134 Tested with Jesus (2): Attack on Faith and Falling from the Temple

The Attaching to God podcast continues a three-week Lenten series on the Temptations of Jesus.

This episode reframes Jesus’ second temptation as an attack on his secure attachment to the Father—an attack on FAITH, provoking anxiety and testing whether God is really available. Geoff and Cyd talk about all the different reasons we develop “trust issues” and how they come out in our lives. They define faith as embodied reliance and lived loyalty, they share practical examples, and offer a practical Lenten practice. 

Dive deeper in our new book, Landscapes of the Soul: How the Science and Spirituality of Attachment Can Move You into Confident Faith, Courage, and Connection, and learn about our trainings and other resources at embodiedfaith.life.

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Transcript

Second Temptation

Geoff Holsclaw: Welcome back to the Attaching to God podcast. Today we are continuing our journey through Lent and the temptations of Jesus. Together here we are exploring the science and spirituality of attachment to help you move into confident faith, courage, and connection.

Cyd Holsclaw: And we're doing a series for Lent, and this is our second episode on the Three Temptations of Jesus. And as. We look at the three temptations of Jesus, we're remembering the, the, the question we're using to frame our conversation about the temptations is what if the devil's temptations of Jesus weren't just about sin, but were actually about attacking Jesus's attachment to the father?

So what if Satan wasn't just trying to get Jesus to sin, but he was actually trying to destroy Jesus's faith, hope and love, which are the very foundations of secure attachment. So last time we talked about the attack on Hope, and today we're gonna talk about the attack on faith.

Geoff Holsclaw: So why does this matter? What are these temptations about trying to attack our attachment to the fathers? Well, uh, this is, it affects a lot of practical things in our lives, like relationships, our relational testing. If they really loved me, they would do this for me. If they really loved me, they would notice or they would care.

We're tempted to create kind of, like little loyalty tests almost. We're evaluating people on whether they're really loyal to us. Maybe sometimes we do the opposite, where we sabotage relationships so we can get out in front of that rejection or something like that. Sometimes too, we're testing God and we're gonna get to that.

Uh, in a second. If God really loved me, God would do this for me. We bargain in our faith. We kind of create these conditional statements of if I do this, God will do that. Or if God this, you know, then I would know. It also presses into some other issues of just kind of our trauma or the story of our lives about, you know, people always leave people always let me down.

so I have to get out in front of that. And then in real kind of easy ways, you know, we kind of speak into the air or we take a lot of indirect communication to try to check our relationships. And really those are all different kind of questions about whether we have faith in people.

Cyd Holsclaw: Yeah. And these are all, um, these questions whether, whether we have faith in people. Yeah, it's, it gets to the three defaults of secure attachment that we've talked about. And so last week we talked about sort of the, one of the questions that we're asking as we're growing up in our attachment relationships is, will this distress be alleviated?

Like, is it gonna go away? Is it temporary or does it last forever? And today we're talking about the question of, are others available to me when I'm in distress? Which is really tied to. Faith. Next week we're gonna talk about the last question, which is, how do I use my agency amid distress, which is really getting to the conversation of love.

Geoff Holsclaw: So today is the second temptation. It's the one where Jesus is tempted to leap from the temple. So let me read this passage from Matthew four verses five and six. Then the devil took him to the Holy City, Jerusalem to the highest point of the temple and said, if you are the son of God. Jump for the scripture says he will order his angels to protect you and they will hold you up with their hands so that you won't even hurt a foot on a stone.

Cyd Holsclaw: So there we are with that insidious phrase again, if you are the son of God, which is referring back to if you are really delightful to the Father. 'cause remember we're going back to right before all of this was the baptism of Jesus where the Father said, I am pleased with you. And so this is going back to Satan attacking that relationship again, and now he's doing it in a way where he's testing the availability of God.

Is God really here for you? Does God really care? Can you really trust your father? Will he really catch you if you jump? Is it really should you really have faith in God? And what he is doing here is like in our interpretation at least, Satan is trying to hyper activate Jesus' attachment system. He's trying to lead Jesus into this jungle way of living.

Um, one of the pasture of sort of anxiety the landscape of anxiety. So he's basically saying, be on high alert. Watch your relationships at all times, like test your safety net and. He's trying to disintegrate Jesus's integrated way of living. So rather than living in an integrated way that connects the past and the present and rules and relationships along with reliable patterns and unique people, which are these integrated skills of living in the pasture landscape, Satan is tempting Jesus to live a disintegrated or lap sided life, and he's.

Trying to get him to prioritize intimacy with God, um, in such a way that like testing God to see if God is really available to him.

Geoff Holsclaw: Hmm. So like you just said, this is kind of in a sense in our reading the devil trying to push Jesus into like a jungle pattern of relating to the father tempting Jesus to leave the good pasture. Of the father's love and the delight where he can rest secure in that and kind of look at relationships, always testing them, always seeking to kind of get or assurances and, and in a sense needing people to show that they're available, needing people to kind of show up.

Uh, so how did Jesus respond to this? Well, he, he kind of did what, he did in the last temptation, which is refer to scripture, is he says, um, Jesus answers. It is written, do not put the Lord your God to the test. Do not put the Lord your God to the test. So he is relying on God's written word, revelation.

He's using his kind of some of his cognitive tools, which you're gonna get to in a second. But there's, I, I think, the kind of the deeper truth is don't let this momentary distress, overwhelm, or overshadow years of trust or years of reliability. Don't let this moment. Kind of create an overwhelming kind of situation where you forget how the relationship has gone in the past.

And so that's partly how it's connected to Hope also, which was our last episode. But Jesus is, you know, he's trying to look at a bigger picture by not putting the Lord to the test.

Cyd Holsclaw: Yeah, and that really resonates for me because as you know, having been married to me for 25 years, especially earlier on in our marriage moments can be very powerful. And when you're in a moment that seems to be, I'm not sure this person is really present to me in this moment. In my world, uh, that can disrupt everything I know to be true about our relationship.

Not anymore so much, but that used to be a bigger issue. And it might be for you as you're listening. And what Jesus does, the way that he sort of manages to get through this temptation is he actually draws on both this relational data that he has about the father and how the father has demonstrated for.

Faithfulness to the nation of Israel all the way through the wilderness, all the way through their exile. He's brought them back into the land. He's now sent. You know, Jesus himself has come. And so there's all this relational history that proves that God is faithful and that we can depend on him. And so Jesus doesn't fall prey to the moment of, in this moment I might be hungry and uncomfortable and alone.

But that doesn't erase all this relational data that I have about the father. So he's taking that relational data, but then he is also got the cognitive data, the sort of logical, linear tools of remembering all the words that God has given Israel every time they were tempted to forget how God had saved them from slavery in Egypt and fed them from with manna.

The Psalms are. Of rehearsing the story of God and the scripture is just full of God's promises. So he has this relational data and the cognitive data, and he is using them together to be able to say, I'm not gonna fall prey to this. I don't need to test whether God will catch me.

Geoff Holsclaw: When I, when I used to listen to that. It is, it is written. Do not put the Lord your God to attest. I used to always kind of have like a. Like a stern voice in my head. And that, that where that would go is don't put the Lord your God to attest because he got, you know, God is so transcendent. God is so holy.

God is so glorious that Who are you to? Make God, you know, come and stand before you and test you. Who are you? You know, and in a good kind of Protestant total depravity kind of per perspective, like, who are you to put God to test. But I, I don't think that is where Jesus is coming from. You know, we like the previous, uh, temptation, Jesus answers.

You know, don't you know that man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of the Lord and that every word is really. You know, that's closeness, that's proximity, that is availability that God is near. He's so near that we get his, his voice. He's so near that God is giving us, uh, his words.

And so I just want for all of us listeners, you know, who struggle with that. Don't put the Lord God to test. We have this w wagging finger before our faces. That's I. Like it's, it's more of what you just said, Syd. It's like, well, I don't have to test God because I have such a relationship. I have so much care and concern that I've experienced in the past that even though this is a real distress right now, it's not gonna overwhelm the rest of the history that I've had.

So, as we move on though, can, can we slow down to this kind of define faith a little bit? Cyd, can you kind of just, what, how are we using the word faith? Maybe that's a little different than some people are used to.

Cyd Holsclaw: Yeah. First of all, faith is more than just ideas. Like a lot of times we say, I believe in, even the apostles creed, right? We're saying words these are doctrines that we agree with. But faith is actually more than just ideas. And so to say that I have faith in God, or I believe in Jesus is one thing, but living as if God is available.

Is different than just saying I believe God. And so what we're talking about when we talk about faith is this sort of exercised living in a reality as if God is available. So that's really faith is this trust loyalty like allegiance. And those are really the things that in the Bible, those things kind of line more closely with faith.

So faith is this. Fully embodied, embodied commitment to someone. It's, it's a relationship like faith is living as if this relationship is the most important thing. You could also think of it really simply as in like, you have faith that your car is going to get you where you're going. When you like pull out of the driveway.

You have faith that the car is gonna keep moving, and that's very disturbing when it stops or you have faith that a chair is going to hold you when you sit on it. Ex. And so you expect you're living as if it's true. You sit down because you believe the chair is gonna hold you. And so that's the kind of faith we're talking about, is this trust that things are real, that this relationship is real.

Geoff Holsclaw: Well, you, you just brought up, uh, the car. Our car is in the shop right now

Cyd Holsclaw: Yeah,

Geoff Holsclaw: we, we found out that our transmission is going bad and

Cyd Holsclaw: it wasn't as trustworthy as we thought.

Geoff Holsclaw: And, and we didn't know this, but like the, it's a, it's a hybrid and so it seems that part of the transmission and the battery and the brakes were all kind of together.

And we were on this road trip and the braking started getting weird. Like I wasn't able to, and we, we were driving in the snow and so I wasn't like breaking, and then it would kind of go out and then it'd come back. And so we went from, you know, I have faith that this car is gonna be dependable, reliable.

Two, I don't know if I have faith. And then we found out that, you know, there was this, this kind of major problem, right? So, but it's something that I was entrusting myself to in a very real and embodied way. It wasn't just an idea that I had about cars in general or about our car, but I never took it out on the road.

And so it's just something that's very embodied, you know, to keep using that word. So as we think. Of Jesus, and we said this last time, and we say this all the time, is that Jesus in his humanity is a model for us of what faith looks like, but in his divinity, he in. In a very real sense is who we put our faith into.

And so in Jesus's humanity, he is kind of modeling for us how to respond to the father's love in the midst of times of distress, which is to believe or to commit ourselves to that enduring long suffering love. Even if in this moment of distress we we don't know exactly how it's gonna work out. And so, so we want to become deeper.

And more secure in our attachment with God, just like Jesus was, but in his divinity. In another real sense, Jesus is the one we put our faith into. He's the good shepherd that is leading us to the, into the father's family. And so we, you know, call on Jesus' name, we lay down our life for Jesus. We put our faith in Jesus because he is the one who has walked that path of distress, of suffering, even of death.

But he was raised again. And so we too can be raised, uh, in the final days because of that.

Cyd Holsclaw: Yeah, it's pretty exciting that Jesus is the model for our secure attachment, but he's also is our secure

Geoff Holsclaw: So give us the good news, Sy. Give us the good news.

Cyd Holsclaw: The good news is that God is really for us and God is really with us and God is really available to us. And when we live as if that's true, we will find that it is true. And so, and that can allow us to sort of move from these anxious jungles and avoidant deserts where we test whether God is really for us and with us, and instead we can move into this place of peace and rest as Jesus repairs.

These distorted defaults that we carry, and we can have faith in the one who is always faithful to us, the one who is never gonna leave and let us down. And so that is the good news that God really is available. And what would it be like to live as if that's true?

Geoff Holsclaw: So with that as if. Invitation, what are some of the things then we could do what could be a Lenin practice, uh, this week that people could engage with? And again, these will be in the show notes if you want to go back and look. And they'll also always be on, uh, substack. So like, subscribe, share and join our substack.

And you'll always have all this stuff right in your inbox or on the app. So Cyd, what is the, the Lenin practice?

Cyd Holsclaw: Yeah, it's that question, right? Am I living as if God is available? And so it's taking a look at your life and noticing, maybe starting with your prayer life, do I actually ask God directly for what I need? Does that feel like something that is accessible? Can I say to God, I'm really tired today.

I just really need some energy to get through this day. Or, I am really having a lot of anxiety about this meeting. I really need your peace. I need some grace to get through this meeting. Do we actually ask God for what we need because we trust his availability? And then also noticing like, where are we testing God's availability?

Where are we saying like, I will believe that you're, for me, if you. Or something like that. So just noticing if I were to live as if God is available, how would I pray? How would I go through my day? How, what would it look like to trust God in this day instead of being suspicious of his faithfulness or his availability?

And then also to sort of take some time to remember the data. Of your life. So just like Jesus can recall times when God has been faithful to the whole nation of Israel, you can start your own list of how have I seen God be faithful to, you know, you could even do your parents or your grandparents or your whole community.

But then also, how has God been faithful to me, like God has really shown up in this area of my life or in this way? And then just. Practicing direct communication, and you can do that with humans too. So even going to someone in your life who is someone who you believe is available to you and asking directly for what you need, instead of hinting or speaking into the air or just saying out loud, you know something that you're wanting, but actually say it directly to the person.

Can you help me with this? Are you available to me?

Geoff Holsclaw: Hmm. So this lent in time, we're going through these three temptations of Jesus because Jesus has been tempted in every way that we have and yet did not sin. And so when we follow him, when we learn from him, when we trust in him, we too can be honest about the temptations, about I, I sure want to put God to the test and then learn from him.

Uh, God doesn't need to be tested. Rather his love endures. We are secure in his love as you know, Paul says in Romans 8 38 that nothing can separate us from God's love. And so this, this, as scripture says, the light and momentary troubles, but they often don't seem light and they often don't feel momentary.

But all these troubles, Jesus has been with us and for us. And so let us turn to him who the author and perfect of our faith and, and join us,

Cyd Holsclaw: Yeah. Well, one more thing I'm

Geoff Holsclaw: Yeah, go ahead.

Cyd Holsclaw: love to say before we leave is just that if you do find yourself putting God to the test or feeling, um, uncertain of his availability, that like that's, that's normal. It's a natural thing that we as humans do, and so to instead of living in like shame or condemnation around that or feeling like, what's wrong with me because I don't trust God instead. I'm recognizing that I don't trust God. You can even tell God that you can even say, God, I don't really trust you. Could you please increase my trust? That's another way of letting God know what you need and being just direct about what you need. So just wanted to add that because I don't want anybody walking away from this episode saying, I must be the only person who doesn't trust God.

'cause most of us struggle with that. So

Geoff Holsclaw: Right, right. It's just what are we doing?

Cyd Holsclaw: yeah.

Geoff Holsclaw: Well, thanks for journeying with us just for a little bit. Please, uh, share this with people who you think it might bless. And we'll be back with another episode next week. I.