doors shall be this."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1936.638,"endTime":1939.608,"body":"And you can have 40"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1936.638,"endTime":1939.608,"body":"meters of your path and,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1939.608,"endTime":1940.508,"body":"and stuff like that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1940.928,"endTime":1942.878,"body":"And you can describe the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1940.928,"endTime":1942.878,"body":"building with a completely"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1942.878,"endTime":1946.088,"body":"different, uh, language that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1942.878,"endTime":1946.088,"body":"you would like the risk profile"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1946.448,"endTime":1947.948,"body":"to look not worse than this."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1947.948,"endTime":1951.055,"body":"And, when assessed in,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1947.948,"endTime":1951.055,"body":"in this particular way."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1951.055,"endTime":1953.221,"body":"And, also giving a, a tool how."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1953.926,"endTime":1955.366,"body":"Adjusted risk profile."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1955.366,"endTime":1958.038,"body":"So if you want to adjust"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1955.366,"endTime":1958.038,"body":"this risk profile, you don't,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1958.038,"endTime":1960.876,"body":"change the fire resistance"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1958.038,"endTime":1960.876,"body":"of your wall from 60 to 90"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1960.876,"endTime":1963.276,"body":"minutes as you could do today."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1963.276,"endTime":1967.596,"body":"Like today, if I want to, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1963.276,"endTime":1967.596,"body":"I don't know, reduce the, the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1967.601,"endTime":1970.256,"body":"fire resistance of my walls, I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1967.601,"endTime":1970.256,"body":"have to put sprinklers in it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1970.256,"endTime":1972.956,"body":"And that's my cost"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1970.256,"endTime":1972.956,"body":"benefit analysis."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1972.956,"endTime":1974.966,"body":"The world cost this,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1972.956,"endTime":1974.966,"body":"the sprinklers cost."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1974.966,"endTime":1978.716,"body":"This I benefit by, by making"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1974.966,"endTime":1978.716,"body":"the building cheaper, not, not."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1979.551,"endTime":1982.408,"body":"Probably safer, but I, I don't"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1979.551,"endTime":1982.408,"body":"know that in, in reality, in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1982.408,"endTime":1985.291,"body":"your approach, if you succeed"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1982.408,"endTime":1985.291,"body":"with that, you, you get, a full"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1985.291,"endTime":1989.535,"body":"package of tools, to know the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1985.291,"endTime":1989.535,"body":"risk and then based on the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1989.535,"endTime":1991.275,"body":"on the risk That's, that's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":1991.275,"endTime":1991.785,"body":"beautiful."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1992.017,"endTime":1994.777,"body":"Maybe one"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1992.017,"endTime":1994.777,"body":"thing to, to highlight is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1994.777,"endTime":1997.417,"body":"that, well, I think that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1994.777,"endTime":1997.417,"body":"the, the paradigm, how we."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1997.474,"endTime":2000.429,"body":"Demonstrative building"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":1997.474,"endTime":2000.429,"body":"a safe that should move."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2000.979,"endTime":2004.872,"body":"I am not saying at any point,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2000.979,"endTime":2004.872,"body":"let's throw away all of our"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2005.312,"endTime":2008.853,"body":"existing products and, and the,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2005.312,"endTime":2008.853,"body":"the results we already have."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2009.006,"endTime":2012.032,"body":"because, so it's as if you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2009.006,"endTime":2012.032,"body":"gave an example earlier about"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2012.032,"endTime":2015.272,"body":"high rise structure and fire"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2012.032,"endTime":2015.272,"body":"resistance on, it's as if you,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2015.272,"endTime":2018.192,"body":"if you, you have this Okay."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2018.252,"endTime":2021.032,"body":"BIM model of this high"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2018.252,"endTime":2021.032,"body":"rise structure, the risk"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2021.032,"endTime":2022.432,"body":"profile is evaluated."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2023.276,"endTime":2025.131,"body":"It comes out very good."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2025.211,"endTime":2029.561,"body":"Maybe even you can reduce"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2025.211,"endTime":2029.561,"body":"the classification of your,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2029.731,"endTime":2033.069,"body":"of some structural elements"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2029.731,"endTime":2033.069,"body":"automatically or not, and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2033.191,"endTime":2035.761,"body":"find out that this does not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2033.191,"endTime":2035.761,"body":"influence your risk profile."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2036.776,"endTime":2040.016,"body":". Or on the contrary, if the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2036.776,"endTime":2040.016,"body":"risk is too high because there"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2040.016,"endTime":2042.896,"body":"is this low probability, high"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2040.016,"endTime":2042.896,"body":"consequence event, you might"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2042.896,"endTime":2047.576,"body":"find out that okay, but in using"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2042.896,"endTime":2047.576,"body":"our existing classifications,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2047.996,"endTime":2050.816,"body":"the assessment of the model is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2047.996,"endTime":2050.816,"body":"now that, okay, you have now"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2051.296,"endTime":2052.686,"body":"adequately reduced, this event."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2052.803,"endTime":2052.963,"body":"Hmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2053.096,"endTime":2055.909,"body":"So if a, if"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2053.096,"endTime":2055.909,"body":"it's too much of a revolution,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2056.086,"endTime":2059.076,"body":"as in throw everything away and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2056.086,"endTime":2059.076,"body":"we start from scratch, this is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2059.076,"endTime":2061.996,"body":"just not, not reasonable, as"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2059.076,"endTime":2061.996,"body":"in it's not going to happen."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2062.39,"endTime":2062.84,"body":"And."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2063.618,"endTime":2066.748,"body":"how do you feel like about"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2063.618,"endTime":2066.748,"body":"blind spots of this approach?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2066.748,"endTime":2071.181,"body":"Like, if you are measuring based"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2066.748,"endTime":2071.181,"body":"on, on a set of, assumptions,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2071.186,"endTime":2075.305,"body":"even, even if you try to do"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2071.186,"endTime":2075.305,"body":"it holistically, and, okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2075.305,"endTime":2077.795,"body":"The current paradigm is not"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2075.305,"endTime":2077.795,"body":"very innovation friendly as"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2077.795,"endTime":2080.975,"body":"well, but something might"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2077.795,"endTime":2080.975,"body":"escape the, the set of rules."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2080.975,"endTime":2083.915,"body":"So you, you hope this will"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2080.975,"endTime":2083.915,"body":"be continuously evolving?"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2083.975,"endTime":2087.288,"body":"Uh, we will be building these,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2083.975,"endTime":2087.288,"body":"measures to, to incorporate"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2087.293,"endTime":2090.731,"body":"new, new challenges because"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2087.293,"endTime":2090.731,"body":"if, if you base, the safety and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2090.731,"endTime":2093.748,"body":"the risk profile, you really"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2090.731,"endTime":2093.748,"body":"narrow down the safety margins."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2093.748,"endTime":2096.208,"body":"You know, in, in prescriptive"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2093.748,"endTime":2096.208,"body":"fire engineering, the safety"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2096.208,"endTime":2098.518,"body":"margins are, are enormous"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2096.208,"endTime":2098.518,"body":"in most of the things."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2098.908,"endTime":2102.085,"body":"So, There are chances that if"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2098.908,"endTime":2102.085,"body":"something like comes, beyond"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2102.085,"endTime":2106.555,"body":"the radar uh, safety mar"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2102.085,"endTime":2106.555,"body":"margins would cover that and,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2106.555,"endTime":2108.355,"body":"and we are still protected."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2108.355,"endTime":2111.385,"body":"Maybe that's the trick why the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2108.355,"endTime":2111.385,"body":"current paradigm worked for a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2111.385,"endTime":2114.805,"body":"hundred years because we, we"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2111.385,"endTime":2114.805,"body":"were not aware, uh, about the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2114.81,"endTime":2116.575,"body":"safety margins in your approach."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2116.946,"endTime":2117.726,"body":"By data mining."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2117.766,"endTime":2121.223,"body":"The, let's say true fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2117.766,"endTime":2121.223,"body":"safety of your building."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2121.606,"endTime":2124.156,"body":"you are very devoid of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2121.606,"endTime":2124.156,"body":"this safety margins."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2124.156,"endTime":2126.286,"body":"This, this one, the ones that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2124.156,"endTime":2126.286,"body":"we don't know about because"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2126.286,"endTime":2128.596,"body":"you want to understand the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2126.286,"endTime":2128.596,"body":"performance completely."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2128.596,"endTime":2133.366,"body":"So there's less, let's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2128.596,"endTime":2133.366,"body":"say, uh, for a mistake."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2133.386,"endTime":2134.806,"body":"How, how do you feel about that?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2135.345,"endTime":2137.549,"body":"That we need"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2135.345,"endTime":2137.549,"body":"to be, careful in what we do."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2137.549,"endTime":2140.739,"body":"And this might, this, it's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2137.549,"endTime":2140.739,"body":"a bit of a, a kinda liberal"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2140.739,"endTime":2144.759,"body":"statement maybe, but the less,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2140.739,"endTime":2144.759,"body":"I would almost say, government"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2144.759,"endTime":2145.839,"body":"intervention, the better."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2145.939,"endTime":2149.472,"body":"And, and what I, what I mean"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2145.939,"endTime":2149.472,"body":"with that if you prescri"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2149.68,"endTime":2150.04,"body":","},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2149.68,"endTime":2150.04,"body":"Wojciech Wegrzynski: that."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2150.642,"endTime":2153.329,"body":"if, if you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2150.642,"endTime":2153.329,"body":"prescribe specific target,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2153.589,"endTime":2155.849,"body":"You are a hundred percent,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2153.589,"endTime":2155.849,"body":"you're, you are right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2155.849,"endTime":2156.249,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2156.249,"endTime":2157.769,"body":"You prescribe a specific value."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2158.232,"endTime":2163.61,"body":"and yeah, then it, what is the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2158.232,"endTime":2163.61,"body":"cheapest way to just pass again?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2163.699,"endTime":2167.559,"body":"But what I hope and which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2163.699,"endTime":2167.559,"body":"we will is automatically"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2167.559,"endTime":2168.759,"body":"enabled if we."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2169.312,"endTime":2171.422,"body":"Do what we are trying to do."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2171.812,"endTime":2176.046,"body":"What I hope will be, uh, will"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2171.812,"endTime":2176.046,"body":"happen is that you do a la"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2176.196,"endTime":2179.812,"body":"evaluation and, or you can"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2176.196,"endTime":2179.812,"body":"use any other words, whether"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2179.812,"endTime":2182.412,"body":"you want, but you look at"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2179.812,"endTime":2182.412,"body":"the costs and benefits of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2182.442,"endTime":2183.972,"body":"fire investments, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2184.512,"endTime":2185.862,"body":"in, in the best case."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2186.627,"endTime":2187.067,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2187.067,"endTime":2190.027,"body":"And which I actually also"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2187.067,"endTime":2190.027,"body":"believe it actually fulfills"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2190.027,"endTime":2191.827,"body":"the promise of performance-based"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2190.027,"endTime":2191.827,"body":"design much more."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2191.867,"endTime":2192.427,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2192.427,"endTime":2195.067,"body":"So you will have, you could"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2192.427,"endTime":2195.067,"body":"have cheaper buildings because"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2195.067,"endTime":2198.287,"body":"you will remove things which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2195.067,"endTime":2198.287,"body":"are actually not helping, which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2198.287,"endTime":2200.927,"body":"have better performance because"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2198.287,"endTime":2200.927,"body":"you're going to add things which"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2201.207,"endTime":2202.767,"body":"actually do improve safety."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2203.257,"endTime":2205.287,"body":"So, and, and safety,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2203.257,"endTime":2205.287,"body":"both for people."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2205.457,"endTime":2207.647,"body":"It could be for the environment,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2205.457,"endTime":2207.647,"body":"it could be for property"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2207.647,"endTime":2209.007,"body":"protection, whatever you want."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2209.457,"endTime":2213.052,"body":"So,  if you set a target,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2209.457,"endTime":2213.052,"body":"okay, this is always tricky."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2213.052,"endTime":2214.612,"body":"Which, what should"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2213.052,"endTime":2214.612,"body":"the target be?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2215.336,"endTime":2219.016,"body":"actually, I like those"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2215.336,"endTime":2219.016,"body":"targets for thinking purposes."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2219.016,"endTime":2222.696,"body":"Cause it helps reasoning,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2219.016,"endTime":2222.696,"body":"but what you should do is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2222.696,"endTime":2225.176,"body":"always think about, okay,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2222.696,"endTime":2225.176,"body":"but in normal situations you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2225.176,"endTime":2227.089,"body":"always end up into alarm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2227.562,"endTime":2231.186,"body":"and you invest to the level,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2227.562,"endTime":2231.186,"body":"which is, the risk is as"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2231.186,"endTime":2232.106,"body":"low as reasonably practic."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2232.737,"endTime":2236.123,"body":"So, yeah, you, you should not"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2232.737,"endTime":2236.123,"body":"be close to that target anyway."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2236.161,"endTime":2236.923,"body":"Fantastic."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2237.395,"endTime":2238.575,"body":"I'm"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2237.395,"endTime":2238.575,"body":"also just being a bit"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2238.855,"endTime":2241.878,"body":"cautious because it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2238.855,"endTime":2241.878,"body":"one thing to, to put a vision"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2241.878,"endTime":2245.198,"body":"out there, which I can imagine"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2241.878,"endTime":2245.198,"body":"many people have, could have"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2245.198,"endTime":2248.278,"body":"similar visions and then say,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2245.198,"endTime":2248.278,"body":"okay, these are the things"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2248.278,"endTime":2249.118,"body":"which we need to develop."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2249.461,"endTime":2252.281,"body":"am I sure that we are going"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2249.461,"endTime":2252.281,"body":"to develop some nice things?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2252.541,"endTime":2252.961,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2252.961,"endTime":2255.001,"body":"There, I mean, there's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2252.961,"endTime":2255.001,"body":"risk mitigation the project"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2255.001,"endTime":2256.081,"body":"like in every project."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2256.131,"endTime":2257.881,"body":"So yeah, we are some things."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2258.516,"endTime":2259.036,"body":"Happen."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2259.596,"endTime":2262.186,"body":"do I know now where we're"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2259.596,"endTime":2262.186,"body":"going to end in five years?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2262.196,"endTime":2263.426,"body":"No, of course not."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2264.212,"endTime":2266.852,"body":"Now this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2264.212,"endTime":2266.852,"body":"is the, this is the ERC projects"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2266.852,"endTime":2271.712,"body":"that high risk, high gain, by"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2266.852,"endTime":2271.712,"body":"saying multiple people might"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2271.712,"endTime":2275.263,"body":"have Similar ideas of course,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2271.712,"endTime":2275.263,"body":"because it's evident that"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2275.263,"endTime":2278.443,"body":"our approach is not perfect."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2279.273,"endTime":2281.493,"body":"I guess Kunio Kawagoe"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2279.273,"endTime":2281.493,"body":"I had similar ideas."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2281.493,"endTime":2285.363,"body":"I, I guess a lot of people on"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2281.493,"endTime":2285.363,"body":"the road had similar ideas."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2285.363,"endTime":2290.634,"body":"There's a big difference between"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2285.363,"endTime":2290.634,"body":"having an idea, to having,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2290.978,"endTime":2296.348,"body":"Well thought out pathway, how"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2290.978,"endTime":2296.348,"body":"to go from idea to a solution,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2296.438,"endTime":2298.178,"body":"which is where you are now."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2298.178,"endTime":2302.148,"body":"And I hope in five years you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2298.178,"endTime":2302.148,"body":"are at the, at the solution."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2302.153,"endTime":2305.438,"body":"Demonstrate for one case study"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2302.153,"endTime":2305.438,"body":"at least place, and maybe,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2305.858,"endTime":2310.045,"body":"maybe somewhere where you are,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2305.858,"endTime":2310.045,"body":"um, where you have something"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2310.045,"endTime":2312.505,"body":"very general that that can just"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2310.045,"endTime":2312.505,"body":"work with the whole industry."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2312.685,"endTime":2314.245,"body":"And I think it's a,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2312.685,"endTime":2314.245,"body":"it's a very good shot."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2314.612,"endTime":2314.912,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2314.912,"endTime":2318.335,"body":"I guess, we've covered"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2314.912,"endTime":2318.335,"body":"project, quite well."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2318.575,"endTime":2322.115,"body":"I mean, it's, it's a little"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2318.575,"endTime":2322.115,"body":"chaotic because the projects in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2322.175,"endTime":2324.095,"body":"e r c, they are very not linear."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2324.459,"endTime":2327.128,"body":"to the listeners, it's not"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2324.459,"endTime":2327.128,"body":"that Ruben is proposing I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2327.128,"endTime":2329.828,"body":"will do this test, which will"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2327.128,"endTime":2329.828,"body":"give me this coefficient,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2330.098,"endTime":2333.098,"body":"which then I will use in this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2330.098,"endTime":2333.098,"body":"model and I'll receive it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2333.223,"endTime":2338.929,"body":"But yeah, I hope you guys got"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2333.223,"endTime":2338.929,"body":"a really good Where this is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2338.929,"endTime":2342.379,"body":"heading, or more importantly,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2338.929,"endTime":2342.379,"body":"why and how Now, I, I would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2342.379,"endTime":2345.589,"body":"love to ask you, because"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2342.379,"endTime":2345.589,"body":"it's an opportunity for the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2345.619,"endTime":2349.129,"body":"for the fire, for you as"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2345.619,"endTime":2349.129,"body":"a, as CRC grand recipient."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2349.134,"endTime":2352.745,"body":"This is obviously a, i, I guess"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2349.134,"endTime":2352.745,"body":"a career changing, moment."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2352.775,"endTime":2357.0,"body":"But you also need, need people"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2352.775,"endTime":2357.0,"body":"to work with, so, let, let's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2357.005,"endTime":2358.535,"body":"talk about pragmatic stuff."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2358.535,"endTime":2361.436,"body":"There's a lot of, future"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2358.535,"endTime":2361.436,"body":"potential postdocs, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2361.466,"endTime":2362.666,"body":"listening to the show."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2362.996,"endTime":2366.086,"body":"So, so let's talk about"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2362.996,"endTime":2366.086,"body":"the resources you're gonna"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2366.086,"endTime":2367.459,"body":"need to, to fulfill that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2368.075,"endTime":2370.265,"body":"how, how do you plan out"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2368.075,"endTime":2370.265,"body":"this part of the project"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2370.265,"endTime":2371.585,"body":"managing all, all of this."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2372.086,"endTime":2374.896,"body":"Well, I had"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2372.086,"endTime":2374.896,"body":"to, um, write down a proposal,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2375.087,"endTime":2377.157,"body":"as part of the RC application."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2377.827,"endTime":2381.237,"body":"It's currently foreseen"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2377.827,"endTime":2381.237,"body":"that there are five people"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2381.237,"endTime":2382.077,"body":"working on the project."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2382.637,"endTime":2384.483,"body":"Those are, three PhDs."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2385.378,"endTime":2390.988,"body":"Four years each, and then two"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2385.378,"endTime":2390.988,"body":"posts, three years each now."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2390.988,"endTime":2392.388,"body":"But there is flexibility there."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2392.718,"endTime":2396.543,"body":"So if in the end it turns"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2392.718,"endTime":2396.543,"body":"into three posts, two PhDs,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2396.543,"endTime":2399.703,"body":"I mean, there is nothing"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2396.543,"endTime":2399.703,"body":"stopping us from doing that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2400.106,"endTime":2400.226,"body":"Hmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2400.233,"endTime":2402.383,"body":"Uh, one thing,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2400.233,"endTime":2402.383,"body":"which I mean, if we are talking."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2403.198,"endTime":2404.978,"body":"Pragmatical realistic here."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2405.198,"endTime":2408.418,"body":"One thing which is quite"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2405.198,"endTime":2408.418,"body":"specific for, for Belgium maybe"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2408.418,"endTime":2411.578,"body":"and some other countries as"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2408.418,"endTime":2411.578,"body":"well obviously is we have, so"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2411.578,"endTime":2414.498,"body":"the u c is 1.5 million euros,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2411.578,"endTime":2414.498,"body":"so that's a lot of money."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2414.903,"endTime":2418.15,"body":"part of it goes into just"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2414.903,"endTime":2418.15,"body":"general overhead, but"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2418.15,"endTime":2420.07,"body":"then we have the rest of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2418.15,"endTime":2420.07,"body":"the money is basically"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2420.07,"endTime":2423.83,"body":"all of it is for people"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2420.07,"endTime":2423.83,"body":"because we, um, we already."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2424.52,"endTime":2427.16,"body":"test equipment and, and we'll"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2424.52,"endTime":2427.16,"body":"manage on, on other aspects."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2427.86,"endTime":2430.92,"body":"But in Belgium, it's, Belgium"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2427.86,"endTime":2430.92,"body":"is probably one of the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2430.92,"endTime":2433.96,"body":"best countries in the world"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2430.92,"endTime":2433.96,"body":"to do your PhD as in the,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2434.11,"endTime":2439.541,"body":"it's, the wages, are very"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2434.11,"endTime":2439.541,"body":"high, notably for, for PhDs."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2440.041,"endTime":2445.3,"body":"And, think this is why , we have"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2440.041,"endTime":2445.3,"body":"a place for, for five people"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2445.3,"endTime":2446.7,"body":"within the project and, and."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2448.052,"endTime":2448.652,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2449.462,"endTime":2452.762,"body":"If you did in Poland, you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2449.462,"endTime":2452.762,"body":"could afford like 10 sure."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2453.122,"endTime":2454.772,"body":"Uh, that's an opportunity."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2454.772,"endTime":2458.402,"body":"It can open and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2454.772,"endTime":2458.402,"body":"oversee, uh, department"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2458.402,"endTime":2459.422,"body":"of of the project if you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2459.51,"endTime":2460.82,"body":"So if the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2461.012,"endTime":2461.372,"body":"just kidding."},{"speaker":", Ruben van Coile","startTime":2462.593,"endTime":2464.023,"body":"as long"},{"speaker":", Ruben van Coile","startTime":2462.593,"endTime":2464.023,"body":"as we stay in Europe,"},{"speaker":", Ruben van Coile","startTime":2464.023,"endTime":2468.543,"body":"there are some things, uh,"},{"speaker":", Ruben van Coile","startTime":2464.023,"endTime":2468.543,"body":"no joking there, but um,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2468.775,"endTime":2469.555,"body":"No, we're not leaving."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2469.555,"endTime":2470.035,"body":"No worries."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2471.608,"endTime":2472.428,"body":"The good points."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2472.588,"endTime":2476.041,"body":"So with within the projects"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2472.588,"endTime":2476.041,"body":"place foreseen now is that"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2476.331,"endTime":2479.561,"body":"in, let's say September two"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2476.331,"endTime":2479.561,"body":"PhD students would start,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2479.561,"endTime":2482.961,"body":"but as I said, if, uh, if"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2479.561,"endTime":2482.961,"body":"that would be a postdoc and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2482.961,"endTime":2484.121,"body":"a PhD would be happy as well."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2484.351,"endTime":2488.849,"body":"It's of course crucial to have,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2484.351,"endTime":2488.849,"body":"good people for the job at hand."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2489.139,"endTime":2491.689,"body":"So, and actually this"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2489.139,"endTime":2491.689,"body":"is maybe very specific,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2491.689,"endTime":2493.929,"body":"but it's indeed it's an"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2491.689,"endTime":2493.929,"body":"opportunity for me as well."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2494.514,"endTime":2498.194,"body":"The research project"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2494.514,"endTime":2498.194,"body":"I'm seeing here, if I"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2498.194,"endTime":2499.554,"body":"have my timeline nicely."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2500.128,"endTime":2503.998,"body":"so the first PhD would"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2500.128,"endTime":2503.998,"body":"be working on this value"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2503.998,"endTime":2505.238,"body":"of information aspect,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2505.285,"endTime":2505.895,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2506.622,"endTime":2508.393,"body":"actually working towards"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2508.393,"endTime":2509.713,"body":"it throughout a PhD."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2510.193,"endTime":2511.306,"body":"making a model."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2511.878,"endTime":2515.615,"body":"Glazing, collecting data,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2511.878,"endTime":2515.615,"body":"so input, uncertainty,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2515.615,"endTime":2518.001,"body":"quantification input"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2515.615,"endTime":2518.001,"body":"there, actually doing the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2518.001,"endTime":2522.041,"body":"tests and then quantifying"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2518.001,"endTime":2522.041,"body":"upfront what the test"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2522.041,"endTime":2523.761,"body":"output is going to teach us."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2523.931,"endTime":2525.241,"body":"So this is the value"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2523.931,"endTime":2525.241,"body":"of information."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2525.241,"endTime":2528.361,"body":"So this a PhD, which is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2525.241,"endTime":2528.361,"body":"just doing that basically"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2528.641,"endTime":2530.161,"body":"bringing us to a first"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2530.471,"endTime":2532.921,"body":"evaluation value of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2530.471,"endTime":2532.921,"body":"information for a fire test."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2533.538,"endTime":2536.618,"body":"the second PhD is"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2533.538,"endTime":2536.618,"body":"on the gray model."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2537.016,"endTime":2539.761,"body":"But gray modeling with"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2537.016,"endTime":2539.761,"body":"a bit of, focus on risk"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2539.761,"endTime":2540.801,"body":"as well, I must say."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2540.988,"endTime":2541.268,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2541.521,"endTime":2543.521,"body":"this is, those"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2541.521,"endTime":2543.521,"body":"profiles actually very different"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2543.531,"endTime":2544.561,"body":"if you think about it, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2544.561,"endTime":2549.041,"body":"So the, the first PhD has some,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2544.561,"endTime":2549.041,"body":"would need to know something"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2549.041,"endTime":2552.751,"body":"about structures, or at least"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2549.041,"endTime":2552.751,"body":"be able to, to handle, let's"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2552.751,"endTime":2555.231,"body":"say, infinite element modeling"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2552.751,"endTime":2555.231,"body":"as well there, because you"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2555.231,"endTime":2557.911,"body":"need to do tests on a tructure."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2558.496,"endTime":2561.1,"body":"Element glazing and"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2558.496,"endTime":2561.1,"body":"have the modeling there"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2561.49,"endTime":2563.079,"body":"with uncertainty,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2561.49,"endTime":2563.079,"body":"quantification,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2563.246,"endTime":2566.796,"body":"second profile, thinking much"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2563.246,"endTime":2566.796,"body":"more about fundamentals of"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2566.796,"endTime":2569.636,"body":"risk, what are the constraints"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2566.796,"endTime":2569.636,"body":"and if we do physical modeling,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2569.656,"endTime":2572.116,"body":"how are we going to implement"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2569.656,"endTime":2572.116,"body":"those constraints in our"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2572.116,"endTime":2572.996,"body":"machine learning approach?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2573.126,"endTime":2574.116,"body":"So very different."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2574.57,"endTime":2575.41,"body":"those two."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2576.03,"endTime":2580.49,"body":"The nice thing of the project,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2576.03,"endTime":2580.49,"body":"is that the researchers, both"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2580.49,"endTime":2583.659,"body":"the PhDs and the postdoc,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2580.49,"endTime":2583.659,"body":"they're actually very nicely."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2583.659,"endTime":2586.466,"body":"integrated in the sense"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2583.659,"endTime":2586.466,"body":"that, I'm in a way quite"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2586.466,"endTime":2588.36,"body":"proud of, of that is as an."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2588.975,"endTime":2592.945,"body":"One PhD builds up something,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2588.975,"endTime":2592.945,"body":"a post-OC comes in, they"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2592.945,"endTime":2596.265,"body":"work together to, on one hand"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2592.945,"endTime":2596.265,"body":"side, finish the PhD and the"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2596.265,"endTime":2599.785,"body":"post takes over and moves it"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2596.265,"endTime":2599.785,"body":"forward on the next stage."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2599.995,"endTime":2600.785,"body":"So there's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2600.922,"endTime":2601.192,"body":"uh,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2601.205,"endTime":2601.625,"body":"yes,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2601.702,"endTime":2601.942,"body":"of,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2601.942,"endTime":2602.932,"body":"of knowledge"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2602.992,"endTime":2603.365,"body":"goods."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2603.435,"endTime":2605.538,"body":"at least"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2603.435,"endTime":2605.538,"body":"that's the what is intended."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2605.828,"endTime":2607.378,"body":"Of course that can, there"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2607.658,"endTime":2610.698,"body":"will be for sure some"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2607.658,"endTime":2610.698,"body":"practical issues."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2611.148,"endTime":2612.738,"body":"Um, people who"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2611.148,"endTime":2612.738,"body":"start a bit later."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2613.23,"endTime":2614.35,"body":"Things happen, right?"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2614.76,"endTime":2617.91,"body":"So it'll not be exactly"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2614.76,"endTime":2617.91,"body":"as I said it would be"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2618.169,"endTime":2619.519,"body":"Life"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2618.169,"endTime":2619.519,"body":"always comes in the way, but"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2619.519,"endTime":2622.922,"body":"it's, there's a reason why this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2619.519,"endTime":2622.922,"body":"is a five, uh, grant, not a"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2622.922,"endTime":2624.602,"body":"two or three funding scheme."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2625.022,"endTime":2628.479,"body":"So it, it's meant to accommodate"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2625.022,"endTime":2628.479,"body":"really grant ideas and"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2628.479,"endTime":2629.949,"body":"support you with funding too."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2630.659,"endTime":2632.499,"body":"to help you achieve"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2630.659,"endTime":2632.499,"body":"these grand ideas."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2633.252,"endTime":2636.522,"body":"it, it looks like, uh, I"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2633.252,"endTime":2636.522,"body":"mean, not even day one."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2636.522,"endTime":2638.899,"body":"It's it's day minus, 180."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2639.229,"endTime":2642.169,"body":"But, it's already, it is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2639.229,"endTime":2642.169,"body":"already looking good at Ruben."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2642.189,"endTime":2645.215,"body":"I'm really happy that, this"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2642.189,"endTime":2645.215,"body":"happening and, you have"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2645.215,"endTime":2649.889,"body":"a really great chance to,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2645.215,"endTime":2649.889,"body":"to change, how we work."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2650.249,"endTime":2650.939,"body":"Hopefully, you'll"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2650.939,"endTime":2651.729,"body":"you'll achieve that."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2651.836,"endTime":2652.436,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2652.64,"endTime":2655.56,"body":"Yeah, it's, uh, a challenge,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2652.64,"endTime":2655.56,"body":"but I mean it in a positive way."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2655.59,"endTime":2659.12,"body":"It's, um, the project is what,"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2655.59,"endTime":2659.12,"body":"for me personally, what I wanted"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2659.12,"endTime":2662.986,"body":"to work And there's, I think"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2659.12,"endTime":2662.986,"body":"where I don't see, at least, I"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2662.986,"endTime":2667.196,"body":"don't see any other way to get"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2662.986,"endTime":2667.196,"body":"consistent funding for different"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2667.196,"endTime":2669.476,"body":"work packages, which are"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2667.196,"endTime":2669.476,"body":"actually nicely linked to each"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2669.476,"endTime":2671.076,"body":"other, but still very distinct."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2671.474,"endTime":2671.954,"body":"absolutely."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2671.966,"endTime":2672.916,"body":"Um, so"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2673.296,"endTime":2674.716,"body":"now this is, this is it."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2675.176,"endTime":2676.936,"body":"Now I have to, um, make it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2678.224,"endTime":2680.204,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2678.224,"endTime":2680.204,"body":"that loud, the easy part."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2681.014,"endTime":2682.154,"body":"Congratulations, Ruben."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2682.184,"endTime":2684.504,"body":"Um, once again, and if"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2682.184,"endTime":2684.504,"body":"you, if you do something,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2684.509,"endTime":2686.184,"body":"tell me on on air."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2686.484,"endTime":2687.474,"body":"I don't want you to call me."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2687.474,"endTime":2690.294,"body":"I want you to come to the show"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2687.474,"endTime":2690.294,"body":"and tell us what happened and,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2690.354,"endTime":2693.894,"body":"uh, to anyone listening, uh,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2690.354,"endTime":2693.894,"body":"there's, as you heard, September"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2694.224,"endTime":2695.664,"body":"two nice opportunities open."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2695.664,"endTime":2696.204,"body":"Keep your."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2696.515,"endTime":2697.775,"body":"tracking this space."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2697.775,"endTime":2701.015,"body":"This is a good space to,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2697.775,"endTime":2701.015,"body":"to follow and, uh, really"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2701.015,"endTime":2705.935,"body":"nice to work, in a project"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2701.015,"endTime":2705.935,"body":"that may change, uh, fire"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2705.935,"endTime":2707.885,"body":"science and fire engineering."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2708.365,"endTime":2711.159,"body":"Ruben, thank you very much for,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2708.365,"endTime":2711.159,"body":"for coming to the show and I,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2711.159,"endTime":2712.815,"body":"I'm crossing fingers for, your"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2712.815,"endTime":2713.445,"body":"project"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2713.468,"endTime":2714.975,"body":"Thanks"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2713.468,"endTime":2714.975,"body":"for the opportunity to"},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2714.975,"endTime":2716.095,"body":"talk Wojciech it was great."},{"speaker":"Ruben van Coile","startTime":2716.095,"endTime":2716.455,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2717.307,"endTime":2717.907,"body":"and that's it."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2718.057,"endTime":2720.007,"body":"It's even hard to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2718.057,"endTime":2720.007,"body":"summarize the episode."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2720.007,"endTime":2720.847,"body":"It's, it's so good."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2720.847,"endTime":2723.697,"body":"The grant proposal is so"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2720.847,"endTime":2723.697,"body":"good, and he really is"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2723.697,"endTime":2725.017,"body":"changing the fire science."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2725.617,"endTime":2728.347,"body":"It's not the first time"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2725.617,"endTime":2728.347,"body":"someone has proposed that the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2728.347,"endTime":2729.607,"body":"whole paradigm must shift."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2729.607,"endTime":2733.234,"body":"It's not the first time someone"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2729.607,"endTime":2733.234,"body":"has, proposed innovative"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2733.234,"endTime":2736.774,"body":"ways of testing, but it,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2733.234,"endTime":2736.774,"body":"it is the first time where"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2736.774,"endTime":2739.084,"body":"someone has put it into one."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2739.514,"endTime":2744.704,"body":"Major, well laid out proposal"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2739.514,"endTime":2744.704,"body":"with steps on how to get"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2744.704,"endTime":2746.774,"body":"there, non-linear steps."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2746.774,"endTime":2749.744,"body":"I'm sorry if the parts of"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2746.774,"endTime":2749.744,"body":"the episode were confusing."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2749.744,"endTime":2752.264,"body":"It's really these grants"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2749.744,"endTime":2752.264,"body":"are really complicated"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2752.264,"endTime":2755.654,"body":"and you have to jump"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2752.264,"endTime":2755.654,"body":"from one part to another."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2755.659,"endTime":2758.924,"body":"I hope we've done a good"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2755.659,"endTime":2758.924,"body":"job in explaining the,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2758.924,"endTime":2760.664,"body":"the base concepts and."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2760.929,"endTime":2764.772,"body":"Yeah, I, I hope Ruben will"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2760.929,"endTime":2764.772,"body":"really, really achieve, uh, what"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2764.772,"endTime":2766.332,"body":"he planned in, in this grant."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2766.872,"endTime":2770.202,"body":"If you are someone at the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2766.872,"endTime":2770.202,"body":"early stages of their career"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2770.207,"endTime":2774.612,"body":"in fire science, uh, watch"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2770.207,"endTime":2774.612,"body":"out, uh, announcements for job"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2774.617,"endTime":2777.852,"body":"opportunities at the grant,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2774.617,"endTime":2777.852,"body":"it's an exciting opportunity"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2777.857,"endTime":2780.282,"body":"to work at the project"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2777.857,"endTime":2780.282,"body":"that may change the world."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2780.282,"endTime":2784.062,"body":"And as Ruben said, Belgium"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2780.282,"endTime":2784.062,"body":"sounds like a great place to, to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2784.062,"endTime":2785.962,"body":"work for decent amount of money."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2786.292,"endTime":2787.522,"body":"So definitely."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2788.162,"endTime":2789.992,"body":"Opportunity I would"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2788.162,"endTime":2789.992,"body":"be looking for."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2790.283,"endTime":2793.385,"body":"that would be it,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2790.283,"endTime":2793.385,"body":"uh, for this episode."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2793.385,"endTime":2795.995,"body":"Um, a final announcement,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2793.385,"endTime":2795.995,"body":"a final call."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2796.235,"endTime":2799.522,"body":"The survey of listener"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2796.235,"endTime":2799.522,"body":"experience is still up, in"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2799.527,"endTime":2803.122,"body":"the podcast Webpage will"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2799.527,"endTime":2803.122,"body":"be up for one more week."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2803.122,"endTime":2805.102,"body":"Uh, so if you would like"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2803.122,"endTime":2805.102,"body":"to share your feedback"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2805.107,"endTime":2806.532,"body":"with me, please do so."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2806.542,"endTime":2810.352,"body":"I, I've received amazing"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2806.542,"endTime":2810.352,"body":"feedback, great ideas."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2810.757,"endTime":2813.127,"body":"In five minutes, I'm"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2810.757,"endTime":2813.127,"body":"recording an episode that's"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2814.117,"endTime":2816.817,"body":"directly related to the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2814.117,"endTime":2816.817,"body":"request from the survey."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2817.207,"endTime":2819.724,"body":"This is how I like to"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2817.207,"endTime":2819.724,"body":"react, to, to your needs."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2819.724,"endTime":2822.394,"body":"So if there is something you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2819.724,"endTime":2822.394,"body":"would like to hear on the"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2822.394,"endTime":2825.454,"body":"podcast, if there is a way"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2822.394,"endTime":2825.454,"body":"how I can improve the podcast,"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2825.459,"endTime":2827.284,"body":"please tell me and I'll do that."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2827.974,"endTime":2829.864,"body":"And that's for today."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2829.864,"endTime":2832.084,"body":"I appreciate you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2829.864,"endTime":2832.084,"body":"being here with me."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2832.414,"endTime":2835.354,"body":"And yeah, see you"},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2832.414,"endTime":2835.354,"body":"here next Wednesday."},{"speaker":"Wojciech Wegrzynski","startTime":2835.484,"endTime":2836.094,"body":"Cheers."}]}