Ep.199 Stop Shrinking in Midlife: Reclaim Your Voice, Body & Confidence | Angela Burk

If you’ve ever asked yourself, “Is this all there is?”—this episode is for you.

In this powerful conversation, Michele sits down with Angela Burk, author of The Real Girl’s Guide to Midlife, to unpack what’s really happening during midlife—and why it’s not a crisis, but a turning point.

From hormonal shifts and identity loss to reclaiming your voice, your body, and your desires, Angela shares a refreshingly honest take on what it means to evolve in your 40s, 50s, and beyond.

This episode dives into the emotional, physical, and psychological changes women experience—and how to stop shrinking, stop apologizing, and start living with intention.

You’ll learn:

• Why midlife feels chaotic (and why that’s completely normal)
• The connection between hormones, mood, and identity shifts
• How to stop people-pleasing and start setting boundaries
• Why strength—physical and emotional—is the foundation of longevity
• How to let go of who you were and step into who you’re becoming
• Simple ways to reclaim your voice, energy, and confidence

This isn’t about chasing your 30-year-old body.
 It’s about building the life your 80-year-old self will thank you for becoming.

👉 If this episode resonates, share it with a friend who needs to hear it. We’re not meant to figure this out alone.

You can find Angela Burk's book, The Real Girls Guide to Midlife, on Amazon and other booksellers.

https://www.realgirlsguide55.com/

https://www.instagram.com/realgirlsguide55/

_________________________________________
If you’re doing “all the right things” and still feel stuck, adding a layer of support may be an option. I’ve partnered with a trusted telehealth platform offering modern solutions for women in midlife—including micro-dosed GLP-1 and other peptide therapies.

https://elliemd.com/michelefolan - Create a free account to view all products.

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Transcripts are created with AI and may not be perfectly accurate.

Disclaimer: This podcast is for general informational purposes only and does not constitute the practice of medicine, nursing, or other professional healthcare services. It is not a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your qualified healthcare provider with any questions regarding a medical condition.

Transcript

Medical Disclaimer And Peptides Primer

Michele Folan 0:00

The information shared on this podcast is for educational purposes only and should not be considered medical advice. Please consult a qualified healthcare professional regarding your individual health needs. Let's talk about peptides because they're not just GLP ones. Your body actually makes peptides naturally. They're messengers that help regulate things like fat metabolism, muscle growth, skin health, recovery, and energy. But here's the truth: just like hormones, collagen, and muscle, peptide production declines as we age, especially postmenopause. So if you're feeling stuck, belly fat that won't budge, slower recovery, low energy, or skin that just isn't bouncing back like it used to, this might be a missing piece. And no, this isn't about shortcuts. Lifestyle still comes first. Strength training, protein, sleep, stress management, always. But peptides can be a smart layer on top of that foundation. Not interested in a GLP1? Totally fine. There are other options that support fat metabolism, recovery, cognitive function, and healthy aging. The key is quality and working with a trusted medical provider. That's why I've partnered with LEMD to bring you clinically guided, personalized peptide options that actually make sense for midlife women. And if you're curious, check the link in the show notes and learn what might be right for you. Health, wellness, fitness, and everything in between, we're removing the taboo from what really matters in midlife. If you've reached your 50s or 60s, and life feels quieter than you imagined, the kids are grown, the calendar isn't as chaotic, work life feels routine, and somewhere in the back of your mind, a little voice is asking, Is this all there is? I saw something last week that stopped me. It suggested taking a moment to imagine your 80-year-old self looking back at you right now and asking her, What do you wish I'd been brave enough to do? What risk should I take? Which dreams are still worth chasing? That hit me really hard because midlife isn't the closing chapter. It's the editing phase, it's the revision, it's where we decide whether we're going to shrink or expand. And that's exactly why I'm so excited for today's conversation. Angela Burke, author of The Real Girl's Guide to Midlife, isn't talking about crisis. She's talking about awakening, about chaos, about personality reboots and grieving who you were and choosing who you're becoming. This isn't about chasing your 30-year-old body. It's about building the woman your 80-year-old self will thank you for becoming. Angela Burke, welcome to Asking for a Friend.

Angela Burk 3:12

Thank you so much for having me. What an introduction.

A Career Identity And A Buried Book

Michele Folan 3:14

Well, thank you. Thanks. I I really was looking forward to this conversation for a lot of reasons. But last week, when I saw that quote about imagining you being your 80-year-old self, it really hit home because what does that 80-year-old person really wish we were doing at this phase of life? So good, good segue into this conversation, I think. And I want to talk about you a little bit before your wonderful book, The Real Girl's Guide to Midlife. Who were you professionally and what were you building then?

Angela Burk 3:56

Yeah. It's a really um good question. So professionally, I had spent 30 years in high-tech marketing. Um, I worked for a really long time, lots of different companies. I built things, I fixed things, I solved problems. And, you know, I loved my career. I put a lot of my identity into the way I worked, the relationships that I established, the credibility that I generated through my work. And what's funny though about this book is I actually had this book idea when I was 35. So I was in the middle of my career and I had probably a few different career crossroads, right? Where you sort of get to a career point and you can kind of go left. That's right, and kind of go right or you can go left. And so I was 35 and I was sort of at a career crossroads. I was a mom. I had two, two of my three boys at that time. I was in my marriage, you know, things were starting to shift for me hormonally. I didn't really know it 20 years ago. I don't think I knew what perimenopause was for sure. And I was, I was feeling just angsty and confused. And I was looking around and I'm like, everybody seems to have their stuff together. It's got to be me. I'm the crazy one. I'm not grateful enough. You know, the problem is me. So I started to shape this book. And I put everything that I had, ideas that I had, into a red folder. And lit literally and figuratively, that folder got buried. So, you know, a lot, a lot happened for me career-wise, personally, you know, in my personal life over that 20-year period. But after a 30-year marketing career, which is just obscene to say, it's absurd to me, but um, I had the good fortune of retiring. And when I was cleaning out my desk, I had a small pile right on my desk of just stuff. I found the folder, is basically what happened. And I opened it and I was like, well, look at that. Turns out I still have a lot of questions. Turns out I still feel at a crossroads. Turns out some of the subjects that I thought I was so confused about, I now am not, which is good. I learned something, but now I have a whole host of new things that I'm confused about. So, you know, I gave myself a few months to sort of decide: can I write the book? Should I write the book? Who am I to think I could write a book? I'm not a writer. And the good news is that, you know, I lived a lot of my life with those talk tracks in my head forever. And now I'm at this age where they still creep in, but I can short circuit them. And I did. And so I gave myself two months and then I decided, well, why the hell not? So I wrote the book.

Michele Folan 6:25

Yeah, I think that's great. You know, and and some people wait even longer. So, you know, I think that's that's what's so funny about this is that I mean, I know I've had guests on the show, they're in their 60s and they finally said, I think I better write the book, you know.

Angela Burk 6:41

So I think I'm gonna write the book. And it it was about doing something, and you know, you you mentioned something about the quote that you saw, you know, what would your 80-year-old self go back and and tell tell us now? You know, one of the reasons why write writing the book was so important to me is, you know, I I say a lot of things to my boys, right? And I try to give them these, you know, little mantras or I call them mantras and these little, you know, and they roll their eyes for sure. But I I want to think that they sink in. But a couple of them, you know, and and and a lot of them have to do with you don't just talk the talk, you gotta walk your talk. And one of them is we finish what we start. I love it. And the second one is you're gonna be able to take a lot of risks in life. Always bet on yourself. And so I realized that that being able to show them that I was gonna take this brave step, that I was gonna do something that I had sat on for 20 years, that I was gonna finish something that I started, and that I was betting on myself was really important to me. So those were the other reasons why I decided to write the book. Are they proud of you? Very proud of me. Oh, I love that.

unknown 7:51

Yeah.

Modeling Bravery For Your Kids

Angela Burk 7:51

Oh, that's it. And you know, it's funny because there's a chapter in the book, because I get very real. So when I say that it's the real girls' guide, a lot of it is my stories, other women's stories, and experts, but I get very real. So there's one chapter in the book that talks about desire and pleasure. And I'll just say that, you know, I'm very honest about my own relationship with those things. So in the chapter of the book, I have three warnings because, in addition to me, you know, I was in a long-term marriage, I divorced, I found new love when I was in my mid-40s. That brought on a whole new set of discoveries, but also introduced four additional children into our combined mix. So in this one chapter, though, I have three warnings for the children. As, you know, in the off chance, they're gonna actually pick up the book and read it. Um, like, hey, you might want to throw the book, just close it and throw it. In the middle, it's like, you know, are you still here? And then the end is like, if you children stuck this out, you're gonna see a whole new version of Angela and your mother. And all I can say is, you're welcome, because I am a whole person. And, you know, no apologies, no trying to sugarcoat it. But if they stuck it out, it's like, okay, hopefully this serves you well later in life.

Michele Folan 9:05

I don't know what to tell you. Okay, I gotta back up because I think this is this is kind of important. I don't think our children really see us as a whole person until maybe they're adults. And even then, I think it really depends on how much you let your kids see. Because I know people that are very reserved and don't let their children see that whole side of them.

Angela Burk 9:30

And I think that's a shame. I agree with you completely. And here's why. If I think about it, right? And and many of us women, and also men too, but I, you know, I'm gonna come from the perspective of women. We spend a lot of our life living and acting by the stories that other people tell about us or the stories we tell about ourselves. And most of those stories deal with some amount of shrinking or editing or keeping the peace or carrying the load or not making waves and being the small, the quiet, the steady, the unflappable, the fixer, all these things. And what I am trying to do with my boys in particular is sort of say, like, look, you know, your mom spent the better part of her life playing that part. And what is happening to me now is, you know, you kind of talked about this concept of editing. And the way I sort of describe it is I had to edit myself for a lot of years, right? Because I was the one that everybody turned to and relied on and somehow told myself that my happiness could never come first. God forbid my happiness came first. Everybody around me would suffer. That's a that's a messed up story. But I what I'm trying to model for my boys is, you know, we teach people how to treat us. And if we're gonna edit ourselves, like that's our doing. And I want my kids to see that yes, I am their mom, but also I am a happy version of Angela that they didn't know when they were younger and I was still married, that their mother has desires and wants and fears and you know, pride in her accomplishments. She's embracing the discomfort, she's trying new things. I just signed up for drum lessons, okay? And my kids are like, uh, I'm sorry, you're doing what I'm like, I'm taking drum lessons. And they're like, you know what? Cool. Yeah. And so I want them to see that there is an element of bravery and risk that comes with being your whole person. And I don't want them to have to edit themselves. You know, yeah, like you show up at work, and you know, there's there's certain roles that we have to play for sure, but I am a whole person here, and you know, and I'm not apologetic about it.

Michele Folan 11:47

Yeah. I think this is this is so great because you're you're what, 54? 55. 55.

Angela Burk 11:54

And you're taking drum lessons. I'm taking drum lessons. I'm six weeks into it and I'm loving it. And you know, like, do I have visions of like, you know, opening some concert? No, but I'm really enjoying it. Yeah, and I'm not doing it for anybody else. I'm doing it for me.

unknown 12:12

Yeah.

Chaos Club And Personality Reboots

Michele Folan 12:13

As as well, you should. Yeah. You open with welcome to the chaos club. And is midlife chaotic because of hormones, or because we finally stopped tolerating what no longer fits? Yes, and yes.I I think that it is so, you know, I don't know about you, but I remember um, you know, being raised with this idea of the midlife crisis, right? Yeah. You know, and I was, and my mom and I are 19 years apart. So we're quite close. And I remember she was going through some of these, these periods of of transition for her. And I, you know, being in my 20s and she was in her 40s, and I was like, ooh, that's old lady stuff. Like I just wanted, I wanted to create so much distance from myself and her and the concept of midlife, or, you know, some kind of impending doom that was like coming and all these changes that were happening. I was like, oh my God, that's so gross. And so I think a lot of us are raised to fear, you know, and and believe that this period of time, and there's no magic. It's not like you look at midlife and go, oh, it's your 40s, or it's your 30s, or oh, it's your 50s. It's there's no magic decade. But I think, I think that it is chaotic. Um, and it doesn't mean it's a crisis. It doesn't mean you're falling apart. It doesn't mean that your world's gonna open up and swallow you whole, but it means that a lot of things are changing. And yes, is it hormones? 100%. Yes, is it because we're finally becoming intolerant and exhausted with having to carry the loads and play the role that we've been playing for decades and decades? Yes. Is it chaotic because we're maybe redefining what right or normal looks like and feels like? Yes. Is it chaotic because we're dealing with all the appearance changes and all the things that are like in turmoil? Yes. Is it chaotic because a lot of the roles that we used to have are shifting? Yes. Is it chaotic because we're trying to rediscover parts of ourselves that have been lost? Yes. So you kind of keep adding it, yeah. It's super chaotic. But but chaos is like it's like the word crisis. Chaos is not bad. Yeah. It you know, and I I remember back probably in my mid-40s, not sleeping, you know, maybe maybe late 40s, not sleeping, and just not and feeling really anxious at times. And and I wish, I wish we knew at that time what all this was. And we have a lot more information now, yeah, than than we ever have. You know, the distinction between perimenopause and menopause and and all those body changes that come with it. You know, there's what 30 or 40 different symptoms of of perimenopause and menopause? I mean, come on, we didn't know any of this stuff. And, you know, you you say that it's not it's not a hot flash, it's a personality reboot, which just cracks me up. But you you reframe that narrative completely. What other changes in midlife do women often get mislabeled?

Angela Burk 15:30

I think we get a lot of changes mislabeled, right? I think even the, you know, if I go back and look at my 40s, we're probably the decade so far that has been the most change-filled because all these things were happening at one time, right? So we get mislabeled because, oh my gosh, like she's losing her mind. You know, she must be going crazy. No. Oh my gosh, like why, you know, she's complaining about her marriage or she's complaining about her kids, or she's complaining about her job. You know, she's never, she's ungrateful. No. Oh, you know, so you you kind of take all of these changes that we're going through. And it's very easy from the because it and and a lot of that mislabeling starts with us. I know if I go back and look at my 40s, I had no idea how close I was to actually becoming post-menopausal when I was about 45. I had no idea. I divorced, and it wasn't like this big dramatic divorce, but we, you know, my my my kids' dad and I looked at each other, both realized we could be happier. And that's not how I wanted to live. I didn't want to model for my boys that the, you know, the best relationship that you should seek out is somebody who looks at you and says, huh, I could be happier someplace else. Nah. Again, another career crossroads. I took a massive career risk in changing jobs. And then the backdrop of all that were the hormone stuff. So it felt like I was losing my mind half the time. And so I think, I think that a lot of, you know, and when you're in it, I believe that the mislabeling, I was probably the most guilty at mislabeling a lot of this stuff because I didn't, I didn't stop and look at what was happening. And I didn't have the knowledge to say, man, those hormones are really driving a lot of this. Or, hey, you know, you're not sleeping and you're anxious. Because I looked at that and I went, well, of course I'm anxious and I'm not sleeping. I'm working 14 hours a day. I'm trying to establish myself as a single mom. I'm trying to make sure my boys are situated. I'm worried about them. I'm worried about, like, of course I'm not sleeping. So it was easy for me to justify and rationalize all of these things that I was feeling, in particular at that time, as being um, you know, a symptom of a circumstance. And then I started, again, I was looking around and I'm like, I'm not the only one going through this stuff, but why does everybody else seem to be so good at this?

Michele Folan 17:49

Yeah.

Angela Burk 17:49

So then I must be the crazy one. I must be the one that doesn't know how to do this right. I must be the one that's doing it wrong. And so it the mislabeling, I believe, and it was kind of that kind of belief was validated through a lot of the women that I spoke to for the book. You know, yes, the outside world can mislabel all of this stuff, but I think sometimes we're the worst offenders.

Michele Folan 18:12

Because we're so hard on ourselves. Yeah, we are. But you know, there is there is this point that I think we get to where we become more honest. And I think that honesty can make other people really uncomfortable. Oh, yeah. Particularly our kids. Because not sugarcoating things anymore. Where it's you you worry less about you want to people to know the truth and worry less about hurting people's feelings because they yeah.

Angela Burk 18:44

I it is very uncomfortable. I think honesty does rattle people, you know, and I think um discomfort rattles people. I think change rattles people. I think different rattles people. So when you, you know, whether it's with your kids or your partner or your boss or your friends or your family, when you show up different, when you show up with some attitude changes, with you when you show up stripping away some of the layers that they're so used to seeing that make them all comfortable, it rattles people. People don't like that.

unknown 19:18

They don't.

Share The Conversation With A Friend

Angela Burk 19:20

People don't like it. And then and then the backdrop though to all that is, and and and you know, the science says this, right? So some of the hormones that are so prevalent in us when we're in our 20s and 30s, you know, when we're young and in our 20s and 30s and 40s until we get to menopause, they're meant to keep us soft, right? They they're meant to keep us nurturing and you know huggable. And so you you come at a lot of these circumstances with just sheer exhaustion. You come at it with a new realization, you come at it with brutal honesty, and the hormones that have kept you that way are leaving the building. It's like, of course you're gonna be different. Like you're biologically different, you're chemically different, and people don't like that.

Reducing Shame Around Hormone Change

Michele Folan 20:07

Oh, I yeah. We're gonna continue this conversation after the break. Angela, we'll be right back. Quick pause for a second. If you've been listening to this podcast and thinking, oh my gosh, my friend needs to hear this, don't keep it to yourself. Seriously. So many women out there are trying to figure this stuff out alone. Health hormones, aging, all of it. And half the time we don't even know where to start. That's exactly why I created this podcast. So if something you've heard today resonated with you, send it to a friend, a sister, your workout buddy, that woman you were just talking to about perimenopause over coffee. Because these conversations, they matter, and the more women we bring into this space, the better we all get. All right, let's get back to the episode. All right, we are back. We've talked about hormones, and I think there is this confusion about hormones and just how much is just us getting older, like what's how much is existential, you know, this whole change. I mean, we our our libido changes, our our vaginas change. I mean, everything, everything is changing. How do we get women to understand about hormones that might reduce shame and self-blame at this point in the game?

Libido Shifts And Medical Gaslighting

Angela Burk 21:36

I mean, you you you nailed a concept that I think is really important here. It is wired into us early on that change, things that change are a failure. And with a failure, with this I belief, if if that's the belief we hold that if something changes, whether it's our libido is changing, our appearance is changing, our relationship is changing, um, you know. Our careers are changing, whatever it is, change equals failure. Failure comes with it shame, guilt, embarrassment, fear, all these things. And I think the only way that we can sort of, you, you, you have to have the ability to sort of pause and go, okay, something is different. Different is not bad. Different is just different. And there is no need for me to feel guilt and shame. And like if I'm feeling these things, let me call them out. But now what am I going to do different? And one of the things I will, I will, I'll share a story of what happened with me. So I was writing this book, right? So I started writing in April of 24. I was like June, July, I was writing the book. And I also started a Substack. I was interviewing experts for the book, and I noticed I was suffering from a libido change. So my background is I, you know, started perimenopause very early. I was in my late 30s. I um entered menopause, kind of became post-menopausal at 47. So I thought I think a little on the early side, and I raw dog the entire thing. So no hormones for me at any point. So fast forward, I'm writing this book, I'm talking to an expert. It's all about the time that the FDA did the uh panel discussion on vaginal estrogen cream and removing the black box label. I listened to that. I've never done that before in my life, a government panel, never listened to that. But I was talking to an expert, and all the while I was noticing a libido change of myself. And I couldn't talk to my man about it because I didn't understand what was happening. He noticed it. I noticed it. And it was like a subject that, you know, we would kind of talk about and he'd be like, Oh, is it is it a problem with us? And I'm like, I know, and I don't know what's happening, and I don't really want to talk about it. And then at the same time, like my bladder was changing. So I was like, it just nothing felt sexy. And I couldn't even, I was embarrassed. Yeah, quite honestly. So all of this is happening. I talked to an expert, and you know, we're sort of talking about this the vaginal estrogen cream, and I go to my doctor and I'm telling her what's happening, and she's like, you know, it really sucks, doesn't it? And I thought that's the best you can. And then she says to me, She knows that my partner lives in Australia, I live in California. And she says to me, I think you and your man need to go on more dates. Oh. And I'm like, uh, you do know we don't live in the same country. So, and I and I promise this story is gonna wrap up. But at about the same time, I started reading Miranda July's book, All Fours. Fictional book, kind of smuddy. I loved it. My partner happened to be in California at that time. He started reading it. We like to read the same books. He has to fly to London, and I'm ahead of him in the book. But there's a chart in this book, okay? And the chart is, it's a fictional book, I just want to preface this. And the chart is it's got estrogen and testosterone, men and women, by decade, and it plots the levels of these hormones. And basically, what it shows is women have a plummet of estrogen, usually right around 45. We have very little testosterone, and even that plummet, where men they have more of these hormones, and that their decline is really like this little meandering, little slow, steady, quiet, calm. So my man gets off the plane, he calls me from the Arrowbridge and he says to me, Did you get to the chart? And I said, Well, I'm past the chart. He says, Babe, I am so sorry. Because that chart explained to him why I was suffering and why my libido changed. And it gave me the ability to talk to him in a way that I couldn't talk to him before. And it also prompted me to go talk to a doctor. I got uh uh started on hormones, and things are better. They're not like, you know, it's not sexy time, fun time all the time, but things are better. But the long and short of it is like there is so much confusion and guilt and shame and embarrassment that come with even a libido change. Yeah. And then you you try to seek out help and you get the gaslighting and the oh, you you and your partner need to go on more dates. But and it's why and I had to find language for this in a fictional book. Yeah. But but I did.

Michele Folan 26:00

Yeah. You know, I think some of this, some of this is a choice. Like if you if you decide that it's not that important to you that you don't want to get the help, that's I think that's a choice. And I think some women it's a choice, some women decide to do that. I felt the need to get help with my hormones because I I I was missing that in my life. And I, Angela, this is interesting. So I interviewed a functional medicine integrative health doctor, and we were talking about vaginal estrogen, but he said, you know, what what women often forget is that a lot of their external sex organs, clitoris labia, is they're they're the same tissue that a that a penis is, yeah, and that it's made of testosterone, and that we need that testosterone not just for libido, but for our health of our sexual, sexual organs, yeah, external ones. And I was like, uh, no one's ever really brought that up to me before on the podcast, but I just thought that was interesting. So it's not just estrogen. We got to pay attention to testosterone and progesterone, but 100% we could talk about that all day.

The Choice Is Mine Mindset

Angela Burk 27:19

We could, but one of the things I also want to draw out about what you said is, you know, it is a choice, right? And the choice is ours. So take libido, take your appearance, take a decision to take drums or not take drums. Here's the thing we're finally at a point in life where for many of us, the attention that we used to put out to other things and other people and other places is now, for very real reasons, starting to turn inward. So I was talking to somebody the other day about, you know, the appearance changes. And they're they're jarring. I at least for me, the appearance changes were jarring because I wasn't prepared, right? And I just felt like the injustices just don't stop for us. So it's like every day something changes. And then this person sort of judged me a little bit about wanting to get microneedling and yes, I've dabbled in Botox and all these things. It's like, you know what, hold the phone. The choice is mine, and I don't owe you an explanation, and I don't have to justify it, and I'm not asking for permission. And so take that same mindset and apply it to appearance. I had another conversation with a girlfriend, this was during my time of writing the book, about trucker hats. I show up to her house wearing a trucker hat. I love them. And she's like, ew, you know, a trucker hat. We're too old for that. I think you need a full brim situation. And I was like, uh, what? Excuse me. So I've taken it now. It is my personal mission. Every time I see her, I wear a brand new trucker hat. But, you know, if I want to wear a bikini to the beach, I'm gonna wear a bikini to the beach. If I want to wear a ratty old sweatshirt and my pajama pants to go to Target, guess what I'm wearing? But it's it's the mindset that says the choice is mine.

Michele Folan 29:08

Yeah.

Angela Burk 29:08

And I don't apologize, I don't ask for permission, I don't wait for validation, the choice is mine. And that I think is also a theme that is emerging for a lot of us women in our in our midlife, whether it's your 30s, and that's it starts to brew there. 40s, it kind of starts like the it's kind of coming to a slow boil. Our 50s, we're boiling, and it carries forward into our 60s and 70s and 80s because of the choices we're making now.

Michele Folan 29:37

You know, your your comment about wearing the ratty sweatshirt and sweatpants to Target, I probably wouldn't have done that 10 years ago, but I would do that now. Because I don't give an F what people think.

Grieving Old Identities Without Calling It Failure

Angela Burk 29:52

Because I don't give an F. I wouldn't have done it in my 20s and 30s, no. But now I don't give an F what people think. Yeah. You know, and one of the other things that again, I think that, you know, the universe just has a way of connecting all these dots for us in many ways. The oldest real girl that I spoke to in the book, I interviewed her, uh, she's in she's 82. She wrote her first book when she was in her late 70s, and it was a book about grief because she had lost her second husband. And she decided that she was going to write a book in her late 70s about the grieving process. And through that process, she also began to write poetry. So she's working on a second book of poetry. However, so I'm talking to her and I interview her for the book, and the last and she went on to find new love at at 80. Um, and I said, What's been the most surprising thing about finding love at this age? And basically she said that the parts still work and I like it. And I thought, okay, that was that was another, it was right about the time of this whole libido thing for me. And that was another point in time where the choice, it would, it reaffirmed this idea that the choice is mine to make. So if I'm unsatisfied with my libido, if I don't want to be in my 60s and 70s and 80s with that out of my life, that hey, if if I make a choice that says I'm I'm good without it, again, I don't owe anybody an explanation, but I don't want that for myself. So I'm going to choose to fix it. Yeah. Equally as somebody who decides, ah, I'm good. Yeah. And that's okay too. But it's the I don't, I don't owe the world an apology. I don't owe the world an explanation. And I don't need to seek permission.

Michele Folan 31:30

You know, you brought up grief, and that was one of my questions in grieving who you were and loving who you are. You speak honestly about identity loss. What version of yourself did you personally have to grieve?

Angela Burk 31:49

Yeah. Well, I mean, and look, like let's just grief comes from a lot of a lot of dimensions, right? You can grieve marriages, um, you can grieve old identities, you can grieve the noise of a busy household, you can grieve the life that you thought you were gonna have. And for me, I think I did. I I sort of envisioned my life. You know, I I I believed in my 20s I wasn't gonna get married. I didn't really want to have kids. And then I met a man, I was like, oh, I can get married, and kid things sounds really good. And I sort of projected how, like, you know, what what was my life gonna be like um at 50 and 60 and 70 and 80? And when we made the decision to divorce, I that was a loss, right? This I idea of who I was going to be and the life I was gonna have. And yeah, it I agreed that. And yet what I what I realized was, you know, the the further that I tried to push that away, or the um the the longer I took to just acknowledge how I was feeling, the the longer it took for me to get to acceptance. So, you know, I had to acknowledge I feel sad about this thing. And that kind of moved me to acceptance. And then I sort of needed to shift my mindset in a way that says, you know, grief or change is not a failure. You know, I don't look at my marriage and consider it a failure. I don't. I look at that time and I think, hey, something wasn't working. I'm going to embrace a new definition of right. There's no one way to do this. I'm gonna embrace a new definition of what right looks like for me. And yes, I can feel sad about that. Yes, I could grieve the idea of the life I thought I was gonna have, but now it is not a failure. And I'm taking action, even a small step forward to something new is liberate. And I believed at that time that good things come from change. Good things come from doing something different. I didn't know what it was gonna look like, but I believed that at my core. Um, but it was, you know, and even now, even the identity thing, like I I'm noticing my hair is thinning, which is just like again, the injustices. Are you for real? Yeah, let's just add that one to the list. Just add it to the list. And I, you know, not that I ever had this thick, voluminous hair, but you know, and I I I'm lucky because I have the curls, so it kind of can disguise some of the the thinning. But it's you know, I I I liked my hair when it was a little bit more volume. Yeah. And it makes me sad. It's like, you know, I see too much. And then my my kid, my 15-year-old's like, Mom, I can see a little scalp here. And it's like, thanks, buddy. That makes me sad, right? But it's, you know, it's not a failure. I'm not failing. And if I decide that I'm not happy with it, I will make a change. But that's on me. Like I get to decide to do that.

Michele Folan 34:50

Yeah, and I think it's important to point out too, we don't have to have grief or have those feelings to feel like we want to step into a midlife expansion, right?

Angela Burk 35:01

No.

Michele Folan 35:02

Yeah.

Boundaries In Simple Sentences

Angela Burk 35:02

Not at all. Not at all. But I do think, you know, if I look back at different points of my life, there were times the signs were there, right? If I look back at different points in my life, it might have been, you know, the other thing that I really work on a lot is saying no, because my pattern was always I have to say no with like an essay or some sort of dissertation. And it's like, I'm not available. That's three words. Like that's kind of all I owe anybody. But um, you know, I think, I think that if I look back, you know, the signs were there that something in me was shifting. You know, I would say yes to things I wanted to say no to. It's no wonder I was constantly tired. Or, you know, looking back, I could start to see nothing dramatic or tragic, but I could start to see that I slowly wasn't recognizing myself in my own life. Or a lot of the traits that I feel I have that I really love, I'm persistent, I'm resilient, I'm all these things, I those were disappearing. Like I didn't really see me in the same way. And those, if I if I just quieted my life and I started to see those things, I think the signs are there. But for many of us, we ignore the signs or we don't give ourselves the quiet to just notice them. And that, you know, and I and I firmly believe that this whole transition that many of us are on, it's not about blowing up your whole life. And you don't have to have a perfect plan for everything. But if you give yourself the ability to just quiet the noise and look for the signs, and if there are the signs are there and you're going, yeah, you know, why am I saying yes to so many things I really want to say no to?

Michele Folan 36:40

Yeah.

Angela Burk 36:40

Okay, acknowledging that and then saying what you need out loud, even if it's to yourself, that changes the your thought pattern and your action pattern. But if I'm honest, I think a lot of the signs were there in my 30s and in my 40s, but I just didn't pay attention to them.

Michele Folan 36:58

Yeah, you you said that you've always felt like you had to have this long dissertation whenever you were would say no to something. And I think we we tend to do that. We're like, well, I'm really tired and I gotta, I gotta get up early in the morning, and it's just been a rough week, and I really don't think I should go. And instead of just saying, hey, it really just doesn't work for me tonight. I'm gonna make a I'm gonna take a pass.

Angela Burk 37:21

Yeah. Or the other one, asking for rest. It's for me, I thought the idea of asking for rest, and I'm so sorry, like I've noticed this new wave of menopause. Everything, every orifice that I have is now dry. My nose gets so itchy. So I'm scratching my nose because it's so itchy. But um, you know, it's this idea of asking for rest and saying, I'm tired. Like somehow I view that as a weakness. But there are days like I really work on, I actively work on this practice. And it like if I'm this is how it plays out. I'm going about my day and I'm like, man, I'll say it out loud. I'm really tired. I need a nap. Nobody's home. But I say it out loud to myself because that breaks the thought pattern, right? Yep. And then what am I gonna do with that? Well, I'm gonna go sit down and I'm gonna take a rest. If I'm not available, that's a good way. I I use that, that's three words to say no. Yeah. If I'm not available, I need a break, four words. I disagree. You know, I can't tell you how many times in a corporate setting I'd be sitting in meetings and I would be listening to these executives argue a point and I could see the solution so clearly in my head, or I could see the the seven risks that their solution presented, but I'd sit back on that on my opinion because I'm like, who am I to think I could say it? They're not gonna listen to me. I'm too junior. Um, I disagree. That's two words.

Michele Folan 38:45

Yep, yep. And I'm telling you, I I turned 62 this week. Oh, happy birthday. Thank you. And I love being in my 60s because I now have balls that I didn't have in my 40s, and I don't stay quiet any longer.

unknown 39:08

No.

Michele Folan 39:08

And it's way more fun.

Angela Burk 39:11

It's way more fun, and that's the thing. Like, it doesn't have to start with this big, you know, massive declaration or this massive plan or this massive set of changes. It can start with a simple sentence, right? Deciding, you know, deciding, hey, I'm gonna practice saying no to things. Okay, cool. This week, make a commitment to yourself. If something comes up that you want to say no to, in when it comes up to yourself, say out loud, I don't want to do this. That alone is huge because it's gonna interrupt your thought pattern. Then practice some response. I'm not available. Three words. Yeah, I can't make it, four words. The other thing that I had to start doing was like, if somebody would ask me to do something, it'd be like, I don't want to do that thing, but here's what I can do. Here's what I can do. Five words. That's it. Yeah. And it's a sentence. It's not a big, you're not blowing up your life, you're not going out and spending a you know, $90,000 on a midlife crisis car, you're not, you know, uh making an appointment for a massive, you know, full-plane facelift. You're starting with a sentence.

Strength Training As Emotional Confidence

Michele Folan 40:22

Yeah, and I think it's it's what it is, it's just prioritizing yourself. It doesn't prioritizing yourself doesn't cost doesn't have to cost money. It really doesn't. But I will say that many of my listeners are actively. They're prioritizing strength, the mobility, they're really looking at long-term health and longevity. In your view, how does physical strength intersect with that emotional confidence in midlife?

Angela Burk 40:50

It's I think that they go hand in hand.

Michele Folan 40:53

Yeah.

Angela Burk 40:53

Our mind and our body are completely connected, right? And when we make decisions to alter our mindset and our psychology and our our behavior follows. So for me, you know, take the I've always been, I'll give you a great example. I've always been a very active person, but I distanced myself from things like weightlifting and strength training for a long time. I wish I wouldn't have. I wish I would have embraced those things earlier because the benefits are so proven. But I think the other thing that happens though is when we start, because I know a lot of women, and I did it too when I was in my 20s and 30s, and you have these young kids, and I can't take time to go to the gym. I can't take time to work out. I'm not gonna, you know, I don't have time to make these glorious nutrient-filled meals, three meals a day for, you know, five different people in my household because nobody likes the same thing. Like I certainly can't prioritize these things that are gonna give me longevity because somebody else would suffer. And I think that the mindset shift that we're seeing a lot of women in our age bracket make is it's it's that whole proverbial, you put your mask on first before you you put others on in an airplane, right? When the mind gets right, our behavior changes. And the link between our mind and our desires to then how we physically behave, to then how we act is there. And when we start putting ourselves first and we start believing that our wants and our desires should come first, our actions will follow. And whether that's prioritizing your health, prioritizing your the medical care you're giving yourself, um, whether it's prioritizing rest or exercise or nutrition over keeping everybody else satisfied, like you're putting your mask on first. And I it it I think where we sometimes fall is when we're only paying attention to the psychology and the behaviors not following, or we only pay attention to the behavior, but our mindset hasn't shifted. So to me, that mind-body link is essential.

Michele Folan 42:54

Yeah, and I I do believe that reclaiming your body at this stage in life is reclaiming your voice. Absolutely. Because so much of our self-confidence is in how we feel about our bodies. And if you take that time to start reclaiming that, I think it it does give you more of a voice. Like you feel that you've really got like control of things more.

Angela Burk 43:25

That's the thing. I think what it does is it gives you control, it gives you strength, right? When you when you're physically strong, right? And you're physically strong and you're physically rested and you're physically caring for this vehicle that is your body, you emotionally can manage and regulate so much better, right? And and when you feel these things, and I know for me, I feel more competent. I feel more solid, I feel more secure when my body feels solid and competent and secure. And when I'm doing the things to take. Care of that, I'm inherently putting myself first on the list. And by doing that, it just changes my outlook, right? I'm I'm then viewing myself differently. I view my place in the world differently. I view um what I expect from others differently because I'm caring for myself. So if I'm, you know, and I think the inverse is true too. Like if I look back in my 30s, I was so focused on giving attention to everybody else because I felt like I had to, that I didn't turn it to myself. But the minute I started turning attention back to myself, whether it was emotionally, spiritually, physically, I then became a priority in my own life. And as silly as that sounds, that shift had to happen. And then caring for my body, caring for my nutrition meant that I was stronger. I was physically stronger. And when I felt physically stronger, it was like I then am taking up more space in my physical life, in my emotional life, in my spiritual life, in my um, in every part of my life, really. So these things just sort of, I think, go hand in hand. And I think you're absolutely right. The we can't undervalue the taking care of our physical needs.

Start Small With A Personal Manifesto

Michele Folan 45:08

Right. Yeah. So important. So if if a woman listening right now feels stuck, where does she begin?

Angela Burk 45:16

Yeah, it's it's a really um, really good question. One of the things in my book I talk about is um I end the book with this concept of a manifesto. And it's it's, you know, for me, it's kind of about how we can adapt and start prioritizing our own needs. So and I did this myself, is, you know, it it's you can start with one simple thing, and that is evaluate, just pause and think of one thing that you'd like to be done carrying and one thing that you'd like to reclaim. That becomes a person, and write it down, physically write it down. That becomes a personal contract to your to yourself. So is there something that you want to let go of, a belief, a habit, an expectation? And is there something that you want to begin, that you want to stand in, that you want to embrace? Write those things down. And that shift alone, just the virtue of thinking of one thing in each of those categories and physically writing it down could change everything. And I, and that doesn't take time. It doesn't take money, it doesn't take a lot of attention. It just takes a focus on yourself.

Michele Folan 46:27

Yeah. I think that's a great place to start. It's so simple. So simple. It it it's not it's not a whole vision board or something like that. It's not a vision board.

Angela Burk 46:36

It's just one thing. Like for me, you know, I um the thing that I've been working on a lot is, you know, because I was sort of raised with this belief that I was, um, you know, I was the peacekeeper, I was the the load carrier, I was the problem, the problem fixer, I was the solution person. And I had to realize that that belief about myself kind of railroaded my life in a lot of ways that I feel like I didn't fully control. So I'm really trying to unwind from that. And the thing that I'm starting to embrace is this idea of just saying no. I don't need to explain myself. And so those are the things that I've written down, and those are the things that I hold as a contract to myself. You know, so when I feel the pull toward fixing somebody's problem, when I feel the pull toward having to be responsible for like the emotional regulation of everybody around me, I stop. Yeah. I go, okay, what am I doing? Love it. Or when I feel the pull, like all of a sudden I'm like saying yes to something that I really don't want to do, it's like something in my body's changing. Like, usually I get kind of not a pit in my stomach, but my stomach kind of starts to turn a little bit and I feel like heaviness in my chest. And it's like, wait, I think I just said yes to something I didn't want to do. Like, uh, what's going on? I need to tune into like something's wrong. And then it's like, okay, what am I gonna do? Well, I'm gonna say no. Yeah, I'm not available. Three words. Yep, I love it. And those are big, massive changes, right? No, no, but they're important ones.

Michele Folan 48:08

It's just really about being true to ourselves. So I think that's it. Great advice. What's one thing you wish you knew when you first entered midlife?

Angela Burk 48:17

Oh man, you're gonna ask me to pick one thing. Okay, I'm gonna answer this, but I'm gonna say a couple things. I wish that I would have known that it's it was never a midlife crisis. It was just about clarity. I wish that I would have believed at the times when I was going through a lot of the change, I was never falling apart. Because there were times where I felt like I was. I really wasn't. I wish that somebody would have told me that my body was gonna change a whole lot faster uh than my mindset. Because man, some of those changes hit hard and they're furious. I wish I I wish, you know, a lot of those old stories that either people had written about me or I had written about myself, I wish I would have really challenged those earlier. It's not too late. No, no, and I'm doing that now, but but I I do wish I would have challenged those a little bit earlier. But I think, and and you're not alone. And also you're not crazy. Yeah.

Michele Folan 49:13

Yeah, those are all great. Yeah.

Angela Burk 49:15

What's next for you? Well, um, so the book is out. I'm working on a companion book now, which will be out in the spring. So that's very exciting. I write for my substack. Um, so Real Girls Guide to Midlife.com. I write like three things a week, um, which is really fun. And yeah, um, you know, just getting to meet amazing women like you and have these amazing conversations. I just hope to be doing more of that. And yeah, and more drum lessons. Yeah, and more drum lessons.

Sleep As The Non-Negotiable

Michele Folan 49:41

Yeah. That's so fun. I love it. Yeah. And then finally, this is I ask all my all my guests this. So we're gonna strip away all the buzzwords. What is one self-care, non-negotiable, you protect at this stage of life, even when it could disappoint others?

Angela Burk 50:02

It's sleep, honestly. When I'm tired, I go to bed. And if that means that, you know, somebody doesn't get to do something that they want to do. I last night is a really good example. My son at eight o'clock last night, I had just flown in from Atlanta. I gave a workshop based on a theme of my book at a at a company. So I flew in from Atlanta, I was exhausted. So I'm on East Coast time. I was up from like 2:30 a.m. Pacific time, and it's now 8 a.m. Pacific time. And my son's like, mom, I really need to go to Target. I need to get something. And I said no. And he's like, but but but and I said no. I said, look, uh this isn't urgent for you. And I'm tired and I'm not doing it, and I'm going to bed now. Yeah. And that's all I said. Yeah. Don't have to make a bunch of excuses. I don't. I don't. Oh, and he was like, but and I could tell he was disappointed, but so for me it's rest. Yeah. It's rest and sleep.

Michele Folan 50:56

Sleep is becoming one of the more commonly stated non-negotiables that I'm hearing from my guests. So I think we're all starting to really, you know, understand that we aren't our best selves when we don't get enough sleep. Period. End of story.

Angela Burk 51:14

Oh, and we never were. And I think like for when we were younger, we could, I know for me and a lot of the women that I talked to in the book, it was easy to justify lack of sleep. Kids are young, everybody's sick, I'm working, I'm this, I'm that, I'm having a, you know, I'm trying to be the best mom and the best wife and the best, you know, career woman and the best, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And you could kind of go, of course I'm not sleeping. Like, yeah, you know, I remember my mom used to say, you know, I'll sleep when I'm dead. And it's like, no, that's actually not. And I think we're also getting smart and we understand that our ability to be strong and our ability to exercise and take good care of ourselves is predicated on being rested. And we're we're now becoming more educated on the power of rest and sleep on things like our health and longevity. So, you know, I think we're just getting smarter about it. But I know I I could easily like I can get by on, you know, four hours sleep and four cups of coffee a day, and everything's gonna be fine. And now it's like, uh-uh. I'm not, I'm not trading that anymore.

Where To Find Angela And Closing

Michele Folan 52:13

Nope. Nope. I agree. And now we're on the same page. Love it. Angela Burke, where can the listeners find the real girls guide to midlife and you and the rest of your work?

Angela Burk 52:26

Oh, that's such a great question. Um, so Real Girls Guide to Midlife is on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, all the places that you love to buy your books. I write on Substacks, so you could go to Real Girls Guide to Midlife.com. Um, you subscribe by putting in an email address. It's very low risk and not a lot of effort. I'm on Instagram at RealGirls Guide55. I post really cringy reels and try to keep up on Instagram. The socials are just super scary for me and very uncomfortable. But yeah, that's where you can find me.

Michele Folan 52:55

Wonderful. Angela Burke, good luck with the companion book this spring. Thank you. And uh we really appreciate you being here today. Thank you so much for having me. Before you go, thank you for being here. If you want to go a little deeper, make sure you check out the show notes for this episode. That's where I link anything we mentioned, resources, partners, or tools I actually use and trust. And if you're not already on the Asking for a Friend community newsletter, that's where I share practical midlife tips, favorite finds, recipes, and the things that don't always make it onto the podcast or Instagram. You'll find the link to join in the show notes. Take care, and I'll see you next week.