Azdean [00:00:04]:
Welcome to the Destination Morocco podcast, the show that takes you away to the beautiful country of Morocco. I am your host, Azdean Elmoustaquim. In each episode, we explore moroccan culture, history, attractions and activities. Real and practical information coming from experienced travellers and Native Americans like myself. And now let's go exploring.
Ted [00:00:36]:
How's everybody doing today?
Azdean [00:00:38]:
Wonderful.
Hiba [00:00:39]:
Cool.
Sam [00:00:39]:
Thank you very much.
Hiba [00:00:40]:
Thank you.
Ted [00:00:42]:
Yeah. Nice to see everybody here. We'll keep an eye on our chat here. If people have questions about languages, things they like translated, things they like to understand, that's our theme today. I've been really enjoying the cultural series you guys have been doing the last month or so, learning a bit more about the history of the berber people, the amazer and some of that background. It's been fun. So this really taps into that, the language, and we really want to look at it from a practical side. So if you're travelling in Morocco, day to day stuff and there's tonnes that we can go through, we've tried to pick out kind of just some key phrases here in the time that we.
Ted [00:01:20]:
Yeah, you know, you're in the bazaar and you're in the souks and stuff, and you want to try to barter and order some stuff. You're at a restaurant, you're with your guides and your drivers at the riad. Just basic things. How do you introduce yourself? How do you say hello? Things like that. So that's what we're going to chat about today.
Azdean [00:01:35]:
It's going to be fun. Looking forward to it.
Ted [00:01:37]:
We were talking a bit before here about part of this is a bit of giving a bit of context, because Morocco is. Part of the fascinating thing about Morocco is that we're not talking about just one language. There's many, many. Now, you guys will tell me and our audience about this, but just how many languages and how many dialects there are. So to try to make this as practical and useful as possible, you can see everyone watching that. We've shared our screen and we have this kind of spreadsheet here with some phrases. But you'll see the key is there's Darija, there's French and there's Berber, because you're going to be exposed to all three of those as you travel around Morocco. So first we're going to learn about kind of where you would hear which language and in what context to try to be prepared.
Ted [00:02:22]:
So let's talk a bit about Darija and even what is Darija? Because probably not a lot of people really know what that is. So Asdin can you give us a bit of context about that.
Azdean [00:02:33]:
Terija is basically, it's really a combination of different languages that are spoken in Morocco. It contains some French, some Spanish, Arabic, German, and some Berber as well. It's basically spoken throughout Morocco. There's different bits and pieces that are different from one region to the next. If you're talking the north side versus Marrakech region, the Huz region, the middle, then if we're talking the southern part of Morocco, then we have the Berber, or the Amazon language, which is spoken in the riff mountains in the north side of Morocco, then the Yatlas mountains, then the swiss region, Agadir. Then we have the southern part of Morocco as well. So there's, I would say, probably four maybe different dialects when it comes to Berber language. Then we have the french language, which is really spoken, I would say, in the major cities, the big cities.
Azdean [00:03:32]:
Then when you go to the north side, Spanish is strong. So there are quite a bit of languages that are spoken in Morocco. So in one household, people will probably speak a minimum of two languages, depending what that family is from.
Hiba [00:03:50]:
Morocco is known as a multilingual country, so it has two official languages, which is the modern Arabic and the Berber language. Also, French is extremely useful, especially because of the historical colonial of the moroccan country. And in order like to interact with locals, it's quite necessary to be aware, at least of these three languages.
Sam [00:04:21]:
Absolutely. Morocco is diverse in terms of languages. So I want to add to what Azdean just said, in Morocco, we have, like, I can say 99% of the Moroccans are Berbers, by the way, just to clarify this idea. And then the Arabic is very famous nowadays because most of the generations, especially the modern generations of Moroccans, are converted into Arabs because of the new system, educational system in Morocco. So most of the kids right now, especially you found that parents still speak Berber, but the kids, they speak Arabic. French is very common. Most of the people, they think that French is an official language in Morocco. It's not.
Sam [00:05:09]:
Right. The official language is Arabic, as he mentioned, and Tamazirt Berber, because we talk about three dialects of Berber in Morocco. But the official language of Berber, it's called Tamazirt. Tamazirt, or the Amazon language, which is the official language in Morocco since 2012, which after the change of the constitution, it becomes new signature official language of the kingdom of Morocco.
Ted [00:05:09]:
Right. You can correct my spelling. I'm going to write things down, but correct my spelling if it's off.
Sam [00:05:41]:
That's right.
Ted [00:05:44]:
Well, it goes back to the episodes, right. The last month, learning about this stuff and keeping it straight, because I've been doing the show, we've been doing the show for two years and I've heard the terms and maybe I wasn't paying attention enough, but now I know, like, Derija is kind of the moroccan name for moroccan Arabic, right? And now we know Berber amazer, same thing. We like to say Amazir, of course. And Tamazirt is the Amazir language. Here's a question then. How similar, if any, is there between Tamazir Berber language and Darija? Are they similar at all? Do they mutually understand each other? Are they similar words?
Sam [00:06:24]:
Yeah. Tamazirt is not like Arabic in the modern cities, like big cities, like Marrakesh, for example. In France, if you found people speaking Berber or speaking Tamazir, they mix it with Arabic. You can understand it a little bit. But if you go to the mountains, to the southern part of Morocco, to the reef mountains, for example, to the region Agadir on the road, you will find that it's totally different than derision. All the words, there is no comparison between them. And in the big cities, as I say, there is a common because interculture with the french and spanish words. So the people start speaking a mix of Berber, Arabic and French.
Ted [00:07:05]:
Is it the kind of thing that people are just so used to, being exposed to different languages? Probably more in the cities, I guess, but that people routinely talk to each other and use kind of two or three languages in the same sentence or the same conversation? Does that.
Sam [00:07:22]:
Yeah, that's correct. Especially when you speak with someone. For example, I can speak with hiba, for example, in Berber or in Tamazir, we mix like French, darija, Arabic, Darija and Berber. So the three languages are mixed in one sentence together.
Hiba [00:07:38]:
Yeah.
Ted [00:07:41]:
And you probably throw in a bit of English, too.
Sam [00:07:44]:
Yeah, of course.
Ted [00:07:44]:
I know that not all words are translated, right?
Sam [00:07:50]:
Yeah, we used to talk last time, and I asked her, print me this, and I just translated from. I said it in Berber, in English, in a berber way. I said.
Hiba [00:08:06]:
Remember?
Sam [00:08:11]:
That's so funny.
Ted [00:08:14]:
I find this fascinating because I'm always interested in how people interact on a day to day basis as locals in different languages. Right. Do you find, like, if it's somebody you know, I suppose, friends and coworkers, you would probably learn over time how to communicate with each other. If it's a stranger or someone you're meeting for the first time, does it take a bit of time to figure out, okay, what language are we going to speak? How much does the other person know of certain languages. Is it different with every person, or does everybody kind of just mix it all together?
Azdean [00:08:48]:
It just depends. And I'll give you an example. And also, it's from generation to generation, like our generation, for the first time, we always speak in derision, but then we look at each other, we hear the sentences or the accent, and then we'll say, are you berber? Are you amazer? Oh, yeah. Then we flip it to. And for me, this is how I've noticed it. And when I visit, that's normally the case, but I also would like to hear Sam's experience in Hebrew as well.
Sam [00:09:22]:
Yeah, Sam, for me, when I speak Arabic, all the people, I just start speaking with them because my Arabic is not correct. It's mixed with the berber accent. So most people, they. Sam, are you a Berber? So how do you know. Oh, from your accent. So you are maybe hiba. When she speaks, you can distinguish. You can't, for example, tell her that she is Berber.
Sam [00:09:47]:
But me, first time, you know that I am berber. And we know each other from our faces, our blood, for example, we know I know someone, I meet someone, I know that he is berber or is not.
Azdean [00:09:59]:
Yeah, the bone structure for the. So, ahiba, what's your take? Because I have a story.
Hiba [00:10:11]:
Well, of course, for example, you interact with someone at first glance. For example, if you talk with him, like in derision, for me, I feel most comfortable talking or speaking in derision because my Berber. It's a bit not clear, however, when you find that kind of intimacy with that person. So this is, for me, the right fit. For example, it depends on the intimacy or the engagement with that person in front of.
Azdean [00:10:45]:
I see, you know, we are from Marrakech and comparing us or looking around, like in Morocco, when we talk to anybody from different cities, they know we are from Marrakech because of our accent. It's just like, compared to a texan accent or a southern accent. Here in the US, we speak a little bit slow and we ted to extend the letters a little bit longer. So my last visit, which is a few weeks ago, when I visited Morocco for the first time, I went for dinner, me and Sam and the owner of the restaurant was showing us around, and we were talking, and they have kind know. You can order them out of the menu, but they also have a buffet style, which is really nice. And she started talking to me and talking to Sam, and she said, ask me if I was a Berber. She said that I have a berber accent, which I have never in my life. Somebody told me that I have a berber accent? I mean, when you hear Sam speak The Derrija, you know, he has a berber accent.
Azdean [00:11:45]:
For the locals, maybe. Foreigners may be kind of difficult for them to identify or recognise. But I was very surprised when she said that, pleasantly surprised, because I did not think that I had a Berber accent especially. I don't speak Berber fluently all the way, even though I would love to one day. But, yeah, that was my story for the last time I visited. Yet the accent gives us way.
Sam [00:12:14]:
Yes.
Ted [00:12:17]:
Is there an emotional connection with the Berber language then, for most people? Well, is Darija more common that people would speak? But as you're talking, like, you know, a lot of words and stuff in Berber, but maybe not completely fluent. But is it a source of identity, then, for people, the Berber language?
Azdean [00:12:37]:
Yes. I'll start first. And let me tell you something, Ted. The Berber language opens doors for you in Morocco. Let's say me and Sam went especially. I'm going to say it especially when you go to Agadira, the swiss region. Let's say I'm looking for a place to stay. I go in, I say, hey, I'm looking for a hotel.
Azdean [00:12:56]:
It's the last minute. Oh, no, we don't have anything. Then Sam comes in and he speaks to them in Berber. He'll get the president.
Sam [00:13:07]:
Yeah, absolutely.
Azdean [00:13:08]:
So there's a connection between us Berbers. It doesn't matter where we're from. The north, the south, the middle. Once you know somebody's Berber, there's a certain trust that comes with it. This is our perception. This is how we were raised and built. For me, at least, because what I have just said, this example, Ait actually happened to me and a friend in Agadir. This is back in 2005.
Azdean [00:13:31]:
It doesn't happen in all the cities. It doesn't happen all the time. But when you're a bourbon, you're dealing with other bourbons or Amazon, they really tend to go above and beyond to help and assist. And you can see this, the same trend goes into the tourism industry that people are willing to do for you what a lot of others are not. That's one of the reasons a lot of people, they love experiencing the Berber culture. They love spending time with the Berber family, whether it's lunch or dinner or overnight. It's just. It's incredible.
Azdean [00:14:04]:
This has been my personal experience.
Hiba [00:14:06]:
Yeah. You can feel that relation between you. And if you said, for example, for someone that you are a Berber, you can notice a big smile on his face. And of course, he will assist you with whatever he can do for you. Of course, that serves a lot.
Sam [00:14:23]:
Especially, I want to add, especially in business, when you want to deal with someone throughout Morocco, it's not only in Marrakech or other parts, but all Morocco. When you want to do business with someone and he asks you, for example, are you a Berber? And you said, yes. Then you get like 90% to do business with that person. Even if he is not Berber, he is Arabic, for example, who is Arab or is french or something. They understand because they know that Berbers are trustworthy and they are good people. So word is word. And when he says something and he can do it, if he can't, he said, no, I can't do it. So the people, especially in terms of business, they prefer to do business with Berbers?
Ted [00:15:09]:
Well, this is important in terms of context. So maybe let's look at where we would use each language and then we can get into some of these phrases here. So for instance, if we're going to learn some phrases in Darija as a traveller, kind of mainstream destinations, perhaps. But are we able to use those phrases no matter where you go in.
Azdean [00:15:29]:
The country in most times, fes.
Hiba [00:15:33]:
Yeah.
Ted [00:15:33]:
And then how about Berber? Like, where would you most be actually using that on a daily basis?
Hiba [00:15:39]:
Especially in rural areas, for example.
Azdean [00:15:42]:
Yeah. Southern part, mountains.
Sam [00:15:43]:
Rural areas, yes. Northern part, southern part, the middle Atlas mountains as well.
Ted [00:15:51]:
So less so in Casablanca areas, I guess. Rabat, French.
Azdean [00:15:56]:
Yes.
Sam [00:15:57]:
In Casablanca there is many Berbers. I can say like 60% of the population in Casablanca are Berbers, especially from western part of Morocco, like Seuss, Agadir, terudent and Rond. They are all mouths of.
Azdean [00:16:11]:
Yeah.
Ted [00:16:12]:
Well, in that mean, because I would know if people are learning languages and especially if they enjoy doing that and it's fun, that's great. But there's a lot to learn. And if you want to choose which phrase or which language I should bring out in a certain situation. Right. Do you recommend learning Darija first because it's more common or because I'm really hearing what you're saying about making the connection with people? Can you focus more on Berber, knowing that there's a pretty good chance people would understand it?
Azdean [00:16:41]:
I would say Darija first because it's definitely the number one most common language, even though there's a little bit of variation from the north to the south part. But definitely say Derrije first, then Berber is definitely helpful. And also the know the French language is phasing out, but you can barely see that change now. But the change will be more visible maybe a decade from now. It's still a very important language to communicate in Morocco. And when you're in the north side, Spanish is definitely very helpful as well.
Sam [00:17:14]:
Agree? 100%. Yes.
Ted [00:17:16]:
Yeah. We found that when we were in Morocco last year, and our driver spoke a ait English, but he was much more comfortable in French and of course, Berber and the region, I guess, too. But for us at least, we knew some French coming from Canada, so we could communicate with mean most travellers, whether from North America, Europe, et cetera. You'll probably have a little more familiarity with French, at least than you would with the region, at least in terms of know, numbers and things like that. So you might be able to make some of those connections that way. It was nice being able to talk to them instead of just kind, know, nodding and yes, no. But like, how mutually intelligible is Darija, or Moroccan Arabic and the mainstream Arabic and Egypt and places like that?
Azdean [00:18:05]:
That's a really good question. We feel like we are spies in Morocco because we can understand all of them, but they cannot understand us.
Ted [00:18:16]:
Okay.
Hiba [00:18:17]:
Yes, we are special.
Sam [00:18:19]:
Yes, I agree. We can understand egyptian dialects, for example, or Egyptian Arabic, but they couldn't understand our.
Azdean [00:18:28]:
Yeah, yeah. Egypt, Lebanon, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Emirates, Iraq, we do understand all of their language. There's a little bit of difference, obviously, from country to country, but we recognise the differences because of tv and movies and stuff like that. But unfortunately, they could not understand us. It just sounded know, just a motion of language.
Sam [00:18:54]:
Yes.
Azdean [00:18:56]:
Interesting.
Ted [00:18:56]:
Yeah, I was wondering about that.
Azdean [00:18:58]:
The other thing that I wanted to mention is I just came back from Morocco, and I was very grateful and very fortunate to record a complete section or complete theme of the Darija language, how to say, from English to moroccan dialect. Darija Hiba was involved, Sam was involved as well. And I cannot really thank him enough because this project, we worked on it a year and a half, honestly, for a year and a half, from start to finish. In between, there's a lot of breaks, obviously, but it took a lot of us to work on it. But it was so much fun. It was incredible. I'm so proud of you guys. I've seen some examples.
Azdean [00:19:39]:
I'm not sure if you want to share some of the video that we have with the audience on this session. Ted, we're going to start posting some of those sessions, as we discussed earlier, probably twice a week. Most of them will live on YouTube shorts, then on TikTok, then Instagram. And to follow us in all those platforms. It's at destination Morocco. So it's the same name in all these three platforms.
Ted [00:20:07]:
Let's see if this will work.
Azdean [00:20:09]:
So how do we say hi or hello?
Ted [00:20:11]:
Okay, good.
Azdean [00:20:12]:
Sam, how do we say as a.
Azdean [00:20:16]:
Respond to hi or hello?
Hiba [00:20:17]:
Ali kum Salem.
Azdean [00:20:20]:
Okay, bye. Thank you.
Hiba [00:20:24]:
Shokran.
Azdean [00:20:26]:
You're welcome.
Hiba [00:20:28]:
La shokra lajib. Or merhaba.
Azdean [00:20:31]:
Excuse me.
Azdean [00:20:32]:
Or pardon me.
Hiba [00:20:34]:
Smehelia said it twice.
Ted [00:20:40]:
Good. There you go. So that's your little video. So that's one sample, right, of what you guys are recording?
Azdean [00:20:45]:
Yes. So hopefully you'll enjoy it because we definitely loved putting it together. Every second of it. It's been really.
Sam [00:20:53]:
And hope it will help you during your travel.
Ted [00:20:57]:
Yeah, it looks like fun. Well, that's kind of it. So this here today has been lots of fun to chat about languages. And we had a bit of a plan, but we were just kind of being spontaneous. And the whole point is with these little videos is they're roughly 60, 90 seconds long.
Azdean [00:21:12]:
Right.
Ted [00:21:13]:
So people can get those little snippets much easier, faster to consume and learn a few phrases at a time, which is handy.
Azdean [00:21:20]:
Absolutely.
Ted [00:21:20]:
Thank you. Good.
Azdean [00:21:22]:
Thank you for listening. Thank you to the viewers. We're very grateful for you for the opportunity. And if you need help planning your trip tomorrow, just keep us in.
Ted [00:21:31]:
Yep. All right. Thanks, guys.
Azdean [00:21:33]:
Thank you so much.
Hiba [00:21:34]:
Thank you.
Sam [00:21:35]:
Thank you, dad. Thank you.
Hiba [00:21:36]:
Thank you, all of you. Thank you so much.
Sam [00:21:38]:
Appreciate it.