AZDEAN: [00:00:00] We are here today all the way from village Qsar ElKhamliya. Just to give you a little bit of perspective, it's about six kilometers from Merzouga desert. Is that right? Yes. today's episode, we have a very special guest, Mr. Mohamed or Mohamed, with us. Mr. Mohamed, welcome to the podcast. Very glad to have you today.
MOHAMED:
Thank you so much. We appreciate your hospitality so much. You are so welcome. Also, we are so happy for your existence with us here today. So, you are so welcome.
AZDEAN: I really appreciate that. Mr. Mohamed, would you please tell us and the audience a little bit about yourself? Your background?
MOHAMED: So, my name is Mohamed. I am, twenty six year old. I start, music here in Khameliyah around, uh, eight year old. Since you were eight years old, okay, wow. Until now, so we're [00:04:00] still playing music. I'm eight years old.
AZDEAN: Okay, perfect. What can you tell us about the history of Qsar ElKhameliyah?
MOHAMED: So, for, uh, about Khamelia, Khamelia, it's a Namazia word. What does it mean? It's expressed like the green, some green where, some green land. Vegetation, okay. So that's why people came to live here in the past because of the agriculture. I see. but for now, it's totally different. Yes. As you can see.
AZDEAN: It's very dry. Yeah. very hot. it looks like it's been dried out for quite some time. what can you tell us about the history of the Gnawa music, and We watched you do a couple of shows earlier for us today. Just amazing, incredible. Thank you so much. If you can give us the, little bit of history of Gnawa music. Yeah, sure. Please.
MOHAMED: So for the Gnaoua music, it's traditional music, it's an African traditional music, and it's spiritual [00:05:00] music also. black people created it, became in the past as someone's as slaves and someone's as nomads.
AZDEAN: Nomads, okay. So when you said, can you tell us the country's specific, Specific
MOHAMED: countries. Yes. Actually, there is no one, no specific. I see. Just we can say Sub Saharan countries, all the black countries. Okay. So all black people came as slaves, as nomads from all black countries.
AZDEAN: Okay. So they came to Morocco.
MOHAMED: They came to Morocco and from Morocco to other, countries. And as you can see in US or in Europe.
AZDEAN: Yes. Okay. Uh, what does Gnawa music mean to them? And what's the significance of Gnawa music to them and to this region?
MOHAMED: So for Gnawa music, it has been created just express the suffering of its slaves. I see. it's spiritual music, so [00:06:00] it's to express the suffering of its slaves and how they were looking for freedom. And for us also, how we get freedom, because It's religious music also in this side of getting freedom because for us we believe that we get our freedom because of Islam.
That's why in most of our, uh, music songs we are talking about God, about Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him. And, uh, that's it.
AZDEAN: That's a very short description. I see that you said that you were playing music since you were eight years old. can you take us back to your father's generation, to your grandfather's generation?
How was that music? Has it changed since then? Or culture of it and tradition, it's still the same?
MOHAMED: Surely not, it's not the same. It's not the same, okay. Because in the past it was life here so hard, you know. Okay, can you explain a little bit more? After the agriculture and after [00:07:00] the coming of the occupation of French.
Okay. People who are working with French, especially in place here, it's called MEPHIS. MEPHIS, okay. It was working in the
AZDEAN: Metallic. Okay, give me just one second because to explain to the audience, we have visited this site just earlier today, and we've seen how harsh that life is.
We've seen, we've shown. how the village is and how people live in those harsh and harsh and very difficult conditions under occupation of the French. This is back in 1912. So it's over a century. And they were used, for labor basically. And his grandfather was one of those people. And, our guides told us that they used to have a day off, maybe Once a week, but in his case, his grandfather used to have one day off in two weeks.
So your grandfather will come from those mines to the village to see his family, which is, you know,
MOHAMED: my grandfather, he was working with the [00:08:00] UK patient know. And he just can come back. One time in two weeks, exactly, and it was so hard, hard work for them there.
AZDEAN: I can imagine. Yeah. I mean, going up all the way to those caves, just it's, it's, beyond difficult. So what else can you tell us about the importance? Of Gawa music. We, we understand you said that it's, Sub-Saharan, it doesn't really have a specific origin, but Sub-Saharan came here in caravans as slaves.
Yes. Uh, and the other one, they came by ships. Yes, exactly. Through, uh, Essauoira. So the Gnawa music here, is it the same as the Gnawa music in a RA or in Marrakesh or anywhere else that is being played in Morocco?
MOHAMED: it's not the same, as you can see, just in the dress. Yes, of course, yeah.
here we are using the white dress as a, as expression of peace. Peace, I [00:09:00] see, okay. And also, because it's totally different, because here, it's not like the city. The city, the work and city is totally different. Yeah, yes, absolutely. Because here, in the past, most of the slaves, they work, just with nomads. Yes. to keep saving them animals here.
AZDEAN: I see. Okay. That must have been very difficult. Yeah, I can just imagine it's just It's just beyond incredible. So Can you give us a little bit of history of how the Gnawa music is supported? You know, I see there's a lot of tourists. We've been here for probably two and a half Hours and I've seen people come in and out in and out and in and out small groups a couple that the only way or one of the ways that you guys get support? In the Khameliyah village?
MOHAMED: Yes, for the moment, yes.
AZDEAN: Okay. Is it enough? Or do you need more help? Actually, we still need more help. You need more help. Okay, I don't want to say anything. I don't want to get in [00:10:00] trouble.
I see the importance of you, obviously, trying to keep the traditional life moving from, you know, generation to generation to generation, which is very, very meaningful. as we speak, the Gnawa Music Festival in Essaouira it goes on for a few days. and do you have something similar here? In Khamliya, a festival.
MOHAMED: yeah, here in Khamliya also we, we have festival each year in August. In August. Yes. Okay. For this year it will be in first days of August.
AZDEAN: First few days, okay. Yes. Okay, so now the, the festival in August, why is it specifically in August? Is there a reason why? Or is it just that's how it has always been?
MOHAMED: The reason is, uh, same reason why people came to live here. For agriculture. I see, yes. So, people in the past, they finished the agricultural work in summer, so that's why. They prepared the festival in the same year.
AZDEAN: Oh, it makes sense. Yeah, [00:11:00] it makes sense.
MOHAMED: To celebrate the harvest. When all finish with the agriculture, they start the festival.
AZDEAN: Okay, I see. Anybody can attend the festival or you have to be invited? To attend the festival.
MOHAMED: No, there is no invitation for the festival. Anyone can. Anyone can attend,
AZDEAN: but do you send some specific invitation to people from the village?
MOHAMED: Just before the festival. I see. We, we have, because as I told you. it takes like, uh, one month of preparation.
Okay. So in this, days before, we prepare it by turning around villages. And getting some supports, like money or, I see some dish.
AZDEAN: Okay. To help. Yes, to help. is there a specific area where the, festival is being done, is there like a big tent or how many people usually attend the festival And how long is the festival, by the way?
MOHAMED: So for the festival it's three days. Three days for three days. And there is specific place.
AZDEAN: Sure. [00:12:00] Okay. How many people can that place.
MOHAMED: It is a lot of people. A lot of people. Yeah. Okay. Because also in summer there is the national tourists. Yes. So, as you know, Mirzouga is Now and by the, sand and, that way that's, yeah, are covering.
Absolutely, absolutely.
AZDEAN: Do you invite any certain type of guests, like ministries? Yes, yes, yes. Like that? Okay, I see, I see. So, um, what else can you tell us your story, history, in Qasr Al Khamiliya? Qasr Al Khamiliya. Al Khamiliya.
MOHAMED: Just to give you some information about the groups of music, because normally there is the big group of music that is preparing the festival. Yeah, I see. And it's not the same as this one. Okay. Because normally this one, it's new, newest than the other one.
AZDEAN: So this is the newest group. So basically We talked earlier and you said that you have three groups. The biggest group is the one that takes care of [00:13:00] preparing the festival. And the festival, it really takes a month to, to, yeah, around one month to get it prepared. And the reason why in August, because it's after, the Eid.
Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The Eid Al Hadha, because if you look at Ramadan. And then Eid Al Adha, which is the biggest holiday in our Islamic calendar. It's about two months and ten days. So people, they need a little bit more time. So we're talking about Probably the first week of July will, the preparation will be starting preparing for the festival.
So that's why it takes approximately about 30 days to get it done. And that's the reason why it moved, to August. And it moves around depending on the lunar calendar where that falls. so probably it's gonna be in August for some time. Then it probably moved to July at some point, July at some point.
Then, you know, and it moves slowly year after year, uh, which is, very interesting. So in the village, you have three groups, obviously that's the biggest. [00:14:00] You have a second group that takes care of the tourists. For example, us, when we came in and we've seen a lot of people in and out that you've been doing some shows, quite a few actually, sometimes it gets busy.
So in that case, you have to create another group of Gnawa music. So can you walk us through that experience, please?
MOHAMED: Yeah, because know, This group is the second one the big one.
AZDEAN: Okay, so you're right in the middle.
MOHAMED: It has been created by Mr. Zaid. Zaid,
AZDEAN: so this is group Zaid of Gnawa Music.
MOHAMED: Yeah. so sometimes it became full. I see. So there is nowhere play the music for the other guests. I see. That's why we need another group to create another group. That's why there is Bambara.
AZDEAN: Okay, So the big group takes care of the logistics of big events.
Then it's you take care of something like this, which is just incredible. And then when it gets busy and there's like a waiting list and people are waiting, then the other group of Gnawa Music will take [00:15:00] over And for now, the two groups are working in together.
MOHAMED: Yes, same, same time. At the same time. Each group need help from the other.
AZDEAN: I see. They collaborate. It's teamwork, basically. That's really, really good. So, explain to us, the importance of music to this region, Merzouga, the south of Morocco region. Why is it really important? Why are you keeping this tradition alive?
MOHAMED: Because it's now, it's like a part of life here because for us, it's very important because it's our work for now. And also for the other, other villages, it's very important because it's part of the tours, the touristic programs, you know, to pass it from here to discover. place and to get information about the place, the village.
AZDEAN:
The question that I have for you, Mohamed, is can anybody come and visit you here? Or do they have to make a reservation? Do they have to make a [00:16:00] booking ahead? Or how does it normally work?
MOHAMED: Now anyone can visit us here.
AZDEAN: No reservation? Okay. And they get welcomed with the Gnawa music. Yeah.
MOHAMED:
No reservation.
AZDEAN: Authentic Gnawa music and mint tea. the tea was just very different. it has a kick. If you know what I'm talking about is, you know, the, desert tea is very different. So I really, really enjoyed it. Now, the question that I have, I want to see if there's anything else you want to share with the audience, something that we did not talk about, you and I.
MOHAMED: So just to make you know that, uh, here in, Khamenei also we have a Bivouac Gnawa. Around, yes.
AZDEAN
Oh, I did not know that.
AZDEAN: Just here. And also we have a riad. So Mr. Mohamed, what he just said that they have a riad with the local family, uh, Gnawa, and also they have a camp, Gnawa camp, in the desert.
MOHAMED: Yeah. Where you can enjoy music [00:17:00] at night. And it be totally different, of course, than the one that we just had. Because it be with women, because normally there is women also playing music with us.
AZDEAN: I see. So, in the camp, it's music with the women. It's a mixture of men and women playing music in the camp. To get traditional.
MOHAMED: After dinner. Yeah.
AZDEAN: Yes. Oh, nice. Nice. Okay. Anything else, Mohamed?
MOHAMED: That's it. Thank you so much.
AZDEAN:Thank you. This concludes our episode. of today's grammar music. Really, really appreciate you tuning in.
IMRAN: And please book a trip to Destination Morocco podcast. Thank you.
AZDEAN: High five. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.