Hale Irwin - Part 8 (45 Senior Tour Wins and Reflections)

In the powerful conclusion to our eight-part conversation with World Golf Hall of Fame member Hale Irwin, we journey with one of golf’s greatest competitors as he reflects on the final chapter of his playing career and the enduring legacy he leaves behind.

Irwin shares memories of his seventh and final senior major victory at Valhalla, a week marked by rain delays, back pain, and a quiet moment of clarity found in the solitude of his car with a book in hand. He speaks candidly about rival and friend Jay Haas, the grace of Payne Stewart, and the brilliance—yet unfulfilled potential—of Tom Weiskopf. With honesty and humility, Hale opens up about what it truly means to win, to persevere, and to walk away on your own terms.

We also explore Irwin’s deep commitment to philanthropy, including the creation of the Hale Irwin wing at St. Louis Children’s Hospital and his recent honor as the 2025 U.S. Senior Open Honorary Chair at The Broadmoor. Hale discusses his second career in golf course design and the joy of building courses that bring people back for another round.

In our final three questions, Hale reveals the one “Mulligan” he might take—not on the course, but in life—and how he hopes to be remembered: not just as a champion golfer, but as a friend, a mentor, and a man who always tried to do what was right.

This final episode is a heartfelt and fitting end to an extraordinary life story, told in the voice of a man who lived it with integrity, grace, and grit. Hale Irwin’s reflections remind us that in golf—as in life—it's the relationships, not the trophies, that matter most.

Transcript

Mike Gonzalez 0:15

Let's talk about uh that final senior major then. This is number seven in 2004, Bruce. Yeah.

Bruce Devlin 0:24

Fourth time, fourth fourth time he wins a senior PGA championship at Valhalla and uh beat a fine player in Jay Huss.

Hale Irwin 0:34

Jay, you know, one of the nicest guys that'll ever grace the fairways. Uh well, we had uh well two things going on that week, really, for me. Uh my back had kind of given me some real issues, and so I was very uh cognizant of trying to take care of it, not doing things that uh maybe were not good for it. I had I had heard it uh several months earlier. And anyway, uh we had uh a lot of rain that week, and that little creek that runs through Valhalla floods instantly. Of course, the good part is it goes back down pretty quickly, too. But we had uh had several rain delays during the the week, and each time I thought I'm I'm not gonna hang out in the locker room because all you hear is a lot of complaining and storytelling that maybe you don't want to hear. Uh not that I I tried to keep away from the other guys, it's just that I I I didn't want to hear that. Uh maybe it's just the mindset I was in at the time, but I found it was much more comforting, a lot quieter, to go out to my car. I had a book, and I'd wait in the car and I'd read the book. I'd get my mind off of what was going on and the the the doldrums of rain and thunder and lightning and all that was happening didn't bother me. I didn't I didn't have to listen to it.

SPEAKER_04 1:54

Yeah.

Hale Irwin 1:55

Uh but it I think it it it proved to me again after all those years that sometimes you have to separate yourself away from the chaos to find that little peaceful moment, if you wish. And then you can go back out and jump into the chaos and manage it better.

SPEAKER_04 2:12

Yeah.

Hale Irwin 2:12

And with my back being what it was and the weather being what it was, and the this is and the that, you just all the conjecture. Why are we playing? Why are we not this? Why are you not? Hey, I don't need it's not my call, it's not your call. I think I'll go sit in my car and read the book. But it worked, and it's a really good golf course. Val Hall is a really good golf course. Uh another Pete Dye uh stretches your imagination of what you can and can't do.

Mike Gonzalez 2:39

Yeah, yeah.

Hale Irwin 2:40

But it was uh it was a very test, testful uh week for me, and and uh came through it with uh flying colors.

Mike Gonzalez 2:47

Yeah, you mentioned Jay Haas, uh, of course, nephew of Bob Golby, who we talked about before. Yes, uh so Jay was sort of my nemesis in high school. He might have been a year or two ahead of me, but I remember running into him in a sectional event, high school, you know, deal in Illinois, and uh I saw him shoot a smooth little 65, and that was the day I said, I'm not gonna do this for a living. Yeah.

Hale Irwin 3:11

Well, Jay, I think is uh he's he's one of my good friends. He and Jan are just the nicest people. I think the whole Haas family's really, really terrific. Yep. Um and Jay, I think, brings a uh a real grace and and gentleman quality to to golf. But I don't think he's ever achieved everything out of the game that he could have either. Yeah. Uh I think he's he's got a great rhythm, got he still hits the ball sufficient distance now to keep it out there. He's still very competitive. But again, it's what do you lose in the process? Yeah, do you lose that focus? You lose that maybe you make that 10-footer yesterday, today you miss it. Maybe you don't get it up and down today where you did yesterday. And it's just a shot or two here and there. You go from maybe shooting a 72 today to a 69 or 70 yesterday, and that that's a those are big strokes.

unknown 4:08

Yeah.

Hale Irwin 4:08

And it doesn't take much of that. And I think that's where Jay is right now. The last time I played with Jay and hit balls with him, I was, wow, I can still move it. He still does everything well. Yeah. But there's something in there, and maybe it's that time of his career he's thinking, you know, where do I where do I step off? Yeah, yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 4:27

I I I remember a stretch of a few years where it seemed like he was in the hunt every year at Augusta.

Hale Irwin 4:32

Yeah, yeah. He's uh a very capable player, and I think he he's got the killer instinct because he's won, but maybe he he doesn't have the the want to put the chokehold on. I I don't know. I uh all I know is I really appreciate the man for what he is, and he's just uh one of the great ambassadors for golf.

Mike Gonzalez 4:51

Yeah. So let's let's go now to win number 45 on the on the champions tour. And uh before we get into the details of that and sort of the significance of the win, uh let's ask you this. You walk off the 18th green, it was a comfortable win. Were you thinking like most professionals after a victory? I'm gonna do this again.

Hale Irwin 5:14

I think that's part of the knee-jerk reaction. Sure. You think, eh, I I can do this again. Uh I don't think uh anyone after a a victory, or even put, let's say, a a really good performance, is looking forward to stepping off stage. Uh most people, not most people, I say some people may choose to call the end being their their farewell tour. Uh maybe the last month they're gonna give it a wing, but they've already decided. So really their play generally is not gonna be commensurate with what they were playing like when they decided they're not going to do it anymore. Yeah. Uh at least for me. Yeah. So uh but no, I I didn't I didn't think it would be I would I didn't want to step out that way. I wanted to enjoy that moment and consider the next moment when it when it came. Yeah. Uh just take it one step at a time.

Mike Gonzalez 6:20

Was it extra special for you, uh, given your uh lifelong relationship with the state of Hawaii that your last win was there?

Hale Irwin 6:27

Oh, yeah, yeah. I think it uh yeah, I've had uh throughout my career I've had a great success in the state of Hawaii. And uh well, I won the first tournament there at Hualai. Uh it was called the MasterCard then. We played in some pretty rough conditions, and yeah, and I won that tournament. And then you know, some 10 years later I I win the tournament once again. And I suppose at the time I was given some thought to how long am I going to continue doing this. Um I I if I went upstairs right now and got out my suitcase, I wouldn't know how to pack because I've forgotten. Uh it's it's the little things that you want to forget, you don't want to have to remember I've got X shirts, X socks, X trousers. I don't want to do that anymore. And now I've completely forgotten what it takes to pack, but it's great. Yeah. I think your life changes in in many ways, but I think at the same time it's such a big part of your life that you can't ever separate yourself from that. Um, those of us that have played the game for all these years and then have stepped aside, whether we pushed aside or willingly stepped aside, uh, there's a part of it you'll always miss.

Mike Gonzalez 7:42

Yeah.

Hale Irwin 7:43

And I think for me, the thing I miss the most are the relationships that I've had with my fellow players and and and volunteers that you may not see from one year to the next. But they're the nicest people. And uh that's what I miss the most.

Mike Gonzalez 7:59

And Bruce, uh, I would think for you, uh, with you and I having done this for nearly four years ago, uh, it's been a real joy for you to reconnect with some of these guys, hasn't it?

Bruce Devlin 8:10

Yeah, the guys have been just so good about this whole thing, I think. Uh I'm not sure that Hale knows, but Mike was the one that came up with the idea. He said, you know, you've you've got a good relationship with all the guys you play golf with, and let's let's chronicle their lives. And uh it's it's been a joy. And, you know, people like yourself who have teetered up three times with us, I don't know how many episodes we'll end up with Hail Irwin, but uh we you know we receive a lot of great comments about the fact that that you guys go into your life and tell things that I don't think you've ever told anybody before.

Hale Irwin 8:49

Well, it's that's very, very likely the case, uh, simply because uh for the most part uh when you're you're drilling deep as you guys have done, and and and I must say you do have one hell of a job doing it uh in the right way, you're willing to give up. I'm I'm I'll speak for myself. I'm willing to give up to friends of mine, and Bruce and Mike, you're you are I'm willing to give up maybe things to you that I might not give up to somebody else. Right. Uh I'm willing to tell you some of my inner thoughts because you're my friend. Yeah. Now, somebody from John Q Public or Mr. Press Guy, he wants to know, well, you know, go research it. Yeah. See what you can find. Uh so in that respect, uh, that's where I think we share is that we're more than just associates and more than just friends. We have we're sort of blood brothers in the sense we've kind of all done this. And I'm not gonna blow smoke up Bruce's tailpipe, but those guys that came from down under came so bloody far to come over here and to succeed as they've done. And I think, could I have done that in reverse? Yes, you know. Could I have gone that far, left my home, left my friends, left my family, and succeeded as they have. Then that kind of tells you uh what's in their blood, what's in their psyche to make that work. So that's what I enjoy. So it's a two-way street.

Mike Gonzalez 10:23

Yeah. So you've you've sort of uh winding down your competitive career, you talked about a little bit what what like that that transition was like, but uh uh we'd re be remiss if we didn't mention some of the many accolades that uh you've enjoyed uh as a result of your fine playing career. Uh Bruce, we've talked about the World Golf Hall of Fame induction. That was way back in 1992. Heck, you were still playing, Hale. Yeah.

Hale Irwin 10:48

Well, I I was, and uh I appreciate it then. I appreciate it probably more now because it because you're not playing, you you have those few extra moments in time to reflect back, and reflection is not always bad. Uh I I I there are so many times I I want to say, boy, I if I could go back, I would do this differently. Well, you know, at the time you try your best. Yeah, yeah, you maybe you'd have different results, but yeah, how would you change? I I'm not sure that's the appropriate thing to ask yourself. You just say, well, I'll learn from that, and if it occurs next time, I'll I'll try something different.

Mike Gonzalez 11:30

Well, how many of your peers have enjoyed looking back on recognition as a World Golf Hall of Famer for 32 years? And think about your buddy who was just inducted and never knew Tom Weisskopf.

SPEAKER_04 11:46

Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 11:47

Yeah.

Hale Irwin 11:48

Well, uh, Tom was uh when I look back at all the players, and and Bruce, you'd I'd love for you to join in on this. When I look back and I see all the players that I was around uh from all parts of the world, uh who achieved uh some major success, I would have to say Tom probably didn't measure the entire success that he could have.

Bruce Devlin 12:17

I would absolutely agree with you.

Hale Irwin 12:20

Yeah, he he had uh a swing and uh a game that was unlike very many. Uh you can throw in Jack too.

Bruce Devlin 12:30

Yeah.

Hale Irwin 12:30

Beautiful when Tom was on, he was on. Yeah. But this up here, I think he was a very smart man, very intelligent man, but I think it also got in his way. Uh because I I remember once playing with Tom, and we were both pretty much in the hunt. And Tom could outdrive me by miles if he wanted to. Generally, it's just by many yards. But I asked him once, Tom, if you really want to hit it hard, what do you do? I mean, I couldn't do it because he had he was tall, he had that long swing. He said, I take my backswing slower and longer. And that really kind of clicked with me because now you see a lot of today's players, particularly the long drive guys, they just the antithesis of that. Yeah, they they swing faster to create that ground for. I don't understand it all. But uh, but where Tom, in my opinion, where I think he he he played into my game was when he got closer to the greens, he started playing, tried to play the little shots. You know, the little little eight irons were maybe for him as a nine-air or a wedge. He tried to play the little shots. Well, I could carve him up with that, because that was my game. Yeah, I couldn't hit it with him, but when he got in closer to the greens, that's where I think he didn't achieve everything he could have had he just played his game. Wish me to take that nine iron, take that beautiful swing he had and go ahead and hit it up there on the green.

Bruce Devlin 13:59

Yeah Bruce, you you buy into that at all? Oh, absolutely. I agree with you 100%. He was he was just one tremendous talent. Uh I I never liked to hit balls beside him, to be quite honest with you. If he was hitting balls there, I was going three or four stations down to the left or three or four to the right. Uh no, he he had a, like you said, a beautiful golf swing, lovely rhythm, and just a hell of a lot of talent.

Hale Irwin 14:33

But uh, I think he got in his own way at times. Um whether it be the lifestyle, the way he thought, I don't know, but uh he's the the one individual that I can definitely look at and say that man should have achieved more than he did. But that's easy to say, and maybe it's hard to do.

Mike Gonzalez 14:55

Yeah. Is it fair to say you're you're probably uh as proud of the 2019 Payne Stewart Award as anything you've ever received?

Hale Irwin 15:04

Oh, certainly. Um, I think any of those awards, particularly um, you know, I think Payne, rather just being the individual that he was, and he was um he was a very bright spot in in the a a different kind of a spotlight that he enjoyed. But I think it it spread. Uh when he first came out, he was just Payne Stewart. Uh he met Tracy, who's from his his wife, who's from Australia, one of the nicest ladies you ever want to meet. And I really, and I every time I see Tracy, I thank her for really not turning Payne around, but really developing Payne's personality. I think when he met Tracy, things clicked with him. He became more uh uh I don't want to say more extroverted, but I think he became more uh appealing to people. And then he came up with uh the plus fours and the knickers and the the dressing for the NFL colors, and he he had this shtick about him. Yeah, and I remember after he had won his second US Open, I was in a locker room shortly thereafter with Payne. It's just the two of us, oddly enough, we're just sitting there. And I said, Well, Payne, congratulations, how's it feel to be in the multi-open uh US Open championship circle? And he looked at me with that little quirky smile of his and he said, feels great. That's the last time I saw him. Yeah, and I'll always remember that because that's the way Payne was. We're in the Ryder Cup 1990, after the presentation Sunday night, and we're all walking back to the hotel. I'm walking shoulder to shoulder with Payne, and we're talking about how the day went and exciting and this and that. And the next thing out of the corner of my eye, I see him go straight up in the air, and I'm thinking, what in the world? And uh who was it? Okay, I've gone crazy now. One of the masters, he's from Wales.

Mike Gonzalez 17:13

Oh, uh Ian?

Hale Irwin 17:14

Ian. Who's he? He comes up behind him and get put his head between his legs and lift him right up on his shoulders, just as we're walking. Now, you talk about you know, here we've been in a very competitive environment, but that that curtain goes down and then back to the camaraderie that we once had. But that's that was that, and then the next one was at the locker room, and so I with that there's a great uh image in my mind of what Payne did for the game, how he brought that particular stick of his uh to the game. And yes, the the Pain Store Award is uh one of those kinds that you just thank you.

Mike Gonzalez 18:00

Bruce, you're probably anxious to compare notes with Hale on golf course architecture.

Bruce Devlin 18:05

Oh, I know I don't want to compare notes with him. I've uh I do know that uh that's that's become a passion of yours.

Hale Irwin 18:14

Uh well it it has as as it was with you, and then I think for the same reason that we've we've all seen so many golf courses through the years. And and in 1985, I started getting into design, and I felt like okay, if my playing career is supposed to wind down, like everybody tells me, uh perhaps this might be a good idea. Yeah, and then I thought, well, maybe get involved and and see if you like it. Well, of course you like it. It's it's something that uh you you can start manufacturing something on the ground that you have in your mind and you can go back to some of the great courses we've all have played. Not that you're gonna build the course or that whole specifically like it because you don't want to, but at the same time you have these ideas that that the ground will give you. And it was always my my feeling that I can best serve uh my client by building something to their goals. What are they trying to do? And I I needed to know in the very beginning is this a public course, a private course? Is it is it going to be a uh a resort course? You know, what do we have here? Are you gonna be a housing development? Yeah, what's it going to be so you can build to that goal? You can build something that people enjoy because ultimately we want people to enjoy the game. It's not gonna be a game for Bruce or for me, or a course for Bruce or for me, and it's highly unlikely they'll ever have a tournament of this. So, how do you design something where the people can go out there? And I've often said if they can go to the the 19th hole and have a great time because they want to get back to the first hole tomorrow. Yeah. So that's that that says something for your your design work. So that was always my my slogan let's let's make it fun for the people. And it's easy to make it hard. Bruce knows it's that's the easiest thing in the world, to build a hard golf course, yeah. But to build it to the people who are going to play it, so it's fun, that's the objective.

Bruce Devlin 20:20

And Hale, you've got a uh a little bit of your philanthropy deal is in the uh St. Louis uh children's hospital. You we have a wing there called the Hale Irwin Wing, correct?

Hale Irwin 20:35

Uh they do, yes.

Bruce Devlin 20:37

That's great.

Hale Irwin 20:38

We had uh when I lived in St. Louis, my wife Sally is from St. Louis and we lived there for well over 30 years. And long ago, uh I was asked by a friend of mine to attend a meeting with some other people or talking about what we can do philanthropically in the St. Louis community uh to help out a charity or two. What what what what's a goal? What what's an idea? So, well, first of all, there's hardly anyone that I know of that can say no to a child. And I think so we take that idea, if that fits to everybody's uh thinking, then what what do we have out there that will best benefit our community uh for children? Bingo, you come to a St. Louis Children's Hospital, for instance. There are any number of children's hospitals, but what serves the greater good? Um what serves the the market better? And so we we I helped them organize a a one day charitable event. Uh Bruce, did did you come? Did you ever come?

Bruce Devlin 21:51

I uh uh no, unfortunately.

Hale Irwin 21:53

I never asked you. Maybe it's because you couldn't speak English.

Bruce Devlin 21:55

That's right. That's what it was. You couldn't understand me.

Hale Irwin 22:01

But it was uh an idea I wanted to I wanted to pay more to the the people that I had come in because we had all done Monday outings and you didn't get paid much, but I wanted the players to come and not only make money but understand what we were doing. Yeah. And if we had to charge more to our patrons, well that okay. This is where the money's going. But the first couple of years, I think it went into there's no no bad program, but it went into unreimbursed care. Well, I felt like we need to identify something uh so the people know what they're getting.

SPEAKER_04 22:34

Yeah.

Hale Irwin 22:35

So we we got the the Nick used uh mobile and intensive care units for children, not just an ambulance with great big oxygen mass that might fit over the head of a child, but a little oxygen mass that fit over there, for instance, you know, stretchers that were for children, not big ones. So it was built for kids. Yeah. And uh we financed a couple of those and saw those rolling down the streets, and people can say very proudly, hey, I I gave to that. So then it was uh it went on to take care of anything the hospital might need in terms of machines or that would enhance, not a not a parking garage, which there's needs there, but it needed to be something that people knew what they were getting into. So anyway, that uh it came about and uh and it wasn't me. And I'm gonna say really it was not me. That wing should be named for all the people that donated and put their time and effort into that. Uh, I just happened to kind of be a part of it. But I was very proud of that community to have all of our names, and I would say I wish all of their names were on that wing because when you go up there and you see those kids, oh my goodness. You talk about getting not only cut to the quick, but the strength that these kids have and the determination they have. Oh, if ever I got down, I felt bad about myself, and oh, I missed that cut. I'd take a trip down to the hospital. That's right. Walk, walk in there, and I came out rejuvenated because these kids had that strength.

Mike Gonzalez 24:12

Yeah, well, good for you for doing that. And uh, I guess before we put a bow on this with our uh final three questions, uh we'd uh be remiss if we didn't mention something that happened just recently. You were just named the honorary chair of next year's U.S. Senior Open Championship to be contested in uh one of your home states.

Hale Irwin 24:35

Yes, uh at the Broadmoor in Colorado Springs. So yeah, very honored for that. Uh I don't know if it's a blessing or a curse, but it it will be fun. I I it'll be fun. Having uh lived in Boulder, Colorado since I was 14 years old and went to junior high, high school, and college there. And uh my son still lives in Denver area, my brother still lives up there. We have many friends that are still there. Um it's a special significance. The director of golf Russ Miller is one of the nicest gentlemen you'll ever meet, very, very capable of what he does. Uh Broadmore has been on my radar for years and years. A compatriot of Bruce and I, Dow Finster was Finsterwald was the pro there for many, many years. So there's a great history. Jack Nicholas has played there. Uh, all everybody once or one time or another has played in the old Broadmoor Invitational. Yeah, uh, it's a fantastic facility. The the Senior Open has been there twice before. Right there, once or once I know. Uh but anyway, um the players that have played there love it. Uh it's it's a little different. You're at altitude, uh, so the ball flies a little differently, but watching them adapt is is interesting, and and I think it uh it's always interesting to me back when I was in college. We'd have you know Bob Murphy and and and Marty Fleckman and the guys that were the amateur giants at the time will come out and they just couldn't figure out those greens. Those are the Rocky Mountains, and and you've got big slopes, and what appears to be flat could be a five percent slope.

Bruce Devlin 26:26

Yeah.

Hale Irwin 26:26

And okay, so now that it looks like it breaks right, but there's the mountain and it it goes, oh, it just drives them nuts. But you know, knowing that it was I I could read the greens, but it was fun watching them try to get it. But it's uh I'm very honored it it will be a lot of fun. Um and I'm happy to give back what I can to help promote that. And but I'm gonna be selfish to say what it's gonna give me is going to be a lot of fun.

unknown 26:51

Yeah, yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 26:53

Uh before we do the last three questions, then guys, uh just ask either of you is there anything else that you wanted to cover? Hale, anything you you want to mention before we wrap up?

Hale Irwin 27:03

Uh, I don't think so. I think uh you know, for me, as I said earlier, it's it's uh the relationships that I've taken or have been given throughout my career. Of all the things, you can have all these trophies, you can have all the plaques, you can have all that stuff. But don't take away my relationships. Yeah. That to me has meant more uh than anything else. Uh you know, the Jack Nicholas Awards, the Byron Nelsons, you know, they're all great people. Yeah. But just a little brush up against the Gene Saracens and the Byron Nelsons. I don't know if I told you about that, the meeting I had with not the meeting, but the I got to play the par three with those guys in a practice round at Augusta one year. I was coming off the 18th green, playing a practice round by myself. Went over to the first hole to the little par three. Yeah. There was Byron and and Gene. And we were all with Wilson at the time. And they asked me if I'd like to play along that that day could was that little nine-hole hour or hour and a half with them was so enjoyable to seeing how their hands went on the club. And in particular Jean's case, how you used those hands, you know, the old flippy uh shafts they used to have, how they timed their hands to hit that thing in there. Oh, it was just delightful. But those moments you can't take away. Uh and they they've meant so much to me as much as that trophy over there does. Yeah. Because in my mind, it's a real trophy.

Mike Gonzalez 28:38

So, as the senior member of our two-man team here, I always give Bruce the honor on the T for our first question.

Bruce Devlin 28:46

So, Hale, I'm gonna take you back fifty six years and ask you that if you knew then what you know now, what would you have done differently?

Hale Irwin 29:08

Well, I'll go back, Bruce, what I said earlier, is that we all think about going back and would you change anything? No. Because I think if you're true to yourself, you'll follow your heart and do what you think you do. And I'm gonna reverse would you have ever come from Australia knowing what you know now? You can't you can't answer. You can't answer because both are good. Yeah. You know, you uh you your life spins and pivots and goes in different directions, but uh ultimately would I change anything? No, because regardless of what I would have done differently, I would not have been able to touch the number of people that I've touched, they've touched me, the cultures that I've been able to enjoy, uh the sights that I've been able to see. Are you kidding me? Yeah, how do you how do you not want to do that again? Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 30:15

All right, question number two. We're gonna give you one career mulligan. One do over. Where do you take it?

Hale Irwin 30:25

Can I put that in reserve maybe for tomorrow? Let me think about that a bit. Well, oh, you know, if I could go back, maybe I I would reference that little that little putt, but it wasn't, but it was just negligence. It wasn't that I was angry, it wasn't it while it may have cost me, but that was on a Saturday. Who knows what Sunday would have ended up. Uh, I think that's the most obvious people say, oh, well, it's that putt. Well, you know, maybe it wasn't. Maybe it made me try harder. Maybe it I learned from that that you can. Oh, I'm sure you did, yeah. Yeah. Um, so I don't know if if I had a mulligan uh what it would be, because at least at this juncture in my life, I think I tried my best, at least on the golf course, I always tried to hit the best shot. I didn't slough off on purpose. I tried to take my personal relationships and do with them as best I could. Could I have said something differently? Well, maybe. Could I have done something different? Well, maybe. But I'm I don't know as I would have a life mulligan. Uh if it was to be, it might be to be uh maybe more helpful for children. I I'm feeling that now in my life to try to help kids out more, to help, particularly in today's world, to help set them straight with not only what they could do better, but what history has shown to be the case. You cannot fight history, and we just seem to want to put it aside. Uh to help kids uh particularly learn of themselves through the game of golf, accountability, honesty. You're the only one out there. You don't have a teammate covering you, you don't have a coach analyzing every frigging shot you hit. Uh I don't I don't understand it, but um that would probably be my mulligan, it would be to go back and maybe be more instrumental in trying to shape the lives positively for for kids.

Bruce Devlin 32:34

So, Hale, you have without knowing it just about answered my final question with what you just spoke about then. And that is how would you like Hale Irwin to be remembered?

Hale Irwin 32:57

Well, because I I can't climb into the mind of of you, Bruce, nor would I want to. Uh I I think uh maybe as a friend. And when I say friend, I define friend as somebody that's well with uh few questions asked, always have my back. Will help me in times of need, without question. Uh I would hope that that's they would feel comfortable in doing so. Because when you look at your life and you go back and say how many friends do I have? Well, you know, you start counting out. Well, if you have a handful, you're pretty fortunate. Yeah, absolutely if you have family members that you can turn to, you're pretty fortunate. So it would be probably try to develop uh those relationships with people that are significant and I'm and maybe even beyond significant in your life that uh brings something very, very positive to not only your life, but to those around and develop those and learn from them. That would be that'd probably be something I would I would do if more of if I had the mulligan or if I had the opportunity. But again, uh how much time do you have to do all the things you think you want to do? But again, like I say, at 79 years old, and I'm not I'm catching you, Bruce, not quite there yet, but I'm catching you. We can all look back and reflectively and say, was it good, was it bad, did I do my best? And uh what I try to tell kids, I say, you try your best. Each and every time you won't regret it. Yeah, regardless of how it comes out, you try what you think is your best, and to do the right thing, it will work itself out.

Bruce Devlin 34:54

Well, Mike and I can assure you that we have not regretted having Hale Irwin tell us about his life and the things that you went through, the wonderful achievements you've had, and and we thank you for your time, Hale. It's it really has been a pleasure.

Hale Irwin 35:11

Well, uh, you know, again, fellas, it's it's it's my pleasure to uh relive some of the the brightest moments in in one's life. Uh like my dad said, don't start something you can't finish. Uh you know the difference between right and wrong and always try your best. Yeah. So with that in mind, I I think you you don't you shouldn't embark upon something that's where you're going to get a little ways out of the gate and oh, turn around and come back. Well, if that's the case, then why don't you just pull over the side of the road and figure out another way to get there? Yeah. Uh and don't don't go backwards. Uh life's full of all you have to do is get on the internet and see how nasty things can be. God, it's terrible, isn't it? And we need to go forward collectively as a as uh as human beings and help each other and and and build uh to what uh what we all have that potential in us to be.

Mike Gonzalez 36:11

Yeah. Well, hale, uh, it has been an absolute delight having you on the program, and uh we appreciate you sharing your life story for the good of the game.

Hale Irwin 36:21

Well, gentlemen, you guys do a great job. Just keep it up. Enjoy it.

Mike Gonzalez 36:25

Thank you for listening to another episode of For the Good of the Game. And please, wherever you listen to your podcast on Apple and Spotify, if you like what you hear, please subscribe, spread the word, tell your friends until we tee it up again for the good of the game. So long, everybody.