In this episode we speak with CofC junior Francesca Gibson and Jason Coy, chair of the History Department, about the experience of bewitchment in the 15 and 1600s. Funded by a Summer Undergraduate Research with Faculty (SURF) grant, Gibson and Coy explored a time in history when people believed in and feared witchcraft. Their research closely examined this fascinating period of time through the lens of history and psychology. A time when someone, usually a woman, could be accused of witchery based on the testimony of a member of the community and then sentenced to death. Digging deep into a treasure trove of archived sources like court testimonies, the research reveals the power of the mind to cause sleep disorders, nighttime terrors and physical pain.
In this episode we speak with CofC junior Francesca Gibson and Jason Coy, chair of the History Department, about the experience of bewitchment in the 15 and 1600s. Funded by a Summer Undergraduate Research with Faculty (SURF) grant, Gibson and Coy explored a time in history when people believed in and feared witchcraft. Their research closely examined this fascinating period of time through the lens of history and psychology. A time when someone, usually a woman, could be accused of witchery based on the testimony of a member of the community and then sentenced to death. Digging deep into a treasure trove of archived sources like court testimonies, the research reveals the power of the mind to cause sleep disorders, nighttime terrors and physical pain.
Nick 00:12
Hello, Welcome to Speaking of College of Charleston. I'm Nick Plasmati from the College of Charleston Honors College. In this episode, we'll explore one of the more unique research projects currently being conducted at the college. Our guests today are Francesca Gibson, a junior in the College of Charleston Honors College double majoring in history and psychology, and Dr. Jason Coy, Professor and Chair of the college's Department of History. Francesca spent this past summer working with Dr. Coy on a research project that explores the role that dreams, nightmares and sleep disorders played, and experiences of bewitchment that took place during the witch hunts of early modern Europe. This project is fascinating. It is spellbinding and we're about to hear all about it. Francesca and Jason, welcome. And thanks for joining us. So Francesca, let's start our conversation off with a basic overview of your research topic. Tell us a little bit about what you have been working on this summer.
Francesca 01:17
Yeah, so basically, I have been looking at the early modern European witch hunts. And focusing on this period of time where up to 200,000 people were prosecuted mainly women, and up to 75,000 were executed for the crime of witchcraft in the early modern period. So we're talking 1500s and 1600s, for my project specifically. And what I'm focusing on specifically within that genre, is the experience of bewitchment. And so essentially, the experience of bewitchment involves the idea that people legitimately thought that witchcraft had power and also legitimately experienced the power of witchcraft and experienced the negative effects of bewitchment.
Nick 02:06
So for many of us our perceptions of witchcraft and bewitchment comes to us from films, spooky Halloween stories, maybe Harry Potter, but your research is looking at actual documented historical experiences of bewitchment. Correct?
Francesca 02:21
Yes, that's true. So I looked at starting in Dr. Coy's class, which we'll touch on in a second. And then over the summer, I looked at documents which basically painted a picture of people's testimonies in court. So real testimonies in court, and then also these things called the English witchcraft pamphlets, which were somewhat sensationalized accounts of what happened in the trials of that period. And it depicted different issues, especially medical medical issues, which is what I focused on of people talking about how they were in excruciating pain after they got into a disagreement with a neighbor they thought was a witch and how they were oppressed and assaulted by these nighttime terrors such as demons, or witches, or the devil even. So that's kind of what I am looking at, specifically, in my research is the idea within those documents.
Nick 03:14
Very fascinating stuff. I want to bring Jason into this conversation, because Jason, it's my understanding, and Francesca mentioned this, that the root of this resource research really took hold in a class that you taught. So I got to learn more about this witchcraft class. It was an honors class, correct?
Jason 03:31
That's right, I had an opportunity to teach an honors seminar on the witch hunts in early modern Europe. I wrote a book a couple years ago, about folk magic in witchcraft in early modern Germany. And so the class really came out of my research on on that, and I brought it out, and we had 13 Really great honor students in there, and they really engaged well with the material. And we went through a really rigorous set of readings where we were looking at recent scholarship on the witch hunts, throughout the entire period, and from the very beginning until till they ended in the 18th century. But we read these these recent works by historians alongside a lot of primary sources, documents from the period, demon illogical tracks, trial records, Confessions of convicted witches. And one of the things that really came out in the class and I think this is is something that that Francesca and I were able to explore more deeply during the surf grant, was this notion about the reality of witchcraft. That's not to say that people were flying on brooms or turning people into toads. What we mean is, people at the time really believed in witchcraft. There's there's a prejudice in in modern societies to look back at the past with a certain condescension and think that, well, they couldn't have possibly believe this because we don't. But what recent scholarship has shown is that people really live their lives in an animated universe. Magic was a part of their everyday lives. They believed in witchcraft, they feared witchcraft. A few people even used witchcraft and witchcraft was real for them. And it could have real effects harmful effects if you believed in it. And that's that's really where Francesca's work took off.
Nick 05:12
Let's talk a little bit more about that work, Francesca. So you took this honors class and something about it clearly piqued your interest. But how did you go about actually getting started with this research? What were the steps from classroom to research project.
Francesca 05:27
when I was reading these primary sources that Dr. Coy was discussing in class, I saw a clear link between these primary sources, which talks a lot about especially trial records and testimonies, I saw a lot of clear connections between my majors of psychology and history to the things that I was reading. So I saw a lot a lot of psychological impact that was had from these experiences of which meant so for example, there would be people who would experience full body distress and they could experience paralysis and even death because of psychological causes. Because basically, when someone believed that they'd been bewitched, they could become so stressed to the point where they were experiencing physiological ailments. And they would talk about how their whole body went numb because of a witch, attacking them, and that sort of thing. And that really fascinated me, especially with the notion of the reality of witchcraft, because I wanted to delve into how that can happen, and how modern day psychology which is something that historians have really shied away from using due to some issues in the later 1900s. With that, they've really shied away from using these amazing tools that can shed light on the experience of these people, and can provide us with a lot of historical empathy and historical context for what these people were experiencing and dealing with.
Nick 06:53
It's funny, you mentioned psychology, because you are both a history major and a psychology major. So I'm wondering what were some of the benefits to coming look and looking at this topic from these multiple vantage points? So are you bringing ideas from these different disciplines together and using them in the research?
Francesca 07:14
Yeah, so basically, my research combines psychology and history as far as historical and psychological scholarship. So I involve some neurobiology in my research, as well as primary sources from history. And ultimately, my research is culminating in a history paper. So it is a history research project. At the end of the day, however, I've incorporated a lot of psychological sources, which involve all peer reviewed scientific journal articles talking about specifically for my project, sleep disorders, or parasomnias. And then I've also had to use my historical research skills to delve into primary sources, which were in you know, Middle English, and having to read and understand the historiography among the different witchcraft, you know, studies, and it involved a lot of having to kind of merge those two sort of ideas and practices into one.
Jason 08:15
And from my perspective, that's one of the things that made this project really exciting when this was Francesca's idea. And when she came to me at the end of the class and said that she wanted to continue to pursue these topics through this surf grant. It was this interdisciplinarity of it that I found so interesting. And I think it's allowed her to really break some new ground because historians had looked at some of these psychosomatic effects of bewitchment. But very few had looked at the role of sleep disorders within that, and the ones that had had really only looked at sleep paralysis. And they were straight up historians, they didn't have the the background that Francesca is bringing to it, not only in terms of being a psychology major and knowing that literature, but also doing it right now, a lot of these studies were 20 years old, and a lot has been done in in the field of psychology and in medical research about sleep disorders. And so she was able to bring a lot of new insights to it that I think, you know, have really been been revealing.
Francesca 09:19
Yeah, and you see, like a lot of these sources, these historical sources, specifically focusing on sleep paralysis, they use some outmoded methods and ideologies, a lot of them focus on new Freudian concepts. So they focus a lot on sexual desire and its implications in sleep disorders, which you know, has some relevance to it, but I found that it wasn't focusing enough on neurology, and more quote, hardcore psychology. I felt like the historians could have drawn on some more scientific articles which you know, they did to some degree, but I thought there was some more there that could be delved into and we found a lot, got a really interesting information by doing that.
Nick 10:03
And you've already alluded to a little bit of this, but maybe talk a little bit more about your actual approach to this project. For those of us who aren't historians. For many of us, when we think of research, we think of lab coats and laboratories, but there's definite structure to a research process like this. Right? So how did you go about collecting this information and distilling it into the ideas that you're working with?
Francesca 10:30
Absolutely. So I actually started with a more broad thesis focusing on psychosomatic disorders in general. And I soon realized by delving into first I delved into secondary sources and secondary literature, specifically historical literature that talked about what people had already discovered and already, you know, argued and articulated in the historical narrative. And so I went based off of that, and in that context, and using, hopefully the appropriate historiographical like, measures and methods, and then I went into primary sources. And as I was going through and sifting through these primary sources, Dr. Coy, I both noticed that sleep disorders or symptoms that looked like they would be diagnosis, sleep disorders in our modern era, were super prevalent in these court documents, which was just fascinating. It wasn't just, Oh, I feel like I am super lethargic. And I have a headache because this which, you know, attacked me. But no, they were, they were issues of, oh, this witch came and visited me at night and sat on my chest and suffocated me. And that sort of depiction that was reoccurring. And so I really focused on that. And then I after I had that, so I could let the primary sources speak for themselves. I then delved into more of the scientific literature, I didn't want to cherry pick the information from the primary sources, I wanted them to speak for themselves, so that it was a more appropriate historical narrative.
Jason 11:59
But I remember when we first started meeting, and you brought your sort of preliminary findings for us to discuss we we met at a coffee shop. And by the end, we were regulars. When we came in, they knew what we wanted to order every time but but one of those early meetings, you brought up this idea of how much of this material from the 16th and 17th centuries, had to do with things that happen to people traumatic experiences were that they were having in their sleep. And I remember asking you, do you think you've got enough to carry the whole paper, because, you know, it was much broader at first, but that was one of the things we talked about the best history papers, you know, they're they have a very narrow focus. And you delve deeply into that topic, instead of just kind of skirting along the surface. And I think you were able to find and prove that that was the case that there was plenty of good material there. I mean, you know, some of the stories that you told about the experiences people had or had at the time, were really kind of chilling, and you could see how they would have driven these fears of witchcraft.
Nick 12:57
So as you're going along, there's sounds like there's very much an element of surprise and discovery in the research process, maybe talk a little bit about anything that you weren't expecting that you discovered.
Francesca 13:10
So one of the first things that I found that Dr. Coy actually pointed out was when researching sleep in the early modern period, you have to note that people didn't sleep, how we sleep in the modern area, people slept in this pattern called biphasic sleep. And this is a more recent historical finding that people had essentially, at the time I'm looking at, they would sleep in increments about about three to four hours, wake up in the middle of the night, and then go back to sleep for another three to four hours, which is very different. But if you think about it, it came in cases of insomnia. And there are some scientific literature that points to insomnia being a remnant of this sort of biphasic sleep pattern. So that was fascinating. And that also was really interesting, because once I started looking at the general prevalence of these sleep disorders, I started noticing a pattern of sleep quality and sleep deprivation and insomnia being factors that at least were correlated with having more episodes or more intense episodes of sleep disorders, and some even were legitimate finding, and they managed to not just find a correlational relationship, but in actual causational relationship. So that was fascinating.
Nick 14:25
Jason, I'm wondering if you could give us a little bit of context about this specific project, what is so important about Francesca's research? How does it fit into the broader scholarship surrounding bewitchment research?
Jason 14:40
Well, I think there are a few things that are really important and even pathbreaking about Francesca's research. One thing is, she totally convinced me that sleep and experiences that people had during the night were extremely important in how they experienced it. Being the witch, but also in driving the witch hunts themselves. I mean, in some of the in many of the cases that she cases that she talks about in her study, you can see where people are, they might suspect a neighbor of having the witch then they might say, My child is ill, or my livestock suffering, or I myself, you know, I'm having some kind of health problem because I have a dispute with someone in the village that I suspect of maybe being a witch or having used witchcraft against me, when they show up in court, one of the ways that they're proving that these people are really witches, and if really harm them is to say, well, I know she's a witch, because in my sleep two nights ago, I awoke and the witch was in my bed chamber. Or sometimes they describe it as some terrifying black thing where thing like a dog was at the foot of my bed, and I knew that it was the familiar of this witch. So when they get into court, they're using this testimony that comes that, you know, we would dismiss as just a nightmare, it had great significance for them. And I think that's something that Francesca by approaching it on its own terms by not not not approaching it as strictly a skeptical, modern person and saying, well, that's just superstition, but really taking their testimony Seriously, she was able to really help us to understand what these people were experiencing, what they were going through and what it meant for them.
Francesca 16:20
And the interesting thing, too, is that these different experiences at night, they didn't necessarily just interpret them as nightmares. So even in modern psychological findings, issues such as sleep paralysis, and these other sorts of hallucinations, which I won't delve into too much as far as defining, but they are experienced as being real. So people believe that what they've experienced is real. And so even modern people will sometimes experienced an episode of sleep paralysis, and they'll think someone had actually broken into their home and attacked them. And so you can see how these episodes would be completely confirming to these people, their own fears, their own worst fears, and exacerbating these fears, and therefore fueling these witchcraft beliefs and worries,
Jason 17:07
well, that ties into what you found about the way that people populate their nightmares with things that they are afraid of, in their own experience in their own culture. And that changes in different times and places.
Francesca 17:19
there was one study that basically talked about how these Cambodian refugees, they saw in these episodes of sleep paralysis, and these nocturnal hallucinations, they saw their intruder and their assailant as having Khmer Rouge uniforms, which just speaks to the level of detail that can occur during these episodes. And also the amount of cultural and individual trauma and fears that play into these episodes.
Jason 17:49
And you put yourself in the shoes of someone in the 16th or 17th century, living in some village, totally terrified of a neighbor that they think is a witch, in a in a society that believes that the devil is a real physical presence and that witches are out to destroy their neighbors. That would be the image of what you'd see in your sleep. And it would be as you pointed out, Francesca, you know, a really strong confirmation of guilt.
Nick 18:14
Yeah. So truly some very fascinating discoveries. And so I guess my next question is, what's next? Where do you go from here? Where do you take your initial findings? And how do you share this with the world at large.
Francesca 18:30
So first of all, we as a part of the surf grant process, we get to present at the CoFC Expo, which is a poster session devoted to student research, which is awesome, that happens in the spring. And we also have a phi alpha theta, which is the historical Honor Society, they are presenting a conference here. And I'm hoping to be able to present at that. And I'm also hoping to submit my paper and edit my paper a lot to get it into, hopefully, some history, undergrad journals, which include such names as Columbia, and Michigan, and Virginia Tech, which just shows that these things, these opportunities are out there. If you go and search for them. You can hopefully hopefully, it'll get published, fingers crossed, but don't want to speak too soon. But you can go out there and find these opportunities and places to present your research.
Nick 19:27
So there are chances for you to get undergraduate research published. I mean, that sounds like a pretty substantive accomplishment.
Jason 19:36
Absolutely. And again, one of the things that I've really been impressed with while I've been working with Francesca, is that kind of what a self starter she is because I found one undergraduate journal that I thought would be good. And then she came back with an email a day later and said, Here, I found five more. And you know, like, like she mentioned, they're at some of the top universities in the country and I think for someone like Francesca, who, you know at this point is thinking about applying to doctoral programs in this case in history, these experiences of being able to have this grant on on your resume when you when you apply the possibility of presenting at a conference like the file for theta, National Honor Society Conference, and particularly publishing something in a peer reviewed journal, as an undergraduate just really would give her a leg up. So it's, that's something great about the SURF grants, I think.
Nick 20:29
So you've picked up it sounds like quite a few tangible skills and experiences throughout this process.
Francesca 20:34
Absolutely. I have developed a lot of research skills, both for my actual academic research and also for researching the process of actually getting this research out into the world, which has been amazing.
Nick 20:48
Now you've both mentioned the word serve a few times, and I would be remiss if we didn't explain for our listeners. So serve stands for summer undergraduate research with faculty. And these are quite substantive grants that are administered by the College of Charleston's Office of Undergraduate Research and Creative Activities, or URKA, as we affectionately call it around the office. Now your research project was supported by this surf grant, correct? And so you had to apply. It's a competitive process. And it's a pretty arduous process. But there are quite a number of benefits both to going through the application, and also to having the support itself. So if I were a student who is considering getting into research, why should I apply for a surf grant? what are maybe some tips you could share? And what were the benefits that you found to the whole process?
Francesca 21:42
So first of all, I have to say that even the application process for the surf is helpful, it is a long process. So I would advise not waiting until the last minute to do it, identify the faculty member you'd like to work with, see if they're open to working with you, which most of the time, I think they probably wouldn't be. And then making sure you get on top of that and put a lot of effort into your actual application. Because it gives you a experience that goes beyond simply just applying for serve, like serve grants at the college level, it goes into academic grants, both at the college level other ones, and then also in career goals later on applying for a grant and applying for anything in general is a valuable skill to have. And so that in itself is a really valuable experience. And then serve also helped me realize that research is a viable career, I could take what I'm doing and actually turn it into a job. Because before I saw it as kind of a class, activity research was more Oh, this can be a fun hobby. I like to look things up and see what's going on in the world. But this made me realize I didn't have to just go do a nanny job like I did in high school, I could actually try to get a grant. And if you get a grant, then your sight with the summer. It's amazing.
Nick 23:03
Jason, how about from the faculty side of things? What is it like to help advise and mentor and support students in projects like Francesca?
Jason 23:11
like it was a really exciting opportunity. I mean, this gives faculty the chance to work with some of the best students on campus. And I'm really kind of proud of the fact that we came up with this topic together. You know, this was not something where I said, you know, something I've always been curious about is x Francesca, why don't you go study that she came to me with the idea to do a serve grant, she came to me with the idea of what we would be exploring, I was really in the position of just knowing the field a little bit, knowing the literature was out that was out there, helping her find the primary sources she would need. But then that process of narrowing down the topic, doing the research, you know, a lot of that we collaborated on. And then she wrote this fabulous paper. And it was we were meeting every single week, and just going through different drafts and different different versions of it and, and tweaking it and making it better. And I'm really proud of the way that it turned out. And I think that the sciences have been very, very successful in getting these kinds of research grants on campus. And they do a wonderful job and biology and chemistry and things like that, but they don't get as many applicants from students in in my neck of the woods, you know, in humanities and social sciences. So I think it's a really great thing for faculty in our school or schools like ours, to encourage students to get involved in and take advantage of this as well.
Nick 24:30
So before we wrap things up any final words of wisdom for students who might be interested in getting involved in research in the humanities, in history in psychology, something within that realm?
Francesca 24:43
Honestly, I would just say that research seems daunting, especially like Dr. Coy was saying, in a humanities field, where in science you often have the professor who's kind of helping guide you through the process, and it's normally more more lab based. So the professor can be like, Oh, here's how you do This, this is a more of an exact science, history research English research, political science, that sort of field, it's a lot more kind of in the unknown. And so it's hard to really figure out what that means. And don't let that scare you. Because it gives you a lot of cool opportunities to actually figure out what it means for you. Because as cheesy as that sounds, research is kind of what you make it and you have the ability and the awesome flexibility to ask questions that you're actually curious about, and I recommend that everyone apply, but especially humanities majors, definitely consider doing that and don't be afraid of it.
Nick 25:39
Francesca, Jason, thank you so much for joining us and sharing this wonderfully fascinating research. We wish you all the best as you move forward with it in the future. Thank you. Thank you for listening to speaking of College of Charleston, with today's guests, Francesca Gibson, and Jason Coy. For more episodes, and to read stories about our guests, visit the College of Charleston official news site the collegetoday@today.cofc.edu. You can also find this and other episodes on all major podcast platforms, including Apple podcast, Spotify and Stitcher. If you like what you hear, please subscribe and leave us a review. This episode was produced by Amy Stockwell from university communications with recording and sound engineering by Jessie Kunz from the Division of Information Technology. Thanks for tuning in. Please join us next time