Becoming Undeniable feat. Efen Thao

Join us on the latest episode of Lead. Empower. Grow. as we sit down with Efen Thao, a former law enforcement officer from Alaska who made a dramatic career pivot to become a successful business builder in financial services.

Efen shares his unique journey and the common thread of protection that runs through both of his careers. From sharing the challenges he faced in law enforcement to explaining how he helps secure the financial futures of families, Efen’s story is one of resilience, learning and empowerment.

Tune in to discover how Efen found his path to becoming someone's superhero in unexpected ways.

To connect with a First Financial Security agent about entrepreneurship opportunities or products and policies, visit our website.

Transcript

You're listening to Lead. Empower. Grow.

A podcast featuring entrepreneurs who lead productive teams, empower their communities, and grow successful businesses of their own. Today's episode features another young business builder, Efen Thao, who has an incredible story of going from law enforcement in Alaska, of all places, flying around to different townships, to finding his way to First Financial Security as a life insurance agent. And we talk about the connective tissue, the through line that runs from protecting people as a law enforcement agent and protecting people's future and families as an insurance agent, something that may not seem as glamorous in a Hollywood sense, but essentially does the exact same job.

He also had some great moments of wisdom. We talk about learning to love to fail and how that will lead you to success, and how the market doesn't discriminate, and how to make yourself undeniable, in his words. It's a great talk, can't wait for you to hear it, so let's just dive right in.

Thank you so much, Efen, for coming on the podcast. I like to start with my agents. What did you do before FFS?

How did you find First Financial Security? Were you in the business, the industry, or what were you up to before you found us?

Again, Jeffrey, thank you for having me on here. Appreciate you guys giving the time for us. You know, before joining First Financial Security, I worked as a law enforcement officer up in the state of Alaska.

Whoa. Whoa. That's a cool story.

Well, yeah, you're my first Alaskan, first one who's ever touched way up there.

So what I did was actually I had the privilege to work with different agencies up there. Up in Alaska, there's small little villages around Alaska that you can fly to. And, you know, everything up there, the law enforcement officer, they're more as the whole states in different areas.

A lot of the law enforcement officer, basically a really big family up there.

Yeah, I can imagine. Yeah. Are there a lot?

I mean, it's a big state, obviously, but not a lot of people. So I wonder how big the force is. Yeah.

It sounds like you're flying around to the tiny places. So what's that?

No, you're definitely correct. So I know in Anchorage, it's not, you know, there's Anchorage Police Department. There's the University of Alaska, the police department.

And I mean, you think about it, there's probably about 300,000 people, just in Anchorage, but covering about 300,000 people, maybe about 30 people that covers that much. There are 30 law enforcement officers that covers that much. So you would think about it.

There's not a lot, but the people up there are very nice, and they're very law enforcement oriented.

Yeah, that's what I figured. I was like, it seems like they're pretty chill. No pun intended.

It seemed like they'd be relaxed. I don't know yet. To live up there, you probably have to have your own vibe.

You would take care of yourself.

Oh, yeah. I mean, everybody go up there and they talk about the nature and the salmon, and the moose, and the caribous, and the train. And it is exactly what people talk about.

Alaska is just a whole new world. And you can be walking, and you can look maybe about 30, 40 miles away, and it's a whole new world over there because maybe it's raining on that side over there.

That's awesome. Yeah. It's so big.

And aren't days longer and nights longer up there? Are you that far north? How does it affect those?

So Anchorage isn't as far north, but going up to Fairbank, that's a little bit far farther north up there. Anchorage itself, even though you're not all the way up north, you still get those more nights. When I first went up there, it was more like, let's see here, it will be 11 p.m.

and the sun will still be up, and you know that you got school the next day, but you don't realize that it's 11 p.m.

That's crazy. Yeah, wow. Almost goes down a bar and it's still like sun's out.

Like, you're like, whoa, it's almost midnight. Oh, yeah.

I've had plenty of those days, but I was a law enforcement up there, and I loved it up there. But the law enforcement has always been my dream job, and I'll tell you that. I grew up in Los Angeles, and I always thought law enforcement officers are superheroes when I was young.

And when I got into the field, I really thought, and I knew that I couldn't save everyone, but I knew that one day I can be somebody's superhero, and that's why I did it. But getting into that and then looking into... I actually got introduced into First Financial Security through my mom, actually.

And growing up, my mom was the... she was a single mom for a long time, and in everything she say, she was doing it for us, and we knew that. And even at the age of 21, 22, sometimes we think that we know more than our parents at that age.

I was there.

And I was the same. I got out of the... I got right into law enforcement in 2015, and in 2015, I joined First Financial Security just to help her out.

Yeah, on the side, like a starting part-time.

Yeah. I mean, I wasn't even doing part-time. I was just, hey, you know what?

Why not?

Be part of the team.

And so I started with her. In 2015, 2016, 2017, I did the law enforcement thing, and then I really, really looked back at how much I've done in such a short time in the law enforcement field. I mean, I was very successful in there, and it was at that point of my life where I said, there's probably more out there than this.

And so I kind of digged into, in 2018, I dig more into First Financial Security and came to love the company and learn more and see the world a little differently.

Yeah, when you describe superheroes, law enforcement, that is kind of what everyone I interview revolves around with First Financial Security, even though it sounds absolutely crazy to say insurance agents would be superheroes. But at least I would seem crazy before I got into the mic. But after interviewing so many people, I mean, that is just as effective a way to save.

It isn't glamorous like the movies, but it is absolutely saving families and protecting them just the same way. It seems like it translates in a way I never would have thought it would. Did your mom stay in Los Angeles, or did you all move to Los Angeles?

Yeah, so we were in Los Angeles in 2010, and we actually moved out of Los Angeles because of the recession.

2007, 2008 really hit hard, and it became very difficult to live in a place that you don't have family. There's no other family except for your mom.

Yep, and already a pretty expensive city, very expensive.

Yeah, it's already expensive, and it's not getting any cheaper. During that time, people were being laid off, left and right. And so it was a big move for us to go to somewhere else, especially Alaska.

We didn't know anything about it. All we knew was that family was up there.

Good. Okay, good. Yes.

Yeah, that's important. You're right, following the people who can support you and support each other. That's awesome.

You said you wanted to broaden your horizons. Was it just that natural? Did you kind of like, was it, was law enforcement, did it tire you out?

Was it too hard or was it more just like, I'm just like getting, like, want to explore other things? Kind of the way you talk about it, it sounds like a very calm transition. But when did you kind of like step into doing First Financial full time?

I know you gave us a year, but what was that like? Was it kind of like a one day drop at all or?

Well, I went to, you know, if it was a one day drop at all, then I probably would have done it a lot faster. But, you know, the transition to law enforcement, to the first financial side, it wasn't, it was difficult, but it wasn't, it was an easy decision to as well. And the reason why I say that is because me, I've always, I've always been that person.

I love the adrenaline.

I love the, yeah.

And I, it's, I've always been that person. Be a little bit more risky and see what you can do and how far I can take it. And to me, law enforcement is, it's a hard job.

It's a difficult job to do. And to be in that kind of position, you have to know how to talk, communicate, and understand everybody in a little different way.

Yeah.

And the only thing that I come up to about was business. Business is, it's right around the same alley. I mean, of course, it's a lot more safer physically.

But financially, it's a whole different ballpark there.

Yeah. Yeah. The adrenaline comes from the going out in your own, building your own.

Entrepreneurship has been a high-stakes game always. Yeah.

And so like they say, you basically have a good-paying job that's paying you maybe $80,000, $90,000 a year. And you just leave it and go to a place that a different position that is not paying you anything, but you still have to work 24-7.

Yeah, exactly. Like the ceiling's higher, but the floor is also way lower down to like, well, you could make nothing if we're not doing it right, if we're not doing anything.

Yeah. So, you know, and so that's what really caught me was that I've always been a person to take on challenges. That was very, almost impossible or difficult task to do.

And I want to, you know, hopefully achieve it in a different way or a better way than most people that had came through before me.

Yeah. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah.

So you saw the challenges and that was almost like the motivation. Like the challenge was what spurred you on. It sounds like it's like I can conquer that.

And you had it. Well, your mom, she was in it. So you had like to see something, you know, kind of how to start it in a way, you know, versus like if you had absolutely nobody in the family who had done it before.

Well, that's that's one of the biggest motivation I think for me was seeing that somebody. So my mom is an immigrant from Laos and seeing somebody coming from Laos, not going to high middle school, high school, no other education. And us being born and raised in America and take things for granted is like, OK, well, somebody right next to me, you know, my own parent can make crazy amount of money that you that people in this world rarely see.

Yeah.

You know, and for us to go to, you know, go get our bachelors, master degrees, which I say school is, I'm not saying that school is not good, but I think if you're going for a career that you're going to need those degrees, definitely do. But I was just saying that it's, you never think in your mind that all you have to do is do the work in those kind of field, and you can be successful, more successful than most people in this world.

Yeah, when we talk about, we talk about that kind of stuff a lot in the pod, and it's not like we're ever talking down to school, it's more like it, the way it's sold here. And, you know, in the past generations, it's not, it's sold as if it's for everyone, when in reality, like not every nothing in the world is for every single person, you know, like, we all should decide our own way. Yeah, yeah, school itself, ideally, you know, would be like, for the people who really want to learn, but it's kind of been sold for the people want to get rich too.

And it's like, well, not necessarily, you know, there are other ways to do that.

Yeah, I mean, like, I tell you this, I still have, I still like, I went to school for law enforcement and, you know, criminal justice and things like that. And, I mean, I paid for college loans and, you know, student loans and things like that. And when, after being able to do that and, you know, making what we thought, what I think, what I thought was great money, coming to compare or compete against, you know, even my own mom, it's like, I'm just a little cub still.

You're gonna learn the process, because, you know, and when we think that, well, we're not humble, and we think that we know more than you, because we went to school or things like that, it's, you know, they bring you back down to reality and say, you know what, you have to be humble and you have to learn from other people still.

Yeah, particularly immigrant stories like Corona in years where, yeah, it's complete, absolute, adventurous, but scary and struggling change to be across the notion, but also, yeah, no education or anything, but to achieve true success just by completely your own. That's it. You know, impressive.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know, there's always, I mean, when we talk about challenges in the business or just challenges in life while doing those things, one of the biggest challenge, I tell you that when I first started First Financial, was you worried about other people's perspective of you. And their opinions, so much that you built this fear in the back of your head, I was thinking that they're thinking of me somehow, someway, even though they don't see me. And I think, when I first started First Financial Security, that was probably one of the biggest things that affects the individual when they first start.

It's like it's, and you know, it's it, but it's, again, part of, it's part of it. You need that, too, you know?

Yeah.

You need to feel that.

Yeah. Yeah, I know what you mean. Yeah.

Yeah, it's a big part of, like, it's hard to train people or help them overcome fear, but it is half the battle, if not just so much of the business is, you know, learning to bounce back from rejection, the resilience, because it's hard. You know, you're just, you're out there selling, but you're also, you know, delivering a message that people may have the wrong idea about or don't know anything at all about. So you're facing rejection, but you're also, yeah, it's your every single person is deep, deep down has something where it's like, what are they thinking about me?

Oh, yeah, yeah, I think that I think when you're first starting, that's that's one of the biggest challenges, because, you know, like I said, you're you're you were a part of a very successful career in your, you know, in your career job, the transition. And then, you know, everybody in career jobs is, oh, why are you going to leave a, you know, a $90,000, $100,000 paying job to go chase after something that it's only hope? Yeah, you know, and it's only a dream.

And it's it's it's still very far away from you or something like that. But when you are born, I feel like when you are born different and different as in good and you know that you can take the challenges, you can take it. You want to go out there and either prove them wrong or either prove yourself that you can do it.

And yeah, yeah. Yeah. And so in that, like, you know, just just knowing that, hey, you know what?

You proven so many people that doubted you wrong or, you know, you you thought you fought those challenges. And one thing I'll say this, that the challenges from failing, what I learned to do was love to fail. I love.

Yeah, I tell you this. I love to fail because it just makes me a better person. But not just that, but be a better student to a to a new teacher coming to teach.

Yeah. It puts into words something that like we hit often, whichis like you have to love to fail because you're going to do it. If you go too long without failing, and unless you have like keep your really keep your wits about you, if you just like never fail, then the first time you do, it's going to be completely new thing.

And you're just going to pop the balloon. It's just going to be wouldn't know how to deal with it at all. Yeah.

But loving to fail is knowing it's the law of averages thing. Yeah. Because being good at failing means also you're going to try just as much and get just as many successes.

You know. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. And I think when you're first starting, if you're not learning that quick enough, eventually what a lot of people do is they start. Because, you know, I mean, whenever you say, for instance, somebody is going to pinch you, typically what we'd like to do is we like to pull back, go away from.

But what if, you know, what if I tell you that, you know, you let that person pinch you and you let that person continuously pinch you? Eventually, you wouldn't feel anything more. You would you wouldn't feel it would be a part of you.

And so so that's why when if you can learn fast about the challenges that you're facing and the fears that are coming and play them in your mind, like it's already happening to you a thousand times, then it becomes easier for you in life and easier for you in the business. It's because you basically have skin in the game.

Yeah. Yeah, that's great. It's almost like it makes me think, yeah, so you're out in the world.

Everyone's pinching you, even if it's not just the same person. And if you learn to not be afraid of the pinch, then like eventually you come along. One person doesn't pinch you in their hand is like a hundred dollar bill.

You know, like, and that's why every once in a while there's that guy.

Yeah, every once in a while there's somebody there, you know, and maybe they might have been paid to pinch you, you know.

Yeah, exactly. I know. Yeah.

Do you have a story? Do you remember when it first did click, like the first person who did have that hundred dollar bill? But in this case, it would be the first person, like your first big sale or maybe your first person you really helped.

Is there any, do you remember any huge like, sounds like you loved, you learned to love to fail early. But like, do you remember the first success or one of the first big, bright spots? Are there any stories like that?

Oh, yeah. No, I can never forget my first big success. It's a story that it's, I love to tell people because in your whole entire life, you never think or you never know what's going to happen tomorrow, the next day or the next day.

Yeah.

But what you can do is you can do a lot of preparation and preparing.

Yeah.

So I had a client that was that he was looking, you know, he's been working at a job for about 34 years. He had a good retirement plan. He still had to work for a couple of more years before he can fully retire and, you know, get all his Social Security money and things like that.

But he had a huge lump sum of money somewhere that I decided, hey, you know what, present something that might be a very good value for him, especially during this time. And so we were able to move a lump sum of his money into an account that he can't lose money inside. And so what we did was we did a rollover into a different account.

And when he, when I want to say 2020 or 2021, when COVID really hit and a lot of people really lost money during that time, he actually gained enough money, didn't lose any money in there, and he became so thankful. And of course, for him rolling his money, I mean, it was a very good, I mean, the commission was great. Well, one of the biggest thing was that he introduced me to a lot of his families, friends, and we started becoming very close friends.

He wanted to learn more about, Ethan, how did you know that these stuff happens when people lose money? Why aren't people doing it more? And those kind of questions.

And so I said, there are, it's a history thing because it's happened before, and people have wrote books saying that, you know what? These stuff happens, and how do you prepare for it? But all you have to do is read.

Because the more you know, the more you know is the more you'll be, you'll have an advantage over a lot of things. So I gave him a couple of the books that I've read that I love. I mean, you know Shirley Lu, right?

I've given him that book, The Power of Zero. I've given him that book. I gave him a couple of different books for him and his wife and his family to read.

And so it's been about three years now, and he's been continuously asking, hey, what's the next book I should read? And so I do that with some of my clients, and they love it so much that we've become families. That's one of the biggest success that I've ever had.

Yeah. Your little life-changing library. Yeah.

But you're right. I mean, that's part of our mission is, with financial literacy, how it is in America and in the world. We're not necessarily in schools.

A lot of places, his question, the answer to his question, like, how do you know? It's like, well, someone has to tell you. You have to find it.

It's almost like a little miracle, but we want to make sure it doesn't go up to chance. We want to spread the wealth, spread the knowledge, and in turn, that does spread the wealth.

And yeah, and the best customer, the referrals come from just helping. The commission, like you said, is good, but it's the help. When you do put help first, feed good into the world, it'll come back to you kind of thing.

And I like that story because a lot of people talk about death benefit, which is absolutely so saving, so life saving, but we never really want to have to encounter, even though we will, someone who had found death in their family and then be delivering the check. I like the rollover story because it's a nice, it's a different side. And also something that happens a lot, helping people with their retirement money, too, is a big part of what we do.

Oh, definitely. I think like now, I think more than ever, people need to, especially if you're at that age of a baby boomer, you definitely need to consider something because your money will continue. It's not going to, I mean, you can't add any more debt on top of that.

And you are retired. Are you going to continuously work until you're 70, 80 to fill up that gap? That's one of the biggest things.

And when we see, when I see that, I say, what are we doing? We should be out there providing these different kinds of benefits to the individuals that are affecting them right now. Because, I mean, as we're still young, being at this age of 30, I can still go out there and work.

I mean, work like crazy. But when you are at the age of retirement and you're looking to settle down, but somebody outside of your circle said you cannot do it. You cannot settle down.

It's because we, because inflation. Then that becomes so difficult for a person to retire.

Yeah, I know. Yeah, it's and that's some of the worst news. And I don't know.

Yeah, even if even for those who there are some out there who love their job, they want to keep working forever. But, you know, there's just then there comes to like the unknown, the illness, injury, God forbid. You know, but yeah, yeah.

If you want to, sometimes, you know, you can't work forever. Everyone needs that. Everyone does retirement planning.

Yeah, this vehicle, this body that we have only goes for so long.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel like something you might have learned early with the law enforcement release encountered, even if it's not like dangerous, which when you're not, you ran into that just like being so active. I remember when I started running, I was like, oh, this meat bag.

After his dream destination, I'm right there with you. Too much food.

A lot of, you know, a lot of agents, us, we come into this field, not really fully understanding what it is, but we come into this field because there's an interesting thing that happened to somebody or something intrigue, or we met somebody that were like, wow, they are very, very successful. But I think one of the biggest thing is that when I first started being a young person, when I first started, let me see here, I was 20, 24 or 25 around there. And, you know, being young at that age, we question ourselves saying, are we too young to know or to know these things?

Or are we too young for those people that actually do have money to see us? And a lot of, you know, to see us, the young generation, knowing this knowledge. But one thing I did was I learned and I read and I learned from different people within the company, within First Financial, not even just First Financial, but within other companies.

Yeah.

You know, learn from them. And once I became knowledgeable and can compete, I became one of those people that other people cannot deny when I talk to them. They cannot deny me anymore.

There we go. Yeah.

And so I think that once you become that individual where the market, because the market doesn't discriminate, but the market cannot deny you too. Because when you become undeniable, then you become, you know, you become one of the players in the game.

You were talking earlier about, yeah, we go through a young, a youth where it's like, we do feel like, not maybe, maybe we don't think we know everything, but you kind of feel like, you know, I have the confidence of youth, but then I feel like around 24, 25, you start being like, or once you get out in the world and you run into people who don't trust you or don't think you know what you're talking about, then you're like, well, what do I know? But then, like, you double down, you learn, like you said, and then the knowledge gives you the confidence, gives you that foundation. And then, like you said, it's undeniable.

Yeah, you can go in and you know what you know, so they can't counter anything, you know? It's like, test me, shoot it, you know? Yeah.

You know, and even like we say, like, even if the next person, they know more about you, you have to fail because that person is teaching you something.

Yeah, that's, goes right back to the love of failure. Yeah, you're right. Yeah.

If you go in there and they do present something you don't know, then that's something you learn.

Yeah, that's something you learn.

Yeah, you pick it up. That's great. Well, one of my last questions is, what goals you have over the next year?

Like, what are you shooting at? Looks like you have two DDCs under your belt, if not more, if I'm not mistaken.

Yeah, I do have two DDCs under my belt. You know, I recently moved to North Carolina, and I want to, which I'm loving it, because the weather is nice. I think the weather is nice.

I feel better in North Carolina, but I think, you know, for my next goal, of course, is always to make more than what I made last year.

But it's important to say. It is.

I think the money is good. I think, you know, my next goal is to reach people more that are needing the help and building a bigger community around that area of North Carolina.

That's great. A great goal. Yeah.

Extending your reach or putting down roots and just building, impacting your new community. Really, that's what it is. Yeah, that's good.

Well, I can't wait to see what kind of team you grow there or, you know, if you project team or just what kind of protection you're going to bring there. I love North Carolina too. It's beautiful too.

It's a big state, but a lot of those mountains. Yeah, I can't wait to see where you're going to go. And thank you, Efen, for being on the podcast.

And thank you all for listening. To hear more stories from entrepreneurs and business builders like Efen, you can listen through our past episodes on our feed or at firstfinancialsecurity.com. And of course, subscribe or follow wherever you get your podcasts to listen to new Lead.

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