Messy Endeavor

In this episode of Void Signal, Brian Prime sits down with Reno-based installation artist Henry Sanchez, who works under the name Messy Endeavor, to explore his journey creating immersive, technology-driven art rooted in light, sound, and motion. Henry discusses how a formative synesthetic experience, briefly “seeing” music, inspired his use of LEDs, CRT televisions, and reactive visuals to evoke emotional and sensory responses, blending DIY electronics with concert-style lighting aesthetics. Drawing on his background as an electrician, his curiosity as a child who dismantled electronics, and his desire to make art accessible, interactive, and fun rather than traditionally gallery bound, Henry reflects on cultural upbringing, creative independence, and the challenges of sustaining an artistic career. The conversation touches on viral online success, wearable LED art, public installations, emotional storytelling through visual media, and his long-term goal of building Messy Endeavor into a platform that supports and uplifts other emerging creatives.

https://linktr.ee/messyendeavor for more Messy Endeavor


Void Signal intro courtesy of Processor. Visit https://processor2.bandcamp.com for more Processor.

Transcript

Well hello again and welcome to Void Signal, I'm the maker of this mess Brian Prime and this episode is a chat with local Reno artist, Henry, who produces art as Messy Endeavor. Henry's interest in art started early and he utilized his skill as an electrician to produce vibrant, color-filled art, in addition to traditional art pieces. His works are a combination of technology with an infatuation for light, sound, and motion. They're splendid to behold in person. I sat down with Henry in his studio not that long ago for a chat.
But before we get to that, I need to remind you once again that Void Signal's intro is courtesy of Processor, you can visit processor2.bandcamp.com or search Processor on the streaming platform of your choice.
Were you also aware that Void Signal is four years old and still ad-free? Void Signal is powered by people and made for people, please consider supporting the Void Signal project and independent media by visiting VoidSignal.net or Patreon.com/voidsignal and slip me some dollars if you had a good time. Thank you as always for your support and your ear time.
Okay, our time is at an end. Tune in next time for either an interview with Rabbit Junk, or the Wasteland Weekend episode. One of those. MYSTERY. See you again soon. Stay safe, stay loud.

My recording 24
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Brian Prime: [00:00:00] That mic doesn't pick me up as well. Okay. Check, check. One, two. Say a couple words. Hello? Hello. Okay, we're good. All right. Welcome to Avoid Signal. I'm, here speaking with Henry Sanchez, which is, that's the name you go by for all your art and stuff, everything, right? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Uh, ~I actually go by messy endeavor.

I started it as a project. About six years ago. I named a messy endeavor because I didn't know what it was gonna be. ~Sure. ~And ~I wanted it to be in, ~I wanted to be able to interpret it any way I want in the future. ~Sure. ~So, messy endeavor. 

Brian Prime: Tell me a little bit about what got you into the style of art that you make.

Henry Messy Endeavor: I had an experience where I was able to physically see music for a couple minutes, and it really stuck with me for the longest time, I wanted to come back to that, and I wanted to come back to that experience and see the colors. As [00:01:00] vibrantly as I did in that moment. 

And just be able to come back to the ~ex ~experience whenever I wanted.

So a lot of my work involves lights, bright fluorescent colors and lights that react with music. 

Brian Prime: Sure. ~And ~all with the goal ~of sort ~of trying to recreate that synesthesia ~sort of a ~experience that you had. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~That's exactly what I'm going for. ~

Brian Prime: ~Gotcha. ~What led you to this medium in particular?

~Just, ~is this the only one that you found could, ~like, ~replicate what you're looking for? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Uh, ~the technology medium? Yes. ~Um, I~ I was. Initially, ~uh, ~doing blacklight stuff like portraits and sculptures, ~uh, ~that were either blacklight or, low in the dark. ~Sure. ~But it doesn't have that same motion that I can get with LEDs ~or, ~or the TV setup.

Brian Prime: Yeah. And for ~like ~people who ~may not know or ~may not realize, the medium that you use, ~and I just witnessed a demonstration of it~ is, CRT TVs and ~like ~neon and ~a lot of ~stuff. Tell me a little bit about, so you played a song and the TVs did different things at different times. Tell me a little bit about [00:02:00] what goes into the backend for making that happen.

Henry Messy Endeavor: It is actually surprisingly easy. Yeah. What I try to do is not overcomplicate things. I, I just have a goal that I want to gear toward Sure. ~Uh, ~that I want to achieve, and I try to go about it the simplest way I can. So surprisingly, a lot of my visuals are made through Cap cut, which is an editing app that you can use on your phone.

~Mm-hmm. ~

~But, um. Oh, I forgot what I was gonna say. ~

Brian Prime: ~How do we trans, ~how do you go about transferring from the one device to these TVs? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: It we're lucky enough to live in the future where you can get anything you want and basically create anything I want. 

Sure. 

~Uh, ~though reason I started working with the CRTs is because I wanted to initially.

Do concert style lighting visuals. Mm-hmm. But then I saw how expensive DMX lights and lasers would be. Sure. I already had a CRT, a small CRT collection just because I felt really bad that they were going to waste. So that's. I just got [00:03:00] really creative about 

Brian Prime: Yeah. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Using them in that way. 

Brian Prime: ~Sure. Just like, what am I gonna do with this whole thing?~

~Yeah, exactly. Gotcha. ~How long have you been, how much time goes into like, the programming of the individual components? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: There's not a whole lot of programming involved. ~It's, uh, ~the hardware basically does it for me. ~It splits up the video in, into~ it splits up the video into different sections so then I can, edit a video into ~what's gonna be in the.~

What's gonna be timed into the different tv. Gotcha. And then I can just play it and sit back and watch what I created. 

Brian Prime: Gotcha. Okay. So it sounds ~pretty, ~pretty simple, 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~right? Right. Gotcha. This is, uh, ~this is the first thing I've made that became really popular, at least online, and that basically propelled me.

Into doing different projects ~that I, ~and becoming an official installation artist. 

Brian Prime: Sure. So the attention garnered by this particular, outlet just sort of prompted you ~to, ~to expand and just like really throw up with 

Henry Messy Endeavor: this. It gave me, it made me feel like I had something it made me feel that I had something there that I can work off of.

~Sure. ~There's a lot of fixtures around the space that I've made previously. 

And it just didn't really spark [00:04:00] the, the reaction I was looking for. 

~Sure. ~

And it made me feel crazy at the time, ~uh, ~that I was putting so much effort into the things I was creating, and it didn't seem like a lot of people ~were~ really saw the vision that I.

Intended, ~uh, intended my, ~my work to have. ~Sure. ~

Brian Prime: What efforts have you made to help bring that vision to people? ~Um, ~'cause you're, it sounds like you're describing like a, a first draft or a first iteration of a thing. Mm-hmm. ~Um, ~but what steps have you taken to sort of hone in on what you're seeking?

Henry Messy Endeavor: I like to see what other people. Enjoy. Especially in concerts. I really love to, what I pay attention to most in concerts is what they do with the lights and how they time them and, the sequences that, that they do to basically cause that synesthetic experience for the audience. 

So it's basically, basically just taking a little, ~uh, ~ideas from that. ~Sorry, this is my first time on a ~

~No, you're fine. ~

~This is my first time being interviewed. This is really interesting. It's really interesting experience.~ 

Brian Prime: Yeah, no, totally. ~Um, ~[00:05:00] so basically just to ~sort of, ~increase your own drive, you just ~sort of ~looked at what others were doing is what it sounds like, 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~right?~

I did an intent for the, for technology to be my medium. ~Mm-hmm. ~But I look at the goal that I want achieve and then I. ~I, I, ~I think about my why and then, the how just ~ba basically Sure. ~Comes along in the process, right? 

Brian Prime: Yeah. I mean, if you're an artist trying to capture, ~um, ~music in motion in like neon and light, ~um, ~you're not gonna grab like a paintbrush.

So it makes sense that you would pursue 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~this. ~Right. And my attention span is fried. So yeah, I kind of needed something ~with a little more, um. ~With a little more energy than a painting. 

Brian Prime: ~Yeah. Uh, something that feels a little energetic. What led you to, ~did you have a background in like working with electronics or technology?

Henry Messy Endeavor: Well, it made me comfortable with electronics is working as a residential electrician. 

And then I basically taught myself ~the, uh, ~the rest of what I needed to know. 

~Mm-hmm. ~

~Uh, it's surprisingly. ~It's surprisingly accessible, but, society the way things are, you're made to feel like you need to get a four year degree into engineering to even attempt ~Sure.~

The things that I'm doing, but it's actually really accessible if you could [00:06:00] really put your mind into it and take the time to push through the frustration of learning, ~uh, ~what you need to know. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. How, ~if you, ~if I asked you to just sort of gauge where you're at right now in your career, obviously early, ~but ~what would you say is the next thing you should probably work on when it comes to what you wanna create?

Henry Messy Endeavor: What I'm trying to work on now is something that I can make consistently that I can, maybe sell as a product, ~which are, uh, the l ~which are my LED light harnesses. 

~Mm-hmm. Um, ~

they're basically rave outfits that light up. And that also pick up music and, the lights switch around ~as~ as they listen to the music that.

~Uh, ~they're picking up from your phone. 

Brian Prime: Gotcha. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Uh, ~that is something ~that I can, ~that I can put out as a product and that would actually ~help me fund and actually I'm, ~help me fund my life and then put the money back into other projects that I wanna experiment with. Sure. So, yeah, something that I can just consistently make that can be my bread and butter would be, ~uh, ~really nice to figure out.

Brian Prime: Sure. Something tangible that mm-hmm. Generates an [00:07:00] income. Sure. Makes sense. ~Um.~

On the subject of marketing and selling art, I know plenty of artists and interview plenty of musicians and stuff, and, ~um, ~most of the people doing it, are doing it just out of the love of it. ~Um, ~nobody's really making a killing. ~Mm-hmm. So to speak. ~Given the sort of modern landscape of sort of everybody can make art in some way, what things have you found to be effective for making yourself stand out?

And what challenges do you think lie before you as an artist in a modern landscape? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Well, I started off messy endeavor, basically doing illustrations and painting and ~trying to go into the, ~trying to go the traditional route. 

And then AI started rolling out and, ~uh, ~in the moment I was, ~uh, ~trying to get better at digital drawing, but, ~uh, ~I figured AI ~is gonna, ~will eventually ~take, uh, ~take away the lu ~of, ~of digital art for me at least. So I wanted to think of something a little more creative and outside of the [00:08:00] box, that wouldn't necessarily fit in a gallery. 

The art I make is more so, ~I wanna make it~ I wanna make it accessible for the common person to understand.

~Mm-hmm. ~So there's not, ~uh, I don't, in, ~I don't make my pieces with deeper meaning involved. I kind of, it's mostly something pretty and fun that people can interact with. ~Mm-hmm. ~And a lot of this stuff ~is just~ looks really good in parties. ~Sure. Yeah. ~And ~that's where the, um, ~that's where. People have their emotions ~wrapped up, ~ramped up, ~yeah, sure.~

And they can, ~you know, ~connect with the beautiful lighting environment around them. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. With that perspective, would you say that your art is maybe better enjoyed, in the moment of like, I'm out at a thing or I'm experiencing it in the setting It's supposed to be. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: That's exactly right.

~Um, ~I decided that I wanna be an installation artist because I. Personally, I kind of hit the concept of selling, of making pieces to sell. 

I would rather make something and then have it experience. A lot of interactive art galleries are doing this where [00:09:00] people just pay, ~uh, ~a small, fee to enter their interactive galleries.

Mm-hmm. ~Experience. ~They are without the. ~Uh, ~the pressure of having to buy anything or being, ~um, ~marketed to and I also love everything I make, so I, I want to keep it and just, ~um, ~yeah. You know, let people borrow it and enjoy it, but 

yeah. 

Yeah, I, I get really sentimental about. ~Uh, ~yeah. About the things I work really hard on.

Yeah, 

Brian Prime: understandable. ~I mean, like, uh, ~a thing that is born from you is ~like, uh, it's kinda ~like a baby. It's like, hop is my baby. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Oh, yeah. ~Um, so yeah,~ 

Brian Prime: your art is ~definitely ~your baby. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: It's a lot of blood, sweat, and tears. Yeah. ~Like very, in a very literal sense. ~

Brian Prime: ~Yeah. Um, ~tell me a little bit about ~like ~where you came from, like ~where, ~what was your, ~uh, ~you don't have to gimme your childhood or anything, but just like, where did you come from?

Henry Messy Endeavor: For my mother. ~Okay. Well, I'm trying not to. Okay. ~I'm trying not to get too political. ~Um, ~and avoid that because that does really, that actually does go into, ~the, ~where I came from actually, ~like, um. ~Motivates my art in a way. 

Brian Prime: Sure. Just a quick aside, you can totally get political. It's totally fine.

~Whatever you wanna say, you're welcome to say Okay.~ 

Henry Messy Endeavor: It's your podcast. So I just don't wanna yeah. [00:10:00] No, you're fine. Okay. Yeah, so earlier this year I was kind of having a mental breakdown, you know, when, you know who got into office. Mm-hmm. And I had, I felt like I had a decision where I would either leave the country and drop everything, or I can just double down on what I'm doing, because the future is pretty uncertain anyway and, for my demographic.

Sure. Things are very, ~uh, ~things are a little tense, so, mm-hmm. ~Um, my, ~the pieces I work on are in a big part ~in escape from~ an escape from society, let's say. Sure.

~How do I describe this in the sense that I've not, ~by me being a successful artist, ~I'm not, I. ~I'm not another gear in the system, ~uh, ~that perpetuates the things that I don't like. 

Brian Prime: Yeah, no, that's fair and admirable. ~And ~I do take your meaning, ~um, ~because like we live in grim times and, yeah.

The world is getting crazier by the [00:11:00] day. ~But just wha what, um, ~was there something in your. Youth that you feel like was a catalyst for where you've landed now? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~I see. Yeah. I was the type of, ~I was the type ~of kid that, well, I was a weird kid, but I was the certain kind ~of kid that would take things apart ~and ~just to try to understand what was going on in them like.

~Like ~alarm clocks and electronics and stuff. ~Mm-hmm. ~And it would always frustrate me that I, it would get me nowhere. Like IW had no con context for what I was looking at. 

~Uh, ~once I learned a little bit of electrical, that ~condom ~got me curious about how much more I can understand. 

~Mm-hmm. And ~

I love being able to understand ~the~ the things around me and how they work ~at, ~at least at a very basic level.

Brian Prime: Gotcha. And just sort of reflecting back on like Young Henry who's like dismantling shit and, seeing how things work versus where you are now. How do you feel, ~uh, ~looking back on that younger version of yourself now as the person that you are? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Uh, ~sometimes I get a little upset about it.

I just ~wish I had the support. I ~wish I had the support to, ~uh, ~pursue ~my, ~my interest a little further. 

~Mm-hmm. ~

~Uh, I'm, ~I'm Latino by the way, ~uh, ~and ~mm-hmm. Latino people are very, uh, well, ~I come [00:12:00] from, ~uh, ~an immigrant, household. So it's very strict about the path that you're supposed to take, ~uh, ~when you're growing up.

~Sure. So, uh, ~whereas. ~Let's say ~a college educated, ~uh, ~household ~would kind of encourage, ~would kind of see this, drive and encourage it and put you in programs ~that would~ that would teach you ~a little ~something in the path you wanted to take. ~Sure. Uh, ~for me, I feel like ~I, ~I would've gotten a little further along if I had a little more support.

Sure. And this goes into other. Aspects of my interest. ~I, I, I, ~I like doing a lot of things. ~Um, I picked up well, ~I picked up guitar mm-hmm. Around middle school and I was also really good as I've always had a weird talent for drawing. 

So I wish that I didn't have to figure everything out myself.

I kind of, wish I had a little bit more support ~from, uh, the people well from, ~mainly from my family, but, I wish there was also programs available for people like me, in school. Sure. 

Brian Prime: ~Yeah. ~Based on what you're saying, ~it, ~it sounds like you were sort of, maybe not just ~societally, ~societally, but maybe culturally sort of [00:13:00] pushed in a particular direction.

Would you agree with that? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Um, ~I come from a construction background. Mm-hmm. That's why I ended up, ended up in construction as a fallback. 

Yeah. 

~Um, ~I could have gone to college, but unfortunately I didn't really figure out ~what I, uh, ~what I like to do. Sure. Soon enough. Yeah. And that's another aspect where you kind of have to, you're really forced to figure yourself out right away.

~Um. Mm-hmm. And then if you miss that. ~If you miss that window, it's a little too late for you ~that a little afterwards.~ 

Brian Prime: Yeah. ~Agree. ~My first time going to college was in my twenties and I didn't know who I was or what I wanted or what I liked. Right. ~Who does? Um, yeah, exactly. ~But going back later, and pursuing what you want.

Pursuing a career in the arts, no less a degree in the arts. It feels like burning money at times. ~Mm-hmm. ~Of like, I'm never gonna do anything with this, but, ~uh, ~it's a thing you'd love. So I guess you do it, but, what steps do you think, you will take personally to try and push your art to the next level?

Henry Messy Endeavor: Well, ~well basically 'cause~ seeing what ~o ~opportunities there are around me, ~uh, ~to get a little bit of attention. Something I wasn't expecting is to [00:14:00] get, moderately popular online through TikTok. ~Uh, when, uh, ~back when I was just posting videos of the projects I was doing, ~just ~in order to be able to pull up really easily, ~um, when, uh, ~when I talk about them to people ~mm-hmm.~

I was never expecting, a video to get 2 million views, ~just ~from. ~Like ~a really badly shot video ~of the, ~of the TV setup, to be honest. ~Yeah. ~

~Yeah. ~

So I have two aspects of my art. One of them is online and the other one is in person. 

~Mm-hmm. ~

~Uh, ~I am, ~I'm ~trying to keep up with both of them, ~uh, ~where ~I, honestly, being an influence, like being.~

I never wanted to be an influencer or an online person, but, I figure since that's a window, or an avenue I can take, I've been working on that. And then also I've been getting to know people, locally, through the, our galleries here and trying to see what opportunities I can either help with or I can provide my own ideas to.

Brian Prime: ~Yeah. ~Gotcha. ~Um, ~how successful has that been? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~I am surpri. ~I'm surprised by how much I've done this summer. 

~Yeah. ~Yeah. It's been a lot. ~Uh, I ha ~I have objectively been pretty [00:15:00] successful, for the amount of time I've been doing this. Seriously. But as far as, monetarily, I'm still trying to figure that out.

Sure. To make this, because I do have to make this sustainable. There's just not a lot of time, ~uh, ~when you work a full-time job, like, ~to, you have about~ for me, I had about three good hours, ~um, ~of energy that I could put into my projects after work on a good week. And you, there's just so much that goes wrong. ~There's. ~There's just not the time. There's ~not ~never enough time.

Brian Prime: Yeah. There's never enough time. ~Yeah, ~I hear you there because, ~uh, ~also working 40 hours a week and when I get home, like my creative juices are near their limit. So like, it's hard to sit down. ~I'm like, I'm gonna embed myself and whatever. ~Aside from your art. What does your future hold for you?

What else do you want to pursue besides this? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: I mean, obviously I wanna make sure ~my, uh, ~my relationship with my wife ~is, uh, ~is solid. That's what I care about the most. 

~Um, and, uh, ~everybody wants to travel, ~um, sure. ~And ~be a little more, ~be a little more worldly, like be a little more aware of.

~What's of ~the [00:16:00] world. ~They're, uh, ~they're inhabiting. 

~Mm-hmm. ~

~And, ~but ~this is, ~this is what I want to do for the rest of my life. ~I, I, ~my generation is not gonna retire. ~Yeah. Um, ~I figured I'm gonna put in the energy now to make a ~suce ~sustainable career with what I actually enjoy doing, and then I'm gonna do it until I die.

~Yeah.~ 

But my goal eventually is to make messy endeavor. ~A~ basically ~a, not so much a gallery, but ~a group of, ~uh, ~like-minded people where I have, a solid, recognizable brand that I can use to lift people up who I see that have potential and a creative drive that ~gets, ~need a little more resources and attention to what they're doing.

Basically, ~uh, ~I wanna be. Basically I'm thinking about ~my young, ~my younger self, ~and yeah. ~I wanna be like, ~you know, the, ~the big brother. ~Yeah. Or yeah, yeah. ~What we were getting on earlier. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. No, ~uh, ~that's an excellent answer. ~Uh, because, um. ~Just for me personally, like I always tell people, and ~uh, ~this is true, void signal ~to, ~to a certain extent, is made for the younger version of myself, of like, I was up late by myself and listening [00:17:00] to the radio and, you know, I would've loved to listen to something like my podcast, ~uh, ~when I was younger, just to ~like, ~hear adults have a conversation that's, and say things that are insightful or interesting or learn about people.

So, yeah, ~I can, ~I can understand your motivation there of my younger self would've loved this. Okay. ~Um, ~what is the next big milestone that you have on your horizon? Is there something coming up that you're excited about that you are working towards? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Uh, let's see. I'm. ~I obviously want to get ~my, uh, ~my stuff viewed by more people.

~Uh, ~so I'm trying to, ~I'm trying to~ find projects that I can, ~uh, ~get funded by the city, ~uh, ~and do public works. Like, we have a lot of cool Burning man art downtown. ~Mm-hmm. Uh, ~so it's more along those lines of ~have, um, ~building things that are more structurally, stable, ~uh, ~that can. Be put ~out ~outside and that can grab a lot of attention from people, ~um, ~out publicly.

Brian Prime: ~Gotcha. Um, ~did you make it out to the, ~uh, ~Western Lights Festival? ~Is that what it's called? ~I did last year. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Yeah. ~Yeah, that was cool. ~[00:18:00] So events like that, ~um, uh, ~around that time I'm working towards a different event out in Carson, ~uh, ~just only because I don't have, ~um. Uh, uh, the, ~the Western Lights Festival is held outside, ~uh, ~in the winter time.

~I~ I haven't been too confident on making something ~that will, uh, ~that will hold up, depending on the weather. ~Uh, that's Sure. Uh, that's gonna be Gotcha. Um, ~that's gonna happen at the time. So during the same time, I'm gearing towards doing something out in cars. And that's indoors, that's basically gonna be a neon golf course.

Brian Prime: Yeah. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: That's 

Brian Prime: cool. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Um, ~so ~I love, ~I love doing big projects like that. ~Um, yeah. ~This last, ~uh, a, a previous, ~something that I, ~uh, ~finished last month was an interactive art gallery exhibit. It's a rocket, it's a spaceship it control room, at the potential studio. 

~A lot of~ it's a really cool art gallery for kids and it's really cool to see them just run around and play with everything.

Brian Prime: Yeah. ~Um, that, ~tell me a little bit about that experience of you. You make these things, you put these things together with these installations that, ~you know, ~[00:19:00] produce, sound, and light and entertainment, visual stimulus. How do you feel watching people interact with it or see it for the first time? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: I try to detach, ~uh, ~my feelings from it because I try not to like look over and see the.

Something I'm trying to get better at is like, try not to be effective by the reactions of other people, because some people can enjoy it and then ~not have any, ~not show any expression. 

And I don't really expect everyone to be blown away, by what I'm making, but there's some people that really can connect with it.

Like, engineering types, kind of understand what I'm doing and how I put things together. So they were a little more impressed ~by~ by the stuff that I'm building. 

Brian Prime: ~Mm-hmm. I, on that note, ~I do have to say that ~it is, um, ~your art is something that spoke to me. Something about, CRT TVs and, I had a light bright as a kid and like, you know, glow in the dark stuff.

~Um, ~so everything that you make and have been making is like very, ~like ~up my alley. Sitting here now, like looking around your space and everything. These harnesses [00:20:00] are, dazzling and just absolutely brilliant. Tell me about how long it took you to put these, ~uh, ~you have three here so far. ~Mm-hmm.~

~Um, ~how long did it take you to put these together, 

Henry Messy Endeavor: the research and development? ~Uh, let's see. Uh, those came along. Um. ~Let's see, how did those come along? ~Uh, something that~ something that ~I've, ~I'm interested in visually is shibari. 

~Uh, and it. ~There's something about ~some, like ~the theme like female bodies, like I'm sure.

And how the ropes gets like tied around like so magically and, ~uh, ~look really decorative. ~Mm-hmm. ~So ~that~ that guided me towards basically doing that. ~But, uh, with. ~With lights, which I have a piece in here ~that, ~that is basically that. ~Yeah. ~And then that led me towards, ~uh, ~making the harnesses because I wanted to make something that can be pulled off and actually be worn by people.

~Yeah. ~

~Uh, it's an ongoing process of, ~I wouldn't say I completely figured it out yet because ~it's, ~it's a completely new ~con ~concept that I haven't seen anybody else ~really~ really perfect. 

So it did take me a really long time to, come up with the material. Luckily, ~I, ~I was able to ~find with~ find material that I can put together to make 'em.

Mm-hmm. 

But I always run into [00:21:00] issues. ~Um, ~that I'm sorting out, when it comes to structure, because people ~are, ~are gonna be, I'm expecting people to dance around with 'em and ~Sure. And ~maybe wires get caught somewhere. ~Uh, ~right. That's what I'm trying to mitigate and that's the hardest part to, the designs that I'm making.

~But, I forgot what I was getting. ~

Brian Prime: ~Uh, ~how many hours would you say that it took you ~into ~to 

Henry Messy Endeavor: too many To 

Brian Prime: even 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~to count? I, ~I don't even want to think about how many hours. 

Brian Prime: ~Okay. Fair enough. ~Everything Sake. Yeah. I was gonna say, ~um, ~you know, a thing that's wearable, like having to think about, like, making 

Henry Messy Endeavor: it resilient.

I made a, my first batch, I made about, I made about four of them. Mm-hmm. ~Uh, those, uh, ~those pieces took me about 15 hours each. And they all, ~they're, ~they all broke. Oh, wow. ~So, um, luck, luckily~ luckily it did teach me about, what I could, ~um, it, ~I was able to see the weak points in them, ~uh, ~that I was able ~to, ~to solidify and, fix that design. 

Brian Prime: Yeah, 

Henry Messy Endeavor: so it is always, ~it is ~an ongoing process of trying to find the best material ~and~ and methods, and also ~like ~learning new techniques to, ~uh, make your. ~Make your work a little more sturdy. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. And I know you said earlier that ~you, ~a lot of your inspiration [00:22:00] comes from just kind of looking around at what others are doing, especially in live venues and things like that for lighting.

~Do you, ~have there been other sources of inspiration maybe outside of that, that have, ~uh, ~spoken to you or given you an idea? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~I. I, ~I keep finding these, ~uh, YouTube I keep finding ~YouTube videos. If you could look around, if you could spend some time going through, ~um. ~Our videos, you eventually find something that maybe has like a hundred views and it's just like the most creative and beautiful thing you've ever seen.

So a lot of the stuff I make is ~iterative, ~iterative of that. 

Mm-hmm. 

Another thing is, ~uh, ~poi spinning or ~glow. ~Glow stick spinning. ~Uh, ~what you see people do a lot at raves or Burning man. 

Yeah. 

~They the, if you, um. ~If you see ~photography, long, ~long exposure photography from that, you can see some really beautiful patterns that the human body can make.

Mm-hmm. ~Uh, ~waving, ~uh, ~these lights around and the ~geome ~geometric patterns, inspire me. ~What ~inspire ~the, our the, ~the big fixtures that I make, and aside from that photography ~mm-hmm. Um, photographers have. A very, ~a good photographer knows how to, ~uh, ~take something mundane and [00:23:00] then ~make and then, uh, ~present it in a way where it looks, ~um, not other word where I.~

Sorry, I'm losing the word. No, it's okay. 

Brian Prime: ~Um, I, ~I take your meaning Yeah. Of just like ~a, ~a go to photographer and make the mundane seem spectacular. Exactly. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Exactly. ~By the way, I, ~I listened to your podcast with ~Corn ~Cornelius. Oh yeah. And he definitely has a more, ~um. Exec, ~his personality is ~a, a little more, um, he's ~a little more of a people person than I am.

Yeah. I feel like ~my, ~I'm very, ~um, ~eccentric in my mind, but I have a hard time expressing that, in person, like to other people. Sure. 

Brian Prime: I feel like that's a thing that, takes practice. And, ~uh, ~thank you for listening. First off, ~yeah, ~Cornelius is, Corey. I love that guy. ~Uh, ~I would love for you to meet him 'cause ~um, I, ~he also makes art and makes, ~um, like ~robots.

His robots stuff. ~Yeah. ~I got a robot right there. ~Yeah. Um, ~he would be about it. And at the Western Lights Festival, he was helping run, ~um, h ~shot the robot. He was driving around and stuff. But, ~yeah, I, ~I feel like being able to talk about the things that you're excited about or the things that love or interest you, I feel like that's a thing that takes practice.

You can't just [00:24:00] sit down and ~like ~be put on the spot and ~like, ~oh, lemme tell you about this thing I love and why, ~um, ~I feel like it takes a little bit of thought and consideration. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Right. That's been my challenge, especially with, ~uh, ~the online aspect of what I'm doing. Mm-hmm. Because I spend so much time, ~basically secluded, um, ~secluded away from society, gets like tinkering with my little devices and then something off popular and I wanna pursue 

Whatever opportunities that leads you, but it's. The challenge is like, ~uh, ~oh, now I have to, ~uh, now I have to, um, ~build up my skills ~to um, yeah, ~to be that kind of person. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. 'cause not only do you have to like, not only is there the requirement of like, oh, I need to know what to do. But the like, oh, I have to over overcome a portion of myself to be able to do it.

'Cause at least for me, I was always a shy wallflower of a person. Like, don't perceive me. I don't wanna talk kind of a thing. But you know, it is, I have found it to be worth it to, to overcome. ~Um, ~oh yeah. Absolutely. ~I'm gonna quickly pause 'cause I'm gonna go pee really quick, if that's cool and then we can pick this back up.~

Absolutely. ~Uh, ~I also couldn't help but notice, some of the art you have hanging on your walls, ~like ~throughout your home. ~I saw a couple of familiar painters. ~Is there [00:25:00] anyone in particular, any artist ~in particular ~that, ~like ~you feel speaks to you or has really ~like ~inspired you? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Yeah. ~Yeah. Um, ~there's this, ~uh, manga, uh, ~manga artist.

~Uh, ~his name is, ~uh, ~Rogo. ~Mm-hmm. He, ~his work is really bizarre. ~It~ there's something about repeating ~PR ~patterns for me ~that really, um, ~that really give me the brain tickles. 

~And his, um, his stuff is, can get really~ his stuff plays on repetitive ~pa ~patterns, tapestries, geometric patterns, but ~it's also, ~a lot of his stuff involves the human body and, ~uh, ~distorted in a way that can be really gory or beautiful.

Mm-hmm. 

~And it can be taboo at times. ~And he really, it seems like he really, has a lot of fun with his work and, ~uh. Does~ does some really neat drawings that are very unconventional ~to, um, ~to what's. ~Soci, um, ~you know, ~what a, ~what a gallery would hold up as being, ~uh, ~like high art. ~Sure.~ 

Brian Prime: Kind of challenges the standard 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Yeah.~

~A little bit. ~Gotcha. 

Brian Prime: ~Uh, ~would you say ~that ~that is your goal as well? 

Henry Messy Endeavor: To challenge the standard? Yeah. Yeah. Mainly I wanna make my stuff accessible. Like, I actually hate, Hmm, maybe not hate, but I, I dislike going to museums and I see. Very, like, plain, let's say black and white, like photography or, ~um, ~just [00:26:00] abstract art that you don't really understand.

~Mm-hmm. ~That, with a little note card, ~uh, ~of their description, but nobody's really around to describe what's actually, what the significance of the piece is. ~Mm-hmm. I like~ I like being able to make stuff that is just, something that you can understand right away and guess, ~that's.~

Mainly for the purpose of fun and taking you out of, your serious, mundane life for a little bit. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. I like that. I can admire you for that. ~Of~ just making a thing that's fun and entertaining just to be a fun, entertaining thing. If we get some fields or some thoughts from it, that's a bonus, right?

It's right. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: And my, I guess you can't see it ~in~ in the audio ~but my, ~the way I set up my studio, ~it's a very I, ~I like to make it very cozy and have all my art around me because that motivates me to, ~uh, ~keep going with it if I see the pieces I've already made. But also, the way your brain works is that when you enter a room, your brain is a simulation machine.

So, ~uh, ~you enter a room and it simulates, ~um, the, ~the room is basically the world for you. 

~Uh, ~[00:27:00] and I find that if you're in a space that, ~uh, ~is very creatively inspiring ~or, ~or beautiful, ~uh, ~whatever theme the room is, ~uh, ~your brain is gonna, ~uh, ~latch onto the frequency of the. Basically the vibe of, ~uh, ~the room you're in.

Brian Prime: Sure. ~In. Gotcha. ~That said, your studio space is quite cozy. ~I, ~I do like what you've got going on here. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Yeah. A lot of people have a, a lot of people in their studios have a lot of clutter or they don't have anything fun around because they don't wanna be distracted by, by anything and get straight to work.

~Uh, yeah. ~But I find, I. I basically wanna build a, I basically want the space to be a playground for me. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Because that's when you're having fun, that's when you're making your best work. ~Yeah. 

Brian Prime: ~Um, ~I can appreciate that. My own home studio for ~like ~recording and doing stuff is like, ~I, ~I try to make it look like a nightclub, you know, like it's neon mights and weird lighting that changes on its own or does whatever.

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Yeah. That's what I'm going. ~Yeah. So, I 

Brian Prime: mean, being here is like. Kind of being in my own space a little bit. ~Uh, not as elaborate as this, of course. Mm-hmm. Um, but yeah, ~hanging out in the dark with music and cool lights on, and that sounds fun. That's makes me creative at least. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Right, right. It takes [00:28:00] the press pressure off because if you see a cluttered space where with a lot of, let's say, paintings that you need to get done, ~it's ~

~mm-hmm.~

There's a lot of tension there. And ~I wanna I, ~I wanna relieve the tension for myself in the space that I work in. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. Makes sense. Well, I don't wanna keep you too long. I will hit you with the last question ~mm-hmm. Um, that I was asked, ~which is just what is something you've been enjoying recently, and your answer can be anything, book, movie, TV show, something you've just realized about yourself lately, but what's something you're jazzed about?

Henry Messy Endeavor: I knew this was coming up. ~Uh, ~I was trying really hard to plan something out. But what comes into my mind, ~uh, ~recently is, ~um. ~Religion, really? ~Uh, ~not, like the history of religion and how that impacts society, ~not, not so much. Mm-hmm. Or~ not so much, ~uh, the participation in religion.~

~Sure. ~But just, the way people feel like, ~uh, ~examining how people feel about it and ~how that~ how historically that shapes or, ~not encouraged, but~ motivated people to do certain things and 

Brian Prime: yeah. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Also the aesthetics of religion, which is also where my fixation of geometric patterns come from.

And the beauty like of old, medieval Catholic art ~uh, ~Renaissance, ~uh, ~religious paintings. [00:29:00] Yeah. Just the whole lo behind that. And yeah, the ~mystic ~mysticism. I, that's, that's what I really like to. Yeah. To explore. 

Brian Prime: That's a good answer. I'm interested in that stuff as well. ~I actually, so ~one of my core humanities classes was about ~how it was like ~the evolution of, ~um, ~heaven and hell concepts of good and evil and sort of where our morality spring from, right.

And how religion has borrowed from this and ~borrowed from ~that and shaped this thing and shaped that thing. Plus at least for me, like I always liked, ~um, ~I grew up in like the deep south, not religious myself, but around a lot of it. ~Mm-hmm. And ~I've always found religious artwork to be so grim and morbid in a way.

~Right. ~Right. But that's what I enjoy about it now. ~Yeah. Like it's, ~there's a scary element to it. ~Mm-hmm. ~Because I've been told this is a scary thing my whole life. Exactly. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Ums, ~there's something. ~Uh, that, ~that's triggered in your brain? For me, it's, with Christian, not just because our culture ~has been, is uh, is around Christian ~is mainly around Christian, ~uh, the ~theology.

~Uh, it's, ~I find that, ~like, like I said, uh, uh, Renaissance, uh, ~Renaissance Catholic paintings and, ~uh, ~work like that, it's a fast way of [00:30:00] triggering. A deep emotional response in myself and other people. 

~And that's, ~that's a feeling ~that I really, uh, ~that I really want to explore and ~I really want to ~do something with it in my art pieces in the future, 

Brian Prime: the religious aspect, ~or trying to reach someone on that level.~

Henry Messy Endeavor: Either one or, or both? Maybe both. Maybe with both. Yeah. Yeah. ~A ~as pretty as ~my, ~my work is, ~it'd be really a ~a lot of the TV sequences I do with the music. I wanna, ~my, my goal is to. ~Invoke an emotion in people. So, sadness, happiness, like you want energy. Mm-hmm. Like, let's say you wanna dance to the music, but ~I'm thinking I'm trying to think, ~I'm trying to come up with a way where I can make ~a different kind of~ a different kind of piece that invokes ~that same.~

~That if books some, ~some sort of deep emotion in people. 

Mm-hmm. 

And ~that's, that's, uh, ~that's my goal ~for, uh, ~for the future. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. ~Um, ~good goal to have. I feel like that's a goal that a lot of artists or creative people probably share with you is that like, oh, I wanna make something that touches someone, ~um, ~or moves someone in an interesting way.

Yeah, good answer. ~Uh, ~that's definitely been my goal with making a dumb little [00:31:00] podcast, but, ~uh, ~so far, so good. I always answer the question myself. The thing I've been enjoying recently, changing my mind, having someone in my life that I trust and being able to hear their viewpoint and hear their perspective and be self-aware enough to go.

They're absolutely right. I need to change my ways or change my whatever. And just realizing the error of your ways with the assistance of someone else and being like, okay, I heard loud and clear, I'm course correcting. 'Cause it feels good afterward to move on from that point. Feel like you've grown and feel like you've become a little bit better of a version of yourself, I feel like.

So I've been enjoying that a lot.

Henry Messy Endeavor: I wouldn't say it's a fun thing to do, ~but ~

Brian Prime: ~Yeah. ~Yeah. It's not the most fun thing to do. I don't like being wrong, but, 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~well, sometimes we are. And well, in a way, um, in a way, ~I can say the same ~about~ about my fixation with religion because ~I, ~I grew up religious and, ~uh, ~steered away from that.

I like the way it makes me uncomfortable, like it challenges. [00:32:00] I'm an atheist. ~I, I'll, ~I'll be an atheist for the rest of my life. Yeah, same. But ~I like the way ~I like looking into it because it challenges, ~uh, the way, um. ~The way ~I, ~I perceive ~the~ the world. 

Brian Prime: Yeah. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Or a talent. ~It challenges my core beliefs and I, there's something that I really enjoy about that.

Brian Prime: Yeah. For me, I think ~it's, ~there's an element of sort of a horror aspect to it. A little bit. Like there's a part of me, like teenage Brian is still in here very much, and like I watch something like the witch or hereditary. ~Mm-hmm. ~Or, ~um, ~religious horror of some kind. ~Um, ~or listen to, behemoth ~as like, ~as blasphemous as it gets, as they say when it comes to metal and things.

But, things like that. Then imagery, it evokes like a. Fear response a little bit. ~Mm-hmm. ~Because I grew up being ~told about, ~taught about hell as most of us are of like, there's an eternal place you're gonna go to ~a fought ~police in the sky are gonna convict you of ~mm-hmm. ~Whatever, and you're gonna go there and suffer and whatever.

That's a scary thing for a 10 year. To grapple with. Oh, yeah, yeah. I was right there with you. ~Yeah. ~So spend a [00:33:00] lot of time thinking about that. And you know, ~again, ~that comes back to like, the artwork associated with it. I just also have to point out like, little religious pamphlets. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: Mm-hmm. 

Brian Prime: Like have crazy fucking art in them.

~You know, uh, ~people being ripped into the earth and pulled, you know, by demons. And then you read crazy shit. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~Uh, we got one recently and you read it and it's, um. ~We got one recently, ~uh, ~it from a door to door person. Mm-hmm. We, ~uh, we read the, ~we read the verses that they wanted ~to~ to present to us.

And it, it's insane. Like, ~uh, ~it, I can't remember exactly what scene in the Bible, but it was, one part where God, genocided like a whole group of people. ~And then, uh, it says~ and then it ~diverged and ~says, oh, God loves you if you, yeah, if you believe in him and knows who don't, will. 

Brian Prime: ~Yeah. ~Yeah. And I mean, that's the duality that I grew up with of like, there's this God that knows everything and knows your thoughts, and this is a God with one hand drenched in blood and one in whatever else you wanna say.

~Um, ~it was always such a scary duality. But yeah, I agree. ~Uh, ~religious horror is and [00:34:00] is, affects me deeply for that reason of just growing up with it and feeling like it's because it almost feels like, ~um, ~an urban legend that everybody's into, everybody's heard of, everybody knows about, and that's how it feels at times of like everybody's afraid of this thing that may or may not exist 

Henry Messy Endeavor: ~along with the horror aspects.~

~Um. ~That's definitely something that interests me, but, something I've been thinking about a lot is the actual story of Jesus Christ. Mm-hmm. ~Um, whether he was, you know, ~whether he was a real person that actually, you know, ~um, the, ~where those events actually happened, is different from ~the, ~the way that people connect with that story ~and in a.~

To an extent that it's lasted several hundred years and people go to war, because of that story. ~Like, um, yeah. ~And whether ~you, the ~people believe in the character ~Yeah. Or~ or not that strong emotion is what ~I really want to~ I really want my art or. To say a story that connects to somebody in such a deep level where it gets blast.

Brian Prime: Yeah. 

Henry Messy Endeavor: [00:35:00] And ~a lot of people~ a lot of musicians are able to do it with their music and that's just so iconic in the last centuries, and it just really touches people at a very primal. 

Brian Prime: Sure. And I mean, I think the advantage of music too is that you can, write a lyric or write a whatever too, or say the words necessary to, have a little bit more precision.

Mm-hmm. ~Um, but I mean, in, ~in your case, working in your medium, ~you know, ~how do you take, ~um, ~CT TVs and make them express love or joy or sorrow or what have you? ~Uh, why, let me ask you that question. Just h how, ~what efforts have you made, and what experiments have you made to try and do such a thing if you have?

Henry Messy Endeavor: Well, first I have to find the right music. Sure. So if, so it starts with a love song. ~I, like I, ~I made a sequence, ~um, ~that was around cigarette cigarettes after sex, the, the band. Mm-hmm. ~Um, ~and. ~It, the, the mon, ~the montage I put together and put on the screenings is, a couple, that's glitched.

You can't see their faces because ~they're, uh, they're. ~The video is glitched out, but you can see their [00:36:00] silhouettes and it's just a couple, like falling in love and doing love. Things like walking through ~like a, ~a meadow, but it's like really glitched. ~It looks really glitchy. ~Nice. ~Uh, ~so ~you can't, you know, ~you can put yourself into the character.

Right. And in a way it's, it's, I make my work the same way. Well, I make my sequences the same way that movies are structured. Where I, I want, it's a different experience with the movies because I can have different, ~uh, ~things playing at the same time on, on different screens. Hmm. ~Uh, ~that tie into a central story that you're able to put yourself in and connect to it.

~Hmm. ~And then there's another interesting thing. Is a song that ~I put toge, a song ~I put together, ~uh, ~with, ~uh, ~news, like recent, ~uh, ~recent news clips. Going back to the political chaos that's going on right now. Yeah. And that's a different kind of, ~uh, ~feeling where it's, where I want to invoke a stress response.

'cause seeing all these news, ~uh, ~segments going ~on, ~on at the same time ~with~ on eight different TVs. Mm-hmm. But they're all synced up [00:37:00] too. Music in some kind of way. 

Brian Prime: Gotcha. 

That's awesome. Okay. That is it. ~Um, ~all right. We did it. Thank you so much. ~Yeah. ~Thank you so much for your time and for allowing me to come into your studio and see the things that you've made.

~Um, ~I certainly want you to continue pursuing your art and making stuff, 'cause I get to enjoy it as well. ~But yeah, uh, ~you definitely have. A unique vision and, ~uh, yeah. ~I'm excited to see what you end up making in the future. Me too. ~Yeah. ~Well, thank you so much.